BCC Minutes 02/05/1992 S Naples, Florida, February 5, 1992
LET IT BE REMEMBERED, that the Board of County Commissioners in
and for the County of Collier, and also acting as the Board of Zoning
Appeals and as the governing board(s) of such special districts as
have been created according to law and having conducted business
herein, met on this date at 5:30 P.M. in SPECIAL SESSION in Building
"F" of the Government Complex, East Nap]es, Florida, with the
following members present:
CHAIRMAN: Michael J. Volpe
(ABSENT) VICE-CHAIRMAN: Richard S. Shanahan
Burr L. Saunders
Max A. Hasse, Jr.
Patricia A. Goodnight
ALSO PRESENT: Debby Farris and Annette Guevln, Deputy Clerks;
Neil Dorrlll, County Manager; Jennifer Pike, Assistant to the County
Manager; Ken Cuyler, County Attorney: William Lorenz, Environmental
Services Administrator; Mike McNees, Budget Director; Leo Ochs, Jr.,
Administrative Services Administrator; Tom Whitecotton, Human
Resources Director; Tom Olltff, Public Services Administrator; George
Archibald, Transportation Services Administrator; Ken Baginski,
Planning Services Manager; Tim Clemons, Wastewater Director; Michael
Arnold, UtllttJes Administrator; Ladd Ryziw, Engineering Pro3ect
Manager; Eric Young, Planner; Sue Filson, Administrative Assistant to
the Board; and Deputy Byron Tomlinson, Sheriff's Office.
Page
February 5, 1992
;t?,i PIt~ENTATIO~ OF RECO~4]LFDATIONS PURSUANT TO THE COUNTY MANAGKR'S
~. ~AG~ ~ OR~I~TION~ ~I~ - P~ ACCE~D ~ ~
~IO~ OF CO~T ~INIS~TION, DK~LO~ S~ICKS ~ PKLIC~
~Y ~SITIONS ~IL ~R ~YSIS
Legal notice having been published in the Naples Daily News on
February 2, 1992, as evidenced by Affidavit of Publication filed with
the Clerk, public hearing was opened to consider the County Manager's
proposed Management Reorganization Plan.
Due to the absence of Commissioner Shanahan, John Keschl
requested a one week continuance of this meeting to permit the hearing
before a full Board.
Commissioner Volpe stated there is a quorum, there is a majority
and the Board of County Commissioners is prepared to proceed with the
meeting this evening.
County Manager Dorrtll gave an overview of the County Manager's
Agency from a lateral perspective. Utilizing an overhead projector,
he explained that historically within the County Manager's Office
there have been three assistants, one being the position of Assistant
County Manager (said position being vacant at the present time), with
two Administrative type positions providing personal assistance and
support to the County Manager's position, along with seven line divi-
sions dealing with commonly grouped departments, and he proceeded to
identify same. He verified there are two departments that are not
aligned in divisions, same being the Office of Capital Project
Management and Office of Management and Budget. He related that,
while some 1,O0! positions have been approved in the budget, the
number of positions in the County Manager's Agency is down to around
slightly over 900 positions as the result of the hiring freeze and
vacancies that are not being filled. He reflected that over the years
there has never been more than 5% of the entire organization in a
management classification. He announced that over the past five years
the number of county employees per capita has ranged from 5-1/2 to 6
employees. He explained that usually there is less than 1/3 of one
Page 2
February 5, 1992
~.'~. management position for every 1,000 residents in Collier County.
Commissioner Saunders pointed out that had the Board of County
Commissioners not adopted a hiring freeze but instead simply filled
all the positions as requested, the percentage would probably increase
to 6.2 or 6.3.
Mike McNees, Budget Director, interjected that the 5.9 reflects
budgeted positions and, therefore, if taking the hiring freeze into
affect and looking at how many positions were filled, the number would
be considerably below 5.9.
County Manager Dorrtll revealed that approximately 80 positions
have been included in the hiring freeze and, therefore, at any point
in time almost 9% of the entire work force ls lncluded in the freeze.
He implied it has been the focus to ascertain which positions can be
consolidated or phased out over the long term.
In response to Commissioner Volpe, County Manager Dorrill
verified he did, tn fact, meet with the Court Administrator's Office
regarding the Court Counselling position; with the Development
Services Steering Commlttee regarding some of the recommendations
within that report concerning the Community Development Division; and,
finally, with the Pelican Bay Municipal Taxing District regarding the
position of District Manager. He requested the original recommen-
dations stand as they have been proposed. Recognizing that the Court
Counselling function is believed to serve a valid purpose as a Court
Aide to the Judicial System, he suggested eliminating the present
position but combining some of the departmental responsibilities to
keep the program aspects and, if at all possible, the current encum-
bent in that position. Within the Developmen~ Services side, he
related there is support of the recommendations which have been made
ms well as interest in ascertaining whether or not the Housing and
<" Urban Development Department is more of a Social Service function as
~:~ opposed to a Community Development function. Regarding the Pelican
"' Bay Municipal Benefit Service Unit, he recommended elimination of the
" position of District Manager while exploring some form of contracted
04
,: Page 3
February 5, 1992
consulting management of the district.
Regarding the Court Counselling Program and the Pelican Bay
Municipal Service Taxing Unit District Manager positions, Commissioner
Saunders questioned whether the Board of County Commissioners should
keep these positions intact tonight and direct County Manager Dorrtll
to meet with appropriate entities to work out how there might be a
County Manager Dorrlll stated he is more /nc]/ned to say these
positions have been targeted for elimination, but work should be done
to resolve some of the implementation problems between now and
October.
Commissioner Saunders countered that he prefers to keep the posi-
tions open at this time and reconsider them for elimination at a time
when a new position has been found. He reasoned that, if recognizing
the person and the function should be maintained somewhere in the
county structure, there is no reason to create any type of uncertainty
for the program or the person tonight when there is no economic
impact until October 1, 1992.
County Manager Dorrill answered that if his recommendations are
heeded and the program is implemented immediately there will, in fact,
be some dollar savings as soon as the employees are moved.
In response to Commissioner Volpe, County Manager Dorrill con-
firmed there is a proposal to consolidate three of the planning
departments into one planning department with only one department
director as opposed to three.
Don Barber, Chairman of Development Services Advisory Committee,
stated the industry is still concerned about services, and wants to be
made a part of the reorganization planning. Accordingly, he submitted
a written list of five proposals regarding the proposed Development
Services reorganization.
In response to Commissioner Volpe, Mr. Barber confirmed that
County Manager Dorrtll has heard a verbalization of the five proposals
but has not been afforded the benefit of reviewing the written version
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February 5, 1992
currently presented, which he proceeded to read. He announced that
his committee generally concurs with the recommendations proposed by
County Manager Dorrtll.
The following persons spoke in opposition to the elimination
and/or drastic streamlining of the Court Counseling Division citing
reasons which include: The wisdom and economic effectiveness of this
program dispels any doubt about the worth of same; there is no logic
to consolidating this program with the Witness Management Program as
there is no relationship between the need to coordinate the presence
of witnesses with those in need of counselling due to alcohol and
substance abuse, mental or emotional illness, etc.; it is doubtful
that consolidation of this program with some other department will
affect any savings unless employees are dismissed from within the
department it is merged with; the Judges in the 20th Circuit have the
highest caseload of any Circuit in the state and our time as Judges is
greatly enhanced by what the Court Counselling Coordinator does; and
it is a position that is absolutely essential, saves money and, if
anything, we should be discussing expanding that area:
Judge William L. Blackwell
Judge Ted Brousseau
Frank Baker, on behalf of the Collier County Bar Association
eeo Recessed: 7:00 P.M. - Reconvened: 7:05 P.M. at which time
Deputy Clerk Guevin replaced Deputy Clerk Farris
The following people spoke concerning this item, stating: the
Pelican Bay Services positions should be maintained in order to con-
tinue the quality of service in Pelican Bay; residents in Pelican Bay
feel strongly that there is the need for a District Manager, however,
would not be opposed to contracting for that service; Pelican Bay
residents are willing to pay add~tional taxes for add~tional services;
strong support for Diane Flagg, whose position of Quality Assurance
Manager in EMS is proposed to be cut; if that position is eliminated,
the Board needs to look at the substructure of EMS and ask why this
critical, pivotal person is not a major player in that organization;
the posit/on of Court Counselor should be retained because of the
Page 5
February 5, 1992
funds being saved through the progress made in reducing the recidivism
rate, and causing individuals to become taxpayers rather than tax bur-
dens; concern with loss of services in the field through position cuts
that are paid by user fees; the performance of employees should be one
of the criteria used in the reduction efforts; those directly affected
by the changes as well as the public should have more input into the
position cuts, which should also be done in a more compassionate way;
the County Manager should be allowed to do the 3ob asked of him by the
Board of County Commissioners; elimination of the building inspector
and engineering inspector positions means a total of 24 employees will
be supervised by the one remaining compliance supervisor, resulting in
a degradation of services and elevation of problems to upper level
management at an ever increasing rate:
Bernie Young, Chairman, Pelican Bay M.S.T.B.U. Advisory Committee
Tape #3
Robert Tober, M.D.
Ken Rote
John Keschl
Mark Lamoureux
William Jones
Heyward Boyce
Frank Reske
Thomas Gaffney
George Keller
Karen Bishop
Frances Barsh
Mark Morton
In response to allegations of violation of Collier County
Ordinances made by Victor Valdes, Commissioner Volpe asked that he
present his information at the next regular Board of County
Commissioners meeting during the time set aside for public comment.
In answer to Commissioner Saunders, County Manager Dorrlll
explained the functions associated with Diane Flagg's position have
little to do with EMS. He said her function is to provide training to
non-County departments, including the Sheriff's Office and the inde-
pendent Fire Districts. He indicated there ts no need to retain that
function, however, he will attempt to place the employee within the
County.
Responding to Commissioner Volpe, Paul Brigham, Court
Administrator, stated he and County Manager Dorrtll have met a number
of times on the issue of the Court Counselor position. He said Mr.
Dorrtll has been presented an alternative proposal, however, this eve-
87
Page 6
February 5, 1992
ning's hearing lacks the benefit of time to work out that proposal.
He asked that the position be left on the table, and he be given the
opportunity to meet again with the County Manager to look at certain
other positions.
Commissioner Saunders communicated his understanding that an in-
depth analysis of functions was to be performed in order to eliminate
positions without eliminating the services.
County Manager Dorrill stated the Committee did not do an in-depth
analysis of the performance of individuals whose positions are pro-
posed to be eliminated. He said the first and foremost goal was to
determine whether the position is absolutely essential, not whether an
employee is outstanding, average or popular. He reminded the Board
that evaluation of employees is not a function of the Board of County
Commissioners.
County Manager Dorrill commented with regard to the building
inspector and engineering inspector positions proposed to be elimi-
nated, that those positions were volunteered by management of that
Division. He said a goal was set to limit the layers of supervision
to three, and in this instance there are four layers before getting to
those who do the work. He indicated he took it upon himself to make
the difficult decision of putting these two positions on the list.
Based on the controversy of this itea, the following ia a verbatim of
the ~ot~on by Comissioner GoodnJght and diacusston that fo/lowed:
I have a couple of suggestions. I think
that during the course of the discussion
that we have heard discussions on the
position in the Courts Administration.
We've heard discussions on Development
Services, in Pelican Bay and I think that
we should accede the Manager's first
Attachment of his plan with the
understanding that he's going to come
back with the recommendations, I would
assume during the budget process, as to
how he's going to centralize these and to
bring them in. And then we should accept
the pay changes and the title simplifica-
tions that's in Attachment 2.
Is that a motion, Commissioner Goodntght?
Yes, sir.
I'll second that.
Commissioner Goodnight:
Commissioner Volpe:
Commissioner Goodntght:
Commissioner Hasse:
Page 7
". Commissioner Volpe:
'~.~. ~ Commissioner Saunders:
February 5, 1992
A motion and a second. On the question,
Commissioner Saunders?
I guess a couple of concerns. First of
all, this sort of reminds me of the
debate that federal officials are having
concerning the federal economy and trying
to encourage people to buy more American
products. As soon as somebody says that,
the other side of the issue says well
that's Japan bashing and therefore we
shouldn't talk about how to improve
purchasing of American goods because that
raises the specter of Japan bashing. The
same thing has happened here tonight.
We've raised questions concerning the
Manager's proposal. The Manager has
characterized this as a popularity con-
test and I take strong exception to that.
We are talking about in my notes, five
positions and quite frankly, I don't know
personally any of the people in those
five positions. I know the Court
Counselor only by reputation, by what
I've heard. I'm sure I've met him but I
couldn't pick him out if he was standing
here with two other people I couldn't
pick out which one was the Court
Counselor. Jim Ward at Pelican Bay, I
know him by reputation and he's been to a
couple of meetings. I don't know him
personally. Diane Flagg, I'm not sure if
I've ever met her or not, perhaps I have
but I don't recall. The Engineering
Inspector Supervisor, the Building
Inspector Supervisor, I don't know who
those people are. So, I want to state at
the outset that this is not a popularity
contest. I don't know these people. My
concern for those five positions that I
Just mentioned is that I think we can
adopt the Manager's plan almost in total,
but I don't think we have to adopt the
entire plan and then be characterized as,
and if we don't adopt the entire plan we
are characterized as making political
decisions. For some reason, that's
improper to make a political decision.
Or we are characterized as doing
something that is not objective. I am
very objective ia my evaluation of the
Manager's plan. I have problems with the
five positions that was the focus of this
meeting tonight. I'd like to ask
Commissioner Goodnight if she would con-
sider the following. That is to approve
the Manager's plan with the following
exception. That the Court Counseling
Program or Counselor be left in place.
That Mr. Ward with the Pelican Bay
Improvement District be left in place.
Diane Flagg, the Quality Assurance
Protection person, be left in place. The
Engineering Inspector Supervisor be left
in place. And the Building Inspector
Supervisor be left in place. For the
time being. And the reason is, that
Commissioner Goodnight:
~euruar¥ D, 19~2
there is no economic impact on making
that decision tonight to eliminate those
positions. We've heard significant
information from the public which I think
we have an obligation to consider. The
Manager by his own admission has said
that he did not conduct an /n-depth ana-
lysis of the functions. I would like to
have an in-depth analysis of those func-
tions of those particular positions
before we simply eliminate them.
Furthermore, in reference to the Court
Counseling Program, there's been a state-
ment that the person should be preserved
and the function should be preserved. So
there is no reason to eliminate the posi-
t/on tonight. In reference to Pelican
Bay, the manager there, Mr. Ward,
there's no benefit to the taxpayers to
eliminate that position tonight. The
Manager has suggested that we have a
contractual arrangement with him. Let's
work out the contractual arrangement and
then let's take a look at the position.
We've heard testimony concerning the
Quality Assurance Protection Program from
Dr. Tober. I'm quite concerned about the
elimination of that program without there
being an in-depth analysis of the func-
tion of that particular position as well
as that person. The two Inspector
Supervisors, Engineering and Building
Inspection Supervisors, the Community
Development Division. Those two par-
ticular positions are totally funded by
user fees. Totally funded by the
building industry that came forward today
and asked that these positions be main-
tained. We al/ get calls from builders,
developers, single family home builders.
They are constantly calling us up and
saying we need help in terms of getting
something through the building Community
Development Department, we need some help
in getting a building inspector to come
out and take a look at our project. If
we eliminate those two supervisory posi-
tions, I believe we create a problem of
service to that industry. But more
importantly, that industry is paying for
those two positi~ns. I would,
Commissioner Goodn]ght, respectfully
request that I'll support your motion if
you'll make that amendment.
Well, I think that what my motion said
was that the Court~ AdmJnJstrat~on pos~-
tion, the position that was in Pelican
Bay and the positions that was in the
Development Services, that these posi-
tlons would be addressed by Mr. Dorrill
and the advisory boards that were there
and that whether there was a contract and
I will go further to tell you that
whether there was a contractual agreement
or whatever happened with Pelican Bay or
with any of the rest of them, that this
~ g~]~Or:~ 10 Page 9
Commissioner Saunders:
Commissioner Hasse:
Commissioner Saunders:
Commissioner Goodntght:
Commissioner Volpe:
February 5, 1992
would be an item that would be brought
back to us during the budget hearings so
that the final decision could be made by
this Board whether or not to terminate
that position or if there was an alter-
native selection such as the contractual
agreement. However, I will completely
disagree about the posit/on with EMS. I
do not feel like it is our Job to train
the fire fighters in this County without
us being paid for it and it has nothing
to do with Miss Flagg because I am very
well familiar with her. I know her, I
have talked to her. She has helped me on
a couple of accidents that I have been on
the scene and she is an excellent
employee. But I feel like that this
Board has got to be responsible to the
citizens and if we're going to train fire
fighters to be EMS, then the independent
districts should pay the County for that.
And so I have no problem whatsoever of
eliminating that one position.
OK, Just so I understand your motion
then, because I didn't quite understand
it the way you've rephrased it. I will
support the motion .....
Well I have seconded the motion as it
was.
Just a second, Commissioner Hasse. OK, I
understand, but we're trying to clarify
the motion right now and Commissioner
Goodnight made the motion. The clarifi-
cation, I believe, was a little bit dif-
ferent than the motion and I want to make
sure I understand what the motion is.
The motion at this point is to approve
the Manager's plan with four exceptions
at this point, the Court Counselor, the
Pelican Bay person and the two Inspector
Supervisors, the Engineering Inspector
Supervisor and the Building Inspector
Supervisor, until there's further analy-
sis done during the budget process.
It's not Just the two building super-
visors. It's all of the people that are
in Compliance Services, because from Don
Barber's paper, that Committee is wanting
to go back and look at the reorganiza-
tion. They are tn support of the reorga-
nization but they're wanting to have some
more ~n-depth studies on the thing. So,
I'm not Just looking at those two inspec-
tors, I'm looking at Community
Development all together and at the time
we're going through the budget process,
where we're going to approve or
disapprove, then the Manager's going to
come back with his alternatives.
Commissioner Goodnight, I think I
understood the motion as it's been
clarified. And so that I, Just for my
February 5, 1992
Commissioner Goodnlght:
Commissioner Volpe:
County Manager Dorrill:
Commissioner Hasse:
Commissioner Saunders:
own, and maybe for the record as well,
your motion is accepting the recommen-
dation with respect to Attachment I which
has to do with the proposed position
reductions? I think that was part of
what you recommended .......
With Attachment I with the exceptions of
the three which had to deal with Courts
Administration, which Mr. Dorrill has
indicated that he will work with Mr.
Brigham on coming up with Just exactly
how that's going to be structured. He
also indicated that he's wanting, that he
will work with the Steering Committee for
Development Services, so that the people
that are in there, there will not be a
lack of services, but we will still be
able to get the Job done. And then the
Pelican Bay committee has also said that
there are some alternatives for that and
directing Mr. Dorrill to look at that.
And then accepting the rest of the
attachments.
Thank you. Obvl~usly these are very dif-
ficult decisions that we are required to
make. I'm supportive of the plan for
reorganization, and I'm not insensitive
to the people who occupy certain of these
positions. I think that this is a Good
first step of what it is we're trying to
do and I think that, Mr. Dorrill, you've
got your work cut out for you with Phase
2 of this program as well. So, I think
that what you've done and what we're
attempting to do is responsive to what we
feel is a balance in terms of the ser-
vices to be provided. And obviously, we
are in the business of providing these
services and whether it's Development
Services or any of the other services.
We have not heard from some of the other
people whose positions are being elimi-
nated and that doesn't mean they are any
less important than those who have had
people who have come and who have spoken
on their behalf. So, there are at least
21 other positions out there that are
being eliminated for whom we've not heard
a speaker and we've gotten some
correspondence. That's not to suggest
that those positions aren't equally as
important as those s~x that we've heard
very eloquent speeches about the impor-
tance of those positions and the func-
tions.
Thank you.
Mr. Chairman, before you ask for a vote,
I might say this. You said Just what was
supposed to be said ~n regard to, we're
talking about positions. We're not
talking about individuals.
Mr. Chairman
,7. Commiss'.oner Volpe:
· ~. Commissioner Saunders:
Co~issioner Goodnight:
February 5, 1992
Mr. Chairman
We have a motion and a second.
Before you actually call the vote, then
support the motion as outlined by
Commissioner Goodnight in her last com-
ment as to what the motion intended to
do.
And Mr. Chairman, if you want to hear
more about Parks & Rec., Commissioner
Hasse and I will be more than happy to
give you however long you want to sit
here about how important we feel like
Parks & Recreation is in Collier County.
Commissioner Hasse:
No, please not tonight.
Commissioner Volpe:
We have a motion and a second. Any
further discusst.>n? Hearing none, I'll
call for the vote. All in favor signify
by saying Aye. The motion passes unani-
mously.
':i There being no further business for the Good of the County, the
i""~ meeting was adjourned by Order of the Chair - Time: 8:45 P.M.
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,>:. Th* ,e[~%~es approved by the Board on
as presented or as corrected
BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS/EX
OFFICIO GOVERNING BOARD(S) OF
SPECIAL DISTRICTS UNDER ITS
CONTROL
Page 12