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BCC Minutes 02/13/1996 R REGUAR HEETING OF FEBRUARY 13, 1996 OF THE BOARD OF COUNTY COHMISSIONERS LET IT BE REHEHBERED, that the Board of County Commissioners in and for the County of Collier, and also acting as the Board of Zoning Appeals and as the governing board(s) of such special districts as have been created according to law and having conducted business herein, met on this date at 9:05 a.m. in REGULAR SESSION in Building "F" of the Government Complex, East Naples, Florida, with the following members present: CHAIRMAN: John C. Norris VICE CHAIRMAN: Timothy L. Hancock Bettye J. Matthews Timothy J. Constantine Pamela S. Hac'Kie ALSO PRESENT: W. Neil Dorrill, County Manager Mike HcNees, Assistant County Manager David Weigel, County Attorney Item #3 & #3A AGENDA AND CONSENT AGENDA - APPROVED AND/OR ADOPTED WITH CHANGES CHAIRMAN NORRIS: I'll call to order the meeting of the county commission on February 13, 1996. Mr. Dotrill, could you lead us in an invocation and pledge to the flag, please. MR. DORRILL: Heavenly Father, with the crispness of the air this morning we give thanks for the wonder and glory and the beauty of our land and especially Collier County. We give thanks for the wonderful opportunity that we have to raise a family or start a new business or enjoy our retirement years. Father, as always, we give thanks for this great country, the greatest country in the world, and we pray not only for our commander in chief but for our elected officials including our county commission. We would ask that your hand guide them this morning as they make the important business decisions and undertake the deliberations for this community. Father, we thank you for your saving grace and your wonder, and we would ask that what would occur here today would be fruitful and beneficial for Collier County and its people. And we pray these things in Jesus' name. Amen. (The pledge of allegiance was recited in unison.) CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Do we have any changes to our agenda, Mr. Dotrill? MR. DORRILL: Yes. Good morning, Commissioners. I have only one change in the change list this morning. It's just a note upon the part of the clerk's report. It's a request that item 6(B) should replace item 6(A) as part of the regular agenda on the clerk's report. Then I have one item pertaining to staff communications that we want to advise you a week in advance of a somewhat different type of bond refunding that we intend to propose to you next week. It's different because it is an item that local banks can bid on, and we expect to receive a favorable rate, and they're projecting net present value savings of about $150,000. And I'll report that to you at the conclusion of today's meeting. And that's all that I have, Mr. Chairman. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Fine. This change on the clerk's report, did you indicate that that is going to be a permanent change in the way our agenda's presented? (Commissioner Hancock entered the room.) MR. DORRILL: Yes. That's the indication that was referred to us by Mr. Brock's office. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. Commissioner Matthews, do you have any changes? COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: No, I have none. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Commissioner Hancock? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: No, sir. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Commissioner Hac'Kie? COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: No, sir. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Commissioner Constantine? COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I have no changes. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: In that case we need a motion. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'll make a motion to approve the agenda and consent agenda as amended. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Second. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: We have a motion and a second. All those in favor, signify by saying aye. Item #4 MINUTES OF REGULAR MEETING OF JANUARY 23, 1996 - APPROVED AS PRESENTED And we have minutes. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Mr. Chairman, I'll make a motion we approve the minutes of the meeting of January 23, 1996. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Second. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: We have a motion and a second. All those in favor, signify by saying aye. Opposed? Item #5A1 PROCLAMATION DESIGNATING FEBRUARY 18-24, 1996 AS ENGINEERS WEEK - ADOPTED Proclamations, Commissioner Hancock. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: This morning I have the pleasure of reading a proclamation declaring the week of February 18th through 24th Engineers Week, and here to accept that proclamation is John Steven Kempton, the ways and means chairman of Florida Engineering Society. Mr. Kempton, if I could ask you to stand right here and face the firing squad. Whereas, engineers help to design, construct, and maintain the infrastructure and facilities that contribute to high quality of life for all residents of Florida; and Whereas, Florida's future growth depends on engineers executing innovative, creative, high-quality solutions to technical problems; and Whereas, the stated purposes of the Florida Engineering Society shall be to advance the public welfare and to promote the professional, social, and economic interests of the engineering profession and to stimulate and develop professional concepts among all engineers through education and practice; and Whereas, current members of the Florida Engineering Society and the Florida Institute of Consulting Engineers are making strides to interact with the engineering education sector to prepare future engineers to maintain our economic leadership and quality of life; and Whereas, it is fitting that we recognize and honor the continuing contributions of America's engineers by observing Engineers Week with a motto, engineering, the future. Now, therefore, be it proclaimed by the Board of County Commissioners of Collier County, Florida, that the week of February 18th through 24th, 1996, be designated as Engineers Week in Florida and urge all residents to join me in paying tribute to the contributions of engineers in our society. Done and ordered this 13th day of February, 1996, signed John C. Norris, chairman, Board of County Commissioners. Mr. Chairman, I would like to make a motion that we accept this proclamation. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'll second the motion. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: We have a motion and a second to accept this proclamation. All those in favor, signify by saying aye. And opposed? There are none. (Applause) MR. KEMPTON: On behalf of the Florida Engineering Society, I would like to accept this proclamation and thank the county commissioners and the county in general for recognizing us. Thank you. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Thank you. Item #5A2 PROCLAMATION DESIGNATING FEBRUARY 13, 1996, AS EDGERRIN JAMES DAY - ADOPTED Commissioner Matthews, I believe you have a proclamation. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Yes, I do. Is Edgerrin James in the room? As he comes forward -- COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: What a way to get out of class. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: A few weeks ago we were honoring a football player at the college level. It is a football player at the high school level who has also made considerable achievements in his short career so far. A proclamation: Whereas, Edgerrin James is a native of Collier County and a member of the 1996 class of Immokalee High School; and Whereas, in his junior year in football he was the state's leading rusher and first team all state; and Whereas, in his junior year in football he led his team to a district title; and Whereas, in his junior year he was the most valuable player in both football and basketball and received all-county honors; and Whereas, in his senior year despite injury he gained 1,252 yards and scored 9 touchdowns; and Whereas, in his senior year he was district 16 player of the year and second team all state; and Whereas, in his senior year he was selected as one of the state's top 26 seniors and selected to play in the Florida/Georgia all-star game; and Whereas, in his high school career he has rushed for 4,248 yards and 43 touchdowns; and Whereas, he was selected as Parade All-American for 1996. Now, therefore, be it proclaimed by the Board of County Commissioners of Collier County, Florida, that the 13th day of February, 1996, be designated as Edgerrin James Day. Done and ordered this 13th day of February, 1996, Board of County Commissioners, Collier County, Florida, John C. Norris, Chairman. Mr. Chairman, I'd like to make a motion that we accept this proclamation. COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: Second. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: We have a motion and a second. All those in favor, signify by saying aye. Opposed? There are none. (Applause) COMHISSIONER MATTHEWS: Hopefully in four years we'll be back honoring him as a college all-American. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Four years, heck, two years and name the bowl now. Item #5B EMPLOYEE SERVICE AWARDS - PRESENTED CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Service awards, Commissioner Constantine. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: We have service awards for two of our employees this morning, one of them celebrating her fifth anniversary with the county from the department of revenue, Virginia H. Miller. We have a pin and the certificate for five years. (Applause) COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: You have achieved something we haven't; five years. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Longer than anybody on the board. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: And speaking of longer than anybody, we have the coveted green-stone pin for 20 years' service with the county, Nery Anderson. (Applause) COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Twenty years? MS. ANDERSON: Yes. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Ahh, thank you. Item #5C1 SIMON VAINER, SOCIAL SERVICES, PUBLIC SERVICES DIVISION, RECOGNIZED AS THE EMPLOYEE OF THE MONTH FOR FEBRUARY, 1996 CHAIRMAN NORRIS: I have the honor this morning to recognize our employee of the month for February, Simon Vainer. Simon, would you come up and stand and face the camera here while I read a few things about you. Mr. Vainer has fulfilled the requirements of the county technician with responsibility for state and federal grants. Mr. Vainer has done exceedingly well at filling this position. His generosity in sharing his computer expertise has profited many county employees, both in and out of this department. All deadlines are met by this employee with no complaints and little external oversight. When extra hours are required for project completion, there's never a problem. Mr. Vainer devoted much time to the management information system task force that eventually facilitated the creation of the new information technology department. He regularly assists supervision and division administration with production of computer graphics and functions as our liaison for all computer concerns with the district area Agency on Aging and the Florida State Department of Elder Affairs. We are most fortunate to include him as a valued member of our staff. Mr. Vainer, I have for you here a letter of commendation for your files. I have a plaque to present you as employee of the month and the $50 check to go with it. (Applause) Item #8A1 RESOLUTION 96-62 APPROVING AN AMENDMENT TO THE LOCAL HOUSING ASSISTANCE PLAN TRANSFERRING $225,000 ORIGINALLY ALLOCATED FOR RENTAL IMPACT FEE WAIVERS TO THE COLLIER COUNTY S.H.I.P. DOWN PAYMENT/CLOSING COST ASSISTANCE PROGRAM - ADOPTED CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Hr. Dorrill, we are ready for 8(A)(1). MR. HILNE: Good morning, Commissioners. My name is Don Hilne. I'm a planner with the housing and urban improvement department. And this morning I'd like to come before you and request your approval on a budget amendment that would transfer $225,000 that was originally allocated for a SHIP impact fee waiver program into the SHIP down payment and closing costs assistance program. The reason for this transfer really is twofold. Number one, we've had a very, very good degree of success with the down payment assistance program. And as of my last calculation, we've helped 115 families purchase their first houses -- first homes, rather -- since the program was adopted in November of 1994. It exceeded all expectations, and with the rates down lower now, there's a lot more people have been able to qualify. And it's been a great accomplishment. The funds that are in the impact fee waiver account right now are not going to be utilized this fiscal year. And since we do have the need for the money in the down payment assistance program right now and we have not been able to find a matching source that would leverage the funds in the impact fee waiver account, we're hoping we can continue the down payment assistance program until the next funding cycle, which would begin in June, which is the state funding cycle. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Commissioner Constantine. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: You mentioned we're not going to use anything out of impact fee waiver. You said that with some degree of certainty. What's the application process if someone -- particularly if an individual comes in with a sole situation as opposed to a developer? I assume it's not more than a six-month process for them to apply. Does this drain the account and then they not have an opportunity to apply? MR. HILNE: This would be strictly for the multifamily rentals, so this would not affect an individual. This is more along the lines of an actual rental complex where those fees would far and above exceed that $225,000. Without actually having funds to match or leverage that with, we cannot utilize them at this time. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: That wasn't my question. MR. HILNE: I'm sorry. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: The impact fee waiver, you said with some degree of certainty there will be no request for those the rest of the year -- MR. HILNE: Yes. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: -- rest of the fiscal year. Again, if some individual comes in requesting impact fee waivers, do we turn them away and ask them to come back in October and hold off building their home or -- MR. HILNE: I -- I think that would depend upon the circumstances as the project was presented and if at that time that individual was able to come up with an additional funding source that would be able to match those -- that $225,000 that's presently in the account. MR. MIHALIC: We still have ownership funds -- we still have ownership funds available. Excuse me, I'm Greg Hihalic of housing and urban improvement. We still have funding for ownership for waivers and deferrals. This is only for rental complexes. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Okay. MR. HIHALIC: We're trying to do very low income rental assistance. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Host of those applications that we've seen more recently are taking a six-year deferral which requires no cash transfer; is that correct? MR. HIHALIC: That's right, Commissioner. But we will continue to help first-time home buyers who are building new houses with impact waivers and deferrals, and there is a separate budget item for that. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Okay. Thank you. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Do we have public speakers on this? MR. DORRILL: No, sir, you do not. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: I had one question. This is $225,000, and I admit, it's not -- it's not a lot of money when you're talking about a large low income affordable housing project. But we do have an item on the agenda later today where within the documents it indicates that they're going to be requesting impact fee deferrals. And I don't know -- my calculations for whatever they are, they're $600,000 worth of deferrals that at some point in time they may come back and ask us to fund for them. Now, what's your suggestion that we should do in order to accomplish that should we choose to? MR. HIHALIC: Well, Commissioner, basically that's 204 units. The maximum we could assist with this program is about 45 units of very low income housing. But I have several developers who are going to develop very low income housing. It's difficult to say whether this 204 should get it or the other 42 should get it or this 35 should do it. So it's impossible. I would expect that we're going to have probably 350 units of very low income housing developed this year in Collier County, and I don't know how we would allocate it to one developer versus another. That's why I'd rather eliminate the incentive, because there's really not enough money to jump start this type of program. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: So is there any other imaginative financing that's going to be available for these very low income projects? MR. HIHALIC: A six-year deferral or outside funding, funding from the state and federal government. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Okay. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: And this is more in line with the board's direction regarding ownership and trying to make it more available for folks to buy into a home as opposed to rent. So I'm -- you know, if we can't make significant difference in one venue, I'd like to see us make it in the other. I think it's a good move. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Is that in the form of a motion? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Yes, sir. I will make a motion that we approve staff recommendation. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Second. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: We have a motion and a second. All those in favor, signify by saying aye. Opposed? There are none. Item #SB1 FUNDING RELATED TO THE HUBSCHHAN SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT - FUNDING ALTERNATIVE "B" APPROVED Item 8(B)(1). COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Mr. Conrecode, is this item completely consistent with the agreement we had before the board verbally? MR. CONRECODE: Yes, sir, it is. The only difference is we have a recommended funding option, that being that we cash flow this, and we will account for it in next year's budget, because we didn't budget for it specifically this year. It won't cause any deferrals of projects, but we didn't see any sense in borrowing from anyone else if we can just simply borrow from our own -- our own funds. Staff recommends accepting alternative B in the executive summary. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: So this is internal borrowing then? MR. CONRECODE: Yes, ma'am. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: If there's not any further questions, I'd make a motion that we approve alternative B. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: We have a motion. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: There's no problem. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Second. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: We have a motion and a second. All those in favor, signify by saying aye. Opposed? Being none, we'll move to 8(C)(1). Item #8C1 AGREEMENT WITH COLLIER COUNTY HUMANE SOCIETY, PARTICIPATING VETERINARIANS OF THE COLLIER COUNTY VETERINARIAN SOCIETY, AND COLLIER COUNTY, ESTABLISHING SET FEES FOR NEUTER/SPAY OPERATIONS AND REDUCE MEDICAL TREATMENT FOR ANIMALS IMPOUNDED BY COLLIER COUNTY ANIMAL CONTROL - APPROVED MR. OLLIFF: Good morning. For the record, Tom Olliff. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Mr. Olliff, are we going to take the next two items in conjunction? MR. OLLIFF: Yes, sir. Both of those are companion items. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Are these ones that we had moved off the consent agenda, because there were some continuing discussions that you were going to have, and have you had those? MR. OLLIFF: We have had those. They actually resulted in one good clarification-type change, and I'll just point that one change out for you on this agreement. On page 2 of the contract, which is attached to the executive summary, in paragraph 3 towards the bottom of the page we would like to propose at the end or actually the middle of the third line just putting a period at the end of unit price and eliminating the rest of that sentence which says together with the cost of any other charges and fees. That was a little confusing at the end of that one sentence. I think that was Hiss Paton's (phonetic) primary concern. We've actually made that change to the agreement and had the attorneys review and resign, and it's actually been approved by the veterinarian's association and the Humane Society as well. I would also ask that you allow me to correct -- when we went through the agreement again there were several typos and what we would just call scribner-type errors, and other than that there were no changes. We would recommend your approval of both the agreement and the resolution. COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: Move approval subject to Mr. Olliff's comments. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Mr. Hancock. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: I was just going to ask Mr. Weigel if we need a separate motion on these two items. MR. WEIGEL: Because the second item is a resolution, I'd appreciate it if you could have two votes for that, please. COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: Then I move approval of C(1). COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Second. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Mr. Dorrill, do we have speakers today? MR. DORRILL: No, sir. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. We have a motion and a second on item C(1). All those in favor, signify by saying aye. And opposed? Being none, the motion on number two. Item #8C2 RESOLUTION 96-63 MODIFYING THE NEUTER/SPAY AND PRE-ADOPTION HEALTH CARE PROGRAM OF IMPOUNDED DOGS AND CATS; PROVIDE CONTINUED FUNDING OF THE EXISTING NEUTER/SPAY TRUST FUND; THE PAYMENT OF A SERVICE FEE FOR EACH ANIMAL LICENSE SOLD AND REPEALING RESOLUTION NO. 91-214 - ADOPTED COHHISSIONER MAC'KIE: Move approval. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Second. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: We have a motion and a second to approve the resolution. All those in favor, signify by saying aye. Opposed? Item #SD1 REPORT PRESENTED REGARDING THE OUTCOME OF THE LITIGATION IN THE MATTER LAWSUIT OF BILLUPS VS. COLLIER COUNTY, CASE NO. 94-3606-CA-01-TB 8(D)(1), this is a report. MR. DORRILL: Mr. Chairman, I had asked that this -- this be put on. I think in our society there's -- there's always an attorney who's -- who's willing to take money out of somebody's pocket. And this was a case where we had an elderly citizen accidentally fall on a handicapped ramp and thought that they would get $50,000 from the people of Collier County for what was an accident. And we successfully and aggressively defended that ourselves, and I wanted to let you know the outcome of that and also, frankly, to share a credit with the two gentlemen who were here this morning who saved the taxpayers $50,000 in an award and probably $50,000 in outside attorney fees that would have otherwise been required to defend that. Good morning, Jeff. MR. WALKER: Good morning. Jeff Walker, risk management director. I appreciate the opportunity to come before you this morning. Item 8(D)(1) is an informational item regarding the outcome of the Billups versus Collier County case. With that I'll turn it over to Mr. Bryant. He can share the details with you. MR. BRYANT: Good morning, Mr. Chairman, Commissioners. Hay it please the board, I want to thank Mr. Dotrill for those kind words. We believe that we have vindicated the board's direction to us to, one, take a very hard line on these type cases where we believe that somebody is coming to the board and coming to the taxpayers and wanting to get money for something they should be responsible for. As Commissioner Constantine has said over and over, people need to be responsible for their own acts. And that was our whole defense in this matter. We probably didn't spend more than about $5,000 totally in defense costs with our independent medical examination, with witness fees, and everything else. If you remember, this is the case that we went to mediation. We offered the plaintiff $4,000. They wanted $18,000 in mediation, and the board said no way. We went to trial. They put $50,000 on the board. We asked the jury to come back with no negligence upon the part of the county. They were out 17 minutes and exactly came back that way and said no liability. The county doesn't pay anything. In fact, we're now going after the plaintiff because we served an offer of judgment last year on them for our costs and fees. So we wanted to share this with you, and we wanted you to know that what you wanted in your direction to us has been vindicated and been furthered. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Commissioner Hancock? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I just want to compliment the county attorney's office, in particular Mr. Bryant. Your discretion and recommendation to this board on which of these appear to be frivolous and should be pursued has been on the mark, at least the year I've served on this board. I think it's a credit to the county attorney's office to advise this board correctly, and I sincerely appreciate that. And on behalf of the taxpayers of Collier County, thank you for a job well done. (Applause) CHAIRMAN NORRIS: My goodness, what an unusual set of circumstances. MR. DORRILL: Let the record show there was applause as the county attorney's deputy left the room today. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: I think it's great, though, that we go on notice to the -- to the public that these kinds of suits will be aggressively fought. MR. DORRILL: Unfortunately, we have another suit at the same building for a similar type of -- of incident where somebody slipped walking up a built-to-code ADA specified handicapped ramp, but I have an attorney who's willing to take a case on a contingency fee, and we intend to do the same thing on that as we did on this. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Good. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I think particularily what we're doing is going after the expenses on the case, so maybe people won't be so willing to step forward on frivilous items. Item #10A RESOLUTION 96-64 APPOINTING STEVEN BIEGELOW, VANESSA FITZ AND JANET TESTERMAN TO THE CITIZEN'S ADVISORY TASK FORCE - ADOPTED CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. Our next item is appointment of members to the Citizens' Advisory Task Force. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Mr. Chairman, I'd like to nominate Steve Bigelow. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Steve Bigelow. Any other nominations? COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: You took mine, so I -- COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: I'd like to -- I'd like to nominate Janet Testerman. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: And Vanessa Fitz. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: That's fine with me. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Motion to approve those three folks. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Second. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: We have a motion and a second to appoint Vanessa Fitz, Steven Bigelow, and Janet Testerman. All those in favor, signify by saying aye. Those opposed? There are none. Item #10B RESOLUTION 96-65 RATIFYING THE APPOINTMENTS OF FRANK BALOGH, TERRI DOUGLAS, RONALD SMITH, ART DOBBERSTEIN, HEL FISHER, ELLIE KRIER, BUDDY BRUNKER, WILSON RUHBERGER, AND STEPHEN LADD - ADOPTED Next item is appointment of members to the disaster recovery task force. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I have a question. Here at the bottom it says additionally staff is requesting the board to ratify the appointment of Stephen Ladd. I'm not sure. I need an explanation there why that individual didn't submit an application. I realize it's only through September of this year, but '- MS. FILSON: None of these actually submitted applications to the disaster recovery that the -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: What's the difference between Mr. Ladd and the other eight names here? MS. FILSON: He's only filling in the remainder of the term. The other terms have expired. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: I didn't hear that, Miss Filson. Say that again, please. MS. FILSON: He's filling in the remainder of the term, and all the other terms have expired -- CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Her microphone's off. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: The term that he's filling, has it expired? MS. FILSON: No, it won't -- CHAIRMAN NORRIS: So this -- this one seat is different from all the others? MS. FILSON: Yes. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Miss Filson, I think your microphone is not working. You might want to grab Paul's. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: So I can be clear, if Mr. Ladd is to be ratified, we have the remaining eight applicants and eight vacancies? MS. FILSON: Yes. These names are submitted by the organizations, and the commissioners simply -- COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: I don't think that mike is working. MS. FILSON: None of them work. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. Well, that -- motion to -- COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Try that one. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Can I just hear her explanation again? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Yeah. MS. FILSON: Mr. Stephen Ladd's appointment will be to fulfill the remainder of a three-year term, and that term will expire this year, September of this year. The other terms are for four full years. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Is there a way we can make Mr. Ladd concurrent with everyone else and clean this up? MS. FILSON: We can appoint him for the remainder of this term and then for another full four-year terms. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: If we choose to do that. MS. FILSON: Which we normally do if we appoint members to advisory boards for six months or less. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I understand the desire to do that, but I'm not sure Mr. Ladd -- COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: -- signed up for that. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: -- is aware of another four years. Did he sign up for another four years? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: He's in the Army so '- MS. FILSON: I think these applicants are appointed by the organizations. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Why don't we do this. Why don't we -- why don't we put Mr. Ladd in on the same schedule as everybody else today. If that's not acceptable to him, he can tell us. MS. FILSON: Okay. But when you -- when you establish the ordinance, the terms are alternating terms so that everyone's term doesn't expire at the same time. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: All right. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: How many people are on the task force in total? MS. FILSON: I think it's something like 26. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Okay. That explains why there are -- COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Good, motion -- motion to approve staff recommendation. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Second. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: We have a motion and a second. All those in favor, signify by saying aye. Opposed? COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: September will be plenty more. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Mr. Dorrill, do we have a public comment today? MR. DORRILL: No, sir, we have none. Item #12B1 ORDINANCE 96-2, RE PETITION PUD-95-12, ROBERT L. DUANCE OF HOLE, HONTES AND ASSOCIATES, INC., REPRESENTING THE FIRST BAPTIST CHURCH OF NAPLES, INC., REQUESTING A REZONE FROM "A" TO "PUD" FOR PROPERTY LOCATED ON THE EAST END OF ORANGE BLOSSOM DRIVE AND THE WEST SIDE OF THE LIVINGSTON ROAD RIGHT-OF-WAY - ADOPTED WITH STIPULATIONS AS AMENDED CHAIRMAN NORRIS: We'll move onto the afternoon agenda then. First item is 12(B)(1), petition PUD-95-12. MR. BELLOWS: For the record, Ray Bellows of current planning staff presenting petition PUD-95-12. Robert Duane of Hole, Hontes and Associates is requesting to fezone a 100-acre parcel agriculture to planned unit development to be known as the First Baptist Church PUD. As you see, the site is located at the east end of Orange Blossom Drive and along the west side of north Livingston Road. They're surrounded by the Walden Oaks PUD to the west, agriculture to the north, the Vineyards and ag and estates zoned property to the east. And further south is the Naples Community School. Phase one of this project includes a 75,000 square foot church and an 80,000 education and administration building with a childcare facility and a 400-student school. Phase two will expand the church and administrative buildings to 120,000 square feet each. The site is designated urban residential in the future land use map which permits nonresidential uses such as churches and similar uses of proposing this PUD. In addition, the traffic analysis indicates that phase one will generate 2,747 trips on a weekday -- excuse me -- on a Sunday and 1,426 trips on a weekday. Phase two at buildout could generate up to 4,396 trips on a Sunday. It is anticipated that Livingston Road will be improved to a four-lane facility prior to the completion of phase one. And based on staff's analysis this project will not significantly impact the adjacent roadway system. Since the site has been cleared for agricultural purposes, the project will not have any environmentally sensitive areas. This petition was referred to all county agencies, and their review indicates that no level of service standards will be adversely affected. The project is designed to locate in a cjuster, as you can see, the -- from the site plan more intensive uses will be in the center tract C. Less intensive uses will be on the surrounding areas. The greater setbacks will be required from the perimeter, the lesser setbacks from within the tract boundaries in the middle. The Collier County Planning Commission reviewed this petition, and it was approved unanimously. No letters for or against this petition has been received by staff. Therefore, staff recommends that the Board of County Commissioners approve petition PUD-95-12 with a recommendation of approval. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Commissioner Hancock. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Mr. Bellows, how does -- let me ask this. What is the long-term plan for (inaudible) Drive and how does this project impact those plans? MR. BELLOWS: Well, the long term would be for it to connect up with Livingston Road, and it will be a local-type road. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. But this -- this project is adjacent to that roadway? MR. BELLOWS: Yes. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: And is there any problem with reservation of right-of-way, or do these plans conflict with potential right-of-way of Orange Blossom at all? MR. BELLOWS: No. I believe they are extending that roadway through the north end of their property. MR. DUANE: Yes, sir. For the record, Robert Duane from Hole, Hontes and Associates. We're proposing to upgrade that roadway as part of our long-term plans. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Mr. Duane. MR. DUANE: Yes, sir. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: It's unusual for you to be bringing a church petition. Therefore, is Dr. Spagna on vacation? MR. DUANE: No. I'm actually proud to bring this. I'm a member of this church. And our Pastor, Dr. Hayes Wicker, is here also today. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. I do have a question on this. I see part of the proposal is a 50-bed congregate living facility. MR. DUANE: Yes, sir. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Is that a firm proposal? Are you planning to do that right away, or could you give us a little explanation -- MR. DUANE: Yeah. It's one of a menu of long-range options that we're presently considering. That's the best answer I can give you today. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Perhaps I should ask Mr. Bellows then, ACLF, would that be normally a use that would be associated with a church? MR. BELLOWS: It's possible. It's nothing in the Land Development Code that says it is an accessory use; but definitely that is something, care and providing, that some churches have been involved with. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I believe the court system has said it's not a regular accessory use, though, in another church in Collier County. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Well, that wasn't an ACLF. It was some sort of homeless shelter. MR. BELLOWS: This is part of -- that why they came in traditional church use, they're filing for a PUD, the mix of uses. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Well, let me ask then if someone could come in and do just an ACLF on this property, would it be consistent with the growth management plan based on density? MR. BELLOWS: Well, the density is 26 beds per acre or units per acre. And that is consistent, because the code allows for -- the growth management plan allows for that density for that type of facility. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: So what they're asking for is consistent with the growth management plan. The question is because the PUD and not any conditional use requests; it's not a question of accessory. It's a question of is this mix appropriate for its location. Is that really the central request we're dealing with? MR. BELLOWS: Yes. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Our growth management plan answers that question yes, so it seems to me that settles it. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Commissioner Constantine. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'm not sure if it does answer it yes. Mr. Duane, you mentioned this is -- Mr. Duane, you mentioned this is one of many items on a menu of potential uses down the road. Would you object to removing this one item from the menu? MR. DUANE: Well, I would, because it's the kind of a facility that we think can compliment the campus that we're trying to -- that we're trying to provide here. We have worship. We have education. We have child care. We have a school. We have a conference center. And it's the kind of use that we think could be integrated well with those kinds of use, albeit it may never be constructed, but we want to keep the opportunity open to have it. We've limited it to 50 beds. We're a hundred-acre tract. We have restrictive standards that are more restrictive than you would typically find in other zoning districts. So my answer to you is I think it's an appropriate location, and it can be a compatible use for this property. Now, I think we're only looking at 50 beds on perhaps an acre or two of our almost hundred-acre site, so it is by no means a principal component of this project. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Hay I ask a question, Mr. Bellows? CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Excuse me. Mr. Hancock's next. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I was just going to say and offer an option. The First Baptist Church has a history of consistency in this community. They've been here a while. They continue to grow. It's a very strong church. So my question is -- and we -- we talked about this recently on a day-care facility. If there is going to be an ACLF use on the property, we would like -- I think this board in the past has said that it must be noted that it will be owned and operated by the church, that we're not talking about something that can be broken away and sold to someone as a commercial venture outside the church. I think the history of the First Baptist Church in this town -- you know, I would be more comfortable knowing that this would be related with the church, owned and operated by the church and not sold as a commercial venture to someone else. Could we at least have that assurance today? I'm not sure if that will answer Commissioner Constantine's question but -- MR. DUANE: I can count to one, two, three, and I -- I'll be happy to make that modification if that's the pleasure of the board. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: And as an option, we have in the past on some PUDs taken some uses and really placed them in a conditional-use status in the PUD that should you decide to do them, you would -- they would require board approval at a later date. And, again, that's merely an option if you weren't willing to look at the first one, so I wanted to mention that. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: If you put that option in, I can support the motion, but I can't otherwise. And I fully support the church, the school facility, the childcare facility, and all of that. But I'm not comfortable with this component if we put that in as a conditional use -- COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- stipulation that any ACLF that operates will be owned and operated by the church -- MR. BELLOWS: The Wilderness PUD has residential and a commercial tract, and in part of that commercial tract there is an ACLF approved very similar to this concept. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: But not only the church owned and operated, but have it return like a conditional use type item as you mentioned. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: It's for my comfort level. I don't know about the rest of the board. But short of that, I can't support it. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Mr. Duane, a couple of the board members are expressing a desire to sort of be consistent with what we have done in the past on some PUDs with certain uses that we -- we wanted a further examination of in the future. And that is to ask you to come back if -- if, indeed, you do at some point in the future want to put in the ACLF, to ask -- to ask you to come back for a further approval at that time. Would that be acceptable? MR. DUANE: That would be acceptable. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: I had one more question, if I may, quickly. Mr. Bellows, did you receive any letters or phone calls of objection on this application? MR. BELLOWS: None. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: That's important, because there are some residences nearby, and I'm really happy to see that's not the case. MR. DUANE: Mr. Hancock, we met with the adjoining residential property owners. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: I had a feeling you might have done that. MR. DUANE: Thank you. MR. BELLOWS: We just had one little comment from the property owner to the south. He was concerned about possible spraying of crops to the orange grove to the south that may affect this project. With the typical setbacks and the dwellings and the Walden Oaks being closer than some of the proposed buildings here would be, they'd be put on notice that residents within -- or businesses within this -- or church uses within this PUD that could possibly be spraying that could affect this, that no spraying would -- or church operation would affect the spraying on the property to the south. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. Thank you. Miss Mac'Kie? COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I'll waive. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: You'll waive? COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Yeah. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: I have one question. Mr. Duane, can you explain to me the phasing of this project? When is it your intention to put in which part of the various uses? MR. DUANE: Phase one will consist of the -- of the church. That's going to be the principal use, which is going to be confined to the center portion of the project. And we anticipate that being constructed sometime after the year 2000. We -- we used a ten-year window in our traffic study. It's possible if our fund-raising efforts exceed our expectations, that we might move that up a few years, but that's the principal focus of -- of phase one, along with the educational and administration building. Now, phase two, the buildout will include an expansion of the -- of the preschool facility and the student school. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: An expansion? MR. DUANE: Right. We're going to have childcare in phase one also, which will be limited to -- we estimate 100 children will be in phase one also along with construction of the principal facility. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: I -- I guess what's crossing my mind is a couple weeks ago we heard a petition similar to this, and we required in the end that the -- that the church be constructed before the day-care center. Is that your intention? MR. DUANE: Oh, I can assure you that that will be the case, and we have no problem with agreeing with that stipulation. That will be the building that we would be using, the principal building -- COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Uh-huh. MR. DUANE: -- so that would go hand in hand. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Mr. Dorrill, do we have public speakers? MR. DORRILL: No, sir, you have none. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: If not, I'll close the public hearing. Commissioner Constantine? COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'll make a motion that we approve with the stipulations as outlined by Commissioner Hancock with the conditional use on the ACLF within the PUD, the approval based on consideration of the urban residential use that's allowed under the future land use element map, and that seems consistent, and also there are no level of service problems with the project. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Second. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Commissioner Matthews had brought up a question of making sure the church is constructed prior to opening of a day care. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'll amend the motion to include that stipulation. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: We had also talked of the -- having assurances within the development order that the ACLF and the childcare center when built will be owned and operated by the church, just to have assurances that that will be true. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: The -- COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Would the motion maker -- CHAIRMAN NORRIS: The ACLF will have to come back at a future meeting, and that will take care of that automatically. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: It will be operated by the church, Mr. Duane? MR. DUANE: Yes, sir. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'll include that as part of the motion. I think conditional use, we can take care of that later by the board, but I'll include that as part of the motion as well if petitioner is comfortable with that. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Second. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. We have a very lengthy and amended motion. Perhaps Commissioner Constantine, if you could restate it. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Move to approve the items and the stipulations including a conditional use on the ACLF that the day-care and childcare facilities will be owned and operated by the church -- and what was the other one? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: The church be constructed -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: The day-care facilities will not be built until the church is first built. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Second? COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Yes, sir. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: We have a motion and a second. All those in favor, signify by saying aye. Those opposed? There are none. Item #12B2 ORDINANCE 96-3, RE PETITION PUD-90-1(1), KAREN BISHOP OF PHS, INC., OF NAPLES, REPRESENTING GEORGE H. WERNER REQUESTING A REZONE FROM "PUD" PLANNED UNIT DEVELOPMENT FOR A PROJECT KNOWN AS RICHLAND PUD FOR THE PROPERTY LOCATED IN THE SOUTHWEST QUADRANT OF IHMOKALEE ROAD (C.R. 846) AND C.R. 951, CONSISTING OF 150 ACRES, MORE OR LESS - ADOPTED Item 12(B)(2), petition 90-1, sub 1. MR. NINO: Good morning, Commissioners. Ron Nino for the record with your community development staff. The petition that is before you essentially has us revisiting the Richland PUD, which was approved in 1990. And the focus or the thrust of this amendment really has to do with removing the requirement to build a specific distribution of single-family versus multifamily housing units. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Mr. Nino, before you go any farther on this one, let me -- let me just say that I am going to abstain on this petition. I have a business relationship with Mr. Werner in another capacity not dealing with this land. But in order to avoid any perception of a conflict, I will abstain on this one and let Mr. Hancock run this item. ACTING CHAIRMAN HANCOCK: Mr. Nino. MR. NINO: The existing or the currently approved PUD requires that 130 of 650 dwelling units be single family. This petition, the amended petition, retains the 650 dwelling units but has no limitation as to the mix of single family versus multifamily. The -- that issue would be determined obviously by market conditions at the time that the developer proceeds to go ahead with this PUD. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Mr. Nino, that -- that change is one that I've seen in all of the PUDs that I've approved since I've been on the board this past year. That's just something that has become more typical is that we allow the market to control what the mix is, but we put a cap on the maximum number of units? MR. NINO: That's exactly correct, Commissioner. ACTING CHAIRMAN HANCOCK: And the units in this petition are not increasing; they're staying the same? MR. NINO: They're not increasing. The other element of this petition is that it has a commercial component, because it is located within the -- an activity center at the intersection of Rich -- of 951 and Immokalee Road. The original PUD allowed 150,000 square feet of commercial floor space. The existing -- the amended PUD would retain that same amount of commercial floor space, namely 150,000 square feet. However, because that petition predates the current LDC code which references -- which references SIC codes and has a use list, the current -- the proposed PUD adopts the -- purports to adopt the C-4 requirements from the current Land Development Code which references SIC code numbers. Staff in conjunction with the petitioner did refine the C-4 uses to eliminate some uses that had outdoor storage as a major component of their operation. We didn't think, quite frankly, that that was the kind of use that that intersection ought to be put to. ACTING CHAIRMAN HANCOCK: So the more noxious C-4 uses have been removed? MR. NINO: Exactly. This petition, however, does introduce a nursing home or an ACLF into the residential tracts. And our concern was that the location of a nursing home not impact single-family housing if that decision is made. And we've introduced into the PUD some spacing requirements for ACLF facilities should they, in fact, occur in this development by requiring transitions on multifamily housing. Also the standard with our -- also as is usual with our concern for the mix of single-family and multifamily housing, again, we put in some spatial requirements that would insure that lo and behold somebody doesn't build a bunch of multifamily structures in between two single-family housing units. The petition was consistent with the growth management plan in 1990 and remains consistent in its amended form. The Planning Commission reviewed this petition and unanimously eight to nothing recommended its approval to this board. No person spoke in opposition to the petition or have received any -- or have we received any communications in opposition to the petition. ACTING CHAIRMAN HANCOCK: Thank you, Mr. Nino. Commissioner Constantine. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I need you to -- excuse me. I need you to help me with the -- via the SIC code. What's -- how redundant is that? What's in some of these categories? Item number 5 on page 36 of our agenda item, automotive repair and services, that's group 7542. MR. NINO: That is car washes only. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Item number 7, business services, and there are 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12 -- there's about 20 groups in this. MR. NINO: That's advertising, credit reporting, photocopying businesses, commercial photo types of business, arts and studio supplies, reporting services, medical equipment rental, equipment rental and leasing, a whole host of computer program services, photofinishing labs, and then a miscellaneous business. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Okay. I'm -- that's fine. Item 19, miscellaneous repair services, there are five different groups. MR. NINO: Radio and television repair, refrigeration and air condition repair, electronic repair, water and clock -- watch and clock repair shop, printers or upholstering. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Thank you. Finally personal services, item 24. MR. NINO: Laundry, coin laundries, other laundry services, a photo -- photographic studio, beauty shop, barber shop, shoe repair shop and miscellaneous services, generally in that intensity of use. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Thank you. ACTING CHAIRMAN HANCOCK: Any more questions for staff from the board? Is the petitioner here? Miss Bishop, do you have anything else you'd like to add to the group? MS. BISHOP: Karen Bishop. I'm an agent for the owner. No, thank you. We're happy with everything. ACTING CHAIRMAN HANCOCK: Any questions for the petitioner? Mr. Dotrill, do we have any public speakers? MR. DORRILL: No, sir, you don't. ACTING CHAIRMAN HANCOCK: I'll close the public hearing. Motion to approve. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Yup. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Second. ACTING CHAIRMAN HANCOCK: All those in favor, signify by saying aye. Opposed? None, motion carries four to zero. And we welcome back Commissioner Norris. Not bad for my first one. Item #12B4 ORDINANCE 96-4, RE PETITION PUD-95-13, BARBARA H. CAWLEY OF WILSON, MILLER, BARTON & PEEK, INC., REPRESENTING IHMOKALEE HOUSING PARTNERSHIP, INC., REQUESTING A REZONE FROM "A-HHO" TO "PUD" TO BE KNOWN AS GARDEN WALK VILLAGE PUD FOR PROPERTY LOCATED ON THE SOUTHWEST SIDE OF S.R. 29 AND OPPOSITE FARM WORKER VILAGE - ADOPTED WITH STIPULATIONS CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. We'll move along then to item 12 (B) (3) , PUD-95-3. MR. DORRILL: I believe that's been continued, Mr. Chairman. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Oh, I'm sorry. You're right. 12(B)(4) then, petition PUD-95-13. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Before -- before he speaks, Mr. Chairman, am I right from a parliamentary perspective that I have a motion on the floor that was tabled from the last presentation? CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Mr. Weigel, did we table or continue? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I believe we tabled. MR. WEIGEL: My recollection here operatively will come to the same result, but I believe that -- someone help me. I think we continued. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Why don't you make a motion to take it off the table. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: That's exactly what I was going to do. I move to take it from the table. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Second. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: We have a motion and a second to untable. All those in favor, signify by saying aye. Opposed? COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: And, if I may, at the time I had made a motion to approve subject to installation of a sidewalk. And I'd just like to withdraw that motion at this time, and we'll start fresh today. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Thank you. Mr. Bellows. MR. BELLOWS: Okay. For the record, Ray Bellows of current planning staff presenting petition PUD-95-13. Barbara Cawley of Wilson, Miller, Barton and Peek is requesting a fezone of a 17-acre site on agriculture with a mobile home overlay to PUD to be known as the Garden Walk Village PUD. Petitioner proposes a 204-unit multifamily development on property located on the southwest side of State Route 29 and opposite the Farm Worker's Village development. The site is designated NC on the Immokalee master plan which permits densities up to 12 units per acre but also allows for commercial and schools and other government facilities. The proposed four hundred -- or 204-unit development is at 12 units per acre. So, therefore, it is consistent with the Immokalee master plan. The traffic analysis indicates that the trips are to be about 1,220 trips per day which is -- exceeds the 5 percent significance test on State Route 29, however, will not lower the level of service on that road. The Environmental Advisory Board determined that the project will not adversely affect any sensitive area. The property is adjacent to -- the properties to the west are also designated NC which allows for the same 12 units per acre. The property to the east, Farm Worker's Village, is zoned RMF-6 which allows for 6 units per acre, though, predominantly it's been developed at 4 units per acre. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Mr. Bellows, we heard this petition a couple of weeks ago. We don't really need to rehash the entire thing. If there's something new -- MR. BELLOWS: No, nothing new. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Not all of us heard -- COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: -- I believe is why it's here today. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Please continue. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Well, may I ask, were you able to review the record? Are you familiar with -- COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I read it. I did not watch the videotape. I know the facts -- facts part of it as you read it, if you can add it in color. MR. BELLOWS: It is consistent with the Immokalee master plan. The -- it's within the neighborhood center which permits those densities and those uses. It's -- actually the growth management plan encourages those densities in that area as a mix with commercial which is also allowed in there. It's not too far from the Immokalee industrial district at the -- COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: What did you say about that? It encourages those densities in that area? Would you repeat that? I think that's really important. What encourages -- MR. BELLOWS: It doesn't expressly say encourage, but it does permit up to those densities. In my conversations with the long-range staff, they are looking for bonuses to get development in those areas and mixed with commercial, somewhat like the activity centers and neighborhood centers. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: That's what I thought. Thanks. MR. BELLOWS: The PUD document also allows for building heights of three stories, which is consistent with the RMF-12 district, which allows for taller structures. This project is similar to other developments in Collier County. It's not applying for affordable housing density bonus as if it would. If it was not in the NC district, they would have to strike an agreement with our housing and urban improvement department to get bonus densities to get up to the densities they're asking for. This is consistent with the Immokalee master plan, so they don't need that affordable housing density. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Would you tell me again the uses and permitted uses on the north side, south side, and west side of the property? MR. BELLOWS: Okay. To the north is -- as far as State Route 29, Farm Worker's Village, and that folds over to the east side. To the southeast is residential zoned RSF-4. To the south is undeveloped active -- actively farmland. And to the west is undeveloped zoned agriculture but within the neighborhood center. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Thank you. MR. BELLOWS: The Collier County Planning Commission reviewed and approved this petition on January 18th and recommended approval by a five to one vote. That concludes my presentation. Any questions? COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Yeah. I -- I'm -- I'm the person that caused this to be heard again the second time. And -- and I do want to say primarily the reason for the no vote three weeks ago was density, height and -- and the fact that I had some questions that I couldn't get answered in the short period of time from the -- when they first appeared. We all received a letter from the fire district that morning addressing fire flows and quality of life issues. I've since met with the fire district, fire chief, and while his -- his concerns about fire flow can easily be addressed, and I believe he's already met with the developer to address those, his major concerns are really life and safety issues and -- and essentially evacuation of a building in the middle of the night that has 36 units in it possibly and -- and you're talking 108 people at 3 a.m., which could be a difficult thing, but proper training of his officers will -- will accomplish that. The other concern that I had, though, has not really been resolved, and that is dealing with the water-sewer district. I did not have at the time, three weeks ago, a Boyle Engineering report which does -- which did exist, but I did not have it, and I've since been through it and reviewed it. And our -- our executive summary says that the water-sewer -- Immokalee water-sewer collection and transmission facilities are deemed adequate. But this Boyle Engineering report indicates that the water-sewer district is going to have to spend approximately a half a million dollars to provide the services to this development. And I -- I'd like to see something in the development order which will meet the problem here, because this particular water-sewer district does not assess impact fees. It does not assess capacity fees. And this half a million dollars will be borne by the rate payers. MR. MIHALIC: If we may address that, Commissioners. We just applied for a community development block grant funding on behalf of Immokalee water and sewer for another area. We've given them approximately a half a million dollar grant to assist to pay for the infrastructure in that area for water and sewer. And that should assist in freeing up those additional payees that are coming on line, and their rates will be able for them to do the capital improvements in other areas of the district. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Right. You just raised another question then. Because in my discussion with the water-sewer district, they have recently issued 4.3 million dollars worth of bonds, and they have recently received 1.4 or 1.5 million dollars worth of grants -- MR. MIHALIC: Yes. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: -- to improve the infrastructure in their five-year plan. This is not in their five-year plan. It's in addition to their five-year plan. And at this point the 4 million dollar bond issue that's been issued to make these improvements is already going to generate a 15 percent rate increase effective this May. And I -- I would just like to see something in this plan that addresses the half a million dollars. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Commissioner Constantine. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Mr. Weigel, we're restrained somewhat on what criteria we can approve or not approve a PUD. And while a valid concern, I'm trying to figure out if it falls within our authority to decline a PUD. MR. WEIGEL: Okay, fine. Miss Student may want to add to my comment, but the approval of the PUD conceivably could go forward with a stipulation which, in essence, restates what has to occur anyway. And that is that the petitioner, the owner, developer, will have to obtain in the permitting process certificates of adequate facilities which may in part respond to the question raised concerning the Immokalee water and sewer district. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: But, Mr. Weigel, that's every -- nobody -- you can't build a house without that. I mean -- MR. WEIGEL: That's right. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: -- that would be an absurd condition in my judgment since we have ordinances already in place for this issue. And I'm terribly concerned that we're not going to see any more affordable housing projects in this county if we don't stop throwing up roadblocks to them. And that is a concern. It's a valid concern. It will be addressed by the ordinances of the county. We need to apologize to this developer for the delay and approve his project and thank him and hope that he'll bring more back. And as far as the rate payers, the people in Immokalee are begging us for this project. Please improve our community. I think they're willing to pay rates if that's what it takes. They're here saying please approve it. We need to stop putting up roadblocks and approve this project. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Mr. Weigel, again, my question is it's my understanding we already require that as part of ordinance so -- COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: What's the problem? MS. STUDENT: If I might, because this is a private provider, they don't fall under our regular AFCO process. I think it would be appropriate perhaps to put some conditional language in the development order that before they could go further in the process -- and perhaps this is something that could be discussed with the developer's representatives here today -- that there be satisfaction that there is adequate capacity to meet the water and sewer -- COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: They can't -- they could get a permit without adequate facilities if we don't put that in? I don't think -- if that's a gap in our ordinances, we need to address it. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: We may be a little out of -- out of the context here. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Yeah. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Do we have a letter from the water and sewer district objecting to this project? MS. CAWLEY: No. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. So the water and sewer district that's responsible for providing service has not objected. The second point is that same water and sewer district has decided to -- instead of charging impact fees in their district, they have decided to finance future system expansion on the rate payers instead of impact fees. So the idea that any expansion of the system is going to impact the rate payers is their decided method of operation. Whether it's a single-family home, a multifamily complex, a commercial building, the rate payers are going to finance the expansion of the system regardless of the project. So we don't have an objection from them. We are -- you know, this is their normal method of operation. So for us to object to their chosen method of operation and this project's impact on it I think is -- is not our responsibility. That's left to them. If they have a problem with this expansion, I would assume somebody after this has been heard now a second time would be here telling us that. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Right. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I don't hear it. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'm looking from our legal staff for a yes or no answer. If there is a problem with providing water and sewer service, will that be picked up somewhere in the permitting process even if we don't stipulate it today? MR. WEIGEL: The answer is yes. I think Miss Student's going to address that further. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Yes will do. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Yes will do. We don't need any amplification on it. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: As much as we love lawyers. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Mr. Dotrill, do we have any speakers? MR. DORRILL: We have a number of them. Mr. Kelly, if I could have you come forward, please, sir, and then, Reverend Allen, if I could have you please stand by. MS. CAWLEY: Good morning, Commissioners. I'm Barbara Cawley with Wilson, Miller here representing the petitioner. One of our team members would like to also speak to you first, if you wouldn't mind. Mr. Thomas is here, and he drove in from Immokalee and would like to speak to you first. We didn't sign him up because he is one of our team members, so if we could indulge your time for a moment. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Fine. MR. DORRILL: Mr. Kelly, if you will stand by for just a moment. Mr. Thomas. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Getting a little crowded over there, folks. MR. THOMAS: Yes, Commissioners. The hat I have on today is the executive director of the Collier County Housing Authority. The Collier County Housing Authority has worked with many private developers who are going to build affordable housing in the Immokalee community. This developer came to us several months ago to talk about building some housing across the street. The housing authority has developed a nonprofit arm called Collier County Housing Authority Land Acquisition and Development. That's been around for about four years, five years. They are a partner -- I'm the secretary-treasurer of that particular board, and we are partners with Roy Cronacher Development forming a new Immokalee housing partnership to put these things together. So as a part of that other package, I officially endorse the building of that particular project. Okay? COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Thanks. MR. DORRILL: Now, Mr. Kelly, if you would, please, sir, and then Reverend Allen, if I could have you stand by. MR. KELLY: Good morning, Mr. Chairman, commission members. My name is John Kelly. I'm a retired attorney admitted to practice in the State of Florida presently staying here in Naples. I don't claim to have detailed familiarity with the housing plans for Immokalee. However, my business affairs do take me to Immokalee with some frequency. And considering the -- the appalling housing conditions under which many people in Immokalee are now forced to live, I would urge the commission to view this petition with Christian compassion as well as the necessary legalistic and administrative practices. Thanks very much. MR. DORRILL: Reverend Allen and then, Mr. Lee, if I could have you work your way to the front, please, sir. Reverend Allen, good morning. REVEREND ALLEN: Good morning. Good morning, Commissioners. Thank you for giving me a few minutes of your time. I'm here in support of the project that is -- I need to give my name; right? My name is Howard Allen. I'm president of CURE, Collier (inaudible) for Rights Equality. And we thought we had this made last -- a couple of weeks ago when this came before the board. You noticed I didn't even show up, because I was so sure it was going to pass, so I didn't feel I needed to come down. But this morning I'm here and urging you to pass this. As has already been stated, if we don't allow this developer who is willing to spend 17 million dollars to put some affordable housing -- COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: It's not 17 million, sir. It's somewhere between 7 and 8 million. REVEREND ALLEN: Okay. I have to fault the paper for that then. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Yeah. REVEREND ALLEN: So that's what I -- but anyway, whatever the amount of money that he's going to spend to develop this project would be good for Immokalee. Now, I've also heard that it's not good for the south side. But if you take it and move it north, then it's okay to have it up near the hospital. I mean, that's how we get slums and other -- other neighborhoods that's not fit to live in simply because we take everything good and put it on one side of town, and then when the bars and clubs and all of these other things come in, then we put them on the south side of town, and then we create a slum, and then we get the big fog lights out there so everybody know where the slums is when they're coming into town at night. But if they start to develop the south side along with the north side and improving -- those people who are living in those rundown houses can move out and into something decent, then you'll soon see those houses begin to disappear and the whole area then become an area that when you bring tourism -- that's my concern. When tourists come to town and other peoples come, you take them on those big bus tours. They never carry through the south side of town. They kind of go around the edge and take the other way out and around, because they don't want them to see this side of town because the -- our government and the landowners haven't done anything to improve this. So we don't want this blight in the tourists' mind when they leave and go back to where they are. We want to think of this as a nice, green metropolis, and over in that metropolis you have something that's disgusting that you don't want seen. So I urge you all in your vote today that you vote to approve the project, and then any other that come along that's good for the south side, that you also vote on them, too. Thank you. MR. DORRILL: Now Mr. Lee and then Mr. Matthews. MR. LEE: First, I'd like to thank the commissioners for allowing me this privilege. I won't say very much because I think you all have a much bigger task before you, it seems like, from the audience. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Could you say your name for the record? MR. LEE: Yes, sir. My name is Albert Lee, just a concerned citizen from Immokalee. What I would like to do is direct most of my little speech to Miss Matthews who happens to be our representative from that particular area. We certainly welcome good things perhaps that may come to our community. We certainly hope that you can find and afford the time to at least say one time this may be good. I have seen -- again, and I stated that in the last meeting, we were concerned then about three-story buildings. And there wasn't no three-story buildings in Naples. So we're not going to worry about how tall or how what -- you have to worry about density and all of those things. But look at where we hope we will go and hope that you and the rest of the commissioners -- which I don't see very much opposition from the rest of them and not too much from you this morning. So let's get on about passing it and hope that we can live with it. Thank you. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: As I stated earlier, my opposition three weeks ago was that there were unanswered questions that I needed to get answered, and I wasn't being afforded the opportunity. I have since answered most of them and have a few minor things that I'd like to put in the order. MR. MATTHEWS: Good morning. My name is Joseph MAtthews. I come to you this morning, as I did a few weeks ago when this matter came before the commissioners, representing the Immokalee Water and Sewer District and the Immokalee Fire Control District, two of which I've heard Mrs. MAtthews talk to you about. But the fire chief, I think, and Mrs. MAtthews had a conversation. She made the assertion earlier that it was with the fire district, which I would tend to believe that that suggests the whole board. The whole board has not heard this particular project or talked about this particular project in terms of the fire safety concerns that the chief has. I don't differ with the chief really that in the sense that, yes, someone would have to be concerned about it. We have to look at it and determine best how we overcome those fears and those concerns and all. But aside from that, I think normal training that I heard someone talk about earlier -- you put together the training and the -- the proper sequence of machinery, all of those things, and we certainly come over that. As far as the Immokalee Water and Sewer District, again, two weeks ago or three weeks ago when this matter first came before you, as I reported then and I'll report again, this matter came before the Immokalee Water and Sewer Board Tuesday a week ago. The board without a comprehensive engineering study was not able to discuss this issue to a great deal obviously because the two engineers, our engineer, Boyle Engineering, and the engineer for this specific project, has not sat down to determine exactly what it was going to take to put potable water there and obviously take away the wastewater away from that project. Also along with that the Florida Department of Transportation was expanding a length of the highway there, so there's a lot of things to take place in a normal conversation with the boards and all. And without that there's no way nobody can determine what it's going to actually cost. Talking to the engineer, Mr. Kernrellette from Boyle Engineering, that was the worst-case scenario that could happen, that five hundred thousand. In fact, the figure I heard was three to five hundred thousand. That was the very worst-case scenario. There was not a comprehensive study done no place other than our office. Until we can actually sit down and talk with Immokalee water and sewer now, with the engineers from this specific project, determine what it's actually going to take from our standpoint or from their standpoint, there's no way that we can actually define the costs. But again, my understanding, the concerns that we have here is the permitting process and which the district themselves always give a -- a letter of service. In other words, we can actually -- adequate service to a project. Those kinds of things take place much later in the project. Again, I'm not here speaking on behalf of the board. Again, I am in support of the project as a business manager of the community and resident of the community. I support this project wholeheartedly. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Commissioner Mac'Kie. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I just want to -- is that the end of the public speakers? MR. DORRILL: Yes, ma'am. COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: Then if you'll close the public hearing, I have a motion. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Not that she's telling you what to do or anything. COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: Well, I'm anxious to make this motion. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: I will close the public hearing. COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: I'd like to move approval of the petition subject only to the conditions that are set forth in the PUD that came out of the planning commission with a recommendation of approval. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Second. COMHISSIONER MATTHEWS: Be -- before you call the motion, I would like to discuss one or two more items with Mrs. Cawley and -- and we talked about them in the last 24 hours or so. And one of them was aligning the entrance to this project with the southernmost entrance to Farm Worker Village so that we don't have -- well, let me say this; there's enough traffic going south on 29 and turning right into the project to cause a decel lane that has to be constructed. It stands to reason that if there's that much traffic turning right, there's going to be that much traffic turning left and going north on 29 out of the project. And the southernmost entrance for Farm Worker Village is around three or three hundred and fifty feet to the north. And my question is, is there a way that we can align these two entrances or exit accesses so that we reduce the possibility for accidents, people turning left onto a 60-mile-an-hour roadway, 350 feet away, there is somebody turning right. And I'm a little bit concerned about safety issues on this and don't want to create accidents. MS. CAWLEY: The problem with doing that obviously is that we don't own the land. COMHISSIONER MATTHEWS: I understand that. MS. CAWLEY: The land directly adjacent from that access into Farm Worker's Village is owned by another entity, and we have no control over whether or not we can obtain easements or get access or buy more land from that entity. I think that that's -- it's sort of out of our control. What we can do, of course, is work with DOT to make it the safest entrance possible and -- and move it as far south as possible so that we can avoid the problem. COMHISSIONER MATTHEWS: Uh-huh. MS. CAWLEY: Right now it's just sort of out of our control. We'd like to be able to fix it, but I don't know how to fix it at this particular moment. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: I understand there's going to be site -- site changes and stuff as the project comes forward. But I just want to put on the record that with the distance between these two projects opposite on the road being only 30 feet and it's a 55-mile-an-hour speed zone, not 60, but people travel 70, you know, 350 feet from somebody having turned left and accelerating doesn't give them a lot of time to do something about somebody who's recently come right out of Farm Worker Village onto 29. And I'd like the petitioner to -- to try to address it, either put more distance between them or align them. MS. CAWLEY: We -- we will -- we will do our best to put the maximum distance we can between them. Thatws not a problem. We can work with that in our site planning very easily by just moving -- moving the access road as far south as we can possibly get it. I donlt know that therels anyway -- COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Therels a natural point that if you moved in a southern direction to get away from it, lining up right there and moving the building over. Thatls a couple hundred feet. Thatls -- that can happen. MS. CAWLEY: Therels ways of adjusting that. That shouldnlt be a problem. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Fine. That will address that concern that I have. MS. CAWLEY: Okay. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: And the last one deals with density bonuses. I understand that therels no density bonuses available in a NC district. MS. CAWLEY: Right. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: But Iim asking the petitioner to agree that density bonuses will not be asked for in the future. MS. CAWLEY: We will agree to that. Therels no problem. Weld have to get a comp. plan amendment in order to get any more density in that particular location, and we donlt have any desire to do that. Welre trying to get this project done quickly. We need to get into the cycle to get the tax syndication money, because we think this is the last year that it may be available. So we donlt have time to go into a comprehensive plan amendment. We have no interest in doing that. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Well, with the assurances that the water-sewer district board is aware and is already working on this and the fact that the project has to get adequate public facility certificates before it can go forward, I have no problem supporting the motion. All the problems that I had three weeks ago have been addressed. MS. CAWLEY: Thank you, Commissioner. MS. STUDENT: Madam Chairman, I just want to state for the record -- COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Iim not chairman. MS. STUDENT: I beg your pardon. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Itls Mr. Chairman. MS. STUDENT: I beg your pardon. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: I told you it would happen. MS. STUDENT: Mr. Chairman, I just want to state for the record that at the time this project would need a C.O., they would have to have other ordinances. There would have to be water and sewer to serve the project. And typically a case goes to private providers. I understand from staff that at the SDP level a letter from that provider is provided indicating that the capacity will be available. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Thank you for that. And with that Iill call the question. All those in favor, signify by saying aye. Those opposed? There are none. Letls take a short break, and weill be right back. MR. CUYLER: Thank you, Commissioners. (A short break was held.) Item #13A1 RESOLUTION 96-66, RE PETITION V-96-1, MARVIN DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION REPRESENTING FRANKLIN AND DEBRA NORTON REQUESTING A 5 FOOT VARIANCE FROM THE REQUIRED 25 FOOT REAR SETBACK TO 20 FEET FOR PROPERTY LOCATED AT 290 SAYBROOK COURT, LOT 9, MADISON MEADOWS SUBDIVISION - ADOPTED CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Ladies and gentlemen, let's -- let's get back in session here, please. Thank you. Thank you very much. We're ready to start item 13(A)(1), petition V-96-1. Mr. Nino. MR. NINO: Ron Nino for the record, community development services, presenting petition V-96-1. This is a petition requesting a variance of 5 feet to a required rear yard of 25 feet. As the executive summary points out, to a large extent staff is culpable inasmuch as staff approved a site plan with the issuance of the building permit that, in fact, showed the building within 20 feet of the property line. The -- this issue was -- came to light at the spot survey when another staff member noted that -- that location was inconsistent with the requirement for that zoning district by 5 feet. The Planning Commission reviewed this petition and unanimously recommended approval of the variance. You'll note that the resolution acknowledges the grant of the variance to only a small portion of the building. The building takes on an L shape at the back, and that variance would only recognize the long side of the lake. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Mr. Nino, does the staff error relieve the developer or builder of the responsibility of -- of conforming with the statutes, the laws? MR. NINO: I hate to answer legal questions. Perhaps -- MR. WEIGEL: No. The answer is no. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Mr. Weigel said the answer is ~o? COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: No. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: The answer is no. Any other questions from the board? COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Is the petitioner here? MR. NINO: I don't know if the petitioner is here. He's from Cape Coral. He said he was going to monitor the proceedings, see if he could be here. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I was just curious if there was an explanation why it was designed that way to start with and -- MR. NINO: Staff report points out that this developer, they could have complied. The house is not larger than the combination of the front and rear setbacks. The building is set back 5 feet more than the ordinance requires, so it's not a blatant situation where somebody is building a house that's larger than the setbacks. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: At what stage of construction are we? MR. NINO: We're at tie beam. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Tie beam? MR. NINO: (Nodded head.) CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Do we have any public speakers, Mr. HcNees, on this item? MR. HcNEES: No, sir. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: What's on the property that it impacts? Mr. Nino, what's on the property that it impacts directly adjacent to it? MR. NINO: The rear yard faces east, and to the east you have undeveloped land at this point in time. Matter of fact, you have high tension power lines and, quite frankly, the likelihood of -- of shallow lots in that area is -- is very remote, in my opinion. So -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Are the power lines directly adjacent to the property? MR. NINO: No, they're not. They're some distance from -- a couple hundred feet from that lot. But I suggest to you that the configuration of land along there, one, we don't know what's going to happen to it; and, two, if it is developed, they will likely be very long, very deep lots. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Are there any platted lots behind there at this moment? MR. NINO: No, there aren't. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: In the past we've had this discussion, and really whoever pulls the permit, it's their responsibility to make sure that the building setbacks comply with what the code sets forward. And I'm always reluctant to relieve them of that responsibility regardless of the stage of construction. Because we don't know what's going to be behind this, I'm kind of at a crossroads on this one. Again, we hate to penalize the homeowner but, you know, this is something the builder should have -- have caught. And I don't have enough knowledge of this individual neighborhood to know if -- if this is going to seem out of place or not. But I'm inclined not to support the variance. MR. NINO: Well, we've had no communications of opposition. Notices were sent out to property owners within 300 feet of the property. No one has expressed any concern. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Let me go ahead and close the public hearing. Continue the discussion. COMHISSIONER MATTHEWS: Mr. Chairman, I have a question. You're saying that there are no platted subdivisions to the east of this. Wasn't there a fezone that we did a year and a half or so ago that was between Turnberry and the power lines? And it may not have extended this far north, but there's something there that was zoned, and I'm trying to remember the name of it, Charting something or other. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: That was south of there. MR. NINO: My recollection was that there -- COMHISSIONER MATTHEWS: I'm just wondering how close it comes to this. MR. NINO: I don't know of any development that I'm -- you know, during my time with the county suggests that there's been any zoning approvals in that area. I could be wrong, but I don't -- I don't recall any. COMHISSIONER MATTHEWS: Okay. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: The -- I think a couple of points here. On the negative side it is still the builder's responsibility to make sure that the house is properly sited. On the other side, though, there -- there was a mistake made by our staff that -- that kind of helped this along. And there are at the present time no platted lots directly adjacent to this lot. If -- if there are to be in the future, then the -- whoever was bringing a petition to replat would -- would know that this variance was already in existence and would be able to accommodate it that way. So there's -- there are positives and negatives here on this one. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: You make a valid point. If it weren't for the staff mistake, I would have zero inclination to proceed with this. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I concur, but because our staff did play a role in it, at the very least, helping it along -- I have some -- for the homeowner. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: The public hearing is closed so CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Yes, it is. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: -- if there are no speakers, I'll make a motion that we approve petition number V-96-1 based on the discussion we've had. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Second. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: We have a motion and a second for approval. All those in favor, signify by saying aye. Opposed? There being none, we'll move on to item 13(A)(2). Item #13A2 RESOLUTION 96-67, RE PETITION CU-95-21, R. BRUCE ANDERSON OF YOUNG, VAN ASSENDERP, VARNADOE, P.A., REQUESTING CONDITIONAL USE 2.6.35.6.3 IN THE ESTATES ZONING DISTRICT FOR A 180 FOOT HONOPOLE COHMUNICATION TOWER FOR PROPERTY LOCATED APPROXIMATELY 1 MILE EAST OF INTERSTATE 75, SOUTH OF AND ADJACENT TO IHMOKALEE ROAD (C.R. 846), CONSISTING OF 1.31 + ACRES - ADOPTED MR. MILK: Good morning, Commissioners. For the record my name is Bryan Milk. I am presenting petition CU-95-21. Petitioner is requesting a conditional use in order to construct a new 180-foot monopole communication tower to replace the existing 55-foot guide tower that currently exists at the North Naples Fire Control and Rescue District's fire station and emergency medical facilities building. The district intends to provide an added height which would increase its effective radius for emergency broadcast. It would provide a permanent mount for its radio repeater system, and it would allow on the top of the monopole a fixed location for a whip-type antenna for cellular communications for Cellular One of Southwest Florida. The subject property has been in existence for approximately six years with little complaint from the surrounding area. Staff has a letter from St. Honica's Episcopal Church directly abutting and east of the site which is in support of the petition. On January the 18th the Collier County Planning Commission voted seven to zero to recommend approval. There were no letters of opposition or any inquiries of opposition to this -- CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Commissioner Constantine. MR. MILK: -- particular project. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: The existing tower is 50 feet; is that correct? MR. MILK: About 55 feet. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: And this is proposed to be as high as 180 feet? MR. MILK: That's correct. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: So it's not identical. We're not simply replacing one with another. We're almost four times as large. MR. MILK: About three and a half times as large, right. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Yeah. The -- I'm just reading here. It says the tower is similar in design to a common light pole, 180 feet high, common light pole. MR. MILK: I guess the reference to the interstate off ramps, they have the large light poles. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Bryan is kind of a big guy, so maybe this -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I think at Joe Robbie Stadium they have 180-foot light poles. Will this in any way potentially interfere with TV or radio or telephone communications? And I ask that only because this past weekend as I walked around the tournament, I know the ESPN folks were having some difficulty because of a couple of towers that were located near Lely Resort. And, of course, they're not an everyday type use. But I'm wondering for those who live in the area, does this potentially -- MR. MILK: There's two things that happen. Cellular industries have their own frequency range that's direct line of sight, so that will not impact with any radio or TV transmissions. Radio frequencies from the fire station is on a separate band, and they're going to use a dish-type antenna and a repeater system and a filter system to eliminate that. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Who's they're? MR. MILK: There are two different frequencies, two different systems, two different precautions for filtering and not affecting the nearby TV and radio transmissions to the private homeowners. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Two more questions. Is the tower prohibited from renting space to anyone other than the fire department and Cell One, or can they add additional antennas for whomever may need it in the future? MR. MILK: The way it's proposed is that there's going to be a whip antenna on the top for Cellular One, possibly a 32-inch dish radio antenna for the fire station, and a mount for the repeater system on the tower, and that would be all. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Okay. And that is limited by the scope of what we're being asked to approve here to those? MR. MILK: To those folks only. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Okay. And then the final question. I assume there's some sort of lighting -- FAA requirements for lighting of a 180-foot tower either by strobe or the red lights or what have you? MR. MILK: That's correct. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Do those in any way -- I realize this is estates property; I'm familiar with the location. But do those in any way have impact on any surrounding residents? I know with the state's tower over by Radio Road, we had an incident with their little strobe light just happened to be blinking right in someone's back window. MR. MILK: That is fairly obnoxious, and there's a condition in here to provide a beacon instead of a strobe. The FAA, by the way, did not require a light for this particular tower to be lighted. Mosquito control asked that there would be a beacon on the tower. Every time we do a communication tower in Collier County, the FAA, airport authority, and the mosquito control district gets a copy so they can plot them as they fly in their flight paths. They had asked that it be lighted, and I talked to Ernie Paschard (phonetic) of Cellular One. They are willing to put a beacon on the tower that is not obnoxious to the adjacent properties and not a strobe. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Thank you. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Miss Matthews. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Back to the interstate light poles that resembles; they're at 1-75 and Immokalee Road up on the interstate. Compared to Immokalee Road, what is the height of those light poles so I can get some idea of what we're talking about? I know they're very tall. MR. MILK: They are very tall. I'm -- I don't know. I have no idea. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: A hundred feet? MR. MILK: They're probably 150 feet. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: One hundred fifty feet as viewed from Immokalee Road? MR. MILK: At Immokalee Road and at intersections, yes. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: So this tower is only 20 feet or so taller? MR. MILK: Very similar in height, yeah. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Thank you. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Do we have public speakers on this issue? MR. HcNEES: No, sir. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Let me close the public hearing. Further discussion? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: No. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Motion to approve the item. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Second. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: We have a motion and a second to approve. All those in favor, signify by saying aye. Opposed? Being none, we'll move over to 13(A)(3), petition V-95-29. Item #13A3 RESOLUTION 96-68, PETITION V-95-29, HARK J. WOODWARD AND ANTHONY P. PIRES, JR. OF WOODWARD, PIRES, ANDERSON & LOMBARDO, P.A., REPRESENTING GBFC BEACH, LTD, A FLORDIA LIMITED PARTNERSHIP AND PARCEL H-I, INC., A FLORIDA CORPORATION D/B/A FC BEACH JOINT VENTURE, REQUESTING A SIDE YARD SETBACK VARIANCE FROM THE REQUIRED SETBACK OF 50% OF THE BUILDING HEIGHT WITH A MINIMUM OF 15 FEET FOR PROPERTY LOCATED AT 488 SOUTH COLLIER BOULEVARD, MARCO ISLAND - ADOPTED WITH STIPULATIONS AS AMENDED MR. REISCHL: Good morning, Commissioners. Fred Reischl, planning services. This is a petition and its companion item on a parcel of land on South Collier Boulevard that is irregularly shaped created by a court order, and it's a 3.95-acre site. And before I go further into my presentation, the petitioner has requested to speak. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Petitioner. MR. PIRES: Thank you, members of the board, Mr. Chairman, Mr. Reischl. My name is Anthony Pires, Junior, and I'm with the law firm of Woodward, Pires, Anderson, and Lombardo. We are here today representing the petitioner in these two matters, this item and the next companion item. Petition V-95-29, the variance petition, was carefully evaluated by the staff after its submittal utilizing all of the appropriate criteria under the Land Development Code. Staff concluded and found and recommended to the Planning Commission that the variance petition as filed be recommended for approval. The Planning Commission after deliberations made a recommendation to this board by a seven to one vote that petition V-95-29 be granted. Petition CU-95-24 is a companion petition item. It's a conditional use item. That, again, was carefully evaluated by staff utilizing the Land Development Code criteria. And the staff recommended to the Planning Commission and the Plan -- favorable approval. The Planning Commission recommended for approval to this board as the Board of Zoning Appeals said conditional use CU-95-24, a conditional use for a private club on the same parcel of land. I believe copies of the staff's recommendations and the Planning Commission's recommendations are included as and made part of this record. After the Planning Commission's hearing, substantial public opposition arose focusing initially as to the conditional use request and then subsequently as to the variance request. The focus of the concerns, as we understood them from some meetings that we had and some various correspondence that we saw in communications and discussions that we had with particularly Commissioner Norris, were issues concerning traffic generation on Marco Island, beach overcrowding on Marco Island, and other issues concerning -- of concern. Although we felt that in some situations their numbers were overstated as to the number of people that would use the facilities, although we felt that the numbers were overstated as to the impact on the roads and beaches, we internally looked hard and worked hard to try to accommodate these concerns, those raised by the public and those raised by Commissioner Norris. While the uses outlined in the conditional use application for a private club, we believe, are appropriate for this site, we are today withdrawing petition CU-95-24, the application for the conditional use of the private club. We believe that as we are no longer requesting the conditional use approval for a private club, that certain items that became issues and were necessary as part of the initial application that were necessary as part of the staff review that were issues raised by members of the public, are no longer applicable, pertinent, or relevant to the variance petition which is still at stay, that being variance petition V-95-29. We believe that the elimination of the conditional use eliminates any of the questions raised by Commissioner Norris as to whether there would be a doubling up on uses, which I believe he articulated as a concern, that being -- having the maximum number of residential dwelling units coupled with what was perceived as a commercial use. We also believe that eliminating and withdrawing the conditional use application eliminates any questions with regards to traffic generation and overcrowding of beaches, and we believe they are no longer relevant issues before this board. In light of the decision to withdraw the conditional use, our client instructed the consultants, land planners, and architects to reconfigure the project without the conditional use. We and our client have intentionally scrutinized the site in light of the concerns and in light of the withdrawal of the conditional use and have by this process been able to narrow down the area where the variance is needed to that portion dealing with the tower portion of the structure fronting on South Collier Boulevard. With the board's indulgence, if I may, I have a few large exhibits, and then also I have some handouts for the board. I have prepared -- we have prepared for the board's review and utilization in this a notebook for the board which in part contains a revised site plan dated February 8th of 1996. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Mr. Pires, can we just ask you -- MR. PIRES: Yes. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: -- is your sketch over there the same as the one here that's colored? MR. REISCHL: Yes, that's the February 8th one also. MR. PIRES: Yes, sir. The staff has the February 8th. And what I'd like to do -- COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Uh-huh. MR. PIRES: Try not to trip over the foam core board or the -- or the wire here. As I said, the use will be that of a hotel. A hotel is permitted as a matter of right under the RT zoning district. A hundred and three hotel units can be constructed on this site utilizing the criteria outlined within the Land Development Code. The hotel will have the normal accessory and allowable customary uses and facilities associated with a hotel permitted as a matter of right in the RT district. We would like to provide this overview followed by some testimony and reserving the opportunity, as is customary, to respond after public comment to pertinent issues dealing with the variance including calling additional witnesses. Further, there may be some discussion about deed restrictions, and I believe that the Land Development Code specifically outlines that deed restrictions are not appropriate for discussions of zoning matters by this board. That's section 2.6.18 of the Land Development Code. The site plan that you have in your booklet, which is at tab 3, depicts the proposed revised variance request. You will note I have outlined -- and for the purposes of the notebooks that you have -- in yellow, and I'll outline here the area where the variance is now requested. It's approximately a 220-linear-foot dimension being 145.82 feet along the front portion near South Collier Boulevard and approximately 74 feet in length in east-west direction along the southerly property line. The initial request was for variance over a larger portion of this southerly-easterly meandering side yard. We have natrowed it down to the minimum necessary to obtain a reasonable and practical use of the property. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Mr. Pires, just because I'm -- have -- have a little kindergarten trouble with looking at this -- what I see is just some building footprint that abuts what looks to be tennis courts now? So this -- this setback that you're asking for the variance is a setback from tennis courts, not from habitable structure? MR. PIRES: At this location to the -- to the due south of this portion of the tower structure are tennis courts. This building that stays is an existing one-story building, is a facility that is a -- appears to be a manager's office, an operational office for the time-share project. The parcel to the south is a Club Regency time-share project. A little bit of history. Initially there was a design to have the whole project as a time-share project. In 1986, however -- well, prior to that time the phase one was developed, as you see it in the southerly portion with these various three-story buildings, the tennis courts and the one-story building and another recreational facility building in this location. The concept called for four phases of the condominium. However, a foreclosure action that initiated in 1986 culminated in 1990, four years later, with a court ordered foreclosure sale of the subject property. So this parcel, that lot line, was -- it became a hardened property line by that foreclosure action. In 1995 the property was sold, and a bankruptcy court ordered auction in New York City. That's where our client acquired the property. From an orientation standpoint, the -- the structure is located, as I said, more in a north-to-south direction. And from the aerial photographs, which is located at tab 1 of your booklet, gives you an overview of the surrounding and adjacent uses. The subject property is noted. Immediately to the north is Eagle's Nest, which is 13 stories tall. To the north of that is the Marriott, a 10-story hotel; across the street, Marriott tennis courts and parking lot; to the south the Club Regency. Further south is The Chalet, a 12-story structure that currently exists south of our subject property. Furthermore, you -- I'd like to direct your attention to tab 2, the aerial photograph of this site. And this, I believe, dramatically iljustrates the extremely irregular shape of the parcel, which the courts have found to be a classic hardship. The courts in Florida have stated when you have an irregularly-shaped parcel of this nature, it is deemed to be a classic hardship. We have outlined and delineated in red the property line of the subject property to indicate and give you an idea of how it is situated. You will note -- and Mrs. Cawley will be testifying as a land planner, will go over in greater detail, but the tower location is in this portion of the site. It is located closer to South Collier that is landward or eastward of existing high-rise structures and other residential units in the area, Eagle's Nest being this tower structure which is located more forward of our proposed tower structure, The Chalet which is located substantially forward of our proposed tower structure, and these are the existing Club Regency units (indicated). This unit in the center here (indicated) which is about two or three stories in height on our parcel, is a temporary sales facility that will be removed. The petition as originally configured with greater areas where setback was requested was favorably reviewed and approved by your expert staff, Mr. Mulhere and Mr. Reischl. I would ask that they also be acknowledged as experts in planning, land use, and zoning ordinances today by this board and that they have stated -- I believe you will hear them state that they have their continued favorable recommendation of the variance request. And I believe they also will advise you that by reducing the area involved, no further staff review or action is necessary. As I stated before, the rationale for granting of the variance, we are locating the taller structure closer to South Collier Boulevard away from, behind existing adjacent structures. The buildings in the westerly portion of this site will have reduced heights. It will allow a 103-unit hotel with associated uses and facilities on an extremely irregular piece of land and otherwise will have no reasonable use of the property. As I stated before, it's well recognized -- CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Go ahead. We're waiting for you to finish your disclaimers here so we can proceed. MR. PIRES: As I said, the irregular shape of the parcel constitutes a classic hardship, hardship that arises from the realty itself. What I'd like to do at this time is have Ms. Cawley -- unless you have questions of myself or any other members of our staff. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: I think we will have questions of you right now. But I'm going to take this opportunity to put on the record that I have had numerous contacts, personal, telephone, written contacts on both sides of this issue. But I am going to base my decision on the information presented here in this hearing today. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I need to repeat that same disclaimer. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Ditto. COMHISSIONER MATTHEWS: I, too, have had mostly letters from citizens on Marco Island, no phone calls, but certainly contact with the petitioner. And I will also base my decision on what I hear today. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Same for me. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Mr. Reischl, how many -- with the 103 units of hotel space, how many parking spaces will be required by our code? MR. REISCHL: Hotel requires 11 spaces for every 10 guest rooms plus 50 percent of the required restaurant parking. I have a handout if you want me to hand out -- CHAIRMAN NORRIS: And what does that -- just tell us what that figure comes up to. MR. REISCHL: Well, that would depend on restaurant size and various other things that are not -- were not under review when they were submitted. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Just for the rooms how many would it be, and then we can guesstimate over and above for restaurant? CHAIRMAN NORRIS: A hundred and fourteen. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Hundred and thirteen. MR. REISCHL: Thank you. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: It would be 114. MR. REISCHL: Just for the rooms, and then restaurant would be calculated at 50 percent of normal restaurant fillings. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Of normal restaurant size, which is one for every two seats. MR. REISCHL: One for every two seats or 60 feet -- CHAIRMAN NORRIS: So it would be one for four seats -- MR. REISCHL: Yes. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: -- you're saying? MR. REISCHL: Yes, yes. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Mr. Pires, how many parking spaces are -- is the petitioner going to provide here? MR. PIRES: At the minimum, the minimum amount required by the Land Development Code. But for the type of resort hotel that is being proposed -- but we may have additional parking facilities which is allowed under the Land Development Code. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Do you have a number? MR. PIRES: I don't have a number, no, sir. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: You don't have a number? Please, let's -- let's hold the comments down from the audience. That's really not allowed here. You're out of order when you do that. Let's give the petitioner a chance to try to answer the questions. And the question is how many parking places you intend to provide, and you don't have an answer for that? MR. PIRES: The answer is that it will have an adequate number of parking spaces to support the principal use and associated customary accessory uses. There may be additional allowed under the Land Development Code. COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: May I ask you a question on that? CHAIRMAN NORRIS: You certainly may, but I find it difficult to believe that -- that you're proposing a large project and you don't have any idea of how many parking spaces you're going to provide. Is what you're telling us is you don't have a number in mind? MR. PIRES: Well, as to the parking structure -- that portion, once again, we have withdrawn -- or we are not asking -- we are no longer asking for a variance for the parking portion of this structure. The portion that we're asking the variance for is the tower portion where the units will be located along with the normal associated operational aspects of a hotel, which the site as it's configured -- no reasonable practical use of the site of this for a hotel, as a resort hotel, can be made without locating in this area. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Let me ask a different question in the same light. Do you anticipate building a parking garage to facilitate these parking spaces that you need? MR. PIRES: The -- this portion of the project in this area here is designed to accommodate the parking for the facility (indicated) in this area. And these are all achieving the setbacks. Initially -- the initial application requested variances for portions of this parking portion of the structure, but we have now achieved the setbacks after receiving the various comments, after changing the nature of the use so as to be able to meet the setbacks for the parking portion of the structure. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: And how big -- how many stories will that parking structure be? MR. PIRES: The height that we understand at the present time is approximately 27 feet above the -- in this case the base elevation would be 12 feet, so approximately -- we have the grade, though, so it's difficult -- possibly 30 feet above sea level, approximately 33. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: That being three stories or four stories? MR. PIRES: I believe it could be three stories, possibly four stories. It would be three stories above grade. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. Let's see, we have -- everybody wants to ask a question. Who's first? Mr. Hancock, I believe, and then Ms. Matthews. COMHISSIONER MATTHEWS: If you don't mind, I've just got a legal question for Mr. Weigel before we go much further. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Oh, that could take a while. COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: Start the clock ticking. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: But my question is real simple. With all the substantial changes that have been offered today, does this need to go back to the Planning Commission? MR. WEIGEL: I think that -- I think that what we're finding are reductions from what has previously been before the Planning Commission. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Okay. I'm aware of that. I just want it on the record that we can move forward with this, and I don't want anybody saying that we didn't have the authority. MR. WEIGEL: Okay. You have the authority to move forward. COMHISSIONER MATTHEWS: Okay. Thank you. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. Commissioner Hancock. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Mr. Pires, I'm going to cut to the chase on the real question that everyone seems to be here for and Commissioner Norris was alluding to, and I think it's important that we get this on the record. You have removed the conditional use for a private club. We sit here in assumption then saying there will not be a private beach club on this site; is that correct? MR. PIRES: There will not be a private club; that's correct. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: So you will not be selling memberships to this property for use of these facilities; is that correct? MR. PIRES: Well, the Land Development Code has a very specific definition as to what a private club is, and that's a conditional use under the RT zoning. As any other hotel similarly situated in RT, we cannot have a private club without having a conditional use approved by this board. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. So five years from now if this building is built and someone finds that there are private memberships being sold, you are in violation of the Collier County zoning ordinance, would you be? MR. PIRES: If they find that we are a private club under the Land Development Code, yes, sir, we would be. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Which implies having memberships and selling them that qualifies you as a private club; is that correct? MR. PIRES: The definition of private club under the Land Development Code addresses civic, fraternal, and social organizations and generally not-for-profit types of organizations. And there's a general -- it's a well-defined term in the Land Development Code. And we cannot provide or operate a private club as defined in the Land Development Code. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: You're not trying to get around that and do it in another way is what -- MR. PIRES: Oh, no, sir. Whatever a legal associated customary accessory use associated with hotels will be utilized and provided for on this site. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: You understand, the residents here -- going to have more parking that is required by code that says to them that you're going to have other uses that are not being identified today. That's the imp1 -- that's what's being implied -- MR. PIRES: I understand. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- and I think these folks as well as this board need an assurance -- not just an assurance, but full knowledge that that's not the case. And that's what I'm asking you is -- you know, we can talk about how it's defined all we want. But I need to know that a private club will not be a part of this building and this development. And so the people on Marco Island need to know that. MR. PIRES: There will not be. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: The remaining questions I have is that your parking garage for the most part is shielded by the building; is that correct? MR. PIRES: That's correct. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: So from the street they're going to see the front of a building, not a parking garage, except for it looks like there's a load that sticks out on the south side? MR. PIRES: A relatively small portion -- I believe there might be a north side -- I know I get a little -- in this area will be visible from South Collier. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Well, I was looking at the south. There's a little piece that sticks out below the -- MR. PIRES: No. This actually is a configuration of a parking structure here. This is an area -- and Barbara Cawley will explain more in detail for the landscaping that we propose to have in a conceptual nature in this area. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. My remaining question is one that in looking at this site plan, it's obvious that you could build a structure here without a variance. What would -- it makes me ask why you're here for the variance. I mean, the building configuration could be changed. Why wouldn't you be willing to change it to avoid the variance? MR. PIRES: We can't -- you know, to obtain a reasonable and practical use of the property, the tower structure needs to be located in the location as indicated on the proposed site plan and in this revised variance request. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Is there any benefit to changing this or any detriment to changing this instead of being front-ways being depth? I mean, that's what I'm getting at is I look at this, and to me you have two ways to build. You build across the frontage, or you can build through the depth on the northern property boundary. And I -- one is probably preferable to the people on either side, and one is preferable to the rest of the island. And, you know, I -- either way someone's going to get happy. But I'm just curious why this configuration and why this variance. What is the benefit here as opposed to making you build it within -- within the setbacks? MR. PIRES: Once again -- and Miss Cawley will provide testimony to substantiate that to obtain a reasonable and practical use of the property it does need to be located and situated in the manner indicated on the site plan and not in any other location. You have this irregular -- extremely irregular -- I guess, tortured lot line that creates, once again, what the courts have indicated is a classic hardship. And to obtain a reasonable and practical use of the property it needs to be situated and sited as indicated. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Let me -- let me go back to what I was getting at, because this is getting right to the heart of it, and you say reasonable and practical use of it. Let's -- let's do some quick calculations. From the information we received from Mr. Reischl we need 114 parking spaces for the hotel usage. If we have a 200-seat restaurant, then we need 50 more. That's 164. There's going to be other accessory uses, so let's say 200 parking spaces. No, let's be generous and say 250 parking spaces, because there may be things that we haven't anticipated yet, and you need employee parking. So for 250 or 300 parking spaces why do you need a four-story or a three-story parking garage? And the answer is you're going to do something to attract people other than usage for the hotel; right? MR. PIRES: No, sir. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: In other words, you're going to try to operate what you were asking for with the private club, but to do it and not call it a private club; isn't that really what you're telling me? MR. PIRES: No, sir. We're not going to operate a private club. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: You're not going to operate a private club, but you're going to provide all the parking to do -- without calling it a private club and without operating it as a private club; isn't that correct? MR. PIRES: No, sir. What we're going to do, as I indicated, is have the parking. We can have adequate parking and even more parking for the principal use and its associated customary uses. It can be convention facilities, stage entertainment, restaurants, beach facilities, health facilities, all that are customary associated accessory facilities of a hotel. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Mr. Chairman, we don't generally penalize people for going above and beyond what the code requires. I understand your point, and that is are they trying to come in the back door here. And I think via statements like that on this record and via stipulations that we have the ability to put in whatever motion we eventually get to, we can make sure that that doesn't happen. I understand your point, but the parking in and of itself may indicate that. If you can clearly indicate you're not going to have a private club that you say helps -- MR. PIRES: We're not going to have a private club -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: -- a little bit. I think once we get through the rest of your presentation, it's going to help clarify what uses you do and don't intend. What I think you see from at least a couple of members of the board, some concern about what was originally presented. Now you've withdrawn some of that. When I read this over the weekend there were the conditional use, and there were a number of variances. That has slimmed down considerably to this point to just a couple of points. And we need to make sure as -- as part of your presentation that those uses aren't going to crop up through the back door. And I've heard you assure that, but we need to be very clear on that now as you go through your presentation, because I'm not sure that everything -- and, again, it's -- that's not what's in front of us now. But I'm not sure that everything that had initially been presented was compatible with what some of the board members felt. I'm just getting in that left field here. So we're going to need some assurance that that's not what you're looking to do now over and above your verbal statement. I think we need to know what are you looking to do. MR. PIRES: Once again, we -- you know, there's a stipulation there will not be a private club pursuant to the Land Development Code. We've said that; it's on the record. We've committed to that. And from the standpoint -- the variance request is solely for the tower portion of the project, and that's necessitated by the height. The RT zoning district requires setbacks in this instance -- instance for the tower be one-half the height of the structure. The structure is 98 feet and needs to be set back 49 feet. That's irrespective of any parking consideration. I believe Barbara Cawley can testify to that. I just wanted to make that -- COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: So the only variance request you're having right now is in regards to height? MR. PIRES: That's correct. For height variance for the tower portion of the structure solely. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: There are no setback variance? COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Setback variance. MR. PIRES: The variance relates to that portion of the tower structure. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Thank you. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I guess then that's where we need to focus our discussion, because we seem to be drifting off onto other things. And there is a particular variance being requested, and we need to address that. And if there are some problems with that, we need to address those. But some of the other things aren't being requested anymore. And if they're not being requested, we're not doing a lot of good talking about them. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Let me ask Mr. Reischl real quickly what would be the typical number of parking places for a 103-unit hotel. COMHISSIONER CONSTANTINE: They're not asking for any reduction in parking spaces. MR. REISCHL: It would be the 114 just for the hotel and then the restaurant and -- COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: What about convention space? MR. REISCHL: Convention space -- COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- because parking at the Marriott's a nightmare. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. But, board members, I understand that's not what they're asking for. But by granting this variance what they are, in effect, doing is asking us to -- to grant them a variance so that they will have more room available to build a parking structure which is going to be far and above what their typical usage would be. And that's why I'm trying to get to -- MR. REISCHL: Okay. The accessory structures, I think, are spelled out in the parking requirement including restaurant, miscellaneous retail uses, meeting rooms, ballrooms and convention rooms, lounges, bars, and nightclubs. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: So all of those -- all of those have to be factored in at the time of SDP to provide the proper amount of parking? MR. REISCHL: Right. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Mr. Pires. MR. PIRES: Yes, sir. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Do you have an architectural rendering that specifies the amount of convention space, lounges, restaurants? You don't have that? MR. PIRES: No, we do not. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. Because if you are going to include significant convention space, anyone who has attended a convention at the Marriott knows that more parking is needed than is provided there. That would bump up your parking requirements significantly if you were to do significant convention space. MR. PIRES: Yes, sir, convention facilities, conference facilities. So in working with -- COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: I'm as suspect as Commissioner Norris about the private club side of things. The inability to nail down a number of parking spaces today is related to the -- those things not being answered, those things not being decided yet? MR. PIRES: It's anticipated, once again, a conceptual plan that the restaurant and convention facilities be primarily located in this structure closer to the beach for which no variance is being requested. So, once again, it's an accessory -- customary accessory use to a hotel, so we don't believe it's pertinent to this discussion. The request for the variance is, once again, along this yellow line here solely for the tower portion dealing with the hotel units themselves. I'd like to at this time have the board qualify Miss Barbara Cawley of Wilson, Miller, Barton, and Peek. And I'd like to tender her as an expert in land use and zoning and the Land Development Code. I don't know if the board wishes to engage in any examination of her. Her resume is in front of you. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: We'll stipulate. MR. PIRES: Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. And Ms. Barbara Cawley. MS. CAWLEY: Good morning again, Commissioners, Barbara Cawley for the record. I think Tony's done a pretty good job of describing the parcel to you and why we're here today for this -- this variance request. We've natrowed down our variance request, as Tony has said, to a very, very small area of the site. And we looked at the site to determine why we needed -- how we could construct a building on the site, and this was the minimum that we could do in terms of how the shape of the parcel allowed us to build and because of other factors that also are involved in the site such as the coastal construction control line, such as views from adjacent properties which we didn't want to disturb. We felt that those were -- were crucial in terms of how we -- we located the building on the site. And in order to fit the -- the required -- the use that we're requesting, the hotel unit on the site, this is the minimum variance that we're -- that we're going to need. The other part of that is that in terms of parking spaces if we were going to be changing the design of this property, this -- this building, we may not be able to get the minimum number of parking spaces required by moving the building in -- in a different location. So we were concerned about making sure that we had the minimum parking spaces that we did need in order to -- to build on this site and to adequately serve the people that are going to be using the hotel. As -- as Tony said, really the parking -- number of parking spaces that we're -- that we're going to be locating on this site is now irrelevant, because we don't have a request in for the -- the parking structure anymore. It's -- it's going to comply with any setbacks that are existing on the site. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Let me -- let me ask something there, because there's a similar situation, and I don't want to get into it because it's in code enforcement right now. If a hotel comes in for an SDP, they have to provide a parking calculation. MS. CAWLEY: That's correct. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. In that parking calculation they have to account for all generators of parking spaces. MS. CAWLEY: That's correct. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: If in that you put in, you know, off site -- you know, off site beach people or off site -- if there's anything extra and above that, that would be a serious question probably from our staff's perspective why additional parking and so forth. I'm trying to nail down where this comes about. If we find out down the road that you are -- that the property is selling parking spaces to utilize the beach and it was not a part of your parking calculation, I believe we then have a violation of the zoning ordinance, do we not? MS. CAWLEY: That would be something for code enforcement to look at at that -- at that time. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: And we're looking at it right now on another property. MS. CAWLEY: And then I guess we'll have an answer if code enforcement is in the process of -- COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: My interpretation is that -- MS. CAWLEY: I don't know where they are with that. I didn't -- COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Yeah. Bob, if someone is -- is selling beach privileges at a hotel property where they can come and park, if their parking calculation for their SDP did not show it, it would be a zoning violation. MR. MULHERE: I would agree. We have a zoning violation. We have a violation of the approved SDP as well. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: But if they're giving them away, not selling them -- MR. MULHERE: I think we still have a violation. MS. CAWLEY: And generally I know that the staff encourages additional parking. We get into situations where we have one parking space over the max -- the minimum needed, and that does get into some problems sometimes. But in this case we probably will have -- giving ourselves a buffer in terms of causing any problems with parking down there. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: How many hundred buffers would you -- MS. CAWLEY: Commissioner, I really don't know how many parking spaces they're talking about. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Let me ask if this would be a real good time to -- to ask if the petitioner would be willing to stipulate that they will make their calculations on their SDP for parking with the approved uses. Would you be willing to stipulate that you'll go to that calculation plus or minus 10 percent or plus 10 percent? MS. CAWLEY: Let me let the petitioner answer that question. MR. PIRES: I believe that would -- once again, I think the topic is being diverted from the primary focus of the tower, which is the variance that's being requested, and as to -- as to the question asked, I believe that what is now happening is that the minimum is now becoming the maximum. Once again, the determination of the number of parking spaces is something that's determined by the property owner, and through our access the code says enhance your interior landscaping, and that's -- CHAIRMAN NORRIS: So your answer was no? MR. PIRES: That's correct. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. Thank you. If that's all, Miss Cawley, we'll go to the public speakers. MS. CAWLEY: Excuse me. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: I got one question. MS. CAWLEY: I just need to put a few things on the record for your indulgence as an expert tendered in land planning. There exists an exceptional and unique land hardship unique to this parcel and not shared by others in the area. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: While you're on that, may I ask, has that hardship been imposed on the property owner since the property was purchased by this property owner? MS. CAWLEY: Since the property was purchased? No, it was prior to purchase. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: So it existed before the property was purchased. MS. CAWLEY: That's correct. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. Let's have that on the record as well. MS. CAWLEY: That's correct. It was done under -- as Tony -- Mr. Pires stated, during the bankruptcy and foreclosure of the property. The minimum variance necessary -- this is the minimum variance necessary to make a reasonable use of the property as requested today, and we've revised the site plan to show that minimum variance needed. And the staff has concurred with this request. The requested variance is consistent with the Land Development Code, with the growth management plan, and is in harmony with the general intent and purpose of the provisions in the Land Development Code. The granting of the variance will not be injurious to the neighborhood and will not be contrary to the public interest. We agree with the staff recommendations and the Collier County Planning Commission recommendations and the conclusion that this variance should be granted. I also agree that no reasonable use of the property can be made of this property without granting this variance. The only reasonable use of this property is for a high-rise structure, and this -- and the minimum variance that we're requesting is necessary in order to make reasonable use of this request and that this -- this variance, if granted, will permit the property owner to make reasonable use of the property, and this reasonable use could not be made without granting of this variance. Thank you very much. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: I have a question. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Commissioner Matthews has a question, Miss Cawley. MS. CAWLEY: Yes. COHHISSIONER MATTHEWS: As a land planner looking at that -- at the drawing, I guess it really doesn't matter which drawing MS. CAWLEY: Any drawing would work. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: In the RT zoning the required setback is one-half of the building height? MS. CAWLEY: That's correct. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: And the height is 98 feet? MS. CAWLEY: That's correct. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Can you give me some idea of '- MS. CAWLEY: Where that would cut off? COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: -- where that would cut off? MS. CAWLEY: It would be approximately about here (indicated). You would cut off this entire south end of the -- of the property here. This is -- you would -- you would cut off -- this is -- this is approximately 54 feet here. So if you do the same thing here, you're -- you're cutting off the entire south end of this building. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: You're going to lose about one-third of the building. MS. CAWLEY: You lose about a third of the building; that's correct. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Okay. Thank you. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Hiss Cawley, while you're there, what if you took that portion of the building and just continued the angle on out to the southwest '- MS. CAWLEY: Down this way? CHAIRMAN NORRIS: -- couldn't you get the same number of units in there? MS. CAWLEY: You couldn't. You would also have a problem of -- of the property line as well. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: How about if there was an additional wing on the north end that went straight out to the west? You could get your units, couldn't you? MS. CAWLEY: You would really have a tortured building if you start making a big L in the building in terms of how the -- and it would also block the views of the people in the Eagle's Nest which we were really concerned about. So we wanted to make sure that the building was as far to the east as we could go in order to be compatible with our neighbors. I don't believe that it would be an appropriate building. MR. PIRES: Just briefly, I guess, also, Hiss Cawley, we have a conceptual landscaping plan, If you could briefly describe that to the board. I know there are a number of registered speakers, and then if I could make brief concluding comments with opportunity for rebuttal. MS. CAWLEY: This is a -- this is a rendering -- I know people in the audience can't see. This is a rendering that we did of the site plan. And the interesting thing about this is that the developer has a history of developing high-rise condominiums and in -- and landscaping the tops of parking structures. If you're familiar with The Brittany in Pelican Bay, this is the -- a similar idea from -- to that. This would be the high-rise structure. We now would have landscaping, of course, all along the southern portion of the -- of the property as well as our required buffer on the north and on the east. And the top of the parking garage would also have some type of landscaping to -- and also allow people to access the convention facility and beach facility along the top of the parking garage instead of having to go down into the parking area to have access to the beach facility. And then, of course, we have our boardwalk across the sand dune to the beach consistent with the -- with the code. COHHISSIONER MATTHEWS: What are the red things? MS. CAWLEY: Like bougainvillea. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Okay. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: It's an architect's illusion of a tree. MS. CAWLEY: They're bougainvillea. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: I thought trees were green, not red. MS. CAWLEY: Those are flowering plants. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Does that conclude your initial presentation? MS. CAWLEY: That concludes my presentation. MR. PIRES: In conclusion we believe that -- the staff has provided testimony in the form of the recommendations. And I believe they would say so today also, and we would like to hear them say that and that our expert, Barbara Cawley, had concluded that variance request is consistent with the growth management plan in harmony with the general intent and purpose of the LDC, the criteria, and seven-part test outlined in the Land Development Code for review granting a variance request have been met. Under Florida case law, particularly City of Coral Gables versus Geary, the irregular shape constitutes a classic hardship. There is a legal hardship under that same case. The hardship involved arises from circumstances peculiar to the realty alone, and it is not the act of the purchaser which brings the hardship into being and, therefore, is incorrect to charge him with having created it. He had not created it. We request an opportunity to provide additional rebuttal evidence and argument depending upon what, if any, pertinent comments may arise during the course of the registered speakers portion. Thank you very kindly, Mr. Chairman. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. We'll go to the public speakers. While Mr. HcNees is calling you up -- we'd like to call up one, and the following speaker, if you could come up and be ready to go. We limit our speakers to five minutes maximum. We have a number of speakers today, so we'd certainly appreciate if you don't use your total five minutes. We ask you probably to do your best not to be too repetitive. And one last reminder is that we are -- we're dealing with the discussion of a variance here. Please confine your -- your remarks to the subject of the variance. That's what's being discussed. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Mr. Chairman. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Yes. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Mr. Reischl looked like he wanted to interject something, and I'd like to hear that. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Mr. Reischl, you need to put something else on? MR. REISCHL: I just wanted to say that staff does recommend approval of the reduced variance. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. MR. HcNEES: Yes, sir, Mr. Chairman, your first speaker would be Hr. Eric Silversen (sic) followed by James Haynes. MR. SIVERSEN: Good morning. My name is Eric Siversen, and I am a taxpayer and resident of Marco Island. I'd like to make a couple points. I was a little taken back by the change today. I had come prepared for something quite different. But I have to tell you sitting here and listening to the petitioner's representative I smell a Trojan horse. It's just as clear as crystal to me. With respect to the parking and the inability or the unwillingness to generate an actual imperical number frightens me to no end. The -- the area in question, it -- it -- it lends itself to problems. Number one, those people that live on Marco are aware of the conditions this summer due to lack of drainage on the island. With every rainfall of any significance Collier Boulevard was completely flooded, impassable. The -- the building of any further structures and/or parking facilities or macadam will further make difficult the problem of -- of losing that water, that rainwater, in the summertime. It will just make matters that much worse. Having been a previous business owner of a security company on Marco Island, I can also tell you that the most security problemed area is the beach adjacent to the Eagle's Nest which is adjacent to the property requesting the variance. I submit to the board that a check with the sheriff's department will confirm the fact that the calls to the beach for problems are significant in that area, perhaps the most significant on Marco Island. Basically without those imperical numbers, I'd like to leave it at two minutes by saying again and repeating again, I believe that this is a Trojan horse, that it's just a -- a ruse for getting back to the original concept that the developer had. And one last point, with respect to the -- the hardship, the petitioner purchased the hardship. It may not have been his fault that the hardship exists, but the petitioner himself purchased the hardship. Thank you very much for your time. (Applause) CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Thank you. MR. DORRILL: Mr. Haynes and then Mr. Cronin. MR. HAYNES: Mr. Chairman, Commissioners, thank you. I'm Tim Haynes. I'm a full-time resident of Marco Island. I'm also a member of the Vision Planning Committee and have been since its inception, but I'm speaking as a resident of Marco Island right now. I support everything the prior speaker said with the addition of a couple of comments. One, I did hear petition -- I was ready to applaud the petitioner for the revision until I heard a few things that he said. One thing he said, that subsidiary uses had to do with the beach as well. He did dance around the idea that this would not be a private club. That's -- that's okay. That sounds good but -- however, would he agree that they would not advertise parking to off-island facilities that they or some people that they are involved with would support as a -- as an attractive sales gimmick? I am very frightened here, and I compliment you, Mr. Chairman and Mr. Vice-chairman, both of you, for your probing questions. And I think that there should be written assurances that there won't be any other subterfuges used, either implied in advertising or the salespeople on some other facility off island would be saying, hey, you buy this, you got -- you can park in this hotel. I would appreciate it. Thank you. MR. DORRILL: Mr. Cronin and then, Mr. Mackelfresh, you'll follow Mr. Cronin, if I could have you stand by, please. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: How many do we have, Mr. Dorrill? MR. DORRILL: I'm going to say you've got 18. MR. CRONIN: Good morning. My name is Dennis P. Cronin. I'm an attorney. I represent the board of directors and the board of administration for Club Regency, which is the property immediately to the south of this proposal. I think that one of the things that I would question the petitioner's presentation was that it was very conclusionary with respect to the issue of reasonable and practical use of this property. I think the board appropriately questioned a scale-down or a different development plan for this property, certainly makes it reasonable and practical. I think that what's really at issue here and what is underlying this entire proposal is an economic consideration, which is inappropriate for a variance consideration. You're looking at a 49-foot variance proposal on the south side of that property, which I believe is extreme in scope and extreme in magnitude and could clearly be scaled back to meet that requirement and redesign of the property. And that's really what needs to -- to be done here. I think that your -- the Florida case law is clear. The reasonable use of a property is this is the only use, and that's not the case here. It's very clear. Mr. -- Mr. Pires quoted the case of -- of Coral Gables versus Geary. Another quote from that is if a purchaser buys land with a condition creating a hardship upon it, the owner is only entitled to such variance as its predecessor was entitled, so I think that's clearly the case here. The irregular shape of the property is a function of the auction process and was reflected in the purchase price presumably that the petitioner paid for this property. With respect to other aspects of the elements of variance petition, I think that the -- the board should consider these as conjunctive, that they all have to be met, and clearly the -- the fact that there is a reasonable use of this property -- it's available. What's driving this -- this proposal is the case of economic feasibility. The boundary lines were drawn when the purchaser purchased the property. Is it hardship versus inconvenience, and is it self-created under that Coral Gables versus Geary case? The hardship issue must render it virtually impossible to use the land for the purposes or in the manner for which it is zoned, and that's clearly not the case here. That's the extent of my comments, and Mr. Hackelfresh and Mr. Pearman, Judge Pearman, also from Club Regency. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Wait, Mr. Cronin. You said that this was created -- this was created by -- and fill in the blank. But wasn't this created by Club Regency, and don't you have buildings that have a zero lot line setback on your property? MR. CRONIN: Because it was a phased development, I can let Mr. Hackelfresh speak to that. I believe that's irrelevant to the zoning for this property, yes. MR. DORRILL: Mr. Hackelfresh and then Mr. Pearman. MR. HACKELFRESH: My name is John T. Hackelfresh. I'm a resident of Marco Island. I'm a property owner of two unit weeks also at the Club Regency. And I'm also the vice president of their new board, which we have now taken over from the developer just in the past month. I have owned that property since about nineteen eighty-four -- three really at the Club Regency and have seen the disasters that have fallen on numerous people who have endeavored to buy the property to develop it to do whatever with it. But when it was first defined, that property was -- we had a very lovely little condominium time-share unit. And I'll be glad to show a photograph -- picture -- picture of the board which I think -- or rendering to the board which I think would be very nice to know what the original plans were. Let's see. Here we go. Here's some postcards that they provided. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. You have to speak on the record, Mr. Mackelfresh. MR. MACKELFRESH: These are postcards that were provided, and that is essentially the way the development was to be done over a period of time in a phased -- phased manner. Well, we all know that finances can get to be a problem, and it happened in the configuration of that lot or property was -- was defined in 1986. And it hasn't changed since 1986. If there's a hardship, I think the only hardship is paying many millions of dollars for a piece of property that you knew the lines on and made it difficult to build something on. So I question that there really is no real hardship at all, and they should -- I would hope that the developer would do -- endeavor to -- to design his building to more reasonably fit the property and not get involved in this -- not get involved in this zero setback line. Thank you. MR. DORRILL: Mr. Pearman and then Mr. Volpe. MR. PEARMAN: Good morning, Commissioners. My name is Ralph Pearman. I am individually an owner of weeks at both Club Regency and Eagle's Nest. And fortunately or unfortunately, I am the president of the board at Club Regency following a recent election and am here to appear on their behalf. And we really want to be good neighbors. And we realize that these folks have a right to build a hotel or a condominium on this property, and we wish them well. Just don't step on us in the process. We were not given any opportunity to observe or study or even know what the changes were for this morning to try to answer or object to this variance. The only thing we had was the initial phase plan which was shown at the previous hearing. And if you look at that, it's all concrete in front clear down to the beach line. I come from a rural area originally, and drainage is something that is very near and dear to everyone. And we have certain legal principles establishing the right to drainage. And being the neighbor is going to have all this concrete poured in there, according to their original plan, with no provision for drainage, we are concerned. We've seen no engineering studies. We have not been talked to how are they going to provide -- so that we don't get dumped on and inundated by this concrete structure that they're putting up known as a parking garage, that we do not know how big it will be, how high it will be, or how many spaces it's going to afford. Now, we want to get along, but we want to be able to use and enjoy our property, too. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: And I'm sorry to interrupt, but earlier at a different public hearing, Mr. Weigel, I asked if someone got their petition -- that was the affordable housing -- if they were required to get certain permits for their water and sewer. And you had said yes, regardless of what we did here. I'm going to assume -- and this is just trying to answer that question, is that between the county and Southwest Florida Water Management and others that the drainage issues all have to be addressed so that it's not just concrete going -- so the water doesn't just drain anywhere, particularly onto the neighbor's property; is that correct? MR. WEIGEL: That is correct. And that would come through site development plan and other reviews at the county level, let alone any outside governmental entity that might be looking at it. MR. PEARMAN: I was concerned that Mr. Pires did not give any unequivocal answer to the chairman's question about the membership or the back-door issue. And we would like to have an answer that Fiddler's Creek or no other development that they are connected to, members will be given, awarded, sold, or in any way provided passes, parking spaces, or access through this particular development. And we have another particular interest. There was an easement granted by our predecessors, the developer, at Club Regency to this neighboring property for common use or easement of this entrance. At that time we had no idea how many people will be coming through. We were not given the opportunity to comment on it. We have seen no -- nothing in the plans or what provision is going to be made to access. But I think as one of the commissioners commented, the traffic and parking and problems at the Marriott when they have a convention. Now, are we going to have to share a common entrance with them with the convention facility for an easement that was taken without any consideration given or any concern for the property use traffic tie-up effect on Collier Boulevard that was going to be given? Also, I'd like to clarify that Club Regency was not built in 1986 but about four or five years previous to that. Eighty-six was when the first developer went bankrupt and it was foreclosed on. We -- we would like to get along with them and -- for the betterment of all the properties along the beach. But if they won't talk to us, tell us what they're going to be doing, show us their plans, we have no alternative but to appear here and respectfully request that you deny this application until further plans can be provided and exact answers be given to your questions. Thank you. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Thank you. MR. DORRILL: Mr. Volpe and then Mr. Blanchard. MR. VOLPE: Good morning, Mr. Chairman, members of the board. My name is Michael Volpe with the law firm of Treiser, Kobza, and Volpe. I'm here this morning as the legal representative for the 90 unit owners of The Chalet of San Marco, which is a condominium to the south of the subject real property. I am a legal representative to my clients. You have your legal representative who has advised you regarding the procedure. On behalf of my clients I would like to object to the procedure which is currently being employed in this quasi-judicial hearing. This is an advertised public hearing. It is quasi-judicial in nature. The matter which we have come here today to address is the petition which was reviewed by your CCPC, the Collier County Planning Commission, which sought 12 variances for the purposes of allowing the construction of a multifamily residential structure. I have sat here during these proceedings. I have no idea of what -- which 1 or 2 of those 12 variances are being requested. So I feel that as a matter of procedure this is not the proper venue at this particular time, that there is a substantial change or modification in the petition which is a matter that should go back to your CCPC. I've heard Mr. Reischl, I believe, make some comments about some variances, but those have not been, from what has been represented this morning, properly evaluated by the staff. So on behalf of our clients, I am objecting to the procedure that is being employed. Secondly, this is a quasi-judicial proceeding, and it is the petitioner's burden to prove by substantial competent evidence that the petitioner has met all of the criteria that is required in order for the grant of a variance. I need to just go back just a moment in history. This property previously received a preliminary SDP in 1991, and in that way the then property owner was able to avoid zoning teevaluation. It was exempted from zoning teevaluation. I questioned whether that prior approval of the SDP for this site, which would be phase two of Club Regency which showed another multifamily condominium project and how that prior approval impacts upon the proceedings that we're engaged in this morning. A lot of discussion about private club. I'm glad the questions have been asked. There have been no questions asked about -- originally we were looking at a conditional use which would accommodate a restaurant of 250 seats -- I have no idea of what the size of the restaurant will be to service -- I believe, it's 103 units. Also a private club, if you look at your definition under your Land Development Code, that means that there would be no unrestricted access by the public. So obviously you sell memberships to a private club. A hotel is a public facility. And so I think that with the restaurant and health club membership which would be an accessory use to a restaurant, there are opportunities that exist. Someone has mentioned that perhaps this is through indirection what we had taken away with the withdrawal of the conditional use. So I think that those are issues that the board should be aware of. The last point I would make is simply that there are a number of criteria which are in your Land Development Code, and I submit that there has not been substantial competent evidence to establish that this variance, whatever the variance is that's being requested, is a land-related hardship that was not created by the petitioner who purchased this property with full knowledge of what the restrictions were. And in closing I would simply request advice from the county attorney as to whether there would be the opportunity for any representative of an affected property owner to cross-examine the experts who have offered testimony this morning. MR. WEIGEL: Do you want me to respond? Yeah, I'll be happy to respond. In -- in the presentations that are made by the speakers that have signed up, through the chair they may have -- may have the opportunity to elicit information from the petitioner to be brought before the board. The chair retains the ability to control the length and type of discussion within certain parameters. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. MR. VOLPE: So may we submit questions to the chair to be asked of the petitioner in rebuttal? MR. WEIGEL: Well, you can -- if the chair so determines, you could direct the questions directly to the petitioner, and -- but the chair continues to be the moderator of the hearing, in any event. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: The petitioner's representative has asked to retain the right for rebuttal at the end of the discussion period, and if you are requesting the same right, I think it would probably be appropriate. MR. VOLPE: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Mr. Weigel, Mr. Volpe raised a point that this petition is not exactly as it was advertised now. Am I correct in -- from your earlier statement that the variances that are now being sought are -- a few of those that were originally advertised and, therefore, we can proceed with this hearing? MR. WEIGEL: I think thatws correct. Staff may have some additional comment in that regard. And by virtue of the fact that, in essence, we have a reduction of that was advertised -- CHAIRMAN NORRIS: But my point is that the variances that are being requested are exactly the -- the way they were presented in the advertised material? MR. WEIGEL: Well, ultimately thatws not important. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. MR. WEIGEL: The legal advertisement requirement merely has to be -- CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Bottom line is we can proceed? MR. WEIGEL: Yes, you can. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: The substance of the variance that is still being requested has been reviewed by the Planning Commission? CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Yes. Just instead of 12 now there are what; 37 MR. WEIGEL: Evidently, something to that effect. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: This particular variance, though, being requested the Planning Commission has addressed, I mean, this small part that itws reduced to? MR. WEIGEL: I believe so, yes. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Okay. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: I would like to point out, based on Mr. Volpews request, that we be consistent in time frames to avoid sitting here through an hour of questioning and cross-examination and so forth. I think whether itws the rebuttal time or the questioning time, we need to be consistent in that allotment. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: We will be. We will be. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: And wewll be brief because this is a -- not really -- this is a quasi-judicial hearing. Itws not a court of law. Mr. Blanchard, please. MR. DORRILL: And then Mr. Hill. MR. BLANCHARD: Thank you. Good morning. My name is Frank Blanchard. Iwd like to speak as a representative for two different organizations. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: You only get five though, Frank. MR. BLANCHARD: Huh? COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: You get only five minutes. MR. BLANCHARD: Iwm watching the time here. Youwll get a bargain. Youwll get it all two for one. The first organization Iwd like to present concerns from is the Marco Association of Condominiums. Iwm the president of that organization, and we have discussed the -- the proposal for the development of this property. Basically, I guess, with the changes that youwre making or the petitioner is making, if the request all fits within the existing zoning regulations, then we have no -- we have no reason to express concern. There is a concern. The primary concern that we had was primarily one of the intensity of use of that one section of the beach. As you know, youwre right in the middle of the prime hotel areas, and so the activities in that area are then maximized because of the numbers of people present on the beach during this time of year. Iim a little concerned. I was thrown off by saying this is not to be a social club arranged. But there is within the existence of the current county regulations the possibility of a hotel arranging for some kind of social representation. I would like to request; could you please print that in the newspaper as to what that is? Thatls a little concern. Now, actually I had heard rumors of one of the hotels south of this area perhaps of making some kind of an arrangement with people who lived in Eagle Creek. Iim not sure. Is this arrangement policed? Who polices it? What is the control mechanism? COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Frank -- and just real quickly, thatls something that I have worked on on other properties. And the bottom line is if a hotel property tells someone who buys in another property you can use our parking, thatls an off-site parking demand. Unless their original development order allowed for that, they are in violation, and the county can take them to task on it. MR. BLANCHARD: All right. So in this particular case then that will not occur? COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: In this particular case if -- and Iim drawing the scenario, and Iim sure our staff will correct me if Iim wrong here. If these folks say to the folks in Fiddler Creek -- and, of course, I know this has nothing to do with the variance, but this is the main question that Iim hearing from the residents on Marco. So if these folks tell the people in Fiddler Creek, herels your sticker, you can park at our property, thatls an off-site parking generator that is not allowed or permitted by this action today or by the site development plan, and it canlt be. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Once again, welre getting far afield from the variance. MR. BLANCHARD: Could I ask that you please print in the newspaper what the current county permitted arrangements are for this hotel that was referred to? Iim not aware of that. I presume -- COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Why donlt we just have our staff mail something directly to Mr. Blanchard. COMMISSIONER MACIKIE: That we can control. What the newspaper prints we have trouble with. We rarely can control what the newspaper prints, so we would do better if -- MR. BLANCHARD: You too? You also? COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Very much so. MR. BLANCHARD: The other organization I wanted to represent is that Iim the chairman of the advisory committee for beach renourishment on Marco Island. And by your direction you have asked that committee to control the beach vendor arrangements on the beach. And obviously if youlre going to permit an intensity of use on that beach, youlre exacerbating it at just the wrong place in the -- in that area. So please be considerate of what will take place in that area. Itls already crowded. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Why are you looking right at me? Therels five of us up here. MR. BLANCHARD: Well, I donlt know. Perhaps you were looking at me, and I established eye contact, so I was talking -- Bettye, I appreciate the comment. I'll talk with Pam. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Let's talk. MR. BLANCHARD: Our concerns are really intensity of use. The second point is that we would hate to see a precedent set by whatever kind of arrangements you make on this property, because there is the potential of other properties along the way. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Thank you, sir. MR. BLANCHARD: Thank you. MR. DORRILL: Mr. Hill and then, Mr. Lyon, if I could have you stand by, please. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: How many do we have left, Mr. Dotrill? MR. DORRILL: Ten after Mr. Lyon. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Ten, that's 50 minutes maximum. Let me ask the board if -- the pleasure of the board if we take a lunch break, come back and rehear the rest of these. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Keep going. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: There's only one more item after this one, too. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Board members I was polling. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: There's only one more item after this one. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Let's go. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: I'd just as soon finish it. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: No lunch. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. We got three no lunches, so we'll go ahead. Thank you, sir. Go right ahead. MR. HILL: Good morning. My name is Howard Hill, and I'm representing The Chalet of San Marco Condominium Association where I am president. We were very disturbed when we first found out about this project and rightfully so. I come here today, and I'm just as confused as I was disturbed before. I don't know what we have. The only thing I'm confident of is that when the developer bought this property at auction, he didn't buy a pig in the poke. He knew exactly what he had. And I find it very, very uncomfortable at this point to have them come before this commission today and present a totally new plan that we were unaware of and I'm assuming all of you were unaware of. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Just a quick correction. I've got to reiterate. This is not a totally new plan. They've eliminated all except I think one item, but it was one of the items they requested before. It's not a totally new item. MR. REISCHL: There are 4 requested setbacks out of the original 12. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: And I know that we're all confused by virtue of the -- of the changes, but I hope that, you know, you can understand, I'm -- I'm confused by this. It seems to me they were asking for a lot more, and you guys won. You scared them off. They're not asking for what -- all these many, many variances and this conditional use. And that's probably good, because they also can probably count and realize that they weren't going to get the votes for that because of the extreme amount of objection in the community. But what they're asking for now is just the setback variance that is generated by the height of the building. You're not going to have more density than you would otherwise have. And if they do something other than that, we -- it's our job to send code enforcement out there to make them stop. And you're -- we hope and trust that you'll tell us when they're violating that. But I think that, you know, the change may have confused people. It seems to me that you've already won a great deal of what you set out to -- to do. MR. HILL: Well, I -- in all due respect, I disagree with that. I have a problem with giving any variance because of this alleged hardship on this property based on the fact that they knew what they had when they bought it. I'm not or we're not against a development of that property per se, believe me. We're not against that, but we -- I want to reiterate; we have a problem with what they -- how they've gone about accomplishing this. My guess is they never had the first intention to put up the original -- original project. They had this in the closet somewhere, and it hasn't just developed over the last couple three weeks. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Well, the original project bankrupted. MR. HILL: I'm talking about the original project that the developer presented here two or three weeks ago. I will hope -- I would hope that the commission -- commission would reject this -- the petitioner's request for a variance. Thank you very much. (Applause) CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Let's take a break and let the court reporter change her paper. And let me ask -- we're going to go ahead and go through lunch here. If you do intend to speak and all the points you want to make have already been made up here, we wouldn't mind if you'd just pass. But if you do have something new that hasn't been put on the record yet, by all means, please come up and say so. MR. DORRILL: This is Mr. Lyon. Then Dr. Biles will follow Mr. Lyon. Mr. Lyon, go right ahead, sir. MR. LYON: My remarks will be more in the line of questions than answers, I'm afraid, but I don't believe the county commissioners have before them adequate information on which to base a decision. There's been some what I believe misinformation and some mistakes made. The speaker for the planning staff said that the lot line had been created by a court order. I'm aware of the lot line for years prior to the court order. I believe the lot line was drawn as a phase line for phase two of the -- of the Regency development. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I think I can actually answer that one. Up here. Hello. MR. LYON: Hello. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: It was a phase line for the condo, but what they mean, the court created it as a property line. It was a part of one big lot, but when it -- when the foreclosure happened, the court drew a line and said this is the new lot line, the new legal property. MR. LYON: With all due respect, I think you're in error. The lot line -- CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Excuse me. Present your case, and let's move on. MR. LYON: Thank you. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: It's a minor point, in any case, who established the line. The line is there. MR. LYON: The line has been given some credibility presumably by a court order. It's my opinion that's not so. One of the expert witnesses talked about a parking structure three or four stories high but couldn't tell us how many parking places there would be. I find that hard to understand, and I think it's a question that your board is entitled to. And -- and an expert who knows the size of a building should be able to tell you how many parking places there are. I'd like to ask whether or not all of the owners of the abutting properties have been notified in writing of this hearing. I've talked to some here today who have not been. Have you -- has the planning staff any idea of the total floor area of all of the buildings that are proposed to be built? Have they taken that into consideration? Is there any other tract of land on Marco Island with such intensity of development? The zero lot line of Club Regency that was referred to as preexisting -- if there was a zero lot line, it preexisted only because it was a phase line rather than a subdivision line. The deed under which this property was originally deeded said that there would be no subdivision of the property. Those are my questions. Thank you. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Thank you. MR. DORRILL: Dr. Biles and then Mr. Kramer. MS. BILES: For the record, Fay Biles. I'm president of the Marco Island Taxpayers' Association. And I agree with Commissioner Mac'Kie; don't believe everything you read in the paper, and don't read John Lundsford's articles. I've been accused of writing a letter to the commissioners. I want to say to you that we all met together. Joe Coriatchi (phonetic) wrote a letter on behalf of MICA. Frank Blanchard wrote one on behalf of MAC. We have realtors. We have -- many people have written letters. I do want to correct one thing he said also. He alluded or inferred that there was a high-rise developer that had objected to this. That's not true, absolutely not true. We have checked into that. I think we all know who he's alluding to. He had never said a word of complaint. I think there's a principle involved here that I like -- I would like the commissioners to think about setting a precedent. What is to prevent any developer from coming in, buying a piece of property for land use -- they know the configuration. They know everything about it. They know the code. They know the setback. They know exactly what is required -- and then coming into the commissioners and saying, well, now we want to upgrade this and we want to make more money out of it and, therefore, we need to change the variance, we need to change other things about it? I think this is so fuzzy at this point, how many floors, what the height, of the parking places. I think it's probably time to go back to the Planning Commission and let them look at this whole project again. It's been made very fuzzy, and I think you're going to be setting a precedent if you give a variance for something that no other property on Marco Island -- Collier, South Collier has a lot of hotels, a lot of condos. They're attractive. They have obeyed the variance. Nobody else on Marco has been given that variance. Why should we now give this property a variance in order to make more money out of it or whatever? You're cram jamming a lot into that small property when they knew from the beginning what they had. Those are my comments. I won't repeat everything else because it's been said. Thank you. (Applause) MR. DORRILL: Mr. Kramer. Mr. Kramer and then Mr. Patterson. MR. KRAMER: Thank you. My name is Fred Kramer. here on behalf of the Marco Island Civic Association. Iid like to thank you for the opportunity to speak with you. Iid also ask the chairman, if I might, if you would allow me and the petitioner would allow me to take my time to ask several questions of their expert witness, Miss Cawley. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Thatls a little bit out of order, Mr. Kramer. MR. KRAMER: Thatls fine, sir. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Perhaps you could get with one of the representatives that is going to be allowed to -- to have rebuttal at the end and get your questions asked. MR. KRAMER: All right. Also, I apologize if I did not do this. I would like to join with Mr. Volpe in the objections he raised before the board this morning. We have a situation where last fall the petitioner acquired this property in a foreclosure sale. Within three months it sought a variance for the zoning code. That was before us until this morning when all of a sudden itls announced that this massive project for a 64-unit high-rise condominium had overnight changed to a 103-hotel-unit facility. I cannot understand the petitionerls testimony that this three and a half acres cannot be developed in any way or any fashion without going to a property line -- CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Use the hand-held mike if you want to go over there, please. Itls right behind that -- MR. KRAMER: -- how the only conceivable way to develop this property bought by the developer with existing law as it is and knowing the problems is develop a building which now becomes a hotel again overnight, a zero lot line, a structure 98 feet tall on the property line. I cannot imagine therels any other facility in the entire county with a zero lot line with a facility like that. If there is, Iid stand corrected by the petitioner. I cannot understand how no reasonable use may be made of this property unless this 98-foot structure is built on the property line. I cannot understand therels no ability to develop anything but a high-rise facility here when the property -- when the property to the south of it is a garden style two-story facility. If I understand correctly, then the variance sought is purely for the area of roughly a hundred feet along the property line for the structure of a 98-foot building, again, as a hotel. That is not in accord with the petition that was presented or advertised. Thank you for your time. MR. DORRILL: Mr. Patterson and then Mr. Savage. MR. PATTERSON: I waive my right to speak. MR. DORRILL: Mr. Savage, and then Mr. Schmidt will follow Mr. Savage. MR. SAVAGE: Good afternoon, Chairman and Commissioners, and thank you also for allowing me to speak. Iive been at odds all morning listening to all these comments. And one of the greatest things that Fred Kramer just talked about it, one of the biggest items that hels asked for in the variance is to put a 98-foot high building on a lot line. If youill look at this orange or pink drawing over here, you imagine the property that owned -- is owned by the tennis court people decide they want to build a building on their tennis court. They have the right to do so according to our laws and our zoning. What are they going to do? Does this owner have an agreement with the adjacent property owners so that there's no building going to be built next door to that nine-story or 98-foot building? That's one of the biggest factors in the whole project. He has the legal right to do an RT building, and I think the county planning people have done a very great job. They have every right to do those things. This is still free -- not free, excuse me, private enterprise. And I feel that they have a right to do those things but don't do those things which are totally out of -- out of the reason, and that is to build a 98-foot building on a lot line. I'll show you the GulfviewApartments, which I designed on Marco Island back in the '70s, and we had a hundred-foot setback, and it wasn't because we wanted to. It was because we had to, had a hundred-foot setback on a 20-story building. We had to do that. We followed the rule, parking garage there three or four stories tall. I don't know that many people even ever see that parking garage. Landscaping and the architecture of it was such that it isn't that noticeable, but it's still set back based on the law. I feel that this man or this woman or whomever it is in this project probably had their set of drawings and wanted to build it here instead of redesigning and building it for this particular site. The same thing about conventions. If -- if we have an architect that's involved in this, can you imagine putting the convention facility out on the beach when it should be up near the area, in my view, like the Marriott hotel or some of the other hotels have their facility near the traffic center where they can control all those matters and let the rooming units be out on the beach? Those are many things that are, of course, planning, and I'm not going to get into that. I'm just saying the legal aspect of a parking garage on this site along the lot line and a 98-foot building is totally out of the question and ought to be returned to them for restudy. And I thank you very much. (Applause) MR. DORRILL: Mr. -- Mr. Schmidt. MR. SCHHIDT: Good morning. I'm John Schmidt. I reside at 1421 Butterfield Court on Marco. I own three other pieces of property on Marco including beachfront property. I will not repeat anything anyone else has said. I have only two points to make. I do endorse the chairman's questioning, and I adopt the comments of the first two speakers. The only thing I'll suggest to this commission -- and forgive me if it's too naive to suggest -- is we ought to look into whether memberships to an athletic club at a hotel could be sold to someone who is a nonguest. This may be a way around things. And I don't know if it's appropriate for the commission to look at or to advise any other county or state commission, perhaps the consumer fraud division, if people start advertising access to this property through these developers. Thank you very much. (Applause) MR. DORRILL: I believe the next name is Hoai, H-o-a-i. MR HOAI: I'll waive my right to speak. MR DORRILL: Thank you. Mr. Bailey, R. E. Bailey. MR BAILEY: I'll waive my right. MR DORRILL: Mr. Donnelly. MR DONNELLY: I'll waive my right to speak. Mr Donnelly was your final registered speaker. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I think it's safe to say all three of you were opposed? Okay, okay, just checking. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Mr. Weigel, we'll now get into the -- into the rebuttal phase. We'll ask each side to limit their rebuttal to seven minutes. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Mr. Chairman. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Yes. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: While Mr. Pires is coming up, could I ask him to address the athletic club membership that was raised? MR. PIRES: I'll address that, if I could. I believe initially that -- I believe your staff and -- I can't speak for staff. Mr. Chairman, it may be appropriate to ask staff -- CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Go right ahead. MR. PIRES: Oh, I'm sorry -- whether or not the consideration of the parking is a valid consideration with regards to consideration of the variance. I believe the answer will be no, but I think it's appropriate to have them indicate that. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: We've been known to spend time on things that were not valid before. MR. PIRES: I just wanted to get that on the record, I think. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. MR. PIRES: Furthermore, with regards -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'm sorry. Did we get an answer from staff on that? I agree, it's a legitimate question. MR. REISCHL: This is a request for variance. The conditional use was withdrawn, and parking is usually not a consideration of a variance request. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Thank you. MR. PIRES: Additionally with regards to the nature of the variance request, once again, it's an approximately 220-linear-foot dimension, 145.82 feet in a north-south direction on the portion that fronts South Collier Boulevard. That lot line is actually about 65 feet from the right-of-way line of South Collier, so the building will be set back at least 65 feet from South Collier, but we need the variances along that lot line. And then there's -- say you have 145.82 feet north-south, approximately 75 feet east-west for a total distance of 220 feet that the variance is needed solely for the tower portion of this project. Once again, your staff has indicated it is a reduction. We have heard no competent substantial evidence contrary to that provided by your staff or competent substantial evidence provided by Hiss Cawley. I believe the case law is clear that when the petitioner meets the burden of proof, as we have, by, number one, receiving a favorable recommendation by the staff on the initial application; two, a favorable recommendation by the Planning Commission; three, a further favorable recommendation today by staff of the revised request; four, expert testimony from Hiss Cawley, that is all competent, substantial evidence. No other experts have been testifying here to rebut or contradict any of that testimony provided by those experts. Mr. Cronin represents, I believe he said, Club Regency. I believe that he testified -- mentioned about a tower structure. The proposed tower structure he mentioned, if the project was able to go ahead by a former owner as a successor developer, then that might be questionable. It wasn't the same location. That's -- the SDP that is referred to was right in this location (indicated). Dimensionally this tower is located about approximately 160 feet from the nearest residential unit situated on the Club Regency parcel. And this is at a diagonal in this direction (indicated). Just to make it clear, the parking is -- no variance is requested for the parking area. We're asking for a variance without any conditions. We will comply fully with the Land Development Code of Collier County, and if building commences, we'll file for a site development plan when we use the property as zoned RT for all of its permitted and permissible uses under the RT district. We don't believe there is any relevance to attempting to impose any conditions, and the variance should be granted as requested without any conditions. As a point of note as far as other clubs, other hotels, it hasn't been brought up by any of the members yet or the residents, but Marriott's Marco Island Resort, for example, offers a tennis membership. Residents are welcome to join, so residents of Marco Island currently enjoy that. Obviously that must be an accessory permitted use of a hotel. The Hilton Marco Island Beach Resort has a fitness center. Residents may join that. And those are clubs that those hotel facilities have that apparently are customary accessory uses. But, once again, we will only use this facility as permitted by the zoning -- by the zoning ordinance. And if a determination is made those are not proper, then those determinations will be made by your staff or by code enforcement whatever the permissible range of uses are we will utilize on this site. I find it also interesting to note the comments by The Chalet that no variances -- no variances ever. Their carport, which is located right about 5 feet from this lot line, received a variance in 1991. Apparently there must have been some determination made by them that it was appropriate to obtain it. But this might be a different situation. So they have a variance. They don't want anyone else to have one. Once again, this extremely irregular lot line, as testified to by Miss Cawley and as provided for by Florida cases, constitutes a classic hardship. Mr. Savage mentioned about a three- or four-story parking structure. This will not be visible from the road. It is tucked behind the building. Once again, the testimony was from Miss Cawley this is the minimum variance necessary to obtain a reasonable, practical use of the property. The property is not practically -- effectively can be utilized without it. It is not a self-created hardship under Florida law. And we request that you grant the variance as modified by the site plan that we have before you today. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Commissioner Hancock. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Yes, sir. Mr. Pires, on that point, if the variance were not granted, how would the footprint and external impacts of the building change? MR. PIRES: I can't answer that. It's speculative, once again. We know no other reasonable, practical use of the property can be utilized other than with granting this variance. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: The reason I ask that is the only reason I see to grant this variance is because building the building parallel to the street on a north-south orientation as opposed to an east-west is advantageous to the properties on either side. That's the only reason I see for granting this variance. If what you're telling me is that -- you know, the reason I come to that is you're requesting the variance to go this way because otherwise you're going to have to push along the northern property line towards the beach. MR. PIRES: That's correct. COHHISSIONER HANCOCK: So instead of 98 feet this way, we're going to have 98 feet going this way, which is going to have a much more adverse effect on the properties to the north and maybe a more adverse effect to the south or probably a wash -- I don't know -- to the south. I really can't visualize it as well. MR. PIRES: That's correct. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: So that's why I'm asking. I need to know -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: You will also be able to see parking from the road that way, too. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: It's going to put the parking in the front on the left as I look at the -- MR. PIRES: Yes, sir, I believe Hiss Cawley testified one of the considerations in citing it was to -- taking that into account. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Without the variance I don't like it better than I do with the variance and that it just -- and I don't think the people to the north are going to like it better. That's just a statement. MR. PIRES: Thank you for your comments. We request the approval of the variance as provided for by the site plan for that approximately 220-foot-linear dimension to zero -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Quick item. Just quick housekeeping item. I don't know that we recognized our staff as experts, which we need to get on the record. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: So moved. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Duly noted. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Mr. Volpe, you're going to handle the other side? MR. VOLPE: Yes, I will, Mr. Chairman. Thank you. Commissioner Hancock, what I heard you say was that the only reason that you would see for the granting of the variance is that it would be advantageous to the adjoining property owners. That is not -- I repeat, that is not one of the criteria for the grant of a variance. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: It's a real-world criteria, Mr. Volpe, that we have to deal with. I'm using it as a consideration in addition to what the applicant has put on the record. MR. VOLPE: I understand that, Commissioner Hancock. I appear as a legal representative, and from a legal perspective that is not what the criteria -- COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Fine. I'll consider it in conjunction with the other items the applicant has presented here today. MR. VOLPE: Mr. Chairman, could I ask for clarification as to exactly what variances are under consideration this morning? CHAIRMAN NORRIS: You may. Mr. Reischl, are we down to three variances on this? MR. REISCHL: Four. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Four. Explain them to Mr. Volpe, please. MR. REISCHL: There's a variance along the building line that runs parallel to South Collier Boulevard of various depths. I don't know if they have the letters on the map over there, but where A is, that's a request for a 46-foot variance to the 98-foot building here. Where letter B is, that's a request for 23 feet. And C at this portion of the building where the -- it architecturally protrudes there, that's a request for a 44-foot variance. And then along the south property line where you can see the blue property line in the pink building, that's where it goes down to a 49-foot variance request. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Could I -- could I make available to you this -- as part of the packet that was given to us that highlights that information, because it should be made clear to you? MR. VOLPE: I do have a copy of that. I just was not clear in the discussion which four we were talking about. At one point we were talking about two, and it was 220-feet-lineal variance. I just wanted to make sure I understood which were the four specific variances. In many instances what I think we have heard commented on was that these reductions would be 46 feet was a reduction to -- for one, a reduction of 26 feet for another. As a part of the criteria, the question is whether this is the minimum variance that would be required in order to meet the criteria of your Land Development Code. I don't believe that there has been any testimony that these are the minimum variances that would be required. Again, the evaluation of the staff was made based upon this building being used as a 64-unit residential multifamily residential unit. The findings of fact that had been made -- the findings of fact that had been made by your CCPC and those that are included in your agenda package were based upon a -- a different consideration than the consideration which is -- you're being asked to make this morning. In closing I just simply would emphasize that there are the criteria for the granting of the variance. One of the criteria is that this must be a land-related hardship. I submit that there has not been substantial competent evidence from the petitioner, whose burden it is, that there is, in fact, a land-related hardship. Miss Cawlay testified that this would allow for a reasonable use of the property. It doesn't -- for an economic perspective that there may be a better use of this property by allowing this building to be built with a variance which is a reduction of 46 feet. I think if you look at the record and the testimony that has been introduced this morning, what we have is perhaps an economic benefit, or we may have a perception that this variance will benefit adjoining property owners. But we have not, in my opinion, and I submit based upon the evidence, established any one of the criteria that would be required from a legal perspective to justify the grant of the variance. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Questions for Mr. Volpe? MS. STUDENT: Mr. Chairman, if I might for the record, I was aware of Commissioner Hancock's concern about neighboring property owners. And with all due respect to Mr. Volpe, there is a provision in our code and part of the variance criteria that talks about that the grant of the variance would not be injurious to the neighborhood. So looking at surrounding properties and how the building might fit in and whether or not it would cause a problem to the neighbors I think is a criteria that's in the code, and I wanted to clear that up for the record. Thank you. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Commissioner Constantine. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Mr. Volpe, I think Mr. Pires referred to Coral Gables v. Geary a couple of times as a cite case for this. Do you have any familiarity with that? Have you seen that? In your reference that you don't think legal substantial evidence has been -- competent substantial evidence has been put forth, are you -- do you have any familiarity with that case, and do you think it does or does not apply here? MR. VOLPE: I'm not sure if Mr. Pires cited that case as it related to a self-created hardship or whether it was on the issue of competent substantial evidence. It is my opinion that the authority is that the self-created hardship is not, in fact, the basis upon which a property owner can seek a variance. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: I want to handle that. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I got a problem with this self-created. MR. VOLPE: Correct. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: The property owner purchased a piece of property that had a property line created by a court action not involving the current property owner. The property owner did not create the hardship. A court action created the property line that is being referred -- would you let me get a question answered here, folks? MR. VOLPE: I don't disagree with that statement, Mr. Hancock. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. Because we're saying self-created, you're losing me a little bit there. MR. VOLPE: In the eyes of the law -- CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Excuse me, Mr. Volpe. He may not have created it, but he assumed it with the purchase of that property. MR. VOLPE: I was simply going to clarify that under the recorded cases where a person purchases property with full knowledge of what the configuration is and what the limitations are, the cases do hold that that is, in fact, a self-imposed hardship, perhaps not self-created, but self-imposed. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Yes. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: I can't help but remember all of the single-family lots at Lely Barefoot Beach who are of such odd configurations. People purchased those lots knowing the size and shape of the lot and as soon as they meet with their architect/builder find out, gee, I can't build what I want, and they're immediately in here asking for a variance of some sort. And there's not one yet that we've not granted. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Well, we're not discussing those today. MR. VOLPE: Hay I just -- just one last comment. Commissioner Hancock, the Coral Gables versus Geary does, in fact, talk about where the property has been purchased with certain limitations that that is, in fact, a self-created hardship. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Thank you, Mr. Volpe. MR. VOLPE: Thank you. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: With that I'll close the public hearing. We've set here through quite some time listening to all of this. There's a few common threads in this discussion that need to be brought out. And the main point is that we're discussing the variance and do they deserve a variance or do they not deserve a variance. And there's been a number of points raised that are very pertinent to that question. First of all, I think it's very important, and I think it is competent substantial evidence that the hardship was imposed by the court before the property owner bought the property. Therefore, as we have heard, he assumed that hardship and, therefore, it is a self-imposed hardship. We heard substantial competent evidence. I'll get to you, Commissioner Constantine, in just a second. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Yes, sir. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Now, the other thing that we have seen that is substantial competent evidence is that a -- a development could occur on this site that would be reasonable and economical and would not require a variance. It can be done. It's just a matter of rearranging the footprint of the building. So this -- this variance request then becomes a variance of convenience and not hardship. And that's very important, as also we've heard substantial competent evidence to that effect. I need to ask Mr. Reischl one question. We saw earlier in the discussion the -- a sort of a proposed site plan which had a large amount of impervious area. Is there a minimum requirement of pervious area? MR. REISCHL: Of the open space -- this lot is too small to qualify for the open-space requirement. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: So they could pave the whole thing -- COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Variance or not. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: -- as long as they take care of their water management. MR. REISCHL: Well, they couldn't go farther then the coastal construction line. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Yes. MR. REISCHL: But there is buffers that are required. There are, you know, various landscape -- interior landscaping that's required. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. Because of -- of the -- the items of substantial competent evidence that I have cited, I'm going to vary from normal procedure here and make a motion to deny this variance. Commissioner Constantine, you had a comment? COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Yeah. I completely understand the residents' concerns, particularly the suggested use. I think what was withdrawn today, the conditional use, the idea of having as much traffic and as much activity there that isn't normally necessarily associated with a hotel or a condo development I think was a valid thing. That was withdrawn today. We get down to just the variance issue. You mentioned two things, one, the assumed hardship as you referred to. And I -- I think Commissioner Matthews' point has a great deal of merit. When the individuals have purchased that property in north Naples, they had under your scenario assumed that hardship, and we should not grant that variance, but we have because they otherwise have a piece of property on which they cannot build a home, which is -- COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Not a reasonable home. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: A reasonable home, which is the zoned use of that property. And today we had someone whom we recognized as an expert testify, again, that you could not use this for -- have a reasonable use for this property simply by changing the footprint. So I disagree with you on that point, I guess. I have a number of concerns, but I don't know that we're -- I think they are meeting the hardship requirement, and I'm not sure we heard substantial competent evidence to contradict that. And I'm kind of grasping for a way to find if there is, but I -- I haven't come up with it. And we have -- we talked about parking, and that really doesn't apply here. If someone wants to put in more than the minimum, we don't prohibit that, whether it's with hurricane code or with parking code or with green space. If they want to put in more -- I don't disagree with you. It raises a red flag with me, but there's nothing illegal about that. We can't prohibit that from happening. And so -- you're right. I'm looking for something to grab on to here, but I can't find it from a legal perspective. And what this board had -- and we haven't had any for awhile, but we had a little streak, and prior to when we were on the board in 1991 and '92 and I think into '93 of things that were turned down and then overturned in court because there wasn't a legal means for which they were turned down. And I haven't been able to grab something here that I feel is a legal means to decline that, because I think they are meeting the hardship requirement, and in order to turn that back we have to have something to hang on to. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: And if I can respond to that, I would say that they can build a hotel in here without asking for a variance, and they can put in all the parking that they want. They can put in all of the accessory uses that they are allowed to by law, and they can do all of that and accomplish their goals without having a variance. And that's my response. And if they want to do that, that's fine. Power to them. They've got a legal right to do that. It's RT zoning and they can do it. But I'm just saying if you'll look at the property line there, you can already see that this is a -- a bad situation because it is such a chopped-up property line. And what we're being asked to do is take a bad situation and simply exacerbate it by putting a hundred-story building -- hundred foot -- excuse me, hundred-foot building -- COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Is that a motion, Commissioner Norris? CHAIRMAN NORRIS: -- on a property line. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Mr. Weigel, did you have something you were going to -- MR. WEIGEL: I do. Thank you, and you're right. It doesn't come up particularly often, and so when we roll up our sleeves and go through them, I think it's important to -- to look at the procedure as it's presented in the -- in the staff report and the agenda item. And I would urge you to refer back to the agenda item. Particularly the criteria and questions for criteria for a variance are shown on pages 6 and 7 of your agenda item. I'm not going to recite all the questions, but it's up to the board to determine the answers. The answers that appear in the agenda item are staff response based upon what's been before the staff. That's not necessarily determinative of the board's response or answer to those questions based upon the testimony and all of the materials that have been presented to you today. As you look at those -- as you look at those questions -- and a couple of them have been discussed or even paraphrased by Chairman Norris, Commissioner Constantine. I'll lead you to two. The second one is particularly little letter D on page 6, I think it is. And the other question I think is on page 7. And these two questions are -- and, in fact, have partially been discussed by this board as it approached the motion. Can the property be developed under current zoning that is compatible with neighboring properties? The board will make that determination as part of its full determination as to whether a variance is appropriate here. The second question -- and this harkens to little letter D on page 6 -- is the variance requested or variances requested the minimal variance necessary for the reasonable use of the land, building, or structure. Again, you're charged with the responsibility to answer that question in context with the other questions which form a basis for a determination as to whether a variance should exist. Hardship alone is a factor. You have your own determination to make based upon the information presented to you and the testimony today as to whether a hardship exists and at whose creation. But that's just one factor of several factors as you make your determination, ultimate determination, as to whether a variance should be granted. And the rest of those questions there, to the extent that you wish to address them on the record, may be of some assistance to you there. I can't give you the answers. The answers are yours. Okay? CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Go ahead. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Many of the people in the audience came here today to fight a much larger battle than we're discussing now. It was a battle over a private club. It was -- I call the proverbial ten pounds in a five-pound bag argument. And I think you were justified in -- in your concern. You were justified in being here. A lot of that has been removed. We can sit up here and talk all day about parking and about whether it's -- it can or can't be permitted. Even though it's outside the variance, I think it's a reasonable discussion to have, because it addresses a lot of the concerns of people that are here. I feel those concerns have been addressed through our code enforcement and zoning issues that disallow that type of use at a hotel. That's been made very, very clear. So I'm comforted in -- the private club scenario is no longer a facet of this. When I look at this -- when we talk about a land-related hardship, my -- my planning background tells me something very, very simple. When you have an irregular-shaped lot that squeezes the footprint down to a small size, you have two options. You can either request setbacks on the periphery, or you can go up. We have a combination here of an irregular -- an irregular lot with a hundred-foot high maximum. These petitioners made a choice. And that choice was rather than request a variance on height due to the small footprint, they would push the building to the south and do a zero setback adjacent to tennis courts. Of those two choices for people that live on Marco Island if they were going to request a variance, I think that was the better of the two. It's been said that they don't need a variance. Build what you've got. Yet this board hasn't taken that position on residential lots that were oddly configured. And although we will go after a builder that makes a mistake or an after-the-fact variance, when you're given the opportunity on the front end to make that decision, it makes it easier. So we've done it for residential lots that have had a lot fewer problems than the shape of this one. I think the conditions are very much the same. What would result if no variance is granted is a -- a less desirable footprint height and extension of building to the people to the north and possibly to the south. And I'm not in favor of doing that. So I'm not going to second the motion to -- to deny this request. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Bettye. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: I'm not going to second the motion either, and if the motion maker chooses to withdraw the motion, I'd like to make a substitute. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I'm not going to second it. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. My motion is going to die for a lack of a second. But let me explain what's happening here. The original proposal is for 64 units of condominium and a private club. And the reason for the private club was to get people other than who lives in the condominium access to the beach. Everybody knows that. There's no sense trying to hide that. Okay. So we -- we have made it clear that we're not going to approve the private club for the beach under the conditional use, so that has been retracted. Now, we have a proposal -- instead of 64 units of condominium, now we have a proposal for a hotel with many, many extra spaces of parking. What do you suppose that parking is going to be used for? The same thing that the private club was going to be used that we objected to. We're being sandbagged here, folks, and we need to understand that. If -- if -- if the property owner wants to live within the variances, power to him, hotel. If that's what he wants to do, 64 units of condo, fine, just don't give the variance. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: And you think by not granting the variance that will change anything that they would want to do even if it is against zoning codes? CHAIRMAN NORRIS: No. But at least it keeps them within the code. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Commissioner Norris, I understand your concern. I don't necessarily disagree, but we need to frame any objection we have within legal framework. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: And what we're being asked. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: And I did. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'm not sure you did. And that's why I didn't second it, because I'm not sure that it meets the legal burden. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Mr. Chairman, if I have the floor, I'd like to make a motion that we approve. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Go right ahead. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: -- that we approve the variance request for the four points only indicated. And I'm -- I'm not sure that putting the stipulation in for the private club is appropriate or not because it's a variance. But if our attorney feels that it is appropriate, I certainly would like to see it in there. But if you can help me, I don't think it's even appropriate at this point. MS. STUDENT: Our code does provide that we can put stipulations in variance resolutions. However, they should be related to the variance and, therefore, I feel it's not appropriate. And I feel also since the private club is something you'd have to get a conditional use for, our code already takes care of that problem. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I think there's a way to tie it to the variance, Hiss Student. If the motion is stated or the motion maker will include that the variance -- or the intent of the variance is not to expand the building footprint to allow for more parking for the use of a private club at some point down the road, that we can then make that a stipulation, that a private club will not be a permitted use due to the granting of this variance. It's thin, but it's there. MS. STUDENT: I think that you've made a satisfactory connection. COHHISSIONER MATTHEWS: Okay. The motion maker accepts that change. MR. REISCHL: And also staff would like to request that a copy of the site plan be attached to show the -- because the variance is so complicated, the architectural drawing is complicated, if you could state that the -- COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: I'll incorporate that also, that a site plan be included with it. Are we going to get some more? MR. ARNOLD: If I might, Wayne Arnold for the record. One of the other conditions that has been discussed is the use of the property. It is zoned RT and allows for several uses. If the proposal is contingent upon it being a hotel, that also might be a condition of the site plan. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Actually, I'd rather see it condos. I'd hate to tie them into a hotel if they will do condos later. You know, the RT uses are there. I don't want to tie one in, particularly if it's more intensive than other RT uses. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Yeah. If the board doesn't object, I'd rather not include a requirement for that. So the motion is to approve variance number 95-29 with a stipulation that the variance is not to be used to provide excessive parking for the purpose of a private club, and there was another stipulation which I didn't get written down that we include a site plan. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. Mr. Reischl, how are we going to police excessive parking, the term excessive parking? MR. REISCHL: The way I understood the stipulation was excessive parking for a private club. Is that how you worded it? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: The point of the inclusion is to get it on the record that it's recognized that this has the potential for an end run, as does every other hotel in Collier County today. And by getting that on the record, it puts everyone on notice in this room that if you see little stickers from Fiddler's Creek on windows in the parking lot, it's time to call the county -- MR. REISCHL: Call code enforcement. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- and get it enforced. And that's the intent. You know, how do we -- how do we enforce our code better? COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: It's a complaint-driven enforcement. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: But you see the flaw is that restaurant patrons can come and use the parking facility and go to the beach. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Strip down to their skivies and run out. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Can I just ask the motion maker -- I want to second the motion, but I wish your stipulation would just be that the property not be used as a private club. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Well, I don't mind doing that. Ms. Student, though, suggested that we have something tied to the variance itself, and Commissioner Hancock has offered wording that does that which he agrees ties it to the variance. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: It says the same thing in a much more wordy fashion. I'm working on my law degree. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: We have closed this, but -- MR. PIRES: For clarification, if it helps with the motion maker and the seconder, stipulate that it will not be used for a private club, we have no problem including that as a stipulation. COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Okay. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I'm going to second the motion, and I want to second it based on the fact that all of the variance criteria that are a part of our code have been met, that the experts on our staff and the private experts both have indicated that all of the variance criteria were met, and based on that I second the motion. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I assume you mean that there are special circumstances and conditions, that the applicant did not create those conditions, et cetera, et cetera? COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Exactly. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: We have a motion and a second. All those in favor, signify by saying aye. And opposed? Passes four to one. AUDIENCE: (Booing). VOICE: Boo, boo. Go home, guys. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: We are home. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: We're in session, ma'am. We're in session. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Well, you know us off islanders. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: We're in session here, please. Step down, Herb. We're in session. MR. SAVAGE: I thought you were in recess. Excuse me. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: As soon as we clear the room, we're going to proceed with our agenda. Item #13A4 - Withdrawn by Petitioner Item #13A5 RESOLUTION 96-69, RE PETITION NUA-95-1, ARTHUR C. QUINNELL, P.E., REPRESENTING DROP ANCHOR MOBILE HOMEOWNERS ASSOCIATION, INC., REQUESTING A NON-CONFORMING USE ALTERATION IN ORDER TO ENABLE UNIT OWNERS TO REPLACE EXISTING NON-CONFORMING MOBILE HOMES AS NEEDED, FOR PROPERTY LOCATED ON PAPAYA STREET IN GOODLAND - ADOPTED Okay. Let's go on to 13(A)(5), petition NUA-95-1. MR. BADAMTCHIAN: Good afternoon, Commissioners. Chahran Badamtchian from planning staff. This noncomforming is -- COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Excuse me. Can we wait a few minutes? CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Let's wait a second for the -- until they move out, and we can get a little quiet. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: It's quieter now. Thank you. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Go ahead. MR. BADAMTCHIAN: This is a request for a nonconforming use alteration for a mobile home park in Goodland. This mobile home park was built in 1940s and 1950s. It contains 3.3 acres with 75 mobile homes for a gross density of 22.7 acres. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'm really sorry to interrupt. In short, this is a mobile home park that's been used for 40 years, and they'd like to put some nice new-type units in there? MR. BADAMTCHIAN: They want to place mobile homes which requires code approval itself. We have done this three times in the past for three separate mobile homes. This is a blanket request for all the rest. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Have we received any objection on this? MR. BADAMTCHIAN: No. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: I don't think you would. Let me just ask one question on the timing. Would this grant an opportunity to remove a mobile home and leave it vacant for some period of time, or is it simply a direct swap? MR. BADAMTCHIAN: Just for replacement co-op property -- CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Because the reason I'm asking that question is because I think that you lose your nonconforming use after a certain period of time if it's left vacant; isn't that correct? MR. BADAMTCHIAN: You have six months. If you leave it over six months, we lose it. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: So we don't want that situation to happen. MR. BADAMTCHIAN: No. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: All right. Mr. Quinnell. MR. QUINNELL: Art Quinnell. I'm here mostly to answer any questions you might have. But as of on the front page of the thing that you have in your packet there, it shows the stipulation that we're putting right in -- the notice of intent is right on there. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. MR. QUINNELL: And that is -- pretty well will answer your questions. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. Thank you. COHHISSIONER MATTHEWS: Mr. Chairman, if you'll close the public hearing, I'll go ahead and make a motion. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. Do we have a public speakers on this one? MR. DORRILL: No, sir, you do not. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: I'll close the public hearing. COHMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Mr. Chairman, I'd like to make a motion that we approve petition NUA-95-1. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I second the motion. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: We have a motion and a second. All those in favor of the motion, signify by saying aye. Opposed? There are none. Item #14 BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS' COMMUNICATIONS That concludes our regular agenda. Commissioner Matthews, do you have anything else? COMMISSIONER MATTHEWS: Only that I did go to Tallahassee last week and spent a couple days running around the senate office building and the house office building. There was a number of things going on, and I'm hoping that before the end of this week I can have a memo to each of you of what is going on, particularly dealing with the partial year ad valorem program that we're also interested in and some other issues dealing with the school budget versus the lottery. But I'll be glad to make that information available to you. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. Commissioner Hancock? COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: None. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Commissioner Mac'Kie? COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: No, sir. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Commissioner Constantine? COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: No, sir. Item #15 STAFF'S COMMUNICATIONS CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Mr. Dorrill? MR. DORRILL: Only one item. I've asked Mr. McNees to briefly advise you of the item and my intent to have an item for your consideration next Tuesday to refund a very small bond issue, about 2 million dollars. MR. McNEES: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mike McNees from the county manager's office. We just wanted to make you aware today that the financial advisor brought to staff's attention that we have a series 1977 guaranteed entitlement bond at issue principal outstanding of about 2.4 million dollars that they see as a real good refunding candidate. Net present value savings would be about 120,000. They're saying we could structure it in such a way to generate about $150,000 in cash up front which would help us in our general fund during the coming budget year. I wanted to make you aware of it today, because we're going to do it. We'll explain this to you in great detail next week. The financial advisors and bond council are out working this week on the issue. They've made it clear that if you should decide next week not to go forward, we're not on the hook for any expenses. They are proceeding at their own risk. But we didn't want to bring to you completely packaged and ready to go refunding next week that you had no knowledge of and wanted you to know that was happening. And unless you have any major objections, we'll continue with that process next week, bring that item to you next Tuesday. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Mr. Weigel? MR. WEIGEL: Nothing really except I'd appreciate it if you, Mr. Chairman, could sign off on a travel request for me to the Florida local government and finance tax seminar in Orlando in March. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Where was that? In Honolulu, did you say? MR. WEIGEL: It's a free seminar, transportation not provided, however. But I need your signature on that, if you would be so kind. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Miss Filson, do you have anything? MS. FILSON: I have nothing. CHAIRMAN NORRIS: Okay. We're adjourned. There being no further business for the good of the County, the meeting was adjourned by order of the Chair at 12:17 p.m. ***** Commissioner Constantine moved, seconded by Commissioner Matthews, and carried unanimously, that the following items under the consent agenda be approved and/or adopted: ***** Item #16A1 RESOLUTION 96-44 RE THE RECORDING OF THE FINAL PLAT OF "SUNGATE CENTER PUD" - WITH LETTER OF CREDIT, CONSTRUCTION AND MAINTENANCE AGREEMENTS AND STIPULATIONS See Pages Item #16A2 RESOLUTION 96-45 RE FINAL ACCEPTANCE OF THE ROADWAY, DRAINAGE, WATER AND SEWER IMPROVEMENTS FOR THE FINAL PLAT OF "QUAIL WALK PHASE TWO" See Pages Item #16A3 APPLICATION FOR THE FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION ARTIFICIAL REEF GRANT FOR THE ARTIFICIAL REEF PROGRAM OF COLLIER COUNTY - IN THE AMOUNT OF $25,000.00 See Pages Item #16A4 DONATE A FAX MACHINE TO THE COHMUNITY DEVELOPMENT AND ENVIRONMENTAL SERVICES DIVISION Item #16A5 CONTRACT WITH THE FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION (FDEP) TO PARTICIPATE IN STATEWIDE GROUND WATER QUALITY MONITORING EFFORT - IN THE AMOUNT OF, NOT TO EXCEED, $3,000.00 See Pages Item #16A6 EXCAVATION PERMIT NO. 59.560, "BERMUDA ISLAND APARTMENTS", LOCATED IN SECTION 6, T495, R26E, BOUNDED ON THE NORTH BY VANDERBILT BEACH ROAD EXTENSION AND ON THE EAST, SOUTH, AND WEST BY LAND ZONED PUD (VINEYARDS), THE WEST BOUNDARY IS ALSO THE PROPOSED LIVINGSTON ROAD - WITH STIPULATIONS Item #16A7 RESOLUTION 96-46 RE FINAL ACCEPTANCE OF THE ROADWAY, DRAINAGE, WATER AND SEWER IMPROVEMENTS FOR THE FINAL PLAT OF "COVENTRY SQUARE" See Pages Item #16A8a RESOLUTION 96-47 RE LIEN RESOLUTION TO EFFECT THE ABATEMENT OF THE PUBLIC NUISANCE FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO. 50523-083; OWNER OF RECORD - DORIS UMBRICHT See Pages Item #16A8b RESOLUTION 96-48 RE LIEN RESOLUTION TO EFFECT THE ABATEMENT OF THE PUBLIC NUISANCE FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO. 50612-008; OWNER OF RECORD - BENITA F. RECIO See Pages Item #16A8c RESOLUTION 96-49 RE LIEN RESOLUTION TO EFFECT THE ABATEMENT OF THE PUBLIC NUISANCE FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO.50626-075; OWNER OF RECORD - CAPITOLIS AUSLANDISCHE See Pages Item #16A8d RESOLUTION 96-50 RE LIEN RESOLUTION TO EFFECT THE ABATEMENT OF THE PUBLIC NUISANCE FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO.50707-014; OWNER OF RECORD - JOHANNA M. PRINDIVILLE See Pages Item #16A8e RESOLUTION 96-51 RE LIEN RESOLUTION TO EFFECT THE ABATEMENT OF THE PUBLIC NUISANCE FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO.50717-094; OWNER OF RECORD - ROSA DE CORES; TERESITA MENDEZ See Pages Item #16A8f RESOLUTION 96-52 RE LIEN RESOLUTION TO EFFECT THE ABATEMENT OF THE PUBLIC NUISANCE FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO.50727-030; OWNER OF RECORD - AJUAD ABOU ASALI See Pages Item #16A8g RESOLUTION 96-53 RE LIEN RESOLUTION TO EFFECT THE ABATEMENT OF THE PUBLIC NUISANCE FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO. 50804-006; OWNER OF RECORD - JOHANNA M. PRINDIVILLE See Pages Item #16A8h RESOLUTION 96-54 RE LIEN RESOLUTION TO EFFECT THE ABATEMENT OF THE PUBLIC NUISANCE FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO. 50809-033; OWNER OF RECORD - DOUGLAS M. KELLY See Pages Item #16A8i RESOLUTION 96-55 RE LIEN RESOLUTION TO EFFECT THE ABATEMENT OF THE PUBLIC NUISANCE FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO. 50822-033; OWNER OF RECORD - ZBIGNIEW TOMSZAY AND DORILA M. TOMSZAY See Pages Item #16ASj RESOLUTION 96-56 RE LIEN RESOLUTION TO EFFECT THE ABATEMENT OF THE PUBLIC NUISANCE FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO. 50823-045; OWNER OF RECORD - NOEL H. WILLIA_MS See Pages Item #16A8k RESOLUTION 96-57 RE LIEN RESOLUTION TO EFFECT THE ABATEMENT OF THE PUBLIC NUISANCE FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO. 50901-037; OWNER OF RECORD - DANIEL CASTRO, GISELA CASTRO See Pages Item #16A81 RESOLUTION 96-58 RE LIEN RESOLUTION TO EFFECT THE ABATEMENT OF THE PUBLIC NUISANCE FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO. 50905-064; OWNER OF RECORD - EDWARD PELC AND LAVERDA PELC See Pages Item #16A8m RESOLUTION 96-59 RE LIEN RESOLUTION TO EFFECT THE ABATEMENT OF THE PUBLIC NUISANCE FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO. 50907-076; OWNER OF RECORD - GUISEPPE FALIVENE See Pages Item #16A8n RESOLUTION 96-60 RE LIEN RESOLUTION TO EFFECT THE ABATEMENT OF THE PUBLIC NUISANCE FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO. 50927-010; OWNER OF RECORD - FLOREAL DE LA GARZA See Pages Item #16A9 - This item has been deleted Item #16A10 RECORD THE FINAL PLAT OF "BERNIER ESTATE" Item #16All RESOLUTION 96-61 RE FINAL ACCEPTANCE OF THE ROADWAY, DRAINAGE, WATER AND SEWER IMPROVEMENTS FOR THE FINAL PLAT OF "QUAIL WEST UNIT ONE, REPLAT BLOCK C" See Pages Item #16A12 FINAL PLAT OF "PELICAN HARSH UNIT TWELVE" - WITH CONSTRUCTION AND MAINTENANCE AGREEMENT AND STIPULATIONS See Pages Item #16A13 FINAL PLAT OF "NORTH NAPLES MEDICAL PARK" - WITH CONSTRUCTION AND MAINTENANCE AGREEMENT AND STIPULATIONS See Pages Item #16B1 ADJUSTMENTS TO ROAD CAPITAL BUDGET Item #1682 SUPPLEMENTAL AGREEMENT FOR ADDITIONAL ENVIRONMENTAL PERMITTING SERVICES FOR THE RATTLESNAKE-HAMMOCK ROAD FOUR-LANING PROJECT - IN THE MAXIMUM AMOUNT OF $4,900.00 See Pages Item #1683 CHANGE ORDER #5 FOR BID 94-2263 FOR THE GOLDEN GATE PARKWAY SIX LANING IMPROVEMENTS, (JCT. GOODLETTE-FRANK ROAD TO JCT. C.R. 31) - IN THE AMOUNT OF $12,634.64 AND NEW 10% CHANGE ORDER AUTHORIZED See Pages Item #1684 CHANGE ORDER #5 FOR THE C.R. 951 IMPROVEMENT PROJECT BID NO. 95-2320 FOR ADDITIONAL UTILITIES WORK - IN THE AMOUNT OF $2,742.00 AND NEW 10% CHANGE ORDER AUTHORIZED See Pages Item #1685 RIGHT-OF-WAY AND UTILITY EASEMENT TO NTC DEVELOPMENT, LTD., DEVELOPER OF CARLTON LAKES PUD See Pages Item #16C1 AUTHORIZATION THAT THE PARKS AND RECREATION DEPARTMENT OPERATE ADDITIONAL SUHMER CAMPS FOR FISCAL YEAR 1996 Item #16C2 CONCESSION AGREEMENT WITH OCEAN STATE LEMONADE COMPANY FOR THE OPERATION OF A FOOD VENDING CART AT THE GOLDEN GATE AQUATIC FACILITY AND THE IHMOKALEE RECREATION/AQUATIC FACILITY IN RESPONSE TO RFP #95-2448 See Pages Item #16C3 BID #95-2467 FOR PRINTING OF THE PARKS AND RECREATION LEISURE LINE BROCHURE AWARDED TO NEWSPAPER PRINTING COMPANY OF FORT MYERS IN THE AMOUNT OF $51,675.95 Item #16D1 COUNTY OWNED PROPERTY DECLARED SURPLUS; AUCTION TO BE HELD ON SATURDAY, FEBRUARY 17, 1996 Item #16D2 CONTRACT TERMINATED WITH WATERMAN CHEMICAL AND RE-AWARDED UNDER BID #95-2398 TO CARUS CHEMICAL COMPANY FOR POTASSIUM PERHANGANTE FOR THE UTILITIES WATER DEPARTMENT Item #16D3 - This item has been deleted Item #16D4 CERTIFICATE OF PUBLIC CONVENIENCE AND NECESSITY FOR THE COLLIER COUNTY EMERGENCY MEDICAL SERVICES DEPARTMENT See Pages Item #16El BUDGET AMENDMENT 96-117 Item #16E2 CONTRACT WITH NAPLES AREA CONVENTION AND VISITORS BUREAU FOR CATEGORY B, TOURIST DEVELOPMENT REVENUE FOR PROMOTING COLLIER COUNTY DURING THE OFF SEASON See Pages Item #16G1 CERTIFICATES OF CORRECTION TO THE TAX ROLLS AS PRESENTED BY THE PROPERTY APPRAISER'S OFFICE 1993 REAL PROPERTY No's. Dated 236 01 24/96 1995 REAL PROPERTY 183-186 01 24 - 02 01/96 191-194 01 24 - 02 06/96 1995 TANGIBLE PERSONAL PROPERTY 53-56 01 12 - 01 30/96 Item #1662 MISCELLANEOUS CORRESPONDENCE - FILED AND/OR REFERRED The following miscellaneous correspondence as presented by the Board of County Commissioners has been directed to the various departments as indicated: BOARD OF COUNTY COHMISSIONERS BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS/EX OFFICIO GOVERNING BOARD(S) OF SPECIAL DISTRICTS UNDER ITS CONTROL JOHN NORRIS, CHAIRMAN ATTEST: DWIGHT E. BROCK, CLERK These minutes approved by the Board on as presented or as corrected TRANSCRIPT PREPARED ON BEHALF OF DONOVAN COURT REPORTING BY: Barbara A. Donovan