BCC Minutes 10/26/2010 R
October 26, 2010
TRANSCRIPT OF THE MEETING OF THE
BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
Naples, Florida, October 26, 2010
LET IT BE REMEMBERED, that the Board of County
Commissioners, in and for the County of Collier, and also acting as
the Board of Zoning Appeals and as the governing board(s) of such
special districts as have been created according to law and having
conducted business herein, met on this date at 9:00 a.m., in
REGULAR SESSION in Building "F" of the Government Complex,
East Naples, Florida, with the following members present:
CHAIRMAN:
Fred Coyle
Jim Coletta
Donna Fiala
Frank Halas
T om Henning
ALSO PRESENT:
Leo Ochs, County Manager
Jeffrey A. Klatzkow, County Attorney
Ian Mitchell, BCC Executive Manager
Crystal Kinzel, Clerk's Office
Mike Sheffield, Assistant to the County Manager
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COLLIER COUNTY
BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
COMMUNITY REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY BOARD (CRAB)
AIRPORT AUTHORITY
AGENDA
October 26, 2010
9:00 AM
Fred W. Coyle, BCC Chairman Commissioner, District 4
Frank Halas, BCC Vice-Chairman Commissioner, District 2
Jim Coletta, BCC Commissioner, District 5, CRAB Vice-Chairman
Donna Fiala, BCC Commissioner, District 1, CRAB Chairman
Tom Henning, BCC Commissioner, District 3
NOTICE: ALL PERSONS WISHING TO SPEAK ON AGENDA ITEMS MUST
REGISTER PRIOR TO SPEAKING. SPEAKERS MUST REGISTER WITH THE
COUNTY MANAGER PRIOR TO THE PRESENT A TION OF THE AGENDA
ITEM TO BE ADDRESSED. ALL REGISTERED SPEAKERS WILL RECEIVE
UP TO THREE (3) MINUTES UNLESS THE TIME IS ADJUSTED BY THE
CHAIRMAN.
COLLIER COUNTY ORDINANCE NO. 2003-53, AS AMENDED BY
ORDINANCE 2004-05 AND 2007-24, REQUIRES THAT ALL LOBBYISTS
SHALL, BEFORE ENGAGING IN ANY LOBBYING ACTIVITIES
(INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, ADDRESSING THE BOARD OF
COUNTY COMMISSIONERS), REGISTER WITH THE CLERK TO THE
BOARD AT THE BOARD MINUTES AND RECORDS DEPARTMENT.
REQUESTS TO ADDRESS THE BOARD ON SUBJECTS WHICH ARE NOT ON
THIS AGENDA MUST BE SUBMITTED IN WRITING WITH EXPLANATION
TO THE COUNTY MANAGER AT LEAST 13 DAYS PRIOR TO THE DATE OF
THE MEETING AND WILL BE HEARD UNDER "PUBLIC PETITIONS."
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October 26, 2010
PUBLIC PETITIONS ARE LIMITED TO THE PRESENTER, WITH A
MAXIMUM TIME OF TEN MINUTES.
ANY PERSON WHO DECIDES TO APPEAL A DECISION OF THIS BOARD
WILL NEED A RECORD OF THE PROCEEDINGS PERTAINING THERETO,
AND THEREFORE MAY NEED TO ENSURE THAT A VERBATIM RECORD
OF THE PROCEEDINGS IS MADE, WHICH RECORD INCLUDES THE
TESTIMONY AND EVIDENCE UPON WHICH THE APPEAL IS TO BE BASED.
IF YOU ARE A PERSON WITH A DISABILITY WHO NEEDS ANY
ACCOMMODATION IN ORDER TO PARTICIPATE IN THIS PROCEEDING,
YOU ARE ENTITLED, AT NO COST TO YOU, TO THE PROVISION OF
CERTAIN ASSISTANCE. PLEASE CONTACT THE COLLIER COUNTY
FACILITIES MANAGEMENT DEPARTMENT LOCATED AT 3301 EAST
TAMIAMI TRAIL, NAPLES, FLORIDA, 34] 12, (239) 252-8380; ASSISTED
LISTENING DEVICES FOR THE HEARING IMPAIRED ARE A V AIL ABLE IN
THE COUNTY COMMISSIONERS' OFFICE.
LUNCH RECESS SCHEDULED FOR 12:00 NOON TO 1 :00 P.M.
1. INVOCATION AND PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE
A. Reverend Sammy Mosquera - United Pentecostal Church
2. AGENDA AND MINUTES
A. Approval of to day's regular, consent and summary agenda as amended (Ex
Parte Disclosure provided by Commission members for consent and
summary agenda.)
B. September 23, 2010 - BCC/Budget Hearings
C. September 28,2010 - BCC/Regular Meeting Minutes
3. SERVICE AWARDS: (EMPLOYEE AND ADVISORY BOARD MEMBERS)
A. 20 Year Attendees
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October 26, 2010
1) Kevin Dugan, Transportation Engineering
B. 25 Year Attendees
1) Alice Toppe, Risk Management
C. 30 Year Attendees
1) Rhonda Tibbetts, Purchasing
D. 35 Year Attendees
1) Kathy Carpenter, Public Services Administration
4. PROCLAMATIONS
A. Proclamation designating October 26,2010 as the Eleventh Anniversary
Day of the Red Walk in Collier County. To be accepted by Susan Barcellino.
Sponsored by Commissioner Fiala.
B. Proclamation congratulating the Collier County Solid Waste Management
Department for the receipt of the 2010 Silver Excellence Award. To be
accepted by Dan Rodriguez, Solid Waste Management Director, and Solid
Waste Management staff. Sponsored by Commissioner Halas.
C. Proclamation designating October 30, 20 I 0 and October 31, 20 I 0 as Swamp
Buggy Races Weekend. To be accepted by the Honorable Chuck McMahon,
Casey Hornback, the Honorable Thomas Cannon, Norman Tester, Rob
Swiss, Randy Johns and Mark Creel. Sponsored by Commissioner Coletta.
D. Proclamation designating October 26,2010 as Safe and Healthy Children's
Coalition Water Safety Day. To be accepted by Dr. Vedder and Associates.
Sponsored by Commissioner Coletta.
E. Proclamation designating November 4 thru November 7, 2010 as Naples
Film Festival Week. To be accepted by Rowan Samuel, Founder and CEO
of Naples International Film Festival. Sponsored by Commissioner Coletta.
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October 26, 2010
5. PRESENTATIONS
A. Presentation of the Collier County "Business of the Month" award
to Conditioned Air of Naples for October 2010. To be accepted by
W. Theodore Etzel, III, President & CEO.
B. Presentation of the Advisory Committee Outstanding Member of the Month
Award to Jeffrey S. Curl for his contribution to the Land Acquisition
Advisory Committee.
C. Presentation by Clarence Tears, Director, Big Cypress Basin, regarding real-
time modeling and gate operations.
6. PUBLIC PETITIONS
A. This item continued from the September 28, 2010 BCC Meetin2. Public
Petition request from E's Country Store at Oil Well Road and Immokalee
Road.
B. This item continued from the October 12, 2010 BCC Meetin2. Public
Petition request from Ms. Monique Perez Marini requesting assistance for
Chinese Drywall remediation.
Item 7 and 8 to be heard no sooner than 1 :00 p.m" unless otherwise noted.
7. BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS
8. ADVERTISED PUBLIC HEARINGS
A. Recommendation to adopt an Ordinance amending Chapter 74 of the Collier
County Code of Laws and Ordinances (The Collier County Consolidated
Impact Fee Ordinance) providing for the incorporation by reference of the
impact fee study entitled the Collier County Emergency Medical Services
Impact Fee Study Update, dated September 30, 20 I 0, and the Collier County
2010 Fire/Rescue Services Impact Fee Update Study Ochopee and Isles of
Capri Fire Control and Rescue Districts; amending the Fire Impact Fee rate
schedule, which is Schedule Five of Appendix A, in accordance with the
findings of the update study; amending the Emergency Medical Services
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October 26, 2010
Impact Fee rate schedule, which is Schedule Seven of Appendix A, as set
forth in the update study, which provides for a reduction in rates; providing
for a delayed effective date of November 1,2010 for the amended
Emergency Medical Services Impact Fee rates and a delayed effective date
of January 24,201 I for the amended Fire Impact Fee rates, in accordance
with the 90-day notice requirements of Section 163.31801, Florida Statutes,
which is the Florida Impact Fee Act.
9. BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
A. Appointment of member to the Golden Gate Estates Land Trust Committee.
10. COUNTY MANAGER'S REPORT
A. Recommendation to accept the report on the status of cable television
competition within Collier County. (Jamie French, Manager, Operations and
Regulatory Management, Growth Management Division)
B. Recommendation to approve the FYII Contract between Collier County and
the State of Florida Department of Health for operation of the Collier
County Health Department in the amount of $ I ,666,400. (Marla Ramsey,
Public Services Administrator)
C. Recommendation to adopt a Bond Resolution authorizing refunding of all of
the County's outstanding Capital Improvement Revenue Bonds, Series 2002,
in the amount not to exceed $27,300,000. (Mark Isackson, Corporate
Financial Planning and Management Services, County Manager's Office)
D. Recommendation to authorize Waste Management Inc. of Florida, to submit
an application to the Florida Department of Environmental Protection to
increase the height of the Collier County Landfill to a maximum elevation of
200 feet above grade to gain additional disposal capacity, saving rate-payer
funds and maximize existing resources. (Jim DeLony, Public Utilities
Administrator)
E. Recommendation to award Bid # I 0-5594 North Collier Recycling Drop-Off
Center to Taylor-Pansing Inc. in the amount of $1 ,412,385 for construction
of the North Collier Recycling Drop-Off Center at the North County Water
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October 26,2010
Reclamation Facility, Project #70013. (Dan Rodriguez, Director, Solid
Waste)
F. Recommendation to direct the County Manager or his designee to prepare an
appeal to the proposed FEMA Flood Maps by authorizing the county's
consultant to remodel and provide more current flood maps for two of the
twelve basins at a cost not to exceed $75,000 and to process the necessary
budget amendments. (Robert Wiley, Project Manager, Growth Management
Division)
G. Recommendation to review options related to the application ofreduced
impact fee rates to building permits that have not been issued and are
currently in apply or ready status, prepared in accordance with direction
provided by the Board of County Commissioners on October 12, 20 I O.
(Amy Patterson, Impact Fee and Economic Development Manager, Growth
Management Division)
H. This item to be heard at 1 :00 p.m. Recommendation to deny North Naples
Fire Control and Rescue Districts application for a Certificate of Public
Convenience and Necessity for an Advanced Life Support Non-Transport
Service. (Dan Summers, Director, Bureau of Emergency Services)
11. PUBLIC COMMENTS ON GENERAL TOPICS
12. COUNTY ATTORNEY'S REPORT
13. OTHER CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICERS
14. AIRPORT AUTHORITY AND/OR COMMUNITY REDEVELOPMENT
AGENCY
A. Recommendation for the Community Redevelopment Agency (CRA) to
approve a Request for Proposal (RFP) scope of work to build single-family
homes on CRA owned land; approve the Executive Director's advertisement
of the RFP through the Purchasing Department and return with
recommendations. (Jean Jourdan, CRA Project Manager)
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October 26, 2010
]5. STAFF AND COMMISSION GENERAL COMMUNICATIONS
16. CONSENT AGENDA - All matters listed under this item are considered to be
routine and action will be taken by one motion without separate discussion of
each item. If discussion is desired by a member of the Board, that item(s) will
be removed from the Consent Agenda and considered separately.
A. GROWTH MANAGEMENT DIVISION
1) Recommendation to approve final acceptance of the water and sewer
utility facilities for Mercato.
2) Recommendation to approve final acceptance of the water utility
facility from Osprey Pointe at Pelican Marsh Condominium
Association, Inc.
3) Recommendation to approve the partial release of lien in the Code
Enforcement Action entitled Board of County Commissioners vs. Ted
Zhi Luo, Code Enforcement Board Case No. 2007-100, relating to
property located at 11580 Riggs Road, Collier County, Florida.
4) Approve Change Order No.5 to the agreement between Collier
County and Van Buskirk, Ryffel and Associates Inc. for the updating
of the Collier Interactive Growth Model (CIGM) and for continued
interaction with the Horizon Study Oversight Committee.
5) Recommendation to approve Release and Satisfactions of Lien for
Five separate Code Enforcement cases.
6) Recommendation to approve an amendment to an existing purchase
agreement with extended possession related to the Vanderbilt Beach
Road Extension Project. Project #60168 (Fiscal Impact: $0.00).
7) Recommendation to approve an easement agreement for purchase of a
road right-of-way, drainage and utility easement (Parcel 1344RDUE)
required for the Vanderbilt Beach Road Extension Project. (Project
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October 26, 2010
#60168 - Phase II.) Estimated Fiscal Impact: $6,575.
8) Recommendation to approve the adoption of the Zero Tolerance
Substance Abuse Policy for Collier Area Transit to be implemented
by the transit management vendor, Tectrans.
9) Recommendation to enter into a Landscape Maintenance Agreement
with Kings Lake Homeowners Association to allow the association to
perform maintenance along Kings Lake Boulevard and other
landscaped areas that may be within the County rights-of-way within
the HOA's jurisdiction and that the Board of County Commissioners
waive the right-of-way permitting fee in the amount of $2,000.
10) Recommendation to approve the request by the Economic
Development Council of Collier County to provide a waiver of the
minimum job creation requirement for a business locating in western
Collier County (creating 20 full time jobs) to allow ValueCentric,
LLC to be accepted into the Job Creation Investment Program and
Broadband Infrastructure Investment Program for creation of a
regional headquarter's office in Collier County (Fiscal Impact:
$48,750)
11) Recommendation to approve the application by Animal Specialty
Hospital of Florida, LLC for the Job Creation Investment Program.
B. COMMUNITY REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY
1) Recommendation for the Community Redevelopment Agency (CRA)
to approve and execute a Commercial Building Improvement Grant
Agreement between the CRA and a Grant Applicant within the
Bayshore Gateway Triangle area. (4097 Bayshore Drive, $30,000.)
2) Recommendation for the Community Redevelopment Agency (CRA)
to approve and execute a Commercial Building Improvement Grant
Agreement between the CRA and a Grant Applicant within the
Bayshore Gateway Triangle area. (2891 Bayview Drive, $50,000.)
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October 26, 2010
3) Recommendation for the Community Redevelopment Agency (CRA)
to approve and execute a Site Improvement Grant Agreement between
the CRA and a Grant Applicant within the Bayshore Gateway
Triangle area. (2741 Riverview Drive, $8,000)
4) Recommendation that the Community Redevelopment Agency (CRA)
approve CRA staff attendance at Florida Brownfield's Association
2010 Annual Conference; authorize payment of attendee registration,
lodging, travel and per diem from the Bayshore Gateway Triangle
Trust Fund (Fund 187) travel budget; and declare the training received
as serving a valid public purpose. (Fiscal Impact: $601)
C. PUBLIC UTILITIES
1) Recommendation to accept a South Florida Water Management
District Alternative Water Supply Grant in the amount of $500,000
for partial funding of the construction ofthe Irrigation Quality Water
Pond Liner, Project #73950.
2) Recommendation to award Bid No. 10-5556, Bleach Storage and Feed
Facility Modifications at the South County Water Reclamation
Facility, to Odyssey Manufacturing Company, in the amount of
$539,000 for Project #73969, South County Water Reclamation
Facility Technical Support.
3) Recommendation to approve the acquisition of an easement area to
improve on the current access route serving Master Pump Station 312
in order to ease the inconvenience to neighboring property owners for
a total cost not to exceed $2,100 (Project #72549).
4) Recommendation to approve a payment plan agreement & completion
ofa State of Florida Uniform Commercial Code Financing Statement
Form and Security Agreement to secure the payment plan debt
between Ms. Denise Denard and Collier County's Water-Sewer
District as one-time exception to Consolidated Impact Fee Ordinance
No. 2001-13, as amended, for wastewater impact fees and allowance
for funds prudently invested fee for building Permit #2010070017.
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October 26, 2010
D. PUBLIC SERVICES
1) Recommendation to approve and authorize the Chairman to sign four
(4) change orders for contract extensions to provide additional time to
complete grant-related residential rehabilitation activities being
funded by the Collier County Neighborhood Stabilization Program.
2) Recommendation to approve grant related expenditures in excess of
$50,000 for real property acquired under the Neighborhood
Stabilization Program to fund rehabilitation activities. Funding will
ensure compliance with Collier County Building Code regulations and
further the goals and objectives of the Housing Element of the Growth
Management Plan (estimated fiscal impact: $57,364.09).
3) Recommendation to approve and authorize the Chairman to sign ten
(10) Subrecipient Agreements for the Community Development Block
Grant (CDBG) and Home Investment Partnership Program (HOME)
projects previously approved for Department of Housing and Urban
Development (HUD) Funding in the 2010-201] Action Plan.
4) Recommendation to approve and authorize the Chairman to sign
twelve (12) releases of liens for deferral of 100% of Collier County
impact fees for owner occupied affordable housing dwelling units.
5) Recommendation to authorize staff to apply for a US Soccer
Foundation Grant in the amount of$20,000 to provide for registration
fees, uniforms, and soccer equipment for the Youth Soccer program at
Immokalee Sports Complex.
6) Recommendation to authorize staff to apply for a US Soccer
Foundation Grant in the amount of $1 00,000 to retro-fit existing
lighting at Immokalee Sports Complex.
E. ADMINISTRATIVE SERVICES
1) Recommendation to approve an Agreement for Sale and Purchase
with Richard F. Berman as to 1/3 interest and Raymond and Terry
Bennett also known as Terri Bennett, husband and wife, as to 1/3
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October 26, 2010
interest and Frank J. Celsnak and Marlene J. Celsnak Trustees U/D/T
dated December 27, 1991 as to 1/3 interest for 2.73 acres under the
Conservation Collier Land Acquisition Program, at a cost not to
exceed $28,000.
2) Recommendation to approve an Agreement for Sale and Purchase
with Mabel R. Boose, Trustee, Mabel R. Boose Trust, such trust
having been established under that certain Revocable Trust
Agreement dated June 12,2006 for 1.59 acres under the Conservation
Collier Land Acquisition Program, at a cost not to exceed $16,500.
3) Recommendation to approve an Agreement for Sale and Purchase
with Linda Jones, and Kay Kinlaw-Presutti formerly known as Kay
Kinlaw as Joint Tenants with Full Rights of Survivorship for 1.59
acres under the Conservation Collier Land Acquisition Program, at a
cost not to exceed $16,500.
4) Recommendation to approve an Agreement for Sale and Purchase
with Aspen DaNee, LLC, a Florida limited liability company, by its
undersigned Managing Member, for 1.14 acres under the
Conservation Collier Land Acquisition Program, at a cost not to
exceed $9,] 00.
5) Recommendation to approve an Agreement for Sale and Purchase
with Barbara S. Cannon, as to an undivided 1/3 interest, and Marsha
S. McElroy, formerly known as Marsha S. Ghent, as to an undivided
1/3 interest, and Deborah S. Mullis, as to an undivided 1/3 interest for
2.27 acres under the Conservation Collier Land Acquisition Program,
at a cost not to exceed $17,650.
6) Recommendation to approve the one year extension of Contract
#06-3983, Group Health Third Party Administration Services to
Meritain Health, Inc. in the anticipated annual amount of$392,875.
7) Recommendation to authorize budget amendments appropriating
$55,758 ofFY2010 carry forward for approved purchasing card
transactions in Fiscal Year 2011 for operating budget funds.
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October 26, 2010
8) Recommendation to approve a resolution establishing a policy for the
acceptance of monetary payment and land donations by the
Conservation Collier Land Acquisition Program in lieu of meeting
off-site native retention requirements, as set forth in recent
amendments to the Land Development Code (LDC), Section 3.05.07.
9) Recommendation to authorize the on-line auction of Collier County
surplus property.
F. COUNTY MANAGER OPERATIONS
1) Recommendation to approve a resolution approving budget
amendments (appropriating grants, donations, contributions or
insurance proceeds) to the Fiscal Year 20 I 0-11 Adopted Budget.
2) Recommendation that the Board of County Commissioners review
and approve the Fiscal Year 2011 Strategic Plan for the Naples,
Marco Island, Everglades Convention and Visitors Bureau (CVB) and
approve all necessary budget amendments.
G. AIRPORT AUTHORITY
1) Recommendation to approve and authorize the Chairman to execute a
resolution authorizing execution of Joint Participation Agreement
Contract No. AQI22 with the Florida Department of Transportation to
fund security upgrades at the Marco Island Executive Airport in the
amount of $60,000.
H. BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
1) Commissioner Halas requests Board approval for reimbursement to
attend the NAACP Freedom Banquet. $65 to be paid from
Commissioner Halas' travel budget.
2) Commissioner Fiala requests Board approval for reimbursement
regarding attendance at a function serving a Valid Public Purpose.
Attended Marco Police Foundation Lunch with the Chief at CJ's on
the Bay, Marco Island, FL on September 27,2010. $20 to be paid
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October 26, 2010
from Commissioner Fiala's travel budget.
3) Commissioner Fiala requests Board approval for reimbursement
regarding attendance at a function serving a Valid Public Purpose.
Attended New Water System Effort Appreciation Luncheon at Pelican
Bend on Isles of Capri, FL on October 1,2010. $12 to be paid from
Commissioner Fiala's travel budget.
I. MISCELLANEOUS CORRESPONDENCE
1) Miscellaneous items to file for record with action as directed.
J. OTHER CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICERS
1) To obtain Board approval for disbursements for the period of October
2, 20 I 0 through October 8, 20 I 0 and for submission into the official
records of the Board.
2) To obtain Board approval for disbursements for the period of October
9,2010 through October 15,2010 and for submission into the official
records of the Board.
3) Pursuant to Florida Statute 318.18(l3)(b) the Clerk of the Circuit
Court is required to file the amount of traffic infraction surcharges
collected under Florida Statute 3l8.18(l3)(a)(I) with the Board of
County Commissioners.
4) Request that the Board of County Commissioners approve the transfer
of tangible personal property, purchased in FYI 0 to benefit the Collier
County Sheriff, to the custody of the Sheriff of Collier County.
5) Recommendation to approve a budget amendment recognizing carry
forward earned from previous year's interest and current interest
earned in Supervisor of Elections Grant Fund No. 37008.
6) Recommendation to approve a budget amendment recognizing carry
forward earned from previous year's interest and current interest
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October 26, 2010
earned in Supervisor of Elections Grant Fund No.3 70 II.
K. COUNTY ATTORNEY
1) Recommendation to approve an agreed order awarding expert fees
and costs in the amount of $42,000 for Parcels 109FEE & 109TCE in
the lawsuit styled Collier County v. A.L. Subs, Inc., et a!., Case No.
09-3691-CA (Collier Blvd. Project #60092) (Fiscal Impact: $42,000)
2) Recommendation to approve a Stipulated Final Judgment in the
amount of$127,500 for Parcels 169FEE &169TCE in the lawsuit
styled Collier County v. Scott Faunce., et a!., Case No. 10-2684-CA
(Collier Blvd. Project #68056) (Fiscal Impact: $85,300)
17. SUMMARY AGENDA - THIS SECTION IS FOR ADVERTISED PUBLIC
HEARINGS AND MUST MEET THE FOLLOWING CRITERIA: 1) A
RECOMMENDATION FOR APPROVAL FROM STAFF; 2) UNANIMOUS
RECOMMENDATION FOR APPROVAL BY THE COLLIER COUNTY
PLANNING COMMISSION OR OTHER AUTHORIZING AGENCIES OF
ALL MEMBERS PRESENT AND VOTING; 3) NO WRITTEN OR ORAL
OBJECTIONS TO THE ITEM RECEIVED BY STAFF, THE COLLIER
COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION, OTHER AUTHORIZING
AGENCIES OR THE BOARD, PRIOR TO THE COMMENCEMENT OF
THE BCC MEETING ON WHICH THE ITEMS ARE SCHEDULED TO BE
HEARD; AND 4) NO INDIVIDUALS ARE REGISTERED TO SPEAK IN
OPPOSITION TO THE ITEM. FOR THOSE ITEMS, WHICH ARE QUASI-
JUDICIAL IN NATURE, ALL PARTICIPANTS MUST BE SWORN IN.
A. This item requires that ex parte disclosure be provided bv Commission
Members. Should a hearin2 be held on this item, all participants are
required to be sworn in. Recommendation to approve Petition V AC-
PL20 I 0-1116, to disclaim, renounce and vacate the County and the Public
interest in two 7.5-foot wide drainage easements and in two 5-foot wide
landscape buffer easements over Lot 2 and Lot 3, White Lake Corporate
Park, according to the Plat thereof as recorded in Plat Book 31, Pages 26
through 28, of the Public Records of Collier County, Florida, situated in
Section 35, Township 49 South, Range 26 East, Collier County, Florida, the
easements to be vacated are more specifically depicted and described in
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October 26, 2010
Exhibit A, and accept the replacement drainage easement depicted and
described on Exhibit B.
B. This item requires that all participants be sworn in and ex parte
disclosure be provided bv Commission members. Petition: PUDZ-2008-
AR-14048 Robert E. Williams, Trustee of the Robert E. Williams Trust
dated October 5, 2004, represented by D. Wayne Arnold, AICP ofQ. Grady
Minor and Associates, Inc., is requesting a rezoning from Commercial (C-2)
and Mobile Home (MH) zoning districts with a Rural Fringe Mixed Use
Neutral Lands overlay to a Commercial Planned Unit Development (CPUD)
zoning district, with removal of the Rural Fringe Mixed Use Neutral Lands
overlay, for a project to be known as Corkscrew Commercial Center CPUD.
The rezoning petition allows for a maximum 60,000 square feet of
commercial, retail, office, church and school uses. The subject property
consists of 8+/- acres which is located at the northwest corner of Immokalee
Road and Platt Road in Section 27, Township 47 South, Range 27 East, in
Collier County, Florida.
C. Recommendation to adopt a Resolution approving amendments
(appropriating carry forward, transfers and supplemental revenue) to the
Fiscal Year 20 I 0-11 Adopted Budget.
18. ADJOURN
INQUIRIES CONCERNING CHANGES TO THE BOARD'S AGENDA SHOULD
BE MADE TO THE COUNTY MANAGER'S OFFICE AT 252-8383.
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October 26, 2010
October 26, 2010
MR.OCHS: Mr. Chairman, you have a live mike.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Ladies and gentlemen, the Board
of County Commission meeting is now in session. Will you please
stand while Reverend Sammy Mosquera of the United Pentecostal
Church provides the invocation.
REVEREND MOSQUERA: Good morning. Thank you.
Almighty God, ruler of the universe. You are the giver of all
good gifts. Your power will move, and we have our beings (sic).
Weare gathered here today to serve you and to conduct the
affairs of this beautiful county of Collier. Give us the knowledge and
the strength to do your will with the proper balance of eternal values
in our present needs.
May we accept our responsibilities and not (sic) with courage.
Consider the feelings of other people. Grant us a sense of justice and
a stewardship both now and forever.
We ask this to your Lord Jesus Christ. Our Father, who art in
heaven, hallowed be thy name, thy kingdom come, thy will be done,
on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and
forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us,
and lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil. For thine is
the kingdom, the power, the glory, now and forever. Amen.
I pledge allegiance --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Please join us in the Pledge of
Allegiance.
(The Pledge of Allegiance was recited in unison.)
Item #2A
TODA Y'S REGULAR, CONSENT AND SUMMARY AGENDA AS
AMENDED - APPROVED AND OR ADOPTED W /CHANGES
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. County Manager, you have any
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October 26, 2010
changes to the agenda today?
MR. OCHS: Yes, sir. Good morning, Commissioners. These
are your agenda changes, Board of County Commissioners' meeting
October 26, 2010.
First item is a request to withdraw Item 14A. It's a
recommendation for the Community Redevelopment Agency to
approve a request for proposal, scope of work to build single-family
homes on CRA-owned land, and that's requested by the staff.
Next item is to move Item 16A6 from your consent agenda to
your regular agenda. It will become Item 101. It's a recommendation
to approve an amendment to an existing purchase agreement with
extended possession related to the Vanderbilt Beach Road extension
project. That item's moved at Commissioner Coyle's request.
Next item is to move 16D2 from the consent agenda to the
regular agenda to become Item lOJ. It's a recommendation to approve
grant-related expenditures in excess of $50,000 for real property
acquired under the Neighborhood Stabilization Program to fund
rehabilitation activities. That item is moved at Commissioner Coyle's
request.
Next change is to continue Item 16F2 to the December 14,2010,
BCC meeting. It's a recommendation that the Board of County
Commissioners review and approve the fiscal year 2011 strategic plan
for the Naples, Marco Island, Everglades Convention and Visitor's
Bureau, that is being requested by the staff.
You have two time-certain items this morning Commissioners.
Item lOG will be heard at 10: 15 a.m., and the other item that's
previously been published in your agenda for a time certain is Item
10H, and that will be heard at one p.m.
Those are all the changes I have, sir.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Thank you very much.
County Attorney?
MR. KLA TZKOW: No changes.
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October 26, 2010
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. And we'll go to the
commissioners. We'll start with Commissioner Henning this time for
ex parte disclosure and any changes to the agenda.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Good morning, Mr. Chair.
I have no changes to today's agenda. 1 do have ex parte
communication on 17D, and I received staffs report to the Planning
Commission.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Commissioner Coletta.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Yes. Good morning, sir.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Good morning.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: No changes to the agenda, and
the only ex parte I have is on the summary agenda, 17B. I have
received correspondence, and it's in my file for anyone that wishes to
see it.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Thank you. And I have no
further changes to the agenda. And with respect to ex parte disclosure,
I have received Collier County Planning Commission staff report on
Item 17B.
Commissioner Halas?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Good morning, Chairman.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Good morning.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: As far as any changes to today's
agenda, 1 have no changes at all. And as far as disclosures, the only
one that I have is 17B, and that is a staff report, and that's basically the
report from the Planning Commission.
Thank you very much.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you.
And Commissioner Fiala?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yes. No changes or corrections to
the agenda. Nothing to declare on the consent agenda. And I only
have 17B and, again, just as the others, the staff report.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you very much. Then I'll
Page 4
October 26, 2010
entertain a motion to approve the --
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Motion to approve today's agenda.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: -- minutes, agenda.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Second.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Very well. Motion by Commissioner
Halas to approve, second by Commissioner Fiala.
Any further discussion?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: All in favor, please signifY by saying
aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Aye.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Any opposed, by like sign?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: The motion passes unanimously.
Page 5
Agenda Changes
Board of County Commissioners Meeting
October 26, 2010
Withdraw Item 14A: Recommendation for the Community Redevelopment Agency (CRA) to
approve a Request for Proposal (RFP) scope of work to build single-family homes on CRA
owned land; approve the Executive Directors advertisement of the RFP through the
Purchasing Department and return with recommendations. (Staff's request)
Move Item 16A6 to 101: Recommendation to approve an Amendment to an existing
Purchase Agreement with Extended Possession related to the Vanderbilt Beach Road
Extension Project. Project No. 60168. (Commissioner Coyle's request)
Move Item 16D2 to 10J: Recommendation to approve grant related expenditures in
excess of $50,000 for real property acquired under the Neighborhood Stabilization Program
to fund rehabilitation activities. Funding will ensure compliance with Collier County building
code regulations and further the goals and objectives of the Housing Element of the Growth
Management Plan (estimated fiscal impact $57,364.09) (Commissioner Coyle's request)
Continue Item 16F2 to December 14. 2010 BCC Meetin2: Recommendation that the Board of
County Commissioners review and approve the Fiscal Year 2011 Strategic Plan for the Naples,
Marco Island, Everglades Convention and Visitors Bureau (CVB) and approve all necessary
budget amendments. (Staffs request)
Time Certain Item:
Item lOG to be heard at 10:15 a.m.
10/26/2010 8;39 AM
October 26, 2010
Item #2A and #2B
MINUTES FROM SEPTEMBER 23,2010 - BCC/BUDGET
HEARINGS AND SEPTEMBER 28,2010 - BCC/REGULAR
MEETING - APPROVED AS PRESENTED
COMMISSIONER COYLE: Now we have the minutes for the
September 23,2010, BCC budget hearings, and the September 28,
2010, BCC regular meeting minutes.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Motion to approve.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Second.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Motion to approve by Commissioner
Halas, second by Commissioner Fiala.
Any further discussion?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: All in favor, please signify by saying
aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Aye.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Any opposed, by like sign?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: It passes unanimously.
Item #3A, #3B, #3C and #3D
SERVICE AWARDS - PRESENTED
COMMISSIONER COYLE: That brings us to service awards.
MR.OCHS: Commissioners, you'll be joining us down in front
Page 6
October 26, 2010
of the dais, please.
Commissioners, we're recognizing several employees today with
years of service, dedicated years of service, to Collier County.
Your first recipient for 20 years of service is Kevin Dugan from
Transportation Engineering.
(Applause.)
MR. OCHS: Picture, Kevin.
(Applause.)
MR. OCHS: Commissioners, your next service award recipient
for 25 years of service, Alice Toppe from Risk Management.
(Applause.)
MR. OCHS: Commissioners, your next awardee for 30 years of
service, Rhonda Tibbetts from Purchasing.
(Applause.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: It's even set for the proper time.
Congratulations, thank you.
(Applause.)
MR. OCHS: Commissioners, your final service awardee this
morning is celebrating 35 years of service to Collier County, Kathy
Carpenter from Public Services Administration.
(Applause.)
Item #4
PROCLAMATIONS (ONE MOTION TAKEN TO ADOPT ALL
PROCLAMA nONS)
MR. OCHS: Mr. Chairman, that takes us to Item 4 on the
agenda, which is your proclamations this morning.
Item #4A
Page 7
October 26, 2010
PROCLAMATION DESIGNATING OCTOBER U 29, 20 10 AS
THE ELEVENTH ANNIVERSARY DAY OF THE RED WALK IN
COLLIER COUNTY. ACCEPTED BY SUSAN BARCELLINO.
SPONSORED BY COMMISSIONER FIALA - ADOPTED
W/CHANGE TO DATE
MR OCHS: The first proclamation is Item 4A. It's a
proclamation designating October 29 that should read, instead of
October 26. It's -- again, it's October 29,2010, as the 11th
Anniversary Day of the Red Walk in Collier County. To be accepted
by Susan Barcellino. And this item is sponsored by Commissioner
Fiala.
If you could please come forward, Susan.
(Applause.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Are we going to correct the
proclamation?
MR.OCHS: Yes, sir, we will.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: We'll issue a corrected -- proclamation
with the correct date.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Good morning.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Thank you for your
commitment.
(Applause.)
Item #4 B
PROCLAMA TION CONGRA TULA TING THE COLLIER
COUNTY SOLID WASTE MANAGEMENT DEPARTMENT FOR
THE RECEIPT OF THE 2010 SILVER EXCELLENCE AWARD.
ACCEPTED BY DAN RODRIGUEZ, SOLID WASTE
MANAGEMENT DIRECTOR, AND SOLID WASTE
Page 8
October 26, 2010
MANAGEMENT STAFF. SPONSORED BY COMMISSIONER
HALAS - ADOPTED
MR. OCHS: Item 4B is a proclamation designating October 30,
2010 -- I'm sorry. I'm on C. 4 B is a proclamation congratulating the
Collier County Solid Waste Department for the receipt of the 2010
Silver Excellence Award. To be accepted by Dan Rodriguez, Solid
Waste Management Director, and the Solid Waste Management staff.
This item sponsored by Commissioner Halas.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Who's going to take this? Dan, are you
going to do this?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: I'll take it.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Now, do you guys recommend yourself
for these awards?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Congratulations.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Directing from the back.
(Applause.)
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Commissioners, just briefly, in could share
just a few words with you.
Thank you for the recognition. This award is a national award.
This is from the S W ANA organizations that recognizes solid waste
operations throughout the nation.
There's three recipients. We got the silver. Sorry we didn't bring
the gold, but we did get the silver.
But certainly special thanks goes to you, the Board of County
Commissioners. Ten years ago when you adopted your first
Integrated Solid Waste Management Strategy, you laid out the game
plan for the cells one and two reclamation. And we're happy to be
before you to recognize that it was successfully done well under
budget. The engineer's estimates were close to 12 to 15 million
dollars. We were able to complete that project at $6 and a half
million. In addition, it was -- it was completed well ahead of
Page 9
October 26, 2010
schedule.
So thanks to the board for making the hard decision. It is the
largest reclamation project in the State of Florida and one of the top
five in the nation.
Thank you.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Can I just say something,
Commissioner?
(Applause.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Sure, sure.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Dan, I want to tell you how proud
we are of what you've done to this landfill.
When Jim, Tom, and I -- Jim Coletta, Tom Henning, and I began
serving the county in this capacity, we had a stinking landfill, as you
well know. I mean, it made your eyes water it was so bad.
And now, I've taken a tour up there, and I'm going to start
another tour. Anybody who wants to go on my tour, by the way, just
let me know because I'm going to have another tour. We go right up
to the top of the hill and it's -- and you can hardly tell you're even at a
landfill, for goodness sake.
And you guys have done so good. And aren't we the lowest rate
__ don't we collect the lowest rate of anyplace in the State of Florida?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: We do as it relates to your collection
assessment --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yes.
MR. RODRIGUEZ: -- for the level of service, we do, as well as
your disposal fees.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: And I'm pretty proud of that.
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Sure, absolutely. And thank you,
Commissioner. That's a good point. All the dedication, all those
wonderful people you saw up here, everyday they work very hard.
Intelligent, bright individuals, and thank you.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: And the place is so clean. My
Page 10
October 26, 2010
goodness, you could eat off the floor, for goodness sake.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Well, I'm not going to go there. But--
COMMISSIONER FIALA: On the top of the hill, you get a
lunch and everything.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: So that's where she goes when we break
for lunch.
Dan, I'm puzzled. What did you do wrong that you didn't get the
gold award?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: It's actually probably because over the last
ten years, Commissioner, you've actually won four awards. You won
a gold award for your single-stream recycling, you won a gold award
for the landfill work that you did nine years ago to stop it from
stinking and provided -- just last year you won the gold award for your
recycling center on Marco Island, and this year it's silver, so --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Just a correction. We didn't win the
award. You won the award.
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Thanks for all your hard work.
(Applause.)
Item #4C
PROCLAMATION DESIGNATING OCTOBER 30,2010 AND
OCTOBER 31,2010 AS SWAMP BUGGY RACES WEEKEND.
ACCEPTED BY THE HONORABLE CHUCK MCMAHON,
CASEY HORNBACK, THE HONORABLE THOMAS CANNON,
NORMAN TESTER, ROB SWISS, RANDY JOHNS AND MARK
CREEL. SPONSORED BY COMMISSIONER COLETTA -
ADOPTED
MR.OCHS: Commissioners, next item is 4C. It's a proclamation
Page 11
October 26, 2010
designating October 30, 2010, and October 31,2010, as Swamp
Buggy Races Weekend. To be accepted by the Honorable Chuck
McMahon, Casey Hornback, the Honorable Thomas Cannon, Norman
Tester, Rob Swiss, Randy Johns, and Mark Creel. And this item's
sponsored by Commissioner Coletta.
You gentleman please come forward.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I didn't see you here; how I did miss
you?
MR. OCHS: And Mr. John Norman, I'm sorry. He's not on my
list here.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I hear you're the new president,
huh?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Who are you?
MR. NORMAN: I have no idea.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: I don't either.
(Applause.)
Item #4 D
PROCLAMATION DESIGNATING OCTOBER 26,2010 AS SAFE
AND HEALTHY CHILDREN'S COALITION WATER SAFETY
DAY. ACCEPTED BY DR. VEDDER AND ASSOCIATES.
SPONSORED BY COMMISSIONER COLETTA - ADOPTED
MR.OCHS: The next item is Item 40. It's a proclamation
designating October 26, 2010, as the Safe and Healthy Children's
Coalition Water Safety Day. To be accepted by Dr. Vedder and a
long list of associates. And this item is sponsored by Commissioner
Coletta.
Please all come on up.
(Applause.)
MR. OCHS: Sheriff, organize these guys. Come on.
Page 12
October 26, 2010
(Applause.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: We're going to lose half our audience
with that group.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: We could demand that they stay.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: We could?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: No.
DR. VEDDER: I wanted to thank you all. Thank you,
Commissioner Coletta, for giving us this proclamation opportunity,
and thanks to everyone for taking time away from a potential early
voting opportunity as well as from your busy schedules to attend the
unvailing of our Safe and Healthy Children's Coalition.
The groundswell of grassroots support that embodies our
coalition really came about on account of one substance that ties us all
together, and that's water. As a pediatrician, I'm trying to get my
patients to drink more of it instead of sugar-laden juices and sodas.
The dentists would be even more overwhelmed with tooth decay
problems if fluoride wasn't in it.
It puts out fires. It breeds -- unfortunately it breeds
infection-bearing mosquitoes, and it fills the countless pools, lakes,
and Gulf that serve as an excellent source of exercise.
But it's water's ability to literally take our breath away that has
motivated our coalition to develop a program to stem the tide of
drownings in our area. Since 2004, drowning has been the leading
external cause of death for Collier County children one to four years
of age.
And even this past summer, and I believe even this past evening,
drowning was in the local headlines way -- it's been in the headlines
way too often.
There are very few moments, very few, in our educational
careers where we can honestly say we learned a lifesaving skill. We
want drowning prevention to be one of those moments, especially for
our three- to five-year-olds enrolled in our daycares and preschools.
Page 13
October 26, 2010
This has been done with great success over on the east coast in
Broward County for the past ten years where every preschooler and
kindergartener in their public schools has an opportunity to receive
drowning prevention education in the classroom from teachers and
Red Cross volunteers, and at the poolside from certified instructors at
facilities such as the YMCA, Parks and Recreation, and the Boys and
Girls Club, and no child, no child in the past ten years who's been
enrolled in their program, has been a drowning victim.
So what's the secret for success with the folks over in Broward?
Overwhelming support from their school board and their county
commission and local government.
Our coalition is excited about building a similarly strong
partnership with our elected officials to develop our own drowning
prevention initiative as well as others that will address the major
safety and health issues adversely impacting Collier youth.
The agencies represented in this room, in this audience, are all
committed to the safety and well-being of children in Collier, but there
are some issues where we -- if we work in a synergistic fashion rather
than a parallel fashion, we can accomplish much more.
We must act so no more children in Collier County succumb to a
statistic by-line or a sobering headline. This is our dream. This is our
mission. And thank you all, thank you all, for your support.
(Applause.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you.
Item #4 E
PROCLAMATION DESIGNATING NOVEMBER 4 THRU
NOVEMBER 7,2010 AS NAPLES FILM FESTIVAL WEEK.
ACCEPTED BY ROWAN SAMUEL, FOUNDER AND CEO OF
NAPLES INTERNATIONAL FILM FESTIVAL. SPONSORED BY
COMMISSIONER COLETTA - ADOPTED
Page 14
October 26, 2010
MR.OCHS: Commissioners, that takes us to Item 4E on your
agenda this morning. It's a proclamation designating November 4
through November 7,2010, as Naples International Film Festival
Week. To be accepted by Rowan Samuel, Founder and Chief
Executive Officer of the Naples International Film Festival.
This item sponsored by Commissioner Coletta.
(Applause.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Good morning. Congratulations. Thank
you.
MR.OCHS: As well as Mr. Scott Lapore.
MR. LAPORE: I'm just always involved in everything.
(Applause.)
MR. SAMUEL: I just wanted to thank the Board of
Commissioners. It's a huge honor in our second year to receive this
proclamation. Thank you, Commissioner Coletta.
We're incredibly excited. Last year our economic impact on the
region was about $900,000 for 100 percent of volunteer staff. Our
expectation this year is to hopefully double that. So we're incredibly
excited. We'd love to see you all out on the red carpet on November
4th, and come on out to the festival at the Mercato.
Thank you very much again. Cheers.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Chairman, I make a motion that we
approve today's proclamations.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Second.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Motion to approve the
proclamations by Commissioner Halas, second by Commissioner
Fiala.
All in favor, please signify by saying aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Aye.
Page ] 5
October 26, 2010
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Aye.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Any opposed, by like sign?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: They pass unanimously.
MR. OCHS: Thank you, Commissioners.
Item #5A
PRESENT A TION OF THE COLLIER COUNTY "BUSINESS OF
THE MONTH" A WARD TO CONDITIONED AIR OF NAPLES
FOR OCTOBER 2010. ACCEPTED BY W. THEODORE ETZEL,
III, PRESIDENT & CEO - PRESENTED
MR.OCHS: That takes us to Item 5 on your agenda this
morning, presentations. Item 5A is a presentation of the Collier
County Business of the Month award to Conditioned Air of Naples for
October 20 I O.
This award to be accepted by W. Theodore Etzel, III, President
and CEO. Mr. Etzel.
(Applause.)
MR. ETZEL: Thank you very much.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: You've been winning all kinds of
awards lately, haven't you?
MR. ETZEL: Thank you so much. It's very special.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: If you'd like to say a few words, we'd be
happy to do that after the photograph.
MR. ETZEL: Commissioners, thank you so much for this honor,
and I am happy to accept it on behalf of our team, nearly 200 people
that work for Conditioned Air and serve Southwest Florida.
We recently, about two-and-a-half years ago, remodeled and
Page 16
October 26, 2010
moved into a new headquarters on Mercantile A venue. Offer any
tours over there as well. We have some nice high-tech equipment
shown in there, and we really appreciate being in Collier County for
over 48 years now.
So it's a long-standing company. And just as you awarded
people with 20 and 30 and even 35 years, we, too, have people that
worked with Conditioned Air for that long as well. That just is a great
statement for the county that we work in and the community that we
serve, and we really strive to do the right thing for our clients who are
our true employers.
So I thank you very much for this honor. It will be shared with
our entire team. We appreciate it very much.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you, Mr. Etzel.
(Applause.)
Item #5B
PRESENTATION OF THE ADVISORY COMMITTEE
OUTST ANDING MEMBER OF THE MONTH AWARD TO
JEFFREY S. CURL FOR HIS CONTRIBUTION TO THE LAND
ACQUISITION ADVISORY COMMITTEE - PRESENTED
MR.OCHS: Commissioner, next item is 5B. It's a presentation
of the advisory committee Outstanding Member of the Month award
to Jeffrey S. Curl for his contribution to the Land Acquisition
Advisory Committee.
Mr. Curl, please come forward.
(Applause.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: This is a big plaque.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: And congratulations.
MR. CURL: Appreciate it.
(Applause.)
Page 17
October 26, 2010
Item #5C
PRESENT A TION BY CLARENCE TEARS, DIRECTOR, BIG
CYPRESS BASIN, REGARDING REAL-TIME MODELING AND
GA TE OPERA nONS - PRESENTED
MR.OCHS: Commissioners, Item 5C is a presentation by
Clarence Tears, Director of Big Cypress Basin, regarding realtime
modeling and gate operations.
Clarence, good morning.
MR. TEARS: Good morning, Commissioners. Clarence Tears,
Director of Big Cypress Basin, South Florida Water Management
District.
Well, today I'd like to talk about real-time hydrologic monitoring
and modeling, which basically means in the past, there was a lot of
questions raised over the years over, are the gates open? Are the gates
closed? You know, what is the district doing to move forward?
Well, today we have a model that actually depicts the surface and
groundwater in Collier County. It's real-time modeling, real-time
data, and also it does real-time simulation forecasts based on current
conditions and projected rainfall.
So the idea is, you can go on this site and take a look at the
current conditions and, really, you can learn about our system, how it
operates, how it operates during the dry season, how it operates during
the wet season and, you know, when we have a significant amount of
rain, how the system reacts and moves water.
BCB has a canals and telemetry network all throughout Collier
County. It includes rainfall structure, surface water, and groundwater
stations, and all this is fed into a computerized system that depicts the
surface and groundwater in Collier County, and it's a model that
depicts a majority of our area from -- roughly from State Road 29
Page 18
October 26, 2010
west.
This shows you some of the major functions of this model is, it
monitors BCB conditions, hydrologic conditions, and flood
forecasting.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Clarence, do you think everybody
understands what BCB means? Just so you can say --
MR. TEARS: Big Cypress Basin.
This -- if you go to our Website, basically you go to
www.sfwmd.gov, and you go to locations and look for the BCB, Big
Cypress Basin, you'll come to our Website. And if you go down to
real-time hydrologic monitoring and modeling, you'll come up with
this location.
In addition, what you'll see at the bottom here is you can select
any structure, and what it will do is, it will tell you the current
conditions, it will show you the gate openings, the current water levels
and the flow going through that gate. And if you look over here, this
shows you just over a period of a few days, 25 through 28. It shows
you the water elevations.
Over here it shows you the gate openings. Down here it says, if
the gate is fully closed, it's zero. So right now you can see the gate is
open about 3 feet, gate one, and the blue shows you just -- it's trying to
show you how open the gate is. And this is real. This is real-time
data. It's provided to the public. Twice a day it's updated to the public;
however, it's updated in the system about every 15 minutes.
As I stated, it's automatic real-time forecasting twice a day. One
of the challenges we still have is, you know, forecast rainfall. What
we use as a default is the National Weather Service forecast for the
area, and this is for our long-term forecasting. So say in the middle of
the wet season, if the national weather forecasts 3 inches of rainfall,
we can put it into the mode- -- it will automatically put it into
modeling and estimate what the system will look like three days out.
Some of the key capabilities is to provide an efficient overview
Page 19
October 26, 2010
of what is happening within the watershed, automatically how the
water levels in the channels and groundwater will change, and this can
be used by emergency operation. The whole idea is that by
forecasting into the future, if we're expecting 7 inches of rainfall and
the system's completely full, we can identify areas that we may have
problems with flooding and long-term, you know, challenges with
water moving through the system.
So we'll -- we can use it with our emergency operation. In
addition, we're trying to work with Collier County staff to try to put
some of your key structures on this system, and then we can look at
the system holistically.
I think I missed something. I just wanted to -- now, this is -- this
is actually going to the Website right now. I don't know if it's going to
work. One thing I wanted to show on this one is the forecasting. And
there's a line that shows you the current realistic forecast. And once
you get past that line, it's trying to protect the future.
Right here is Golden Gate number one. This is by Bears Paw.
This is the upstream level. This is a current -- this is real-time data on
this side of this dotted line, but this is the projection for the next few
days out based on the weather patterns for our area, and you'll see that
the water level is anticipated to rise just a little bit. And that's
basically, we're trying to store back as much water as we can this time
of year because, you know, we're entering the dry season.
It's kind of exciting. You know, they have real-time forecasting;
however, they don't -- they don't have the projected forecasting
anywhere else in the world except here. So we're on the cutting edge.
This is kind of exciting. And it is a tool. Anybody can go online, take
a look at the system. And by just looking at it daily or weekly or when
the rain falls, you can learn a lot about how this system works in
Collier County, and you can learn about the whole system, how it
works, because, you know, we manage the primary system, but the
secondary system that Collier County manages feeds into it. And the
Page 20
October 26, 2010
tertiary systems, which are your neighborhoods, all feed into the
primary system.
So it's kind of exciting. We're on the cutting edge. It's really just
another way to get information out to the public and allow us all to
learn about the system.
And thank you. Is there any questions?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you, Clarence.
Any questions? One by Commissioner Coletta. Go ahead.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Actually, two questions, if I
may, Clarence.
The -- we're talking about diverting some of the water from the
main canal to try to take a little pressure off Naples Bay at times of
high water. How's that project coming forward?
MR. TEARS: Well, actually the challenge I have is right out by
__ you know, near CityGate, that area is where we're trying to divert
the flows, is land acquisition is the only holdup at this point in time.
The goal is to divert approximately 60 million gallons a day.
Golden Gate main originally cut off the sheet flow to the south.
So Rookery Bay is not getting enough freshwater certain times of
the year. So the idea is to try to re-conduct some of the historical
flowways that were cut off by, you know, some of the canal
improvements in the '60s and try to rehydrate some of the areas that
are lacking surface water.
But we're -- our projection is to begin that project in 2013.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: The other question, sir, is the
restoration of the Everglades, the project they got going on in Collier
County, the pumps. How is that project coming along?
MR. TEARS: Yes. Actually, they're in middle construction of
the Prairie Pump -- let's see. It's the prairie pump station. In addition,
they're -- actually, it's Merritt Pump Station, and they're -- actually, I
think the bid was awarded for the Faka Union Pump Station. So it's
moving forward.
Page 21
October 26, 2010
The projected goal at this point in time is to complete the project
by 2017; however, the Miller Pump Station at this point in time,
there's no money identified through the Water Resource Development
Act; however, it is on the table for the Corp. to continue with the
project so they can always move or shift funding around. So we're --
we truly believe that this project will be completed by 2017.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: And the reason for asking this
question is, one of the things that came about for the restoration was a
much-needed facility out in the eastern part -- northern part of the
county there, was the temporary interchange that they placed at
Everglades and 75.
MR. TEARS: Yes.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: That the water district said we
can use in case of emergency of flood or fires to be able to get onto
75, which is greatly appreciated.
I just want to see what kind of time period was going to exist
before they got to the point. Because they were talking of removing
the whole temporary interchange. I want to see what the time period
of it is so that we can get meaningful discussions going to keep that
facility in place forever until we get our regular interchange in there
for the safety of the residents that live in that area.
And so if you could comment on that, I'd really appreciate it.
MR. TEARS: Well, I really don't have any comments on the
interchange itself. You know, really, I think you have to work with
Department of Transportation on that because, you know, the roadway
__ our main focus is the restoration, and it's really being used to
support the restoration project.
So, you know, there will have to be more discussions on that.
But we really don't have a point on that long-term usage of the
interchange.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Okay. Just for my sake so I
know my timing's right.
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October 26, 2010
MR. TEARS: Yes.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: We have what, months, years,
whatever, before that interchange --
MR. TEARS: At least to 2017. So we're talking at least -- what,
we're in 2010 -- seven more years before that project will probably --
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Before they would actually be
even contemplating removing that interchange.
MR. TEARS: Yes, that's correct.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Thank you, Mr. Tears.
MR. TEARS: Oh, you're welcome.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thanks, Clarence.
MR. TEARS: Thanks again. Have a nice day.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: One question.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Oh, I'm sorry. Commissioner Halas?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Clarence, one of the questions that
come up periodically is, are you keeping up with the maintenance on
Janes Scenic Drive? That's a beautiful drive, it used to be. And, of
course, it hasn't been very well taken care of. Can you tell us ifthere's
going to be any endeavors in keeping that open for the public.
MR. TEARS: Well, Janes Scenic Drive has always been a
challenge on the maintenance side. And the problem is, it's a morrel
drive. And during the wet season, you know, you have hydrostatic
pressures pushing up on it. And people drive across it, and it splashes
out the morrel, and you create these potholes. And then towards the
dry season, they fill them back in, compact it, and it's beautiful until
the next wet season. So it's just a continual --
COMMISSIONER HALAS: So there is maintenance being
taken -- that is taking place --
MR. TEARS : Yes.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: -- during the dry season?
MR. TEARS: That's correct.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: And it is passible where you don't
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October 26, 2010
need a swamp buggy to get through there?
MR. TEARS: Well, I haven't been there lately, so I can't
comment on the current condition.
But Division of Forestry works on maintaining it, and also the
Fakahatchee Strand goes through there and maintains it. But it's --
because of the type of roadway it is and because of the water levels in
there, you know, it is -- it is a maintenance challenge every year.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Okay. So if someone ventures
down there, can they get all the way through Janes Scenic Drive in the
dry season and then get over to Everglades Boulevard, or do they have
to turn around at the -- at the end of Janes Scenic Drive and go back
out the same way they came in?
MR. TEARS: No. My understanding, it's open and passable.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: It is passable?
MR. TEARS: Yes.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: With an automobile?
MR. TEARS: Yes.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Okay.
MR. TEARS: There may -- there may be some areas where you
have to drive slowly.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: In the dry season.
MR. TEARS: Y es. Well, in the wet season -- the challenge in
the wet season, when people drive through there, they relocate the fill,
and then you have these potholes. And then when you drive through
the potholes, they get bigger and bigger. So there are certain times
probably in the wet season you have to be extremely careful.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Okay.
MR. TEARS: But once they repair it at the onset of the dry
season, it's usually good throughout the winter months until we get
into the next wet season and then, you know, some of these holes start
to --
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Do you have the ability to oversee
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October 26, 2010
that just to make sure that it is taken care of during the dry season?
MR. TEARS: I'd probably -- I don't know if I have the ability to
oversee it, but I have the ability to be involved and ensure that it takes
place.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Good. Appreciate that.
MR. TEARS: All right.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Thank you.
MR. TEARS: Yes.
Item #6A
PUBLIC PETITION FROM E'S COUNTRY STORE AT OIL
WELL ROAD AND IMMOKALEE ROAD - MOTION TO BRING
BACK WITH POSSIBLE OPTIONS AT A FUTURE BCC
MEETING - APPROVED
MR. OCHS: Commissioners, that takes us to Item 6 on your
agenda. It's public petitions. 6A is an item that was continued from
the September 28, 2010, BCC meeting. It's a public petition request
from E's Country Store at Oil Well Road and Immokalee Road.
MR. yaV ANOVICH: Good morning, Commissioners. For the
record, Rich Y ovanovich on behalf of BIas -- BIas Elias and Burt
Eisenbud, the owners ofE's Country Store since March of2003.
With me today also is Norm Trebilcock, who's the traffic
engineer who's been working with us on trying to come up with an
access solution for E's Country Store.
As you can see on the visualizer, E's Country Store is at the
corner of Oil Well and Immokalee Roads. You can see on the
visualizer the current access is pretty good for E's Country Store
because it's a two-lane road. They have full movements in and out of
this access point on Oil Well Road.
People coming from the east to the west can turn left on this site,
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October 26, 2010
and -- well, there's really no access issues under the current plan;
however, as we all know, Oil Well Road is under construction right
now. And these are the proposed plans for Oil Well Road.
And I don't know if you can see it up close. But as you can see,
there are some pretty radical changes to the access to E's Country
Store that result from these plans.
Most notably, the connection point from Valencia Drive -- this is
Valencia Drive -- to Oil Well Road under these plans will be severed,
and there will be no longer a connection of Valencia Drive to Oil Well
Road.
Also, there will be no left turn from Oil Well Road as you're
heading east anywhere along Oil Well Road to provide access to E's
Country Store, and a vast majority of the E's Country Store business
comes from the east-heading-west directions.
Now, under these plans, the existing right-in, right-out right here
will remain. So the plan for the county is to keep that access open
permanently, and that's important as I go through our proposed
solution in the long term.
These plans also provide for people who live in Waterways, they
do have a left turn lane at the basic intersection of where Valencia
Drive is. So they have the ability to go left into their site, and that's
also important when we talk about our proposed access solution to
where we are.
The reason the Valencia Drive connection was severed is because
the residents in Orangetree asked that connection be severed, because
during the construction of Immokalee Road their roads became the
bypass to the intersection of Oil Well Road and Immokalee Road.
So they are -- they were concerned about what the situation
would be if Valencia Drive remained open, especially during the
construction of Oil Well Road. It would also serve as a bypass road.
So through the public hearing process, the decision to close
Valencia Drive was made by, I guess, the county and transportation
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October 26, 2010
staff.
We understood, we were involved, we raised objections at the 60
percent plans. We said, go ahead and close it, but continue to provide
us an opportunity to turn left.
And we have been working on a solution that I'll show you in a
moment that respects the wishes of the Orangetree residents to keep
that connection point closed but at the same point provides a left turn
in off of Oil Well Road to the E's Country Store site.
And I hope you can see the colors, but I apologize for the
coloring. It was done by a highly skilled attorney in coming up with
those plans, but --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: You mean your children did this?
MR. YOV ANOVICH: Yeah. Well, it would have been better if
my children had done it. But since I did it, I couldn't stay in the lines.
What you have on the visualizer is our proposed solution that
allows Valencia Drive to stay closed but at the same time provides us
with a left turn lane -- left turn in -- as you're traveling from the east to
the west on Oil Well Road, this yellow portion of the left turn lane
would be constructed as part of the project. You would have a left-in
only, which is represented by this, which would provide access to the
site.
So we would be able to maintain the left turn, and we would
construct all of that as Phase I of the project. The longer term Phase II
solution is in green.
When the shopping center developer comes through the process
and actually designs the shopping center, we would agree to relocate
our current right-in, right-out access further to the east and share it
with the shopping center developer. So in lieu of having two
connection points on Oil Well Road, you would have one connection
point on Oil Well Road.
And the property owners would construct the right turn lane as
well as the on-site improvements that I'm showing you in the green.
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October 26, 2010
So that would be a two-phased approach.
You ask why we need to do this in two phases. Well, no surprise,
we're in a recession and the revenue to the stores is way down. The
ability to construct all of these improvements at one phase, we just
cannot financially afford to do it.
So we have proposed a two-phase process. Now, we're not
asking the county for any money to construct these improvements,
because what we're willing to do is provide the county with a slope
easement, and so is the shopping center developer, to give the county
a slope easement so they can change the construction methods for Oil
Well Road to eliminate a retaining wall and guardrails.
That savings to the county results in $103,000 savings. Those
$103,000 in construction cost savings would pay for Phase I of the
improvements.
Now, we've talked to the contractor, because there was concerns
being raised, if we go forward with this now, Rich, while the road is
under construction, are we going to get behind schedule and is it going
to cost the county any money?
The contractor has assured us he will not be asking for any
additional time to finished the road, and he will not need any
additional money above the 103,000 in savings to construct the
improvements. There are, we believe, several public benefits in
allowing for this left turn lane and on-site improvements to be
constructed as part of -- in a Phase I and Phase II approach.
The first solution -- the first public benefit, as I mentioned is, in
the long term you relocate the access that's close to the intersection,
the current access. You locate it further east. It's much safer, and it
becomes shared with the shopping center owner.
You also get the necessary right-of-way you would need or want
to build a cul-de-sac at the end of Valencia Drive. Because currently
when you close Valencia Drive, it's going to be just a long dead-end.
So when the fire -- fire truck comes or when garbage truck comes,
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October 26, 2010
they're going to have to go to the end and either back out or use
someone's driveway to back up the vehicle.
We will provide you with the necessary right-of-way to do a
cul-de-sac. It'd be similar to the long, dead-end streets you have out in
Golden Gate Estates.
Ifwe were coming through with this project, we would not be
allowed to propose a dead-end street. We would have to build a
cul-de-sac. You, as the county, can have a dead-end street, but we're
willing to provide you with the right-of-way you need to turn that into
a cul-de-sac. So that's a second public benefit you get.
There are legal issues related to the actual closure of Valencia
Drive. You have to go through a public hearing process to do that.
Our client will agree to waive any claims they may have for the
closure of Valencia Drive, and we will get the shopping center owner
to also waive any claims that he may have regarding the closure of
Valencia Drive. So we believe that's also additional public benefit.
I think the most significant public benefit is that a
well-established business that has given back to the community and
employs 31 people and provides them with health insurance will be
given the opportunity to survive. And that, I think, is important in
today's day. They are not saying we don't want to relocate the access,
and they're not saying they don't want to pay for the right turn lane.
They're just saying, we need some time to get through this process of
the recession and others to keep the business up and running. It's
simply a cash flow issue.
Now, you recently, when you were doing the comprehensive plan
amendments for the Randall Boulevard project, you had a similar
situation. You had a convenience store owner show up and say, hey,
your proposed plan is going to destroy our access.
Now, at that meeting your transportation staff said, we have no
other alternative, and I think that property owner agreed, there was no
other reasonable alternative.
Page 29
October 26, 2010
We have a reasonable alternative here that can be a win-win
situation for the residents of Orangetree, they get Valencia Drive to
remain closed, the business owner gets to stay open, it doesn't cost the
county any money because the business owner is helping to reduce the
cost of constructing the project.
So we are proposing and requesting that we be permitted to
provide this type of access to our site in the two phases as I've
described. We will work with your contractor to address the concerns
regarding timing and cost. And ifthere's any out-of-pocket above the
savings, we'll take -- we'll pay it. So it's a win-win, nobody -- it's no
out-of-pocket for the county.
And with that, that's our proposal. I hope I've described it in
great enough detail to get us on a future agenda, I guess, to talk about
a more permanent solution.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you.
Commissioner Halas?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: I'd like to talk with transportation
staff first. How much money do we have invested in Oil Well Road
and also Immokalee Road?
MR. AHMAD: Good morning, Mr. Chairman, Commissioner.
My name is Jay Ahmad, for the record. I'm Director of Transportation
Engineering.
The Oil Well Road project bid price is approximately $39
million. Oil Well is about $35 million -- Immokalee Road is about
$35 million.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Okay. So what we did is we put in
a lot of money here to move traffic, right? And so now we've got --
we're looking at something here that would probably have an
obstruction to what we're trying to accomplish, and that's traffic flow?
MR. AHMAD: We have invested quite a bit of money in this
region in the past five years or so. And certainly this -- I don't see the
left turn lane westbound as a public benefit. I do see moving the
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October 26, 2010
driveway further east as a public benefit, as well as a cul-de-sac. But I
think you're absolutely right, the left turn lane in the westbound
direction will have to be closed at one point in time, and that's
basically what we've been talking with Mr. Y ovanovich and his team
there.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Okay.
MR. AHMAD: And they agreed. 1 thought we had an
agreement till yesterday morning, frankly. And all of a sudden this
thing came up again.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Well, the concern that I have is that
we had a homeowners' association that came before us that claimed
that they had a number of people, that it was going to be a detriment
for them if we didn't have an opening for them. And we found that
they could go down and make a V-turn and then get to wherever they
need to go in regards to getting into their homeowners' association.
The other question I have -- and this is for the attorney. Is all this
land -- does the store owner, E's here, own this land that we're going to
-- talking about this access here?
MR. KLATZKOW: Commissioner, if you're going to consider
any sort of arrangement here, it has to be a three-part agreement,
including the underlying landowner.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Okay.
MR. KLATZKOW: All right.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: So what they need to do is get with
the landowner that is going to someday develop this property and sit
down with them and come up with a plan?
MR. KLATZKOW: You know, we've done scores of
development agreements that were taken before the board. This is yet
another one we can negotiate. With your direction we can sit down --
it will be a three-party agreement with -- including the underlying
property owner, and cut the best deal. We can negotiate and then bring
it back to the board for your review.
Page 31
October 26, 2010
MR. YOV ANOVICH: Commissioner Halas, if! may. We --
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Excuse me. I haven't finished yet.
MR. YOV ANOVICH: I was going to answer your question.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: The concern that I have here is that
we spend millions of dollars of money to try to keep roadways open,
and then at the last minute we have somebody that comes in here and
states, hey, you guys, I'm going to cry foul because we're not playing
the game right.
Well, they understood exactly what's going on here. And 1 can't
see causing a problem whereby we build the roads to move traffic, and
then we get -- there's somebody that wants to come along and add to
the congestion, especially at this intersect.
And I assume that as the eastern area builds out, that it's going to
cause a high congestion in this particular area.
MR. KLATZKOW: Except that you have Valencia here. And
there are some residents that want Valencia closed down. That
impacts an approved PUD here, as a commercial PUD that's owned by
Mr. Bolt, who's not here presently.
There is a possibility that we can negotiate some sort of
transaction that serves that PUD that serves E's store and that serves
the Orangetree development all at the same time without substantially
impacting the intersection.
Now, whether or not we can actually negotiate that, I don't know.
But, you know, that is a possibility.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: All right. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Commissioner--
MR. YOV ANOVICH: May I?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Mr. Y ovanovich, yes.
MR. YOV ANOVICH: To answer all of those questions, we have
already met with Mr. Bolt, who is the shopping center owner, and he
has approved that plan and has committed to give all of the necessary
easements for that plan to be implemented.
Page 32
October 26, 2010
So it's just simply a matter of sitting down and crafting the
agreement that requires the provision of the green areas, as you will --
if you will, as well as the cul-de-sac area. That's all been agreed to,
and we can put that in an agreement with the county.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: In that case I'd like to open this up
to Norm Feder and find out exactly what's been going on behind the
scenes, because this doesn't have a good flavor in my mouth about it.
MR. FEDER: I'm not sure it should have anything but a good
flavor. But what I will tell you is we've been trying to work with them
from the beginning. The issue was raised. We'd rather not put in the
left turn lane. We think that--
COMMISSIONER HALAS: That's right.
MR. FEDER: -- eventually that is going to back up from the
intersection.
Having said that, we did try to work with them because we
recognize that E's has been around for some time. We wanted to try to
see any options we had to meet their needs.
The concern I have is, I think the attorney has correctly said that
we need all three parties sitting down and trying to work this out.
We had an initial proposal somewhat like you see here, which is
a left turn lane in on the yellow, and then a realigned right-in, right-out
in the green.
But we had worked with them and we thought we had agreement
up until yesterday morning on moving that green further to the east,
which is more beneficial for the right-in, right-out, the future access to
the underlying property, the other property owner who, by the way, is
updating, or has been for quite a while actually, updating a PUD
where we haven't seen specifically what the issues are on that.
So if you move that green further over to the yellow and you
have one access point, operationally it works much better. When you
have a left-in like that, and even if the green finally gets built
sometime in the future, you have a distance area there. How many
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October 26, 2010
can you store on your demand? And the demand will not only be for
E's. It would also be for this larger shopping center.
So what 1 can tell you is, we're more than happy to sit down, as
was recommended, with all three parties. We've developed many
developer contribution agreements. If the board wants us to try to find
a way to provide access here in the left turn, we'll try to do that, but
we would recommend that this, which was the initial proposal, I don't
know, three to four months ago, we have some concerns with it, we
expressed that at the time, thought we had gone to something that we
agreed to more, and now we're at this.
So I'm just telling you a left-in as proposed here in yellow that is
differentiated from the opening itself poses more potential operational
issues in the future.
We're still open to considering it, but I'm just telling you that we
thought we had something better, which would basically be a left-in to
a new opening just closer over to Valencia but not at Valencia, which
would be closed off, so it wouldn't be connected.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Is there some disagreement about what's
going on here?
MR. YOV ANOVICH: Yeah. This -- the only change -- this plan
1 have in front of you was a plan that was absolutely agreed to by
staff. The phasing was the issue we raised when we -- when we did
the cost estimates and realized that, to do all of this today, was going
to cost about $230,000 to do it, which meant my client would have to
come out of pocket $130,000, which was the delta.
We went and said, we can't afford the 130,000 today. Can we--
and we said, we'd like to do this in phases so we can come up with the
$130,000 as the second phase. That, correct, was new, but the
ultimate design has been agreed to for quite a while. But the phasing
schedule was the latest change.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you.
Commissioner Coletta?
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October 26, 2010
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Yes, thank you. We need to
recognize a number of things here. We build these roads for
everyone, including the businesses that are along them. You know,
we have -- we have something that's in the works. There's some
possibilities for being able to resolve it.
Of course, the question of money always comes up. We don't
have any money, the petitioner doesn't have any money at the
moment. So where do you go from there? But ifMr. Yovanovich--
as Mr. Yovanovich said, there would be 130- -- $103,000 savings that,
according to him, he talked to the -- and you can clarify this. You
talked to the road builder, and he said that if these changes were made
that he'd be able to reduce his price by 103,000; is that correct?
MR. YOV ANOVICH: Yes. Ifwe were to give you the slope
easement, there would be a cost savings to the county of$103,000.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Okay. Now there's a couple
things, Mr. Y ovanovich, we need to talk about and we have to fully
understand what it means. One is the fact that across from you you
have the Waterways. It came before us before, and it was a long,
drawn-out thing, and they -- in the beginning when they should have
bargained for everything, they didn't -- they missed the boat. They
came a little bit late, but we were able to get them, at least for the time
being, their left-in, left-out, the whole -- that part of it that they really
wanted with the understanding that down the road, when the traffic
congestion gets so and the traffic backs up to Immokalee Road, at that
point in time, Transportation has to reconfigure that and allow only
right-in, right-out.
They were very happy to get that. I mean, if you can get five
years, it's wonderful. Maybe it might even be longer, who knows. I
mean, your client understands that also.
MR. YOV ANOVICH: And we agreed to that condition. We
agreed that -- we understand that this left turn lane may be temporary.
We think it's going to last longer than you all think it will last. But in
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October 26, 2010
any event, we know that, just like Waterways, we have the same
condition.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: One of the things that would
take place is that as time goes along and the development behind you
starts to take place, there'll be another entrance that will be the
right-in, right-out that will -- in the green there, that will help --
MR. YOV ANOVICH: Right.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: -- to alleviate even more
problems because right now, the one turn you do have into the place is
too close to the intersection, but you're vested, and that can't be taken
away from you.
MR. YOV ANOVICH: Correct. That stays where it is.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: But you're willing to deal with
this in the future? In other words, if we were able to put together --
and I'm not saying we can. But if we were able to put together an
agreement between the county and all the -- your client and the Bolts
and everyone else that's concerned, all these things are understood; is
that correct?
MR. YOV ANOVICH: That's correct. We -- yes. We would
move our access point further away from the intersection, which we
all acknowledge is a public benefit.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Okay. Under those kind of
circumstances, I don't see a negative impact on the county. And if the
petitioner truly recognizes what the limitations ofthis is, I'm for
bringing it back at least to be able to explore the possibilities and try
to get this going forward with whatever it takes, three party
agreements or just being able to come up with some sort of way to be
able to make this happen and put it on a regular agenda whenever this
information can be pulled together so we can maybe choose from one
or two different alternatives, with the understanding, too, that the cost
to the county is going to be --
MR. YOV ANOVICH: Zero.
Page 36
October 26, 2010
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Zero.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Is that a motion?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: That's a motion.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Second.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Did you want to ask some questions?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Nope. That's what I was going to
do anyway.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Then I have a question of the
staff.
Explain to me how closing off Valencia contributes to better
traffic circulation.
MR. AHMAD: Closing the Valencia Drive, it's approximately
610 feet east of Immokalee Road. And the queues -- and I have
actually some pictures, if you don't mind me showing you.
The traffic today from the schools -- we have three schools --
backs up well beyond Valencia. Backs up almost to the schools.
We are improving the intersection with adding lanes, triple lefts
and one right. That should help. But we think in the future that
storage is not going to be adequate. So closing Valencia would
essentially give us more storage, and we would be able to extend the
left turn lanes further east.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. We have a motion by
Commissioner Coletta which, if! interpreted it correctly, was that we
should instruct you to work together to seek a compromise on this that
is in the best interest of the county and all others concerned.
MR. YOV ANOVICH: Yes.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Is that basically what --
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Well, that was the short of it,
but I'm sure they can pick it up off the transcribed notes.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Just want to make sure that we don't
make any decisions here.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: No. We're not making any
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October 26, 2010
promises. We're just giving direction to bring back an assortment of
alternatives that will work for us.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: And that's your second?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: (Nods head.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Any further discussion?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Leo's got a question.
MR.OCHS: Mr. Chairman, I'm sorry. Just for point of
clarification, going back to what your county attorney said. Did the
options include a potential developer agreement along with --
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Oh, absolutely.
MR. OCHS: -- all parties including the --
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: You got it.
MR.OCHS: -- commercial landowner?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Whatever we can come up with
so we can sit back and we can cover all bases on it.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Commissioner Henning?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Is it in the motion that this item
is going to come back to the board at a future date?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Well, yeah. I thought that was
understood, but I'll include that. Thank you, Commissioner Henning.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Commissioner Halas?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: I think what needs to also be done
is to make sure that whoever the underlying landowner is, that G's
store -- or E's store works with that underlying landowner so that we
know what's going to go in there so we don't have to tear up the road
again and come up with an ingress and egress out of there for that land
that's going to be included where that shopping center's going to be.
So I think this is going to have to be well planned out and not just
piecemealed here, because I think all parties need to make sure that
they understand exactly that we're only going to have one ingress and
one egress out of here. And if that's not the case, then I'm not going to
vote for it.
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October 26, 2010
So I think it's going to take more than just down the road -- kick
the can down the road for one or two meetings and then figure out
what's going to take place, unless at that point in time the underlying
landowner has a specific plan of what he's going to have there and
how he's going to address all the traffic problems that are on these two
roads that we spent tons of money for to build the roads to move
traffic out in this area.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Just for clarity, the motion does
not limit the range of options. It says to bring us back options. It
doesn't -- it doesn't say which options you should bring back. So I'm
just pointing that out so you don't vote for the wrong -- or don't vote
the wrong way.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Well, I'm just telling you that what
my concerns are is the future of these roadways that we put -- a ton of
money into to make sure that it doesn't add up -- end up to be an -- to
impede the traffic flow here in this particular area.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. And Commissioner Coletta, one
last one.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Commissioner Halas, we got --
Halas is right. You got to make sure that anything we do isn't going to
be detrimental. Also, we got to fully understand that any changes are
going to be made in the future because trying to nail this down now --
I don't know where they are in their PUD planning. But trying to nail
this down now could delay it forever. But with the understanding, any
changes that are made to this road, my understanding, it's going to be
by the developer. They're going to have to pay the cost. We're not
going to pay it.
MR. YOV ANOVICH: Right.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Once this road's completed, you
come along with your development, you want some changes made to
be able to help you out, we've always made them pay, and we're not
going to make an exception in this case.
Page 39
October 26, 2010
MR. YOV ANOVICH: We understand that. We understand that
whatever we build may get torn out at our expense.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. All in favor, please signify by
saymg aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Aye.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Any opposed, by like sign?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: I'm opposed.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. It passes 4-1 with Commissioner
Halas objecting.
You -- we have a time certain in four minutes. You think we can
get through a public petition that quickly?
MR. OCHS: It's up to the petitioner, sir.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay.
MR.OCHS: Would you like to call them?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Yes.
Item #6B
PUBLIC PETITION FROM MS. MONIQUE PEREZ MARINI
REQUESTING ASSISTANCE FOR CHINESE DRYWALL
REMEDIATION - PRESENTED
MR.OCHS: It's Item 6B. It was continued from October 12,
2010, BCC meeting, public petition request from Ms. Monique Perez
Marini, requesting assistance for Chinese drywall remediation.
MS. MARINI: Good morning.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Good morning.
MS. MARINI: I'd like to apologize for not making it on the 12th,
but it was not because of lack of importance. I was at my oncologist's
Page 40
October 26,2010
office.
I'd like to tell you that I purchased a home using SHIP program
money in 2009. It's my first home. It took two years to fix my credit
in order to do so.
And my home is full of Chinese drywall. My three children and
I have to rent a trailer that is on the side of my home in order to sleep
and breath properly. It's getting worse.
I have done research and found that there are alternatives to
gutting the entire house. I've passed that research along to Mr.
Ramsey. It's with Saber Technologies.
The cost for Saber Technologies runs around $40,000 as opposed
to gutting the home of its Chinese drywall and replacing it being a lot
higher. I don't know the number.
What I'm asking the board is to grant remediation to help me
funds -- grant funds to help me remediate this problem, because my
children have bloody noses, headaches, itchy, watery eyes. My tumor
markers have gone haywire since living in the home.
It's a sickness that I've been beating for nine years, and it is
scaring me that I might have to continue fighting longer or might have
problems in the future.
As far as appliances, all my appliances are on the blink. I have
no A/C in the home, which is what prompted me to initially have to
rent a trailer and pay an additional $600 a month aside from my
$1,200 mortgage just to live.
And that's it.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. You have indicated that this is a
matter that is under litigation at this time?
MS. MARINI: It is.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. And that this is a matter which is
subject to an ongoing code enforcement case?
MS. MARINI: It is.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Commissioner Henning?
Page 41
October 26, 2010
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Who installed the drywall?
MS. MARINI: Knauf. The builder, you mean? The builder of
the home is Kaye Homes. The Chinese drywall is named Knauf
Chinese drywall. The person who -- the subcontractor who installed
it, I don't know. I didn't get that information from Kaye Homes.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: When was the home built?
MS. MARINI: 2006, December 2006.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Okay. And you're in litigation
with Kaye Homes?
MS. MARINI: No. I'm in part of the civil action for Knauf
Chinese drywall.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Okay.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: That's a class-action lawsuit.
MS. MARINI: It's a class-action lawsuit, yes.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: County Attorney, provide us some
guidance with respect to involvement in issues that are subject to
litigation and to a code enforcement case.
MR. KLATZKOW: 1 don't know that you want to get involved
in this. There are thousands of these cases in Southwest Florida. I
mean, it's an absolute tragedy what's happened.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: You're going to have to get a little closer
to the mike.
MR. KLATZKOW: Yeah. It's an absolute tragedy what's
happened. It's affecting thousands of our residents in Southwest
Florida, but I don't know that you want to get involved in it. I don't
think that this is the right body for it. I think that the court system is
better geared to handle this than the legislative system is.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Yeah. Commissioner Fiala?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Have there been any grants through
any part of our government to help some of the people recover from
something like this? Because usually, you know, especially in cases
Page 42
October 26, 2010
where they're in lower income housing anyway, they're not going to
have the money to do that.
MR. RAMSEY: That's correct, Commissioner Fiala. Frank
Ramsey, for the record.
There has not been, to date, any specific programs to help with
Chinese drywall; however, the grant agencies have gone on the record
that using grant funds is allowable to mediate Chinese drywall.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: What about us? We have these
stabilization funds, right? Can we -- can we use something like that to
help in this case?
MR. RAMSEY: We could look into it, perhaps. One of the
challenges would be proving that the home is abandoned and
foreclosed, which is one of the requirements of the program in order to
assist that property.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: What about grants that we have that
we offer to people who are trying to improve their house, like a new
roof or new air-conditioning because theirs isn't working anymore?
Do we have anything like that --
SPEAKER: Yes, ma'am.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: -- that we could assist with?
MR. RAMSEY: That would be the funding we would use.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: So have you spoken to her about
that at all?
MR. RAMSEY: Yes, we've spoken; however, if the board were
to direct us to assist, there'd be some items that I would have to be
approved in order to be eligible. For example, your limit per house is
$50,000, and a recent article in which a lawsuit was settled with the
same manufacturer is estimating the cost at $60 per square foot.
And so based on the size of the house, if it's a 2,000-square- foot
house, for example, that would be about $120,000. So I would need to
come back for (sic) you and get certain approval in order to make this
eligible under the program that you have approved currently.
Page 43
October 26, 2010
COMMISSIONER FIALA: She had just said $40,000.
MR. RAMSEY: It would depend. That's under an alternative
method of remediation, and we would need to investigate that -- in my
opinion, we'd need to investigate to make sure that whatever action we
took was truly remediating the problem for -- once and for all and not
at risk of it coming back. But we would certainly do so if so directed
at the most cost effective means.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: How do you decide who you're going to
help?
MR. RAMSEY: That would be up to the board. As it's currently
written, it's first come, first served. As your county attorney
mentioned, there are many, many homes in Collier County that are
affected.
The number -- I'm unable to give you an exact number, but it's
many. The program currently would be first come, first served.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: You don't have to answer this if you
don't want to, okay. But I would presume that a home purchased in
2006 --
MS. MARINI: I purchased my home in 2009.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: 2009.
MS. MARINI: It was a foreclosure.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Then are you--
MS. MARINI: And it's valued --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Are you underwater on the mortgage?
MS. MARINI: No.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. So the property is not, I presume,
is not in danger of foreclosure.
MS. MARINI: No.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay.
MS. MARINI: In order to get an easement from my bank --
forbearance from my bank, 1 would have to be heading towards
foreclosure so that they would waive the mortgage for a year and tack
Page 44
October 26, 2010
it onto the end, but I don't want to do that.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Does anybody want this brought back
for a full hearing? This is a normal procedure. We generally do not
make decisions like this at the time of the petition. It must be brought
back __ generally is brought back for a full hearing so that we have all
the facts concerning the case.
Does anyone want to bring this back for a full hearing?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: I don't think we want go there.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. All right.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: I think it's opening Pandora's box.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. I'm sorry. I think the general
consensus of the board seems to be that this is a widespread problem
and if we open the door --
MS. MARINI: I understand that, I understand that, but SHIP and
my mortgage is backed by USDA, which only brings to mind the
safety in eating beef, so therefore my home should be safe. And I did
initially receive funds from Collier County to match what I put down
on the home, and I'm living in a home that's not healthy.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Is that Collier County's fault?
MS. MARINI: Is it mine?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Did you have the home inspected?
MS. MARINI: Yes, 1 did, and there should have been guidelines
in place to have that inspector be able to see that the Chinese drywall
was in the ceiling of the attic in the garage. As soon as you walk in, it
says it right there, and he overlooked it, for whatever reason.
So it's not your fault. It's not my fault. But the same way you
told the people before that you don't want to waste all the money for
the roadways, my house is worth nothing. And my health and my
childrens' health is at risk.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Thank you very much.
MS. MARINI: Thank you.
MR.OCHS: Commissioners, you have a 10:15 time certain.
Page 45
October 26, 2010
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Yes. We might be able to make it.
MR. OCHS: Yes, sir.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Why don't we do it.
Item #lOG
REVIEW OPTIONS RELATED TO THE APPLICATION OF
REDUCED IMPACT FEE RATES TO BUILDING PERMITS
THA T HAVE NOT BEEN ISSUED AND ARE CURRENTLY IN
APPL Y OR READY STATUS, PREPARED IN ACCORDANCE
WITH DIRECTION PROVIDED BY THE BOARD OF COUNTY
COMMISSIONERS ON OCTOBER 12,2010 - MOTION TO
APPROVE OPTION #1 - APPROVED
MR. OCHS: That is Item lOG on your agenda. It's a
recommendation to review the options related to the application of
reduced impact fee rates to building permits that have not been issued
and are currently in apply or ready status, prepared in accordance with
direction provided by the board on October 12th.
Ms. Amy Patterson will present or answer questions, whichever
the board prefers. We have the staff recommendations, Amy.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Anybody have any questions
about this item? We heard it last time, and staff was going to develop
some policy. And you are recommending some alternatives, and 1
believe you recommend alternative one?
MS. PATTERSON: That's correct.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Is the petitioner here?
MR. OCHS: I believe you have a registered speaker, sir.
MR. MITCHELL: Sir, we've one registered speaker.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. But let's hear from the petitioner
with respect to the petitioner's position on the recommendation of
staff.
Page 46
October 26, 2010
MR. ANDERSON: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
MR. MITCHELL: This is the public speakers. You registered to
speak as well, yeah. Okay.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Well, he only gets to speak one time, so.
MR. OCHS: This is it.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: This is your registered speaker time.
MR. ANDERSON: Yes, sir.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay.
MR. ANDERSON: My name is Bruce Anderson from Roetzel &
Andress law firm, and I support the staff recommendation.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you. Now, let's call the speaker.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: That's him.
MR. MITCHELL: No. That was the speaker.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Oh, that was the speaker.
MR. MITCHELL: That was the speaker. Sorry, sir.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Very well.
Commissioner Halas.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Chairman, I -- some of the -- when
I read all this, I understand that we're in a unique -- the way that our
ordinance is written, this is kind of a unique time because we've never
experienced where we've had a downturn of this magnitude. And I'm
just wondering how much longer we're going to look at readjusting the
impact fees. Is this going to go on for another couple of years, or are
we looking at a possibility of reversing this trend?
My concern is, we have a huge debt service, and at this point in
time it's being administered by ad valorem.
And I'm concerned because the majority of the citizens are
saying that growth has to pay for growth. And I'm concerned in the
direction that we're going with all of these impact fees.
And yes, I understand that the developer in this case, he has the
ability to cancel and then resubmit, and basically we end up where we
are right now.
Page 47
October 26, 2010
But my concern is addressing the impact fees and how they are
going to be used to address our debt.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Would someone like to address that
question for Commissioner Halas?
MR. CASALANGUIDA: For the record, good morning. Nick
Casalanguida with the Growth Management Division.
Legally we were required to do that analysis every year. If
impact fees, our rates go down and our costs go down, our -- goes
down, then that's calculated in there. Also it's calculated your debt
load in essence as well, too.
So unfortunately as these rates decrease, our costs decrease, we
do these analyses and we come back and adjust the fees.
I spoke with the commissioner at length regarding this. The issue
we discussed is setting the time at which you set these fees. You are
now making an adjustment really to go into permit pickup.
Obviously when rates change and we head in the other direction,
there will be a strong movement to make sure we keep it at apply
status. And that's always been our dilemma is that we're on both ends
of the bad side of the curve.
So I hope that answers your question. I share your frustration. I
just don't know what we could do about it.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: I just hope that when we start to
reverse this trend that we address the impact fees as they start to go up
as aggressively as we have addressed them on the way down so that
we make sure that we have equilibrium in regards to addressing the
impact fees and addressing our debt, okay?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: And in fact, there is good justification
for doing that, because when you update the fees, you're using
historical information anyway. So when they start going back up,
we're already lagging the curve, so you don't want to push them
further ahead.
So at the time of application is the proper time to assess it, and
Page 48
October 26, 2010
there's a lot oflogic in doing it that way.
Commissioner Fiala?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yes. I really appreciate the fact that
we're doing this because we're also showing the public at large that we
don't only just go up. We do come down with these fees as well. And
I think it will possibly help to be a stimulus to get some jobs back in
line, to get some people working again. I think that's a good thing. I
liked option one, and so I would like to make a motion to approve
option one.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Second.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. I have a motion to approve option
one by Commissioner Fiala, second by Commissioner Coletta.
Is there any further discussion? Commissioner Henning?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: I was just going to make a
motion to staffs recommendations.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. All right. No further discussion,
all in favor, please signifY by saying aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Aye.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Any opposed, by like sign?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: It passes unanimously.
MS. PATTERSON: Thank you.
MR.OCHS: Commissioner, would you like to take 9A and get
that out of way before your break, one appointment.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay.
Item #9 A
Page 49
October 26, 2010
RESOLUTION 2010-218: RE-APPOINTING KAREN M.
ACQUARD TO THE GOLDEN GATE EST A TES LAND TRUST
COMMITTEE - ADOPTED
MR. OCHS: 9A is an appointment of a member to the Golden
Gate Estates Land Trust Committee.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Motion to follow the
committee's recommendation for Karen Acquard.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Second.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. A motion by Commissioner
Coletta to approve the committee's recommendation, seconded by
Commissioner Halas.
All in favor, please signify by saying aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Aye.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Any opposed, by like sign?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: It passes unanimously.
Do you have anything else we can do in three minutes?
MR. OCHS: No, sir. I've tried that before, and it failed, so --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: You learned your lesson?
MR. OCHS : Yes, sir.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: All right. Then we will take a l3-minute
break.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Great.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: We'll be back here at 10:40.
(A brief recess was had.)
MR. OCHS: Mr. Chairman, you have a live mike.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Ladies and gentlemen, the Board
Page 50
October 26, 2010
of County Commissioners meeting is back in session.
Where do we go from here, County Manager?
Item #lOA
REPORT ON THE STATUS OF CABLE TELEVISION
COMPETITION WITHIN COLLIER COUNTY - MOTION TO
ACCEPT REPORT - APPROVED
MR. OCHS: Mr. Chairman, we're on Section 10 of your agenda,
county manager's report.
Item lOA is a recommendation to accept the report on the status
of cable television competition within Collier County.
Mr. Jamie French, your Manager of Operations and Regulatory
Management from Growth Management Division, will present.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay, Jamie let's hear it.
MR. FRENCH: Good morning. First and foremost, again, for
the record, Jamie French. I'm the Director of Operations and
Regulatory Management for the Growth Management Division.
First and foremost, I'd like to thank the Board of County
Commissioners primarily because it's been a long time since I've worn
my cable hat since the 2007 cable legislation, but it did give my office
the opportunity to reach back out not just to the community, but to this
industry to determine what the needs were of both the citizens of
Collier County and the businesses of Collier County, as well as what
the private industry is doing to satisfy those needs.
I'd also like to thank the members of industry. It's been a -- in the
seven years that I've worked for Collier in the capacity of a regulator,
so to speak, I've never had the opportunity to actually get in one room
with all four companies or all three companies. And 1 didn't
necessarily know if they were just not speaking because of the
proprietary nature of their business or ifit was egos or what. But it
Page 51
October 26, 2010
was really a -- there was a great deal of information passed to staff that
I'm here to share with you today, and better yet, I'm here to allow the
industry to share with you what's going on with their companies.
Additionally, a lot of this could not have taken part without the
efforts of the groups from the ERTF, as well as from the local EDC.
They really did jump in onboard and really help us out as far as doing
research and putting these good folks together.
With that, on the -- at your June 8th meeting, Commissioners,
you directed staff to go out and kind of take a reading of what the
industry was doing maybe to promote competition amongst
themselves to provide alternative services to customers that are only
tied to one provider, whether that be Comcast, whether that be Direct
TV or DISH Network, resale or directly with the company.
So what we did is we did reach out to the State of Florida through
their franchise licensing office. Unfortunately we were not able to
gather all the information we were looking for as far as licensed
providers, and hence the reason why we went back into the
community to determine from the business sections who they were
dealing with.
With that, a couple companies had stepped up, and one of which
we've met with on several times is CenturyLink, our local telephone
exchange provider, and they're going to get up here and tell you a little
bit about some of the things they're doing, as well as Marco Island
Cable, and they also have a sister company called New View, which is
in Collier County, that is also competing for cable television business,
fiber home technical, as well as Internet service.
Additionally, we have invited and graciously they have accepted
on all of our meetings requests, the folks at Comcast, and they have
stepped up. They're here to talk about the changes going on with their
product as well as the service offerings that they provide to the
community .
And finally, because there's been some questions -- or at your
Page 52
October 26, 2010
board meeting there was some questions as far as what was going on
with Immokalee, Commissioner Coletta. And so what we did is we
reached out to a local fiber provider, and this is not someone that is
necessarily in the cable television business, but someone that is in the
business of installing fiberoptics and communications throughout
Collier County, long-term company that has done business with
probably many of the providers that are here today as well as Collier
County and many of the private businesses that operate in Collier, and
that's US MetroTel, and Mr. Frank Mambuca from US MetroTel is
here as well to answer any questions that you may have as far as
communications and where he sees his industry going as far as
reaching out to rural communities like Immokalee, Golden Gate
Estates, beyond the gated communities and reaching out to the
subdivisions as well.
So with that, I'm just going to go in alphabetical order if it
pleases the board and I'll allow --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Could I just ask a question though?
You mentioned something about ERTF. I don't know what that is.
MR. FRENCH: Yes, ma'am. That is the Economic Recovery
Task Force.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay. Thank you.
MR. FRENCH: And Diane Flagg with our Growth Management
Department's heading that up.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Thanks.
MR. FRENCH: And there's a number of SWAT teams that
include county staff, the Sheriffs Office, as well as other local
agencies and the chamber that are reaching out to attract new
businesses to Collier.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. I think it might be appropriate to
provide some guidelines as to what we would really be interested in
hearing, and we wanted to limit this to maybe a three minute brief
presentation per representative.
Page 53
October 26, 2010
But I would like to hear a statement, brief statement, of the
capabilities and interest in providing cable television services within
Collier County and within what time frame. So if people feel
comfortable addressing that in public without violating any of your
trade secrets, I would very much appreciate hearing it.
And the commissioners wish to ask questions now, or do you
want to wait till these presentations are over?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: I just want to make a statement,
working with the County Attorney's --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Go ahead.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: -- Office and Jamie French, we
have identified different funding sources for infrastructure needs, like
I say, a community who has limited infrastructure in there, possibility
of creating municipal taxing benefit units, and the CRAs has a lot of
flexibility to put this in there.
The beauty of that is right now that infrastructure is put on your
service bill. This mechanism provides a homeowner a way to take it
off their taxes, so -- and pay for that infrastructure over a long period
of time.
Really excited about what Jamie has been doing over the past
few months on this issue and -- because it is his work, I think we've
got some attention.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay, good. Anybody else want to
make a statement at this point in time or just hold your questions?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: I'll hold my questions.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Very well.
Then let's get started.
MR. FRENCH: I'm going to go ahead and turn it over to Mr.
Brian Hammond from Century Link.
MR.OCHS: Three minutes each, sir?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Yes, please.
MR. HAMMOND: Thank you very much, Jamie, and good
Page 54
October 26, 2010
morning. I'm Brian Hammond. I'm the Manager of Market
Development for CenturyLink here in Southwest Florida. I'm very
excited to have the opportunity to speak with you this morning.
We have a new offering coming up in the future that I'm going to
share with you some information about. I'm also going to take a few
moments to talk a little bit about who Century Link is and what we
mean to Collier County.
At CenturyLink, we're extremely excited about bringing our TV
service called Prism to the Southwest Florida market. Now, we
believe that once we launch our product, we'll have the most robust
choice for television service in the area.
With Prism, we're hoping to change the way people look at TV.
Prism provides a 100 percent digital picture and sound. It's backed by
fiberoptics. It also provides a networked whole home DVR that
allows you to record a show in one room and then go watch it and pick
it up in another room.
We've also got a list of features that I could stand here and tell
you about all day long. But, you know, we've got some
demonstrations in our stores that you could take a look at, at a later
date.
One of the things that I want to mention is that for Collier County
residents, this basically means they will soon have a choice. They're
no longer tied to Comcast. They're no longer tied to the satellite
providers. They will have another choice, another alternative
television service, and they can then bundle that, high speed Internet
and television service and home phone service all on one bill with us
at CenturyLink.
So who is CenturyUnk? Where did we come from? Well,
CenturyUnk started out as the local telephone company. You may
remember Sprint Home Phone Service or Embarq Home Phone
Service. Well, in July of2009, Embarq and CenturyTel merged to
form a company called CenturyLink, and CenturyUnk is a very
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October 26, 2010
forward looking communications provider. We're a Fortune 500
company. We've got service in 33 different states. But because we
have national scale, that doesn't mean we don't operate on a local
level.
We actually have very localized operations. We even have a store
over there next to the Hollywood 20 on Naples Boulevard with the
largest fiberoptics network in Collier County. We provide high speed
Internet to homes, businesses, and public enterprises here locally. We
also employ approximately 200 people in Collier County alone.
And as I mentioned, we've got that store that's a local point of
preference where people can go in, and if they want to simply pay a
bill, they can pay a bill. They could try our service before they --
before they actually sign up for it.
And then on the charitable side, we do a lot in Collier County and
in the Southwest Florida market as a whole. Our charitable and
sponsors -- charitable contribution and sponsorship budget is a half a
million dollars for this area, and we've done things like get 10,000
pounds of food to the St. Matthew's House down here, support the
Collier County Golden Apple, and also partnered with the Children's
Museum of Naples and the YMCA down here. So we're proud to be a
part of the community, and we're excited about our future offering of
television service.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Thank you very much.
MR. HAMMOND: Sure.
MR. FRENCH: The one thing that, from staffs perspective on
CenturyLink is -- I'm glad he pointed out how many folks they
employ. This new offering, as reported to staff, is going to employ an
initial 20 jobs to Collier County that are going to be north of about
$55,000 a year.
So these are going to put some electrical journeymen, those type
of folks that actually do this type of work -- that's very, very niche, but
the bottom line is, is that their offerings will expand their capabilities
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October 26, 2010
to provide employment just to Collier, as well as their South Florida
market.
I believe, Brian, you're north of about 40 employees that you're
looking at expanding to?
MR.OCHS: When?
MR. FRENCH: When are you -- can you give us any type of--
MR. HAMMOND: So -- if you want me to step back up to the
microphone.
We did have customers that are trialing our service right now in
market. I won't give a specific number, because that is proprietary
information. It is in the hundreds. We are not full scale yet, but we
anticipate being full scale very soon, and we will have a very public
announcement when we do go full scale.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you.
Commissioner Halas has a question.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: I'd like to ask you a question. 1
was at your local store and asked them a couple of questions. One
was, are you going to have the surround sound on all your channels,
your high def. channels, and they couldn't answer the question, so can
you answer that question?
MR. HAMMOND: Boy, that is a great question. I imagine if the
program itself has surround sound on it, then our service would
support that. I can't speak specifically though to that issue.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Well, I've been waiting for an
email from your sales associates, and they haven't been able to provide
that yet.
The other question is, are you going to be as competitive as
Comcast is with high def. television channels?
MR. HAMMOND: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Are you going to carry pretty much
what they carry? And 1 guess then my next -- my last question is, are
you going to be allowed to be directly in competition with Comcast so
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October 26, 2010
that the citizens here have a choice of either Comcast or CenturyLink?
And I'll probably ask this with the other providers that are going to
speak on this -- so that there's the ability and hopefully it will drive the
price of cable television down where it's more affordable for the
families.
MR. HAMMOND: Yeah. I'll take that last question about
competition first. Yeah, absolutely, we believe that having another
choice in the market is going to only improve the conditions for the
customer.
Pricing is always determined by market conditions and demand.
But right now our initial packages and offerings do look like they
come in a little bit lower than our competition.
As far as the high definition channels, we do have over 40 high
definition channels right now, and we only plan to expand that line up.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Commissioner Coyle?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Yes.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I have a question for this gentleman,
if! may.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Please go ahead, yes.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Sir, thank you. Before you were
CenturyLink when it was still Sprint, and still now to this day, we at
the East Naples Civic Association as well as the Bayshore Gateway
Triangle CRA have been pleading with the people to improve the
appearance of their facility over there on Davis Boulevard. It's not a
very nice sight, and especially that chain link fence.
And we've been asking them to do something. They never have.
Sometimes -- most of the times they won't even respond to us. And 1
was -- and it's nice that you're doing so much community activity, but
we would like you to do something about your facility to make our
community look better.
MR. HAMMOND: Sure. I understand and hear your concern. I
can report to you that we're actually actively in the process of offering
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October 26, 2010
that real estate up for sale.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay.
MR. HAMMOND: So.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Thank you.
MR. FRENCH: Your next speakers are representatives from
Comcast.
MS. HAGAN: Thank you, Jamie.
For the record, Barbara Hagan, Vice-President/General Manager
for Comcast.
As you mayor may not know, Comcast, including successor
companies, has served -- serviced the Collier County area with video
products since the '70s, and expanded into broadband services in the
'90s. I personally joined Comcast Communications in Collier County
in 1985.
As the county grew, Comcast grew. Comcast services all types
of neighborhoods, suburban and rural throughout Collier County,
including highrises, single family homes, mobile home parks,
apartments, and gated communities. Our customers includes --
include those with agreements through their associations and those
that are not.
Today your county residents are offered broadband services by
the largest media company in the U.S. servicing over 23 million video
customers, 16 million high speed Internet customers, and over 8
million telephone customers.
Comcast has quickly grown to be the third largest residential
phone service provider in the U.S.
The size of the company is not necessarily important. What is
important is having the ability to keep up with technological
improvements while improving our products and the reliability of our
services we provide.
Comcast has been a true success story through the hard work of
our employees and the reinvestments back into the infrastructure.
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October 26, 2010
I would like to take a couple minutes to explain why I didn't feel
Comcast will continue to be a nationwide leader in broadband
products and service for many years into the future.
In the mid to late '90s, Comcast made a tremendous investment in
fiberoptic technology. Today we have over 3,500 miles offiberoptics
in Southwest Florida. That infrastructure continues to be scalable for
the current products and services we are delivering.
As the county's broadband need -- as the country's broadband
needs change, including Collier County's, the Comcast network will
support that change.
Just last week we announced that our video on demand library
was expanded to 17,000 choices, of which 3,000 are high definition,
and 80 percent are at no additional cost to our digital video customers.
In 2011, that selection will be growing again to 25,000 selections,
of which 6,000 are high definition.
As our customers expect access to more content at times that are
convenient for our busy schedules, there is no company that has more
video on demand choices than Comcast.
Along with the increased options included in our on demand
libraries, we continue to increase our linear content. In 2011, our high
definition channels will grow to 100, and we will also add an
additional ten standard definition channels.
Recently we announced that we have doubled our Coba/Latino
offerings, channels available to our customers. Weare constantly
reviewing our product offerings, looking at customer requests, and we
will continue to do so in the future.
In addition to viewing your favorite sitcoms and movies on the
television, accessing programming through the Internet is growing in
popularity .
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Could you wrap it up a bit? The three
minutes have expired.
MS. HAGAN: Oh, sure.
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October 26, 2010
So today Comcast offers nearly 150,000 video choices on line,
including movies, TV shows, and extras.
We have 800 Come asters that live and work in Collier and Lee
Counties that join a workforce of 100,000 throughout the country. All
of us are investors in the company, and we will continue to work
together as a successful team. We share ideas, challenges, and
opportunities.
I personally thank you for giving me the opportunity to share my
enthusiasm of this fast paced industry on how my company, Com cast,
will continue to meet Collier County needs for many years into the
future.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you.
MS. HAGAN: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Any questions?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: I have one question.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Commissioner Halas?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: What are your plans for updating
your customer service? I think it leaves a lot to be desired. A lot of
times when somebody has a problem, it takes three to four days to
have a technician come out and service the problem. And I think that
you need to step up to the plate and at least come up with something
that's more inclined to less than 24 hours or 24 hours turnaround time.
MS. HAGAN: Yeah. I will tell you, there's two types of
customer service. There's our CAEs, our customer account executives
on the phone, and then our field technicians. We have, in Fort Myers
on Daniels Parkway, we have our phone CAEs, and there's 200
individuals that work in that facility.
Year to date we've answered 80 percent of our phone calls in 30
seconds or less. So I think that's very commendable. And we do a
very good job of staffing that.
As far as our technicians, there are two different types of service.
If you're all out, meaning all of your products are out, we'll be to your
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October 26, 2010
home within 24 hours. If you have a particular product or something
else, it could take probably, on average -- I think our average time to
repair is around 38 hours. Again, that is an average.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Four days.
MS. HAGAN: So -- I apologize ifthere was a situation with four
days, but just last month our average was 38 hours. Okay?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Any other questions?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you very much, Ms. Hagan.
MS. HAGAN: Thank you.
MR. FRENCH: Commissioners, the next gentleman that's going
to be speaking for Marco Island Cable and New View is a gentleman
by the name of Bill Gaston. Bill has been a franchise holder for
Collier County for now over 15 years. Mr. Gaston appeared before
you back in 2005 where we expanded the footprint of his service
availability off of Marco Island so that now he had a -- he has a
countywide franchise.
And although the county does -- no longer issues franchises and
they are set to expire in 2012, Bill has certainly been active in the
Marco Island community, and I know he's expanding his system pretty
rapidly.
So without further ado, I'll turn it over to Mr. Gaston.
MR. GASTON: Mr. French.
I'm, for the record, Bill Gaston, Sr., Marco Island Cable and New
View. Your successors gave Marco Island Cable a franchise in 1993.
So we're 17 years into a Collier County franchise.
And we now have 9,000 subscribers and should be around 10,000
subscribers around the first of January. We're expanding. We were
the first to have a digital head end in Collier County, providing digital
cable box services in 1997. We were the first, including Comcast's
predecessors in interest, CenturyLink's predecessors in interest. We
were the first to offer high speed Internet in April of 1999, and so
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October 26, 2010
we've stayed technology -- we've stayed ahead of the technology
pretty much all the time, and that's why we've been able to gain more
than 50 percent market share in our primary area of Marco Island
Cable.
We do primarily serve condominiums and highrises, but we do
have -- we're in front of over 1,000 single family homes, and we serve
around 600 single family homes in Collier Coun- -- in Marco Island,
and that is expanding.
Starting out in the cable industry is an extremely capital intensive
business. And over the years, we have obtained a very good market
share of the condominiums, but we do not want to slight the single
family homes, and that is our concentration on Marco at the present
time.
In association with New View, we now serve a condominium
complex, 800 -- excuse me -- 180 customers in Naples, the Naples
area, off of Pine Ridge Road. And this is very significant in that we
now offer the first capability to supply 100 megabits of service, 100
megabits of dedicated service, to that new facility. We're building --
we feel that the current cable high speed Internet standard is just too
slow and not that capable. Weare looking at all possibilities to get at
least 100 megabits to a single family home or to a condominium. That
is our push right now.
There are very little differences in the offerings of Comcast
versus Marco Cable versus CenturyLink as far as our linear feeds and
our VOD, but it's very -- we feel where we can excel at this present
time is to offer extremely high speed internet services.
And I think that was my tone. Is that my three --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: You actually have thirty seconds, almost
30 seconds.
MR. GASTON: I got 30 seconds, okay. Let's see.
One of the things we're doing in 2011 is we're going to a
concierge style of service where every customer will have their own
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October 26, 2010
representative at our business, and if they're not happy with our
service, they talk directly to that customer. If that customer (sic) does
not supply the proper answers, they talk directly to me. We do not
have a voice mail system -- excuse me. We have a voice mail system,
but we don't have an automated attendant. They get a live person
when they answer the telephone.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: That's your three minutes.
MR. GASTON: That's my three minutes, okay. Thank you very
much.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you.
Commissioner Halas has a question.
MR. GASTON : Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Are you going to expand your
service to cover all along the coastline and the interior of Collier
County so that maybe the possibility will exist that we could have
possibly three cable services that citizens can choose from?
MR. GASTON: That is our intention. We have access to fiber in
association with U.S. Metro. We have access to fiber that goes
through every major intersection, almost every major intersection, in
Collier and Lee counties. So it is our intention to expand our service
where we're wanted.
It's -- keep in mind that we are -- we are in a competitive
situation now, and we have to -- we have to maintain a bottom line
that allows us to expand. So we will go to where we are needed the
most.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: And when do you anticipate that
you will have the capabilities to service a multitude of customers here
in Collier County?
MR. GASTON: I would expect that we will grow in the
neighborhood of2- to 4,000 subscribers a year in the Naples area over
the next five years.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: So it's going to be some time
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October 26, 2010
before you build out to accommodate people who may wish to have
your service?
MR. GASTON: There is no question about that.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Okay.
MR. GASTON: Now, keep in mind that CenturyUnk and
Comcast have been here a long time. Their predecessors in interest
have been here a tremendous time, and CenturyUnk is using a twisted
pair solution over -- which is a very good solution, but it's -- it does
have some limitations, but it is available throughout all their service
area with some upgrades that they're doing right now. We do not have
that capability, but we still are a very, very viable third choice. We
were the second choice for many, many years.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Good. And I like your attitude
towards customer service.
MR. GASTON: Thank you very much, sir.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: The buck stops here.
MR. GASTON: Yes. You have --
COMMISSIONER HALAS: I wish that more companies would
do -- and you talk to a human and not to a machine.
MR. GASTON: Thank you very much.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Yep.
MR. GASTON: Also I'd like to say that you have a throat to
choke. 1 mean, that means an awful lot when you say, when you're
not happy with your service, you can get to somebody that really can
make a decision for you. Thank you.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Thank you.
MR. FRENCH: Commissioners, Mr. Frank Mambuca's also here
from U.S. MetroTel. He could probably answer some of your
questions, I know he could, as far as the expandability of service
availability of fiber along the coastal areas, as well as through the rural
areas.
This is -- this is what Frank specializes in. He's done a lot of fiber
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October 26, 2010
infrastructure for Collier County, for the school board, and as a private
businessman. He leases fiber, as you've mentioned. As Mr. Gaston
mentioned, he does business with Mr. Gaston, and that's how Mr.
Gaston feeds his signal to other areas throughout Collier County.
They're another locally owned company, employ local workers,
and Mr. Mambuca's here ifhe has any -- if you have any questions for
him or if you'd like to say a few words, Frank.
MR. MAMBUCA: Sure. I'll try to take three minutes. Thank
you, Jamie, thank you, Board.
My name is Frank Mambuca. I'm the President and CEO as well
as one of six investors in U.S. Metropolitan Telecom, which we refer
to as U.S. Metro.
U.S. Metro operates a fiberoptic network across Collier County
and Lee County with connectivity to Miami and Tampa as well. We
serve the business community, not the residential community, and we
provide the double play of services, voice and data.
We basically opened our doors for business at the end of 2007 in
Collier County. We have over 100 miles of fiber. Our fiber goes
through the business areas, through 41, Goodlette-Frank. We do have
fiber out to Ave Maria town, up through Immokalee, and out to
LaBelle to get to Miami.
In the last three-and-a-half years, we've got some 100-plus
businesses, buildings, multi-tenant and single tenant on our network.
And again, we are a local company. That's what we like to say. Our
seven owners are all Collier County residents. We built the company
back in the time when, as Bill said, you had to invest a lot of capital
because we wanted to see commerce grow in Collier County. Our
children, our grandchildren, continue to move for jobs out of the local
area, so we wanted to build that infrastructure that would attract
businesses.
I was even pleased back when -- the potential for Jackson
Laboratories to move into town. The first call I got was from Barron
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October 26, 2010
Collier Companies asking, do you have fiber in this area, which we
do, and that's what we wanted to do when we built the company.
So today we're strong. We like to tell our customers, just the way
Bill mentioned, if you want to come see your billing representative or
your customer service representative, come right to our office, we're
live people, we're there.
What's also interesting about our folks is that we're
internationally experienced telecom people. Myself, I've build 40,000
miles of fiber in three continents, across one ocean, and came to
Collier County in 2001, fell in love, raised my family here, and never
plan to leave here. So that's why we have this infrastructure in place.
At some point in 2006, I met the Gastons, Bill, Sr., and Bill, Jr.,
and we started talking about how we could use this fiber infrastructure
that we have to not only serve the business community, but also serve
the residential community.
We, in the last year, connected fiber across the Marco Island
bridge to our network. And now using our backbone, we can very
quickly get to more of the communities in Collier County and even
Lee County.
We turned up our first community on Pine Ridge Road. We're
looking to turn up the next community on Airport Road, and continue
to do that, you know, throughout the rest of 20 1 0 and 2011.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Good. Questions?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you very much, Mr. Mambuca.
MR. MAMBUCA: Thanks.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: We have public speakers other than
those who have spoken?
MR. MITCHELL: Sir, you've one public speaker.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Would you call that speaker.
MR. MITCHELL: Paul Feuer.
MR. FEUER: Good morning.
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October 26, 2010
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Good morning.
MR. FEUER: I didn't come here to speak, however, in speaking
with Commissioner Henning, he knows that I -- on the -- I serve on
the President's Council, on the executive board as well, and was
involved and still am involved in doing a study on alternatives to our
existing cable provider, as well as speaking with our existing cable
provider.
So let me give you some background. Back in January the
President's Council, which represents 55,000 homes and continues to
grow here in Collier County -- at the meeting in January most of our
representatives were complaining about the service and the prices that
they were paying to Comcast.
It became obvious that everyone was interested in finding an
alternative, if there was, or getting Comcast to become more
competitive with pricing as well as improvement in service, because
service was another problem.
I met together with the chairman of the President's Council, with
Comcast to discuss our concerns. Comcast was pretty steadfast in
their position that our prices were, in fact, reasonable and that the
service was, in fact, satisfactory.
At that point in time, I began to start exploring what was out
there in terms of availability in terms of firms, and we brought in our
first -- as a matter of fact, in February I brought this to the attention of
the county at the president's meeting, letting them know that there are
concerns and issues with regard to cable TV here in our county.
In February I also brought in a firm by the name of Path works,
they were known as Ethos Media, to make a presentation to the
President's Council. You might have read about them in the Naples
Daily News. One of our communities here in Collier County just
signed a contract with them.
Our intent, by the way, is not to endorse any company. Our
intent is solely to find out what's best for our homeowners here in
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October 26, 2010
Collier County.
Last week I had three companies come into Village Walk for the
President's Council, put on presentations, also offering alternatives,
one of which is here, which is New View, which was also Marco
Cable, and we had over 23 associations attend that meeting. It was
very productive, quite informative. And I think we've gained a lot of
knowledge over the past several months in terms of technology,
learning that there's concerns and issues other than just service and
fees.
Most of our homes here in Collier County have the old coax
cable, and what we're finding out as more and more HD TV s go in and
more and more high speed Internet goes in, your reception will
deteriorate, your sound may -- your speed may slow down. You need
to go with fiberoptics if you're looking towards the future. So that's
one of the issues that we're looking at.
And the same thing we're looking at is bundling, because people
are paying abnormal -- very high prices on high speed Internet and so
forth, and there are much better prices.
The only concern I have is --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Sir, your time has expired. Could you
wrap it up, please.
MR. FEUER: Yeah. Well, the one issue, we could take care of
the associations. There's going to be competition. It's the individual
homeowners like in Golden Gate who don't have anyone representing
them. They may have a problem, and that's where the county needs to
come in to help them out as well.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you very much.
Okay. That was our last public speaker?
MR. MITCHELL: That was the last speaker, sir.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Commissioner Coletta?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Yes, thank you. And wonderful
presentation. It's very encouraging to see that free enterprise can work
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October 26, 2010
in most every case out there; however, there are some issues that we
haven't covered.
I don't think that, you know, 250 channels is a necessity for every
person in Collier County. Your economics might dictate that they
cannot afford it, and some people might have to do with nothing more
than an antenna on their roof to pick up two or three stations. And
that's acceptable.
The part I'm having a problem with, and one of the things I'd like
to discuss with you today is the Internet itself. The Internet has
become a part of our being. And in order for -- to be able to keep our
citizens, especially our youth today coming forward at an expeditious
pace, we have to make sure that there is reasonable access to the
Internet.
Now, I am more than willing to pay for what I get, you know, the
service I get, and I think it's worth every penny of it; however, with
that said, there's populations within Immokalee, East Naples, Golden
Gate City, that cannot afford it, and they do without it just for the
simple reason they can't bring it to their house.
What I'd like to see, if you gentlemen could get together, and if
anyone would like to address it, to develop hot spots where people
would be able to access the Internet within these communities. Grant
you, it might not be the same thing you would receive at your home,
but it would allow them to be able to be tied into the Internet and
maybe their children to be able to participate at an early age and not
be at a disadvantage when they're starting school or in school. Can
anybody comment on that?
One at a time though.
MR. FRENCH: Commissioners, I can only speak from staffs
perspective. I would tell you that that is the initiative that's going on
in Immokalee, and there are some -- there are some rural organizations
that have been put together that are taking advantage of some federal
stimulus dollars that will allow for wireless technology.
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October 26, 2010
Clearly, one of the things that staff has found and certainly what
the industry will promote, is that wireless is certainly not the most
secure of connections, not just -- not so much from an identity theft,
but as far as the consistency of the signal and really how it operates,
much like if you've ever tethered an air card or a cell phone to a -- or
an old land line to a computer through a modem, you'll find that it runs
extremely slow.
And, of course, that should not be the case with the Immokalee
project that we've seen. We -- and I've yet to really sit down and
speak with them to better understand what they're doing.
But the issue that they run into is, in the rural areas, primarily
because of the cost to do that type of an overbuild, this organization,
or these organizations, generally look for a payback period within
anywhere from a four- to six-, seven-year period. And if they're not
able to capture that, if there's no dollars available either from local
stimulus or federal stimulus dollars, they answer to investors.
So I don't know that you're going to get the private sector to step
up and say, sure, we're going to invest a couple million dollars into
infrastructure to provide some wireless hot spots throughout the
county, especially when they're not going to be able to pay back their
investors. So that could be an issue.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Well, it doesn't hurt to ask,
Jamie.
MR. FRENCH: Yes, sir. And we are asking.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: You know, if we're recipients of
the public funds, you know, through -- they're the services they
provide, at some point in time, most organizations step forward,
anywheres from the United Way to any other number of endeavors out
there to give back to the community. And I was just making a
suggestion that this may be given some consideration in the future.
MR. FRENCH: And if that's the will of the board, sir, we're
continuing to look at that right now. There are a number of counties,
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October 26, 2010
communities, throughout the nation that have done this through a
municipal type of a broadband effort, wireless effort. And we can --
we can work on that.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: And I realize that the
Immokalee situation is tied into a special grant that identifies rural
areas, but can we also broaden our scope to see what we can do on a
separate note for Golden Gate City and parts of East Naples?
MR. FRENCH: Yes, sir.
MR.OCHS: You talking about market based solutions, sir?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Well, whatever. I'm looking for
some hot spots within those areas, be it the school system provide
them, being that one of these providers out there step forward and say,
yes, we're willing to come up with something, possibly a community
room at one of the developments out there where you have low cost
housing, something of that nature. It wouldn't be an overkill by any
means, but it would just be able to give the residents within there -- 1
mean, they may have to leave their homes and go to the community
center or some point like that to be able to tap into it. Probably
nothing more than a common line that you already have in the
neighborhood, could go to that community center, and that would be
removed from the bill that would -- and then it would just be a service
to that particular community.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: What's wrong with Naples Free Net?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: That's a dial-in, and -- when's
the last time you used a dial-in network? I mean --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Well, ifl don't have one, I'll use a dial-in
network. You know, I don't need to have a G3, G4 network if I -- you
know, ifl'm looking for something that will get me on, I'll use a
dial-in network. I've done that many times, but anyway.
Commissioner Halas?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Commissioner Fiala was first.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Commissioner Fiala?
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October 26, 2010
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay. I have two quick questions.
By the way, the Free Net has been growing. I'm amazed at how big
it's gotten.
Two quick questions. First one, do you have a separate service
other than the ones that have been here that serve Golden Gate
Estates?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Comcast. I believe a couple of
these providers are already there. I know cable TV, Comcast.
MR. FRENCH: Comcast is currently the provider for that area,
ma'am.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Oh, because one of my kids lives in
Golden Gate Estates, and her television channels aren't the same as my
television channels, and I was just wondering if, as you move forward,
if some time or another all of the cable companies will be working
together so that we just have one channel that serves each of these
different -- like, you know, ABC and NBC and so forth.
MR. FRENCH: And it is -- I just got a head nod from Ms.
Hagan. As they move forward, that is the intent, that they'll have a
regional channel lineup.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Oh, great, great. Is that like in the
near future? Will I still be alive?
MS. HAGAN: October 2009.
MR. FRENCH: October 2009 is what she's telling me.
MS. HAGAN: Yeah. So they should be.
MR. FRENCH: I mean, of 20 1 O?
MS. HAGAN: It happened a year ago.
MR. FRENCH: Oh, it happened.
MS. HAGAN: We standardized the channel lineup. But if you
have specific channels, please get to me. There's just a couple
differences, but everything else is the same.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Oh, okay, great. Thank you.
MS. HAGAN: It happened a year ago.
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October 26, 2010
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay, thanks.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Commissioner Halas?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: I think one of the primary things
that -- I'm glad we got all these cable providers in the room at one
time, and I hope that they can look at getting the county government
channel on all of their cable systems, because it's very important that
as we carry on with these meetings, that everybody within the county
that has cable television has access to the government channel here.
In -- on Comcast I believe it's channel 97.
So I would hope that every one of you can provide a feed from
the Board of County Commissioners so that any of the meetings that
are conducted, that will be carried on television. And that's important
to make sure that the citizens here are well informed.
And also that if you're close to a proximity of -- whether it's
Marco Island -- I'm sure you carry Marco Island, the council meetings,
and also Naples, but it's important that all of the customers, whether
they're in Immokalee or whether they're out in the Golden Gate
Estates or along the coast, can view the government channel of the
Board of County Commissioners.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: I make a motion that we
approve the -- or accept the report status given by Jamie French.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Motion by Commissioner
Henning that we accept the report. Is there a second?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Second.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Second by Commissioner Halas.
Any further discussion?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: All in favor, please signify by saying
aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Aye.
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October 26, 2010
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Any opposed, by like sign?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: The motion passes unanimously. Thank
you.
Thank you all for being here.
Item #lOB
THE FYll CONTRACT BETWEEN COLLIER COUNTY AND
THE STATE OF FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH FOR
OPERA nON OF THE COLLIER COUNTY HEALTH
DEPARTMENT IN THE AMOUNT OF $1,666,400 - APPROVED
MR.OCHS: Commissioners, Item lOB is a recommendation to
approve the FY20 11 contract between Collier County and the State of
Florida Department of Health for operation of the Collier County
Health Department in the amount of $1 ,666,400.
Dr. Joan Colfer, your Public Health Director, is available to
answer question or present.
Commissioners, this is an item that was approved as part of your
October 1 budget. It's on the regular agenda due to the dollar amount
of the contract.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Commissioner Henning?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: I just want to recognize that
most of the apartments lowered the -- by 12 percent. This is a -- 5
percent less. Would like to -- information -- I'm sure you can divulge
without any HIP AA violations -- on customers served, historically
customers served.
DR. COLFER: Are you talking about where we took the -- I'm
not understanding the question. Do you want to know where we took
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October 26, 2010
our 5 percent cut? Because we did take a 5 percent cut, just like all
your own departments did, or do you want to hear about services
provided by the health department?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Neither. My question is, you
have on an annual basis, so many people come in through the door.
DR. COLFER: Right.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Can you provide the historical
number of customers coming in the door --
DR. COLFER: Sure.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: -- as far the last six years?
DR. COLFER: Sure. We can give you that.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Great. Thank you.
DR. COLFER: I mean, I didn't bring it with me, but I can
produce it for you, yeah.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Produce it, yeah.
DR. COLFER: I mean, I can tell you some numbers. The
federally funded WIC program provide -- feeds 11,000 women,
infants, and children each year. That's a federally funded program.
Immunizations, we provide roughly 40,000 annually. Last year that
number went to 92,000 because of the HlNl immunizations. And I
can rattle off some things like that, but I'll give you a full report.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Motion to approve.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Second.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Could you copy all of us.
DR. COLFER: I certainly will.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. We have a motion to approve by
Commissioner Coyle, second by Commissioner Coletta.
Any further discussion?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: All in favor, please signify by saying
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October 26, 2010
aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Aye.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Any opposed, by like sign?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: It passes unanimously.
DR. COLFER: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Another good presentation, Dr. Colfer.
DR. COLFER: Thank you very much, Commissioner Coyle.
Item #lOC
RESOLUTION 2010-219: A BOND RESOLUTION
AUTHORIZING REFUNDING OF ALL OF THE COUNTY'S
OUTSTANDING CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT REVENUE
BONDS, SERIES 2002, IN THE AMOUNT NOT TO EXCEED
$27,300,000 - ADOPTED
MR. OCHS: Item 10C is a recommendation to adopt a bond
resolution authorizing the refunding of all of the county's outstanding
capital and improvement revenue bonds, series 2002, in an amount not
to exceed $27,300,000.
Mr. Mark Isackson, Corporate Financial Planning and
Management Services, will present.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: What is that title again?
MR. OCHS: Corporate Financial Planning and Management
Service.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Wow.
MR. OCHS: It's a mouthful.
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October 26, 2010
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Just give us the highlights. We've read it.
MR. ISACKSON: Good morning, Commissioners. For the
record, Mark Isackson. I simply say, from the County Manager's
Office, to make it simpler.
Before you is an item that the Finance Committee has looked at
for the past few months. It comes on the heels of a refinancing of our
commercial paper program, and it is a continual effort by the Finance
Committee to dig into our debt structure to see what makes sense in
terms of refinancings in order to take advantage of the historically low
market that exists right now.
There are three reasons for this pres en- -- this refinancing
refunding that's before you this morning.
The first is, there will be a modest savings of roughly $890,000
over the remaining II-year life of the issue. The second issue is it
frees up about $2 million out of the 19-and-a-half million dollar fund
up that was a result of the bond insurance collapse a couple years ago,
and the third issue is that it takes out what we consider very onerous
bond covenants within this particular series of issues that required that
surety fund up.
So those are really the three big reasons why we are suggesting
that the board approve the bond resolution in an amount not to exceed
$27,300,000 and approve all necessary budget amendments connected
with it.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Commissioner Halas?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: I recommend that -- motion to
approve.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Second.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: I'll second that recommendation.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Motion to approve by Commissioner
Halas.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Second.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: And it was seconded first by
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October 26, 2010
Commissioner Fiala.
Any further discussion?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: All in favor, please signify by saying
aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Aye.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Any opposed, by like sign?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: The motion passes unanimously.
MR. ISACKSON: Thank you, Commissioners.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you, Mark.
MR. OCHS: Thank you, Mark.
Item #lOD
WASTE MANAGEMENT INC. OF FLORIDA, SUBMITTAL OF
AN APPLICATION TO THE FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF
ENVIRONMENT AL PROTECTION TO INCREASE THE
HEIGHT OF THE COLLIER COUNTY LANDFILL TO A
MAXIMUM ELEVATION OF 200 FEET ABOVE GRADE TO
GAIN ADDITIONAL DISPOSAL CAP ACITY, SAVING RA TE-
PAYER FUNDS AND MAXIMIZE EXISTING RESOURCES -
MOTION TO APPROVE W/STAFF'S RECOMMENDATIONS-
APPROVED
MR.OCHS: Item 10D is a recommendation to authorize Waste
Management, Incorporated, of Florida to submit an application to the
Florida Department of Environmental Protection to increase the height
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October 26, 2010
of the Collier County landfill to a maximum elevation of200 feet
above grade to gain additional disposal capacity, saving ratepayer
funds and maximize existing resources.
Dan Rodriguez will present.
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Good morning, Commissioners. Dan
Rodriguez, for the record, your Solid Waste Director.
We're here on one of the next big projects associated with your
Integrated Solid Waste Management Strategy.
As outlined in your executive summary, we're coming before you
to ask permission to authorize Waste Management to apply to Florida
Department of Environmental Protection for the expansion, elevation
expansion, of your Collier County Landfill, as outlined in your
Integrated Solid Waste Management Strategy.
Commissioners, this is your county landfill. It's one of the -- next
to your natural resources here in Collier County, from a business
standpoint, this is one of your most valuable assets. It provides
disposal capacity to the community not only for our generation, but
for future generations as well.
And as you're well aware, they're not building any more landfills
in the State of Florida. And if they are approving them, they're very
few. In fact, in the last 20 years, there's only been one landfill
approved for MSW, in the last 20 years.
What this board has done in the last ten years is outstanding.
You've extended the life of our landfill. Just ten years ago we had less
than three years remaining. We were filling it very quickly to the tune
of about 400,000 tons a year. You've cut that in half to 209,000 tons
just this past year. Annually it continues to decrease; however,
because they're not building any new landfills, we still need the
capacity, disposal capacity, for our community for future generations
as well.
This landfi 11 was permitted in 1975. It started accepting waste
back then. It's 283 acres. And as I mentioned earlier, it takes about
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October 26, 2010
209,000 tons a year.
This board had the foresight ten years ago to include in the
Growth Management Plan specific direction, a mandate that requires
staff to increase the permissible elevation of the landfill to gain
additional airspace capacity.
As part of that Integrated Solid Waste Management Strategy that
you adopted ten years ago, you updated it back in 2006, December
5th. It's a comprehensive plan, Commissioners, and it's not just about
landfilling. It's about recycling.
And this plan, as you see here, has four components, source
reduction, material reuse recycling, it's about diversion, it's about
optimizing existing assets and resources and obtaining additional
facilities. Vertically expanding the landfill, it's in your direction, will
optimize this current asset.
We also follow the guiding principles that you laid down for us
to be environmental and growth management compliant, to preserve
landfill airspace, but also to bring best value services, and operate at
the highest standards. The award that you saw this morning for cells
one and two reclamation is a national award.
Here's the big picture. Collier County still generates about
822,000 tons of waste a year. The very good news is that only 25
percent is landfilled. Huge reduction from ten years ago. 75 percent
of that is diverted or recycled.
As you read in the papers, you hear from many voices, why is
Collier County so dependent on the landfill? We're not. We actually
have a very comprehensive plan to do more with recycling. You
approved single stream recycling five years ago, well before any
communities in Florida, and only a few nationally.
The residents of Collier County have about an 80 percent
recycling rate, and we're making progress with the commercial
businesses in Collier County as well.
Vertical expansion. Currently the landfill is permitted at 108
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October 26, 2010
feet. What we're asking the board to do is to raise the elevation to 200
feet. That additional capacity will give you 19 years of additional
disposal capacity. Most importantly, it has a dollar value of$lOO
million.
To build a new landfill in the State of Florida, as I mentioned
earlier, is very tough to do. First of all, you'd have to find the area to
do it. You'd need at least 1,200 acres to have the appropriate buffers,
and then you have to get it passed by the citizens of that local area, as
well as FDEP, the Corps of Engineers, South Florida Water
Management, and many other regulatory agencies.
Project benefits. It provides long term disposal needs for the
community. Commissioners, this is an insurance policy that you, as
leaders, which you've done very well the last ten years to ensure that
our community will have disposal capacity, not only for this
generation, but future generations.
This is the chart that we're all familiar with. This is the AUIR
chart; however, there's a small change in it. The large blue line to the
far right is the additional disposal capacity that you would gain from
raising the elevation of the landfill.
Currently we have disposal capacity going out to 2039. With this
approved recommendation, we would get disposal capacity out to
2058.
In addition, FDEP's rules and regulations associated with
permitting a landfill are becoming more and more strict. There're
currently 30 permits alone just to operate one landfill we must comply
with. Fortunately for us, we've partnered with Waste Management,
and they provide a very good service and ensure compliance with
those permits.
The other benefit is the fact that our recycling program is very
good in Collier County. As you know, two years ago the State of
Florida adopted new mandates that require municipalities above
40,000 people by the year 2020 to reach a recycling rate of75 percent.
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October 26, 2010
As I mentioned earlier, we're well on our way with residential.
We're above that by 5 percent. We're well on our way with
commercial.
The regulations for managing landfills are getting stricter.
They're going to require us to recycle more and more waste.
Commissioner, that's a short presentation; however, the facts are
pretty much there. It's a best value decision. We're asking a board
recommendation to authorize Waste Management to comply with the
Growth Management Plan, as well as our Integrated Solid Waste
Management Strategy to apply for a permit modification that would
extend the height of the landfill to 200 feet.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Dan, we have some public speakers and
commissioners who also want to ask questions, but I would just like to
make one suggestion.
In your presentations, you should -- you should deal with the
actual figures. You're not asking to raise the height of the landfill
another 100 feet. You're asking to raise it 70 feet. All you're doing is
trying to get some additional space on top so if you have some need to
put a tower or a -- any other gas -- burning gas off the thing, that you
will have room to do that.
So you're not increasing the landfill 100 feet. You're increasing
it 70 feet; isn't that true?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: That's correct, Commissioner. Thank you.
It's 70 feet actually is the increase in height.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: That's right. So that's important because
that's 30 feet less than most people are expecting.
So how about the commissioners? Now you want to ask your
questions now, or would you rather wait for the public speakers?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: I can wait.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. All right. Then we'll have public
speakers. How many do we have?
MR. MITCHELL: Sir, we've just one public speaker, and that is
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October 26, 2010
Wallace Lewis.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: It will be -- the presentation for speakers
is limited to three minutes.
MR. LEWIS: Before I start I'd like to point out for the record
that I've emailed a copy of my comments to all the commissioners this
morning, and also to county manager. And I'd also like to thank the
county's -- sir?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Yeah. Could you state your name for
the record, please?
MR. LEWIS: I will. I'm sorry. My name is Wallace L. Lewis,
Jr., and my sister, Marian H. Jerace (phonetic), I'm also representing
her as property owner.
Mr. Chairman, Commissioners, County Manager, we've owned
the property adjacent to the landfill for -- it's a 305-acre parcel. It's
abutting and it's immediately west of the existing Collier County
Landfill, and we've owned it for over 50 years.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Could I pause you a minute there and
ask the staff to point out, if you can, on this area, what property we're
talking about. It's that green property. Okay.
MR. LEWIS: Thank you, Dan.
Excuse me. County staff approached us, sending us a
representative to Miami about four years ago for the purpose of trying
to purchase the property for a horizontal expansion of the landfill next
door.
And we've held discussions with the then County Manager Jim
Mudd. In July of2008 he stated in our meeting that he did not want to
get into what he -- what happened in the north parcel, north of the
landfill, where that was purchased and then it couldn't be used for an
expansion of the landfill, and so he wanted time for due diligence so
that he could expand onto this property and be sure that the expansion
could be done and permitted and didn't want to put the dollars out and
not know that.
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October 26, 2010
So we gave him a period of due diligence and met again in
January. And in January he was going to send it to the commission.
He told staff to have it ready for -- you know, for a June -- June
proposal to the commission to purchase the property.
Of course, in February, as you all know, he -- was discovered
that he was sick, and ever since, you know, we've been trying to work
things out with the current economy with the staff and so on.
Because time is so short -- I had a lot of points, and I'd appreciate
it if you would review those. But I think that it's important to know
that we are there; we are adjacent to this. This is the only opportunity
the county has to expand as opposed to build a new landfill.
This is an expansion. It's not a new landfill. It doesn't have the
same permitting problems. And this -- I'll finished in just a second.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: That's okay. I interrupted you twice. Go
ahead and take a little more time, if you'd like.
MR. LEWIS: This was originally one section, Section 36. The
landfill property was owned by my uncle, and that half was cut out of
this section. Basically, geologically, et cetera, everything is perfectly
the same, just about, as the existing landfill. So we're not dealing with
an unknown.
If you have to build another landfill later on another piece of
property, as Dan said, it's a 1 ,250-acre minimum. By going next door
in this case, you're actually getting a 300 percent increase because the
land in between can be filled as well as the valleys in between the
peaks can be filled, and so there's a great savings there.
Because of the time, I just -- I wanted to cover the last point,
which basically, as a landowner, I'm obligated to tell you that this
property has -- shares a boundary with the landfill a mile long.
And so arguably I think we're the most affected piece of property
in Collier County. And we had been in the process until 2008 when
we were talking to Jim of permitting this for a business park, and we
had been through most of the permitting with the Army Corps of
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October 26, 2010
Engineers and also with South Florida Water Management.
Both Transportation Department wants to use part of this
property for about 34 acres for the 1-75 overpass, you know, bypassing
951 and the intersection, the Wilson Boulevard project, and also South
Florida Water Management wants to use this property also to divert
the Golden Gate Canal, again, for water purity, et cetera. So we have
many parts of the county that are interested in portions of this
property .
And right now we've gone from an original price of 63 million
down in the 20 range. You know, we've offered terms, five-year
terms, more if we need to. But five year terms with minimum interest
that you're paying to a bank, whatever that is.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. All right. Thank you very much.
Commissioners, I believe Commissioner Coletta was first, then
Henning, and then Halas. Go ahead, Commissioner Coletta.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: You know, there's some things
the county hasn't done right, and there's some things the county's done
very right.
One of the things that this county, at least for the last eight years,
has done very well, and that's handling our waste stream. And the fact
that we are able to produce -- or get rid of a product that's offensive to
most people in an efficient manner. A good part of that waste stream,
what's the percentage again, is recycled?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Seventy-five percent.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Seventy-five percent of our
waste stream is recycled. So this has extended the landfill out a
number of years.
Is the landfill a blight upon the community? Well, let me tell you,
back a number of years ago, they came up with this idea of coming up
with incineration, and they spent a considerable amount of money.
The county actually made a contract with a company out of Sweden --
I believe, but it's a little while ago, so I may have that wrong.
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October 26, 2010
At that point in time, the public rose up and their indignation was
great. They did not want to have smoke stacks, they didn't want to
have this pollutant going into the atmosphere. So they had to payoff
the contract to be able to satisfy it, and they stayed with landfilling.
Then a number of years ago when they -- before they had the
foresight that our present staff has, they decided they would move the
landfill to the far part of Collier County because it should be moved.
And at that point in time there was a lot of problems with odor. There
was; there was a lot.
The problem was is that there was a tremendous uprising within
the regents of the far eastern part of the Collier County area. There
was people that came to the meetings that were very indignant about
the idea of a new landfill being created where it wasn't before.
Well, on top of that, we have the problem of trying to permit it.
What is it, one's been permitted in 20 years?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: That's correct, Commissioner.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: One landfill's been permitted in
20 years. You'd spend millions of dollars just trying to get to the point
you could permit it.
Now, my problem is that there was a -- recent -- recently in the
Naples Daily News there was a commentary by a noted citizens came
out and pointed out a lot of facts that were very misrepresented about
what this is all about and the direction it's going. And the suggestion
would be, is that we should be able to, through extortion or something,
get the land we need for a landfill to be able to build it in the other part
of the county. Not going to happen. Property rights exist in this
county; they have for a long time, and they will in the future.
Also, too, the citizens do not want it. We have no problem, as far
as our citizenry go, where the landfill is today. They've taken care of
the odor some eight years ago, thanks to Jim Mudd, who was in
charge of that department at the time. We have total acceptance out
there.
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October 26, 2010
When they held the meetings about the landfill, how many
people showed up to be able to see about the expansion --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Seven.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: -- the increasing of the height?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Sure. We had our first meeting in 2008.
Two people showed up, and then we had another meeting just recently
where seven showed up.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Well, the article I've got in front
of me from the Naples Daily News right now is totally
misrepresentative of the facts that are out there. There is no public
indignation about the landfill where it is now. The people are very,
very happy with the fact that we're the lowest within the state; is that
correct?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: As it related to rates, we have some of the
lowest rates in the state and nationally.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Lowest rate within the state.
And if we were to go to some new technology, as was suggested in
this column, now, do you really think that's going to lower our cost? Is
that going to get us where we need to be?
Now, let me tell you what's happening. Seventy-five percent of
the stream is recycled. I can guarantee you from what I've heard now
in the talks -- and we have talks going on between our economic
development group and in some entities out there, about taking our
garbage stream and turning it into gasoline, ethanol, and it's well
underway. It looks like a great possibility. Meanwhile, there's a
possibility of other places that are going to be using garbage for fuel,
which I don't recommend we ever get into. Make it to the point they
won't have enough to be able to fire their furnaces, and they may take
it for nothing, for nothing more than the cost of transporting it. So all
these elements are working forward. Meanwhile, everything's well
under control. I commend you for this.
As far as the land that's out there next to the landfill, I wouldn't
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October 26, 2010
recommend expanding the landfill on it. But at some point in time, if
there's some other uses like was talked about, that may be a subject for
another day.
I commend you for what you're doing. You got it right. Thank
you very much.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Commissioner Henning?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Thank you, Commissioner.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: I have some questions.
Is it true that we're in negotiations with Lee County about
shipping our waste up there to the incinerator?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Actually we're in discussions. About two --
I'm sorry, four weeks ago I met with Solid Waste Authority in Lee
County to talk about other diversion recycling opportunities that may
exist, and they actually took it to their board to get a recommendation
from their board to have discussions with us, further discussion.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: What are you planning on
shipping up to Lee County?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: I don't have any plans at the moment.
We're just certainly -- we're discussing the options at their facility.
There are items that we take to our landfill that have to get buried.
They're called class three materials, brown goods, furniture,
mattresses, carpeting. They take up a lot of airspace.
And as outlined in the Integrated Solid Waste Management
Strategy, we're looking for opportunities.
So if it has to be buried, there may be an opportunity for us to
utilize their waste-to-energy facility to take those items.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: That's different than what this
board has previously said in the past about handling our own waste
instead of shipping it out of county.
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Actually it's in line with the strategy, which
one of the components -- let me get to that real quick here.
One of the four component, optimizing existing resources, but
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October 26, 2010
also diversion, the number two category, which includes utilizing
someone else's landfill or processing facilities and --
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Do you have more information
on that you could provide me?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: I don't. It's actually just discussions.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: About diversion?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Oh, certainly.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: You're saying that's a board
policy?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: That's part of the strategy, that's correct.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Can you give me the rest of the
policy on that diversion?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: I can provide you with the strategy,
absolutely.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Of the board's adopted diversion
policy?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Yes.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Thank you.
The next thing is, obviously you're going to change the board's
approved Site Development Plan on this land. What will it look like
when you submit it to DEP?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: It's actually an application to FDEP.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: FDEP.
MR. RODRIGUEZ: That's correct, and it's a modification of the
existing permit. We're currently zoned for solid waste activities.
We're currently authorized to have a landfill. FDEP is the
organization that will determine how high and large and how we
operate that landfill.
So these approvals have already been approved from the original
lay down of the landfill.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Okay. So can you provide me
the site plan that you plan on submitting to FDEP?
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October 26, 2010
MR. RODRIGUEZ: With the board's approval today, that will
set the trigger for Waste Management to engineer and design that.
And as soon as that's completed, we can certainly get that to you.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: As far as the line of say, now--
I mean, our executive summary says to go to an elevation of 200 feet.
It's permitted at 108 feet right now, correct?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: That's correct.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: And you stated to
Commissioner Coyle, you're only going to increase it 70 feet?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: That's correct.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: So it's not 200 feet that you're
asking then?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Right. We're asking for 178-foot maximum
elevation at this time. And the 200 feet gives us the additional space
for gas wellheads, if we have to put towers for monitoring, notification
of aircraft, things like that, as well as any other equipment that they
see fit to manage that landfill when it's in final closure.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: So those will be the structures
that will be associated with this site.
MR. RODRIGUEZ: That's correct.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Those structures that you just
mentioned?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Yes, Commissioner.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Now, the present rezoning on
the landfill is reuse and recycling and landfilling. You're doing
off-site reuse and recycling per your application a few months ago to
the board. So you'd just be using this for landfill?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Yes. This particular request to the board
recommendation is just for landfilling by raising the elevation.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: In the last four years, has the
tonnage into the landfill for bearing has increased?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: No, Commissioner. Every year, from ten
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October 26, 2010
years ago, it has decreased. This year we saw -- I'm sorry -- we've
seen the smallest decrease, and that's by about 6,000 tons from last
year. But it's still decreasing.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: How did -- I mean, according to
your graph, it looked like everything was -- the tonnage was
increasing, or did you have tonnage on there?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Let me pull that graph up. What happens--
this is the total waste stream for the county. The number at the top
fluctuates based -- this includes private businesses that haul material
waste. These reports are given to FDEP, and we get the information.
So there may be other businesses that get captured, but it's a total
waste stream.
So the total waste stream will fluctuate up and down, where the
landfill consistently, what's being buried, has decreased for the last 10
years.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: That wasn't the graph that I was
talking about.
MR. RODRIGUEZ: I'm sorry.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: It was the graph that showed the
number of years, different years.
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Is this the graph you're referring to,
Commissioner?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Correct. Which one shows the
tonnage?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Yeah. There's actually -- this just shows the
years and the balance of remaining tons available for disposal.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Okay. So the actual life
expectancy is increasing of the existing site?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Absolutely.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Oh, okay. So we're -- and
where does it come in -- okay, 20 -- vertical expansion -- no, you want
to correct that, that it's not actually 200 feet you're looking for. Comes
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in at 2028. So we actually have 18 years life left of the existing
landfill.
MR. RODRIGUEZ: No. We actually have, based on this chart,
currently up to 2039.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: 2039?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Correct, of years left.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: 2039 until --
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Then it's full to capacity based on your
current policy and program.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Now does that include infill
also?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Yes.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Commissioner Halas?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Yes. I'd like to have Jim DeLony
come up to the mike and talk about -- in regards to the email that all of
us received in regards to the purchase of this land, and maybe we can
get some clarification on that.
There's always two sides to every story, and so I want to get the
other side of the story.
MR. DeLONY: For the record, Jim DeLony, Public Utilities
Administrator.
I think that you heard the side that dealt with the landowner who
wants to sell his land, and the land is adjacent to your current landfill.
If you'd put the slide up, Dan, please, that has the picture of your
landfill and shows that property.
And the argument is, is that you've got a landfill, you're going to
need a landfill. I have property, and I have it available for sale, and
that's the basis of the understanding.
The reason we went to see Mr. Lewis in the beginning was in the
very early stages prior to your workshop on Integrated Solid Waste
Management to look and find as many options as possible so I could
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October 26, 2010
present those to you as solutions to our, at that time, I thought a very
important and compelling problem for our county, and that was, we
were running out of space.
We looked at this, among many other things, in terms of
horizontal expansion, in other words, moving either north or west or
south in terms of the original footprint, current footprint, of the
landfill. Elevation, which we're talking about today, was one of those
options, and many, many others. And that's how we began
negotiations with Mr. Lewis and his property.
Throughout this process, we've had many discussions, and we
have worked very hard to come to an understanding of the potential of
this property to serve the needs of the solid waste program.
Right now it's not such that I would make that recommendation
to you. We're not at that point. And the one reason that I would not
make that recommendation to you is certainly nothing about Mr.
Lewis' property, but the fact that you have property currently with the
landfill, 80 acres to be exact. And if you would look at your screen, I
would point that -- on this screen here, it is that area, this area here,
which is in the southwest corner of the current landfill that we could
expand our landfill horizontally.
What property you own, we own, and that we have the ability to
do any offset -- any mitigations or any other associated development
to bring that horizontal expansion into being.
So my recommendation would be to look at our own internal
access before -- assets before we would look at purchasing others.
Sir, I don't know ifl've answered your question, but I did try to
provide both sides of the story.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: You did. Thank you.
MR. DeLONY: Yes, sir.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: I have some additional questions for you
about that.
Discuss the permitting issues related to this property that was
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October 26, 2010
offered to you for sale.
MR. DeLONY: It's very problematic for me to discuss them with
any certainty. The property has never been asked -- the permitting
agencies have never been asked to permit for a landfill operation.
Regrettably, in terms of using this property as an expansion of
our existing thing, there is a problem. And if you'll look at this map,
you can almost see it in there on the western side -- excuse me -- yes,
the eastern side ofMr. Lewis', property, you see there's a little line
there. That's the wet side of the property. About 100 acres-plus, in the
documentation I've seen is really considered jurisdictional wetlands.
Those wetlands, which are on the -- are adjacent to our current
landfill site, would have to be mitigated at considerable expense, if
we're able to do it.
There is additional entitlements on this property associated with
the endangered species as well as stormwater issues that I -- would
have to all be addressed as part of the developmental plan if it were
your decision to expand horizontally into this particular footprint or
this set of properties, all of which are going to carry a cost, you know,
and that -- various costs associated with it. But certainly if your initial
cost acquisition is -- I believe, Wally, you said $20 million was your
current offer?
MR. LEWIS: In that range.
MR. DeLONY: And then you'd have to put those mitigation
costs up on top of that. That could be considerable. I don't have an
estimate. We've looked at it only cursory, Toni. Have we got--
anywhere from 9 to $13 million would be a current estimate just to
strip the entitlements off the land so we can move it into an
operational landfill facility.
And again, I'm sorry to give you those numbers, but I have to
give you a range. We do not know. The permitting activities that
have been done for this property was developed, I believe, into some
type of commercial space, or like an office park or, excuse me, a
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October 26, 2010
commercial park. And that's my understanding ofthat.
Did I answer your question, sir?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Yes, I think you did.
Commissioner Fiala?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yes. Could you please explain to
me what 200 feet above grade means on this particular site?
MR. DeLONY: Yes, ma'am. The current landfill-- if you were
standing out there today, the current height of everything there is 108
feet. That's what we're authorized. So that's 108 from grade, from
elevation from --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: What's grade?
MR. DeLONY: -- zero. From zero.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Oh, zero.
MR. DeLONY: Yes, ma'am.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay.
MR. DeLONY: From zero.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: So that's even with the street rather
than --
MR. DeLONY: I'm sorry?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Even with the street rather than even
with --
MR. DeLONY: Again, it's elevation zero, 108 feet from
elevation zero, ground zero. You know, elevation zero. And it's 108
feet above zero.
For example, your home would probably be today 11 feet, okay,
maybe 13. Okay. That -- above zero, sea level.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay.
MR. DeLONY: Did I answer your question?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yes, you did. Thank you.
MR. DeLONY : Yes, ma'am.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay. I'd like to make a motion to
approve this application to be sent to the Florida Department of
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October 26, 2010
Environmental Protection.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Second.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Motion by Commissioner Fiala to
approve the staffs recommendations, seconded by Commissioner
Coletta.
Are there any other questions?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: All in favor of the motion, please signify
by saying aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Aye.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Any opposed, by like sign?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: The motion passes unanimously.
And we're going to break for lunch. We'll be back at 1 :02.
MR.OCHS: We have a 1 :02 time certain then, sir.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: We have a 1 :02 time certain, right.
(A luncheon recess was had.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: You ready, County Manager?
MR.OCHS: Sure.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Ladies and gentlemen, the Board of
County Commission meeting is now in session. We're going to go to?
MR.OCHS: Item 10H, sir--
CHAIRMAN COYLE: 10H.
MR.OCHS: -- which is your one p.m. time certain.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay.
Item #10H
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October 26, 2010
RECOMMENDATION TO DENY NORTH NAPLES FIRE
CONTROL AND RESCUE DISTRICTS APPLICATION FOR A
CERTIFICATE OF PUBLIC CONVENIENCE AND NECESSITY
FOR AN ADVANCED LIFE SUPPORT NON-TRANSPORT
SERVICE - MOTION TO DIRECT COUNTY ATTORNEY TO
WORK WITH NNFD TO WRITE COPN FOR ALS SERVICE-
FAILED; MOTION TO ACCEPT STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION
_ APPROVED; MOTION TO RE-REVIEW AFTER RECEIPT OF
BLUE RIBBON COMMITTEE'S REPORT OF FINDINGS-
APPROVED
MR.OCHS: It's a recommendation to deny North Naples Fire
Control and Rescue District's application for a certificate of public
convenience and necessity for an advanced life support non- transport
service, and Mr. Y ovanovich, I believe, will begin.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Mr. Yovanovich?
MR. YOV ANOVICH: Good morning -- I'm sorry. I wrote the
speech yesterday.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Good afternoon.
MR. YOV ANOVICH: Good afternoon. For the record, Rich
Y ovanovich.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: We can wait till tomorrow morning to
start, if you'd like.
MR. YOV ANOVICH: It may last till tomorrow morning, but
we'll -- we are here to talk about the North Naples Fire and Rescue
District certificate of public need. We have several people here on our
team, few of which will speak. I understand the format we're going to
use is similar to a land use petition where we'll present our case, I
believe the staff will go next, and then public and we'll go through
that, so this is really the first certificate of public need you've probably
ever considered.
With me today is Chief Orly Stolts, Assistant Chief George
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October 26, 2010
Aguilera, who will take you through our specific responses to the
county's comments, Assistant Chief James Cunningham who will take
you through some important statistics regarding the need for the
services we're proposing to provide, and then finally Dr. Jeffrey
Panozzo, who is the medical director for the fire district, will take you
through his proposed training plan for the North Naples Fire and
Rescue District's paramedic program.
We appreciate your time and your patience as we go through this
presentation. This is an important health and safety, welfare issue,
and we believe it's important for the commission as well as the public
and the medical community to understand all of the information that is
in this big, thick book. We won't go through it all, but we will
summarize if for everybody.
In various public forums that I've seen the medical director
speak, he's asked you to put yourself in his shoes when discussing the
paramedic issue. What we're asking you to do is put yourself in the
shoes of the person who's sick or injured and consider that as we're
going through our information, because if put yourself in their shoes,
we believe you'll agree that what we're proposing is a necessary and
useful service in the provision of Emergency Medical Services.
The fire district has applied for a non-transport certificate of
public need. We're not interested in being in the ambulance business.
We are simply interested in supplementing the county's advanced life
support service that it currently provides.
In fact, the district has been doing that since 1999, and we
believe, not by coincidence, in 1999 the county received an award for
its Emergency Medical Services, and again in 2000 it received an
award for its Emergency Medical Services, and we were an integral
part in the county's receiving those awards.
The district has 54 state certified firefighter paramedics in its
employ. It has had seven ALS engines in service through an interlocal
agreement with Collier County. Under that interlocal agreement we
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October 26,2010
operated under the direction of the county's medical director who was
responsible for training and supervising our paramedics.
As you all know, we're at a point now where all of our
paramedics have been decertified and can no longer provide advanced
life support services on their own.
The basis for that concern that's been represented to us and to
others is that he doesn't feel our paramedics are getting enough hands
on experience in the field for him to be comfortable that they're
competent in providing those services.
There was a proposal that our paramedics provide one shift per
three months to augment that, quote, hands on experience. We were
able to meet that requirement the first three month period. The second
three month period, which is during vacation time, we were unable to
meet that. We asked why the ride along was necessary and what
guarantee did the ride along provide that we would actually get any
hands on experience.
So we said, why don't we adapt -- adopt measurable standards.
We're not saying we don't want to be on the ambulance. We're not
saying we don't want to be in the back of the ambulance. We've said,
let's establish standards. How many times do we need to be in the
back ofthat ambulance providing services?
We provided a response that was -- that talked about different
types of advanced life support services and how many times you had
to provide those services in order to keep your county certification to
provide services.
We also committed that we would be in the back of that
ambulance on every serious trip back to the hospital. So we thought
we were meeting the stated goal of, we'll be in the ambulance when
we're actually providing services, and we'll verify that we're getting
the hands on services by adapting measurable standards.
That was rejected. And, in fact, what was a standard of having to
do it once every three months came back as a requirement that we do
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October 26, 2010
it three 24-hour shifts every month. Now, that was -- that was the
goal. It was a mandatory requirement of two 24-hour shifts per
month. Now, meanwhile, we've got to cycle through 54 state certified
paramedics on one ambulance. It's a physical impossibility for that to
occur.
So we are -- we're here today because we could not reach an
agreement on how to work through the county medical director in
providing those services.
What we are proposing today is our own certificate of public
need and with -- and by doing that, we will have our own medical
director who will be responsible for making sure that the paramedics
are properly trained to do the services out in the field, and that's what
you have before you today.
There's a lot of statistics that you will hear, and there's a lot of
statistics in this book, and some of those statistics are just dismissed
by your county staff in a simple one sentence -- one sentence.
There was a study that the county commissioned in 2007
regarding its EMS system, and it's in your binder. It's very thick. And
in that study it recognized the important role that the North Naples
Fire Department plays in providing ALS services to supplement the
county's system.
The study points out and concludes what we know, that every
minute counts when you're dealing with serious illnesses such as
cardiac arrest. So for every minute that we're there and unable to
provide advanced life support services, it could impact the outcome of
that individual.
When you're measuring need, your staff wants to talk about
population. Are there more people? Well, no, growth isn't like it used
to be in Collier County, but need is measured in response time, in
being able to address serious illnesses and serious industries -- injuries
when they occur.
James Cunningham will take you through the statistics to show
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you how frequently we're there for several minutes before the county's
EMS system gets there.
Your own Productivity Committee in the '09 budget recognized
how important advanced life support services that we provide are
when they recommended against two new EMS stations in your
budget. They said, we're doing a good job in North Naples. You
won't need to build or staff two EMS stations. And that information is
also in your book.
So it's -- there's no question that we play an important role in
providing advanced life support services in EMS.
In most cases, we're there first. You're there, most times, most of
the time, quickly behind us, but there are a lot of cases where it takes
several minutes for you to get there.
What we have basically heard from the medical director -- and
I'm sure he'll speak on his own -- is he doesn't want the liability
associated with our paramedics providing ALS services. We think our
paramedics are fine paramedics. But if he doesn't want the liability,
that's fine. We'll come to you with a solution, and that's what you
have today.
The solution today is to give us our own certificate public -- our
own certificate. Under that certificate, Dr. Panozzo, who will explain
in detail his program, will be responsible for those paramedics. So Dr.
Tober doesn't have to worry anymore about his liability, and the
county doesn't have to worry anymore about their liability.
The system we're proposing today will have our own medical
director. That medical director must be a doctor currently working in
an emergency room.
The district's medical director must use the county's protocols, so
there will be no fragmentation of care. We will simply implement the
same protocols that Dr. Tober is implementing for the county's
system.
And as I mentioned under our proposal, the medical director,
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October 26, 2010
county medical director, and the county do not need to worry about
perceived liability if we somehow don't do the job correctly.
I know there's a lot of people who want to speak, and I know you
don't want to have a very long, drawn out presentation, so I've cut my
remarks short to allow George Aguilera to come up here to address
specifically the county's comments on our petition, he'll be followed
by James Cunningham to talk about statistics, and we'll finally have
Dr. Panozzo kind of wrap it up with his proposal.
I think it would be helpful, like we do in zoning cases, if you let
us finish our presentation, and then ask any questions. But, of course,
it's the commission's, you know, prerogative to ask questions at any
time. But if you'll let us go through our presentation, I think we can
get through it faster than asking questions in the interim. Thank you.
DEP. CHIEF AGUILERA: Good afternoon. For the record, my
name is George Aguilera. I'm the deputy chief of medical services for
the North Naples Fire Department.
As Richard Y ovanovich said, I'm going to just take you through
the county's response for the denial of the CON. I'm going to start
with the executive summary, and there's really three specific bullet
statements that were included in that executive summary.
The first one was the issue with the district's request for a
COPCN was, in essence, creating a separate medical direction. That
is true. That's exactly what state law says needs to happen once an
entity becomes a licensed provider.
In fact, standing compliance with Florida Statute 401.401, which
states, each licensee is statutorily authorized to choose whether to
employ or to contract with a medical director. That is what statute
says. What we're asking to be is licensed, a licensee. In other words,
your current COPCN or your current ordinance that monitors the
issuance of a COPCN actually seems to be in conflict with statute.
There is __ current COPCN ordinance kind of forces or leads
everybody to have to use the county medical director. And, in
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October 26, 2010
essence, state statutes says, that's not right.
So just a bit of warning that the first bullet statement for denial in
the executive summary seems to have some conflicts with statute.
The second bullet was, the application did not provide empirical
data. Rich touched on this a little bit already. But let me just read you
the definition of empirical: Originating in or based on observation or
expenence.
The 2007 master plan, which was a vital part of our application,
and -- as far as resource for basing our need, is a collection of
empirical data. It was prepared by a team of experienced, independent
consultants chosen via an RFP by the county. It was accepted by the
board. This report included empirical information obtained from
multiple interviews and discussions with all levels of experienced
providers from both the BLS and ALS realm, they included EMS
staff, chiefs, they included fire department personnel and chiefs, they
included the medical director, and including response data was used
from both the sheriff, Collier County EMS, as long as (sic) with
detailed budget information that was compiled. I believe that's -- will
more than suffice being part of empirical, observation and experience.
The conclusion of this report, as Richard said, was actually used
by the Collier County Productivity Committee in preparing and
providing budget guidance to this board in the '09 CCMS budget,
including updating the AUIR.
The report clearly supported the enhancements and augmentation
of the ALS program provided to the EMS delivery system and the
residents of North Naples. Again, accepted by the board, Collier
County EMS, Productivity Committee. This report that has been cited
to not have been empirical cost about $70,000.
I'm kind of curious why everybody else was able to use this
productivity, the board, to make critical decisions on budgets and
system design but all of a sudden falls short of being acceptable for
the North Naples application.
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October 26, 2010
In addition, the executive summary mentions numerous changes
which has taken place since that report, and I will address those
shortly.
The last bullet, the district failed to indicate that it would staff the
necessary response units. The district currently provides zero ALS
units. So even the addition of one is 100 percent improvement.
The district did mention in the application that we currently
provide ten BLS/ ALS response resources and that we had enough
paramedic and EMTs to provide this level of services. That, in
essence, was our commitment.
It goes on to state there was no plan or information provided on
how the district would handle if multiple resources were being
committed from North Naples for other emergency incidences. In this
situation, when the district resources are challenged, we have mutual
aide agreements with Bonita Springs Fire and the Naples Fire
Department, both which provide ALS response. So our district, if and
when challenged, will be well covered.
If the Board of County Commissioners would like to discuss or
recommend numbers of emergency response units as part of granting a
COPCN, I'm sure that the North Naples Fire Department board of fire
commissioners and staff will be more than willing to sit down and
develop such plan.
The second document to -- that I'd like to discuss is the letter
from Dan Summers to the county manager, and this is from July 1,
2010. And it further provides, I guess you could say, comments or
recommendations that went into the thought process of denial of our
application.
The first one was absence of growth projections that were
predicted, and this refers to the 2007 EMS master plan.
The master plan was not solely based on population. It had an
enormous amount of other data, response times, station locations, and
many other parameters.
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In fact, if we want to use that, the population in North Naples has
stayed pretty stable, hasn't really decreased.
Our current call volume has increased by 10 percent. Hospitals
are reporting similar increases. So what I ask you is, do not throw out
the 2007 EMS master plan. It's still very valid.
Chief Cunningham will provide you with response data which
illustrate that the conditions which existed in 2007 are still in
existence today. In fact, they may be getting worse.
The second point was refinement to national standards and
academic research, verifying the importance of the two tier delivery.
It's misleading, or a little misleading, since much of the research being
conducted on this topic ofBLS and ALS is not conclusive. In fact,
many of the conclusions are preliminary, some of them require more
research, some of them are too small in size to be considered landmark
or evidence based, and those that seem to be large enough to draw
conclusions always refer back to, is -- any decisions based on system
design is a local decision. And in fact, research does not commit to a
one-size- fits-all.
Some of these research only address certain type of calls, for
example, cardiac arrest, which are less than 1 percent of the total call
volumes. What the research literature does not say is that a system
which can deliver simultaneous BLS and ALS care is not an effective
system. In fact, some ofthe most successful systems do just that.
There are many great examples in Florida, and even the highly
touted Seattle Medic One system provides a fire based BLS/ ALS
response. This system is reporting some of the highest, if not the
highest, cardiac arrest survival rates in the country at 49 percent.
Broward, just across the alley, and contrary to comments that
were made by Dr. Tober at a Friday meeting, that had an -- only 4
percent survival rate, is reporting 37 percent out-of-hospital survival
rates, and that will be published in the January edition of the American
Journal of Cardiology.
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Next one was implementation of advanced paramedics, one
person vehicles. Not sure what this means. The State of Florida really
only recognizes two levels, EMT and paramedics. Not exactly sure
what an advanced practice is.
What I can tell you is, if the goal is to place a Collier County
EMS paramedic, first responder, on the scene prior to district
paramedics, that not working, and Chief Cunningham will provide
more information to that.
What they are doing is a duplication of first response service,
which historically has been provided by the districts. Nor -- Dr.
Tober's own words is, the fire department's job is first response.
The most interesting is that the services provided by the
advanced practice paramedic is actually not revenue producing; in
other words, there's no billable source for that, which means that the
full fiscal impact of this duplicative service and this duplicative
program is being funded by the taxpayers, not by user fees.
Most importantly, this program is only available in certain areas
of the county and limited to 12 hours a day.
Commissioner Coletta, I'll give you three guesses, and the first
two don't count. Which areas of the county are not provided by --
services by advanced practice paramedics? They're not in the City of
Naples. They're not in Marco. They have ALS engine programs.
They're definitely not in Corkscrew, Immokalee, or any other of our
rural communities. They're completely segregated and buckled in
parts of this community that are already well served by first response
capable entities and districts and departments.
The next one was improve district -- dispatch procedures. Really
the only changes to the current EMT system, which is the emergency
medical dispatch system, is that EMS is no longer responding lights
and sirens to some calls strictly based on the information that they get
from the callers. Result? North Naples Fire Department paramedics
are now on scene longer with sick and injured patients without EMS.
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The EMT system, by all means, is an excellent system to provide
pre arrival instruction to callers that can be very vital in saving lives,
and it's also used to categorize calls by types, cardiac arrest, chest
pains, shortness of breath. What it does not do is predict acuity levels
or really how sick somebody really is. It doesn't do that. It's not
designed to do that.
So EMS-improved dispatch procedures is simply a guessing
game which places North Naples paramedics not only on scene first,
but now longer with potentially very sick and injured patients. Again,
I do not see the value of that change as far as to deny our COPCN.
The next one was cancelation of the North Naples Fire
Department ALS agreement. This one definitely baffled me, because
the agreement is not officially canceled until December 21, 2010.
Why? Well, staff wrote a letter to the county manager on July 1,
2010, stating a cancelation of the agreement, but they must have
forgotten -- or they did forget to tell the district until sometime in
September of 20 1 0, completely dropped the ball. They mishandled the
process.
It is no wonder that we can't even execute a cancelation of
agreement, why that whole agreement failed to begin with and why
we're here today.
Again, I'm not sure how this impacts staffs recommendation for
denial. The ALS engine program, in essence, has been proven to be
very vital. A cancelation can only be determined as a detriment to the
services in North Naples -- or service being provided in North Naples.
The next bullet is ongoing data collection by the Blue Ribbon
Committee. By the way, great idea. A fantastic group. They're doing
a tremendous amount of due diligence. But the key word is ongoing.
The final report is not due till December 2010. How, back on July,
Mr. Summers determined that the data results will eventually support
a two tiered system is pretty premature and, at best, even suspicious.
This is not a valid reason, again, to deny the district's COPCN.
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That report's not even done yet.
Lastly is the AED program. Excellent program. It has saved
many lives in this county, and just even last week was -- or two weeks
ago was instrumental in savings somebody's life. It was developed in
1999. I can tell you the North Naples Fire Department has been an
incredible supporter of that through community CPR education and
even promotion of the program itself.
The issue is the program -- the expansion of this program is
sporadic, it needs money. You can't plan it. You can't force it. It's
something that comes as opportunities arise. The fact is that, other
than adding units, very little has gone into modernizing that program
itself.
AEDs are used for cardiac arrest. Again, less than 1 percent of
the total calls that we run, and only for a specific type of cardiac
rhythm, which makes it even less than that 1 percent.
So at the end, great program, but how can you deny a COPCN
based on that? It's not a program that's consistent and provides service
to -- what happens to the other 99 percent, in other words?
That's my closing. I want to thank you for the opportunity to
speak. And now I'm going to turn it over to Assistant Chief
Cunningham. Thank you.
ASST. CHIEF CUNNINGHAM: Good morning -- good
afternoon, Commissioners. Appreciate the opportunity to be before
you. My name's James Cunningham, Assistant Chief with the North
Naples Fire District.
My purpose to stand here before you today is to present to you
some of the response time data of why we need to be able to provide
advanced life support and non transport. We are not looking to
provide an ambulance service, as already previously stated, because
we can -- to the contrary, many people we keep hearing from within
the community and from letters out of the Office of the Medical
Director are stating we're trying to take over the ambulance service.
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That is not our intent whatsoever.
What you see before you is our fiscal year 2010 where we ran
6,656 rescue related calls. This is where fire and an EMS unit were
both on scene or both dispatched to an emergency. Of those over
5,600 calls for service, 49 percent of the time the Collier County EMS
transport unit was on scene prior to or at the same time as the fire
response unit; 49 percent of the time.
The remaining 51 percent of the time was North Naples Fire
District had a unit on scene with no Collier County transport unit
present.
17 percent of that time was in excess of three minutes with no
Collier County transport unit on scene. That's 180 seconds of time
with no unit.
9 percent of the time we exceeded five minutes on scene with no
Collier transport unit on scene. And if you look at the bottom number
there, 3 percent of the time North Naples Fire had a unit on scene,
many of which, if not all, were staffed with paramedics on a daily
basis. We were on scene for ten minutes or greater, and I can tell you
several of those calls were in excess of20 minutes on scene.
Now, Commissioners, how do percentiles or percentages relate to
actual calls when you're looking at a number of in excess of 6,600
calls for service, 51 percent of the time that we're on scene, we're
talking about 3,394, nearly 3,400 calls for service that we're physically
there on scene with a patient or someone needing assistance without
an ambulance present.
In excess of three minutes, 1,131 patients or calls that we ran, we
were on scene greater than three minutes. And you can see the
numbers increase from there. 532 calls with greater than five minutes
on scene, and greater than ten minutes we're looking at 199 patients.
Now, the question is, how long is BLS good for? How long does
it take to get through your BLS procedures before ALS is appropriate?
I can stand here before you as one of the 54 paramedics on staff
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at North Naples Fire, can bring some realism to this dilemma. I can
tell you that if you're on scene for ten minutes and there's no ALS
transport possible and you need some air, your airway's closing, I ask
anybody in this room to hold their breath for even three minutes, five
minutes, much less that ten minute scenario with no advanced life
support potentially on scene.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Shall we try that now?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Everybody stop.
ASST. CHIEF CUNNINGHAM: I may need to breath instead.
I can tell you that from the perspective ofBLS, we don't have a
definitive answer of how long it takes to get through BLS before ALS,
because every patient is different. I can tell you in the meeting at the
Pelican Bay Foundation last week, Dr. Tober expressed, it's about
seven minutes to get through the BLS before you get to the ALS part
of the protocol. Wink TV prior to that even mentioned it was 14
minutes. I have a letter here dated April 13, 2010, from the Office of
the Medical Director to our fire chief that requested that if we're on
scene without an EMS unit present, he would like a quick evaluation
done of the patient, and within two minutes he would like a size up go
__ be provided via radio to the medic unit, which we're happy to
provide. We do it on a daily basis, but it just comes to show you that,
obviously, he understands that we can assess the patient and determine
some level of acuity of how severe that patient is within two minutes
of time, which obviously falls well within the 1,100 calls that we're
physically on scene over three minutes without an EMS transport unit
on scene.
So in part of this realism, if somebody in this room's allergic to
bees or allergic to fire ants and gets stung and we respond to that scene
and their airway's closing, I can tell you that in every book that exists
out there, whether it's an EMT book or a paramedic book, they tell
you, you need to rescue the airway quick if the patient's unresponsive,
because an oral airway, or an airway adjunct, which is considered
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October 26, 2010
BLS, is not going to work. They're going to need endotracheal
intubation, which is sticking a tube into their lungs to be able to get
them to be able to breath on their own, an ALS procedure.
A person having chest pains or a heart attack, if a person's having
a heart attack, in BLS I can provide them oxygen, I can give them
some nitroglycerin and I can give them some aspirin, but as everyone
in this room knows, nitroglycerin can have an unsafe drop in blood
pressure very quickly. And one of the caveats they built in for a safety
network is trying to get an IV established so you can give them fluids
in the event they have an unsafe drop in blood pressure.
So today I'm carrying nitroglycerin, I'm supposed to administer it
to that person having chest pain if they fit the criteria, but yet I don't
have the safety net because IV is considered ALS, basic skill.
How about the person that's choking? American Heart
Association will tell you, try the Heimlich Maneuver. If they go
unresponsive, call EMS, call 911, and we're on scene, there is no time
to waste. We don't go past the A. If you can't get an airway, nothing
else really matters. My first thing walking in the door and determine
they're unresponsive and they're not breathing, they've been choking
is, I'm going to have to go in and rescue that airway, all of which are
ALS procedures. I can do nothing but CPR until those advanced life
support transport units actually arrive.
Or worse yet, how about the eight-year-old kid on the soccer
field, the ten-year-old kid on the football field that all of a sudden has
an asthma attack? Mommy may have forgot to get the inhaler. She
forgets the inhaler, that kid's gasping for breath, pursing his lips, and
trying to get his last breath, and I can't give him a very easy basic
breathing treatment because it's considered ALS?
How long do you want us to wait, how many people need to die,
and how long are we going to continue to allow paramedics operating
in the field, 54 specifically in North Naples alone, not able to practice
when they arrive on scene?
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October 26, 2010
I can tell you, I don't care to get in this debate with a doctor or
anyone else. In fact, I do truly appreciate what Dr. Tober has done for
this community. Seven years ago I can tell you I sat in his office,
went to the clinic on a regular basis pleading with him. And he
expressed to me, Jamie, I wish I could. The problem is, I'm under an
administration that has a gun to my head, was his exact words he said
to me, and there was other people in the room.
I assured him that day that we would continue fighting for what's
right for the people and that we're going to move forward and try to
create an Office of the Medical Director so he was no longer under the
people putting the political pressure on him and put him directly
underneath the Board of County Commissioners.
When you approved that in September of '07, I was one of the
only ones, if not the only one, standing at a podium telling you I
support the process of going to an Office of the Medical Director, but
you must put a support network around him, verbatim from the
minutes. And if you don't put the support network around him, he is
going to be -- have to rely on the failed system that put him into the
predicament that he was already in at that time.
Lo and behold, no support network has been put around him. He
has continued to rely on the misleading and false information provided
to him as a doctor, which is why we're in the predicament today.
I can tell you that in 2000 and 1999 when this was an award
winning EMS system, North Naples Fire, along with other fire
departments, had ALS engines working on the street providing
serVice.
In fact, one of the top administrators in Collier County EMS sits
right here, Chief George Aguilera, and he's now one of the top
administrators in the North Naples Fire District doing the same job,
looking out for the best interest of people in our EMS division.
Commissioners, I ask that you move forward with approving a
certificate of need so we can practice advanced life support, non
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transport, and get back to serving the people that we do best.
(Applause.)
DR. PANOZZO: The passion doesn't escape me. I hope it didn't
you, that's why I'm here. My name is Jeff Panozzo, Commissioners.
Good afternoon.
If you'll indulge me just for a moment, I'd like to tell you a little
bit about who I am. I have a feeling many of you know about me, and
for the last five years that I've been in Naples I wanted to meet each
and every one of you, but I've avoided doing that for purposes of
political -- I didn't think it was a proper move.
But today -- I get to meet with you today and talk with you, and
I, too, have a passionate plea.
Commissioner Henning, it's very difficult for a patient to hold
their breath for ten minutes, sir. Very difficult.
I'm an emergency room physician, and I'm here in the interest of
one thing, and one thing only, sir, and madam. I'm in the interest of
patient care, period.
In my career, it's always been about the patient. Nothing more.
The patient. We actually are in the business of taking care of patients.
We have to make some tough decisions, and we need to attend to the
one thing and keep that one thing at the top of the list. The patient.
It's not about one person. It's not about me. It's not about one fire
department, one paramedic. It's about the collective group and what
they can do for the patient.
I'm actually proud to be standing here with a number of the
medics from North Naples and others. I think their show of respect
should let you know what kind of relationship I have with them, and
I'll never forget it, and I'll always be here for them.
Now, I want to tell you something else. Although I'm a medical
director in an emergency department in the county here in a facility, I
do not represent that facility today.
I'm here because I believe in these paramedics from North Naples
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Fire and I believe that their cause to receive a COPCN -- or CON, if
you'd let me call it that way -- to provide ALS care for its community
is vital for the patients in your community that you are under the care
-- they are relying on your decision making.
Here's my background. I came from Chicago where my life was
immersed with emergency medicine and fire since I can remember.
The sounds of emergency units being dispatched were part of my
normal, everyday life wherever I went, particularly in my home. For
us at home, we expected everything in our lives to be interrupted by
an emergency call, and it frequently happened. For me, this call to
duty to act has been strong, and that's why I'm here today also.
Prior to attending medical school, I was a fireman. I was a
certified firefighter in Chicago out in one of the suburbs. I was also a
fire apparatus engineer, and I was a paramedic. First started as an
EMT, then went ahead and became a paramedic. And I was immersed
in EMS, but also in fire activities.
To this day I wish sometimes that I might have stayed in the fire
service, because we had a fantastic fire service. Our fire service
provided ambulance care and transport care as well, and it was a great
system.
In Chicago I attended medical school at the Chicago College of
Osteopathic Medicine, and I'm proud of it. I completed an internship
there, and I was then accepted into a residency in emergency medicine
at Cook County Hospital in Chicago.
I was fortunate to receive world class training. Many of you
probably know a little bit about Cook County Hospital. I saw cases
there that you would never believe and that many of my colleagues
even to this day have not taken care of.
During my medical practice in Chicago, I was an assistant
medical director in an emergency department and I also worked in that
hospital in that facility as a hospital EMS director for medical training
for medics in the area. Trained many, many medics. I'd have the
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October 26, 2010
medics come into the emergency department, join me for clinical
decision making, recognizing who's, who's very sick, and who needs
both ALS and BLS simultaneously.
This is key. Don't believe that you can give BLS care alone and
wait for 15 minutes before ALS care arrived, because that's not true.
And emergency room physician -- and I'm sure Dr. Tober, being that
he's an emergency room physician, will agree with you -- sometimes
ALS and BLS care occur simultaneously and rapidly. These medics
have to be trained on seeing signs and symptoms of immediate life
deterioration, and they have to be able to intervene immediately, not
asking the patient, sir, to hold their breath.
During my time with Loyola EMS program, I sat on the peer
review committee, whose office of medical director at Loyola and
their part of their program was they integrated physicians from all the
area hospitals, and those physicians and nurses -- we had a nurse and a
physician who came in to these peer review committees under the
medical director of Loyola's EMS system, and we discussed issues of
pertinence, much like we're going to be talking about today, or what
we have talked about today.
And the decision making went on. It was not an island. It was
not an island. It was not one person. It was the collective group.
This is my comfort zone. I know what I'm talking about. Now,
currently, as I told you, I'm a medical director and I'm actively
participating, not just in the medical director job. I also work
continually full time in my job. I see patients full time. I take as
many shifts as the other staff workers in my department. I see patients
actively in an emergency room. I know what is going on in this
community .
Oftentimes urgent care physicians, maybe one in Marco Island,
may call me and say, we have to send a patient. We can no longer
treat him. We need you to take care of the patient. The patient will
arrive by Collier County EMS ambulance, and I interact with those
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October 26, 2010
medics on a daily basis, many of them who come to me and say, hey,
Doc, show me the EKG. Let's talk about the EKG. What could I have
done better? That's the way it should be. It should be an interaction
of communication amongst the entire group.
I take care of about 3,200 patients a year in my job as a
physician, as a staff physician, working on shift. Just came off of a
four day stretch. Worked nights. I was taking care of patients all
night. It's what I do. I love my job, and I'm very active in this job.
We're getting busier and busier, and as we do, you notice some of
the numbers Jamie had talked about. The percents are going up; we're
seeing more call volume. So what we're talking about is real numbers
that are very important that we act upon them.
I was a member of the Collier County EMS Advisory Board, and
I do have my Certificate of Appreciation in my office. I'm a member
of multiple committees in the hospital. I'm also the chair of multiple
committees. I'm actively involved. I know what's going on.
I also communicate with my, you might want to call them
competitors, but other physicians in the area and other hospitals,
maybe not even in my system. And we have a, I guess you would call
it, a unified voice in our feelings and thoughts about some of this. I'll
indulge them. If you'd ask them, I guess they could tell you.
So why am I here? I think you know the answer by now. I
believe I'm here because once I was a -- when I was in the advisory
committee, Collier County EMS Advisory Board, I said five words.
Many of you'll know it. I said, "A medic is a medic," and from then
on I had a bullseye on me, and I carry that bullseye with me to this
day.
Now, why did I say that? Well, I observed the system. As a new
member of the community, I observed the system. I was amazed in
the incongruent way that medics were credentialed. Quite honestly,
there's some medics that worked for Dr. Tober's system on a Tuesday,
and on a Wednesday when they were with fire, their credentials were
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October 26, 2010
not valid. And I said, "A medic is a medic."
Now, where I came from, I might be on the engine one day, but I
was a medic. The side of my helmet said medic. And if! pulled a
child out of a burning building and I got lucky enough to get that kid
-- get to that child quickly enough, I brought the child out, I'd set the
helmet down, and I provided ALS care for the child. And that's the
way it should be.
A medic is a medic. Doesn't matter what shirt they wear, if the
shirt says NCH transport or if it says Collier County EMS. A medic,
if they are trained and credentialed, is a medic. And yeah, they can be
Tober credentialed and Tober certified, but a medic is a medic, and I'll
never forget it.
No other issues beginning (sic) to come to my attention, soon I
was off the committee. And just prior to this time, fire approached
me. I live in North Naples, so for me, it was natural to sort of get an
affiliation with one of the fires.
I actually did some work with Collier EMS as well with
educational based stuff, tried to put a lot of programs together, some
of which were excellent programs at the hospital, and the attendance
was, unfortunately, somewhat disappointing.
But fire came to me, and they asked me, Jeff, Dr. Panozzo, would
you come aboard and help us provide some educational classes? And
so I said, sure, I did.
We provide DOT based curricula classes, and I began
immediately beginning classroom based scenarios. And what I
believe -- and you heard me talk about it before -- I talked about
paramedic decision making, not medical decision making. Different
than what you may have heard from some other people in the
community, paramedic decision making, which has to be associated
with the medical decision making of a physician.
And what we did is we talked about core based paramedic skills,
many of which were examples that Jamie, Chief Cunningham, had
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October 26, 2010
brought up to, how to open an airway, how to properly oxygenate a
person that can't hold their breath for ten minutes and other things.
But key things, too, I teach is recognition of a life threat process,
and I make them think. And I always am telling them, saying, how
many -- okay. It's chest pain. What can it be? Give me the ten
possibilities.
We also talked about enhanced CPR, which I believe
wholeheartedly in, and also hypothermia, and I -- these are things that
we know and Dr. Tober knows and has brought to the community
through his EMS, but also, you know, this is -- this is something that's
been going on in the medical community for some time, and we know
the hypothermia programs are also going to save lives.
I stuck myself out and I said, let's do it here at this facility, and
we have an excellent process for hypothermia, and if patients in this
community have a sudden cardiac arrest and they require it, I hope
they come to me, because we're going to take -- we have a team
approach to take care of these patients.
Paramedic decision making skills are stressed when I talk with
these guys, and team work, team work amongst the whole team.
I soon got to know these paramedics, and I understood their skill
level and experiences. I want to tell you a little bit about it. Sixty-six
percent of the North Naples Fire medics have been medics for ten
years. That's valuable, not invaluable. Yes, medics lose their skills.
Everyone in every field loses skills. How do we maintain these skills?
We maintain these skills by proper training, proper attention at the
proper training needed, and those skills can be maintained.
Most of these medics were Tober certified until they moved to
fire. True? Many are military trained, and some continue to serve in
the military as paramedics in advanced careers as paramedics doing a
variety of intense paramedical activities with the military. It's good
enough for the military, it's good enough for me.
I also participated in active field observation since the beginning
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of this year. I have over 100 hours of dry time. My wife said to me,
Jeffrey -- she calls me Jeffrey when I'm in trouble -- you going golfing
today? I said, no, I'm going to the firehouse. I could go golfing. I
could go fishing. I could go out on the boat. I choose to go to the
firehouse, and I choose to go there for the medics because I believe in
this -- I believe in this.
There are issues. Since I've been in the field, I have observed
issues. There are issues. No, we can't hold our breath. We have to act
on these issues, sir.
I'm going to give you a hypothetic scenario. A sick person, that's
the call. Patient has chest pain. North Naples Fire's been dispatched.
Collier County EMS has also been dispatched. North Naples Fire
arrives on the scene first with certified paramedics who are able to
perform any skills necessary of a paramedic.
Collier County EMS is delayed a long time. Don't know why.
This is -- it's a hypothetical. They're delayed for 15 minutes. That's
even five minutes longer, Mr. Henning, than the ten minutes that we
asked you to hold your breath.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Excuse me. Why are we singling out
Commissioner Henning for the comments you continue to make?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Making suggestions.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: It's because he misunderstood --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Yes.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: -- the discussion, what Chief
Cunningham had.
DR. PANOZZO: I didn't mean anything to him, Mr. Coyle.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Well, I find it offensive, Doctor.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: I understand your --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: And I think Commissioner Henning
does, too.
DR. PANOZZO: Okay. No, I apologize.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: I understand your passion.
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October 26, 2010
DR. PANOZZO: I apologize. It's the passion, yes.
And Commissioner Coyle, I apologize, and I will refrain from
that activity further.
So, this is a sick patient. The points -- the point is that I'm trying
to tell you how vitally important this topic is.
That is the scenario, and the patient's quite ill. The fire
department arrives and they have nothing to do but apply oxygen and
an AED which says, do not shock. The patient tells you he's going to
die. When patients tell me, I'm going to die, I'm very concerned about
them. And I -- oftentimes that's all they can tell me, and we're trying
to figure out why.
We're waiting for the ambulance yet. It's been ten minutes now.
Suddenly the patient loses his pulse. There's no pulse; the patient's
unconsciOUS.
What can we do? Can we start an IV? No. Can we look at the
cardi- -- well, the EKG? No. Can we give core drugs, epinephrin,
atropine, amiodarone, life-saving drugs? No. Death is -- will ensue.
It will ensue quick.
Is there a problem? I'd say ask the family of that patient, or the
wife.
The solution is complex. Quite honestly, I think it's pretty easy.
I'm amazed that we have 54 medics in North Naples Fire and they're
not able to provide their skills. They're not able to provide lifesaving
skills immediately on arrival.
And oftentimes, it has to happen simultaneously, not just BLS.
The studies are positive, and they show that early ALS saves lives,
okay. So we don't -- we can't assume that just -- most of the time it's
not a significant life threat, but on occasion some of those patients'
conditions are severe enough where it requires early ALS.
My question to you, my plead to you, is to allow these medics to
practice, provide them with their CP- -- COPCN. And I'll tell you, as
a medical director, I will not accept medics that are unable to provide
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the care required. I will -- they'll be under my license. I will not
accept medics that cannot do the job.
They have to fit the minimum criteria and credentials in order to
keep their position as a medic. Our credentialing process would match
or exceed that which currently goes on Collier County EMS. It's
serious. We would take it seriously.
In your packet there's a number of -- there's a page in here, and I
hope you have a moment to read it. It's on the subject of the
certification of the North Naples fire and medical -- fire and -- control
district and EMTs and paramedics. This is an outline of basically the
process that we have placed together.
We take this seriously, their credentialing. We're not talking
about just credentialing a medic because they're a medic. We're
credentialing the right medic, the medic that knows the skills and can
maintain the skills because our community is relying on us to act.
And if we don't act, lives will be lost.
And I apologize, Commissioner Henning. I certainly meant
nothing at you. When we brought up the ten minute thing, I heard a
comment, and I thought that -- I wanted to make sure you understood
and members of the commission here understood the vital importance
of really --
COMMISSIONER HENNING: And I've tried to hold my breath
before.
DR. PANOZZO: Pardon me?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: And I've tried to hold my breath
before. I'm sure we all have.
DR. PANOZZO: Yeah. Thank you very much.
(Applause.)
MR. YOV ANOVICH: With that, that's a fairly detailed
overview of how we would operate the system, the credentials of our
medical director, the passion that he has and that our paramedics have
in providing this vital service to the community.
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I forgot to mention in my opening remarks that we will not be
charging a fee for that service. That is already included in the ad
valorem taxes for the residents up at the North Naples Fire District.
We will not be competing for any fees that the county's currently
receiving for it -- providing of its service.
We're -- our chairman is here as well, Chris Lombardo. lor
anybody else on -- who has spoken can answer any questions the
commission may have at this point, or if you want to wait till staff
makes their presentation, public comment, however you want to do it.
Mr. Chairman, we're available to answer any questions you may
have regarding our request and our credentials to provide these
serVices.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: You have finished your presentation?
MR. YOV ANOVICH: We are done with our presentation.
We're ready for you to either ask questions of us, or however you want
to continue.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Commissioners, any questions of the
petitioner?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Then we'll-- staff, do you have a
presentation?
MR. SUMMERS: Will you put that on the screen, Mr. Ochs.
MR.OCHS: Sure.
MR. SUMMERS: Commissioners, Chairman, good afternoon.
For the record, Dan Summers, Bureau of Emergency Services. You'll
have to bear with my voice just a little bit today.
I -- today in my presentation --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: That means it will be brief, I presume?
MR. SUMMERS: Yes, sir, it will--
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay, good.
MR. SUMMERS: -- to the best of my ability.
North Naples Fire Control and Rescue District COPC (sic)
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October 26, 2010
application staff comments, I may refer to North Naples as the
department or the district. Those terms are intended to be used
interchangeab ly.
My mission here today is to outline your ordinance for you so
that you understand what we compare the COPCN application against,
all that being the framework of the county ordinance.
The Board of County Commissioners shall not grant -- and I'm
pulling sections out of the ordinance. It's quite lengthy -- shall not
grant a certificate unless it shall find, after a public hearing and based
on competent evidence, that each of the following standards have been
satisfied. And this was the metrics in which I made my appraisal.
To the extent -- and this is one of the sub bullets -- and again, this
is somewhat of an eye chart, but it's important that you understand
what these metrics are.
To the extent in which the proposed service is needed to improve
overall EMS capabilities of the county. The effect of the proposed
service on existing services with respect to quality of service and cost.
The effect of the proposed service on the overall cost of EMS services
to the county. Fourthly, the effect of the proposed service on existing
hospitals and other healthcare facilities. Fifth, the effect of the
proposed service on personnel of existing services and the availability
of sufficiently qualified personnel in the local area to adequately staff.
In addition in Section 7, it says that you shall not grant, under
Section B, that the applicant has sufficient knowledge and experience
to operate the proposed service, that if the applicant -- I'm sorry -- that
if the -- that if applicable, there is adequate revenue base for the
proposed service, that the proposed service will have sufficient
personnel and equipment to adequately cover the proposed service
area.
The denials were made as follows: This particular bullet dealing
with North Naples District seeking separate medical control or
direction has a very lengthy ruling from the state office of EMS. It
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really refers to, in your general statute -- and this is also the case in the
North Naples enabling ordinance -- enabling legislation, excuse me,
that all of this works under single point medical control, and that's
very lengthy in that legal discussion, but it does emphasize the
necessary, within the county, single point medical control for
advanced life support.
In terms of the empirical data for the necessity other than citing
references to the EMS plan. The EMS master plan was not intended
nor designed to be a COPCN empirical data model. There was terrific
participation by the fire districts to set the stage for all the information
that has accumulated in there countywide, but the goal of that was to
help give you a measurement for AUIR. It was not based on medical
necessity .
The applicant's training and experience was also looked at, and
the applicant's training and experience did not demonstrate previous
management efforts under a COPCN. Doesn't mean that they're not
managing fire and rescue? It means that they don't -- have not
demonstrated in the documentation management of these EMS
services under a COPCN environment.
There was also concern about how we -- how simultaneous calls
for service will be managed. That's not just a North Naples issue. That
is a national issue when you're running dual service, fire and EMS. So
my concern that I share with you is that, how will simultaneous calls
-- they're rare but they do happen -- how are simultaneous calls
managed and prioritized between medical and fire or fire calls such as
residential, commercial, et cetera. So, again, that safety net between
simultaneous calls is a concern.
In addition, the ordinance under Section 4, the purpose of the
ordinance is to provide protection by standing -- I'm sorry -- by
establishing uniform countywide standards. As I read this
interpretation and as I've heard this afternoon, this is only for the
North Naples District for this particular application. Your ordinance
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continues to use the word county or countywide.
The commissioners shall also consider, as a minimum, the
following: The extent to which the proposed service is needed to
improve the overall Emergency Medical Services' capability of the
county. And again, I'm assuming geographic Collier County, not
North Naples District.
Part A of Item 6 has to deal with the effect of the proposed
service on the overall cost of the service to Collier County. And there
is cost, not detailed and I -- I have no detailed analysis but, quite
simply, that EMS service, with respect to paramedic, firefighter, and
EMT salaries and benefits are significantly higher at North Naples
District and could result and have resulted in the depletion of talent,
harming the county EMS organization. Transition, turnover,
retraining; that's cost to the county.
The other issue is quality. How do you judge -- how do you
judge quality in this very subjective discussion within your ordinance?
Typically we, again -- and echo the comments of the physicians early
-- patient outcomes, national and international clinical research, skill
sets, proficiency, and direct medical oversight.
And at this time I'd like to add two more members of our group
to make some comments, and I would like to ask Dr. Douglas Lee,
who has to go on shift momentarily -- Dr. Lee and Dr. Tober.
And as I mentioned, we'll be available for questions. Thank you,
Chairman.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Commissioner Henning?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: I found what I need.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay.
DR. LEE: Commissioners, thank you for your time. Can you
hear me okay?
Dr. Douglas Lee. I'm the associated medical director of Collier
County EMS. I'm also an attending emergency room physician at Lee
Memorial Hospital, our Trauma Center.
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When considering from a medical perspective whether we should
have more ALS providers in the field, the answer is no. It does not
make sense. From a medical perspective, it does not make sense.
Now certainly, from budgeting, financial, even political, it might
make sense or you might be able to rationalize it. But from a medical
perspective, it does not make sense.
I want to preface this by saying that I am a firm supporter of our
firefighters. We have some of the best firefighters in the country right
here in our county, okay.
In our support for the firefighters, we should not burden them
with procedures and medications that just don't work. That's one of
the secrets, one of the dirty secrets of medicine, is that ALS does not
increase survival. In cardiac arrest and trauma patients, ALS does not
increase survival. Yep, it's true. It's true.
New England Journal of Medicine, 2004, ALS no better than
BLS and defibrillators. For cardiac arrest, pre hospital ALS is
expensive and gives no proven benefit.
New England Journal of Medicine, 2007. In order to save lives,
healthcare planners should make CPR by citizens and rapid
defibrillation a priority for the resources of EMS systems.
JAMA, 2009, randomized study that did not demonstrate any
increased survival to hospital discharge with IV medication
administration.
Journal of Trauma, October 2000, critical review of 174 articles.
I can't even read 174 articles. A hundred seventy-four articles on pre
hospital ALS or BLS for trauma. Weighted odds ratio for dying was
2.59 for ALS; 2.59 greater chance of dying with ALS.
Pre hospital and Disaster Medicine, 2005, no evidence that ALS
care improves survival in patients with short transport to trauma
centers.
Journal of Canadian Medical Association, 2008. ALS did not
decrease mortality and actually increased mortality.
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Cochrane Review of2008. Cochrane Review, bunch of really
smart people get together, review the literature, pick out the best
studies, the strongest studies, and give their medical analysis.
In trauma in pediatrics, the current evidence does not support
extending pre hospital intubation.
Academic Emergency Medicine, 2006. Pre hospital intubation
has not been shown to improve outcomes and may cause significant
harm in the hands of inexperienced operators.
And then JAMA, 2000, compared intubation versus bag valved
mask, pushing oxygen with a bag. Intubation was no better and may
be worse; 4 percent increase in mortality with intubation.
I don't want that to be taken -- I don't want any of this to be take
as a pylon of the paramedics or the firefighters. That's not what this is
supposed to be. But we need to equip our first responders, our
paramedics, our firefighters, with things that work and stop burdening
them and testing them on medication doses that they're not going to
use and that won't work when they use them.
Doctors are no better. Study, Annals of Surgery, 2003. Big
study, thousands of patients, 9-, 10,000 patients. One-third of them
were transported by BLS/EMT, one-third of them were transported by
ALS, one-third of them were transported by ALS with a physician.
There was a physician on scene riding along scene.
Who did the worst? Who had the highest mortality? That's right,
the ones with the docs. Why? Doesn't make any sense. We're trained
to do things. When we're on the scene, we're poking and prodding,
we're checking in your ears. Really what we should do is scoop and
run, okay. Scoop and run. Don't stay and play. So doctors are no
better.
So in the end, ALS does not work. Let's stop putting all this time
and energy and emotion into ALS. Let's give the resources and give --
we got to pay our firefighters more, we got to pay our paramedics
more, absolutely. But let's give them the tools that work.
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So what saves lives? After 30, 40 years, I think we're getting a
feel for what saves lives, and it's something that everyone here has in
their pockets and in their hands. That's a cell phone to call 911, a
strong pair of hands to do chest compressions, and ifthere's an AED
around, a defibrillator; slap it on and push the button. Early
defibrillation and chest compressions by bystanders is what saves
lives. Medications, anointing dead bodies with medications does not
save lives, okay.
So we always talk about cardiac arrest. And people will say,
cardiac arrest makes such a small portion of all 911 calls. Why are we
always talking about cardiac arrest? And it's a very good point. It's a
very good question. Cardiac arrest represents such a time critical
process. Remember, when you're in defib arrest, every minute that
goes by that you don't get defibrillation, that you don't get electricity,
mortality increases by 8 percent, for every minute, the clock is ticking.
So it's critically time dependent. And a 911 call for cardiac arrest
brings together all the elements of a -- an emergency response. Call
reception, dispatch, priority, first responder, second responder,
hospital care, and then in the end, you have a result, you have a
measurable result. This is why we talk about cardiac arrest. You have
a measurable result; survival or not.
So it's critically time dependent. It brings together all the
elements of an EMS call system, and you have something you can
compare. You have a survival or not.
So that's really why we talk about -- about cardiac arrest so
much, even though it represents -- it does represent a very small
proportion of our calls.
So I'm going to give another secret of medicine, another dirt
secret of medicine. And I know I'm going to sort of ruffle some
feathers with this, but there's a large number of calls, 911 calls for
EMS care, that can be picked up and brought into the hospital and
nothing needs to be done to them in the pre hospital setting, okay.
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They need vitamin D, diesel, diesel fuel to get them into the hospital,
and that's it, okay.
So we have, on one end of the spectrum, patients who are pretty
stable, they're pretty well, they've had abdomen pain for three months
and they wanted to call 911. That's fine, that's fine, come on in. They
don't really need anything done to them. They're very stable. We
have, on the other end of the spectrum, patients who are in cardiac
arrest. These patients need rapid defibrillation bystander CPR. They
don't need medications.
So on each end of the spectrum you have these two classes of
patients. In the middle there exists a portion -- a small portion of
patients but they're real and they're definite -- a small portion of
patients who are very sick. They have a pulse, but they're very sick.
They require high level, complex decision making and procedural
skills, okay. These are low frequency, high risk patients; low
frequency, high risk.
And this is really what brings up the concept of what's called the
paramedic paradox. These low frequency, high risk patients.
So when you increase the number of paramedics in the system,
you decrease performance. I know it sounds weird. When you
increase the number of paramedics in a system, you decrease
performance and you worsen outcomes.
May -- I think it was May 20, 2005, USA Today had a couple
articles on pre hospital care. I ask everyone to go home, Google it,
check it out. They actually did a great study and survey. They called
and they contacted the 50 largest cities in the country, and they got
their data for cardiac arrest survival as well as their stats for their EMS
systems. The best performing systems in the country have the fewest
paramedics per population. The worst performing systems had high
levels of paramedics per population, per 100,000 population.
It's paramedic paradox. And you say, well, that doesn't make any
sense. You know, we're adding more paramedics. We're adding more
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care out in the streets. But when you think about it and when you talk
about these low frequency, high risk situations, you need these
paramedics, whether -- and it doesn't matter if they're fire medics, if
they're service, if they're county. It doesn't matter.
You need these low frequency, high risk situations to be staffed
by paramedics who are in the situation as much as possible, okay.
They have repetition on their side.
It's like the Malcolm Gladwell book, The Outliers. You know,
you want these guys to be the experts, guys and girls, to be the
experts. They have to be doing this all the time, as much as possible.
When we talk about an ALS procedure or medication, and -- now
I'll use intubation, but you can really extend this to anything. EKG
interpretation, medication administration.
When you talk about these low frequency, high risk situations
like endotracheal intubation, you're putting a tube down someone's
throat into their airway. If you put it in the right place, great, that's
good. If you put it in the wrong place and it's an unrecognized
esophageal intubation, you put it in the esophagus, that's what we call
a clean kill, all right. So these low frequency, high risk situations are
incredibly important.
So adding more paramedics to a system just doesn't make any
sense from a medical perspective. Now, where do we go from here?
Where do we go? Well, really what we need to do is have -- we need
to canvass the entire county with BLS -- BLS response, AEDs all over
the place.
We need to fund the fire departments. We need to give them
more money, okay. We do need to give them more money. And I'll
tell you why. We need to give them more money so they can go out
and teach the public how to do uninterrupted chest compressions and
how to use an AED. We need a small number of paramedics who are
mobile, who are flexible, and who are in these low frequency, high
risk situations quite often, as often as possible.
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October 26, 2010
I've taken enough of your time. I do want to let you know, I
don't want anyone in this room walking out and going home thinking
that they're not receiving good pre hospital care. As a matter of fact,
the pre hospital care in this county is excellent. The cardiac arrest
survival rates are upwards of 30 percent. Nationwide, about 6, 7, 8
percent, right?
We have all the firefighters in this room and out in the field and
all the paramedics in this room and out in the field to thank for that.
So I want everyone to go home and do just that. Thank you.
(Applause.)
DR. TOBER: Good afternoon, Everyone. I will be actually
quite brief here. Dan is spooling up my few slides here.
I don't have time nor do I want to take up all your time to respond
to every detail that you've heard today. I will say -- I will make a
couple of comments about some things as we go along.
As a brief introduction, my name is Robert Tober. I've been the
medical -- thank you, Leo. I've been the medical director of EMS
since ALS services were started here on February 2,1979.
I was at Naples Community Hospital and medical director of
their two emergency departments up until 2005 and then took over the
hospital's wound centers, and I am also medical director of the
neighborhood clinic where I see approximately 200 patients a week.
Let me just see how to move this.
I want to call attention to a couple of things on this slide.
Particularly brought up was that in 1999 and year 2000, the year -- the
two years that we received both state and national recognition, we did,
indeed, have an ALS interactive agreement going on with North
Naples Fire Department.
We hand trained seven of their medics, and those seven medics
rotated back and forth on ambulances and fire engines for
approximately two years. At that time then Chief Tobin decided to
terminate that system. That was a far cry from trying to maintain the
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certification of some 56 medics.
I also point to the fact that this system is far from broken. And
contrary to some suggestions about having to hold your breath ten
minutes, we have never had a verifiable incident in Collier County
that was because of delay of EMS, those times that EMS was delayed,
that anybody lost their life as a result of that.
The industry of EMS is rapidly changing. I've chained our
protocol many, many times. In 2009 we changed the protocol twice.
We just finished writing at the University of Miami Miller School of
Medicine the third airway course in my career as an emergency room
physician. That is about to go live.
We're actually teaching our first course to instructors on
November 16th. And I can tell you that that airway course came
about because we realize as a scientific group of physicians trying to
analyze this data dispassionately and with a cold eye of evidence, that
paramedics that don't intubate frequently have very low success rates
intubating.
So the airway course is focused towards teaching people to
support airways more effectively during basic life support and first
response.
This next slide, I just to go over a couple of the theories versus
the facts of EMTs and paramedics. I hope most of you understand
that an EMT takes about 16 weeks to get through school. A
paramedic takes about another two years to get through school.
Dr. Panozzo, again, stated that a medic is a medic is a medic.
And we take state licensed paramedics that apply for work at Collier
County EMS, we put them through a five week full-time school
refresher course, and then they go on the road for two to eight months,
depending on their background data, their background experience,
before we release them on the trucks by themselves.
And although all of these people, and paramedics in the fire
department and the paramedics that apply for jobs at EMS, are all
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already state licensed, that is a giant leap in training by the time they
have finished their EMS education at Collier County EMS.
And in the same vein, a doctor is not a doctor is not a doctor. We
have doctors all licensed by the State of Florida that have many
different capabilities and specialties at our four hospitals, and they do
what they do most often, and that is what they do best.
The four bullets here, I just want to go over these quickly. I've
got to put my glasses on because I can't read this writing here. It says
here on the theory that more paramedics at a scene mean that there is a
high level of care. The fact is that an oversaturation of paramedics
leads to many paramedics that have no skills at all or that most of your
paramedics have very few skills.
One of the things mentioned earlier today was that we have some
free roaming med corns and S UV s responding to incidences, and they
are primarily stationed at our highest density call volume.
The reason for this is that these medics either have very high
levels of experience and/or have demonstrated procedural decision
making expertise so that we try to put a highly experienced medic at
the scene of the worst incident. Again, as Dr. Lee mentioned, one of
the low frequency - low volume, high complication rate situations.
Theory number two is that paramedics must arrive at the patient's
side very quickly. What we actually understand today is that rapid
basic life support is what must happen quickly, and that's what we're
working towards.
Theory three is that multiple large truck staffed with several
responders are necessary at all incidences, and we contend that smaller
mobile experienced paramedics getting there as soon as possible make
the major difference and are the most economical.
And the last theory is that fundamental EMS skills are
complicated, expensive, and time consuming training, and we believe
that basic skills are early taught, and we have so far taught 200 of the
county employees in basic skills in an attempt to get BLS to everyone
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within four minutes.
These are just some of the journals. All of these are major
players in the academic literature supporting the facts versus the
myths on the preceding page.
In September of201O a report titled "EMS Field Experiments"
was published by the Department of Homeland Security. It's
interesting because this paper ignores evidence based medicine and
journals. This was basically a design drill with clinic- -- without any
clinical outcomes. My design drill for this county is based on
everyone's real world data, both locally and nationally.
This was one of the competency reports that we did back in 2006
on a quarter of incidences. The big yellow pie is basic life support
incidences. The blue is ALS incidences within medical protocol; the
pink is ALS incidences that occurred in North Naples beyond medical
protoco I.
When I saw this I became alarmed with what was happening with
treatment going on in fire departments. We had already been made
aware of the fact that our own paramedics from EMS that we loaned
to the fire departments came to me -- I didn't come to them. They
came back to me and said, your stationing us full time on fire engines.
We're losing our skills. We're not taking care of the same intensity of
service or severity of illness. We need to be rotated back to
ambulances.
These are people that went through the full internship, as did
some of the medics that now work at North Naples, but they had no
recency of experience. We now rotate those paramedics two months
on an ambulance, one month on an engine, only to maintain their
skills to maintain their medical decision making.
We also had Q/A issues with North Naples that were usually
argumentative, difficult to solve, sometimes we had to do it from
lawyer at North Naples Fire through lawyer at our county services
here versus our own department that solves Q/ A issues seamlessly and
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immediately.
As a result of that pie chart, we started looking at actual ALS
medication administration at the fire departments versus our ALS
engine medics versus our medics that spend full time on an
ambulance.
And if you look at those three colors, the red line is medications
administered by fire departments for a two-year period from 2007
through 2009, the light blue are ALS engine medics, and the dark blue
are our full-time EMS medics.
Part of our insistence on training on ambulance ride experience
was to try to bring these red lines up so that these people, if, indeed,
we were going to arm them with dangerous and potentially life
threatening drugs, would know how to use them.
The second slide, which looks similar to the preceding slide, was
procedures performed by the fire department prior to EMS. That's the
red line at the bottom, almost a very, very small number, versus the
light blue versus the darker blue. This is what led us to initially go to
rotations of our own EMS paramedics loan to fire engines back to
every other month on an ambulance and eventually, once we studied
the data more, we'd bring them on an ambulance for two out of every
three months. Again, to keep them active in their recency of
expenence.
This next slide looks at three of the primary medications
administered by the fire departments from June of2007 to June of
2009. You will note in June of2007, the average time to
administration was 13 minutes of Atrovent. From 2009 to 2010, that
had not changed. 050, 025, the average time to administration was
13 minutes. That has shrunk by a minute. Those are technically ALS
drugs. And three, the Albuterol mist that they were mentioning as
needed in an acute asthma patient, the average time went from 16
minutes to 13 minutes.
Rich Y ovanovich, their attorney, got up earlier and stated that he
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was happy to relieve me of the liability of placing drugs in the hands
of people that I did not feel had enough recency of experience, even
though they were state certified medics. And the issue really isn't
liability, since the Collier County Commission provides my liability
through the county system and the team of attorneys -- are the ones
who stopgap and protect me from any liability. My much greater
concern as medical director of EMS, I am really charged with the
responsibility of maintaining the safety of every citizen in this
community .
And if I believed that this safety was (sic) being compromised, I
would extend drugs to other people. What I learned from this data
was that safety was being compromised by placing drugs in the hands
of people that did not use them frequently enough. That's why the
decision was made.
It's also important to remind each and every one of you that I laid
out training standards, and it was North Naples Fire that chose to
terminate the agreement because they did not want to comply with
these training standards.
The view of Collier County EMS that I have today and beyond is
basically a tiered targeted system of public response, basic life support
and then advanced life support.
Right now, we have this sort of mosaic of cogs that I am
challenged to somehow align and seamlessly interact with one
another. We have police. We have fire departments. Nine separate
fire departments in this county, four of those fire departments are ALS
engine companies. Ochopee, which has always a Collier County EMS
paramedic on it, Isles of Capri Fire Department, which always has an
EMS paramedic on it, Marco Island and City of Naples, which both
have ALS engine systems and comply vigorously or exceed all
training requirements of Collier County EMS.
Now this doesn't want to go to the next one. Let's see. Here we
go.
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October 26, 2010
What happens today in Collier County is somebody has an
accident, 911 is called, the call is dispatched, resources come from all
parts of the county and, if necessary, the patient is taken to a hospital
if they need to go.
What should happen if there is an injury or an illness and
somebody calls 911 is that nonemergencies, like common colds,
emotional complaints, chronic acres, pains, et cetera, either need to
not happen at all, or when we get there, give them an alternative to
taking them to an overcrowded emergency department.
This will require increased and enhanced education of the public
and additional campaigns to provide more bystander CPR, teach them
compression only CPR without any mouth-to-mouth resuscitation.
What also should happen is that each of the nine fire agencies
right now respond differently, typically sending inappropriate
apparatus and personnel to some things -- some calls. The solution is
to either consolidate all fire departments under one management
structure or immediately adopt consistent response protocols under the
Office of the Medical Director.
The next slide is that too many apparatus with numerous
personnel are currently sent to most incidents. We're trying and
working through the difficult maze of limiting multi apparatus
response to calls so that we keep our streets safer and free of
accidents.
Well, let's see where I am here right now.
The other thing that we're looking at doing is trying to ease
emergency department overcrowding by giving people alternative care
sites, like urgent care centers. The problem is so many people call that
are uninsured, that getting these people to an urgent care center is
difficult because those urgent care centers demand cash or a credit
card in order to be seen.
The current average response time in Collier County for ALS
services is eight to nine minutes. This is unacceptable and must be
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October 26, 2010
corrected. Unfortunately, the average BLS response time is also eight
to nine minutes, and we're trying to drive that down. Again, this is a
difficult thing to do.
The Blue Ribbon Committee, which has one of its members here
today, is looking at this, but it is way too premature to decide how we
can best get this done.
Basically, the tiered system that we have today is, we want public
response to occur within four minutes. We want BLS response to then
occur from fire departments and possibly first responders, and then we
want ALS to occur as it is today.
The -- I think I'll leave it there. I'll be happy to answer any
questions that you might have.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you very much. Commissioners,
we have to take a break for the court reporter for ten minutes. If you
have any questions, is it okay to hold them?
Okay, good. We're going to take a ten minute break. We'll be
back here at 2:46.
(A brief recess was had.)
MR. OCHS: Ladies and gentlemen, would you please take your
seats.
Mr. Chairman, you have a live mike.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Ladies and gentlemen, Board of
County Commission meeting is back in session now.
We have finished the petitioner's presentations and the staff
presentations. We have 26 speakers, if! remember correctly.
MR. MITCHELL: Twenty-seven.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Twenty-seven speakers. And do the
commissioners have any questions they want to ask before the
speakers?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: No. Then we'll hear from the speakers.
Now, what we'll do to get through this as expeditiously as possible,
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we'll call two names, and we'd like people to come up to each podium,
and then -- they'll speak in turn, of course, and then we'll call two
more names, and two more people will come up. And we hope to
keep it moving that quickly; otherwise, we're going to be here all
afternoon.
If somebody's already said something you're going to say, you
can waive if you like. We don't need to be told 26 times the same
thing. But if you feel compelled to speak about it, you're going to
have an opportunity to do it.
So call the first two names, Ian.
MR. MITCHELL: The first speaker is Edward Morton, and he'll
be followed by Ken Croft (sic).
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Do we have Ken Croft here?
Okay, Mr. Morton.
MR. MORTON: Thank you. For the record, my name is
Edward Morton. I've retired as a CEO ofNCH after 35 years. I'm
also a recent graduate of Florida Gulf Coast University where I'm a
trustee in a degree in health science, which I pursued to give me a
little bit more perspective on some of the subjects, one of which we're
talking about today.
I'm a member of the Blue Ribbon Committee. I am not speaking
for that committee. Speaking only as an individual based on my own
expenence.
We have heard, I think, very interesting and very thoughtful and
very emotional presentations. The County Commission impaneled us
and asked us to evaluate the data. And I'm not here today to take one
side or the other. I'm here to simply stipulate that we are in the
process of consuming taxpayer revenue, taxpayer dollars, at the
request of this commission to study the data, to look objectively at that
information, to use professors from Florida Gulf Coast University, to
come back before you with concrete recommendations.
Prior to this -- to this meeting, we also had some conversations
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and we presented here, and I think that we all agreed that a bifurcated
or a two level EMS system was in the best interest of everybody. I
think everyone who has participated in this process -- and I probably
have read 500 pier reviewed articles over the past year, a lot of which
came from both fire, some which came from EMS, and a lot which
came from our own pursuit of information available through the
library resources of Florida Gulf Coast University.
And we, I think, all agree that a two level system, a tiered level
system is in the best interest of everybody.
Number two, basic life support in four minutes saves lives. Now,
after that there's a great deal of conjecture. I think, we also heard from
individuals that there are conclusions that have not yet conclusively
been drawn, meaning that there's a lot of information, a lot of data that
has yet been distilled to the point where it's knowledge. There's a lot
of emotion on both sides, because I think one can make an emotional
pitch in both directions.
What I would ask the commission to do is to spend the time
today appropriately to listen to your constituents, but to wait until the
Blue Ribbon Committee has had an opportunity to present a
thoughtful researched and thorough review of the information and the
data and bring before you concrete recommendations as you asked us
to do.
I think it's premature to try and do anything today until you have
all of that information, all that background gathered by objective
people that don't have a foot in either camp.
Okay. Be happy to answer any questions.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you very much. Any questions?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you, Mr. Morton.
MR. MORTON: All right. Thank you.
MR. MITCHELL: Sir?
MR. CRAFT: Good afternoon, Commissioners. My name is
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Ken Craft, and I'm the assistant fire chief with the Bonita Springs Fire
Department, and I would like to speak in support of North Naples Fire
District's desire to participate in an ALS non transport service in
Collier County.
Commissioners, in 1998, we developed and implemented three of
what would become numerous ALS non transport services in Lee
County. The intent of the program was to expand and enhance the pre
hospital care that the residents and visitors needed in their times of
medical and/or trauma emergencies while waiting for a paramedic
ambulance to arrive.
Fire departments, because of the location and numbers, would
arrive on the scenes of these emergencies anywhere from three to 20
minutes prior to the arrival of a paramedic ambulance and have to wait
for paramedics to begin advanced life support skills.
During that time period, the level of morbidity and mortality was
significant. No matter how minor or how critical the patients'
condition, like in some segments of your system now firefighters
could only deliver basic life support.
Twelve years later, we have over five fire based non transport
providers licensed by both Lee County and the State of Florida. In
addition, we have a few additional fire based ALS non transport
providers working directly under Lee County EMS.
We've gone from three to 30 advanced life support non transport
fire based units in Lee County. Almost every licensed fire based
system has had perfect inspections since their inception in 1998.
These units arrived on the scene prior to the arrival of ambulance
and begin both ALS and BLS care if necessary. Quite often the crews
have the patient stabilized and ready for transport upon the arrival of
the ambulance. Doing so has provided faster ALS care, it's decreased
the on-scene times for the patient which, in the long run, has delivered
them to the hospital faster. Ultimately the level of morbidity and
mortality has decreased.
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October 26, 2010
Additionally, this system allows us to divert ambulances to more
critical calls as well as to transport critical patients immediately from a
scene while fire based EMS paramedics tend to the non- -- the
remaining non-critical patients while waiting for additional
ambulances to arrive on the scene.
To date, each of these services that I have listed have
documented -- documentation of critically ill or cardiac arrest patients
that have walked out of the hospital alive with few, if any, medical
deficits based upon the care of the non transport service providers.
The numbers are even greater when you combine the non transport
with the ALS transport providers in Lee County.
The program, with the coordination of Lee County EMS, has
more than proven its success.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Your time has expired.
MR. CRAFT: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Can you wrap it up. Okay. Thank you.
MR. MITCHELL: Samuel Cadreau, and he'll be followed by
P.H. Kinsey.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Sam -- Sam is not in the room.
MR. MITCHELL: Okay. Then P.H. Kinsey, and he'll be
followed by Mike Ellert.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Come up to the speaker podium as
soon as your name is called.
Thank you very much.
MR. KINSEY: Is he before me or--
CHAIRMAN COYLE: You're first.
MR. KINSEY: Okay. Honorable Commission, for the record,
my name is P.H. Kinsey. I'm the Fire Chief of Bonita Springs Fire
Department.
I don't have any pie charts, and I don't have any citings from
journals. What I do have is 23 years experience in the fire service and
12 years experience in exactly the system that North Naples is
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October 26, 2010
pursumg.
I stand here before you today as an advocate of fire based ALS
service. The Bonita Springs Fire District has provided this service for
12 years. In that time, we have received nothing less than perfect
evaluations from the State of Florida on every comprehensive annual
inspection of our service.
I propose to this commission that there is no reasonable evidence
that can be introduced that would suggest that North Naples Fire
District could not provide the same level of outstanding service that
our agency and many other agencies in Lee County currently provide.
North Naples Fire District has the leadership, experience, talent,
professionalism, and dedication required to implement and
successfully carry out this level of service.
In the long run, it's the end user, it's the citizen, it's the public
who will be the benefactors of this service and who will ultimately be
better served by the program. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you. Sam?
MR. MITCHELL: Harold Whitlock?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: You're next, Sam.
MR. CADREAU: Commissioners, for the record, my name is
Sam Cadreau, excuse me. I'm a retired firefighter from the City of
Naples, 25 years.
In this community, I feel that this is a need that needs to really go
not just to North Naples, but -- they are the icebreakers -- but it needs
to go countywide for the simple reason that looking at this not to be a
transport unit or seeking a certificate of need for a transport unit, but
just to have this ability to be able to save one life, one life, by being
able to have the ability to provide ALS. I think it's a very good need.
I think it's a -- long overdo coming.
So please, take this into consideration, because at some day it
could be you or one of your family members. Thank you.
MR. MITCHELL: And Harold Whitlock, will you come up to
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the other podium, please.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: You are Harold Whitlock?
MR. ELLERT: No, ma'am. I'm Mike Ellert.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Oh, okay.
MR. ELLERT: Commissioners, my name's Mike Ellert, for the
record. I'm a licensed property manager here in Collier County,
specifically in Pelican Bay at a high-rise, one of the 15.
There's 85 communities there in Pelican Bay, and 13,000 people.
I have seen first hand over the last five years the North Naples Fire
Department respond to us, and I want to express to you their quality in
the way they respond.
I have a building of a lot of older people. They've been there
many times. They have been the first responders. And today I don't
know if you were impressed with anything, but the one thing I always
look for in managing property, is there a need for something.
And Jamie Cunningham put up and showed the commissioners
his particular, I guess you would say, report on the need of times that
they responded without having the paramedics there. I have seen that
happen in my building first hand. And I'd just like to say to all of you,
the perception of the quality that they have and the way they perform
is just outstanding.
I'd like you to consider the need first and then the people
themselves that they represent. They surely feel very strongly that we
need this particular service.
There is an act, I think, nationwide called the Good Samaritan
Act, and when somebody is hurt, anybody can respond to that act
because we've received the knowledge that we need to take care of
somebody. You can't be held liable for what you do. A lot of liability
questions were talked about today.
There is a need. What is wrong with somebody who's trained to
respond in many instances? And that's what it comes down to. People
like us and our loved ones definitely need to have somebody there
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who's trained.
Dr. Lee spoke about, jerk them and grab them. If they're first
responders and they prep them, they're all ready to be taken out and
get to the hospital quick. Time's of the essence. My time's up, but
thank you for your consideration.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you.
MR. MITCHELL: Manuel Ortiz, and John Spicuzza.
MR. ORTIZ: For the record, my name is Manuel Ortiz. Thank
you for your time, Commissioners. I'm a resident for the past four
years here in Naples, and pleasantly so. It's a great community.
And I just want to impress on the fact that our life might be in the
balance. It's what we're boiling down to. We have spoken about cost.
We have spoken with attrition and depletion of resources changing
from one department to the other. Who's in control, who's not in
control.
Once again, I impress upon you, it's all about the patient. It's all
about that person hurt. It's not just about a heart attack. It's not about
being firm and the aging community here in Naples.
It might be a car accident, it might be a slip and fall. There are
many variables that are not being considered. And this is not just
about black and white and extremes in a chart. What about the people
in the middle? It's the greater -- it's the great benefit to the community
that needs to be taken care of.
And I believe the resources are there. And the North Naples Fire
Department, like somebody else said just a couple minutes ago, might
be the ice breaker in this issue. But I think it's something that is very
worthwhile to be looking at. It's all for the greater good of the
community. And what else is there? If we don't take care of our
community, what are we here for?
Thank you for your time.
MR. MITCHELL: Robert Schank?
MR. SPICUZZA: Good evening. John Spicuzza, for the record.
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I live in Lee County, but I'm going to give you my perspective from
my experience. I've been in the public safety business for 35 years.
I've been a paramedic for 32 of these years, so, respectively, about a
year longer than Dr. Tober.
It's a natural progression for the fire department to have a
COPCN simply because fire department EMS or paramedics in
general started in the fire service. Most paramedic services in the
country are fire based. And there's a legitimate -- a lot of legitimate
reasons for that.
You know, EMS isn't just there for a ride to the hospital. There
are a lot of things that happen. Transport units are busy. You know,
first responders are going to be critical. You know, they're going to be
busy doing treatment, transport, interfacility transfers and so forth, and
the turnaround time in ERs, it makes sense that there's going to be
some delayed response by some of the ground ambulances. That's
nothing to belittle them. That's just part of the nature of the beast. So
that's why it's critical to have ALS care out there with the first
responders.
As Chief Craft mentioned before about in Lee County, all the
different agencies that work together, you know, all the different
agencies that are transport and non-transport, two fire department
transport agencies, and all the other first responders, we have -- I'm a
part of a committee since its inception, and we have a countywide
protocol and guidelines committee. That involves every single
agency, includes the Lee County EMS, it includes the ALS transport
fire department, the ALS non-transport fire department, and all the
BLS agencies.
And we all have one common county guideline. We all use the
same protocol. Doesn't matter who we work for. We all have the
same protocol; we do the same thing.
What I find interesting is that if paramedics aren't that -- aren't
that important. It's kind of something you've got to be concerned with,
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is that -- Dr. Lee was -- actually was invited to one of our meetings. I
don't know if he was blowing smoke up my skirt or whatever the case
might be. But as he walked out he told us all, I was very impressed
with the cooperation and the professionalism and the organization,
you all working together. It was very impressive, he says. I just wish
we had that kind of cooperation in Collier County.
I don't know where that went. So anyway, you always made the
comment about ALS care doesn't do anything. Well, I can tell you
right now with the budget constraints, here's a money saver. Get rid of
Collier County EMS and just buy a bunch more taxicabs.
In the EMS committee, EMS committee, everyone's involved
with this committee is not -- everyone that's above, like Chief Craft
talked about, and myself, three medical directors, a representative
from Lee Memorial Health System, Charlotte County EMS, which is a
fire based ambulance service, and Collier County EMS has also been
invited, and they are actually participating, because we all regionally
talk about what trends are, what's working, what doesn't, kind of
studies, et cetera, et cetera, so it's very productive, and it's something
that should be done here, because the makeup in Lee County is very
similar to Collier County with multiple fire departments and different
type services and so forth.
And we all have a consensus on guidelines, equipment,
cooperative training, et cetera, et cetera, and all I want to say there is
that it's -- you know, it's not a monopoly or dictatorship by anyone
agency or medical director, and that's not the way it should be. It's no
different than trying to have one county commissioner making all the
decisions on your own. Thank you.
MR. MITCHELL: Regan Sytsma?
MR. SCHANK: How you doing? My name is Robert Schank.
I'm an employer with the North Naples Fire Control and Rescue
District. I'm a firefighter -- I'm a driver engineer with the department.
I'm also a member of the TRT, which is the Technical Rescue Team,
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and Hazardous Materials Team. I'm also a state certified paramedic.
Back in May my engine company, or our engine company,
responded to Gulf Coast High School to an unconscious, not breathing
football player on the football field. When we arrived on scene,
mouth-to-mouth resuscitation was being performed. Once we made
patient contact, we completed all of our basic life support procedures
under our protocol.
The unfortunate thing is, not only did this kid, one of our kids --
he not only needed basic life support, but he also needed advanced life
support.
The other unfortunate problem with this call was EMS was
responding from out of district, out of zone, because they're busy.
They're working hard, just like we do.
But it was 10 minutes till they arrived on scene after we did. So
for 10 minutes after we were on scene, this patient was unconscious
and his airway was being supported by us. Ten minutes.
Bottom line is, no one ever questions me when I go into a
burning building, because that's what I'm trained to do. When I'm on
the Technical Rescue Team, I'm hanging off one of the highrises off
Pelican Bay or even down on Marco Island, no one ever questions me
because that's what I'm trained to do.
I'm asked to go into a structure or a building with an unknown
chemical substance and I'm on the HAZ-MA T Team, no one ever
questions me because that's what I'm trained to do.
Fortunate thing is, is I'm also trained to do advanced life support.
I'm a state certified paramedic since 1997. Let me do my job. Thank
you.
(Applause.)
MR. MITCHELL: Rosalie Rhodes?
MS. SYTSMA: Hello. My name is Regan Sytsma. I'm a
Lieutenant Paramedic for North Naples Fire Department.
I came today because we've been talking about our experience
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and our training and what we're qualified to do, so I figured I'd give
you my viewpoint on how long I've been in the department and what
my qualifications are so you get an idea of what the 54 paramedics in
North Naples are capable and ready to do.
I began my career in 1994 by receiving my paramedic license. I
was hired by Collier County EMS in June of'95. I was a part-time
EMT, and within six months I was hired as a full-time paramedic.
At this point I was placed in the Tober certification program to be
capable of being in charge of an EMS unit. This title was later
dictated as a lieutenant paramedic.
The normal training period at that time was six months with a
training officer, completing an extensive training manual, and sitting
in front of Dr. Tober himself for scenario based questioning.
I completed all the required training and testing, and by 1996 I
was in charge of a Collier County ambulance and consistently
working with part-time EMTs.
I was volunteering for Bayshore Fire Department at the same
time in Lee County. And from the time I was in paramedic school, I
was drawn to the fire service. Being a student athlete and team sports
player, I was interested in the team concept and the family atmosphere
of the fire department.
In May of '97 I was hired by the North Naples Fire Department.
At that time there were no practicing firefighter paramedics in the
county working for any department. The day I left Collier County
EMS and became a firefighter, I was no longer deemed competent to
perform ALS procedures.
In '98 the first interlocal agreement concerning the possibility of
ALS engines was established. I was one of three paramedics on my
shift at the time and only operating at an EMT level.
The first agreement, I had one paramedic from North Naples Fire
Department operating as a third team member for the Collier County
EMS department. This program continued, and I was one of the first
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October 26, 2010
individuals chosen to ride on a Collier County EMS for a six month
training program, now for the second time completing an extensive
training manual and sitting in front of Dr. Tober for scenario based
questioning.
After completing this in February of2000, I was placed on a
North Naples fire engine for one month as a certified medic, and the
next month was placed back on a Collier County ambulance. This
program was maintained by the county for the length of two years,
and I was a member of this. And as soon as that program fell apart, I
was no longer deemed competent to perform ALS procedures.
The next program began, and I went through another two week
training program and then went back on it doing the -- riding on the
ambulance every three months.
In the time that I've been under the medical direction of Dr.
Tober, approximately 16-and-a-halfyears now, I've seen Dr. Tober for
training three times; two of those times being one-on-one questioning.
In the past three years, however, I've been trained by two other
emergency room physicians, Dr. Panozzo and Dr. Nathan from -- that
was the Bonita Medical Director. I've had at least six sessions with
these two physicians and in-the-street evaluations.
I've been a certified paramedic for 16 years and for me, I have
only one other -- I've only ever wanted to do one thing, make a
difference when it counts the most in people's lives. To have even one
patient die because of having my hands tied is --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Your time has expired. Thank you.
(Applause.)
MR. MITCHELL: Ronald Scammon? Ronald Scammon?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay, Rosalie. Go ahead.
MS. RHODES: Okay. My name is Rosalie Rhodes, and I've
been in Collier County since 2000. Fortunately or unfortunately I've
had to call for emergency services a number of times.
I am very grateful that they could perform their services, because
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on one occasion I did have a problem breathing and needed immediate
care. And at that time they could give it, and I'm very grateful
because, otherwise, I don't know what would have transpired.
Our fire -- and I'm not part of the fire department; clearly
understand that. But our firefighters are our first responders. They get
there.
If this were you and not me, would you want them there and then
standing with their hands in their pockets because they can't perform
lifesaving procedures that is important to us?
Dr. Lee talked about, scoop them up and get them out. Well,
under those conditions, all we need to do is call a cab and then get to
the hospital and let the hospital take care of it.
But we depend on the firefighters. We depend on those engines
coming out. When that -- when we hear that siren, that tells us that
someone is coming there to help us, to save us. How important is it to
know that these people are there?
They're trained. My tax dollars are helping them to train. We
don't have to pay extra dollars. We don't have to have extra budget
money in there. We already know that they're being trained, and
they're working hard. They're studying. They're doing all of the
things that are necessary.
How important is it? We're the citizens. This is -- we're the end
users. It is so vitally important that -- the lives that they save, they're
ours.
We're wasting valuable resources. We're taking people that
we've trained, that have studied, that under different circumstances
Tober would -- Dr. Tober would certify and say, well, okay, they can
work, but as soon as they transfer from one branch to the other, it's all
of a sudden they've lost their credentials? I don't understand how that
procedure follows.
They are the first responder. Ambulances don't get there with the
same amount of time.
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My life is at stake. I want those people to be able to help us. I
want the first responder to be able to do what is necessary to save my
life. And I'm sure that if you were that person who were standing or
fallen or in an accident or had a heart attack, your life -- you want that
to be your life that's saved as well as mine.
I thank you for the opportunity to speak before you. Thank you.
(Applause.)
MR. MITCHELL: Erik Espineta followed by Jodi Van Sickle.
(Applause.)
LT. ESPINET A: Good afternoon, Commissioner. My name is
Erik Espineta. I'm a Lieutenant with the North Naples Fire
Department.
I have a brief audio clip that I'd like to play for you. It's an
advanced life support call that we ran on spring of last year. And our
advanced life support capabilities made a difference, and I'd like to
play that tape for you briefly.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: I need to ask you a question.
LT. ESPINET A: Yes, sir.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Are you sure there's nothing on the tape
that violates the --
LT. ESPINET A: It was of a fire commission meeting. It's a
public records, yes, sir. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Oh, okay. Go ahead.
(An audio recording was played as follows:)
UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: "Before I give out this
award, I'd like to ask Doug to come up and say a couple words.
Thank you.
DOUG: Excuse me if I get a little emotional. I'm normally
a pretty stoic guy, but seeing them and knowing what happened
__ first of all, gentlemen, I could never repay you or say thank
you enough mostly for the careers you chose and for being there
when I needed you.
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The one thing I'd really like to say, too, is, is that I have
been involved with talking to our County Commissioners and our
medical director after reading some, what I thought, asinine
remarks in the newspaper about the equipment and the
medications that the fire department carries.
In my personal opinion, I think the medical director is
absolutely wrong. I think it is necessary. I'm a proven fact that,
because you have everything known to mankind, I'm standing
here alive, and I enjoy my life and my family. Without that, I
could not.
You guys were there long before the EMTs ever got there. I
was dead by the time they got there. I know that. I have doctors
in my family. You guys saved my life because you were the first
ones there, you cared, and you had the equipment. In my
personal opinion and my wife's and my family's and everybody
that I can talk to, you guys should have everything known to
mankind to do your jobs with.
I don't care if you have a PhD in it. It doesn't matter to me.
It matters to me that I'm still alive standing here being able to
enjoy my family and my life. And for that, gentlemen, I could
can never repay you for.
I appreciate you choosing the profession you did because
you were there, and your professionalism, I'm standing here
today.
I've been released from my heart doctor. I'm back to my
crazy, insane schedule of - my wife and I had just started a
business back in May, and the stress is what got me.
But again, Commissioners, I hate -- Dr. Tobits (sic) is
wrong in my personal opinion. I am a standing example of why
these gentlemen should have every damn thing known to
mankind. I don't care you raising my taxes to pay for it, because
they are the ones -- when you need them is when you don't care
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anymore.
And I, gentlemen, don't care. So I would implore to you,
please -- no, I don't care what the medical director says. He isn't
the one in that truck when he has to get there when I'm laying
on the ground died (sic). I don't want to -- I don't ever want to
hear that one of these guys didn't get the stuff they needed simply
because a medical director did not think he was qualified. Well,
you know, sometimes I'm wondering if he is, but that's a different
scenano.
Again, please, I implore you all, don't -- do not listen to him.
Give these guys everything they need. They know what they're
doing in the field. They chose the field they're in, and they care
about people like me. And for that, I could never repay them.
Once again, thank you so very much."
LT. ESPINET A: In closing, I'd just like to say that Doug
and his wife asked us, asked my crew, asked my commissioners and
asked my fire department to continue this fight, and that's why we're
here today, and we will continue it because we believe it's the right
thing to do. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you.
(Applause.)
MR. MITCHELL: Mary Kate O'Connell? Mary Kate
O'Connell?
MS. VAN SICKLE: Hi. My name's Jodi Van Sickle. I'm a
Firefighter/Paramedic with North Naples Fire Department, and I do
that full time, so I'm on shift 24, off for 48. But during my off 48, I
work another job, and I work for NCH as a paramedic. I have my own
ambulance. The same exact medications that EMS carries on their
ambulance, same protocol. Why is that?
One day I wear this uniform. I'm not allowed to touch anybody.
I'm not allowed to do anything. The next day, 24 hours later, I put this
shirt on, I'm graced. How does that happen? I mean, is this political?
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Like, what's the issue here?
I don't get it. Do you guys -- do you understand what I'm coming
at? Any comment?
(Applause.)
MS. V AN SICKLE: I'm not the only one either. Just to let you
know, I'm not the only person that does this. May lose my job now by
Dr. Tober, but I don't care. It's what's right. What do you do? It's not
right.
The other thing is, is that I wanted to just comment on what Dr.
Tober has mentioned, that no one has died because there was no ALS
transport there. Well, my crew and I were on a call -- sorry -- fourteen
minutes, and we got to watch this guy die in front of us, and we
couldn't do one thing. He was alive when we got there, and we got to
watch him die.
And EMS -- by the time EMS got there -- and I don't know
where they were, coming out of zone, whatever. What happens during
season happens all the time. All's we got to do is CPR on this guy.
AED said, no shock advised. Obviously there's something wrong with
him. Do you even understand how this happens?
He lied, and he knows it. It's fact. I'm sorry you guys are getting
wrong information. I'm sorry I'm crying. Obviously I'm very
passionate about this job.
I worked for EMS for four years before I came to the fire
department because I wanted to do everything. That's how I am. I
love the fire, I love medical, and that's how I am.
If you guys turn this down, I will make it my personal mission
that every person that is affected by negative ALS on scene and their
life is affected, I will let them know who the gods were that sat behind
that table said no. I will make it my personal mission, and they will
come to you personally. Do you understand?
That's it. I can't take it.
(Applause.)
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October 26, 2010
MR. MITCHELL: Collin Marshall?
MS. O'CONNELL: Good afternoon. My name is Mary Kate
O'Connell. I'm a resident of Naples, and I live under the protection of
the North Naples Fire District.
On February 8th of this year at approximately 7:30 a.m. a 911
call came in requesting urgent medical assistant for Martin Keith, a
70-year-old man, loving husband, and devoted father of seven. It
appeared that he was having a stroke, an advanced life support call.
That morning the NNFD and the ambulance arrived on scene at
the same time. Had that not been the case, Martin Keith could have
lost his life as our firefighters were forced to watch.
Martin Keith was very lucky that day, and so was I. I'm his
daughter. My mother called 911 as she watched him have a seizure,
lose the ability to move the right side of his body. To this day, I can
still feel the weight of him leaning on me because he couldn't hold
himself up, and I can still feel the terror as I squeezed my father's limp
right hand and pleaded, Dad, can you squeeze my hand back?
Until that day, I had never seen fear in my father's eyes. He was
unable to speak, he was unable to answer my request, and it was the
first time in 40 years that my father didn't squeeze my hand back.
As a Collier County resident, I knew that even in the NNFD
paramedics arrived first on scene, although qualified, they would not
be allowed to administer life support to my dad, and that's a disgrace.
I'm not trained in ALS. All I could do that day was hold my
father's hand and repeat, you're going to be okay, Dad. It's going to be
okay.
If the North Naples Fire District is not approved for non-transport
COPCN, their hands are tied, just as mine were that day. My father's
life and the lives of Collier County residents should not depend on the
response time of Collier County EMS or on some distorted political
agenda. In a life-or-death situation, in any situation, our lives should
be in the hands of first responders.
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You don't have to have medical training to know that when
someone is having a heart attack, every second counts. When
someone's airway is obstructed, every second counts. And when
someone like my dad is having a stroke, every second counts.
My father has survived glioblastoma multiform, which is the
deadliest type of brain cancer. He's had two craniotomies since his
diagnosis in November 2008, and the residual effects of the tumors
and the medication he's on have awarded him three separate back
surgeries and a partial hip replacement. And not only is he still
fighting for his life, he attended my brother's wedding two weeks ago.
The fact that local politics could have been the determining factor
in whether or not he lived or died on February 8th is despicable. My
father's visit from Naples to New York this year could have resulted in
his death, and one life at risk is one too many.
Not only are the men and women of the North Naples Fire
District ready, willing, and able to save lives, I am here today because
North Naples is being forced (sic) for the right to save lives. Saving
lives is a duty and an honor. It is not a right.
I implore you to let them do their jobs. As the devoted daughter
of a United States Marine who could have lost a two year battle for
life because of some political agenda, I want to know why this is even
an issue. I also want to know that when I call 911, I'm not rolling the
dice on response times, because every second counts.
Thank you for your time.
(Applause.)
MR. MITCHELL: Ted Raia? Ted Raia?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Your name?
MR. MARSHALL: Good afternoon. My name is Collin
Marshall. I am the Executive Director for the Carlisle.
A few months ago the North Naples Fire Department came to me
and offered me an opportunity to partner, to give something back to
the community, and I jumped at it, jumped at it.
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You have an opportunity today to give North Naples Fire
Department something that they need to do their jobs that they already
do very well, very well.
Yesterday I watched someone die, as I have many times in the
past because of what I do. So I know what 180 seconds feels like, I
know what ten minutes feels like, I know what three minutes feels
like, especially when you're standing there watching somebody die,
okay.
So if I'm in that same position, if I'm laying there and I need help,
I'm here to tell you right now, that I would not rather have anybody
else taking care of me except North Naples Fire. I get to see these
guys work and these ladies work every single day, every day, time and
time again, effortlessly, without fail, and they do it very well.
Competency? No question at all, at all.
So I implore you to make the right decision. Approve this CON
for North Naples Fire. It is something that is desperately needed out
there, desperately needed out there. I don't envy you. The decision
that you make today, today, holds a lot oflives in the balance, a lot.
I have a responsibility. Every day I get up, I go into work. I care
for 430 to 450 people every day. I don't take this responsibility
lightly, and I hope you don't as well.
Give them the tools they need to do their job. Approve this CON.
Thank you.
(Applause.)
MR. MITCHELL: Barry Zeil? Barry Zeil?
DR. RAIA: Yeah. My name is Ted Raia. I'm a retired army
physician with 26 years of active duty and 14 years of reserve duty.
During my civilian life, I was instrumental in forming the Valley
Imaging Physicians -- Valley Emergency Physicians Corporation in
Massachusetts in the '70s and had experience in getting an
organization like this started.
And one of the difficulties we found was, there's one thing in
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training and the other thing is experience. How does one go from
intubating a manikin to intubating a patient? It's a leap. And it's
something you just don't do once. You have to be doing it many,
many times. I would not want anybody coming to me or my family
with an endotracheal tube unless they'd done it many, many times. It's
a lethal weapon.
So I don't know what they're talking about, advanced life support.
If it's that, they need the experience. I implore you, don't make this
emotional.
Secondly, giving IV s is the same thing. You have to know how
to give an IV. You can't spend five minutes looking for a vein.
For years we've had ALS. It's nothing new, but the percentage of
saves was around 4 percent, which is ridiculous. If ALS was that
great, why did we have just a 4 percent save rate?
The only thing that has changed this is the AED, the automatic
electronic defibrillators. They have revolutionized the saving of
patients. The person that's going to save your life is sitting next to
you. It may not be the fire department or the EMTs. It's knowing to
use the defibrillator.
Now, I know they ask -- I asked Commissioner Henning if --
hold his breath for ten minutes. I would like to ask all the
commissioners, do you know where the AED is, and have you tried
using it?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Yes.
DR. RAIA: Because that's the thing. Now, in my own
condominium, I have -- once a year I brief all the residents on where it
is and how to use it. That's the most important thing.
I think this argument about ALS is really not important. You
must base it only on experience. The AED will get the patient to the
hospital alive.
Thank you.
MR. MITCHELL: Bob Naegele?
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Sir, you can start.
MR. ZEIL: My name is Barry Zeil. I'm a full-time resident of
Collier County. I am not -- I come to you because I've had experience
with emergency medical treatment. I've had 13 operations. I've had
malignant brain tumors. I've been saved by highly trained personnel,
and I believe that's the way that Collier County is best served, by the
highly trained personnel taught by the award winning emergency
medical trainer, Dr. Tober.
And this is one instance where I believe that -- and I don't always
agree with you, although I do like the way you're dressed today, better
than Naples City Council who come in sport shirts like me. It is my
opinion that this is the one time, or one of the times, that you need to
follow the recommendations of your staff. Thank you.
MR. MITCHELL: Robert Metzger?
MR. NAEGELE: Yeah, Naegele. Commissioners, my name is
Bob Naegele. I live at 7993 Via Vecchia, North Naples. I've been a
resident since 1994. I'm the recent past chairman of the Pelican Bay
Foundation. I'm not here in that capacity today. I'm here as a resident
of North Naples.
I think you've received from Myra Daniels of the Philharmonic
and Ed Staros, Vice-President, General Manager of the Ritz Carlton,
they've urged you to vote against this denial, and I also join with them
in urging you to allow North Naples residents to have the right of self
determination regarding ALS for NNFD.
And as you vote on this issue that's so important, I hope that our
North Naples county commissioner member, Mr. Halas, presently a
lame duck, recues himself. I hope that he would recues himself from
voting on this vitally important issue.
So I thank you very much.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Can you state why?
MR. NAEGELE: Because you're a lame duck. You'll be out of
here soon, and you've been an adversary for North Naples for a long
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time.
Thank you.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: I don't think --
(Applause.)
MR. MITCHELL: Ken Drogue?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: County Attorney, just so we clarify that
issue, the state law doesn't permit him --
MR. KLA TZKOW: He is obligated by the state law to vote
unless he has sort --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Personal conflict.
MR. KLA TZKOW: -- of technical issue here, and there is none
here.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: That's right.
MR. MITCHELL: Ken Drogue? Doug Dyer? Margaret
Hansen?
CHIEF DYER: Good afternoon, Commissioners. For the record,
Doug Dyer, fire chief for East Naples Fire Control and Rescue
District. You already know what I'm going to say. I've said it
100,000 times.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: You want to waive your time?
CHIEF DYER: No, I'm not. Thank you.
But the -- I think the point being is that we've been saying the
same things over and over again. The young lady, the
firefighter/paramedic from North Naples, probably captured the
essence of why we're here, and that's saving lives and protecting the
public.
She also captured that 800-pound gorilla that nobody really
wants to talk about, and that's the political nature of this issue, because
she hit the nail right on the head. That's exactly what this is all about.
It's not about saving lives or protecting the public. It's about
protecting turf. And I think once we realize the data -- I found it
interesting that Dr. Lee used the term outliers, which is a statistical
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October 26, 2010
term to identifY a data point that falls outside the bell curve, and then a
few minutes later Dr. Tober used a lot of statistics with some pretty
high averages. I wonder where the outliers were in those data points.
I guess the -- Commissioner Coyle, I understand where this
comes from - long term mentor of mine, guy named Colonel Dennis
D. Domingo once told me, when in doubt -- although I don't think
anyone has any doubts, but when in doubt, do the right thing. And
that's all I'm asking you, do the right thing.
Thank you very much.
(Applause.)
MR. MITCHELL: Justin Gibson? Justin Gibson?
MS. HANSON: Oh, he's first?
MR. MITCHELL: No, you can start.
MS. HANSON: Oh, I am. Thank you. All right.
Good afternoon, Commissioners, members of the audience, and
thank you all for coming on such an important thing that we're
discussing here.
For the record, Margaret Peggy Hanson. I am Fire
Commissioner for the North Naples Fire and Rescue District, and very
proud to serve in this capacity. I think we have a wonderful group of
people. I'm always proud of them.
(Applause.)
MS. HANSON: Now, I'm going to talk from a little different
perspective because the -- I get around quite a bit, and the people in
my North Naples district, they tell me they want our trained
paramedics who usually are the first one on the scene, to arrive at the
scene and to treat them right away. That's what they want, and they
all tell me that. Everybody I see.
Okay. So, you know, when we entered into this ALS agreement
with Dr. Tober, things were working out well in the very beginning,
and then he changed the protocols on us, some of the rules. You
know, some of my friends said, do you think he set us up for failure?
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October 26, 2010
Do you think he did that? I hope not. Maybe it was just that he is too
busy to oversee the training properly.
He's never been to our fire station that I know of, never, never.
Now, he's spreading himself too thin. And I'll tell you, don't you think
that if someone is being paid to be the medical director for all of
Collier County -- this is a very large district -- he should be out
stopping at each of the fire stations periodically and making a visit to
see what's going on, perhaps? It would be nice if we had seen his face
once in a while. We never did.
And last week, as a matter of fact, Dr. Tober came to a meeting
at Pelican Bay that I attended, and he talked about -- he mentioned
about -- it's either the Wellness Center or the Wound Center -- I think
it's the Wound Center -- that he's been working on now. Well, he's
also a paid director for the Neighborhood Health Clinic, which is a
shining light in Collier County. It's a wonderful facility that the
Lashods started, and we're very proud that we have that in Collier
County .
But you know what? That takes time also. So -- and also he does
work for the University of Miami and, I guess, Edison or Hodges
College, and he also calls -- he called on a friend of mine who was in
Bentley Village. So how thin can you really spread yourself and do
that good ofajob?
So bottom line is, what I'm saying, people, you may be a very
good doctor but, by golly, he is not a good director, and he needs help.
And we could help him. We could do something.
So please vote yes for this CPCON (sic). Thank you.
(Applause.)
MR. MITCHELL: Margaret Eadington, and she'll be the last
speaker.
MR. GIBSON: Good afternoon. My name is Justin Gibson. I'm
a firefighter/paramedic with North Naples and, more importantly, a
concerned citizen within Collier County.
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October 26, 2010
I look behind you all today and I see the Great Seal of the State
of Florida, and I note that on both of my certifications that I use for
my employment, being my fire certification as well as my paramedic
certificate, that same seal is on there, the same seal that is with
everyone else's.
And I've noticed that the tone today has taken on a bit of an
adversarial approach, and we've gotten a little confused with bearing
statistics and ideologies from two different sides.
And more importantly, let me move towards the aspect of
training. I consider myself an apt pupil. I consider myself trained. I
trained with many of the paramedics that are currently on the road
today that are, quote unquote, certified or credentialed.
And while AEDs may very well be definitive care or at least will
assist you whenever you have ventricular fibrillation or ventricular
tachycardia without a pulse, we didn't talk about the idea of people
with diabetes. When your blood sugar drops so low that they are no
longer conscious, an AED is not going to help you. You need a
payton (phonetic) line, and you need to be administered D50. That's
something that I've done and continue to do.
You hear on the news today opiates and oxycodone,
hydrocodone, things of this sort being taken by our youth. One of the
very first calls where I had the opportunity to actually feel fulfilled by
saving a young kid's life was whenever he had overdosed on taking
Oxycontins. Naloxone hydrochloride is a definitive care to at least
give this person a fighting chance. Give me that chance.
My family lives within the North Naples District. My future
father-in-law is a diabetic. Do not allow me to go over to my future
wife's house and my family's house and not be able to do anything to
help save his life.
Please be great like the seal says. Do the right thing in your
heart. Thank you.
(Applause.)
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October 26, 2010
MS. EADINGTON: I'm Margaret Eadington. I'm the executive
director of the Collier County Medical Society, and I rise to support
the recommendation to deny the North Naples Fire Control Certificate
of Need.
I'm going to read a letter that's been sent to the commissioners on
behalf of Dr. James Talano, who's president of the Collier County
Medical Society. I represent over 530 practicing physicians in Naples.
We do not support the formation of a separate ALS service that
would begin the fragmentation of an outstanding pre-hospital care
system, and we, once again, fully support and enforce Dr. Robert
Tober's effort to serve the community with a centralized and united
ALS ambulance service -- system.
We support the current training standards of CCEMS paramedics
set forth by Dr. Robert Tober and believe that there is such a concept
of dilution of skills by too many providers and that the two tiered
system of first response provided by the fire departments, followed by
second response by CCEMS definitive ALS care and transport of the
patient by advanced and methodically trained paramedics provide the
optimum level of medical care for our residents and visitors.
That one-on-one training in the field by an expert paramedic field
trained officer with the new paramedic hire has no substitute in
preparing a new medical care giver for the rigors of emergency care in
the streets and pre hospital environment.
The decision making at the scene of an accident, the large picture
assessment of the scene, the trials and difficulties of dealing with
distraught family members and friends during illness and injured or
injury must be learned through experience. This internship model has
been copied from a long history of successful medical trained doctors
and nurses and has no equal.
We believe that the rigorous standards of training and continued
paramedic clinical credentialing set forth by Dr. Tober have
contributed significantly to patient safety, survival, and good and
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October 26, 2010
sound medical practice.
We oppose any shortcuts to this training regiment, inclusive of
any deviations from field training internships in an ambulance or
deviations from cyclical rotation to an ambulance on a full-time basis
to prevent deterioration of skills, decision making, and scene
assessment skills.
We clinically credential and train physicians in a similar fashion
and see no justification for discontinuing the system of excellence in
patient safety in the pre hospital environment, CCEMS services,
making it one of the best in the United States.
We see no reason to dilute this delivery of healthcare by allowing
the fire department paramedics the same medical credentialing as the
CCEMS paramedics without the same necessary and extensive
training.
Thank you for your time.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thank you.
MR. MITCHELL: Sir, that was your last speaker.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Last speaker? Okay, thank you very
much.
I think Commissioner Fiala had her light on first. Go ahead,
Commissioner Fiala.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay, thank you.
Well, first of all, I don't believe that ego, politics, control, or
power should be any part of this subject. What we should all be
sitting here thinking about today is the health and safety of our
residents. That's what it's all about. It isn't about who wins and who
loses, but about whose life is going to be saved, and I want my
grandkids' life to be saved and my kids' lives to be saved, and maybe
even mme.
And I'm -- I'm one who believes that I need everybody on the
scene that's going to help me do that.
And I have a question, and this isn't a question that's trying to
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program anything. It's just a flat out simple question.
They've said over and over again, BLS saves lives, and they've
downplayed the need for ALS. Is ALS -- Dr. Palozzi (sic), is that your
name?
DR. PANOZZO: Panozzo.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay. Is ALS needed at all?
DR. PANOZZO: Well, I believe it is.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay. That's all I needed to know.
And if ALS is needed, why aren't we sending it out with BLS? Why
don't we have the full boat right away? Why would we -- why would
we wait? I mean, I don't see why we can't all work together.
And somebody here was from Lee County early on, Ken Craft or
Croft. And I thought, wow, now that's -- why are they being able to
do this? And you would have your own medical director, so you guys
would be trained all the time.
I mean, what is wrong with the first thing in mind saving our
people's lives? And that's so important to me.
(Applause.)
COMMISSIONER FIALA: So at this point in time that's all I
have to say.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Commissioner Henning?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Oh, thank you.
Rich, did I miss the presentation of the training of the
paramedics?
MR. YOV ANOVICH: We--
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Testing, training.
MR. YOV ANOVICH: Dr. Panozzo, in your backup, has an
extensive plan for training and certifying paramedics before they get
out on the road. No paramedic is going to go out on the road based
upon just school or -- they're going to go through a -- they're going to
have to show their skills. They're going to have to have practical
expenence.
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October 26, 2010
And Dr. Panozzo can get up here and go through that, but he did
say he was going to go through basically the same -- essentially
similar training as Dr. Tober in making sure that our paramedics can
provide the skill set that they need.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: What about the testing?
MR. YOV ANOVICH: They'll be tested as well. They'll be
testing --
COMMISSIONER HENNING: I missed that.
MR. YOV ANOVICH: He did.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: I mean, there's a lot of
passionate --
MR. YOV ANOVICH: There was.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: -- testimony here, and I kind of
got lost --
MR. YOV ANOVICH: I can have him summarize again really
quickly --
COMMISSIONER HENNING: -- trying to make a logical --
MR. YOV ANOVICH: -- but he did go through that. And in the
COMMISSIONER HENNING: No. I'll take your word for it.
MR. YOV ANOVICH: -- backup there is testing -- there's
testing, there's practical experience and certification of our paramedics
as well.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: And how would that be similar
to what Collier County EMS is tested and --
DR. PANOZZO: Well, training and ongoing education of
paramedics is complex because many of the procedures have to be
simulated, just by the mere fact that they're not, as Dr. Tober points
out, not necessarily done often; however, they're (sic) still vitally
important that those medics have those skills and those abilities to use
them.
It's much the same as if a sheriff here in the district has training
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for shooting his firearm. I --
COMMISSIONER HENNING: But that sheriff is trained by one
staff personnel or one department.
DR. PANOZZO: I beg to differ with that. I think -- I think that's
a hand/eye coordination skill that I think that -- we have a sheriff
sitting here right now, and I think he can tell you a majority of what he
learns when he's at the range is what he experiences with using his
own firearm.
Sure, there's specific protocols that follow. And as an example,
an intubation. This is one of the areas --
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Okay.
DR. PANOZZO: -- where I tend to disagree with Dr. Tober.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Okay. Can you stop there?
DR. PANOZZO: Okay.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Let's settle this. The Sheriffs
Department is not trained by, you know, people in other agencies.
Aren't they trained by their personnel?
DR. PANOZZO: I'm using an analogy, sir, in regard to the
frequency of a skill set and not --
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Let me try.
DR. PANOZZO: -- throwing out that skill set because, for
example, the --
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Let me try to give --
DR. PANOZZO: The sheriff isn't using his sidearm in ten years.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Let me try it again. I'm trying to
figure out how ALS personnel, whether it be in the county or whether
it be in North Naples, is going to be trained the same way. How is
that coordination going to happen?
MR. YOV ANOVICH: Commissioner, it's the same protocol.
Everybody has the same protocol. George used to be a trainer for
EMS. He would get the message out for Dr. Tober.
We have an experienced Collier County -- former Collier County
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October 26, 2010
employee who will be one of the trainers. But we'll all be trained on
the same protocol.
It works in other jurisdictions, and you heard testimony from
them where, in Lee County they have the same protocol but several of
the departments have different medical directors. They're able to
coordinate that because they're all trained in the same protocol, and
those medical directors make sure that the paramedics they're
responsible for are properly trained and have the proper skills to
implement that. So that's the uniformity, I think, that you're asking
for.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Correct, absolutely. How would
that coordination take place; what will it look like?
MR. YOV ANOVICH: The way we envisioned our proposal
would be that we would get our COPN (sic), which would -- now we
would hire our medical director, which in this case is Dr. Panozzo.
Dr. Panozzo would coordinate with Dr. Tober on Dr. Tober's
protocols, then Dr. Panozzo would go out and make sure that our
paramedics have the proper training and proper skills to implement the
Dr. Tober protocols. So that's the coordination that would occur
between the two.
And one thing I forgot to mention in my presentation. It's not
like we're not providing ALS skills right now, because we are. Even
though we've been decertified, we're providing hundreds of
procedures a year and hundreds of doses a year because we're working
with your paramedics when we arrive at the scene.
So they are using those skills every day. They're just not using
them alone. So it's not like they have no practical experience because
they're with your paramedics, evaluating the situation at the scene,
providing -- performing procedures, and giving dosage as well.
So there is a lot that's going on, and we will continue to assure
quality control through our medical director coordinating with Dr.
Tober.
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October 26, 2010
COMMISSIONER HENNING: And I heard that well from the
young lady who works for NCH as an ALS paramedic now.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Commissioner Halas?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Dr. Tober, if you could come up to
the mike here for a minute. Obviously you've heard all the testimony
that was here. And if my memory serves me right, even though I'm a
lame duck, I think there was some discussion some time ago about the
number of meds that were put on the fire trucks that weren't needed
because of the fact that they were -- ended up being outdated and
everything else.
And my question is, why do we need another medical director?
DR. TOBER: Well, that question's as much political as it is
practical, Commissioner Halas. I can only circle back and tell you the
following. I have to take my best well thought out judgment as to the
safest way to train people and keep them educated and on the spot.
And a couple of comments. The young woman paramedic who --
I don't know if she still works for non-emergency transport. Those are
patients that are being stabilized at a hospital and transferred to
another hospital under physician orders. I consider that an entirely
different environment than arriving on scene of an unknown entity and
having to make decisions as to what to do. So let's clarify, this is --
these are apples and oranges of environments.
Number two is that we already loan highly trained and very
experienced paramedics to fire departments, all right? We discovered,
they discovered, that they could not maintain their skills just working
on those ALS engines and helping out other EMS paramedics when
they showed up on scene. We had to do it by bringing them back onto
an ambulance two out of every three months.
Again, your commission trusts me to make the best decision
humanly possible, heartfelt as to what is the safest way to run this
system. I use the evidence, I use the evidence of medical literature,
and I use the evidence of what happened when we distributed these
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drugs.
And although no one wants to talk about it, these two drugs are
two edged swords. Some woman here -- or a couple of women here
said they wanted these paramedics to have everything at their
fingertips and be able to use them successfully. In a perfect world, that
would be the perfect thing to do, have everybody perfectly trained and
perfectly experienced, but it doesn't happen.
When we had drugs placed specifically in North Naples, we had
some serious mistakes. And, again, I look at all the evidence on the
table, and I have to make a choice. What am I going to do here? What
is the safest weave of the safety net that every human being in this
community needs?
And my decision was, let's work towards a four minute basic life
support system, let's work then towards delivering ALS in eight to
nine minutes, if at all possible, and work from there.
But we have a system that is disjointed in many respect, not the
least of which we have nine independent fire districts.
So everyone can use yesterday's game to Monday morning
quarterback a better way to do it. But I've got just as much evidence
stating that these drugs are at least as dangerous, if not more so, as
they are lifesaving.
So -- and I remind all of you. I set up a training system for North
Naples. They pulled out of it. I didn't terminate it. They said, we
don't want to do it anymore.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: One last question I have for you,
Dr. Tober. You're in the medical field. Do doctors have to take a
refresher course periodically to make sure that they're still competent
in the surgery or whatever they're performing in?
DR. TOBER: Yes. With the exception of some of the internists
previously certified back in the '70s, almost every specialty has
recertification exams every seven to ten years. But in addition to
recertification exams, to get credentialed at the hospital every year,
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October 26, 2010
you have to demonstrate so many procedures, so many patients, so
much ongoing experience. So it's not a simple one threshold and then
you're good for ten years. It's an ongoing continuous basis issue.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: And this is what you expect out of
our EMS system here in Collier County?
DR. TOBER: I try to emulate the medical system in -- that
hospitals use in EMS, yes.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: And that's why we're as proficient
as we are?
DR. TOBER: Well, that's why we are trying to be as proficient
as we are. You know, I struggle to keep the skills of up of 120 Collier
County EMS paramedics. Adding another 50 or 60 just from one
department would so dilute the ability to keep everybody's skills
where they should be that 1 try to focus certain basic life support skills
in one group and then bring the second tier of ALS in there when it
can be done.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: My final question is, if North
Naples would get back into the system again, then there would be no
problem as far as meeting the requirements in case there is problems
out there and the fire engines get there first, they would perform
whatever life threatening problems would be there with the limited
amount of medications that are put on the truck; is that correct?
DR. TOBER: I think what you're saying is, that if they decided
to opt back into the training program --
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Exactly.
DR. TOBER: -- similar to Marco Island Fire and City of Naples
Fire, could this -- could this happen again? Yes, it could. At this
point in time I want to first wait until the Blue Ribbon Committee
gives at least some data analysis as to what they think we should do,
because it's another big step not only for me but for North Naples to
do that again.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Okay.
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October 26, 2010
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Commissioner Henning?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Let me make a motion, and if it
fails for a lack of second, I'll try to do another motion, but regardless, I
guess, Mr. Chairman, you're -- look for your direction. I f the motion
fails in either way --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: I'm going to leave.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: -- are you going to be open to
another motion?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Yes, I would be, yeah.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Okay. I'm going to make a
motion that we direct the county attorney to work with North Naples
to write the NOCO (sic)--
COMMISSIONER FIALA: COPCN.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: -- COPN (sic) certificate of need
for ALS program and put it on a future board's agenda.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I'll second the motion.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. We have discussion?
MR. YOV ANOVICH: Can we -- do you mind? Mr. Lombardo
-- usually we -- I thought we were following the zoning procedures
when we would wrap up with some closing comments in response to
some of the things that, frankly, were not accurate by some
statements, and we want to point those out. And I would hope -- just a
brief summary by commissioner -- by Commissioner -- I'm not used to
calling you that -- Commissioner Lombardo before you vote on the
motion, if that would be appropriate. I'm just -- because I thought we
were following those procedures, and we didn't do the summarization.
Whatever you --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: It's your petition. Go ahead.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Mr. Chairman, I just ask that we
try to provide factual information. There's a lot of emotion in the
testimony today. I don't make my decisions under emotion.
MR. LOMBARDO: Understood.
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October 26, 2010
Thank you for giving me this opportunity. Chris Lombardo. I am
the chairman of North Naples Fire Control and Rescue District. I have
had the pleasure of serving the district for 16 years. I just was
re-elected unopposed, and thank you for that.
This is an emotional issue, and we understand that. And it has
some very unfortunate situations that creates a lot of tensions between
agencies, and that, quite frankly, we wish we could avoid.
I would encourage you not to do anything that would delay our
request, but instead allow us to proceed forward. And quite honestly,
I fail to see where there's harm in that.
I want to address a couple of points on behalf of the 100,000
people that live in North Naples that I believe should have the benefit
of this program. The first thing I want you to realize is while we
would all love to be able to have doctors on the scene at every
accident, it cannot be done. Not feasible.
And so the net result is that we must find an alternative, and that
alternative comes in the form of a combined team in the ALS
programs between EMS and North Naples Fire when it comes to
North Naples.
So when we're talking about paramedics, the individuals we're
talking about are professionals. They are no different than the
paramedics at EMS. The EMS paramedics are state certified, well
trained, well educated paramedics. So, too, are ours. And as you've
heard, many of them come from Collier County EMS.
The paramedics at North Naples have the opportunity to provide
paramedic services every single day. This isn't a circumstance where
we're talking about putting lay people, my Boy Scouts out there,
performing CPR and whatnot on people. That's not what this is about.
What this is about is having trained professionals, educated,
experienced, and certified professionals providing the services which
they do every single day.
Here's the difficulty. Today they must wait until EMS arrives,
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October 26, 2010
and so what you have to do, I believe, is analyze this from the
standpoint of your ordinance and how we should approach this.
But you've heard a lot of interesting things. And I, quite frankly,
pause, because one of the things I heard today from Dr. Tober was that
many times the North Naples Fire paramedics have administered
drugs inappropriately. Quite -- on the contrary, we have received one
complaint that I'm aware of -- and I've been on for 16 years -- from
Dr. Tober from the Office of Medical Director with regard to what he
alleged to be an improperly administered medication. That's before
the state right now, and we don't have a response yet. 1 don't consider
that many circumstances.
We don't have a situation where we have a crisis in that regard.
You have paramedics in EMS who have made mistakes as well.
I also think it's interesting, and I want to make sure you
understand something. We saw a pattern of our paramedics being
decertified. And like the one paramedic who came before you today,
our paramedics who were working second jobs as paramedics with the
Dr. Tober stamp of approval were being decertified when they were
working with us. So on Monday, Tuesday, Wednesdays working for
North Naples, they're not qualified. They don't have the skill set that
they need to provide the treatment for the residents of North Naples,
but on Thursday and Fridays, a different story. Somehow they
became certified.
And we would suggest to you that while I understand Dr. Tober
suggests that that's an apples/oranges, that riding in the back of an
ambulance in a nonemergency transport is a different animal, there's a
reason why there's a paramedic in the back of the nonemergency
transport ambulance, and it is because -- and I've confirmed this with
our doctor -- it's because those patients, even though they came from
hospital to hospital, are those individuals who are most likely to have
some form of significant event occur in transport. So you need an
experienced paramedic in the back of an ambulance.
Page 1 77
October 26, 2010
Now, they're coming, in certain circumstances, from North
Naples, and it is more than one. It creates a problem for my district
and for me personally when I have to listen to my paramedics come to
me and say, we don't understand this. You can see how emotional this
is for them.
Ask yourself this. What do these -- what are they asking you to
do? They're telling you, we want to save lives. We want to do what
we've been trained to do. These are dedicated serious professionals
who want to be able to do this. And when they sit back and they say,
but wait, I'm certified when I'm doing nonemergency transport for the
hospital but decertified when I'm working for fire, there's obviously
something else going on here. And for them, it is very, very hard for
them to rationalize that, and it becomes even -- it becomes something
tantamount to emotional torture, because as they sit there watching a
patient on the pavement waiting for EMS to arrive, they know what
they're supposed to be doing and they can't, and that is the problem.
Here's what you were told by Mr. Summers. We need to look at
your ordinance, and I kind of took a pause. Your point one, need --
the need to improve current system. So what is the answer to that
questions, the need to improve the current system? Apparently the
answer is, yes, we need to improve it. Dr. Tober has told you that
eight minutes for delivery ofBLS is unacceptable. We have to figure
out how to shorten that.
Fifty-one percent of the time North Naples arrives on the scene
first. And we scaled it all the way down. Chief Cunningham showed
you that at the 3 percent mark, we were still 10 percent out -- ten
minutes out before EMS arrives. That's 199 times in a year. That
means every other day North Naples has paramedics with patients
when EMS isn't there. Every other day. Tomorrow it's going to
happen, and yesterday it already has. And we need to address that.
What Dr. Lee told us -- and while I found Dr. Lee's comments a
little confusing because it sounds like he is a proponent to do away
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October 26,2010
with not just the ALS system but EMS in general, because apparently
what's important is to get the patient from the scene into the hospital
and be done with it and nothing in between.
And I would tell you that I believe it's a little more complicated
than that. That may be true in a cardiac world, but there are a host of
emergencies that go well beyond that.
But if we take Dr. Lee's lead, what we hear is that what's
important is to get these patients to the hospital as fast as possible, and
that means we need to improve the system, which fits in your first
category. Well, the answer is, if we have a team of trained, well
educated certified paramedics at the scene, we need to start ALS
immediately because that means when the ambulance arrives, we can
get them loaded and on their way as fast as possible, achieving the
goal of Dr. Lee. And that makes sense to me.
By the way, they reference a variety of articles. One of them
comes from the annals of emergency medicine. I happen to have
Volume 56, Number 4, October 2010, this month. Improve out of
hospital cardiac arrest survival after sequential implementation of the
2005 AHA guidelines for compressions, ventilations, and induced
hypothermia.
Here's what that same group of doctors said this month. Out of
hospital cardiac arrest is a global public health problem with a pattern
of high incidents and variable rates of survival to hospital discharge
ranging from 1 percent to 20 percent. I would suggest to you that
we're on the high end of that.
The strength of the community response, known as the American
Heart Association's chain of survival, may account for higher survival
rates in some communities. The chain of survival is a community
approach to improving out of hospital cardiac arrest outcomes
comprising four links: Early recognition and access to emergency
medical services, early cardiopulmonary resuscitation, CPR, early
defibrillation, and early advanced cardiac life support, ALS.
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October 26,2010
They're telling us this month we need to do ALS on the scene.
They're also telling us, and we've got to get them to the hospital as fast
as possible. We agree, we agree. That's what we're trying to achieve.
Your next -- your next factor is the effect of proposed service on
the existing system.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: There is none.
MR. LOMBARDO: Right. It's not going to be a negative impact
on your existing system. In fact, it supplements your system. We're
not trying to replace Dr. Tober. We're trying to lessen the burden.
We're trying -- we have the ability to provide our own training. We
have -- we have been providing in house training for years. We
provide training for our other districts as well, by the way . We -- if
we decrease the amount of scene time, we increase the delivery time,
that just improves the system.
By the way, when it comes to Naples and Marco, answer this for
me, how do we justifY having it in Naples and Marco but not in North
Naples? And I would tell you -- and this point was made that we
pulled out of the system. And the answer is correct. After we had
watched many of our paramedics be decertified -- I think we were
down to 19 out of our 54 -- and we watched the demands on our
training increase significantly, such that it would have a significant
impact on our overtime budget, we decided that it made no sense the
way it was structured.
The protocol for training was changing on a regular basis. And I
can tell you, for 16 years I have been wrestling with this issue. We
have met with EMS. We have negotiated a variety of approaches.
We have never been able to achieve that goal, but we also have a
discomfort level that comes that makes it difficult for us.
When we have an issue with EMS and we bring it to the medical
director or to Dan Summers and we present those kinds of concerns,
but the response when they have a concern with us, is that they take it
to the Naples Daily News. It's a problem.
Page 1 80
October 26, 2010
CHAIRMAN COYLE: You promised me this was going to be a
brief summary.
MR. LOMBARDO: And it is.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Who's clock are you using?
MR. LOMBARDO: I'm just laying them out there for you.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: You've got to remember he's a
litigator.
MR. LOMBARDO: The overall cost on the EMS is your next
category. I would suggest to you the answer is zero. And in fact, this
concept that somehow we're driving up their expense I don't
understand. But I would tell you this much, that it's my understanding
that last year the overtime for EMS was over $4 million.
Now, I would suggest to you that if we can cut and shorten the
window of time that a patient sits on the ground waiting for EMS, then
we can shorten the amount of time you have your EMS staff, and that
should result in actually an overtime saving for you. And so not only
would I tell you that it's a zero impact, it's a benefit.
The effect on existing hospital. Faster delivery, the hospitals
aren't going to complain. Better services, same quality of services, no
complaint. Effect on existing personnel. I'm going to tell you that the
effect on existing personnel would actually be a beneficial one. And
that, by the way, I believe, means both personnel. Not only yours, but
ours.
Here is the good news. The good news in the field is that our
personnel and EMS personnel have one common goal, and that's to
save lives, and they work together in the field. It's only us that have
this problem.
(Applause.)
MR. LOMBARDO: So I would tell you that if we could stop
this, the effect on personnel in both categories would be positive. And
the answer is a simple one, which we have proposed. Sufficient
knowledge and experience of the personnel -- of the proposed agency.
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October 26, 2010
I don't think I need to go into great detail, but clearly we have a very
qualified group of paramedics who are certified, educated, well
trained, and we're willing to provide and commit to a training program
that meets or exceeds that what Collier County does with its own
paramedics.
Adequate -- adequate financial base. The -- we have the financial
ability to do this with zero impact to our district. It makes sense. This
is resource management. If! can hire a firefighter -- that's one thing.
If I can hire a firefighter who's also a paramedic, isn't that good
business? I get a resource that I can use for multiple purposes. I have
to have paramedics.
And so we have the financial ability, and I'm proud to say, and
you well know, that North Naples happens to be one of the most
fiscally sound political entities in this area. And so we have that
ability right now to handle it. That is not going to be a problem.
Sufficient personnel. We have 54 paramedics. We have
sufficient personnel.
Here's what I think is odd. Here's what I think is the anomaly.
What's missing from your lack -- your list of factors, what's -- the
element that seems to be the one that should be first but isn't even on
the list is the benefit to the residents of the community.
(Applause.)
MR. LOMBARDO: And you cannot argue -- and I've listened to
Dr. Lee and I don't understand the less is more approach. I would tell
you that less is more may mean more overtime for your paramedics
because we're overworking them, but I would tell you less is more
doesn't make sense.
And you have to -- at the end of the day -- and you know, I've
spent 30 years arguing cases in the court rooms of this very county. I
would tell you, I tend to lead with common sense. If -- if you can't
look at it from a common sense perspective and make it add up, then
there's something wrong there.
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October 26, 2010
I don't agree with a less is more. We have residents here who
could -- would benefit from this and would receive, you know, a great
service from this community being allowed to do it in the format that
we've set forth. There's no reason not to do that.
Now, in conclusion, I mean, I look at this and I think we have a
system that -- I know, you're excited about that.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: That's what you said 30 minutes ago.
MR. LOMBARDO: I beg to differ. I never said in conclusion.
That was Mr. Y ovanovich. And sorry to say, he was terrible wrong
about the fact that I would be brief.
But then if you'd come to one of my commission meetings, you'd
see that I'm not particularly brief either.
At any rate, we're not asking to do anything other than
supplement what's happening in this county. We can afford to do this.
It is the right thing to do. We have dedicated professionals who -- and
I'm -- I have to tell you, I find it offensive that the debate seems to
revolve around the fact that they don't have the ability. They don't
have the ability.
You look in their eyes and you tell that dedicated crew of
professionals that they don't have the ability to provide this service.
They do it every day.
Now, we need to stop this battle, and we need to simplify it. And
I'm telling you, after 16 years of analyzing and wrestling with this
issue, the answer now is a simple one, allow us to have the certificate
and allow us to put forth our own medical director. We will follow
the protocol, we will provide the training, and we will provide the
service, and we will protect your residents.
That's all we're asking.
(Applause.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: It's the last time you get anybody to
make a closing statement.
MR. YOV ANOVICH: That was brief.
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October 26, 2010
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Maybe for him, but not in our standards.
MR. YOV ANOVICH: You should see him preach on Sunday.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Let me --I'm the only one who
hasn't had a chance to talk, so let me give you a closing statement,
okay?
MR. LOMBARDO: Please be brief.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: All right. I will.
There are a couple of things I don't think we've reached
agreement on. I don't think we even have a meeting of the minds here,
and so I want to demonstrate to you what my fundamental problem is.
Now, I want you to look into my eyes, okay. I've been flying
airplanes longer than most of the people in this room have been alive.
I have a commercial multi-engine instrument, instructor ratings. How
good a pilot am I?
MR. LOMBARDO: You're only as good as what you did
yesterday. If you're not flying at least two to three times a week --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: You bet, you bet.
MR. LOMBARDO: I understand that.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Now, if I don't fly a specified
number of instrument approaches and holding patterns and landings
and night landings, I can't fly anymore.
MR. LOMBARDO: And that's why we agree on what should be
done here.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay, okay. Now, what I see missing in
this process is that you have not defined how you're going to solve
that problem.
What I see happening is a desire for a group of young dedicated
employees to try to get as many certifications as they can because they
want to be good at what they do, but it also gives them $7,000 a year
more money. And if that drives the desire to become a paramedic,
then what you're not -- you're ignoring is how many procedures you
expose those people to and how frequently they get a chance to
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October 26, 2010
perform those procedures.
You have not mentioned that, nor has Dr. Panozzo mentioned
that. So that is a missing element in making this decision.
I am not convinced that more is better. Ifwe had 1,000 brain
surgeons here in Naples, would I want to go to one of those brain
surgeons? They probably don't get enough practice each year to
remain proficient, unless they're working on County Commissioners.
So I think that --
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Lame duck ones.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Lame duck ones. So more is not better.
Let's cut through the BS. More is -- no, no, no. You've had -- you've
had your closing argument. Now let me give you mine, all right.
If you want to reach agreement on this, we need to get to those
issues. We've got to quit dancing around them.
And the other thing is, what I've heard is that North Naples is the
ice breaker. Ice breaker for what? What we're saying is you want to
fragment the EMS system in Collier County. Ifwe grant a COCPN
(sic) for North Naples, who's the next one who's going to want one?
East Naples is going to want one. Or are you going to do it for East
Naples maybe?
So it becomes fragmented and we don't have a unified EMS
system in Collier County anymore. We have to resolve that. I don't
know what the answer is.
Now, let's be clear about this political issue. Nine years ago
when I met with the then fire chief in North Naples, I thought I was la
la land. There has been conflict with North Naples for as long as I
have been here. It forced us to change the director of EMS many
years ago. We did that because the fire chiefs didn't like who we had
doing the job.
Well, now you don't like the people we've got doing the job now,
and I'm not sure we're ever going to solve that problem.
So, yeah, there is a political issue, and it is not really here at the
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October 26, 2010
Board of Commissioners. We have tried to get you to take over the
entire EMS by consolidating, and you won't do that. In fact, some of
the districts have just put up roadblocks to keep it from happening.
North Naples, I think, has been interested in seeing that happen.
But if you were to find a way to consolidate the fire districts into
one, the commissioners already told you, you could have EMS.
Consolidate under one organization that's separate from Collier
County Government, and you guys would be real happy and you do
what you do.
But these are the questions that I have that are related to this
problem, and so I can't vote for this motion because those questions
have not been answered. There has been no agreement on them. In
fact, there has been no recognition that those issues even exist or that
they are problems. So that is a real, real big issue for me.
And secondly, the motion will not resolve the issue. It means it
will come back and we'll do the same thing we've done here today.
We'll spend all afternoon listening to people tell us why we should do
something, and we'll get all emotional, and we won't have the
information we need to do the job.
But if -- we do have -- the Slue Ribbon Committee will be
coming before us. But please remember, they've already said and
we've already agreed and endorsed a two tier system. That's already
been done. Unlike what Mr. Aguilera says, that has already been
approved by this commission. So that is the preferred model at this
point in time. So we're going to have to deal with that. And for that
reason, I can't vote for the motion. But I'll call the motion.
All in favor of the motion, please signify by saying aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: All those opposed, like sign?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Aye.
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October 26, 2010
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: So it fails, 2-3.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Mr. Chairman, could I make a
subsequent motion --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Sure.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: -- of accepting staffs
recommendations?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Yeah, of course you can.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Okay.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: I'll second that.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. The motion by Commissioner
Henning, seconded by Commissioner Halas.
Let me ask a question. Would there be interest in taking a look at
our decision again after the Blue Ribbon Committee makes its
recommendation?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: That could be a subsequent
motion.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Yeah, okay. All right. Okay. Let's vote
on the first one first then.
All in favor of the motion to accept staffs recommendation of
denial, please signify by saying aye.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Aye.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Any opposed, by like sign?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. It passes 4-1, with Commissioner
Fiala dissenting.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Let me just say. You know, I would
really like to hear from the Blue Ribbon Committee. I would have
made that motion had I been able to do that, but that's all right. You've
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October 26, 2010
got the motion. You've got four votes, but I would like to hear from
them.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: And we will.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Yeah. That was what Commissioner
Henning said. He said that can be a subsequent motion if you'd like to
do that, so --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Well -- but you've already voted to
deny it.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Well, yes, but you can take a look at the
Blue Ribbon Committee's recommendation.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: And then go back and relook at it?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: And refine what it -- refine whatever
decision you've made.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: All right. Then I do make that
motion that I would like to hear from the Blue Ribbon Committee.
And you know what, before we go any further --
COMMISSIONER HENNING: I'll second that.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: -- I want to just say, this isn't about
how great EMS is. Those people work so darn hard. And it isn't great
-- it isn't anything about how great the paramedics are here, because
they work so hard. Everybody is hard working.
This is trying to make a decision at this higher level, and it's
about a struggle for power, actually and -- and I'm just going to say
that right out.
But maybe the Blue Ribbon Committee can unravel this thing
and give us a recommendation that we can then look at and possibly
make a future decision on.
So I will make that motion.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Yeah. And for those who don't follow
the Blue Ribbon Committee, it is not a committee appointed by us.
They're not ours. They are a committee that was formed from a group
of concerned citizens who said, we're going to study this issue, and
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October 26, 2010
we're going to make some recommendations to you. And so that's
what they've been doing. They said they'll have that report sometime
in December. It will probably be January by the time we get it, but
we'll take a look at it.
So the motion is to take a look at the Blue Ribbon Committee
and refine whatever decisions we need to make at that point in time,
and so --
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Is there a second?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Coletta.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: It's a second already by Commissioner
Coletta.
All in favor, please signifY by saying aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Aye.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Any opposed, by like sign?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. That motion passes unanimously.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Take a break.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Yes. We're going to take an hour and a
half break. We'll be back here at 4:35.
(A brief recess was had.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Ladies and gentlemen, the Board of
County Commission meeting is now in session.
Thank you very much.
And where do we go from here, County Manager?
Item #8A
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October 26, 2010
ORDINANCE 2010-41: AMENDING CHAPTER 74 OF THE
COLLIER COUNTY CODE OF LAWS AND ORDINANCES (THE
COLLIER COUNTY CONSOLIDATED IMP ACT FEE
ORDINANCE) PROVIDING FOR THE INCORPORATION BY
REFERENCE OF THE IMPACT FEE STUDY ENTITLED THE
COLLIER COUNTY EMERGENCY MEDICAL SERVICES
IMPACT FEE STUDY UPDATE, DATED SEPTEMBER 30, 2010,
AND THE COLLIER COUNTY 2010 FIRE/RESCUE SERVICES
IMP ACT FEE UPDATE STUDY OCHOPEE AND ISLES OF
CAPRI FIRE CONTROL AND RESCUE DISTRICTS;
AMENDING THE FIRE IMP ACT FEE RATE SCHEDULE,
WHICH IS SCHEDULE FIVE OF APPENDIX A, IN
ACCORDANCE WITH THE FINDINGS OF THE UPDATE
STUDY; AMENDING THE EMERGENCY MEDICAL SERVICES
IMP ACT FEE RATE SCHEDULE, WHICH IS SCHEDULE
SEVEN OF APPENDIX A, AS SET FORTH IN THE UPDATE
STUDY, WHICH PROVIDES FOR A REDUCTION IN RATES;
PROVIDING FOR ADELA YED EFFECTIVE DATE OF
NOVEMBER 1,2010 FOR THE AMENDED EMERGENCY
MEDICAL SERVICES IMPACT FEE RATES AND A DELAYED
EFFECTIVE DATE OF JANUARY 24,2011 FOR THE
AMENDED FIRE IMP ACT FEE RATES, IN ACCORDANCE
WITH THE 90-DA Y NOTICE REQUIREMENTS OF SECTION
163.31801, FLORIDA STATUTES, WHICH IS THE FLORIDA
IMP ACT FEE ACT - ADOPTED
MR.OCHS: Commissioners, that takes us to Item 8A, advertised
public hearings. It's a recommendation to adopt an ordinance
amending Chapter --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: 8A?
MR.OCHS: Yes, ma'am -- adopting an ordinance amending
Chapter 74 of the Collier County Code of Laws and Ordinances,
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October 26, 2010
commonly referred to as your Consolidated Impact Fee Ordinance.
And Commissioners, we're updating three impact fee studies
here, your Emergency Medical Services impact fee and your impact
fees in your two dependent fire district, Isles of Capri and Ochopee.
And Ms. Amy Patterson will take you through or answer your
questions.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: You know, I read this whole thing.
And this is so well written and explains it so clearly, I make a motion
to approve.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Second.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: I couldn't agree more.
Now what was this about again?
They're all going down, by the way, so -- all of the rates are
going down.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Just except one.
MR. OCHS: Except for the commercial rate in Ochopee.
MS. PATTERSON: In Ochopee. One category's going up.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Well, they've only got one commercial
building, so you can't do anything about it.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Anything she's got to put on the
record?
MS. PATTERSON: No.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: No, okay.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. A motion by Commissioner Fiala
for approval, a second by Commissioner Halas.
Any further discussion?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: All in favor, please signify by saying
aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Aye.
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October 26, 2010
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Any opposed, by like sign?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: The motion passes unanimously.
MS. PATTERSON: Thank you.
MR. OCHS: Thanks, Amy.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Wonderful presentation though,
folks.
Item #IOE
BID #10-5594 NORTH COLLIER RECYCLING DROP-OFF
CENTER TO T A YLOR-P ANSING INC. IN THE AMOUNT OF
$1,412,385 FOR CONSTRUCTION OF THE NORTH COLLIER
RECYCLING DROP-OFF CENTER AT THE NORTH COUNTY
WATER RECLAMATION FACILITY, PROJECT #70013-
APPROVED
MR.OCHS: Commissioners, we move back to Item 10 on your
agenda. We're on Item 10E. It's a recommendation to award bid
number 10-5594, North Collier Recycling drop off center to
Taylor-Pansing, Inc., in the amount of$I,412,385 for construction of
the North County recycling drop off center at the North County Water
Reclamation Facility.
Mr. Rodriguez is here to answer questions or make a presentation
at the board's pleasure.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: I just have two questions.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Go ahead, Commissioner Henning.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: When did this go out to bid?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: September 18th.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: And when did you receive all
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October 26, 2010
your permits for construction?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Actually, Commissioner -- for the record,
Dan Rodriguez, your Solid Waste Director.
The permits are in process. They're ready to be issued once we
get the approval for the Site Development Plan and an ERP permit
from FDEP, which will be within two weeks.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: ERP permit from FDEP?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Correct. They're reviewing it now.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: What are they reviewing it for?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: They are reviewing the Site Development
Plan for the facility.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Okay. The Site Development
Plan is not complete?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: It's in process. Once we -- hold on one
second. I'll have --
MR. HANCOCK: Commissioners, Tim Hancock with Davidson
Engineering. We are working with URS on this project.
The Site Development Plan is in its --
COMMISSIONER HENNING: URS.
MR. HANCOCK: It's got two outstanding issues. We have
addressed them with county staff, and we are awaiting the FDEP
approval on the ERP permit. Once we get that we'll go back in, and--
we should be in two to three weeks, have the SDP approved and ready
to go.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Just that I was told yesterday all
those things -- SDP was approved and all permits --
MR. HANCOCK: I will tell you that confusion may be, in part,
our responsibly, because we have received a lot split and an SDPI that
has been approved, and the building permit was -- we anticipated
being done by now. But the ERP permit, which is really just for water
management, it's an amendment process. That has to go to FDEP, and
that's really kind of the holdup right now.
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October 26, 2010
We expect it to be issued within the next two weeks though.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: The only questions I have.
Thank you.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Commissioner Halas?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Can Nick say where we are? Do
we have any issues with the fire or anybody else in this issue?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Well, we didn't until today.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: They've redenied (sic) it. No, sir.
In the building permit, it's a bubbler that they want to change out,
so the fire's already signed off, so there's no issues there. So they're
minor changes, but they use -- typically an engineer or private firm
can go out to bid when they're at first and end goal, so it's not an
atypical process to do that. They've seen that.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Thank you. I'd like to make a
motion that we approve the construction contract on this.
And we heard some interesting -- some interesting items from
Dan Rodriguez this morning when he was asked, how come we didn't
have a gold on some of these issues. And looking at this nationwide,
the deal was that we ended up with a gold for a recycling center down
in Marco Island, and I think we should move forward on this because I
think it's a great thing to also try to save our landfill as much as we
can.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: And I'll second that motion.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Motion by Commissioner Halas
to approve, second by Commissioner Fiala.
Any further discussion?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: All in favor, please signifY by saying
aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Aye.
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October 26, 2010
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Any opposed, by like sign?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: It passes unanimously.
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Thank you, Commissioners. If I could just
add quickly to thank all the people in the process, the procurement
staff, Scott Johnson, who did an excellent job, as well as the County
Attorney's Office for the quick review, but also Nick and his team did
an excellent job in providing feedback to us, and we have a very good
project at best value. Thank you.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Thank you for all your hard work
also. This is -- this is great for the citizens up there in North Collier
and out in the Estates area.
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Thank you.
Item #10F
COUNTY MANAGER OR HIS DESIGNEE TO PREPARE AN
APPEAL TO THE PROPOSED FEMA FLOOD MAPS BY
AUTHORIZING THE COUNTY'S CONSULTANT TO REMODEL
AND PROVIDE MORE CURRENT FLOOD MAPS FOR TWO OF
THE TWELVE BASINS AT A COST NOT TO EXCEED $75,000
AND TO PROCESS THE NECESSARY BUDGET
AMENDMENTS - MOTION TO APPROVE STAFF'S
RECOMMENDATIONS - APPROVED
MR. OCHS: Commissioners, that moves us to Item 10F on your
agenda.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay.
MR.OCHS: It's a recommendation to direct the county manager
or his designee to prepare an appeal to the proposed FEMA flood
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October 26, 2010
maps by authorizing the county's consultant to remodel and provide
more current flood maps for two of the 12 basins at a cost not to
exceed $75,000, and process necessary budget amendments.
Mr. Casalanguida?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. I have a question, Nick.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Sure.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: In the executive summary you're saying
that if you model these two basins, there's a chance that it might help
some neighborhoods, but it will probably make things worse for other
neighborhoods. So the net effect is probably not going to be positive.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: That's correct.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Now -- but then you say that if
we modeled the basins closer further west, that a one foot difference
could make things better for those people?
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Closer to the riverine areas, that's
correct.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. So why are you recommending
we spend money in an area where it's not likely to have a net positive
effect and ignoring the people where the net possible effect is
possible?
MR. CASALANGUIDA: For accuracy, sir. And I'm going to
take you through this.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Oh, accuracy is only good if it benefits
the people.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Very true, very true, but --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. I've gone through this process for
12 years now, and I'm reluctant to spend more money on a project that
says right up front, you know, you spend $75,000, and it's not going to
do any good.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Well, Commissioner Coyle, I'll be
honest with you. Probably it's -- the frustration you have, I'd multiple
it by ten and that's what I'm dealing with, with FEMA.
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October 26, 2010
To start off with, it's a federally mandated process that they've
put us through. Part of the county never had a flood zone
determination in the eastern part. They were defined as X and D,
mostly the Estates area.
So think about this. We started this process ten years ago with
2001 lidar data, and it was certified in 2003. Then we go through this
incredible growth period, and liken it to a bathtub where, you know,
for the next ten years you're putting things in the bathtub, yet you
were using the information from the prior ten years to develop these
models.
And I kind of laughed with Stan Chrzanowski last night in
talking about this engineering calculation where we certifY the
accuracy to a foot and with elevations certified to the tenth of a foot.
This effort has been a daunting task.
So why am I here bringing this forward to you? Because in the
Estates, and even in the urban Estates, you have new base flood
elevations that people are counting on. And we just got handed the
letter -- I think Mr. Ochs presented it to me -- with a 90-day appeal
period that's coming forward right now.
So I'm left with this challenge. We have a 90-day appeal period.
I certainly don't want to remodel this. I have ten-year-old data that's in
front of me. So we talked with internal staff and we said, what two
basins -- and I'm going to take you through a couple pictures that will
give you a little information, will provide the most benefit to an idea.
Those are all the 12 basins you're looking at right now on the
viewer that are there. And what we're proposing are these two basins
right here. And as you can see, they make up a bulk of the urban area
going east, and pretty much the urban -- the urban -- the rural -- urban
Estates and a large chunk of the rural estates -- urban and rural estates.
The consultant, Tomasello, can only do two if we were going to
go forward with doing this, because for the -- and during the appeal
period, he can probably only manage those two. Those two would
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October 26, 2010
give us a pretty good picture of what would happen to the area where
there's been a bulk of development.
And in that green area -- I'm going to overlap it with another
slide. I'll use my mouse here, and if you can see this moving around.
All this yellow was previously X and all this purple was undefined.
So you've got a large area that didn't have a base flood elevation
before, and these two basins -- I'm going to go back one, if I can.
These two basins make up a majority of that that we could get done.
So that's why we're recommending those two basins.
Now, honestly, will it make a lot of difference to those folks
other than giving them a better product? That's the challenge. It may
not and it may. And, you know, I read through a little quip that Stan
and I talked about last night, providing dubious information, quantify
__ unjustifiable or undefinable data through incomprehensible formula
will provide you, you know, results that --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: The right answer.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: The right answer.
So the idea is that we could handle this without doing the study.
So if you said to me, Nick, I want to wait five years until the next
update is due -- because you need to update these maps every five or
__ five to ten years, we could certainly do that.
And I want to inform you what we would do to manage that. We
would make sure that every person, when getting a building permit,
was notified about this one foot discrepancy.
Now, to give you a -- kind ofa measure in terms ofthe county,
Golden Gate Boulevard, where it meets Collier Boulevard, all the way
out to Wilson Boulevard, is five miles. In Collier County that's within
a foot, the elevation. We're one of the flattest, you know, counties on
the east coast.
So, you know, does a foot make a difference? Not for FEMA.
Their tolerance is 2 feet plus or minus. Does a foot make a difference
in Collier County? It does.
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October 26, 2010
So what I'm recommending is to get those two basins done. But
if you say, Nick, let's not spend the money right now, let's put this off
till a later time, I'm going to go about notifying people that we're using
2003 lidar shot in 2001. We have a discrepancy of about a foot, and
those base flood elevations could modulate one foot plus or minus
with the next update. And I will just put them at risk and let them
know what we're up against.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Well, that's the point I'm worried
about.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Uh-huh.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: If you spend the money and then you
find out we've got more people in the flood zone than we had before
and those people did not expect that, they were happy where they
were, then we haven't done a service to our citizens.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Catch-22, because I'll have the
opposite effect, too, with some folks. Some will be in a flood zone
where, with this updated information, they may not be. So that's why,
you know, until they run model, I don't know who's going to benefit.
But the bottom line is, if I run the model, I'm going to be more
accurate than the model I ran before. So it cuts both ways.
Will we be doing this the next five years or so? Absolutely.
You're going to have to remodel these flood -- these basins in order to
get the updated information.
I don't like it any more than you do, sir, and it's a federal process
that's kind of got us in a pickle.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Commissioner Coletta?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Yeah. Nick -- and I brought the
same issues up to Nick, my concerns also.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Sure.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: That was a loss, why the one
area could benefit and the other one is going to -- we don't know,
really don't know what's going to happen in the Estates. We speculate
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October 26, 2010
that some people, right at this point in time, may appear to be safe as
far as their flood insurance or minimal flood insurance, may suddenly
be thrown in a whole new element; is that correct, Nick? Am I saying
this right?
MR. CASALANGUIDA: That's possibly correct. Remember we
talked about the bathtub effect. In those two -- the picture you have
on your screen right now, they're using data that was flown in 2001,
certified in 2003.
We know that that bathtub had a lot more put into it in the last 10
years. So that means that when you typically put things in a bathtub,
water goes up. So it's going to affect people a little different, but we're
saying the grades are actually a foot higher. So rerunning the model
would be -- would get us the more accurate answer.
It's no similar (sic) than putting away money to redo your roof
eventually. You're going to have to do this eventually anyway. You
either budget for it over a course of five to ten years or you pay for it
in a lump sum.
The only reason we brought this forward is because we are now
in the 90-day appeal period. We have Tomasello, Baker, and FEMA
that are all on task, aware of this, they've been working together for
five years. We can get a pretty decent bang for our buck while this is
fresh in everybody's head during this appeal period and get these two
basins done properly.
Now, I'm willing to go with board direction, but I think we'd be
doing you a disservice if I didn't bring this up to you and make you
aware of what the potential impacts are and that 90-day window that
we have, because I can tell you that the citizens wouldn't be happy if I
didn't bring it up, because they brought it up to me.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Well, okay. Let's talk about this
for a minute, Nick.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Sure.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Because, you know, we
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October 26, 2010
represent the residents that live out there in Collier County. And, you
know, the truth of the matter be said, any way we can delay any kind
of expenses coming down from federal government insurance
requirements, we've done. I mean, we carried these things out to the
extreme.
We're looking for exact science, which will never happen. I
mean -- but we get closer and closer to it.
But some of the reasons why we paid for doing the benchmarks
out there for reasons why we kept doing the study over and over
again, kept questioning what took place, they've all taken us to a
period, what, six, seven years down the road where we didn't have to
pay flood insurance. We were able to hold out on our own.
Now the rubber meets the road. We have a -- we have an
element in front of us now, a map in front of us, that could be as much
as a foot off. Of course, that foot off is all elevations out there. In
other words, the low part is one foot higher; the high part's one foot
higher. Where it makes a difference is where it slopes down to the
canal, because the canals (sic) itself, where they've taken the readings
there, I guess they remain true; is that correct?
MR. CASALANGUIDA: They remain true. Sea level and your
water control structures in your canals are all accurate. Those have
not changed, because --
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: So if you live on a street that
drains towards a canal, you very possibly would see a slight difference
of --
MR. CASALANGUIDA: The closer you are --
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: -- of exposure?
MR. CASALANGUIDA: -- to that canal and the control
structure, you probably might do better, because that -- you're talking
about it raising a pancake in the Estates. It goes up all even. It's very
flat. But the closer you are to that slope, you might do better. The
farther you're away to that -- when you're in that flat area, it's going to
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October 26, 2010
be probably a proportional rise. BFE goes up. Ground elevation goes
up.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: And I'll tell you what, this is a
hot potato. No matter which way you go with it, it's going to be
wrong. If you go forward with it and you say, okay, let's do the study
so we got the true accuracy we need, you're going to have people
come back and saying, okay, you just cost me a considerable amount
of money. Five years later I got to do it.
If you don't do it, the question out there they're going to say is,
well, I'm a foot higher if you did the study, so obviously I would have
been better off. Why didn't you spend the 70-some thousand dollars
and go forward with the study?
Let me ask you this, Nick: How critical is it that you have an
answer this time? Can you wait till November the 6th where we can
get it back out to the community and possibly have some more people
show up, or maybe we can get some -- between now and then try to
get a better feel for where we're going? I'm very uncomfortable with
this going either way, to be honest with you.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Sure. Commissioner, I have the letter
that, you know, came from Mr. Ochs' office, and I've been CC'ed on
it. The 90-day appeal period starts November 5th. So if we're going
to do this, it's now. And you can do an update even after the 90-day
appeal period, but they will adopt these maps going forward, and then
it will just be a map update, which FEMA's happy to do as well, too.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Well, let me ask you the
question. And please, you're patience.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: That's all right. If -- and whenever you
finished, just make the motion to approve it, and we'll blame it on you.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: I understand that. I'm not in a
hurry to do that.
Okay. So Nick, what you're saying is the fact that we can go
ahead and say no, don't spend it --
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October 26, 2010
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Right.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: -- not put the appeal in, to go
ahead forward, do the study over a period of time to be able to
evaluate what it is, and then come back five years later.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: You could do that as well, too. You
could direct staff --
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Okay. Then I make a motion
that we reject the spending of the money on this and then have you
come back after the appeal period for this is over with so that we can
go ahead and give serious consideration to authorizing the study being
done. And if we find out the study is a net gain to the residents that
live out there, we'll put through an appeal at that point in time to be
able to bring it forward. If not, we'll hold off till the last minute five
years from now.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Well, five years is not a hard date.
What I would recommend, if you're not going to do this now, then
we'll make a staff sponsored public outreach effort just to make sure
everybody knows what's going on and what they're up against,
especially when they come in for a building permit, and we'll still do
some community outreach through the civic associations and groups.
What I'll probably do is work with the county manager, give you
a five year budget to do these updates over either time or say, you
know, we'll put this off till fiscal year '13 and we'll do it as one shot.
You're going to want to update these maps eventually only for --
the reason is, that bathtub is ten years old, the map of the bathtub, and
you don't want it to be 15 years old with 15 years worth of new
development --
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Well, I understand that, but
what if we do the study, the results of that study is, it's ours to turn in
as we see fit, right?
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Yes.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Okay. So at this point in time
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I'd say don't proceed with the appeal, and then we'll come back and
maybe do the study in the next year or so to be able to see where it is.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: That's fine.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: But what about the coast? What
do we have to do on the coast to be able to make that work?
MR. CASALANGUIDA: You've done -- as part of this -- the
map that's in front of you, you're doing part of the coast. And with the
coast, the sea level has held, and the one foot goes up higher, that
wave velocity zone has now a one foot higher barrier to get through.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Well, I understand that, but how
can we get credit for it?
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Well, you'd have to do the study to
prove that that's the case.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Okay.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Why can't you divide them?
MR. CASALANGUIDA: In terms of -- what do you mean
divide them?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: You can't -- why can't you do the one
that you know is going to have a positive effect now, and the one that
you're uncertain about, do it later?
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Well, even -- when they say in the
executive summary that some will have probably more high likelihood
of a positive effect, you're still going to have some negative effects in
there, too.
So -- and you can do them basin by basin. They're broken out
that way. So you can do them a little at a time.
MR. OCHS: So the question is, why can't we do the one now on
the coast --
MR. CASALANGUIDA: You could.
MR. OCHS: -- if it's generally favorable?
MR. CASALANGUIDA: You could. I could eliminate the
green section.
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October 26, 2010
CHAIRMAN COYLE: All right. Let's split the baby then.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Tan. I pick tan.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. I'll pick tan.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Okay. And my only concern is that
you're getting into the Estates area. They're getting a new BFE. That's
why I think I was more concerned with the green section than I was
the coast. They're, for the first time, getting a base flood elevation.
They never had one before.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Well, yeah. But you don't want to make
it worse for them.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: You know, if you want to do this -- if
you're not going to do this during the appeal period, let me get you
what the impacts would be without, on the fly, of what it would be to
do separate basins. And I can come back, and either -- through a
memorandum for the county manager, give you an update as to what
that would be.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Well, how are we going to prove it then
in time for you to proceed?
MR. CASALANGUIDA: You wouldn't for the appeal period,
but I can do an update outside the appeal period. I can go into FEMA
anytime and say, I've got better data and I want you to update the
maps. The maps will get adopted as-is, and I could say I'm going to up
that section of the map.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Are we hearing we can't split the basins?
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Well, that's why I didn't want to do
that on the fly.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Commissioner Halas?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: I'll wait till Nick gets -- I can get
his undivided attention.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: No. After talking to Bill-- because
we looked at -- these two basins could be done together but splitting
them, he said, won't work. You'd have to do them in basins that
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October 26, 2010
would make sense that are tied together, because otherwise you can
get elevations that don't match.
So these two would work. The rest of it, we could come back
later if you wanted to and just set up a schedule to do an update as we
move forward.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Commissioner Halas?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Okay. You're talking about the
bathtub. You're talking about, we'll have to go back and remodel it in
another five years.
So I'm assuming what you're telling me is that as people build
homes and they raise the pad of their house, okay, and if we get more
people out there that continue to raise the pad of their house, the
people that were -- that built out there five, six years ago may end up
being flooded out; is that what you're trying to tell me?
MR. CASALANGUIDA: That's a -- well, in a --
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Is it because we have a sheet flow?
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Because you've got two things.
You've got your sheet flow and putting things in the bathtub. The
more floodplain you take up, when it rains, that water has to go
somewhere. Now--
COMMISSIONER HALAS: It's a no win situation.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Well, in a flat area that's low water,
you are making it worse. Now, what you do is you -- for planned unit
design development, they keep their water internal, so they manage
their own water. For a single family home it's different--
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Yeah.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: -- and they affect sheet flow. So it is
one of those situations that -- it's a bathtub, and as you keep putting
things in there, that potential rise in flood waters does come up, and
that's an effect you have, because we are such a flat community.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: And so we've got a swamp out
there.
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October 26, 2010
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Commissioners, I'd say that's a true
statement. They filled in a -- they drained the swamp doing the
Estates, and even in parts of the urban area, that would be true.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: So people that have built their
homes, let's say ten years ago, and we said okay, you had to be 10 feet
above flood elevation or let's say 5 feet above flood elevation, so now
we're going to go out there and tell people, oh, by the way, we're not
quite sure of what we have here because we have lidar maps that we
made measurements back in 2003. So now anybody that comes in and
wants to build a house, we're saying, now you're going to have to
build your pad maybe up to 6 feet.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Well, it'd be -- I would say whatever
the base flood elevation is now --
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Whatever the base flood elevation
IS.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: I would say if I was making a
recommendation, I'd say, probably go a foot higher. Just give yourself
a little level of protection.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: So it's 6 feet, so we say, we'll build
at 7 feet. So the poor guy that's built his house at 3 feet, he's going to
end up being flooded out.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Potentially, Commissioner. I mean--
and you know, Collier County, with its vast size and the development
we've seen over ten years, you know what happens as people continue
to build; it impacts that floodplain. Everything would impact that
floodplain model.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: So you're saying that the amount of
homes that were built out there between 2000 and today at 2010 has
already changed the base flood elevation by somewhere between a
foot and 18 inches?
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Well, I would say -- I can't even give
you that number. It'd be between, you know, 9 inches and a foot and a
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October 26, 2010
half, and that could affect the base flood elevations in some areas, that
and a combination of that lidar discrepancy.
And I think if you think of Collier County as, you know, the rural
and urban section -- I've been visiting for 15 years, been coming down
very periodically for ten and living here for six, the amount of
development we've seen in the past ten years, we've got a lot of dirt
that went in and, you know, either blocked sheet flow --
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Yeah.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: -- or filled in some of that bathtub, as
we'd like to call it.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Commission Henning?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Thank you.
The -- you know, the affected area -- one, being out in Golden
Gate Estates -- I was at the Estates Civic Association meeting last
week. They were aware of this. They talked about it. They were not
happy that they give more money to the consultant. But from what I
got is, they were supportive of staffs recommendation.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: They were.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Yes.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Yes. I'm agreeing with you. They've
told me the same thing.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Oh. So I don't understand why
we need to do some more outreach, why we can't make a decision
today.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: You can make a decision today.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Well, I mean -- so I'm going to
make a motion to approve staffs recommendation and see where it
goes.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: And may I discuss that a little
bit with everyone? The information that's being supplied is something
that I don't think they really understood. That's the part I'm having a
problem with. And then when this information comes through and
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October 26, 2010
these maps become available -- so if you put an appeal in before the
6th, or whatever that date is that you have to put it in, then we have to
provide these maps regardless, right? We can't get the maps and find
out that they're going to do us a disservice and withdraw our appeal?
MR. CASALANGUIDA: No. You've got a 90-day window to
put in an appeal. And then at that time, reading through the letter that
FEMA came in today, they'll with- -- as long as it's a scientifically
backed appeal, they'll review the information and make a
determination.
MR.OCHS: I think the question I hear the commissioner asking
is, can you file the appeal, and then as you work through the study, if
you're finding the data isn't delivering what you hoped it would, can
you withdraw your appeal before the 90-day period expired?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Because the civic association
was under the apprehension that they were going to be a net gain.
MR. OCHS: Right.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: And you're going with the idea
that if everything's a foot higher, then you're out of the floodplain,
which isn't necessarily true.
MR. OCHS: That's true, that's correct.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: And I just want to make sure
that I do as little damage as possible.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: I'm having a side -- I'm going to pay
attention to you, Commissioner.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: I'm sorry. I can't hear you.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: I want to pay attention to you, sir. I
think you asked, could we do the study and not submit it; is that what
you're asking?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: That's correct.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: I don't think that'd be ethical. Ifwe
knew the information was actual factual information then say, we're
not going to submit it because it doesn't help certain people, I think it
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October 26,2010
would be -- I think an engineer would have a hard time, or even
FEMA would say, what are you doing?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Okay. So going back to what
we were talking about a moment ago. Ifwe let this appeal period go
forward and do the study without filing the appeal --
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Right.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: -- we can take and evaluate it
and then make an appeal at that time; is that correct?
MR. CASALANGUIDA: It would be different -- if you're out of
the appeal period, it wouldn't be an appeal. It would just be a map
update we'd be filing. So the regular maps would probably go through
the adoption process, then we'd submit a map update for that area, and
it wouldn't be through the appeal process.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Okay. So--
MR. OCHS: The answer's yes, yes. You can file it later.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: So in other words, we really
wouldn't -- what would happen is, is that ifthere is going to be some
savings, it would come a year later. And if there's going to be
increased costs, it could be as much as five years away?
MR. CASALANGUIDA: After we did this study we could
evaluate that, and that's possible, Commissioner. But I'm saying, once
we've done the study and that information is there, I think you'd be
ethically (sic) to put it forward. You know, I don't think you'd want to
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Of course, there's nothing like
the truth to be able to deal with everything up front.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Right.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: People won't be sitting on their
-- standing on their toes trying to figure out what's going to happen
five years down the road. Man, it's just the uncertainty of the whole
thing here.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Well-- and I think the reason we
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October 26, 2010
brought this forward, we knew the appeal period was coming forward.
You know, we said, what's the balance of this foot; what would it
make?
We've got back comments from the consultant, three or four
internal engineers who've said, you know, it depends on how close
you are to riverine area, but it would give us a good look at the other
ten basins as to what the impact would be of the last ten years' worth
of growth, and we'd have a good BFE in the two areas you see right
here.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Based on the --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: You've got to make a decision.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: -- the recommendations of the
Golden Gate Civic Association, I'm going to second Commissioner
Henning's motion.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. A decision has been made.
Any further discussion?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: All in favor, please signifY by saying --
COMMISSIONER HALAS: The decision is that we're going to
spend the money to do the lidar study; is that --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: You betcha.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Okay.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: Spend the money--
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Even though we know it's not going to
do any good. But that's all right. I mean, you know, it's only $70,000,
$75,000 --
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Seventy-five.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: -- you know. Okay.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: I hate to --
COMMISSIONER HENNING: It could be 130 million.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: The last project was multiple millions in
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October 26, 2010
12 years, but that's right.
All in favor, please signify by saying aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Aye.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Any opposed, by like sign?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. We did it.
Item #101
AN AMENDMENT TO AN EXISTING PURCHASE
AGREEMENT WITH EXTENDED POSSESSION RELATED TO
THE V ANDERBIL T BEACH ROAD EXTENSION PROJECT.
PROJECT #60168 - MOTION TO APPROVE STAFF'S
RECOMMENDATIONS - APPROVED
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Now we're going to I, right?
MR. OCHS: Yes, sir, we are.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: That's one that I wanted to move.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: And I agree, and I'll second that.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: And I -- the only thing I wanted to do is
-- you know, this is property that we purchased from a man and his
wife, and the man has just returned from Iraq. We let them stay in the
property for a specified period of time until March of next year, if!
remember correctly.
MR. AHMAD: It's 60 days from the time he asked -- he asked us
for 60 days, sir, and --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay.
MR. AHMAD: Jay Ahmad, for the record. And we gave him 60
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October 26, 2010
days, and now he comes back and tells us 60 days is not okay, so
we're extending it for a year.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: He wants to go longer, and we're
extending it for a year.
MR. AHMAD: Correct.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: But then we're going to charge him
$2,000 a month to try to push him out. All I want to say is, if we don't
need the property at that point in time, I would just encourage the staff
to be a little more flexible in dealing with them. If they can't move
somewhere else and haven't found another place to move, don't
penalize him because he's spent six months or a year in Iraq, okay?
MR. AHMAD: Absolutely, sir.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: So all I would ask you to do is, if you
don't need to start construction at that point in time, just use a little
judgment and maybe be flexible with respect to another month or so
extension. That's all I'm asking.
MR. AHMAD: We'll do exactly that, sir. Ifhe comes and asks
us for an extension again, we will be accommodating.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay, all right. That was fine.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Then do you want to make a motion
to approve?
MR.OCHS: Please.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Oh, yeah. I'll make a motion to approve,
but I've got two --
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Second.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: -- people. Who was first?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Let Henning go first.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: The second, the motion to
amend the contract to have additional -- how many extensions?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Well, actually, I would make a motion, if
you wouldn't mind -- if you wanted to make one -- to approve the
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October 26, 2010
staffs recommendations but just to provide guidance that if the people
ask for another extension and we don't need the house at that point in
time, that we're not going to be starting road construction or anything,
that we be reasonable rather than charging him a punitive rent. That's
all I'm asking. Okay.
MR. AHMAD: We would have to come back again -- to you,
again, sir, for extending that agreement as well.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay, all right.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: I'll second that motion.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay, okay. Commissioner Coletta, do
you have any more?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: No, that covered it.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Then all -- there's a motion by me, and
it's seconded by Commissioner Henning.
All in favor, please signify by saying aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Aye.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Any opposed, by like sign?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: It is approved unanimously.
Item # IOJ
GRANT RELATED EXPENDITURES IN EXCESS OF $50,000
FOR REAL PROPERTY ACQUIRED UNDER THE
NEIGHBORHOOD ST ABILIZA TION PROGRAM TO FUND
REHABILITATION ACTIVITIES. FUNDING WILL ENSURE
COMPLIANCE WITH COLLIER COUNTY BUILDING CODE
REGULATIONS AND FURTHER THE GOALS AND
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October 26, 2010
OBJECTIVES OF THE HOUSING ELEMENT OF THE GROWTH
MANAGEMENT PLAN - APPROVED
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Now, the next one is J, moved from
16D2. I pulled that one also, and here's the reason. We're getting
grants and we're buying properties that are generally foreclosed
properties, and we are rehabilitating them, and then we're trying to sell
them.
I don't think we should ever have been in that role as the
government. And what we have here is a case where we failed to
understand the extent of the renovations, and so we got in over our
heads. We got a lot more money to invest in this than we thought we
should have.
I believe that we have to -- have to approve this, because I don't
know of any way to extricate ourself from the situation. But what I'm
asking the board to do is to give consideration to saying this is it. If
we get grants to buy bankrupt and abandoned homes, we ought to give
those grants to the private sector and let them take the risk on building
them and selling them, so -- with, of course, a return to us based upon
the grant refunds.
So that's what I'm saying. We don't need to be in the business of
renovating homes. There are other people who are more experienced
at it, and I'd rather see them take the risk in these things than have our
taxpayers take the risk.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: I'd like to hear staffs side.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: No. She's not permitted to speak on
things. You know --
MS. KRUMBINE: Because I'm not tall enough?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: No, no. It's just a matter of, when I pull
things, I pull them with the intent that there's not going to be any
rebuttal.
MR. DeLONY: Good thing we know that now.
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October 26, 2010
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay, go ahead. Violate my rules.
MS. KRUMBINE: For the record -- it's 5: 17. For the record,
Marcy Krumbine, Director of Housing, Human, and Veteran Services.
Commissioner, this is a Neighborhood Stabilization Program, the
program that we got $7.3 million to buy abandoned and foreclosed
properties.
I can take you back to -- I'll lose time right now -- December of, I
believe it was, 2008 where I bought -- brought the best of the minds of
Collier County in a room from purchasing, County Attorney's Office,
the clerk of finance, Crystal, was in the room with her staff.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Well, no wonder we're way over budget.
MS. KRUMBINE: Do you have a -- no, she doesn't have a mike.
She's being quiet. Good job over there.
MS. KINZEL: I could --
COMMISSIONER HALAS: You're digging yourself a big hole.
MS. KRUMBINE: Real property. And we talked about how--
how are we going to spend this money? What is the most efficient --
the best way to spend this money, an d an 18-month deadline.
And we agreed that Collier County, through the staff of all those
different departments, did have the expertise and the ability to spend it
in the most efficient manner. And that's why, Commissioner, you got
a letter congratulating you that we were one of the few municipalities
that met the deadline and obligated the money on time, and we
purchased 70 properties.
So what we find, as we work together, is that we have greater
controls. And when you subrecipient it out, as you're suggesting,
you're asking a nonprofit to front that money. And, quite frankly, they
do not have the money to front, and they do not have the wherewithal
to -- to administrate a program like this and get the dollars expended,
and then HUD would just take the money back.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Are you telling me that Habitat for
Humanity doesn't have the capability to do this?
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October 26, 2010
MS. KRUMBINE: Habitat for Humanity got $9.9 million, and
they've closed on maybe a couple of houses, and they've got their
pockets full right now.
And for them to expend additional funds to wait for the county to
give it back to them, I think that it's -- I think that they wouldn't be
jumping at the chance at all. They have $9.9 million.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: How much money have you spent and
how much money do you have left?
MS. KRUMBINE: We spent it all. We spent 7.---
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Typical government organization.
MS. KRUMBINE: And we did it on time. And we've got the
money coming back because we're reselling the houses. So it's a fund
-- a revolving fund that keeps on going.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Can you give us a report on the financial
MS. KRUMBINE: I'd be happy to.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: -- situation?
MS. KRUMBINE: We provide one once a month, and I'll be
happy to give you an updated report on where we're at.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: A consolidated report that --
MS. KRUMBINE: Absolutely. One page. How's that?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: -- summarizes all the money that was
expended and how much we've gotten back as a result of it.
MS. KRUMBINE: Be happy to do that. And, you know -- and
since I'm getting the microphone to rebut, I want to talk a little bit
about the house and going over $50,000. And one of the things that
you all directed me on, which we were very eager to do is not compete
with the regular market.
So we actually go out and buy, for the lack of a better phrase, the
dogs, the houses that a person who wants to get in to buy a house, a
homeowner, they don't have the wherewithal to put all that money in
to rehab it. We do have the grant money to do it. And the whole
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October 26, 2010
purpose of this is to stabilize a neighborhood and bring neighborhoods'
streets up.
I mean, Commissioner Henning, we're doing whole streets in
Golden Gate City. Commissioner Fiala, we've got one whole street in
East Naples where we bought five or six properties, and it's going to
make a heck of a difference on that street.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Let me jump in and say, because
you're upgrading them, right?
MS. KRUMBINE: Yes.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: And making them a better place to
live and making the neighborhood better rather than continuing to
keep it very low income. I love that.
MS. KRUMBINE: Yes. And so, if we go over, it's because--
you know, like I -- you know, my administrator says, Marcy, you're
not supposed to go over. Would you stop bringing things to the board.
So I go to my staff and say, why do we keep going over? And they
say, because you keep buying them like this and -- because that's what
we're doing is we're buying the ones in the worst shape because we're
making a difference with them.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Do you have any more money?
MS. KRUMBINE: That's a -- how did I do for my rebuttal?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Do you have any more money?
MS. KRUMBINE: I always have money because it keeps
coming back. We sell houses and the money came back. So I have a,
I think, about 6- or 700,000 right now of money from resales. But I've
got about 50 houses that I'm going to sell. And then we -- the portion
of the money keeps coming back, and we do it again.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Typical--
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Tax base.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Typical government.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Marcy?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Performance is based on how fast you
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October 26, 2010
can spend the money.
MS. KRUMBINE: I only follow the rules.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: There's a time limit to spend it,
right?
MR.OCHS: No. Yeah, that was part of the grant requirement;
you had to spend it in 18 months.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Commissioner Coletta?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: The positive aspect of this
whole thing is that we're taking abandoned homes out there and
recycling them back into the system.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: We're upgrading them. Remember
that, upgrading them. There's the difference.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Well, they are, right. They're
upgrading them.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Right.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: One of the things, Marcy, and I
wouldn't -- I wouldn't hold it against you if we do, but is there a net
gain or a loss on these homes? I mean, when you get through with the
money we spend to buy them and then what we use to fix them up and
what we sell them for? Just as a balance to be able to find out.
MS. KRUMBINE: There is no net gain. That was actually part
of the grant requirement, too, is that we can't make a profit.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Okay. I understand that. Is
there a net loss or a small loss?
MS. KRUMBINE: Well, there isn't a loss as much as we're
leaving money -- we're leaving down payment or purchase assistance
in the home.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Okay.
MS. KRUMBINE: So people could get a mortgage.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Okay.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Keep up the good work.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Okay.
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October 26, 2010
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Commissioner Henning?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: What color appliances are you
putting in these homes?
MS. KRUMBINE: White.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Good answer.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Motion to approve.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Second.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Second.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Motion to approve by me, second
by -- who was first, Commissioner Coletta or --
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Yep, both.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: -- Commissioner Henning. Okay,
Commissioner Coletta.
Any further discussion?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: All in favor, please signifY by saying
aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Aye.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Aye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Any opposed, by like sign?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COYLE: It passes unanimously.
And we're going to have correspondence and --
MR. OCHS: First public comment on general topics, sir.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Do we have public comment?
MR. MITCHELL: Sir, we've no comments.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay.
MR. OCHS: Thank you.
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October 26, 2010
Item #15
STAFF AND COMMISSION GENERAL COMMUNICATIONS
CHAIRMAN COYLE: All right. Mr. Ochs, do you have
anything real fast? Say no.
MR. OCHS: No, wouldn't dare, sir.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. County attorney?
MR. KLATZKOW: No, sir.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Commissioner Fiala?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: No. This time I'll just let it go.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Good.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I got the evil eye.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: From who? It wasn't me.
Commissioner Halas?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Just briefly. I hope that my fellow
commISSIOners --
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. That's enough.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: -- got the commentary that I
thought was necessary -- and there was a lot of research, and I want to
thank staff for assisting me in getting the necessary information. And I
thought it was done in a manner that needed to get out there for the
public.
But I find that after I submitted it to the Naples Daily News, the
first thing it said was, cut it down to 750 words, and I felt that because
of the content and the depth of the article, that there's no way that I
was going to cut it down to 750 words because it would detract from
the real meaning of what we were trying to accomplish.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Well done, by the way; very
informative.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: So I'm hoping that maybe they'll
take a second look at this. Jeff Lytle, take a second look and --
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October 26, 2010
because I think this is something that needs to be put out there so
people got a better understanding of what we're trying to accomplish.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: May I add that I had also wrote one.
I didn't realize you were writing one. But it's in the Collier Citizen.
Came out on Friday. But I don't know if any of you have ever seen it.
But anyway, I wrote one in there. And they -- they let me put 998
words in there.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: That's nice.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Oh. Well, that's interesting.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Submit to the --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Collier Citizen.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: -- Collier Citizen.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: I'll see what we can do on that one.
Thank you for the suggestion.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Commissioner Coletta?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Yes, sir. I've got two things.
One, we've had a little bit of controversy going on over the RSLA and
the future plans that are out there for the biomedical facility at Ave
Maria and the location for it and whether it would require three votes
or four votes, and I heard arguments both ways on the -- on this
particular issue. One of them being that the -- the fact that the RSLA
has gone through such a long process and certain facts were
recognized in advance, that it would require only a simple majority to
be able to go forward.
Now, the problem is, is that no one's discussing this. And what
I'd like to do with your blessing is have it come back on the next
agenda so we can discuss it and be able to weigh everything that's out
there and be able to make a decision as we go forward.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Sure.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay, yeah. You finished?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Yeah. No, I got one more, but
Commissioner Henning had a comment.
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October 26, 2010
COMMISSIONER HENNING: No, no, no, I want -- on this
item.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: You want him to provide some
information?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: He may.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Commissioner Henning?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: As long as he can hold his
breath for ten minutes. Go ahead.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Commissioner Henning, go ahead.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: There's a process when there is
an interpretation issue with our Land Development Code, and that is
an official interpretation from the planning director, okay? That is a
process that is advertised, our planning director provides their
interpretation, and it's provided to the applicant.
This is the way -- and mind you, this is going to set precedence.
It will set precedence. And I'm concerned of the equal protection of
all zoning issues in Collier County. We cannot provide the -- one part
of county with lesser or more requirements than the other part of the
county.
RSLA (sic), Immokalee, East Naples, when it comes to
affordable housing, you need to treat it equal. If they want -- if the
owners in Barron Collier and Jackson Lab want a lesser requirement
by a simple majority instead of a supermajority, we need to do the
same thing for affordable housing and other zonings in Collier
County. Simple as that. And we always had, in any zoning issue, a
supermajority vote.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I lose them all anyway, so it doesn't
make any difference to me.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: You had another item, or do you want to
continue on that one?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Well, we already gave direction
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October 26, 2010
on this, correct?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: We did? I don't think we did, no. If you
don't mind me making -- weighing in on that.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Well, of course I don't mind.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: I'll tell you, now is not the time to start
cutting corners. Ifwe -- if we implement any unusual or irregular
procedures to deal with this interpretation, I think it's the wrong thing
to do, because it will have the appearance of granting some degree of
favoritism to Barron Collier and/or Jackson Labs.
And I'm only suggesting that whatever we do with that, ifthere's
a disagreement between the county attorney and someone, then
whatever is the legal process for getting it resolved is what we should
pursue. And we really shouldn't create any exceptional circumstances
or procedures to try to get this resolved.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Could we hear from the county
attorney?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Yeah, by all means, yeah.
MR. KLATZKOW: Your problem here is that this is more than
just an ordinance issue. You have a 1967 special act that says that all
your zoning amendments must be by supermajority vote. And I've
had discussions with representatives from Barron Collier on that.
They disagreed with that. They want to show me why I'm wrong. I
said, I'll take a look at it.
But it's been the prior opinion at the County Attorney's Office,
going back a number of years, as well as zoning staff, that these types
of arrangements require four votes.
Now, the board has the power to interpret its own ordinances, but
Commissioner Henning is right, there is a procedure for that. That's a
public procedure. But this is more than just your own ordinance. This
is a special act, and that you don't have the authority to interpret. That
came out of Tallahassee. And that's what -- and that's -- and in my
opinion, that special act is what's going to control this issue, because
Page 224
October 26, 2010
your RLSA ordinance is absolutely silent on this issue. It talks about
SSA designations requiring majority, but SRA designations, it goes
through the procedures, and it doesn't say how many votes are taken.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. What is your recommendation
concerning how to proceed?
MR. KLATZKOW: My recommend- -- at this point in time, my
understanding is that there's an application winding its way through
the system on a map amendment that will be coming to you in
November. At that point in time you will have an opinion from the
county attorney, as well as from staff, we believe how many votes are
necessary .
It's been our prior opinions that it's four, and we try to be
consistent with our prior opinions. Unless we're palpably wrong, then
we tend to go with them.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: If! may?
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Go ahead.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Yes. I appreciate the floor to be
able to finish this out.
We've all received that letter from Allen Reynolds explaining his
position, and he's here today, been sitting here all afternoon. And I'd
like to be able to hear from him to just see if he has any other
suggestions. We -- pretty much of the opinion, sir, that it's not going
to work, but I'd like to hear what you got to say.
MR. REYNOLDS: Thank you. And just to be clear, I'm here
representing the Eastern Collier Property Owners.
And I just want to clarifY a couple of things that were said.
Number one, the issue -- what we have asked the board to do is
schedule time at their next meeting to hear from the Eastern Collier
Property Owners with respect to this issue as it pertains to the entire
Rural Land Stewardship Area.
This is not a Jackson Lab issue. This is an issue that affects
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October 26, 2010
property owners that own 160,000 acres of land in Eastern Collier
County. And those property owners have already designated 55,000
acres of land and have received over 130,000 credits with the
understanding that the rules that are applied to designating a
stewardship receiving area are administered through a different
process and is not a rezone.
So the matter that is going to be coming before the board about
the map amendment for Jackson Lab is not this issue. This is an issue
with respect to designating Stewardship Receiving Area.
So I want to make sure that the board's clear, there is a process to
request an interpretation of the code. That's not what we're asking.
What we're asking the board to do is hear from the Eastern Collier
Property Owners and other interested parties and express their intent
when the program was put in place, because it was everybody's
understanding in Eastern Collier County that the process of
designating a Stewardship Receiving Area was not a rezoning action,
followed a different process, and there is significant amount of
supporting data that supports that position.
So, again, just to be clear, this is not -- this is not us trying to ask
for an interpretation. We understand there's a process to do that. It's
really to get the board to hear from the Eastern Collier Property
Owners and express what their understanding and intents were when
the program was put in place. And we would just appreciate that
opportunity at your next meeting.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: So you're just asking that something be
put on the agenda to inform us or --
MR. REYNOLDS: That's correct.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: -- or is there a petition --
MR. REYNOLDS: There is no petition. It's going to be to
present our understanding of how the program is working and ask the
board to reaffirm what the intention was when the program was put in
place. That's what we're asking for.
Page 226
October 26, 2010
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: County attorney seems a little
bit perplexed.
MR. KLATZKOW: Well, I mean, you know, I'm going --I've
had my staff go through the entire record. The record is silent, silent
as to this issue. And you know, we've gone through the transcripts of
the discussions, everything. It was -- it was never discussed.
And I have asked for the proof, you know, of the intent, and I'm
waiting to get it. And if I can get it, that would be great. That will
help with the analysis.
But to ask the board to say, well, yeah, it was everybody's intent
that it be, at this point in time, majority is the same thing as asking for
a legal interpretation. It's just asking it through the back door.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: May I make a suggestion?
Mr. Reynolds, rather than push the issue about coming back on
the regular agenda, could you come under public petition and see if
that would help to move it forward to a future agenda? I don't know
what else to do, but I'm kind of concerned we don't have enough
support here to be able to even get it on the regular agenda.
MR. REYNOLDS: Well, all I would ask is that the board be
willing to give the Eastern Collier Property Owners the opportunity to
present their position before the Board of County Commissioners at
their next meeting. And at that point the board can decide that either
they -- we have a legitimate issue or we don't, or you can direct us to
go back to through the interpretation process.
We have had conversations with the County Attorney's Office.
We are in the process of preparing some fairly extensive
documentation that we believe backs up our position. But we have,
unfortunately, as I said, property owners who have been working in
reliance upon an understanding of how this program works for the past
seven years that have given up their development rights to receive
credits with the understanding that those credits had marketable value.
Page 227
October 26, 2010
And it's our belief that if we don't get this issue resolved, then a
lot of those property owners are going to have to reconsider whether
or not that was a prudent action for them to take.
So it's -- again, it's an important thing. And the reason for having
it at your next meeting is, frankly, because your next meeting is going
to be the last meeting at which all of the members of the Board of
County Commissioners that were there when this program was put in
place will still be here, and we thought it would helpful to have the
conversation at that point in time.
So we would just respectfully ask your indulgence to allow us to
have that opportunity at your next meeting.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Well, I, for one, don't have any
problem to listen to what they have to say.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: I don't either.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Why would anybody?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: I think we ought to hear their side
of the story because obviously they've given up a lot of development
rights here, and we need to hear their side of the story.
MR. REYNOLDS: We appreciate that very much.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: And while you're at it, when they're
talking about how many development rights they gave up, they could
-- you know, if this -- if this isn't what they thought it was, can they
take them back? That would be an interesting question to have
answered. Being that they've given them up, maybe they need to take
them back again.
MR. REYNOLDS: We will address that.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Ifwe -- if we place -- it looks like we've
got enough nods to put it on the agenda next time, but will you have
information similar to what the county attorney has asked for which
demonstrates why you believe that the intent was different from what
the county attorney --
MR. REYNOLDS: Yes, sir.
Page 228
October 26, 2010
CHAIRMAN COYLE: -- specifies it was?
MR. REYNOLDS: Yes, sir, we will.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay.
MR. OCHS: So this will be scheduled as a county attorney item
or a --
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Public petition.
MR. OCHS: -- BCC item or staff item? I'm not quite sure how
the format of this is going to work.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Put it on a public petition.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: No, that doesn't work. You can't
have other people give testimony during public petition. I was
thinking about that originally, but not to have a couple of people be
able to offer their opinions. So it has to be the agenda. I'll tell you
what, you can put it under the commission part of the agenda under
my name.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. All right.
MR. REYNOLDS: Thank you very much. We appreciate that.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. Thanks. Is that it for you?
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: One last thing, very brief.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: It has to do with the fact that we
have a change of the guard as far as the state offices go. There's
something that's taking place that's a little bit disturbing as far as a
waste of taxpayers' money.
On Friday they're coming in here to empty out the -- Rivera's
office and Grady's office of all the furniture, put it in storage, and then
the following week, when the elections are over, whoever it may be,
they're going to deliver the furniture back.
I don't know -- if anyone facilities or the county can get ahold of
somebody at the state -- it can't be an elected official -- somebody
from their facilities and say, hey, why don't you just wait, and if for
some reason that person doesn't want the office, then come and get the
Page 229
October 26, 2010
furniture, rather than moving it out of the building, putting it into
storage, and then coming back again. It's going to cost hundreds of
dollars for them to do it.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Thousands of dollars.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Thousands of dollars, okay.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Oh, boy. I'm in agreement with
that.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Yeah. Just if somebody could
reach out and touch them just to let them know what's happening.
And if they decide to go ahead --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Look at Leo when you're doing that.
Leo's the guy.
MR. OCHS: Yes, sir. Will do.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: You've got a facilities coordinator who
can deal with that, right?
MR.OCHS: I do, sir.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. You finished?
Commissioner Henning?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Motion to adjourn.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: Second.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Good. All in favor, please say yes.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yes.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Yes.
CHAIRMAN COYLE: Okay. We are adjourned. Thank you
very much.
****Commissioner Halas moved, seconded by Commissioner Fiala
and carried unanimously that the following items under the Consent
and Summary Agendas be approved and/or adopted ****
Item #16Al
Page 230
October 26, 2010
FINAL ACCEPTANCE OF THE WATER AND SEWER UTILITY
FACILITIES FOR MERCATO - W/RELEASE OF ANY UTILTIES
PERFORMANCE SECURITY (UPS)
Item #16A2
FINAL ACCEPTANCE OF THE WATER UTILITY FACILITY
FROM OSPREY POINTE AT PELICAN MARSH
CONDOMINIUM ASSOCIATION, INC - W/RELEASE OF ANY
UTIL TIES PERFORMANCE SECURITY (UPS)
Item #16A3
PARTIAL RELEASE OF LIEN IN THE CODE ENFORCEMENT
ACTION ENTITLED BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
VS. TED ZHI LUO, CODE ENFORCEMENT BOARD CASE NO.
2007-100, RELATING TO PROPERTY LOCATED AT 11580
RIGGS ROAD, COLLIER COUNTY, FLORIDA - DUE TO NO
CODE VIOLATIONS ON THE PROPERTY
Item # 16A4
CHANGE ORDER NO.5 TO THE AGREEMENT BETWEEN
COLLIER COUNTY AND VAN BUSKIRK, RYFFEL AND
ASSOCIATES INC. FOR THE UPDATING OF THE COLLIER
INTERACTIVE GROWTH MODEL (CIGM) AND FOR
CONTINUED INTERACTION WITH THE HORIZON STUDY
OVERSIGHT COMMITTEE - EXTENDING THE CONTRACT
TO SEPTEMBER 30, 2011
Item # 16A5
Page 231
October 26, 2010
RELEASE AND SA TISF ACTIONS OF LIEN FOR FIVE
SEP ARA TE CODE ENFORCEMENT CASES - FOR THE
FOLLOWING CASES: #2007070252, #2007080695,
#20080007331, #20090002302 AND #2003101183
Item #16A6 - Moved to Item #101 (Per Agenda Change Sheet)
Item #16A7
EASEMENT AGREEMENT FOR THE PURCHASE OF A ROAD
RIGHT-OF-WAY, DRAINAGE AND UTILITY EASEMENT
(PARCEL 1 344RDUE) REQUIRED FOR THE VANDERBILT
BEACH ROAD EXTENSION PROJECT. (PROJECT NO. 60168-
PHASE II.) ESTIMATED FISCAL IMPACT: $6,575 - FOLIO
#40573240001, PARCEL 1344RDUE
Item # 16A8
THE ZERO TOLERANCE SUBSTANCE ABUSE POLICY FOR
COLLIER AREA TRANSIT TO BE IMPLEMENTED BY THE
TRANSIT MANAGEMENT VENDOR, TECTRANS - IN ORDER
TO MEET ALL OF DOT'S FEDERAL GUIDELINES AND
REQUIREMENTS
Item # 16A9
A LANDSCAPE MAINTENANCE AGREEMENT WITH THE
KINGS LAKE HOMEOWNERS ASSOCIATION TO ALLOW THE
ASSOCIATION TO PERFORM MAINTENANCE ALONG KINGS
LAKE BOULEVARD AND OTHER LANDSCAPED AREAS
THAT MAYBE WITHIN THE COUNTY RIGHTS OF WAY
WITHIN THE HOA'S JURISDICTION AND THAT THE BOARD
Page 232
October 26, 2010
OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS WAIVE THE RIGHT OF WAY
PERMITTING FEE IN THE AMOUNT OF $2,000 - AFTER
ST AFF DISCOVERED THAT NO PERMIT OR MAINTENANCE
AGREEMENT HAS BEEN ENTERED INTO WITH COLLIER
COUNTY
Item #16AIO
ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT COUNCIL OF COLLIER
COUNTY PROVIDING A WAIVER OF THE MINIMUM JOB
CREA TION REQUIREMENT FOR A BUSINESS LOCATING IN
WESTERN COLLIER COUNTY (CREATION OF 20 FULL TIME
JOBS) IN ORDER TO ALLOW V ALUECENTRIC, LLC
ACCEPTED INTO THE JOB CREATION INVESTMENT
PROGRAM AND THE BROADBAND INFRASTRUCTURE
INVESTMENT PROGRAM FOR THE CREATION OF A
REGIONAL HEADQUARTERS OFFICE IN COLLIER COUNTY.
(FISCAL IMPACT: $48,750) - AS DETAILED IN THE
EXECUTIVE SUMMARY
Item #16All
APPLICATION BY ANIMAL SPECIAL TY HOSPITAL OF
FLORIDA, LLC FOR THE JOB CREATION INVESTMENT
PROGRAM - LOCATED IN THE MARKET CENTER PROJECT,
CLOSE TO THE INTERSECTION OF DAVID BLVD. AND C.R.
951
Item #1681
A COMMERCIAL BUILDING IMPROVEMENT GRANT
AGREEMENT BETWEEN THE CRA AND A GRANT
Page 233
October 26, 2010
APPLICANT WITHIN THE BA YSHORE GA TEW A Y TRIANGLE
AREA. (4097 BA YSHORE DRIVE, $30,000.) - FOR
INSTALLATION OF NEW OVERHEAD ELECTRIC SERVICE,
UNDERGROUND ELECTRIC SERVICE AND UPDATE TO
FRONT OF BUILDING
Item # 16B2
A COMMERCIAL BUILDING IMPROVEMENT GRANT
AGREEMENT BETWEEN THE CRA AND A GRANT
APPLICANT WITHIN THE BA YSHORE GA TEW A Y TRIANGLE
AREA. (2891 BA YVIEW DRIVE, $50,000.) - THE PROJECT IS
EXTENSIVE DUE TO THE SITE BEING VACANT FOR 5
YEARS
Item #16B3
A SITE IMPROVEMENT GRANT AGREEMENT BETWEEN
THE CRA AND A GRANT APPLICANT WITHIN THE
BAYSHORE GATEWAY TRIANGLE AREA. (2741 RIVERVIEW
DRIVE, $8,000) - REPLACING DRIVEWAY AND FRONT
PATIO WITH P AVERS AND REPLACING WINDOWS AND
SLIDING GLASS DOORS
Item #16B4
CRA STAFF ATTENDANCE AT FLORIDA BROWNFIELD'S
ASSOCIATION 2010 ANNUAL CONFERENCE; PAYMENT OF
A TTENDEE'S REGISTRATION, LODGING, TRAVEL AND PER
DIEM FROM THE BA YSHORE GATEWAY TRIANGLE TRUST
FUND (FUND 187) TRAVEL BUDGET; AND DECLARING THE
TRAINING RECEIVED AS SERVING A VALID PUBLIC
Page 234
October 26, 2010
PURPOSE. (FISCAL IMPACT: $601) - HELD NOVEMBER 14-17,
2010 IN JACKSONVILLE, FLORIDA
Item #16Cl
RESOLUTION 2010-112: SOUTH FLORIDA WATER
MANAGEMENT DISTRICT ALTERNATIVE WATER SUPPLY
GRANT IN THE AMOUNT OF $500,000 FOR PARTIAL
FUNDING OF THE CONSTRUCTION OF THE IRRIGATION
QUALITY WATER POND LINER, PROJECT #73950-
INCREASING IQ WATER STORAGE TO IMPROVE
AVAILABILITY FOR DISTRIBUTION
Item #16C2
BID NO. 10-5556, BLEACH STORAGE AND FEED FACILITY
MODIFICATIONS AT THE SOUTH COUNTY WATER
RECLAMATION FACILITY, TO ODYSSEY MANUFACTURING
COMP ANY, IN THE AMOUNT OF $539,000 FOR PROJECT NO.
73969, SOUTH COUNTY WATER RECLAMATION FACILITY
TECHNICAL SUPPORT - CARRIES A GENERAL ONE (1)
YEAR WARRANTY WITH EXTENDED WARRANTIES ON
CERTAIN INDIVIDUAL COMPONENTS
Item # 16C3
ACQUISITION OF EASEMENT AREA TO IMPROVE UPON
THE CURRENT ACCESS ROUTE SERVING MASTER PUMP
STATION 312 IN ORDER TO EASE INCONVENIENCE TO
NEIGHBORING PROPERTY OWNERS FOR A TOTAL COST
NOT TO EXCEED $2,100 PROJECT NUMBER 72549 - TRACT
"HH" AND A PORTION OF TRACT "A" OF WHITTENBERG
Page 235
October 26, 2010
VILLAS
Item # 16C4
PAYMENT PLAN AGREEMENT AND THE COMPLETION OF A
STATE OF FLORIDA UNIFORM COMMERCIAL CODE
FINANCING STATEMENT FORM AND A SECURITY
AGREEMENT TO SECURE THE PAYMENT PLAN DEBT
BETWEEN MS. DENISE DENARD AND THE COLLIER
COUNTY WATER-SEWER DISTRICT AS A ONE-TIME
EXCEPTION TO THE CONSOLIDATED IMPACT FEE
ORDINANCE, ORDINANCE 2001-13, AS AMENDED, FOR THE
WASTEWATER IMPACT FEE AND THE ALLOWANCE FOR
FUNDS PRUDENTLY INVESTED FEE FOR BUILDING PERMIT
NUMBER 2010070017 - AS LONG AS THE APPLICANT
MOVES TO NEW LOCATION AT 4573 ENTERPRISE AVENUE
WITHIN 90 CALENDAR DAYS OF THE BOARD'S ACTION
Item #16Dl
FOUR (4) CHANGE ORDERS FOR CONTRACT EXTENSIONS
PROVIDING ADDITIONAL TIME TO COMPLETE GRANT-
RELA TED RESIDENTIAL REHABILITATION ACTIVITIES
BEING FUNDED BY THE COLLIER COUNTY
NEIGHBORHOOD ST ABILIZA TION PROGRAM - EXTENDING
CONTRACTS FOR 3120 WILSON BLVD N., 4818 30TH PLACE
SW, 5410 26TH A VENUE SW AND 5271 24TH AVENUE SW
Item #16D2 - Moved to Item #IOJ (Per Agenda Change Sheet)
Item #16D3
Page 236
October 26, 2010
TEN (10) SUBRECIPIENT AGREEMENTS FOR THE
COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT BLOCK GRANT (CDBG) AND
HOME INVESTMENT PARTNERSHIP PROGRAM (HOME)
PROJECTS PREVIOUSLY APPROVED FOR DEPARTMENT OF
HOUSING AND URBAN DEVELOPMENT (HUD) FUNDING IN
THE 2010-2011 ACTION PLAN - FOR IMMOKALEE CRA,
GUADALUPE CENTER, GOODWILL INDUSTRIES OF SW FL,
HOUSING DEVELOPMENT CORP., GROWTH MANAGEMENT,
HABITAT FOR HUMANITY OF COLLIER COUNTY, BIG
CYPRESS HOUSING CORP., EMPOWERMENT ALLIANCE OF
SWFL, HOUSING, HUMAN AND VETERANS SERVICES AND
THE SHELTER FOR ABUSED WOMEN AND CHILDREN
Item #16D4
TWELVE (12) RELEASES OF LIENS FOR DEFERRAL OF 100
PERCENT OF COLLIER COUNTY IMP ACT FEES FOR OWNER
OCCUPIED AFFORDABLE HOUSING DWELLING UNITS -
DEFERING A TOTAL OF $171,958.84
Item #16D5
A US SOCCER FOUNDATION GRANT IN THE AMOUNT OF
$20,000 PROVIDING FOR REGISTRATION FEES, UNIFORMS,
AND SOCCER EQUIPMENT FOR THE YOUTH SOCCER
PROGRAM AT IMMOKALEE SPORTS COMPLEX
Item #16D6
A US SOCCER FOUNDATION GRANT IN THE AMOUNT OF
$100,000 RETROFITING EXISTING LIGHTING AT
IMMOKALEE SPORTS COMPLEX
Page 237
October 26, 2010
Item #16El
AN AGREEMENT FOR SALE AND PURCHASE WITH
RICHARD F. BERMAN AS TO 1/3 INTEREST AND RAYMOND
AND TERRY BENNETT ALSO KNOWN AS TERRI BENNETT,
HUSBAND AND WIFE, AS TO 1/3 INTEREST AND FRANK J.
CELSNAK AND MARLENE 1. CELSNAK TRUSTEES U/D/T
DATED DECEMBER 27,1991 AS TO 1/3 INTEREST FOR 2.73
ACRES UNDER THE CONSERVATION COLLIER LAND
ACQUISITION PROGRAM AT A COST NOT TO EXCEED
$28,000 - PROPERTY LOCATED WITHIN THE WINCHESTER
HEAD MULTI-PARCEL PROJECT
Item #16E2
AN AGREEMENT FOR SALE AND PURCHASE WITH MABEL
R. BOOSE, TRUSTEE OF THE MABEL R. BOOSE TRUST,
SUCH TRUST HAVING BEEN ESTABLISHED UNDER THAT
CERTAIN REVOCABLE TRUST AGREEMENT DATED JUNE
12,2006 FOR 1.59 ACRES UNDER THE CONSERVATION
COLLIER LAND ACQUISITION PROGRAM AT A COST NOT
TO EXCEED $16,500 - PROPERTY LOCATED WITHIN THE
WINCHESTER HEAD MULTI-PARCEL PROJECT
Item # 16E3
AN AGREEMENT FOR SALE AND PURCHASE WITH LINDA
JONES, AND KAY KINLAW-PRESUTTI (FORMERLY KNOWN
AS KAY KINLAW) AS JOINT TENANTS WITH FULL RIGHTS
OF SURVIVORSHIP FOR 1.59 ACRES UNDER THE
CONSERVATION COLLIER LAND ACQUISITION PROGRAM
Page 238
October 26, 2010
AT A COST NOT TO EXCEED $16,500 - PROPERTY LOCATED
WITHIN THE WINCHESTER HEAD MULTI-PARCEL PROJECT
Item #16E4
AN AGREEMENT FOR SALE AND PURCHASE WITH ASPEN
DANEE, LLC, A FLORIDA LIMITED LIABILITY COMPANY,
BY ITS UNDERSIGNED MANAGING MEMBER, FOR 1.14
ACRES UNDER THE CONSERVATION COLLIER LAND
ACQUISITION PROGRAM AT A COST NOT TO EXCEED
$9,100 - PROPERTY LOCATED WITHIN THE RED MAPLE
SWAMP PRESERVE MULTI-PARCEL PROJECT
Item #16E5
AN AGREEMENT FOR SALE AND PURCHASE WITH
BARBARA S. CANNON, AS TO AN UNDIVIDED 1/3
INTEREST, AND MARSHA S. MCELROY, FORMERLY
KNOWN AS MARSHA S. GHENT, AS TO AN UNDIVIDED 1/3
INTEREST, AND DEBORAH S. MULLIS, AS TO AN
UNDIVIDED 1/3 INTEREST FOR 2.27 ACRES UNDER THE
CONSERV A TION COLLIER LAND ACQUISITION PROGRAM
AT A COST NOT TO EXCEED $17,650 - PROPERTY LOCATED
WITHIN THE RED MAPLE SWAMP PRESERVE MULTI-
PARCEL PROJECT
Item #16E6
ONE YEAR EXTENSION OF CONTRACT #06-3983, GROUP
HEALTH THIRD PARTY ADMINISTRATION SERVICES, TO
MERITAIN HEALTH, INC. IN THE ANTICIPATED ANNUAL
AMOUNT OF $392,875
Page 239
~-"-'---~"."---""-
October 26, 2010
Item #16E7
BUDGET AMENDMENTS APPROPRIATING $55,758 OF
FY2010 CARRY FORWARD FOR APPROVED PURCHASING
CARD TRANSACTIONS IN FISCAL YEAR 2011 FOR
OPERA TING BUDGET FUNDS - AS DETAILED IN THE
EXECUTIVE SUMMARY
Item # 16E8
RESOLUTION 2010-213: ESTABLISHING A POLICY FOR THE
ACCEPTANCE OF MONETARY PAYMENT AND LAND
DONATIONS BY THE CONSERVATION COLLIER LAND
ACQUISITION PROGRAM IN LIEU OF MEETING OFF-SITE
NATIVE RETENTION REQUIREMENTS, AS SET FORTH IN
RECENT AMENDMENTS TO THE LAND DEVELOPMENT
CODE (LDC), SECTION 3.05.07
Item #16E9
ON-LINE AUCTION OF COLLIER COUNTY SURPLUS
PROPERTY - FOR VEHICLES AND EQUIPMENT IN THE
FLEET MANAGEMENT DEPARTMENT
Item #16Fl
RESOLUTION 2010-214: BUDGET AMENDMENTS
(APPROPRIATING GRANTS, DONATIONS, CONTRIBUTIONS
OR INSURANCE PROCEEDS) TO THE FISCAL YEAR 2010-11
ADOPTED BUDGET
Page 240
October 26, 2010
Item # 16F2 - Continued to the December 14, 2010 BCC Meeting
(Per Agenda Change Sheet)
THE FISCAL YEAR 2011 STRATEGIC PLAN FOR THE
NAPLES, MARCO ISLAND, EVERGLADES CONVENTION
AND VISITORS BUREAU (CVB) AND THE NECESSARY
BUDGET AMENDMENTS
Item #16G 1
RESOLUTION 2010-215: JOINT PARTICIPATION AGREEMENT
CONTRACT NO. AQ122 WITH THE FLORIDA DEPARTMENT
OF TRANSPORTATION TO FUND SECURITY UPGRADES AT
THE MARCO ISLAND EXECUTIVE AIRPORT IN THE
AMOUNT OF $60,000
Item #16Hl
COMMISSIONER HALAS' REIMBURSEMENT TO ATTEND
THE NAACP FREEDOM BANQUET. $65 TO BE PAID FROM
COMMISSIONER HALAS' TRAVEL BUDGET - HELD AT THE
NAPLES HILTON NAPLES, 5111 T AMIAMI TRAIL N.
Item #16H2
COMMISSIONER FIALA'S REIMBURSEMENT REGARDING
ATTENDANCE AT A FUNCTION SERVING A VALID PUBLIC
PURPOSE. ATTENDED MARCO POLICE FOUNDATION
LUNCH WITH THE CHIEF AT CJ'S ON THE BAY, MARCO
ISLAND, FL ON SEPTEMBER 27,2010. $20 TO BE PAID FROM
COMMISSIONER FIALA'S TRAVEL BUDGET - LOCATED
WITHIN THE ESPLANADEA T 740 N. COLLIER BLVD, SUITE
Page 241
October 26, 2010
105, MARCO ISLAND
Item #16H3
COMMISSIONER FIALA'S REIMBURSEMENT REGARDING
ATTENDANCE AT A FUNCTION SERVING A VALID PUBLIC
PURPOSE. ATTENDED NEW WATER SYSTEM EFFORT
APPRECIATION LUNCHEON AT PELICAN BEND ON ISLES
OF CAPRI, FL ON OCTOBER 1,2010. $12 TO BE PAID FROM
COMMISSIONER FIALA'S TRAVEL BUDGET - LOCATED AT
219 CAPRI BLVD
Item #1611
MISCELLANEOUS ITEMS TO FILE FOR RECORD WITH
ACTION AS DIRECTED
The following miscellaneous correspondence, as presented by the
Board of County Commissioners, has been directed to the various
departments as indicated:
Page 242
BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
MISCELLANEOUS CORRESPONDENCE
October 26,2010
1. MISCELLANEOUS ITEMS TO FILE FOR RECORD WITH ACTION AS DIRECTED:
A. Minutes:
I) Animal Services Advisorv Board:
Minutes of May 18,2010; June 15,2010; July 20,2010.
2) County Government Productivity Committee:
Minutes of April 21, 2010; May 19, 2010.
3) Hispanic Affairs Advisory Board:
Minutes of May 27, 2010.
4) Immokalee Enterprise Zone Development Agency:
Agenda of September 15, 2010.
Minutes of August 18,2010.
5) Immokalee Local Redevelopment Advisory Board:
Agenda of September 15,2010.
Minutes of August 18,2010.
6) Ochopee Fire Control District Advisory Committee:
Minutes of May 17,2010.
7) Pelican Bay Services Division Board:
Approved Budget FY20Il.
Agenda of October 6,2010.
Minutes of September 1, 2010; September 2,2010 special session.
October 26, 2010
Item # 1611
DISBURSEMENTS FOR THE PERIOD OF OCTOBER 2,2010
THROUGH OCTOBER 8, 2010 AND SUBMISSION INTO THE
OFFICIAL RECORDS OF THE BOARD
Item #16J2
DISBURSEMENTS FOR THE PERIOD OF OCTOBER 9,2010
THROUGH OCTOBER 15,2010 AND SUBMISSION INTO THE
OFFICIAL RECORDS OF THE BOARD
Item # 1613
THE CLERK OF THE CIRCUIT COURT FILING OF THE
AMOUNT OF TRAFFIC INFRACTION SURCHARGES
COLLECTED UNDER FLORIDA STATUTE 318.18(l3)(A)(l)
WITH THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
Item #16J4
TRANSFER OF TANGIBLE PERSONAL PROPERTY,
PURCHASED IN FY 2010 TO BENEFIT THE COLLIER
COUNTY SHERIFF, TO THE CUSTODY OF THE SHERIFF OF
COLLIER COUNTY - BENEFITING OPERATIONS AND
PRISONER SERVICES
Item #16J5
A BUDGET AMENDMENT RECOGNIZING CARRY FORWARD
EARNED FROM PREVIOUS YEAR'S INTEREST AND
CURRENT INTEREST EARNED IN SUPERVISOR OF
Page 243
October 26, 2010
ELECTIONS GRANT FUND 37008 - RECEIVING $959.21 FROM
THE HELP AMERICA VOTE ACT (HA V A) FUNDS
Item #16J6
A BUDGET AMENDMENT RECOGNIZING CARRY FORWARD
EARNED FROM PREVIOUS YEAR'S INTEREST AND
CURRENT INTEREST EARNED IN SUPERVISOR OF
ELECTIONS GRANT FUND 37011 - RECEIVING $655.33 FROM
THE HELP AMERICA VOTE ACT (HA V A) FUNDS
Item #16Kl
AGREED ORDER AWARDING EXPERT FEES AND COSTS IN
THE AMOUNT OF $42,000 FOR PARCELS 1 09FEE AND
109TCE IN THE LAWSUIT STYLED COLLIER COUNTY V. A.L.
SUBS, INC., ET AL., CASE NO. 09-3691-CA (COLLIER BLVD.
PROJECT NO. 60092) (FISCAL IMPACT $42,000)
Item #16K2
STIPULATED FINAL JUDGMENT IN THE AMOUNT OF
$127,500 FOR PARCELS 169FEE AND 169TCE IN THE
LAWSUIT STYLED COLLIER COUNTY V. SCOTT FAUNCE.,
ET AL., CASE NO.1 0-2684-CA (COLLIER BLVD. PROJECT NO.
68056) (FISCAL IMPACT $85,300) - A 0.265 ACRE PARCEL
NEEDED FOR THE EXPANSION OF COLLIER BLVD FROM
GREEN BLVD TO GOLDEN GATE BLVD
Item # 1 7 A
RESOLUTION 2010-216: PETITION V AC-PL2010-1116,
Page 244
October 26, 2010
DISCLAIMING, RENOUNCING AND VACATING THE
COUNTY AND THE PUBLIC INTEREST IN TWO 7.5-FOOT
WIDE DRAINAGE EASEMENTS AND IN TWO 5-FOOT WIDE
LANDSCAPE BUFFER EASEMENTS OVER LOT 2 AND LOT 3,
WHITE LAKE CORPORATE PARK, ACCORDING TO THE
PLAT THEREOF AS RECORDED IN PLAT BOOK 31, PAGES 26
THROUGH 28, OF THE PUBLIC RECORDS OF COLLIER
COUNTY, FLORIDA, SITUATED IN SECTION 35, TOWNSHIP
49 SOUTH, RANGE 26 EAST, COLLIER COUNTY, FLORIDA,
THE EASEMENTS TO BE VACATED ARE MORE
SPECIFICALL Y DEPICTED AND DESCRIBED IN EXHIBIT A,
AND THE REPLACEMENT DRAINAGE EASEMENT
DEPICTED AND DESCRIBED ON EXHIBIT B
Item # 17B
ORDINANCE 2010-40: PETITION PUDZ-2008-AR-14048, A
REZONING FROM COMMERCIAL (C-2) AND MOBILE HOME
(MH) ZONING DISTRICTS WITH A RURAL FRINGE MIXED
USE NEUTRAL LANDS OVERLAY TO A COMMERCIAL
PLANNED UNIT DEVELOPMENT (CPUD) ZONING DISTRICT,
WITH REMOVAL OF THE RURAL FRINGE MIXED USE
NEUTRAL LANDS OVERLAY, FOR A PROJECT TO BE
KNOWN AS CORKSCREW COMMERCIAL CENTER CPUD.
THE REZONING PETITION ALLOWS FOR A MAXIMUM
60,000 SQUARE FEET OF COMMERCIAL, RETAIL, OFFICE,
CHURCH AND SCHOOL USES. THE SUBJECT PROPERTY
CONSISTS OF 8+/- ACRES WHICH IS LOCATED AT THE
NORTHWEST CORNER OF IMMOKALEE ROAD AND PLATT
ROAD IN SECTION 27, TOWNSHIP 47 SOUTH, RANGE 27
EAST, IN COLLIER COUNTY, FLORIDA
Page 245
October 26, 2010
Item #17C
RESOLUTION 2010-217: AMENDMENTS (APPROPRIATING
CARRYFORWARD, TRANSFERS AND SUPPLEMENTAL
REVENUE) TO THE FISCAL YEAR 2010-11 ADOPTED
BUDGET
*****
There being no further business for the good of the County, the
meeting was adjourned by order of the Chair at 5 :42 p.m.
BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS/EX
OFFICIO GOVERNING BOARD(S) OF
SPECIAL DISTRICTS UNDER ITS CONTROL
~w~
FRED COYLE, Chairma .J
.A TrJt,S~:t iJ~:;.
rDWlGHT'''E'/&ROCK CLERK
,:/ . . ,.,' :.,'~~ "'~,II roo: (_
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.19Aat.,.(ont ~ ,.
Th~utes approved by the Board on IZ/I'\- I folO , as presented
~ or as corrected
,
Page 246