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BCC Minutes 12/12/1995 RREGULAR MEETING OF DECEMBER 12, 1995, OF THE BOARD OF COUNTY COHMISSIONERS LET IT BE REHEHBERED, that the Board of County Commissioners in and for the County of Collier, and also acting as the Board of Zoning Appeals and as the governing board(s) of such special districts as have been created according to law and having conducted business herein, met on this date at 9:09 a.m. in REGULAR SESSION in Building "F" of the Government Complex, East Naples, Florida, with the following members present: CHAIRPERSON: ALSO PRESENT: Bettye J. Hatthews Timothy J. Constantine John C. Norris Timothy L. Hancock Pamela S. Hac'Kie W. Neil Dotrill, County Hanager Hike HcNees, Acting Assistant County Hanager David Weigel, County Attorney Item #3 & #3A AGENDA AND CONSENT AGENDA - APPROVED WITH CHANGES CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Call to order the Board of County Commission meeting for Tuesday, December the 12th, 1995. Mr. Dotrill, will you lead us in an invocation and pledge. MR. DORRILL: Heavenly Father, as we've done throughout the holidays, we give thanks for this special time of year. We can't help but recognize and lift up before you people who may be alone this particular time of year or alone for the first time or away from their families. We would ask that you provide them as -- as generous and bountiful a holiday as you do the rest of us. Father, we're also especially thankful this morning for the families of the loved ones who were lost in the Cracker Barrel murder that touched our community. We are heartened by the potential success of good police work there and that that might be a bright light to their holiday this season as well. Father, we're especially thankful to recognize employee achievement at this, the end of our calendar year 1995 and recognize our employee of the year as we do and give thanks for all of the hard work on behalf of our employees and the citizens who choose to participate in county government in Collier County. We ask that you bless our time here together and that it would be beneficial, and we pray these things in Jesus's name. Amen. (The pledge of allegiance was recited in unison.) CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Mr. Dorrill, it doesn't look like it's too long a change list. MR. DORRILL: No, ma'am, I don't believe so. I have two add-on items -- excuse me -- three add-on items. The first one is a proclamation. It will be 5(A) under the Board of County Commissioners' proclamations and presentations, recognizing the Ashbritt Corporation for a special donation to the guardian ad litem program here in Collier County, 5(A). I have an add-on item under the Board of County Commissioners today, which is a request for an endorsement of the revised St. Hatthew's House grant application for FEMA that you saw and discussed several weeks ago at the request of Commissioner Hac'Kie. Final add-on is 12(C)(3) which is the request that the board adopt a resolution authorizing the submission of a separate grant under the Department of Community Affairs community development block grant program for certain projects in Immokalee involving the Shellabarger Mobile Home Park and a portion of Bullard subdivision in Immokalee. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Mr. Dorrill, I have a question on that. When I was adding it to my list, I saw that 12(C)(1) was the same thing, but it says continued after it. MR. DORRILL: It was. That was an oversight on my part. I thought -- initially in trying to read this in a hurry and get it to the printer last Wednesday, I thought it may have been Chokoloskee CDBG program that you expressed some concerns to me about, and I held it off to give me further time to read it, and staff brought to my attention that it was not that project. We're not moving forward with that project until the engineers from Anchor complete their assessment on that. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay, fine. Thank you. MR. DORRILL: We're withdrawing item 8(C)(2), which is a recommendation that the board review a report regarding the expansion of beach and boat launch facility sites as it pertains to the potential sale of Bluebill Avenue which is county owned. That's at the request of Commissioner Hancock who's asked that he receive a briefing in advance of that because of the impact on Vanderbilt Beach subdivision and also what is a fairly large piece of property there that we own. That will be rescheduled as necessary after he's had an opportunity to be briefed on that. I have two items that are on the consent agenda, will be moved and made part of the regular agenda for discussion. The first one is 16(B)(1), is moving and will become 8(B)(7) under public works which is a request to approve a purchase order increase for the Naples Park drainage project. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Again, may I interrupt there? This has my name as being the requester of moving that, and I didn't request that be moved. MR. DORRILL: Okay. Staff was indicating that they asked for it. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay. MR. DORRILL: I apologize. 16(B)(1) is moving and will become 8 (B) (7) . Then under public services we are moving 16(C)(1). It will become 8(C)(3), which is a recommendation that the board participate in the home care for the elderly program and to authorize execution of certain contracts between the local area for aging and your public services division. That request is made through the county attorney's office. 16(C)(1) is moving and will become 8 (C) (3) . I have two agenda notes this morning, the first of which is just for purposes of our recording secretary. Item 16(B)(6) on the consent agenda, the proper bid number associated with that item is 95-24-54. We had a transposition error there. And then also we've had one request in order to coordinate the presentation and keep it as brief as possible for the Naplescape program as it pertains to median beautification. They asked that that item be heard in or around 11 a.m., and I told them that I would convey their request to you and did not think that that would be a problem. And that's all that I have this morning. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. Does anyone have an objection to the Naplescape meeting at 11 a.m.? Okay. We'll hear that at 11 or as close to it as we can. Mr. Weigel, did you have anything to add to the agenda? MR. WEIGEL: No changes, but information I'll add in regard to 10(A) on St. Hatthew's House item that I have prepared copies of the grant application documents that all of you, I don't believe, had -- had seen. It's the revised application as well as copies of a letter prepared by Mr. Goodlette on behalf of St. Hatthew's House and other supporting documentation, and I'll be providing that to you during the course of the morning so that you have it when the item comes up. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Fine. Thank you. Commissioner Norris, did you have changes in operations? COHMISSIONER NORRIS: I have nothing today. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. Commissioner Hancock? COHHISSIONER HANCOCK: No, ma'am. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. Commissioner Hac'Kie? COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: No, thank you. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Commissioner Constantine? COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I have no further changes today. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you, and I have none either. Is there a motion? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Motion to approve the agenda and consent agenda as amended. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Second. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: A motion and a second to approve the agenda and the consent agenda as amended. All those in favor, please say aye. Opposed? There being none, motion passes five to zero. Item #5A PROCLAMATION RECOGNIZING ASHBRITT, INC. FOR A DONATION TO THE GUARDIAN AD LITEH PROGRAM - ADOPTED Next item on the agenda is under proclamations and service awards. We have an add-on proclamation, and it gives me absolute pleasure to do this. Talk about surprises yesterday, I came to the office, and I found this check, which is quite nice. And I'd like to ask Randy Perkins from Ashbritt, Incorporated, if you would come forward and Lisa Cohen (phonetic) and Karen Landy (phonetic) of the guardian ad litem program, if they would come forward while I read this proclamation. Do you want to turn around there so everybody can see what we all look like. Thanks. Whereas, Ashbritt, Incorporated, has been providing service to Collier County since acquiring Universal Wood Recycling; and Whereas, Ashbritt, Incorporated, realizes the responsibility a company has in supporting their community and would like to give something back to Collier County; and Whereas, Ashbritt, Incorporated, is involved in the United Way of South Florida and their various agencies; and Whereas, Collier County has a program this year called the Collier County Guardian Ad Litem Project; and Whereas, Ashbritt, Incorporated, would like to donate a check to this organization in the amount of $2,500 to be used for the holiday gifts or daily essentials of those -- of these needy children of Collier County. Now, therefore, the Board of County Commissioners of Collier County, Florida, does hereby commend Ashbritt, Incorporated, for their contribution and recognition of the needs of Collier County children. Done and ordered this 12th day of December, 1995, Board of County Commissioners, Collier County, Florida, Bettye J. Matthews, Chairman. Colleagues, I would like to make a motion that we accept this proclamation and award it. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Second. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Motion and a second. All those in favor, please say aye. Opposed? Motion passes five to zero. (Applause) CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: I don't know how I can thank you more. MR. PERKINS: You're very welcome. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you very much. And I'm sure that Lisa and Karen are equally thankful. We'll see that the check gets to the appropriate place so that you can -- you can use it. MR. PERKINS: Great. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: on your desk or -- CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. Thank you very much. So do you regularly find checks Well, that's the first time in three years. COHHISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: But if somebody else wants to give some more for purposes like that, I'll be happy to see them. Item #5B EHPLOYEE SERVICE AWARDS - PRESENTED Next item on the agenda are service awards. Commissioner Hancock. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Yes. It's my pleasure this morning to recognize some employees for continuous service to the county. We're going to start with recognizing for five years of service with Collier County, working with the transportation department is Terrance Sumpter. (Applause) COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Been a little busy lately, Terrance? Congratulations and thank you. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you, Terrance. Good work. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Thanks. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Thank you. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Unable to be here this morning, but we'll recognize for five years in utilities and water Barbara Manning and for ten years in building review and permitting Alamar Smiley. Here this morning we also have recognizing for ten-year service also in transportation -- and I'm probably going to mess the last name up -- but James Eliopoulos. (Applause) MR. ELIOPOULOS: You said that good, right on the money. Not bad for the first time. Cool. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Transportation is way too happy. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: All right. It's good to see happy employees. Item #5Cl LUZ H. PEITRI, PUBLIC SEVICES DIVISION, RECOGNIZED AS EHPLOYEE OF THE YEAR FOR 1995 Next item on the agenda are presentations. Commissioner Norris. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Thank you, Madam Chairman. My presentation today is for the employee of the year for 1995. And I'd like to ask Luz Peitri to come up and stand in front of the dais here and face the camera, please. MS. PEITRI: Where is it? CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Right behind you. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Luz began employment with the county in the library in June of 1975. She spent her entire county career with the library serving as the department's secretary. For 20 years Luz has been doing -- has been a stabilizing factor in the public library and doing her job so well for so long she has developed both the patience and the skills to be an outstanding employee. Through the years the library has gone through many transitions, and Luz has been an important factor in making those transitions smooth ones. Luz has proven herself to be a tremendous asset to the library. She assists both the staff and the library patrons. Luz is a hard-working, dedicated employee, a model citizen, and appreciated by all. She also has great customer service skills and has achieved excellent ratings on her performance appraisals. Luz is the kind of dedicated and motivated employee who makes Collier County a better place to live and work. It is for the above reasons that Luz was unanimously selected as the employee of the year for 1995. And I have this letter from the board that says, Dear, Hiss Peitri, it is, indeed, a pleasure for us to announce your selection as Collier County's employee of the year for 1995. This well-deserved recognition is for your valuable contributions to the county through your work as senior secretary. You are truly an outstanding employee in all aspects and well respected by those with whom you come in contact. For these and many other reasons, you exemplify what an employee of the year should represent. We have for you today a plaque and this letter and a check for $250. (Applause) MR. DORRILL: Luz, if you would stay here for just a second, I believe Ms. Hellinger also had asked to say something on behalf of the advisory board. While she's coming forward, we -- we might add we're just very proud of Luz. I think she exemplifies -- you have a thousand people that work for you, and she's especially special to be recognized by her peers who vote to select the employee of the year, and we're just so proud of her, we don't know what to do. MS. HELLINGER: We are also proud of her because she handles all of the work for the library advisory board, and it takes a lot of patience. Thank you so much. You are really a well-deserved winner of this award. (Applause) CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you very much. Item #882 NORMAL PURCHASING PROCEDURES WAIVED AND STAFF AUTHORIZED TO ENTER INTO A PURCHASE AGREEMENT WITH BETTER ROADS, INC., TO MILL 78,500 S.Y. OF GOODLETTE-FRANK ROAD PRIOR TO RESURFACING - APPROVED IN THE AMOUNT OF $61,230 As we move forward, the next item on the agenda into the county manager's report, 8(B)(2), a recommendation the Board of County Commissioners waive normal purchasing procedures. Mr. Archibald. MR. ARCHIBALD: Good morning, board members. For the record my name is George Archibald. I'm the transportation director. Agenda item 8(B)(2) is a request to waive a purchasing procedure to allow the county to complete a project of leveling and resurfacing Goodlette-Frank Road between U.S. 41 and the Golden Gate Parkway construction site. The paving work has to be preceded by the removal or what we call milling of the friction surface. Currently those two activities, the milling in addition to the resurfacing, should be closely coordinated. And as a result of different contractors receiving different awards for those different activities, the staff has received proposals from Better Roads and, in fact, is recommending to the board today that we consider awarding to Better Roads a contract to do both the milling and the resurfacing which currently is part of their contract. Those two activities do require the board to waive the purchasing procedure because of the amount and to recognize that the reasons behind that are, one, we're going to be saving over $50,000 in substantial savings, but also it's going to allow for a better project in terms of roadway safety and roadway operations. With that the staff will complete its presentation, and we'll gladly address any questions. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Madam Chairman, this is rather straightforward. It makes a lot of sense to have the same vendor do both operations, and a net savings of $50,000 to the county is enough incentive for me to move the item. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Second. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have a motion and a second. I have one question. Don't we normally include the milling in the contract to resurface? Why is there a separate contract? MR. ARCHIBALD: This was part of the annual bidding process rather than part of a specific job. So we have a series of different annual contractors. It just so happened that the contractors for milling and asphalt resurfacing in this area were different. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay, thank you. We have a motion and a second. Further discussion? All those in favor, please say aye. Opposed? Motion passes five to zero. Thank you, Mr. Archibald. Item #886 RESOLUTION 95-688 ACKNOWLEDGING RELEASE OF RESERVATION BY LONE OAK, LTD. OF UTILITY EASEMENT LOCATED ON LOTS 4 AND 5, BLOCK B, ON THE PLAT OF LEXINGTON AT LONE OAK, UNIT 1 - ADOPTED Next item on the agenda is item 8(B)(5), a report with recommendation of approval to initiate a Collier County urban -- it's not eleven o'clock yet, is it? COHMISSIONER NORRIS: No. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay. Gotcha. I saw you looking at your watch. We'll delay that one until eleven o'clock. Next item is 8(B)(6), resolution acknowledging release of reservation by Lone Oak Limited. Mr. Archibald. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I just need to make on the record that I have a conflict on that matter and won't be able to vote. I represent the petitioner -- or property owner. Excuse me. MR. ARCHIBALD: Board members, agenda item 8(B)(6) is a resolution which acknowledges the release of reservation of utility easements, and I've got to read this into the record, easements on lots 4 and 5, block B, the plat of Lexington at Lone Oak, unit 1, plat book 22, page 24 through 27. Under the original plat the developer had reserved certain utility easements. As -- as a result of a prior vacation and as a result of an effort to correct any title defects, the staff, the county attorney's office, has gone ahead and prepared a resolution that will, in fact, terminate the reservation. That termination of reservation document is part of your agenda item, part of the add-on, and the only item that's in question right now is a legal description that's going to be attached to it. Accordingly, based upon prior actions of the board in vacating this, your staff is recommending that the resolution acknowledging, again, the release of reservation be approved subject to the county attorney's office finalizing and reviewing the legal description that carries with it the termination of reservation. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Questions for staff? MS. ASHTON: If I could just make a point of clarification. For the record, Heidi Ashton, assistant county attorney. The termination of reservation is being prepared by the developer. It's not finalized. It's not attached in your agenda package; however, the resolution of the board which acknowledges the termination of the reservation is attached, and that's what you're being asked to sign today. I just wanted to clarify that. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you, Miss Ashton. Commissioner Hancock. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I note the staff executive summary says Lone Oak Limited is desirous of releasing utilities and the reservation to allow construction and avoid a title cloud. Is this just construction within the easement? Is that simply what it's referencing? MS. ASHTON: Yes, they're just trying to clear a title matter, uh-huh. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: motion? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Okay. Any other questions? Is there a Motion to approve. Second. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have a motion and a second to approve item 8(B)(6). Any other discussion? All in favor, please say aye. Opposed? Motion passes five to zero. COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: Four. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Four to zero, I'm sorry. Thank you, Mr. Archibald. Item #887 APPROVAL TO INCREASE NAPLES PARK DRAINAGE PROJECT PURCHASE ORDER - APPROVED IN THE AMOUNT OF $19,541 Next item on the agenda is 8(B)(7). This is the item that was moved from the consent agenda. Mr. Boldt. MR. BOLDT: My understanding is a property owner in Naples Park by the name of Betty Hathes (phonetic) asked for this thing to be put on the regular consent. That's why your name was confused. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: That's okay. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Is Hiss Hathes here? MR. DORRILL: She's not here, but we do have some speakers. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay. MR. BOLDT: Just very simply, back in October when we reviewed the Naples Park project, you directed us to go forward with reevaluating the project, the design, the methodology, and bring it back in 90 days, which will be late January or early February. The consultant, Agnoli, Barber, and Brundage, is engaged on this project on an hourly-rate basis, how we expended the hours in the original purchase hours. In order to do this additional work, we need some additional hours and dollars to do that, and we're asking this morning for an increase in the purchase order to cover the work that you asked them to do. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you, Mr. Boldt. Are there questions? Commissioner Hancock. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Just again in a nutshell, Mr. Boldt, this is what the board asked the engineer to do in order to get a look at this in that 90-day period, and that's simply what this is covering? MR. BOLDT: Yes. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Do we have speakers, Mr. Dotrill? MR. DORRILL: Yes, ma'am. We have two, Mr. HcGilvra, and then following he we'll have Ms. Pistori. HcGILVRA: Good morning, Commissioners, Doug HcGilvra. I have nothing to say except to go ahead as planned. It's exactly what we intended to do, and we're going forward. I think we should continue. Thank you. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. MR. DORRILL: Ms. Pistori. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Ms. Pistori. MS. PISTORI: Good morning. Gene Pistori, Naples Park. The HSTBU was put in place. You voted to approve it. You voted to say let's do this; let's get this drainage through. Now we must see the end -- must see it through to the end. Let this money go through. If this is what is needed, let's go forward with it, and let's do it, please. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. MS. PISTORI: Thank you. MR. DORRILL: That's all. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: That's all the speakers? Is there other discussion or questions from the board? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I do want to respond to one phone message you all received about a conflict of interest from Miss Mathes. There is a peer review as a part of this that I believe Johnson Engineering will be performing on Agnoli, Barber, and Brundage's plans. So any conflict of interest will be answered by a third-party independent peer review, and that's been addressed. So I just wanted to mention that. And with that I'll make a motion to move the item. COMHISSIONER NORRIS: Second. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have a motion and a second to move the item. Is there further discussion? All those in favor, please say aye. Opposed? Motion passes five to zero. Thank you, Mr. Boldt. Item #8C1 LEASE AGREEMENT WITH THE FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH AND REHABILITATIVE SERVICES (HRS), COLLIER COUNTY PUBLIC HEALTH UNIT (CCPHU), FOR USE OF COUNTY OFFICE SPACE BY THE CCPHU - APPROVED Next item on the agenda is item 8(C)(1), a recommendation that the Board of County Commissioners approve a lease agreement. Mr. Olliff. MR. OLLIFF: Good morning. For the record, Tom Olliff, your public services administrator. This item is a lease agreement with the Collier County public health unit. It is for a space that is currently already occupied by the health unit within your building H or health and community services building. In real quick terms, the general highlights of the agreement are that the term is a ten-year term that takes it through the year 2001. It's actually backdated as an initial start date to 1991 when the health department actually took possession of the space that they're in. And that's simply to protect the county for any instances that may have arisen during the period of time when they were in the building. While the term is what it is, it also provides some termination provisions within 90 days' notice should the county or the health department decide that it wants to relocate or find space in other areas. I need to walk you through the handed-out agreement that I just gave you, and we've tried to tab it for you. There are several changes, but the ones that are -- that are tabbed and made are, frankly, very minor in nature, but I do need to walk you through them real quickly. Article 4 on page 1, it's simply an indication of where the utility costs will be paid for through the county financial system for the utilities used by the health department in the building. The utilities are paid by the health department. Frankly, they are pass-through costs as the county supports that cost center and pays for that through its own general fund. On page 3 there is an indication that should insurance coverage change from the state provider, that the county would be notified. That's a standard type provision that we have in most of our agreements and was recommended by Mr. Walker in your risk management department. And the last change simply was one on page 4 which was in terms of notice. We added some specific provisions about the notice for the health department staff that it be the district administrator's office and be carbon copied to the public health director here locally. The reason this lease agreement is separate from the CHSI, the lease agreement that you approved several weeks ago, it is for the space that the health department will be using outside of what CHSI space is. It's simply an agreement that we're trying to do through the real properties department and risk management to consistently have lease agreements with agencies other than county departments who are currently using county space. All of this has been reviewed and approved by the county attorney's office, and our recommendation is for approval. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Questions? Commissioner Hancock. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: If the lessor should default in services through either this agreement or the previous one, do we have -- I mean, is there any difficulty in the public health unit picking up where they left off so to speak? And I'm sure that had to be addressed. I just need some comfort level on that. If we should have a problem that the new folks that come in should up and decide this isn't profitable, we're out of here, what difficulties would we have in -- in the public health unit's ability to pick back up on services? MR. OLLIFF: I'll let Dr. Polkowski answer that question, because I think they do have that covered in their agreement. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: There may be an agreement laid in that question, but I wanted to ask you. DR. POLKOWSKI: Okay. I just want to make sure I understood your question. If CHSI was not able to provide services, is that right, would we be able to pick it up? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: If they default, they walk away from it. It's a losing deal, and they walk away from it at some point. DR. POLKOWSKI: Right. We would not be able to provide the same level of services. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. That's not what I'm asking. I'm asking what -- what financial or physical difficulties would we have in stepping back into the building and staffing it and performing the services to whatever extent we can. We've talked a lot about equipment. We've talked a lot about what they bring in and what they don't bring in and so forth. I'm just looking if that transaction should have to occur, what difficulties can we expect or can we expect that we've covered in both this and the previous agreement that eventuality? DR. POLKOWSKI: Okay. Well, any of the equipment and furniture which they're using that was originally used by the health department would be reverted back to the county. The space would be reverted back to the county. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: But does that include inventory of supplies and materials? DR. POLKOWSKI: Yes. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. DR. POLKOWSKI: That was originally part of the health unit, supplies and materials, yes. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. Thank you. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: But CHSI, Dr. Polkowski, is picking up the former employees who were performing the services? DR. POLKOWSKI: Some former employees, right. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: So we could, if they were to back out -- back away from this, have some difficulties from a staffing level? DR. POLKOWSKI: Yes. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay. Any other questions? Is there a motion? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I'll make a motion we approve the lease agreement. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Let me interrupt a moment. Mr. Dotrill, do we have speakers? MR. DORRILL: No, ma'am. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay. We have a motion to approve the lease agreement. Is there a second? COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Second. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Motion and a second to approve. Further discussion? All those in favor, please say aye. Opposed? Motion passes five to zero. Thank you, Mr. Olliff. Item #8C3 BCC PARTICIPATION IN THE HOHE CARE FOR THE ELDERLY PROGRAM, THE RELATED STAFF CHANGE, AND EXECUTION OF CONTRACT BETWEEN THE AREA AGENCY ON AGING AND COLLIER COUNTY SERVICES FOR SENIORS - APPROVED Next item on the agenda is an item that was moved to the consent agenda on the home care for the elderly. MR. MANALICH: Good morning, Commissioners. For the record, Ramiro Manalich. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Good morning. MR. MANALICH: This is a brief item. Basically the recommendation -- this was item 16(C)(1). In that recommendation one of the things that your authorizer asked to do was to authorize a contract to be executed with your agency on aging. Basically the contract has been reviewed by the county attorney's office and is fine in all respects except one. There is a broad indemnification provision. I don't believe that contract is contained in your packet. That is a standard contract for funding, but there was a broad indemnification provision which we found to be in derogation of our sovereign immunity and eliminates some of our defenses and our rights to not have to indemnify the state for its negligent conduct. Consequently, the only thing we would ask today is that you approve the recommendation with the proviso that the county attorney's office make a notation on this agreement so that that indemnification is not approved and we further negotiate with the state for a provision that will be acceptable to the county attorney's office and not beyond what our legal rights allows us to insist on. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Is this similar to the indemnification we were looking for with the public health unit? MR. MANALICH: It is in this sense. I think that the state is asking us to indemnify them beyond what we should be required to do. However, we would -- we would like to approve the contract with the exception of that one provision so that the funding can continue, and we can negotiate with the representatives of the state and hopefully convince them of the error of their ways. COMMISSIONER NORRIS: This is -- these are the same folks that didn't want to indemnify us? MR. MANALICH: That's curiously true. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: So moved. COMHISSIONER NORRIS: Second. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have a motion and a second to approve the contract subject to the wording Mr. Manalich has asked for. Are there further questions? Speakers, Mr. Dotrill? MR. DORRILL: No. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: I'll call the question. All in favor, please say aye. Opposed? Motion passes five to zero. MR. MANALICH: Thank you. MR. DORRILL: Mr. Manalich, I understand you being our resident Miami Dolphin fan, that you may have been at the game last night which would explain the smile on your face. MR. HANALICH: I'm a walking human sleep deprivation experiment. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: that? CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: that, huh? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Ramiro, we'll bond later. How's You were up late, too, watching Oh, yes. Item #BE1 FUNDING FOR MARCO ISLAND CHAMBER OF COHMERCE AND ANPLES AREA TOURISH BUREAU WITH CATEGORY B, ADVERTISING AND PROMOTION, TOURIST DEVELOPMENT REVENUE - APPROVED CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Next item on the agenda is item 8(E)(1), funding for the Harco Island Chamber of Commerce and Naples Area Tourism Bureau from category B. Ms. Gansel. MS. GANSEL: Good morning, Commissioners, Jean Gansel from your budget office. The Tourist Development Council had received two applications for category B, which is advertising and promotion funding. The two organizations that had submitted separate applications are actually the group that had previously been known as the Collier County Tourism Committee. They have been funded for two years now with this funding. They have split only for ease of administering the contract. Everything else is the same. The total amount of the grant requested was $992,587. The Tourist Development Council voted unanimously for funding. There are sufficient funds available for these grants. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay. Questions? Commissioner Hancock. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Is this within the annual anticipated collection that is allocated to category B? MS. GANSEL: Okay, what we do is it is an annual grant to these two organizations with funding that we collected last year. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. MS. GANSEL: We always allocate what is in the bank and collect for it. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: But we anticipate collections in the coming year in excess of this amount? MS. GANSEL: Exactly. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. Thank you. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: The issue is -- well, I guess there's not really an issue. But there's a point that they are now working separately you say rather than as a group or otherwise no changes? MS. GANSEL: Exactly. And, in fact, they had actually been working separately before -- COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Uh-huh. MS. GANSEL: -- and it's staff's recommendation that they submit two applications. It eases our administration. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: So let me ask you a question for clarification purposes. If this grant application is -- is approved and -- but it's money that was collected during fiscal year '94-'95, if we were -- if the TDC and the Board of County Commission were to get a application requesting category B funds during the coming 12 months and we wanted to -- to fund that project, where would the money come from? Would it come from currently collected funds then? MS. GANSEL: That would be the only source that we would have. It has been the policy of the TDC and the board only to allocate funds that are in the bank. So depending on when an application came in, if you adhere to that policy, that would possibly limit the amount of money that would be able to be used for another grant application. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay. Any other questions? Is there a motion? MR. DORRILL: You have one speaker. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: One speaker? Hay we hear that speaker? MR. DORRILL: Mr. Watkins. MR. WATKINS: Good morning. My name is Mike Watkins. I'm the chairperson of the Naples Area Tourism Bureau, one of the two applicants, along with the Marco Island Convention and Visitors' Bureau for these category B funds. I'm available only if you have questions. I think you're familiar with the two organizations, HICV, Marco Island Convention Visitors Bureau, and then Naples Area Tourism Bureau. We've been in front of you before. This will be our third year in operation as the entities promoting the destination. It's very important for continuity's sake for the effort to continue in promoting our destination. It's my understanding from numbers from the county that tourist tax collections in '95 fiscal year compared to '94 are up 9.6 percent. We believe that's an indication of the success of our effort, and I think the allocation of the magnitude of funds as -- as we're requesting will enable us to look a year out in our advertising campaign and continue the operations that we've begun in the past on behalf of Collier County. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Motion to approve. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Second. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Second. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have a motion and a second to approve the item as presented. Any further discussion? All in favor, please say aye. Opposed? Motion passes five to zero. Thank you, Miss Gansel. Item #8E2 REQUEST FOR CATEGORY C TOURIST DEVELOPHENT GRANT FOR FILLABELLY FOUNDATION, INC. - APPROVED WITH STIPULATIONS Next item on the agenda is consider request for category C, TDC grant for the Fillabelly Foundation. Miss Gansel. MS. GANSEL: The Tourist Development Council received an application from the Fillabelly Foundation for category C special event funding. The amount of the request was for $73,300. The event that the Fillabelly Foundation wanted to -- the special event was for a concert which would be in early Hay. The Tourist Development Council rejected the application by a vote of five to four. Fillabelly Foundation had requested that this item be brought to the Board of County Commissioners for consideration for funding. The grant application for $73,300, it is the intention of the Fillabelly Foundation to totally refund the money to the Tourist Development Council with proceeds from their ticket sales. They need the money up front for seed money to engage an entertainer for the event. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Will somebody summarize what the nature of the objection was? Why was there not support? CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: See if I can re -- recapitulate what -- the discussion did not last long. There were two or three dates available that the Fillabelly was suggesting, two of those dates being in late April and one of them being in early Hay. And there seemed to be a concentration on these late April dates, and there -- those dates not being in the quote, unquote, off season, but certainly in the shoulder season. And there wasn't a lot of discussion beyond that. MS. GANSEL: I had gone back to listen to the tapes as I was preparing this item so that I could pinpoint for you the objections of the council. And as Commissioner Matthews did say, the dates -- there was discussion of the dates. Since this had previously been a local event, they had no history of room nights that they were able to generate, but knowing that that was the Tourist Development Council's emphasis, they have increased their advertising budget to attempt to promote people -- more people coming from out of the county and staying here for the event, that there was some discussions regarding that and the number of room nights that they would be able to generate. If I might mention one other thing. On their budget there is an item for $36,700 that is for the coalition funding. This is kind of a different item in a budget, and I just call it to your attention. It's certainly not a tourist-related item in their budget, although the amount of funding that they are requesting for advertising and for the entertainer exceed the $73,300 that they have requested. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay, fine. Thank you. Commissioner Constantine. COMHISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I think the question that you need to raise is tourist development dollars go to develop tourism and try to bring people here to expend their money. And while it's a wonderful cause, I think the question we have to ask is are they going to generate hotel nights. I understand the increased advertising proposed for Miami and Lauderdale and Tampa area. The question I asked yesterday and I think is a very important one and no one could answer from the Fillabelly Foundation, many entertainers will come to an area, to the State of Florida, and play four shows or five shows or eight shows, and usually part of their contracts will include not playing within a 150-mile radius of the next or previous show so as not to saturate the market. What I'm wondering is if we are going to try to spend money to advertise and draw people from Tampa and from the east coast, can we be assured that whomever the entertainer is that they are bringing is not playing the previous night in Tampa or the next night in Miami, because obviously no one is going to come two and a half hours unless it's the Grateful Dead to -- COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: No, no, that's over. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: You're right. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: That's over. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: It's not going to happen. Nobody is going to travel if they're playing in their own town. They're not going to go the next night to a different town. And so I think that's a very, very important part of it is we're not going to draw from anywhere else, and we're going to defeat the purpose of the tourism dollars if the entertainer is playing elsewhere in those areas that we're trying to draw from. MS. GANSEL: I think part of the problem that they have right now is they need to have a commitment of the funds so that they can go and enter into a contract with an entertainer to do this, and until some of the finer details are pointed out, I don't know if that's a provision they can put in the contract when they make, you know -- select an entertainer for this event. Possibly you would want to make that a condition if that was a concern that you have. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: It's a very strong concern. The sole purpose for expending tourist tax dollars is to draw tourism to our community. And if this event wants tourist tax dollars, it has to have the goal of bringing people to our community. If they are advertising and the entertainer is playing already in the markets they're advertising to, we're not going to bring anyone here, and it defeats the purpose. So that's a pretty strong point for me. MS. GANSEL: Sure. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I have one other question, and that is what exactly is the coalition funding? You mentioned $36,700. That goes for -- MS. GANSEL: It's the food bank that Fillabelly Foundation distributes food to the different organizations in town for feeding the hungry. COMHISSIONER CONSTANTINE: And that is or is not included in the 73,0007 MS. GANSEL: That is included in their budget, but they have other items in their budget that exceed the request from the Tourist Development Council. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: They have eligible items that exceed 73,000 excluding that. MS. GANSEL: Yes. I did want to, you know, again emphasize that their intention is to pay back the 73,000. They are looking at 73,300 as seed money and not matching funds. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Yeah, I -- I note in their budget the anticipated repayment of the TDC funds. Commissioner Hancock. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: I was going to mention that I believe this is intended as a loan, not as a, in essence, a true expense to -- to generate room nights. However, the intent of category C still needs to be met. No one will argue the benefit of the Fillabelly Foundation. What I have a question regarding is -- and this may be more appropriate for someone with Fillabelly -- is the manner in which -- advertising does one thing. It may advertise the concert itself. But if you're going to create room nights, you need to tie an event to something else that goes on maybe the next day or day prior, some of the local attractions, that kind of thing. If there is a manner in which tickets are ordered and sent out, and with the return tickets you can include tourism information that cause people to spend more than one afternoon or evening here for a concert, now we're getting into trying to, in essence, promote room nights and tourism. And I would like to see some commitment from the folks at Fillabelly to work with the -- I guess I would say the NATB or some other appropriate organization to find a way in which you can link this concert to an overnight stay, you know, things such as whether it's Jungle Larry's or the Everglades or Third Street South or whatever, somehow packaging Naples if -- to people who are coming from out of town so they'll stay that night and -- and so forth. So if I can see something like that, then I think we have -- have tied it. And if it's a loan, we've taken little or no risk with the money. And if it turns room nights, then we've got a benefit. If it doesn't, we'll know. MS. GANSEL: Well, this was one of the items that they did discuss in their presentation to the TDC that as ticket sales come in, they would send information on hotels to, you know -- having the concert on a Friday night was their intention so that people more than -- you know, could be staying over Friday night and promoting it, giving -- sending some information to ticket holders about the area. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: I just want to know that there's going to be a concerted promotional effort on the part of the Fillabelly to turn these into room nights, and if I can get those assurances from them, then I think it's worth pursuing a loan, not purely a grant. MR. DORRILL: They have a representative here who may be able to answer those. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Commissioner Norris. COMMISSIONER NORRIS: Yes. The category C recipients are -- are asked to pay this money back to category C out of profits or '- MS. GANSEL: That's correct. COMMISSIONER NORRIS: -- overages in their events. Has Fillabelly applied for these grants before? MS. GANSEL: No, they haven't. COMMISSIONER NORRIS: They have not received a grant before? MS. GANSEL: That's correct. COMMISSIONER NORRIS: Okay. So we don't have a history on their prior events to show how successful they've been in attracting people? MS. GANSEL: We have received budgets from them on their past events. They had been fairly successful up until their last event. They always had generated sufficient funds to fund the next concert. The emphasis that the TDC in -- in their presentation there was that in the past their concerts have been successful, but we don't know how many people came from out of the area and how many did use room nights. So we know the concerts had for the most part been successful. But as far as how many out-of-town or out-of-county people, we didn't have records on that. COMHISSIONER NORRIS: Thank you. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. MR. DORRILL: Mr. Doyle is here on behalf of Fillabelly, and then I have one other speaker. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. Mr. Doyle. MR. DOYLE: Good morning, Commissioners. I'll try to tell you a little bit about our intention for Fillabelly that hopefully answer some of your questions and then answer any additional questions that you have. My name is Robin Doyle. I'm the president of the Fillabelly Foundation, which is a -- an organization that is qualified under Section 501(C)(3) of the Internal Revenue Code. Fillabelly was formed with the sole intention of raising funds to feed the hungry. That remains our mission. We've been successful both in raising funds and in establishing a coalition of agencies who feed the hungry. One of the questions was who is this coalition. Each of the members of the coalition that we have provided funding for in our budget are 501(C)(3) agencies. They are the ones who directly distribute food to the indigent. Those agencies work together. It was because of the impetus of Fillabelly that we were able to bring them together as a coalition. They now work together to buy food. They work together to trade information and actually to trade food on occasion to -- to coordinate their efforts. And I think that has been one of the great successes of Fillabelly is in the foundation of the coalition to feed the hungry. Fillabelly's sole purpose, however, has been to raise funds. We have done it with six very successful concerts and one concert that was a great concert but not a financial success. We have done all of this with absolutely no administrative costs. All of the funds that we have raised have been used for the concerts, and the net funds have been used to purchase food. Now, when we started Fillabelly it was certainly not our intent to promote Collier County, but I think we've found out that we have done so without even trying. We have -- we have tracked our ticket sales and know that 10 to 15 percent of our sales in the past have been made outside of Collier County. This is without any advertising targeted outside of the county. We have not tracked the number of room nights that this has created because it wasn't our intention to be attempting to promote the county. We're certain there were some room nights. In fact, I think the Beach Club Hotel where we have held most of the concerts certainly had some room nights there, but I cannot tell you how many. They would be better able to speak to that than we. And I think we've also generated a large interest in the community. We cannot do another concert without the seed money. We -- even in the year that our concert was not a financial success, we continued to fund to the level that we could the coalition agencies, but we lost our seed money for our concerts. It took us six years to build that seed money, and we think that we can build it back again, but we need the loan from the tourist development funds to be able to get it started again. As you have heard Hiss Gant (sic) say, it is our intent to repay the tourist development funds. We're looking for seed money. This is really a short-term loan. Our concert would be held the beginning of Hay, and once the concert's over, all the funds are in, and we would repay the money at that time. In an attempt to show our intention with regard to tourist development funds, we have increased our advertising budget substantially in excess of what we have done in the past, about double what we've done in the past. In the past our -- our advertising has been targeted to Collier County. We have now expanded that and will target our advertising from Tampa Bay south, because we believe this is an area which we have a substantial opportunity to draw from. We have in the past sought entertainers who actually had other concerts somewhere in the Florida area, in answer to Commissioner Constantine's question, because that was a way for us to keep down the cost of the entertainer. But we understand the concern about that if we're trying to draw from a larger area, and so we would tell you this morning that we would do everything in our power to get someone who does not have another concert announced within a 150-mile radius of Naples. So it would be our goal to try to create an event that would attract people because, quite frankly, the more people we can attract from outside the area, the better it is for us, the more funds that we'll raise. And I think it's consistent with what the commission is attempting to do with the tourist development dollars. I think that with the commitment that we've made to advertise from Tampa Bay south, we will be able to increase the percentage of our sales that are from outside of the county and will increase the number of room nights. It is our intention to send with our tickets that are sold out of town a stay-the-night brochure. We would be glad to coordinate that with the NATB or any other group. We'll enclose anything that we can to promote the area with our -- with our out-of-town ticket sales, because we think that that not only benefits the county but certainly benefits us too in creating an event that makes Naples an entertainment destination. So if there are any additional questions that I could answer, I would be happy to do so at this time. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have a speaker. Why don't we hear from the speaker first, Mr. Dotrill, and then we'll get back to whatever questions we have. MR. DOYLE: Yes. MR. DORRILL: Yes, ma'am, Mr. Olds. MR. OLDS: The name is Stanley Olds, and I am a concerned citizen. And I'd like to recommend that the Fillabelly Foundation's a very good one, and I've read about it constantly, and they've done a very good job throughout the county. As far as tourism money goes, I think the gentleman here has made a very good case for spending that money. There's quite a bit of it there, and so far you haven't done too much with it. But I would say for the foundation itself, it's a good cause. And when we have a good cause like this, why not support it. And I think that they've answered your question, Mr. Hancock -- I mean Mr. Constantine, about combinations of -- COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: We both look alike. MR. OLDS: Both names, you know. But anyway, I'm all for it, and as a concerned citizen, I'd recommend it highly. Thank you. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you, Mr. Olds. Do we have questions? Commissioner Constantine. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Robin, I appreciate the fact you've said you'd commit to someone who didn't have a concert within 150 miles. I wondered if we might extend that just a little bit to someone who didn't have it within -- doesn't have to be 150 miles, but some range of the advertising area, because if -- I have no idea what the Sun Dome is, but if that's 152 miles from here and we're advertising in Sarasota and Tampa and they're playing at the Sun Dome, it still defeats the purpose. MR. DOYLE: I would understand that to include the Tampa-St. Petersburg area. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: And are we doing any advertising on the east coast for this? MR. DOYLE: No, we're not. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Okay. MR. DOYLE: Well, let me say -- that is not planned at this time. We're working with Image Marketing who is the advertising agency that's actually donated a lot of time to Fillabelly over the years, and we will discuss with him further exactly what the advertising plans are, but my understanding is we're looking to west coast -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I certainly wouldn't object to advertising the east coast but just under the same circumstances. If they are playing in that metropolitan area, we don't want to throw our money away. That does answer that question. The second is you mentioned in the past traditionally 10 percent roughly of ticketgoers have been from somewhere else. Do we have any numbers on how many of those are from Lee? I know the one concert -- Kenny Rogers concert was held in Bonita anyway, so I've got to assume that it's a pretty strong turnout from Lee as well. MR. DOYLE: Ten to fifteen percent. I would assume that some of those have been from Lee. I may actually have some figures on that, but I don't recall exactly what they are. Obviously -- and one of the questions we were asked when we appeared before the TDC was, well, how many room nights have you generated? Well, we don't know the answer to that. We can't pretend that those people who come from Bonita or happen to be in Lee County are going to stay the night in Collier. However, we think that by targeting more advertising toward the Sarasota-Bradenton area that that might certainly create the possibility of more room nights. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: The -- we've had a great deal of difficulty trying to find appropriate category C expenditures. Fillabelly is a wonderful thing, as Stanley said, but that is -- I think we have to stay focused on not only necessarily whom the beneficiary is but whether or not the rules of category C are being met. I think with that, your agreement on 150-mile radius and the Tampa metropolitan area so we aren't competing with the same performer, then it does answer my question, and this is fairly clear that it's an appropriate use of category C. We have a good event, hopefully bring some people here, and then as a side to that, do benefit a great foundation in the process. So thanks for answering my questions. MR. DOYLE: Thanks. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'll support it. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Commissioner Mac'Kie. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I just want -- well, I'll be happy then at this point then just to make a motion that we -- that we accept staff's recommendation and approve the application under the conditions Mr. Doyle has described. My -- my feeling on this is that we -- we know what Fillabelly's always been in the past, and it's been wonderful. But it hasn't been something that would qualify for category C tourist tax funds. If, in fact, there is a way, and if you're going to recast it so that we'll try it this year and see if it -- if it does, in fact, sell some room nights, we at least have a track record on this being a successful event. Frankly, when we get some applications, they're brand new ideas, and we don't know if they're even going to fly. So I'd like to see this supported, and I'll move that we go forward. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Second. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Motion and a second. Commissioner Hancock. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: I just wanted to ask, Mr. Doyle, how do you plan on tracking room nights this year? MR. DOYLE: That's a good question. And I'm not a hotel expert, but we will -- we will check with the experts and find out. I don't know that you actually can accurately track the room nights, but we will do everything we can to see -- COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: You can do crowd sample surveys that are real easy and that kind of thing. So please work with the hotels, because if we go ahead with this this year, we need some baseline to look at -- MR. DOYLE: Sure. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- if a request should be made in future years. MR. DOYLE: We will be glad to do that. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you, Mr. Doyle. Commissioner Norris, did you have something? COMMISSIONER NORRIS: No, I do not. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have a motion and a second to grant the request to fund the Fillabelly Foundation grant with category C funds. Any further discussion? All in favor, please say aye. Opposed? Motion passes five to zero. Thank you. Item #9A PROPOSED AMENDED SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT IN THE MATTER OF BENEDICT P. MIRALIA, TRUSTEE V. COLLIER COUNTY, CASE NO. 90-2910-CA-01 FOR PROPERTY LOCATED IN SECTION 32, TOWNSHIP 48 SOUTH, RANGE 25 EAST - APPROVED Next item on the -- it's just after ten o'clock. Next item on the agenda is on the county attorney's report, item 9(A), a recommendation for a proposed amended settlement. MS. STUDENT: Good morning, Commissioners, Harjorie Student for the record. This is a settlement, an amended settlement, of an already executed settlement agreement for litigation that ensued between the property owner and the county, I believe, back in 1990 and basically involves some vested rights issue in its interplay with our zoning teevaluation ordinance. I did not handle that litigation for the office, but Mr. John Passidomo is here. He represented the plaintiff and could possibly fill you in on any historical information you might need about that. In any event, the property owner filed for an injunction and declaratory relief. And the property is located, by the way, at the intersection of Vanderbilt Beach Road and Vanderbilt Drive up near Beachwalk and Pavilion. And what the property owner agrees to do pursuant to the amended settlement agreement is to relinquish the right to develop a hotel and agrees to reduce the maximum amount of retail intensity from 14,500 square feet to 5,500 square feet and again replace the hotel with 190 multifamily units along with 20 existing hotel/condominium units, or in the alternative, demolish the existing structure and replace that with a 210-unit facility of maximum density. And I've attached a red-lined copy of the settlement -- or the amended settlement agreement to the executive summary for your review. Mr. Passidomo is here to answer any questions you might have. I will try to answer any questions you might have. And I have a member of planning staff here, Bob Hulhere, as well. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. Are there questions? Commissioner Hancock. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Am I correct in -- in the statement that an original settlement agreement was arrived at, agreed upon, and this is amending that settlement agreement? MS. STUDENT: That's correct, Commissioner. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: That original settlement agreement had land uses that were larger in square footage and greater in intensity than what is being proposed here? MS. STUDENT: That is correct. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. Thank you. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Any other questions? Is there a motion? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I'm going to make a motion to approve the amended settlement on the basis that it's less intensive and less impact on the surrounding neighborhood than what was originally proposed for the site. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'll second his motion. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have a motion and a second to approve the amended settlement agreement. MS. STUDENT: MAdam Chairman, if I might, I just wanted to make one reference to paragraph 15. There was a transposition error, and it should read, The county has determined that multifamily residences constitute a superior and less intensive land use to the hotel permitted on the Musca Property by the settlement agreement and that exchanging a hotel for multifamily. That's what the transposition error was. Residences on the agreement is canceled and terminated, et cetera. There was -- it is stated multifamily where it said hotel and vice versa. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: The motion will include that change? MS. STUDENT: Yes, it will. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Does the second accept the change? COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Yes. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: There's a motion and a second to approve the amended settlement agreement with the changes noted. Any other discussion or questions? All those in favor, please say aye. Opposed? Motion passes five to zero. Thank you, Miss Student. MS. STUDENT: Thank you. Item #9B RESOLUTION 95-689 APPROVING THE ISSUANCE BY THE COLLIER COUNTY INDUSTRIAL DEVELOPMENT AUTHORITY OF REFUNDING REVENUE BONDS FOR THE PURPOSE OF REFUNDING CERTAIN OUTSTANDING BONDS ISSUED BY THE COLLIER COUNTY DEVELOPMENT AUTHORITY AND THE INDUSTRIAL DEVELOPMENT AUTHORITIES OF CERTAIN OTHER COUNTIES - ADOPTED CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Next item on the agenda is adoption of a resolution approving the issuance of Industrial Development Authority refunding bond. Mr. Pickworth. MR. PICKWORTH: Good morning, Commissioners. My name is Don Pickworth. I represent the Industrial Development Authority. As we explained in our executive summary, the authority has been requested by SSU to be the lead issuing agency for a refunding bond issue to refund some outstanding SSU bonds covering not only bonds issued in Collier County, but also other counties. The authority held a meeting last Friday, and representatives of the company were there and explained the proposed financing. I have set forth in -- in summary form in the executive summary the purpose of the financing, which probably in a sentence or two is simply to take advantage of current low interest rate opportunities to wipe out some variable rate financing that, therefore, removes some interest rate risk and also to take some fixed securities and lower the interest rate. And that in -- in a nutshell is the -- is the purpose of the financing. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Mr. Pickworth, it sounds like there is no downside to this. MR. PICKWORTH: It's not really -- CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We don't have a motion yet. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'll make a motion we approve the item. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Second. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Ahh, now the order's straightened out. We have a motion and a second to approve the item. Is there further discussion? There being none, I'll call the question. All in favor, please say aye. Opposed? Motion passes five to zero. Thank you. MR. PICKWORTH: Thank you. Item #9C BCC PARTICIPATION IN THE FLORIDA ASSOCIATION OF COUNTIES LEGAL DEFENSE FUND - APPROVED CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Next item on the agenda is a recommendation the Board of County Commissioners consider participating in the FAC legal defense fund. MR. MANALICH: Good morning, again, Commissioners. For the record, Ramiro MAnalich. In your packet is a rather detailed summary of the history and purpose of this item. Essentially this is a proposal by the Florida Association of Counties to recruit funding among the counties on a pro rata-type basis to fund potential litigation statewide which would affect counties that are throughout the state. Essentially the decision that you need to make today is, number one, do you wish to participate in the program, which a number of counties have already pledged to do; secondly, if you do wish to participate, then the choice would be do you participate on a case-by-case basis where a statewide case comes up and we would then pledge some funds, or do you simply want to go with the formula set by the Florida Association of Counties, which is a per capita formula, one time initial contribution of $1,800 toward that goal. Our analysis from the county attorney's office indicates this is a rather small amount in comparison to the potential cost of these types of litigations. We have identified a fund -- county attorney's special counsel fund that would be available if you choose to follow this course. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay, Commissioner Hancock. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: At the meeting on MArco Island, I voted against the establishment of this for the simple purpose that some of the things that Mr. MAnalich has just discussed were not a part of it at that point. There have been changes since then that make it so that it's not mandatory but that it's somewhat discretionary on the part of the county. Already this year we have seen action from the FAC regarding the ability of utilities to cross county lines and charging, and there's already work going on this year that is going to have a fiscal impact hopefully positive on Collier County. So based on Mr. MAnalich's allocation of funds from the county attorney's office and, in essence, the county attorney's recommendation that we're going to get at least $1,800's worth of benefit from this, I'm comfortable in -- in moving this. This is -- you know, I just want to clear up. This is per annum, so each year it's $1,8007 MR. MANALICH: Well, the way that was explained to me by the executive director is right now there is a onetime initial contribution and to see how the fund is used, what cases arise. Obviously they have enough criteria that's set forth in your packet to determine when and if they will intervene, and whether they will need any more funding or not remains to be seen. This will be in effect for one year. Beyond that they will reevaluate, see what they have done, what cases have they handled, what benefits have been achieved, and then make a further determination from there. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay, thank you. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Commissioner Constantine. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'm going to make a motion we approve the item, and I'm going to tell you why. We spend -- how much do we spend annually now in our three-county effort to go up and rent an apartment and do our thing? And that is because we want to try to have some impact on what goes on at the state level and how that impacts us here in Collier County. Florida Association of Counties is probably our best voice in county issues as far as being in Tallahassee. They know the players. They know the people. They've got their hand literally on the pulse of what goes on day to day up there. And so if they are looking to put together a legal team and make some things happen on behalf of the counties, including us, $1,800 is probably about half what we're spending anyway in our effort. I would say it's a bargain. I agree with you, Commissioner Hancock, and I think it's money well spent. So I'll make a motion we approve the item. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Second. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have a motion and a second. And I'm not going to oppose the item at all. I was at the FAC meeting where it was originally proposed that the counties consider doing this. And this is not just a state-county issue. This is a national issue. We -- we are looking at legal cases going to the Department of Labor at a federal level and mandates coming back down for counties having to reimburse police officers for time they bond with their canine dogs for -- do I need to go any further? COMHISSIONER NORRIS: No. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay. So if there's not any further discussion, I'll call the question. All in favor, please say aye. Opposed? There being none, motion passes five to zero. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Let the record show Commissioner Matthews was solely against the dog bonding issue. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: No, not at all. I think they need to bond. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Headline: Commissioner Matthews hates dogs. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Not fair. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Just teasing. Thank you very much, Mr. Manalich. Item #10A REQUEST FOR ENDORSEMENT OF REVISED ST. MATTHEW'S HOUSE GRANT APPLICATION - CONTINUED TO 12/19/95 Next item on the agenda -- it's 10:20 -- is the item 10(A). This is an add-on item regarding the St. Matthew's House grant proposal that we attended to a couple weeks ago. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Can I ask when was this available? CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Just now. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. Because after -- after the review of the last one, being handed this document now and being asked to make a decision now on this document, I -- I have no desire to do until I have the time -- suitable time to review this. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Can I respond to that? COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I agree. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: If I just -- I agree that there's no possible way to review that and have any idea if it's something that we can or can't support. But you were also handed a letter that I think was drafted by Mr. Goodlette. I'm not sure who drafted it. But what it does, if you will -- if you'll read it, it says what the Collier County Board of Commissioners would acknowledge that the St. Hatthew's House operation has the right to do. And -- and I have one question myself about it. But it does very specifically say what we're -- what we're not supporting, that they're not permitted to provide services such as food pantry, labor pool, case management, apartment rental information. Frankly, this letter does -- in my judgment, does what we were concerned we might have a duty to do in the first place, and that is tell this federal agency what -- I'm sorry, tell this state agency what exactly it is that this group is allowed to do. So I think we have not a duty to do that, and I think this letter summarizes that very well. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Commissioner Norris. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: I agree that just to be handed this right now and say we're going to make a decision on it, I don't think, is -- after knowing what was in the first document, I wouldn't feel comfortable voting on this until I had a chance to look at it. I don't know if there's some sort of a time constraint here. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Time sensitive. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: But here's in effect what we're being asked to do, I believe, is we're being asked to say that we don't necessarily agree with what's in this grant application, but if we have our conditions put on it, then maybe we do. But, you know, who's going to look at this letter? They're going to see the grant application. I -- I need some time to look through this, because the first one, in our opinion, as a board, was -- was certainly -- contained some misleading information if not outright fraudulent, and I need to be assured that we've got this cleaned up. I don't want to just say, well, this -- this agreement is -- or this application is okay but, you know, to keep it honest, we -- we have these provisos. I don't know that that's what I want to do. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: But -- and I just ask you -- I agree with that, because none of us want to do that. We made that real clear. And that last application was horrific. It was awful. But this -- well, I hope Mr. Goodlette will tell us if there are, in fact, time constraints. I was asked to put this on today's agenda because of the time constraints, so let's hear about that. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Mr. Goodlette, I'd appreciate a clarification on that, because I met with the chairman of St. Hatthew's House board and a couple of other members and your attorney and the executive director a couple of weeks ago, or I think it was about a week and a half ago, at which time I was told it was a moot point now because we had missed the deadline. And all of them agreed, gosh, it's too bad we missed it but it's over now. So you folks don't have to worry about an endorsement at this point; it's a moot issue. And now we're being told that window is open again. MR. GOODLETTE: Madam Chairman, if I may, Dudley Goodlette. I'm here this morning on behalf of the St. Hatthew's House. Let me answer the question of the timing because, again, I am relying upon information that has been provided to me by Mr. Westley who is -- will soon become the president of St. Hatthew's House. Dr. Collins is here and may be able to add to this. But it is my understanding that that window is still open to grant this application but that the -- Mr. Hanlon (sic), who is the person to whom the letter that Commissioner Mac'Kie alluded -- the person to whom that letter is addressed, is waiting to hear from the county on whether or not or to what extent it would support the application that's pending before that agency. And the effort in this letter was to do exactly what Commissioner Mac'Kie outlined, which is to merely state as matter of factually as this letter, we believe, does, what is the status of the St. Matthew's House and what do they do for this community. Some of that is outlined in the application. To the extent that the modified application does make reference to certain uses that might be for nonresidents, like a thrift shop, like a labor pool, this letter clarifies or is -- is designed to clarify that that is not the case unless and until separate approval is obtained by St. Matthew's House pursuant to your Land Development Code to accomplish that end. What this letter does state is matter of factually what has been approved. And these funds -- if you look in exhibits -- in the -- in the larger packet that Mr. Weigel distributed to you, you can see that the one-hundred-and-eighty-two-thousand-and-some-dollars funds are for operational expenses and for some employee-related expenses. Frankly, we have been advised by Mr. Hanlon -- or Mr. Westley has been advised by Mr. Hanlon that there is a good likelihood that this grant would be approved if this Board of County Commissioners will just merely state whether they -- you know, to what extent they support it. And that's what this letter at the llth hour -- for which I apologize, because I have to admit to you that I was within the loop on this for the first time in a meeting yesterday morning, Commissioner Constantine, that I think you were aware that exists. Mr. Weigel can speak to that. Mr. Cautero was there as well. Representatives of St. Matthew's House were there. So, yes, there are some exigencies of time that are important. But, frankly, to the extent that we have been informed that the likelihood of this being granted are pretty good, we hate to leave $182,000 sitting on the table. And if you look at the application and -- and -- and there are reasons why this commission should scrutinize this application as it has scrutinized this application, but the mission of St. Matthew's House is what I hope will not get lost in the mix here. And it's designed as -- this new shelter for -- for men and for women and for children. Many of these funds are for playground equipment for facilities for children that do not currently exist, because we don't currently service children and women. And so if -- if you look at the -- simply tracing the funds and what -- what would this $182,000 resource be used for, I would hope that you can endorse that, and we can set to the side -- and what this letter is designed to do is set to the side the issues, the zoning issues, the land-use issues, the comprehensive plan, the Land Development Code issues that we have had so much consternation about in the past. This -- hope -- hopefully this letter as it's drafted is designed to bring the community together on these issues. It's not designed in any way to -- to endorse anything in this application that's -- that's fraudulent or that's in any way designed to -- to misrepresent where we are in the process. It's simply this: I can tell you that without a letter of -- of endorsement in this fashion from this commission today this grant will not be made. COMMISSIONER NORRIS: Mr. Goodlette, I appreciate your comments there. They're well -- well taken. The thing -- the point from my perspective is that if I'm asked to endorse this application, it needs to be on the basis of the application itself, not this letter, in my opinion. And I would just prefer to be able to have the time to go through this again. I don't know that you directly answered the question of will a week's delay harm the chances of getting the grant. What was the answer to that? MR. GOODLETTE: I've been told that Mr. Hanlon needs a response today. I would be more than happy -- if you wanted to defer this item to the end of your agenda today, I'll talk with him personally. I don't want to make representations to you standing before you this morning, Commissioner Norris, that I can't personally validate. But I will do that if you would like. I would be happy to have any of you do that. I would be happy to have your attorney do that. And if there is no time constraint, I'd love to give you all the time, you know, that would be permissible. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I think what I'd like to do is that, and either yourself or Mr. Weigel perhaps can inquire of Mr. Hansen if we can have that week to -- I've got to assume the agency has the best interest at heart as well. And I'd just as soon be able to review this, and that would answer everyone's question. And we could review it, and we could be back and have an answer for you next Tuesday. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: And here's my problem, Mr. Goodlette. When this goes through, this letter, along with the letter from the county commission and every other agency that lent support to this grant application, will be put in a file somewhere, and this grant application will go in a file somewhere, and the -- the two will never meet again, if you get my meaning. I mean, the grant application then will stand on its own, and that's why I'm saying that if I'm going to endorse this grant application, I want the grant application itself to be approveable. MR. GOODLETTE: Perhaps -- Madam Chairman, if I may, perhaps the issues that -- that concern and understandably concern Commissioner Norris, I think, have been addressed by Mr. Weigel and Mr. Cautero from the standpoint of looking at your Land Development Code determining -- determining what activities can take place on the current -- on the new facility, if you will. And I think this letter is designed to -- to -- to acknowledge what those limitations are. And perhaps Mr. Weigel would like to comment. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: A few quick questions. You've referred several times to the moderated change -- the modified application -- MR. GOODLETTE: Not changed, altered. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Thank you -- application. Do those modifications change some of the concerns that were raised last time around? If when we read through this between now and next Tuesday, are we going to see -- COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Yes. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: -- it no longer includes some of those things of which we were concerned? MR. GOODLETTE: I believe that is correct. I was not present when you last considered, but Dr. Collins tells me that is correct. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: And my review indicates, too, that there are significant changes. I haven't done a thorough enough review to tell you guys that it's perfect. MR. GOODLETTE: Perhaps Dr. Collins could speak to the time issue. I think maybe he does have the personal knowledge that I do not. Perhaps he has the knowledge that I do not, Madam Chairman. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. Commissioner Hancock, you had a question? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Before Dr. Collins speaks, I'm going to be honest with you. It's not going to matter what your timing is. I find five issues in the first three pages I have questions about. And unless I have the ability -- if I'm going to sign on as a member of this board that I support a grant application, I need to be able to support it in its entirety both in what it asks for and what it represents in the situation in which St. Hatthew's will operate. So your timing I appreciate, but if -- you know, how long ago was it that we kicked this back? And yet we received this application this morning. That's simply irresponsible. There is no way you can ask this board to review this document and sign on to it being given it this morning knowing the history of what we reviewed previously. And, you know, I just -- regardless of your timing, I cannot -- I cannot shirk my duties and just sign on based on -- and I appreciate the information Mr. Goodlette has presented and the work you've put in and in making the assurances regarding zoning and operation that you've made. But there are representations in here that have nothing to do with operation but have to do with the basis on which the grant is being requested. And I need to make sure I agree with those. And when I go through the first few pages and see some questionable items already, I'm very, very concerned about, you know, having the opportunity to review it in its entirety. So, you know, make your case, but I'm telling you from my standpoint receiving this this morning, being asked to approve it today, and if not today, don't bother, then I'm not going to be able to be -- to be a part of it. You know, if you want to give us a week to look at this and give us time to get a list of questions back to you, I would do that in a matter of two days. But at this point I don't think I can move ahead in approving this in the manner which it's been presented. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Dr. Collins, is this time sensitive? MR. COLLINS: Yes, ma'am, very much so. And the irresponsibility, let me assure you, does not lie with St. Hatthew's House. We were only told on Thursday or Friday morning of last week that we had opportunity to put the grant application in late, because they wanted to fund us if we could. We then met with Mr. Weigel and Mr. Cautero yesterday morning. We moved immediately then to call the -- Mr. Hansen. He said if you can get that through to us today -- what we would do would have to be to fax a letter today that would be attached to the application. So we were kind of left out too, I mean, until the end of last week. And we moved as quickly as we could. There was no attempt to slide anything past you or anything like that. We made an attempt when it came back to us through some discussions with Mr. Weigel's office to answer some of the questions you had, and most of them seemed to point toward the placing of ministries at the new St. Hatthew's House that we hadn't really talked through, and that was not the board's purpose in doing that. That got past the board. What we're trying to do in the letter is say we don't want to try to do anything there that we're not legally licensed and able to do. And we'll -- we're willing and wanting -- that's why our discussions have been with -- with Mr. Constantine and some of the staff, to work through those things. This issue flared up Friday afternoon, as I said. And we did even not know until yesterday afternoon after meeting with Mr. Weigel and trying to discuss through some more issues that we still had a chance. In discussions yesterday afternoon they said, yes, if you can get the letter tomorrow and fax it to us with the permanent copy to come by mail, so that's why we tried to move this. There's no attempt to act irresponsibly. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: My apologies if you take affront to that. But from my perspective to be asked to review this sight unseen in this time frame is very, very difficult, if not impossible, to do. MR. COLLINS: I understand that. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: And my apologies if you've taken affront to that statement. It really wasn't intended in that manner. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: May I? CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Commissioner Mac'Kie. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Just in an effort to focus what -- the agenda item that I asked to be added today was not would we endorse -- would we see that this -- that everything in here is correct. The agenda item was intended if we could look at this letter and see if there is a way to write a letter that says we don't know what they put in their grant application, but here's what they're permitted to do in Collier County. We talked about having that obligation to notify other governmental agencies anyway. Perhaps just that letter would be better than no letter. If we had a letter that said we haven't had an opportunity to thoroughly review the amended application; we did see the first one and we rejected it; but here's what we do support their ability to do in Collier County. Perhaps a letter like that would at least keep the door open. And -- and, again, we talked about having an obligation to provide that notification to this other governmental agency. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Well, that's not what the proposed letter says. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Right. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: It says we agree to endorse the above-referenced grant application. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: ANd I'm suggesting something else. I hear from you that there's not support on the board to do that, and so I'm suggesting that maybe we write a different letter. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Write a different letter. Also could I ask -- Commissioner Norris's comment that this letter would probably be separated from the grant application, and once submitted never the two would meet again. I see attached to the grant application are a number of -- of letters from various organizations, groups, and representatives that are a part of this application. Can't we make this letter as much a part of this application as these other letters are? Is that possible? MR. COLLINS: I would think so. I wouldn't know how to answer that 100 percent without talking to Mr. Hansen. But the problem they're having is they're wanting to give $182,000 to the people of Collier County to deal with a very significant problem, and we can't seem to get connected here as to the wording of the letter, and that's all we're trying to do. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: I understand. Commissioner Constantine. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I have a misunderstanding, I guess, because in our previous meetings -- and I've met with the board members -- the indication was that an endorsement letter from a local government agency, being the board of commissioners, was a 100-point checkoff on the point system toward what grants fall where on the scale. And so that if you do not get a letter, it means you have a hundred-point disadvantage from those communities that did get a letter from their local government agency. But what I've heard Mr. Goodlette say is, gosh, if we don't get this letter, we're absolutely positively not going to get the grant approved. And those are two very different statements. And I'm wondering are we entering a different process than what was explained to me in the meetings in the other room? Is it a hundred points, or is it a yes or no? MR. COLLINS: My understanding, Mr. Constantine -- and let me tell you that I'm not the board member who's worked directly with the grant -- is that it was a 10-point -- COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Okay. I'm sorry. MR. COLLINS: -- deficit. That was our understanding at the beginning. Then when we say, well, we may not have it, it then moved from the state's perspective to, well, there's not much chance of getting it to you won't get it without the local government endorsement. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: So while the -- while the -- MR. COLLINS: See, we're trying -- excuse me, Commissioner Mac'Kie. We're trying to deal with the state and their language to us and try and filter that to you in a positive way, and that's been some of our struggle with them, to be very honest about it. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: So it's not just a point criteria now the -- despite the fact that's how it appears on the application. They verbally told you that it is an exclusionary criteria? MR. COLLINS: Well, I think the terminology was there's no chance you'll get this without the county -- local county government. COMMISSIONER NORRIS: Could you ask them to clarify that? MR. COLLINS: Well, there was another word used in there, Commissioner Norris, but I would not use it with the commission this morning. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: We appreciate that. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Commissioner Mac'Kie, did you have another comment? COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: No. I would just ask your consideration of our drafting a letter modifying what we have in front of us that tells -- that goes with this application, becomes a part of it. And it could be drafted to say there -- just what I said before; there are -- there were definitely problems with the original application. We understand it's been amended. We haven't had adequate time to review it. We do, however, want to inform you that the following is permitted under this PUD, STP, whatever it is, in Collier County, period. COMMISSIONER NORRIS: LDC. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Thank you. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. Do we have speakers, Mr. -- MR. McNEES: Yes, ma'am. You have one, Dave Carpenter. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Mr. Carpenter. MR. CARPENTER: Hi, Dave Carpenter, East Naples Civic Association. Still have a tie on today. See, I didn't know about this. I'm like you guys. I can't think of a more controversial issue that's come before this county commission in the past two or three years than -- than the question of St. Hatthew's House. You're being asked today, despite how you word it, to sign off on a grant which the last version you saw of it you basically rejected. At least St. Hatthew's House has a representative here today. They didn't when they first submitted the grant, which might have solved some of these problems. You're doing it without the public seeing the document, without the public seeing the letter, and without you folks having the time to look at the document or really study the letter. My suggestion would be on this that you say, thank you, we will consider it, and we will have it on the agenda next Tuesday regardless of what their time problems are. I don't see any other logical way out on this. I think if you go ahead, this amounts basically to an endorsement of the grant application. If you go ahead with that without the documents being in the sunshine for the public of Collier County to see it, I think you're making a grave mistake no matter how you word your letter on it, and it may come back to haunt you. Thank you. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Just a response to that, if I -- if I may. Apparently the grant review process is almost over. If, in fact, we as Collier County government are going to have any input at all, this is our opportunity. If you want to write a letter that says their -- their grant application is full of lies and we don't endorse it, we have some obligation to correspond to these agencies. I think that a factual letter that says this is what is permitted -- for your information, this is what's permitted in Collier County. We talked about that as an obligation. But I think we have an obligation to communicate with this agency whether it's positive, negative, or neutral. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Are there any other comments? Mr. Collins, you have something to add, Dr. Collins? MR. COLLINS: Yes, if I may. I would recognize part of Mr. Carpenter's statement. There has been some controversy over the issue of St. Hatthew's House, but the fact remains that St. Hatthew's House is here and in place and is doing good ministry in this community. And I would hope that the board could in some way support that ministry with some kind of letter to the government so we would at least have an opportunity to provide better services to the people of Collier County. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'll make a motion that we review the item and be prepared to create a letter with our response on Tuesday, the 19th, after we've had a chance to review it. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Second. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have a motion and a second to review the item, review the letter, the grant and so forth, and bring it back on the 19th. I'm not going to support the motion, because I think it essentially kills the opportunity for St. Hatthew's House to receive this grant. I -- I would prefer -- I know we're on short notice to take a table and review it in the afternoon and hear it again at the end of the day. But we have a motion and a second. Any further comments? COMHISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'll make one amendment to the motion, too. I'll ask that Mr. Weigel contact Mr. Hansen and inform him of our intent so that if there is a way for them -- I think usually if communication is clear, most government agencies are fairly cooperative. So if we communicate clearly with them, they may well be open to that. I'll make that part of the motion as well. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: change? COMHISSIONER NORRIS: COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: I have a -- Does the second accept the Yes. Question. Commissioner Hancock was first. I -- I sincerely appreciate what Commissioner Mac'Kie has said today. And if there were a way to do it and be reasonable, I would. Unfortunately, the only letter I can sign right now says I haven't reviewed it; I can't agree to it; I can't agree to its content; however, this is what they can do in Collier County. However, that to me does nothing. It says this is what their permitted uses are, period. By the way, we didn't get a chance to review the application, so we can't support the grant per se. That -- that's the only thing I can sign on to, and that does absolutely nothing. So I'm going to support the motion in the hopes that this gets back to the state agency, and they can give a one-week leeway so we have the ability to review this and make some meaningful statement. Otherwise I -- I just don't see any good coming out of a letter that says we don't support the application but, by the way, they're zoned to do X, Y, and Z. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: My question is whether or not the board would indulge -- would indulge me to give us until the end of the day to ask if, in fact, a factual letter would do any good or to ask if, in fact, there's any consideration will be given to this item if it's postponed for a week, just that we table this motion -- CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Is that a motion -- is that a motion to table? COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Yes. It's a motion to table until the end of the meeting. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: I'll second the motion to table until the end of the meeting. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: We have a motion and second on the floor. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Motion to table -- motion to table takes precedence. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Oh, I see. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have a motion and a second to table the motion until the end of the day where we've had time to further address it. All those in favor, please say aye. Opposed? CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Motion fails two to three. We have a motion and a second on the floor to direct -- direct staff to bring this issue back to us on the 19th to further address the letter and the grant application. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: And that we contact -- we ask Mr. Weigel to contact Mr. Hansen and that we're prepared to issue some sort of written statement next Tuesday. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have the motion restated. All those in favor, please say aye. Opposed? Motion passes three to two, Commissioners Mac'Kie and Matthews being in the opposition. MR. COLLINS: May I speak? CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Dr. Collins, real quick. MR. COLLINS: Would that be able to be done very quickly, because to be honest about it, if we don't get something to them today or some word to them today, then there really is no use to proceed, and there's no use to waste your time next Tuesday reviewing something that we can't submit? COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Maybe Mr. Weigel can call them when we go on break in two minutes. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: And let us know if that will work or not. With that in mind, why don't we take a break. We'll come back at eleven o'clock, and the Naplescape item will be on the agenda at eleven o'clock. Thank you. (A short break was held.) Item #8B5 REPORT WITH RECOHMENDATION OF APPROVAL TO INITIATE A COLLIER COUNTY URBAN AREA TAXING DISTRICT FOR MEDIAN LANDSCAPE DESIGN/CONSTRUCTION/OPERATION - MEDIUM MAINTENANCE TO BE FUNDED FROM THE GENERAL FUND FOR NEXT BUDGET YEAR AND THIS ITEM TO BE BROUGHT BACK TO THE BCC AGAIN NEXT WEEK CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Let's reconvene the Board of Commissioners' meeting for December the 12th, 1995. We have a time certain that we are addressing as close to eleven o'clock as possible, and that's the Naplescape median program. Mr. Dorrill. MR. DORRILL: Commissioners, I'm going to introduce this item and provide the highlights to it. The Naplescape people are here. They will participate in terms of the type of projects that have been conceived and are in their five-year work plan, and they also have developed some schematics in terms of a good, perhaps the best, representative project of the type of ongoing work that they are involved in, and that includes Davis Boulevard. So I've got a couple of -- of exhibits that I hope will provide some clarity to this item. There's been a great deal of confusion as a result of people reading or trying to follow this in the newspaper. For whatever reason we don't have a hand-held mike on this side, so I'll stand here. What we are portraying in this particular slide shows you the extent to which you currently have an investment in improved and irrigated medians in the urban area, the exception being Marco Island where many of those medians are not irrigated. And, thus, we have the problems that we experienced over the summer and last spring with the need to have an irrigation truck. But I think what you can see from this first exhibit are two things. You can see the county's growth in providing for improved medians, and I will tell you that I think perhaps second to our beaches, the most recognizable asset that we have, at least when -- when I hear people say or who visited Naples, is that we seem to have the cleanest, most attractive streets and efficient roadway system of any community our size, and I don't think that I would disagree. You can see the growth in the county system now to include streets, arterial streets, or major collectors that include Seagate, Pine Ridge, Goodlette Road, the lower portion of Goodlette Road, in addition to the Trail and Airport Road. We have also sponsored in the past year to 18 months two private-sector projects that were built with either partial or full support from the private sector, and those include the medians on Immokalee Road that run from U.S. 41 to Goodlette that were installed as part of an agreement with Collier's Preserve and also Pine Ridge extension which was done under an agreement with the Vineyards Development Company and extends just east of 1-75 all the way to Santa Barbara. The second distinction on this slide shows one of the problems that we have in terms of -- of what I will call fairness for median beautification. In addition to the city that historically has maintained the U.S. 41 median and also the Goodlette Road median up to Coastland Boulevard, we have two other communities that are paying the sole cost of the arterial medians in their community. That includes the Golden Gate beautification MSTU, which is here (indicated) -- COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: You aren't thinking of the Telltale Heart right now? COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: Yeah. MR. DORRILL: -- and also the Marco Island beautification MSTU, and the contention being that aside from the taxes that are collected in those districts, the community at large derives a greater benefit for having improved medians. I think that's particularly true in Golden Gate. Only the people who live in Golden Gate city are paying into the cost to improve and then maintain Golden Gate Parkway medians. But I think it's safe to assume that a much larger part of the community derives some benefit directly or indirectly from having those medians in their community. The second slide shows essentially what is the -- the basis of the proposal, and there are a series of options. And this is where the proposal has become somewhat confused. In order to establish current county commission obligations for maintenance and also to provide a mechanism for future improvements in capital projects, it has been proposed that a taxing district be created to replace sort of what is the current hodgepodge arrangement for revenues that are raised to support median projects. The area that is designated in yellow shows and is the urban area as defined under your comp. plan, which is essentially everything one mile east of 951 and then running out the east Trail for about an additional mile or so exclusive of the City of Naples. And this is important, because if we are to create an urban area-wide fund as one of the options, the city wants to remain independent for at least the next year, their rationale being the very large cost that they incur independently to maintain those two median projects that I've already mentioned. In addition, the city maintains an elaborate series of residential streets and minor collector streets, and I was even surprised to find out just the other day in discussing this with Dr. Woodruff, the city maintains 61 different cul-de-sac locations throughout the incorporated city limits. They're not being maintained by homeowner or property owner associations. So the city feels that for the coming year they've got more than what they can handle in terms of doing with city revenues those two projects that are otherwise county arterial roads, U.S. 41, and also the lower portion of Goodlette. And in an effort to then bring some clarity to this, I'm going to continue to defeat the general fund budget dilemma that will confront you this summer. But I'm reminding all of us that one of your primary stated goals that you identified for 1996 was to continue to have fiscally sound and I might add conservative local government as one of your primary stated goals. We have worked with the Naplescape people to produce this option proposal for you in recognition of that. I think the Roman numeral number two there clearly shows what is happening to the county general fund and the road and bridge fund. Historically the road and bridge fund for maintenance -- the road and bridge department has been paid for with gasoline taxes. Prior board action is using every dime of gasoline taxes in this county to construct new roads. As we have then looked to find a replacement to those gasoline taxes, which just a year ago were 4.2 million dollars in support of road and bridge maintenance, we have turned to the general fund and are using essentially your excess sales taxes that are currently a non-ad valorem revenue in the general fund to replace the gasoline taxes. Ultimately we are impacting the general fund by this revenue going in support of the road and bridge fund. In addition to that, and I'm -- I won't beat a dead horse on this issue, but preliminarily the sheriff's budget for -- and if you annualize the 28 new deputies for this year and you also take into account the cost associated with the special pay increase for the sheriff that was approved a month or so ago, the potential increase in the sheriff's budget next year could be 5 to 6 million dollars. And the countywide tax implications of that could be at least a 20 percent increase over the rollback rate in the general fund. So I -- I mention that because of at the same time we are building median beautification projects, we need to find a -- a fair and consistent and either countywide or urban area-wide source of maintaining these districts once they're put into place, because gasoline taxes are gone in the road and bridge fund, and increasingly sales taxes from the general fund are keeping afloat your road and bridge department as we know it. There is an extensive amount of detail that is in the executive summary, and we didn't intend to overcomplicate it but to try and show you all of the different angles and all of the history in terms of expense and revenue projections that have gone into place here. In the very last -- I have just attempted to show you the major options that are there. Obviously the biggest and most expansive option is to continue to recognize that medians throughout the community derive a countywide benefit, whether they are in Immokalee, whether they're on Marco Island, whether they're in north Goodlette Road as we look to expand those projects in the future, or Davis Boulevard in East Naples are two representative projects that are important to the staff. Countywide value is 18 billion dollars or one-tenth of a mill, whether either in the general fund or in some special fund would raise obviously 1.8 million dollars a year, and then you can take that up in terms of a fraction of a mill as you add additional capital projects. And this is something that the Naplescape people want to touch on briefly. They're interested in how are we going to continue to take advantage of the success that we have had; how are we going to continue to build additional projects. My interest as your county manager is to keep reminding you that we've got operating responsibilities, and we need a more consistent way. So then we have stepped it down to if you only look at the urban area, that value is 14 billion dollars. If you look at the urban area exclusive of the city, which is something that the city desires here at the end of 1995, you're down to 10 billion. And if you excluded both the city and Marco Island, they alone account for almost half of the assessed value in the county, so then we're down to just seven and a half billion dollars. And so these are the options. I think if I had my druthers, I would say that we ought to continue to recognize the responsibility to maintain medians. We already have in our annual work plan that you're going to see what Mr. Sumac called the action agenda, wide-scale privatization of median beautification projects that will occur in the coming year that will account and anticipate increased cost. In addition, I will tell you that we have already heard enough from the communities that have their own district, that they want to preserve the right to be left alone, whether on Marco Island or Pelican Bay or Lely. Pelican Bay and Lely from my perspective are residential beautification districts. They don't deal with arterial road systems. But even the little West Lake community that is only levying about five or six thousand dollars a year in ad valorem tax -- I think where we have special districts in place and an overriding desire for those people to continue to do their own thing, it would certainly be my recommendation to you to let them do that if that's what they want to do. My interests are the countywide or urban area assets that you're putting into place on arterial roads and to recognize here today and show you some options associated with that. With that I'm concluded, and I'd be happy to answer any questions. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: If I -- Mr. Dotrill, if I could ask one -- one question that I'm -- I'm getting a little bit concerned about the MSTUs in general and the blossoming that -- that we're seeing. Is there a millage cap statutorily for MSTUs? MR. DORRILL: We're -- we statutorily are required in aggregate not to exceed a 10-mil cap. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: For all MSTUs? MR. DORRILL: That -- I'm saying in aggregate for any particular district that would have a county tax, and let me give you the best example. The assessed value at Ochopee for the Ochopee Fire District is very low, and as a result of that, their fire district millage is very high. And the Ochopee area is the only area in the county where we are running the risk or nearing the risk of having problems associated with a 10-mil cap, but it likely will not occur in the coming year. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: How about the MSTU involving Sabal Palm? MR. DORRILL: That could be one, and I'd have to look to my budget office to provide me a little more -- because, see, Sabal Palm may not be in some other districts. I don't know all of the districts that would affect Ochopee. They've got the additional one that they've had down there in the past that involved the MS. I'd really need Mr. Smykowski to help me with that. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We may, if we elect to do this and proceed with the sheriff's MSTU, be coming to an area where we're approaching in some districts that 10-mil cap. MR. DORRILL: People should recognize clearly as we discuss a countywide district for sheriff's protection -- know that we will see a corresponding decrease at the same time in the general fund millage, so that is a straight wash. That is not a new tax, nor would a countywide or urban area-wide MSTU here be a straight -- because we will see corresponding decreases in all of those other MSTUs or to the extent in which the general fund is subsidizing median beautification, which for the last year was about a quarter of a million dollars. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: That's -- that's the point I was hoping that you would make is that we're not really doing anything different than what we've been doing. We're merely going to reallocate it and give it a different name. MR. DORRILL: I'm taking full responsibility for that. And I even shared with someone in the audience earlier this morning, because they didn't understand, and they asked me. And when I come to work every day, I deal with this every day. And this is just like the back of my hand. I think when people read or hear that the county is considering an MSTU for this, that, or the other, they suddenly think this is a new tax that is going to be added on top of all the other taxes that I'm paying. That's not correct in this particular case or in the case of the sheriff's MSTU. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay. Thank you. Commissioner Hancock. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Mr. Dotrill, based on last year's maintenance budget alone for landscape medians, if you converted that to millage -- in other words, I'm a county resident. And I say of my taxes I paid last year, approximately what millage would it -- since we're -- today we will be talking about millage. If I were -- if we were to convert the monies spent on maintenance of medians last year to a millage rate, do you have a ballpark idea what that would be? MR. DORRILL: Well, I'm -- I'm going to keep my answer as simple as I can and, again, just focus with the arterial roads that we were responsible for -- COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Right. MR. DORRILL: -- so automatically I take out Golden Gate, and I take out MArco Island. And Mr. Archibald will help me here if I get off track. I think the road and bridge fund spent about $330,000 last year in addition to the maintenance districts that are in place. So there's a third of a million right there that was, we'll call it, an ad valorem-type requirement. In addition, we have now built this year the Airport Road median, and I will say that that's going to increase by a function of whatever the lineal foot cost is. We also spent a quarter of a million dollars last year to undertake the Collier's Preserve improvements, and that was a subsidy from the general fund. And I, frankly, will need a little help with what our continuing commitment is to the Vineyards where you are subsidizing the Vineyard's Development Corporation maintaining their fund, so we're paying for that as well. I'll say in aggregate last year we probably spent $750,000 or -- or thereabouts, and if you'll look at a countywide perspective, that would -- would be only about fifty-one-hundredths of a mill or one-half of one-tenth of a mill, and it starts to get real complicated. But you can see that we spend about half of what one-tenth of a mill would generate countywide. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Yeah, because I think when we talk about finding a fairer way countywide to handle the -- the increasing maintenance burden, we may not be talking about a -- an increase per se. But when we talk about the potential construction schedule and the addition of median beautification throughout the county, which I am -- am a proponent of, we do have to look at that as an increase because, in essence, we will be asked to spend more than we're spending on maintenance and construction right now from what I see. So the increase needs to be measured against what we currently are paying on an annual basis to determine -- you know, in other words, if we talk about two-tenths of a mill, we're not talking two-tenths of a mill increase. Part of that is subsidizing what was already being paid for maintenance and construction on an annual basis. So the increase in that would be marginal. I think that's a key point. MR. DORRILL: As -- as we look to build future projects, and your executive summary includes a very fine analysis and spreadsheet of potential costs that was prepared by the Naplescape organization, I will tell you increasingly I don't think that gasoline taxes are going to be available to pay for those types of projects. We did pay for the Airport Road project with gasoline taxes, because that project came in a half a million dollars below the engineer's certified estimate of costs. So it -- it was an extra that we added to that project that we were able to do for no other reason than it came in below the engineer's certified estimate. Otherwise, we're going to have to look to what I would call what is the general fund equivalent of your capital improvement program, which is your 301 fund, and that is something at the moment we levy about, I'll say, four-tenths of a mill, five-tenths of a mill countywide for pay as you go capital improvement projects in your 301 fund. Aside from that, the only other way we're going to see projects be developed is through the continuing work of the Naplescape people to be a facilitator to developers who derive a benefit, as was the case of Collier's Preserve and the Vineyards, or what is a very difficult project for them on Davis Boulevard where you have an established community and they're trying to raise a piece at a time or incrementally the funds associated with doing the Davis Boulevard project between Airport Road and U.S. 41. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Commissioner Constantine. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: The -- I was going to save most of my comments for later, but I hear the train warming up already, so I want to make sure I get my comments in early. Commissioner Hancock, you mentioned as we look to increase two-tenths of a mill, all of that isn't necessarily new. But, Mr. Dotrill, if I've understood you properly, what's currently being spent out of general fund is about half of one-tenth of a mill. So we're looking at well more than double -- perhaps we can get some lights back -- well more than double what we're currently spending. Am I incorrect in that? MR. DORRILL: You're -- you're not incorrect, but if -- if you want to take it to the higher plane, and to pick up Golden Gate and to pick up Marco Island, it is going to be much closer to one-tenth because I'll tell you, they spend over a half a million dollars a year alone on Marco Island for what is that one major project that they have there. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: I wasn't -- I do want to clarify. I wasn't advocating necessarily two-tenths. I was using it for an example. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I understand. The -- and what's the total expenditure in Golden Gate annually? MR. DORRILL: I'll say it's in excess of $300,000 for Golden Gate. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I think you're right. One of the things Commissioner Matthews said earlier that concerned me was we're not really changing it; we're doing an accounting change. I'm rewording what you said, but I think we are changing what we're doing quite a bit here. Marco Island and Golden Gate are two examples you just mentioned and probably two very good examples. They are two communities which have voluntarily taxed themselves and which hold their own destiny. They decide what they're going to do year to year. They have a board that oversees, and they make up their own priorities, that if we suddenly turn those over -- if we were to turn over Marco Island, if we were to turn over Golden Gate, those priorities will then be determined by someone other than the residents of those communities. So we're looking at a very different way of doing things. I think the same can be said in Pelican Bay or any other areas which voluntarily -- MR. DORRILL: Which was the point you made to me last Wednesday, which was we shouldn't overlook. And that's why I said earlier that for communities that want to continue to do their own thing exclusive of the road and bridge department in a countywide or urban area-wide for the other projects, I couldn't agree more. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: But what I hear you saying -- and you can correct me if I'm mistaken. What I hear you saying is they can continue to do that, but they're also going to pay the countywide assessment. So if they want to tax themselves over and above that, now they can be taxed twice. And the difference is right now they are voluntarily taxing themselves and determining their own destiny. What will happen under this scenario is they will be taxed whether they want to or not. Countywide everyone will be taxed whether they want to or not, and someone else will determine the priorities and where that money will be spent. Now, if they want to tax themselves again over and above the involuntary tax, they're welcome to, by golly, good luck, and they can determine where that money will go. But that doesn't make a whole lot of sense. I say this week after week. I see the charge of this board as health and safety and welfare. And planting sticks and shrubberies and flowers is not a health, safety, and welfare issue. It certainly beautifies the area, but the system we have right now isn't broken. It has worked very well, whether it's -- Marco Island has chosen to beautify their own committee -- community and has benefitted from that. Golden Gate has done the same. Pelican Bay has done the same, but all of those have been voluntarily. And to say we're going to put a tax on somebody, whether they want it or not for plants and sticks and shrubs, I don't think is appropriate. The -- you mentioned a couple of shared-cost projects. The Vineyards has split some costs with us, Collier's Preserve splitting some costs with the county on those major thoroughfares. And I think some of the incentive for that will disappear under this system. You mentioned, well, that will be Naplescape's responsibility to still try to encourage that. I think the best way to encourage that is make that be the manner in which those community districts are provided, not as a sideline maybe if they're, you know, a good resident, and they will contribute. I think right now the system works very well, and if an area wants to beautify their area, they help make that happen. In many cases they solely make that happen. I guess the original concept had some merit to me. I still had a number of questions. I still didn't like the idea of putting a plant tax on, but the -- with the -- with the city opting out, with Marco Island preferring not to be in there -- that number keeps growing and growing -- for the rest of the community to shoulder the burden, I think we've all got voter letters on this, some in support and some against. But I think virtually all of the civic and taxpayer groups on Marco have been opposed. I know early on in Golden Gate the groups liked the concept because of what you had said; if they want to use their own money that they're collecting now for other projects, that would be beneficial. But they do not like it -- since they've seen the final proposal, they no longer like it, because suddenly the numbers have gone up and gone up and gone up. And you look at the long-term projections, and the maintenance comes on as we build each of these. And I think we're not talking about a tenth of a mill tax. We're talking about a lot more than that long term. And we're talking about a lot more than that short term now. It's plain and simple. If a community wants beautification now, they set it up themselves, they voluntarily tax themselves, and they move forward. And that has been extremely successful. And I'm not sure if it's not broken why we want to tinker with that. MR. DORRILL: Let me take you back to my first exhibit. That's only the case in two communities, because you now have five other projects that need to be maintained that -- that are the reason for my general fund, road and bridge fund analysis. Airport Road, Pine Ridge Road, Seagate Drive, Immokalee Road and Pine Ridge extension are all arterial median projects that are not in a district and for which there will not be any gasoline tax money at all next year to replace. And it's going to require general fund participation in order to continue to allow either road and bridge or a road and bridge private contractor to do that maintenance work if we continue to want Marco and Golden Gate to -- COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'm glad you brought that back up because I had forgotten. I was going to make a point on that as well. If you shift the general fund dollars over to an MSTU, the tax burden is still on John Q. Public, whether he's paying in one or paying in the other. It may look great in accounting and make this board look good to say, boy, the ad valorem tax has gone down a tenth, but they're still paying it. And, frankly, if it goes down a tenth, I'm not sure this board doesn't find -- maybe not this year, but in some year -- some other expenditure that will make up for what we've dipped down. And I hope we don't do that, but that's human nature. It's like the old -- the lottery was going to have all kinds of money for education, and what it did was the money they made on education then they took what they had allotted and put somewhere else. MR. DORRILL: Well, I'm not espousing that at all. And, in fact -- COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'm sure you're not saying in favor of that, but what likely will happen is exactly that. We'll take the money out of the general fund and put it in this special tax, but then we'll spend general fund monies on something else instead. And I have a real hard time with this, because any way you look at it, it is an additional tax. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Commissioner Norris. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Well, I have to say that I agree in concept with a lot of Commissioner Constantine's comments. I know I have not heard from a couple of beautification districts, but I have heard from a couple. And I think the consensus is that they would like to keep their independence and their local control. And I think that's very important to some of the districts that are already out there. At the same time I think our FOCUS meetings as well as our Vision 2000 meetings around the county in different areas have all said that beautification is a very important matter. We have a lot of medians that are already beautified, and Naplescape is going to show us their plans for the future to continue to do this. We have a number of medians that are built. We have to maintain them. We don't have a choice. I mean, you've got to maintain them. And those that we build in the future you have to maintain. But at the same time I agree with Commissioner Constantine, that to set up a separate new taxing district is probably not the way to go. The way we are doing it now is to fund it through general revenues, and I think that's the way we ought to continue. It's in everyone's best interest to have a -- an attractive well-maintained community. Everyone's property values go up at that -- at that level. And if -- on the converse, if the community does not look attractive, then everyone's property values are going to go down. And it's -- you know, take your choice. Personally I think an attractive community with higher property values is in everyone's best interest. Now, there may be some that would disagree with that, but it certainly seems to make sense to me. So what I would suggest is that to -- to uncomplicate things, that we don't set up a special district to do any of this funding, but just to continue funding the medians that we have now and the ones that we will have in the future strictly through general fund revenues. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Commissioner Mac'Kie. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: No, no. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: I'm sorry, I thought I heard you say something. MR. DORRILL: We have a handful of speakers, and I do know that Mr. Botner has a brief presentation to show you in terms of what the future has in store in the way of additional capital projects that ultimately you're going to be asked to maintain. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Well, why don't we ask Mr. Botner to make that presentation first, and then our public speakers will have the entire picture so that they can comment on it. MR. BOTNER: Thank you, Commissioners. For the record my name is George Botner. I'm executive director and president of Naplescape. We appreciate your time and your indulgence, and as you know, this is not a new item. You know that this is an issue that we have been wrestling with, frankly, amongst ourselves for about the last two years. And that two-year time frame relates back to the initiation of the development of a comprehensive master plan for our streetscape throughout Collier County. And I just want to show you one graphic related to that. And I'm sure most of you have seen this, because we've tried to keep you up to date on the progress of the master plan. This graphic came from HPO's 2015-year plan when we started the master plan effort a couple of two or three years ago. And as you know, HPO now is up to the 2020 master year plan. But basically what you see up here is that urban area that Mr. Dotrill had represented as being the potential area for a new taxing unit. What it represents is all of the major arterial roadways within our community, both landscaped currently and as yet not landscaped. And, in fact, it also shows some roadways that are not in existence yet but that were a part of HPO's plan, and so we thought to be comprehensive about it, that we needed to look that far into the future so that we knew what we were dealing with. So this network represents 144 miles of roadways within our community. And to do the quick math on that, that represents over 2,600 acres of public ownership within our community, even perhaps more importantly than parks in terms of our actual utilization of that open space, if you will. Everybody uses our public rights-of-way. They are our window into this community. I don't think that anybody is going to dispute the fact that where we have been able to landscape under several different mechanisms over the past several years back to 1987, that it has been a worthwhile project, and I don't think anybody is disputing that. But when Naplescape came to this new larger project and decided that we wanted to try to find a way to extend the benefits that have been enjoyed by landscaping within the context of existing taxing districts and within the context of downtown Naples, the North Trail, most notably, that we needed to find another way to try to fund this, because it wasn't necessarily going to happen unless we were able to come up with a comprehensive mechanism for funding that represented the comprehensive scale of the project that we were looking at. And when you look at it -- the landscapes have been developed in three ways physically. They have been developed as -- as an outgrowth of public-private partnerships. And I can tell you that as executive director for Naplescape over the last three years that we haven't had one that is replicated. They're all different. They all respond to -- to different conditions given who the proponents are and what they need to bring to the table in the way of a deal. That's one technique. And, in fact, that was the technique that was the Immokalee Road approach. I can tell you right now that there are at least three other deals that are on the table like that that we're working on, and so we see that that funding opportunity would continue. But what that funding opportunity does not allow us to do is to develop a comprehensive way of guiding the future of these landscapes throughout the community and what it's going to ultimately cost us. And that's why several years ago we started the development of a comprehensive master streetscape plan, which if it were to come to fruition, if we were include it, would have development schedules for roadways in a manner that was consistent with whatever funding mechanism we devised. I also wanted to mention that the other biggest means of funding landscape, especially outside of the City of Naples, has been through this approach. It's not a new idea. We've already talked about MSTUs. That's how people are able to organize themselves for a few dollars per capita to be able to landscape extensive road rights-of-way. So it did not appear to us to be, you know, a tremendous extent of that logic to say that instead of a proliferation of MSTUs, let's just do one, and let everybody buy into that program, because the cost per capita reduces dramatically. And it also increases dramatically the opportunity for everybody in this community to enjoy the benefits of those landscapes. If you came to me and you said, okay, Mr. Naplescape, what are you going to do, and how are you going to fund the 9 miles of the improvements to the East Trail -- and, believe me, we hear that all the time. I don't know. If we don't have this pro -- the State of Florida's turned their backs on us. We need to be able to come up with a mechanism to do that ourselves. And, frankly, this seemed to be an approach, a logical approach, a logical extension of how we have funded these things outside of downtown Naples in the past. And the same thing goes for Davis Boulevard, which is represented in the drawings on the floor. I know a lot of you have already seen this, but two years ago you funded $5,000 for us to go out and create a design for this so that we could then go out and try to secure some private sector funding and then come back to you for perhaps some matching funds. That was two summers ago we did that. And Dawn Fiala (phonetic), one of our directors, is in the audience today. And she has been working very hard with East Naples Civic Association, as has our group, to sort of joint venture a fund-raising opportunity. Commissioner Mac'Kie was at an event. Commissioner Norris was at an event where from a grass-roots level we've attempted to secure the pledges necessary to support that 50-percent private sector funding. As of yesterday we have raised pledges in the amount of $14,600. The private sector amount needs to be at 90, and we've been at it for two and a half months. It's not an easy thing to do. And that's what we want to impress on you. We do this. I mean, I do this every day; that's my job. But when you leave the City of Naples and you go further out into the community, there are not necessarily all those benefactors that we have enjoyed in the past to do this kind of program. Stepping back from all of that, I would have to tell you that this is one way perhaps among several that we could get a grip on dealing with this subject in a comprehensive way, but we have been working very closely with staff to come up with the beginnings of a program to do it in a manner that is consistent with the way it's been done in the past. I'd also -- while I'm here, I'd like to recognize some other Naplescape board members, Judy Sprowl (phonetic), our current chairwoman, is in attendance. Judy served as our chair last year and has graciously decided to do that for another year with us. Terry Tragesser is here; she's been on our board for a couple years. Susan Watts is here, and I've already mentioned Donna Fiala. And two years ago I'd like to say that, you know, we decided to take this show on the road, if you will. We were very successful downtown, and one of the reasons why we've got the representation on our board that we have now is in recognition of the fact that we need some regional input and assistance as we go out into the community and try to achieve other good things for us. That being the case, if there's any questions of me, I'd be happy to answer them for you. But that's why we worked with staff, to try to generate this funding mechanism that could be as comprehensive as the program. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Are -- are there questions of Mr. Botner? Thank you, Mr. Botner. Why don't we move on to the public speakers and listen to a comment on the overall project. MR. DORRILL: We have six. The first will be Hiss Straton and then following her Mr. Keller. MS. STRATON: Good morning. I'm here representing the Southwest Florida Land Preservation Trust, and at our December 1st meeting of the board of directors we voted unanimously to support Collier-Naplescape in its efforts today to establish permanent funding to move forward the Collier-Naplescape program. And so I wanted to share the board's support with you today. Thank you. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. MR. DORRILL: Mr. Keller and then Mr. Scholes. MR. KELLER: George Keller, concerned citizen and also a spokesman for the Golden Gate Estates Civic Association. There's no question about it that it's very nice to have landscaped medians. There's no question it's nice to have the buildings that are alongside these medians beautifully landscaped. There's only one question. I've -- I've lived in a lot of cities. I worked for the federal government, traveled, and I lived in a lot of cities, and every single city or area that is developing, they all have this idea that what we want to have is beautiful parkways. We don't call them highways; we call them parkways. We did it in Long Island. They did it in Chicago. They did it in almost every city. It's ideal. There's only one problem; they keep on expanding with population. The traffic in Collier County in the last ten years has tremendously increased. Davis Boulevard, we can't even afford to spend an inch of Davis Boulevard on landscaping, because it's going to have to be six- or eight-laned within ten years. Airport Road's the same way. We have to buy all of the property on each side of Airport Road or get rid of any medians. Every single city in the United States that has expanded the way we're expanded ended up with a strip of concrete about 2 feet wide in between the roadways and a fence, a metal fence so the cars wouldn't go across the thing and bang into one another. So it's nice to be -- be -- looking at this thing from a beautiful picture, but let's try to be practical. Secondly, we already have districts that decided that they would want to spend money to improve their own districts. Now, no matter how you work this thing out, who's going to pay back these districts for the capital improvements that they spent? Why should those districts who already spent capital improvements -- and I'm in one of those districts -- pay to go and improve -- make capital improvements in other districts and then also pay for maintenance of the other districts? So it doesn't make any sense. We already passed the -- we already passed the thing. We have already had more traffic than we know what to handle with, and we're going to have to increase laneage on every one of our roads, every one of our roads. Unfortunately there are some roads like Rattlesnake Hammock Road that is going to be very difficult to go and six lane. We may be able to four lane it, but we're going to have a difficult time six laning it, but we're going to have to six lane it if we keep on. Our real problem in this county has been and it continues to be increasing density. Property is getting very valuable, and when property becomes valuable, it becomes economically unsound to go and keep density low. And if we don't keep density low, this place is going to be another Fort Lauderdale, no matter how you look at it. Thank you. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you, Mr. Keller. MR. DORRILL: Mr. Schole and then Dr. Biles. MR. SCHOLES: Good morning. I appreciate the opportunity to talk to you. I'm Gil Scholes, chairman of the Marco Island Beautification Advisory Committee. I would like to say that our committee is made up of seven persons. Five of those persons are appointed by five of the major civic associations on Marco Island. Several of those associations have taken the approach that this represents double taxation, and they have said that Marco Island should stand alone. There are two at-large members. I am one of those at-large members. And I believe most of the people on Marco Island have been totally confused with what has been in the press during the last week, as Mr. Dotrill had said. We've seen figures for the county tax of .10 mill, .20 mills, maybe up to .3 mills with a cap of .5 mills. We are currently in Marco Island paying .17 mills annually for our beautification efforts. Will that continue at that level? North Collier is a so-called signature highway. Will we get a credit or reduction if we would participate? We don't know. We've seen no firm figures. We've seen articles that said that our beautification unit would be eliminated and that the taxing unit would be eliminated and everything would be run by the new county community. So basically the people on Marco are confused. And our beautification committee unanimously at the meeting on March 5th asked me to write the commissioners. I wrote all of you as promptly as possible saying we think it's unfair to go forward so fast without the people on Marco knowing how they would be impacted. And if you do go forward with something, we would ask you that you wait till 1996. Perhaps in January hearings could be held on Marco to tell the people how they would be affected, and I would like to make that request to the commissioners again. Finally, let me close and say that if for some reason you feel something has to be finalized this fiscal year yet -- I'm sorry, not fiscal year, but this calendar year yet, within your next two meetings, then I would like to say that Marco would like to be excluded from the county taxing district and that the HSTU that's been in place about 15 years there would like to continue Marco Island beautification efforts unto ourselves. Thank you very much. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. Commissioner Hancock, you had a comment? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Yeah, there were -- actually I had a couple of comments. If there are more speakers, I'll defer to them until they've -- until that's done. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Dr. Biles. MR. DORRILL: Dr. Biles and then Mr. Pettersen. MS. BILES: Fay Biles, president of the Marco Island Taxpayers' Association, HITA. Our board unanimously voted last week to please ask that we do remain independent. I think some people are confused about Marco Island. Collier Boulevard under this program would only go to the residents' beach, which is San Marco 92. The rest of South Collier all the way down around would be a separate tax. And that's our hotels, our condos. It's for tourists a main attraction. They love those medians, but that is not included under this plan. That's only 60 percent of Marco Island. Our own beautification committee, of course, attends to Barfield and all of the other streets and roads on Marco, and we do pledge ourselves, of course, to do that. Unfortunately, last year with the water situation, the tremendous amount of rain we had, and then plus the man who was doing the watering -- and Mr. Dotrill noted that we have to irrigate our medians -- went belly up. And so it took months before we got a watering truck out there. Then the drive shaft went out. In the meantime, the medians have died. Our medians are in terrible shape. Anybody who comes onto the island now, everybody noted what has happened to those beautiful median strips. So it's going to take a long time and a lot of expense to get those medians to come back to where they were. It's going to cost the county a heck of a lot more money on that. Otherwise we will tax ourselves and do it ourselves as we have done. So we really feel that -- and I speak for both -- all of HITA, MICA and MAC and Kjell -- Mr. Pettersen from MICA, all of us have agreed that we would like to tend to our own. Leave us out of this new plan, and we'll do it. And we'll bring the medians back. We are all for a beautiful Collier County, please. In fact, MITA went to all the Naplescape meetings. We had representation there from the very beginning, the first meeting. And it was private funded, and we were all for that. In fact, we even helped try to raise money from Eagle Creek and Coral Isle shopping, all those shops there, to beautify 951. We were not successful. They weren't interested. 951 is a State Road, and on our master plan vision for Marco Island they -- in fact, we approached them to find out what their plans were, and they have told us they're not going to do anything on 951 until the widening is completed, completely completed, and then that they had very strict guidelines. They like sod and very small trees. That's not our idea of beautification. So in the future I think we have some things to look at. But in the meantime, please leave Marco Island out of it. Thank you. MR. DORRILL: Mr. Pettersen and then Ms. Tragesser. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you, Mrs. Biles. MR. PETTERSEN: Thank you. My name is Kjell Pettersen. I'm on the executive board of Marco Island Civic Association. I also speak for Marco Association of Condominiums. They have asked me to speak for them this morning. I simply would want to underline the statements that we made in our letter to the commissioners recently in our opposition to the proposal that has been made, and I would like to echo Commissioner Norris and Commissioner Constantine's statement that please let us continue to do what we are doing. Let us maintain our independence. Simply please leave us alone, and please fund the urban area through general funds. Thank you very much. MR. DORRILL: Miss Tragesser and then Mr. Olds. MS. TRAGESSER: Good morning, Commissioners. My name is Terry Tragesser, and I do sit on the board of Collier Naplescape. And I -- I see and hear what the Marco people today want. I see very much something that exists in all of Collier County, and that is community pride. I think that when they talk about Marco Island and its beautification, that they truly have taken ownership of the way their community looks. And as I go out in Collier County, I see that played out consistently. What I would hate to see happen in Collier County would be for us to have a very graphic display of inconsistency because we have not developed a comprehensive plan for our county. The City of Naples is an example of a plan that has developed into something superior. I would hate to see people say, oh, I must be leaving the city; it's looking pretty grim. So I would encourage you as -- as leaders of Collier County to look upon this item as something that is important and to find solutions. You know, getting mired in the details of it in a -- in a negative way won't get the job done. And I would hope that you could look at this as something that -- that we can solve. And just as an aside, the Second District had a board meeting last night, and I wanted to kind of test the waters with them. We brought this subject up, and we received nothing but positive responses as it would relate to landscaping and a comprehensive plan. Their interests lied with, you know, what types of plants we would use, the maintenance issues. But out in the community by and large I have not seen anything but positive reception to our signature corridors and -- and making them nice. Thank you. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. MR. DORRILL: And Mr. Olds will be your final speaker. MR. OLDS: The name is Stanley Olds. I'm a concerned citizen, and I think in all of this discussion we've forgotten one factor, that the beautification of a city is certainly a tourist attraction, and I don't know why we couldn't take some of the money from the tourist tax appreciation and put it into this. And if -- if it could be adjusted that way, I -- I would like to see that rather than to have a new taxing unit, because once we get a new taxing unit, again we're going into another tax, another tax, and it could rise and rise and rise. And I think that if you people could work out something about -- forgetting about putting in a new tax, but maybe get the funding from that tourist tax bill, because there have been many people that have been trying to get money out of that, and I think it could be adjusted because beautification is what? It makes the tourists come here along with the other things. So my appeal is that you get the money from the tourist tax thing. Thank you very much. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: the beds? COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: question is best for you. How do we measure the heads on They came because of the trees. Yeah, I came for plants. I have a question. Commissioner Hac'Kie. Just -- Mr. Dotrill, maybe this I love this program. I love Naplescape. I've been a big supporter the whole time. I want to see a comprehensive program. I -- I have a problem with the concept of an HSTU, and I've only been through the budget process once, and that's why I wanted to ask you this. If we adopted an HSTU for landscaping and maintenance, then as we go through the budget process, am I correct that if it were in the general funds, I can prioritize it? I can -- I can cast my vote; based on this year we really need to take money out of -- we can't spend it on landscaping this year, because we have a huge flooding problem or we have some other problem. If it's in an HSTU, have I closed that door? Do I have the opportunity to shift money? I think -- I'm afraid I know the answer, and that's my fundamental problem with this is that I think it's important. I think it's very important, but I don't think it rises to the level of something that requires a tax that can't be touched in the event there's -- there are other problems in the county that the then county commission prioritizes is more important in that year. MR. DORRILL: I think my answer would be, all things being equal, the best way to pay for this program and to have you, as the Board of County Commissioners, who are the ultimate policy makers and the only source of appropriation is to do it through general revenues in the general fund. My efforts this morning are to remind you that in addition to that need, because gasoline taxes is gone and is no longer an option, is in as diplomatically a way as I can reminding you of the other general fund sensitive issues that are going to confront you this summer. Secondarily to that is the proposal that has been developed jointly since last spring with the Naplescape folks is to try and identify and recognize our obligation, thus, this special taxing district. But you're correct. If you levy that money for that single special purpose as you do the Collier County street lighting district if you live in a subdivision that has street lights, then you cannot commingle those funds, and you're precluded from taking money from street lighting districts or from tourist taxes and then throwing them at median beautification projects. You cannot do that. And somebody out there who's smart enough would slap you with a taxpayer's suit to contest your trying to do that. COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: And that's fundamentally what gives me the greatest amount of fear about this. When we're talking about neighborhood districts, and people again have chosen to tax themselves, I -- I love this program, and I want to see it. And you'll find as we go through budget hearings that I'm going to be supportive of maintenance and supportive of capital improvements that have to do with streetscapes. But I'm unwilling at this point to say as a priority for Collier County taxes, this is one that we've got to protect. I'm afraid -- I'm afraid we have more critical needs. Landscaping is important as it is in that if we adopted this MSTU, it -- it's sort of an easy out for future boards instead of having to make hard budget choices about how to spend money. And I love the idea, but I just don't think it's the priority for Collier County that this is a little pot of money that we've got to preserve. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Commissioner Hancock. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: I'm -- today's discussion reminds me of a conversation I had with Ned Putzell, former mayor of the City of Naples, about ten months ago. And it's amazing. If you talk about the beautiful medians in the City of Naples, some officials will break their arms reaching back to pat themselves on the back and talk about what a wonderful job they're doing. But if you go back to when it was originally formed when Ed Putzell, the mayor -- he took a lot of heat. He took a tremendous amount of heat for establishing something and going out on a limb, if you will, to establish something that now has become a landmark not just to the City of Naples, but carries over -- and has carried over to the county through the efforts of Naplescape. It used to be five years ago when someone said, oh, I love the beautiful medians. Your response was, oh, on 417 Now, when they say I love the medians, I like to hear they were in Immokalee when they realized that or out in the Everglades. So, again, I commend the efforts of Naplescape, and I'm reminded of -- of the limb Ed went out on and the rewards that has reaped for this county as a whole. And for Mr. Dotrill, I commend you for bringing this forward today. Have I commended everyone now? Not you. I'm going to hold off on that. I think we need to retain some incentive for developments and businesses to -- to make that extra participatory, you know, step. By blanketing this thing as a whole and taking away that incentive, I think new developments that come on line would not be as ready to spruce up that median as they are now. And so I think that needs to be a little more clear. I would hate to see us take such a comprehensive approach if we were to do this at all, that we eliminate that incentive, and that's a concern. There's a question of control here that Marco Island and -- and the Golden Gate community feel, and it's very similar to what I'm experiencing actually in fire consolidation. It's that if with a small area we have absolute control over what happens and how the dollars are spent, and we're more comfortable with that than we are giving it to a larger whole. And I fully understand that, and I think if this is to move forward, whether it be a minimum maintenance level or level in which it expands the actual creation of medians, there should be some contribution to subsidize the efforts and the dollars spent in Golden Gate and on Marco Island. There's no way we can fairly say, okay, you decided to do it so you keep paying. And, by the way, we're going to add on to that. I think there has to be a give and take there, because when I drive down Golden Gate Parkway, you know, I'm amazed that -- that that community has done that, and yet the county tax base who enjoys it every day -- I don't live in Golden Gate, but I've been up and down that parkway several times in the last month alone, but we get to enjoy it. COMHISSIONER CONSTANTINE: And we welcome you. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Yes, both of them. There are only two people that said welcome. So, you know, I think, again, there's another element to this that we have to look at that we can't really layer it. If it's going to happen, there's going to have to be a commensurate reduction or commensurate contribution to the existing MSTUs and then let them stay in place to maintain that control. You know, I think a hybrid of those two things is going to achieve the most -- most of what we're looking at. What I would like to do today, rather than either propel this thing where there are -- are significant questions or to kill it in its entirety, is to ask the county manager -- manager to try and address what concerns are raised here today and see if there is a form in which this can be brought back to bring some fairness and equity to the folks in Golden Gate and Marco Island so that they can continue what they're trying to do. But I think it's a good idea to establish a minimum maintenance level and to make sure those funds are available for maintenance on an annual basis. If at any given time a future board decides to cut into those maintenance dollars and ruin the efforts of what has been achieved in the past, I think we'll all rue that day and -- and if it takes five-hundredths of a mill to maintain, well, let's at least set that aside so that maintenance can continue. And if there's substantial on top of that, that would fund the general fund. That would be my recommendation, because I don't think it -- it takes away from anything, but it does ensure at least the maintenance of what we have and what we may have in the future. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Commissioner Norris. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Well, I -- I think it's been pretty clear from all the FOCUS meetings and Vision 2000 meetings that the common thread is over and over and over; we like medians beautified. We want Naples to remain as it is. We don't want to lose the character of Naples. We don't want to lose the character of Collier County. We like the ambiance. We don't want it changed, so forth and so on. I think that these issues are very important to people. It's -- it's just always at the top of the list in these meetings. Let's keep the character. Let's keep the community looking good. And at the same time it's very important that these -- to these groups that we've heard from for them to keep their local control, and that's fine. I think they should. And the simplest way to take care of everyone's problems is to simply continue to fund these issues out of general revenues. Now, one thing that we haven't heard here today yet and I think we need to hear is -- or have a discussion on is Naplescape's long-range plans and the implementation schedule for those plans and whether the county intends to formally or semi-formally adopt those plans and to commit to try to adhere to those plans as a schedule and guide for the future. I think we need to -- to -- to hear that part, too. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Good -- good point. Commissioner Constantine. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I think you're right. Regardless of whether we create a special tax or not, we do need to look at what extent do we want to do this. How far do we want -- COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Let me ask someone from Naplescape; do we have -- are you prepared to come forward with a plan, or would you feel more comfortable coming back in a few weeks? Give us an idea here what we -- where we can go. Maybe that's not the good phraseology. MR. BOTNER: For the record, George Botner again. I'm glad you brought that up. That's been a major project of ours, as you know, for the last couple of years at Naplescape. It was like an eight-phased master plan project that Naplescape funded the first phase of which, and then the second phase was privately funded. And we haven't pursued the project past that point as a result of some funding, but it would certainly be within the realm of -- of our interests in finalizing that plan, because it will answer all the questions that everybody keeps asking all the way from, you know, how much is this program going to end up costing us when we're done with it to what street are we landscaping in 1997. And that's really what we view as being a priority as it relates to our activities. Now, what we would like to also suggest is that in the spirit of a public-private partnership scenario is that the county, since it will be the beneficiary of the ultimate result of the plan, share with us in the cost of finalizing that. Now, that could go a long way to -- to getting it completed. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Let me make this suggestion, Mr. Botner. This is really not technically a part of today's agenda. MR. BOTNER: Right. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: When would you feel comfortable in bringing back a proposal or your plans or whatever information you think would be helpful to this board? MR. BOTNER: Next week. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Next week, that was pretty quick. MR. BOTNER: No, we've got all the information together. I don't mean to sound flip about that. We've got it all together. We know what the whole scenario relates to as to schedule, and we can show you what we've produced today, and we can show you the cost -- the projected cost to complete the project. But if -- if we did develop a public-private partnership to conclude the master plan that we've already started and funded ourselves and the private sector has started and funded itself, within six months we could have a completed comprehensive master plan to bring to this board for your ratification. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: That's -- that's what I think this board ought to do is to -- to work towards getting a master plan so we have a direction for the future and we're not just zigzagging around in the future. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Do you want to put that on an upcoming agenda? COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Yes. Matter of fact, I'll make a motion here. I think we've gone far enough into the discussion to do that. I'll make a motion that we -- that we do not change any of the existing HSTUs at this time, that we continue for the next budget year at -- at the minimum to fund our maintenance -- median maintenance through general revenues and, further, that we direct the staff, if possible, to have this -- have Mr. Botner's proposal back on the agenda next week. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'll second that. I just want to share a couple thoughts. I am certainly in favor of beautification and all you're doing. I commend George in particular but the Naplescape group for its efforts, and it clearly does benefit the entire community. The -- I think Commissioner Hac'Kie said it very well, that I'm not sure that this by itself, though, rises to the level that I think is necessary to have its own special little taxing peg that is very difficult to touch later on. I agree with Commissioner Norris; we should keep it in the general fund. What that does is keeps us accountable, but still it also keeps us or allows us the leeway that in those emergency years if DCA throws us a curve or if there is flooding or whatever, if there is some human interest priority, then we have the ability to drop that out for a year, pick it back up the following year, or for that matter, to increase in a year if we have market dip. So I think it leaves us a lot of the leeway and still holds a tight responsibility on it, so I'll gladly second that. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have a motion and a second. I have a question for Mr. Dotrill. In your presentation I seem to remember your saying that in the current fiscal year we were going to be spending -- or at least in the next fiscal year you anticipated spending about three-quarters of a million dollars in maintenance on the existing medians that are not already in a district? MR. DORRILL: Approximately. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: At eighteen -- at eighteen billion dollars of assessed value countywide that's .04 mills distributed countywide. Everybody's paying. There's no exclusion. The city's not excluded. Marco's not excluded. Golden Gate Estates is not excluded. Nobody is excluded. Everybody's paying their fair share. If we are going to leave it in the general fund, I don't have any objection to that. I see this as one of those quality-of-life issues. I like the Naplescape idea, and if -- if we're going to leave it in the general fund, I would prefer to do that as opposed to setting up an HSTU with all these other areas excluded, because currently everybody's paying their fair share for whatever roadway they are using. So with that, I'm not sure there's a whole lot more. Commissioner Hancock. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I think the path I would prefer is a little different, but I'm -- I'm not making a habit of swimming upstream, so I think maybe we can continue to have some positive impacts on the Naplescape plan, and I -- I will support the motion. And, again, I appreciate everyone at least wanting to move ahead and make some level of commitment that this is a priority in the community. MR. BOTNER: Could I just make one comment to that, because we really appreciate hearing that? I know it's not my turn to talk, but we really didn't have the guts to come to you with a general revenue fund request. But if that's the way you'd like to do this, and if we can use the master plan to give some guidance to what's going to be done in the future, then that does what we primarily wanted to do, and that is to put together some sort of mechanism to develop a comprehensive approach to this rather than just shooting at every project that comes along and hoping we can beg, borrow, or steal the dollars to do it. So -- MR. DORRILL: Mr. Botner and I had this discussion yesterday afternoon, and I told him to anticipate that you may want to go to general revenue as opposed to the special revenue route, and -- and he will leave here today if that occurs, and I -- I think that he will, having won a victory for Naplescape and the board's realization that general revenues are to be used to maintain your existing assets countywide. You took that a step farther and said that special districts can remain where communities want them to. But then, frankly, that puts the burden on them continually to be the advocate for future projects because, frankly, there would not be an Airport Road median north of Golden Gate Parkway had it not been for their efforts. I can assure you there wouldn't be one on Davis Boulevard were it not for their efforts, because the staff is still trying to get there, but by and large my public works people think that roads should be asphalt and Bahia sod that gets mowed two or three times a year. MR. BOTNER: They're coming around better. MR. DORRILL: And so that keeps them involved for capital funding, and they'll have to be here -- I wouldn't say that next week is the best time. I think the best time is during your preliminary program budget reviews. And then they're going to have to be here the day that you review the 301 capital improvement fund to see what projects and under what conditions the county commission wants them to proceed. And so that forces them to remain involved and to be an advocate on behalf of the private sector. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: But Mr. Botner was going to come back to say that Naplescape did not have the funds to complete its master plan. MR. BOTNER: That's right. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: And you're going to make a request of this board to participate in that. MR. BOTNER: And we can make that -- COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: If it's not next week -- well, next week's a pretty heavy agenda already, and I think -- I believe. MR. DORRILL: We'll look at that. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Everyone and their mother is coming next Tuesday for something. COMMISSIONER NORRIS: Let me change the motion. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: I was going to say, didn't the motion include that? COMMISSIONER NORRIS: Yeah. But why don't we just amend the motion to let Mr. Botner and Mr. Dotrill to work that out to be a more appropriate meeting if necessary. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: I think it happens actually fine. I just want to make sure it gets in time -- COMMISSIONER NORRIS: Fairly lengthy discussions. MR. DORRILL: That's fine. We'll handle that. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Does the second accept the change? COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Yes. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Fine. Thank you, Mr. Botner. MR. BOTNER: Thank you. I appreciate your help and support. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: If there's no further discussion, I'll call the question. All in favor, please say aye. Opposed? Motion passes five to zero. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Lunch. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Why don't we take an hour, full hour for lunch. Come back at 1:30. It's now 12:25. (A lunch break was held between 12:25 p.m. to 1:36 p.m.) Item #10A UPDATE REGARDING ENDORSEHENT OF REVISED ST. MATTHEW'S HOUSE GRANT APPLICATION CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Reconvene the Board of County Commission meeting for December the 12, 1995. I think, Mr. Weigel, I'm going to ask you to put the information you just gave us on the record, if you would, that you've just talked to Mr. Hansen. MR. WEIGEL: Yes. I -- I had an opportunity to speak with Mr. William Hansen in Tallahassee of -- with the office that is reviewing grant applications for St. Hatthew's House and others, and he indicated to me that they will be making a determination today in regard to the award of grants and that any communication for the Board of County Commissioners would have to be received by today, preferably by early or mid-afternoon for them to be able to utilize it in their determinations. That's pretty much the essence of the conversation. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay. Thank you. Any further discussion by the -- by the board on -- on this issue? If there isn't, we'll move forward. Next item on the agenda is -- We're at public comment. Mr. Dotrill, was there any today? MR. DORRILL: No, ma'am. And the only item for which we have public speakers for the afternoon would be 12(B) 2) and its companion. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: 12 (B) (2) ? MR. DORRILL: Yes, ma'am. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: And -- I'm sorry. You said that was continued? MR. DORRILL: And its companion. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: And its companion. MR. DORRILL: There is a companion. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Companion. Okay. I'm sorry. Thank you. (Commissioner Hac'Kie entered the boardroom.) CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay. So that's got speakers. Item #12B1 PETITION PUD-95-7, KAREN K. BISHOP OF PROJECT HANAGEHENT SERVICES, INC., REPRESENTING BLACK FOREST DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION, REQUESTING A REZONING OF CERTAIN DEFINED PROPERTY AS HEREIN DESCRIBED FROM RSF-3 AND RHF-6 TO PUD (MOONLIGHT COVE) FOR PROPERTY LOCATED 1/3 MILE SOUTH OF THOMASSON DRIVE ON THE WEST SIDE OF BAYSHORE DRIVE - WITHDRAWN AT REQUEST OF THE PETITIONER Okay. Let's get moving. Item 12(B)(1), petition PUD-95-7. Hr. Milk. MR. MILK: Good afternoon, Commissioners. For the record, my name is Bryan Milk, current planning. I am presenting petition PUD-95-7, Moonlight Cove. Petitioner seeks to have certain property as described in the staff report rezoned from RSF-3 and RHF-6 to a planned unit development consisting of single-family and multi-family dwelling units on a 15-acre parcel. The subject property is located adjacent to and contiguous to the west side of Bayshore Drive. It is located approximately one-third mile south of Thomasson Drive. Access proposed for the subject property aligns with Colonial Drive which is opposite Bayshore Drive. The subject property being 15 acres in size has 12 acres of jurisdictional wetlands on the property. It has a three-acre upland. The project proposes to fill five acres of the subject property and return seven acres to its original wetland status. That being because the site is inundated with melaleuca and Brazilian pepper and has been historically impacted by a residential dwelling on the subject site. It -- It histot -- Historically it has been excavated in some places. There's some low-lying areas. I think from an environmental standpoint it's manmade rather than natural. Petitioner -- COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: I need to interrupt just for clarification if I may. MR. MILK: Sure. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Are we talking about 74 units on three acres of upland -- COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Yeah. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- in addition to filling of -- of -- of -- some level of filling on the wetlands? MR. MILK: Twelve acres of the site is jurisdictional wetlands. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. MR. MILK: Three acres is upland adjacent to Bayshore Drive. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. And were you saying they're proposing filling some of the wetlands? MR. MILK: Five acres. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. MR. MILK: It's jurisdictional; however, it's impacted by exotics. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. So the net density is going to be 74 units on eight acres? MR. MILK: That's correct. Okay. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Go ahead, Mr. Milk. I'm sorry. I just needed to clarify that. Thank you. MR. MILK: As it exists today, ten acres of the subject property is currently zoned RMF-6. It's maintained that status through an improved property determination in 1991 per policy 5.9 of the Land Development Code. What that policy says is that if you have zoning and it was deemed improved, you can build 65 units on that subject site according to the RMF-6 standards. Also, the five-acre property to the south that's zoned RSF-3 is five acres. Five times three would allow 15 units per the subject property. In all, the petitioner has the right as of today to construct 75 dwelling units on the three acres or eight acres as it exists. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Would that be affected at all by the fact that this is substantially jurisdictional property? I mean, if -- if your fezone didn't go through, they would have three acres of buildable property until they filled -- until they did the filling work. MR. MILK: That's correct. COHHISSIONER HAC'KIE: So under our code they could build 75 units on the three acres? MR. MILK: On the subject 15-acre site after it's been mitigated for the wetland encroachment. So what we're saying is, based on the mitigation proposed for the entire property, it looks like seven acres are going to remain wetland, five acres are going to be filled, and the remaining three would be also used for upland areas. Of that eight acres is going to be a one-acre lake set in the middle of that for water management in that vicinity. I guess the reason we're going through the PUD is, number one, the RHF-6 zoning district and RSF-3 district are conventional zoning districts with very specific development regulations setbacks standards. The reason to go through the PUD with this particular property is to offset the unability to develop in that jurisdictional wetland area and provide some development flexibility with two-story buildings and setback softenings on the side yards and particular properties in and around the lake on the upland area. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Commissioner Hancock. MR. MILK: The petitioner could not achieve, in my opinion, the net density that was provided for through the zoning re-evaluation and improved property evaluation back in nineteen one -- 1991 because of the physical constraints of the property today. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: It sounds like what we're doing is very similar to a recent change in -- in cjuster developments. In essence, we're reducing setbacks and interior setbacks possibly to allow for more density, and in order to do that, there has got to be, in my opinion, a community tradeoff. I mean, that was part of the cjuster development requirement, is that there's got to be some benefit to the community. And -- and -- Does that apply here -- I mean, in -- in principle? It sounds like what we're -- In essence, what we're doing is very similar to the cjuster development clause in the Land Development Code. MR. MILK: That is a provision of the development standards outlined in the PUD document. That's correct. What you have is single-family and multi-family development standards, those of zero lot line cjuster and multi-family two-story buildings. So the parameters that are applied to this particular district are very similar to those in the RHF-6 district which is already approved on the existing site. The problem is, is the site is constrained by its jurisdictional boundaries. The PUD gives the petitioner the flexibility of achieving its maximum density on that portion that can be built upon, and that's the reason we're here today. Policy 5.1 of the Land Development Code says that if you're going to fezone the subject property, as we are requesting today, from its current status, it cannot go up in density. It has to be a reduction of -- a reduction from 75 units to six -- or 74 units. It's a net reduction of one. There's no real policy that says that's enough or that isn't enough; however, it is consistent with the future land use element. It is deemed consistent with the Growth Management Plan; therefore, staff is bringing this forward to you saying it is consistent by our policies. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: They met it by reducing one unit? MR. MILK: In effect, yes. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. We may have altered your presentation. I apologize if I did so. What are your views on compatibility when the end product is built and, in essence, a net density of somewhere around nine units an acre is achieved? If this were to be built out at 74 units, how is that compatible both to the north and to the south? MR. MILK: To the north, you have undeveloped RMF-6 zoning which allows multi-family and single-family and three-story buildings. That is very compatible. To the south, it's residential single-family. It's also undeveloped. That, in essence, could be construed to be compatible from a residential standpoint. From a height standpoint, there may be some aesthetic concerns on that behalf, although there are buffering requirements per the PUD which would allow a buffer and trees and -- and that sort of thing in that zone between the single-family and the proposed development. Bayshore Drive acts as a barrier to those properties that are east of the subject property which for the most part along Bayshore Drive is undeveloped. There is a band of commercial C-2 property that's undeveloped. That subdivision that fronts Colonial Drive for the most part is developed with older single-family homes. To the direct west of the property is the Collier Development Corporation's DRI. In that particular area, there are buffers and residential and a mixed development on their particular DRI master plan. It -- It's kind of a bubble diagram in that area, but it does show residential and conservation areas abutting the subject property. So, in essence, what you could possibly have here ultimately is two-story buildings that pretty much similarize the multi-family buildings of eight-plexes and ten-plexes in and around Collier County which would be according to the petitioner a condominium project. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Typically -- If I may, typically we look when we go from single-family to multi-family zoning for some level of transition so that, in essence, whether the southern boundary, northern boundary are treated differently or whether the project itself is transitional, what is your opinion on -- on this project, in essence, being a transition from RSF-3 to RMF-6? Is that evident in what's contained in the document, or do you feel there are some gaps there? MR. MILK: I think on the north, on the east, and on the west, it is evident because there's jurisdictional wetlands to the west of the project -- project. There are RMF-6 properties to the north. Bayshore Drive is to the east. The subject RSF-3 property located south, that has somewhat some compatibility issues with probably height rather than residential to residential, but that's my answer to that. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. MR. MILK: The -- Another thing to remember too is the trips that are generated from the project are basically the same, if not somewhat less, because with the mix of single-family and -- and multi-family, there's about 441 trips they've projected from this project at a buildout of 74 units. The particular roadway on this particular area is a two-lane collector road or local collector, and it's currently operating at level service A. The subject property does have water and sewer availability. So from the aspects of residential, it's compatible to the degree that it has all the public services in the urbanized area. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Are there other questions? Does that conclude what -- what you need to put on the record for the petitioner? MR. MILK: The only other comment I'd like to offer for the record -- and it's merely because we want to be a little bit more specific on -- on time frames. For the transportation -- On page 5-2 of the PUD document under transportation which would be item 5.4(B) where it says, "The developer shall be responsible for installation of arterial level street lighting at the project's entrance," I'd like to add, "prior to the issuance of the initial certificate of occupancy." Then on item D, I'd like to amend it. "The applicant shall be responsible for the construction of the northbound left turn lane prior to the issuance of the final certificate of occupancy and the southbound right turn lane prior to the issuance of the initial certificate of occupancy on Bayshore Drive." And that's merely some housekeeping measures on the timing issue for those improvements. That's the only changes or comments that I have. I would be happy to answer any other questions. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: I have just one. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Commissioner Hac'Kie. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Actually, two. What was the vote at the Planning Commission, and -- and did you get letters of support or opposition? Did anybody speak? MR. MILK: The vote at the Planning Commission I believe was seven to one, and I received some letters or actually some phone calls of inquiry on what the project was about, where it was located, who was developing the particular project. No one spoke in opposition to that particular project at the Planning Commission. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Thanks. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Why don't we hear from the petitioner if he has anything to add to the presentation? MR. BARNARD: For the record, Commissioners, my name is Tom Barnard. I'm a consultant representing Black Forest and would be happy to answer any questions that you have. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Are there questions? Commissioner Hancock. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I have a level of discomfort with the project's ability to transition from RSF-3 zoning to RHF-6 on the southern boundary. I read in your development standards a 20-foot setback from project boundaries, meaning that 20 feet from the property line of RSF-3 zoning, we can have the back wall of a two-story or three-story building, Mr. Milk, is it? MR. MILK: That would be a two-story building. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Two-story. I'm not so sure that's a sufficient transition. So I need to -- I need to ask how you've -- you've addressed that. MR. BARNARD: Well, if you view the property from the other -- current stan -- standpoint of zoning, you have RHF-6 against RSF-3, in which case I can't give you the exact dimensions of how many feet further north you would then have three stories impacting single-story -- presumably single -- single-story single-family. that, in essence, the two-story does become a transitional buffer between RHF-6 and the probably single-family at -- at single-story so that you're going three, two, one rather than three, one which you would if it remained as it's currently zoned. I don't know if that answers your concern. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Well, what -- what you could do -- What you could do I don't view as -- as addressing the matter. What I'm dealing with is what you're proposing to do. Okay? So don't -- don't bother telling me what you could do. I fully -- MR. BARNARD: No. COHHISSIONER HANCOCK: -- understand that. MR. BARNARD: I'm simply saying that in -- in -- in our opinion, three, two, one is -- is a transitional type of residential development. We -- We think that it does that. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Any other questions? Public speakers, Mr. Dotrill? MR. DORRILL: No, ma'am. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: I'll close the public hearing. Any further discussion or questions from the commission? If not, is there a motion? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I'm -- I'm kind of flipping through here looking for things to -- to give some ground. I'm -- We dealt with this about two weeks ago on the Airport Plaza issue where when you look at what is on the books for zoning and dealing with what can happen or what may happen -- you know, here we have two vacant parcels so it's tough to gauge. But when we start talking about eliminating a significant amount of the piece and -- and the net density grows significantly here to -- over nine units an acre would be a net density -- I'm concerned about that density on such a small parcel being adjacent to residential single-family. You know, whether it's one building 20 feet from the property line or whether it's, you know, ten buildings cjustered 20 feet from the property line is -- is a visual impact difference to me. What I don't see and -- and maybe I can get some help from the petitioner. I take it, Hiss Bishop's not here? What I -- I don't see or don't hear is the increase in -- in buffering attempts to that southern property line. I mean, let's face it. If there's going to be single-family homes, they're going to be about -- anywhere from 30 to 40 feet from the property line, and I -- I picture things such as in the Crossings development where you have single-family homes and right benea -- right behind them you have Arbour Walk, and there's someone's second-floor balcony right above your fence. You can't build a fence and you can't grow trees within 20 years high enough to give yourself a little bit of privacy there. So what we've looked for in the past is those -- is increasing that setback to give a better line of site to installing sufficient vegetation to -- to give a significant buffer there, and I don't see an effort in that regard, and unless I do, I can't support the petition. MR. BARNARD: Well, in truth, obviously in the location that we're considering and where the property is located, a project such as this has a limited window of economic viability. Certainly we are developing it less -- to less than the maximum but not by significant numbers less. The density -- COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I believe one unit was the amount. MR. BARNARD: Well -- But there is a further reduction of -- We have a site plan which calls for a maximum of 72 units rather than the 74 which is on the approval. I'm -- I'm not sure that -- whether that meets your concerns or not. As I say, as far as buffering and -- and setbacks, obviously increasing the southern setback may further reduce that to a point where the dwelling makes -- make -- makes no sense whatsoever because increasing obviously the -- the -- the buffer has to be in the upland area because that's -- that's where it happens to be located. So I'm not sure that it isn't possible to -- to add some buffering language in terms of vegetation, berming, whatever -- whatever might be -- make sense and would be -- would be willing to -- to live with whatever. I -- I can't speak to exact vegetation types and so on, but certainly anything that's logical and makes sense, we would be happy to comply with. MR. MILK: Right now the minimum landscape buffer per the Land Development Code is a ten-foot buffer with a tree planted every 30 linear feet. That is the transition between residential and residential. If you wish to make that further opaque, there's the requirement for the opaque fence and vegetation and/or the berm combination of that within that ten foot that would offer the opaque buffer in that ten-foot landscaped area. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Commissioner Norris. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Mr. Milk, could you point out on that map for me which of the -- which of the parcel -- what portion of the parcel is currently zoned RSF-3? MR. MILK: Currently the southern five acres is zoned RSF-3. In 1991 that was down-zoned to be compatible with the RSF-3 property that was set just to the south of that. The RHF-6 property to the north encompassing the ten acres and the other ten acres was deemed improved property; therefore, they maintain their RHF-6 status. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: So in 1991 the -- the southern portion there was down-zoned to be more compatible with the property adjoining? MR. MILK: That's correct. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Now, this -- this request that we have before us today would reverse that 1991 action in effect? MR. MILK: For a net density standpoint, no. But for the flexibility of putting more units on that particular five-acre subject property, yes. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Well -- MR. MILK: It's a catch-twenty -- COHMISSIONER NORRIS: -- let me -- let me make sure I understand. In 1991 that property was -- was RHF-6 and was down-zoned to RSF-3 in order to make a transition to the -- to the RSF-3 that is directly to the south to protect the rights of the people that have the property to the south? MR. MILK: I think in conclusion that's correct. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Okay. And now this petition, as I understand it, would allow multi-family units to be placed at -- at a net density of over nine per acre in that southern portion that was in 1991 limited to three units per acre for the protection of the neighboring property? COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I follow what you're saying now, and I wasn't at first. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: That's an excellent point. MR. MILK: What -- What happened -- That's absolutely correct. What happened is, to the zoning teevaluation process, there was no improved statuses or exemptions for that five-acre parcel, so it was down-zoned, period. Again, the ten acres to the north maintained its RHF-6 zoning because it was deemed improved property. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: The difference was, the transitional boundary occurred within the project limits, and by virtue of this PUD, the transitional boundary is being forced to the south where someone else is going to have to deal with it at some point down the road. And where the petitioner says that there's economic viability at a certain point for his parcel, I would tend to believe that that RSF-3 parcel is going to experience some level of -- of -- COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Diminished value. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- diminished potential maybe, you know. So we establish a transition boundary, and then by virtue of a PUD, we -- we abolish it and shift the burden to the southern property, and this -- this is one of those famous ingruns that we hear so much about. MR. MILK: We do abolish it, but we limit it to the upland area. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Agreed, which we don't have much choice about anyway. We don't -- We don't control those permits. MR. MILK: Right. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: So the one dissenting vote on -- on the Planning Commission, was it stated the reason for that dissenting vote? MR. MILK: The -- The thought there was -- and the same conversation arose during the Planning Commission, is how much density should be approved on the subject parcel or on the property as it is. And the conversation was -- is that they are reducing density, so they do comply with policy 5.1 of the Land Development Code which makes this a consistent fezone application from staff's viewpoint from long-range and planning. The opposing member stated that we ought to further reduce that one unit to something else. Nobody could pull a figure out so I think -- MR. BARNARD: If I may, I believe that if you check the tape of that, you'll find that the dissenting voter requested that since the site plan called for 72 units, that -- would we be willing to reduce it to 72. And -- and I can't speak with exact certainty, but I have -- I have a strong feeling that had we done that, it would have been unanimous. COHHISSIONER NORRIS: Let me -- While the petitioner is up there, can I ask a question? CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Certainly, Commissioner Norris. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: What -- The -- Who's going to develop this property? MR. BARNARD: This property is being developed by the gentleman sitting here, Walter Hoffman. Walter is a native of Germany and has been in this country for some time, and he's experienced with doing development in Germany but has not done it heretofore in this country. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Let me -- I -- I need to know what -- what are we going to build here. Are these to be rental apartments? MR. BARNARD: No. They're going to be condominium. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Condominium. MR. BARNARD: Single ownership but in a condominium form, two-story, garden type with a pool, recreation area. Actually, an attractive improvement to an area that has some areas that aren't so attractive, and -- and I don't think I have to explain that. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: But of course you're not biased on that opinion -- MR. BARNARD: Not at all. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: -- at all, are you? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Let me suggest that -- You know, the problem is when we go to net density, net density can change depending on what environmental restrictions you have, what water management requirements exist, and -- and generally net density is going to be at least one and a half times your -- your gross density anyway. I mean, that's -- that's just a reality. The problem that I keep coming back to is -- and it's one that Commissioner Norris highlighted very appropriately -- is that there was a transitional barrier that was within these project limits. That barrier is being shifted. I disagree with that. What I would like to see is that transition to occur within your project, not on -- not on the southern border where an adjacent property owner's going to have to deal with it. Your PUD is not structured in such a way to give different development restrictions on the south than you have on the north; is that correct, Mr. Milk? MR. MILK: That's correct. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. Until you can develop restrictions to the south that cause the transition internal to your project, I -- I simply see you shifting the problem. You know, it's -- it's taking advantage of -- of the structure of a PUD to get around the transition that was imposed in '91. So unless you're willing to today commit to development restrictions similar to those established in RSF-3 on the southern boundary of your property, then this -- this transition I think is -- is unduly and unfair to the property of the south. MR. MILK: That could happen because it is set up -- or development regulations are less restrictive than the RSF-3 district, yet we do have certain categories for detached single-family homes. So you -- you could call out -- You know, for instance, category one shall only be built along that southern property line, and that would provide that transition from single-family to multi-family from the project to the south. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. Help me in the document. Where is category one? MR. MILK: It's on page 44 of your agenda. It's table one on page 3-4 of the PUD document. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Mr. Milk, I think we're -- Are we saying here now that we're going to build only single-family homes in what is currently the southern five-acre portion -- MR. MILK: Well -- COHMISSIONER NORRIS: -- as defined on that map? MR. MILK: That -- That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying along the boundary. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: There will be at least -- You're saying there will be at least one row of single-family -- MR. MILK: At least a row of transition between the property to the south and the property that we're proposing of multi-family buildings. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I like that because it puts the transition back where it originally was intended to be and doesn't shift it to the southern property. MR. MILK: I mean, that could happen because it's set up in a table like that. I can't speak for the petitioner, but, again, that flexibility could be an input into the PUD document which would provide for single-family along the southern boundary of the RSF-3 property, not the whole five acres, and the remainder of the project could be as developed by the petitioner. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: What would that do to the density? MR. MILK: You know, according to the site plan, you come in off Colonial Road. There's a lake in the middle, and there's condominiums designed around that particular lake. I'm sure it would take probably 16 or so units away from the petitioner because of the alignment, the water management, the constraints of the site. That's my guess. It would take a couple of buildings right away. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Based on what Mr. Barnard was saying about the economic viability -- and I can count the shaking heads up here -- I don't know if this is something you're going to want to stop, pull back, and re-evaluate because rather than us right here going through with a red pen and saying what changes under category one, what changes under two are voting to deny, you might be able to be more creative if you went away and came back. That's just COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: My -- My proposal -- and I'll -- I'll -- I'll mention this before I make a motion. Mine would be that only categories one or two type development occur adjacent to the southern property boundary, period. And what that means is single-family or single-family zero lot line occur to the south, and then you can deal with the transition internal to your project in whatever manner you best -- best see, and that gets us back to where -- what -- what was done in '91 and I think what was done appropriately in '91. So it puts a transition in your balipark, not in your neighbors', and I think that's a fair approach, and that would be -- I would put that in the form of a motion. So before I do that, if you wish to, you know, withdraw the application or continue the application to make changes yourself, you may want to discuss that. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Let's give him a couple of minutes to discuss what they want to do. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: That theme from Jeopardy would be welcome at this point. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'm ready for your motion. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Yeah. We're -- COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Yeah. I -- CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We're -- We're getting close to wanting a motion. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Yeah. (Commissioner Hac'Kie hummed the theme song to the game show Jeopardy.) COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Those viewers at home, please don't adjust the volume of your TV set. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: What I'm going -- Unless the petitioner has a statement, I -- I'm prepared to make a motion. MR. MILK: I -- I just want to offer one thing. There's a little language barrier here a little bit. His site plan shows that the closest building to the southern property line is about 100 feet. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: But that site plan is not a part of our package or this. MR. MILK: That's correct. He may not understand that fully, but according to the site plan -- because what happens, there's a road that goes in. It's a loop road. All the buildings are internal, and they have a lake view. So, in essence, that plan provides for about 100 foot of buffer to the property to the south. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Let me get this straight. When I asked about a setback from the south property line, I was told if you moved it more than 20 feet, it may create an economic hardship. let's get with the program here. Either -- COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Is it 100 feet or 20 feet? MR. MILK: No. It's only 20. That's -- That's what the table says. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Right. The setback is 20. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I'm confused. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: But if you were planning on doing 100, that would have been a real good time to tell me that. MR. BARNARD: Well, I -- I don't have the site plan with me unfortunately. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. The site plan is not a part of what we've been given today, so we're not going to -- I'm not going to base my decision on -- on something that's out there somewhere else. One of two things. You need to withdraw your application, or I'm going to make a motion and I'm -- You know, I'll tell you what. I'll just go ahead and make the motion. You can interrupt me if you want. MR. MILK: Let me offer one more thing. I'm sorry. Maybe we can offer a perimeter setback as a part of the regulation. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I like that. COMMISSIONER NORRIS: I -- I'm not comfortable with that because I keep looking at that map, and I remember that in 1991 that line was drawn arbitrarily on that piece of property to keep -- to ensure that there's going to be a transition. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: That's exactly right. MR. MILK: Because I think with the right-of-way and the landscape and the distance between the southern boundary and the buildings -- again, I offer the perimeter setback. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. I'm -- I'm going to make a motion that may contain both of these, and you can either like it or hate it. That's -- That's your option. MR. BARNARD: I -- I -- At this time I would request that we withdraw the application for consideration. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have a request by the petitioner to withdraw the application. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Motion to approve. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: We don't need to approve a withdrawal. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: He's -- He's withdrawn it. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: COHMISSIONER NORRIS: COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: We don't need to approve it. Thank you. Withdraw the motion to -- Mr. Milk -- -- approve the withdrawal. -- as far as staff direction, I think this board has shown one of two things. We want to see a compatible product to the south property line or a setback equivalent to the lot size of the compatible product so that, again, the transition occurs internal with the project. Is that a fair statement from the board? COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: MR. MILK: Thank you. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Sounds fair to me. Sounds fair to me. Okay. Thank you, Mr. Milk. Item #12B2 ORDINANCE 95-73 RE PETITION R-95-7, DR. NENO SPAGNA, PRESIDENT, FLORIDA URBAN INSTITUTE, INC., REPRESENTING JAMES P. NEBUS, TRUSTEE, AND IVEY JEAN NEBUS, TRUSTEE, REQUESTING A REZONE FROM "A" TO "TTRVC" FOR PROPERTY ADJACENT TO ROCK CREEK CAMPGROUND, 3100 NORTH ROAD - ADOPTED WITH STIPULATIONS (COMPANION TO ITEM #13A2) Next item on the agenda is item 12(B)(2), petition R-95-7 and companion item 13(A)(2). Hr. Nino. MR. NINO: Ron Nino, for the record. Good afternoon, Commissioners. The petition that is before you seeks to have three and a half acres currently zoned agricultural zoned TTRVC which is the travel trailer and recreational vehicle campground district classification. The property -- The three and a half acres is immediately contiguous and west of the current Rock Creek TTRVC campground, and, of course, it is the same owner. The owner wishes to expand the current Rock Creek campground. The configuration of the property and the natural conditions of the property suggest that a substantial portion of it -- namely, that portion contiguous to Rock Creek -- will remain in its natural condition due to its mangroves and -- and other qualifying vegetation that demands preservation, and in -- in reality, we have about -- enough land left over according to the petitioner for about 18 sites based on their preliminary analysis of a feasible site plan. The future land use element provides that TTRVC zoning may occur in any urban-designated residential area and that the prevailing density when such an action is undertaken would be the action -- would be the density that's provided for in the Land Development Code which is 12 TTRVC sites per acre, and I enunciate that because we're really talking about a different animal when we talk about TTRVC sites and -- and a -- and a regular dwelling unit per acre. So the -- the -- Because of -- Because of that relationship dictated by the -- by the future land use plan, therefore, the petition as presented is consistent with the future land use element. Reviewed by appropriate staff, jurisdictional staff with responsibility for advising us on levels of service and consistency with elements of the -- of the Growth Management Plan reveal that the subject petition in its location is consistent with all elements of the Growth Management Plan. This petition was reviewed by the Environmental Advisory Board and -- and it was recommended for approval by the Environmental Advisory Board. The Planning Commission heard this petition, and they unanimously recommended approval of the petition. There were some -- There were a couple of people that were present and spoke in favor of the petition. No property owner communicated any level of objection to our office. The resolution -- I would point out that the resolution -- the ordinance that supports the approval action would have one major condition in it, and that is that no a -- approval of this petition will not result in any additional access points on North Road. The project -- In other words, the land will be developed internally from the existing R.V. Park. With respect to the variance petition, the current Land Development Code requires a 50-foot setback from roads and exterior boundaries. That -- That amendment came about in about 19 -- in the 1993 amendment cycle. Prior to that, the setback requirement was 25 feet. Needless to say, the existing park is developed with respect to North Road with a 25-foot setback and is bermed and -- and fairly well landscaped. The staff report suggests that in analyzing the conditions precedent to support of a variance, that there are -- there is reason to believe that there are extenuating circumstances and characteristics unique to the property that -- that support the consideration of the -- of the variance. The Planning Commission when they heard this petition unanimously supported the granting of the petition; however, there was some modification to the conditions in the resolution of adoption that they reviewed versus the one that is now before you relative to the provision of the landscaped berm. You will note -- You'll note in the resolution that there are two conditions that deal with the quality of the perimeter berm -- the berm that would separate North -- North Road from -- from on-site activities, and that condition reads as follows on your page 26. An earthen berm shall be established along north boundary -- the north boundary -- namely, North Road -- of the expanded R.V. Park. The berm shall be -- shall be contoured to achieve a height of four feet; on top of the berm, a vegetation screen with at least 80 percent opacity at the time of planting for additional height of four feet shall be established. And it goes on to arrive that that will be administratively dealt with at the time of site development plan. Submission is required which will be required of this -- this petition at a subsequent development of order of approval base. With respect to the west boundary, the condition says, within the 25-foot west boundary setback, existing vegetation shall be supplemented, if necessary, to achieve an opacity rating of 80 percent at the time building permits are at issue -- are issued for additional R.V. Sites. Most of the property, incidentally, to the west of this site is -- is owned by the -- by the owners of Rock Creek. There is one house on the south side of -- and I -- the name of that road eludes me now. There's only one -- There's one residence on the very south end of East Street that would have any relationship to the R.V. Park and the effect of the 25 feet versus 50 feet. There's a very dense vegetation screen along there. Quite frankly, I don't know that it would meet the 80 percent opacity rating, but at the time of site development plan approval, if you agreed with the Planning Commission's recommendation, we would ensure that whatever vegetation is there does indeed meet the 80 opacity rating. Dr. Spagna is here on behalf of the petitioner. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have questions? COMMISSIONER NORRIS: I have one. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: I -- I just wish to remind the board that we are listening to both a fezone petition and a variance request. Commissioner Constantine. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: You mentioned the setback, and particularly you mentioned on North Road. I might point out that not only is it landscaped, but it has some of the best Christmas lighting in all of Collier County on North Road there. MR. NINO: Including the county. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Yeah. This is -- You said it is concurrent with our Growth Management Plan, does -- was approved unanimously -- MR. NINO: Yes. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: -- by the Planning Commission. MR. NINO: Yes. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: As I look through the pro and cons included in our executive summary here, the cons seem weak at best. The fact that placement of any type of housing that establishes a population could be viewed not without some element of risk when next to an airport certainly hasn't prohibited prior growth around the Naples municipal airport. And the -- As far as the urban intensification, we're only talking 18 new sites. So I don't see that as a big impact on travel or transportation. So I'm -- I'm very comfortable with it. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Commissioner Norris. COMMISSIONER NORRIS: Dr. Spagna, there doesn't seem to be a church involved in this. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: What are you doing here? CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Why are you doing this one? DR. SPAGNA: It will be coming later but not quite yet. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: this property in the end? DR. SPAGNA: Not yet. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: The Rock Creek Church. Are you going to put a church on Okay. They'll be meeting on the fourth pad on Tuesdays. The property -- Mr. Nino, would you help me? The property that is owned by the same folks that are -- are applying for this variance and fezone, how much of that -- Is it all but that one southern parcel that is adjacent to the western boundary? MR. NINO: No. The owners also own the next -- the immediately adjacent west properties extending about halfway down East Street, and there's a house on it and owned by the petitioner. They didn't wish to include it in this petition. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. MR. NINO: It's a functioning residence. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: And help me. On the western boundary, again, existing vegetation and additional plantings to reach 80 percent opacity before a building permit is issued. Is that the extent of buffering on that side? MR. NINO: Yes. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: And we're reducing -- No, we're not reducing the setback on that side, just on the road side? MR. NINO: Yes, we are reducing the -- COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: 50 to 25. MR. NINO: The setback would -- would currently be 50 feet, Commissioner; however, the Planning Commission supports the -- the reduction in the 50-foot separation to 25 feet on the understanding that -- that the vegetation screen in there will achieve an 80 percent rating there -- there -- You know, the -- the feeling is that -- that -- that you can achieve as much -- and we've dealt with this before. You can achieve as effective a barrier within varying horizontal distances. It simply depends on what you do in terms of its intensity on the smaller horizontal distance. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Mr. Spagna, my only concern there is that folks who do develop those parcels may very well develop them residentially, and I'm just concerned about the visual, the visual impact there. So I guess that's about as good as we can do without putting up a fence so -- CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have a speaker on this, Mr. Dorrill? MR. DORRILL: We have a couple. Dr. Spagna, do you have any other comments? DR. SPAGNA: No. I don't have any other comments, except I want to make sure that if you have any questions, that I have a chance to answer them. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Yes. After the public speaker, if -- if you need to -- to rebut anything, we'll be glad to hear it. Mr. Dotrill, you want to call the speaker? DR. SPAGNA: Okay. Thank you. MR. DORRILL: Ms. Krantz. And then Ms. Nebus, Ivy Jean Nebus, if I could have you stand by, please, ma'am. MS. KRANTZ: Good afternoon. My name is Gwyn Krantz, and I'm from the Waterfront which is just west of what we're talking about. And may I say that these people helped us when the city was going to take ten acres alongside of them and put low housing. All they kept mentioning was the three shacks on North Road which was this property that we have in question right now. They bought this property, took the shacks down, are -- in attempt to make it nice and put a berm, and we have -- as the Waterfront with units of 125 to $160,000 have no opposition to these people. We think what they've done is wonderful, and they've also -- when we had our 100-year rain and it was flooding right there by their -- about 400 feet in, they let us go through their park which their roads were better than North Road. So thank you. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. MR. DORRILL: Ms. -- Ms. Nebus. And then, Janet Nebus, you'll follow this lady. Good afternoon. MS. NEBUS: Hi. I'm Ivy Jean Nebus, and we currently own Rock Creek Campgrounds and have done so for many, many years since it was in existence in 1950, and we strive to be good neighbors and hope to be, and we are very fortunate to have the people on Waterfront on the west side of us, and we hope that we can remain good neighbors. So we hope you see fit to grant us this petition and the variance. Thank you. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. MS. NEBUS: Hi. My name is Janet Nebus, and I live and have lived at 2468 North Road which is the neighboring property that you're talking about. I would be the neighbor to the west of the proposed site. I work in the office managing it and working with the family business. Being a native of Naples, I am proud of our small business and what we have accomplished over the years. We've tried to maintain a beautiful place and that promotes what Naples is after, beauty and charm, and I have no reservations, would actually welcome the opportunity to live next door. I think it will be a beautiful place, especially since I'll probably be helping to plant most of the plants on the berm. Thanks a lot. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. That was the last speaker, Mr. Dotrill? MR. DORRILL: Yes. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: I'll close the public hearing. Mr. Spag -- Dr. Spagna, do you need to add anything else? DR. SPAGNA: No, thank you. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I'd like to move approval. DR. SPAGNA: I mean, thank you, no. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Madam Chairman, we need to take both of these -- CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: I think we need to take them separately. Can I have a motion on the fezone petition? COHHISSIONER MAC'KIE: Move approval. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: You have a comment? CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: I'm sorry. Commissioner Norris. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: No, it wasn't a comment. It was a just reminder there's two -- two parts. COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: of the PUD. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: a PUD. COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: approve petition R-95-7. COMHISSIONER NORRIS: There's two. So I move approval Second. It's a fezone petition. It's not I'm sorry. It's a fezone. Okay. I'll second that too. We have a motion and a second to Any further discussion? That -- That's with the stipulations that were discussed? COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: the motion? COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: Yes. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Yes. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Yes. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay. I assume, yes. With the stipulations? Is that Second? Second amends. No further discussion. All in favor, please say aye. Opposed? There being none, motion passes five to zero. Item #13A2 RESOLUTION 95-690 RE PETITION V-95-21, DR. NENO J. SPAGNA, PRESIDENT, FLORIDA URBAN INSTITUTE, INC., REPRESENTING JAMES P. NEBUS, TRUSTEE, AND IVEY JEAN NEUBS, TRUSTEE, REQUESTING 25 FOOT VARIANCES TO THE PERIMETER SETBACKS OF 50 FEET TO 25 FEET FOR PROPERTY CONTIGUOUS TO 3100 NORTH ROAD (COMPANION TO ITEM #1282) - ADOPTED COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Madam Chairman, I'll make a motion we approve V-95-21. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Second. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have a motion and a second to approve petition V-95-21. Any further discussion? All in favor, please say aye. Opposed? Motion passes five to zero. DR. SPAGNA: Thank you. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you, Dr. Spagna. DR. SPAGNA: Have a nice afternoon. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: No church on this one; right? Item #1283 ORDINANCE 95-74 RE PETITION PUD-95-10 GEORGE L. VARNADOE, ESQUIRE, OF YOUNG, VANASSENDERP 7 VARNADOE, P.A., REPRESENTING U.S. HOME CORPORATION REQUESTING A REZONE FROM "PUD" PLANNED UNIT DEVELOPMENT TO "PUD" PLANNED UNIT DEVELOPMENT, "A" RURAL AGRICULTURAL, RSF-4 SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL AND RHF-12 (10) RESIDENTIAL MULTIPLE FAMILY ALL TO "PUD" FOR A PROJECT TO BE KNOWN AS ANPLES HERITAGE GOLF AND COUNTRY CLUB, SOUTH OF DAVIS BOULEVARD AND WEST OF C.R. 951 - ADOPTED Next item on the petition -- on the agenda is 12 -- COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: The Varnadoe Baptist Church. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: -- 12(B) -- 12(B)(3), petition PUD-95-10. Mr. Nino. MR. NINO: Ron Nino, for the record. This petition purports to repeal the current Shamrock Country Club and Golf Course PUD and replace it with a new PUD which will be henceforth known as the Naples Heritage Golf and Country Club. The PUD in its new form increases the land area by 35 and a half acres. Most of the added land is currently zoned RMF-12 with the cap of ten resulting from rezoning re-evaluation process, and some of the land was zoned agricultural. The original Shamrock PUD was essentially a parcel of land that had frontage on Davis Boulevard, frontage on C.R. 951, the added areas agricultural and the RMF-6 up in this corner here. (indicating) The PUD was originally approved for 550 dwelling units. The new PUD would propose 799 dwelling units. However, as I indicated to you -- which, incidentally, is substantially -- the total number of dwelling units is 1.43 dwelling units per acre substantially below the threshold that is permitted by -- otherwise permitted by the density rating system. The base density here is three dwelling units per acre, and because of that frontage on two arterial roads, there's another density dwelling unit, so that makes it four. And a substantial portion of this project is within -- is within the one-mile band of an activity center which would authorize an additional three dwelling units per acre. So you see the density at 1.43 is -- is significantly below the -- the threshold that is otherwise possible for this property. The -- As it's structured, this -- this property is -- is really a green plan and is more as -- so well iljustrated by the -- by the map that is on the wall. If you -- We figured it out, that about 8 percent -- 8 percent, approximately 40 acres, 45 acres of -- of the 550-some acres is really an impervious surface. I mean, that's the building area and the streets area. So there's an infin -- infinitesimal small part of this property that will be in hard surface. Sixty-six percent of the project -- COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Excuse me, Mr. Nino. MR. NINO: Yes? COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Is there anything bad about this? I'm -- I'm looking -- MR. NINO: You might find something bad about it. I don't know. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. MR. NINO: Sixty-six percent -- UNKNOWN VOICE: Not if you sit down. MR. NINO: Sixty-six percent -- COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: So what -- what are you trying to say, Ron? MR. NINO: Well, I want to cover -- Sixty-six percent of the project is an open space; therefore, that meets our open space element. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Madam Chairman, I realize Mr. Nino has a job to do, but I'm very comfortable after reading through the executive summary and attached paperwork. MR. NINO: Wonderful. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Mr. Nino, is there anything else that you absolutely must get on the record? MR. NINO: It was recommended for approval unanimously by the Planning Commission. The only opposition -- I -- I do need to get something on the record. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Yes. I -- I thought there might be. MR. NINO: The only opposition to -- There really wasn't any opposition voiced. There was a concern addressed that the residents in the -- in the airpark, Wing Airpark, would not be -- have future problems by future residents of Naples Heritage with planes flying overhead, and Mr. Varnadoe consented to provide a declaration in the PUD which, incidentally, is not in your copy because the language came along later. So your documents has the revision in it that provides a declaration to property owners that they are in a flight path and puts them on notice, and that addresses that concern. COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: How does that put -- MR. NINO: Other than that, we have nothing else. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: How does something in this property's PUD put somebody else on notice? COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: It puts the owners that are going into this PUD on notice that there is an airpark -- CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: That they're in a flight path. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- adjacent. Is that correct, Mr. Varnadoe? COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: Oh, I got it. MR. VARNADOE: Yes. Wing South is about a half mile to our south, and -- and their runway lines up with the southeastern part of our development there, and they ask that we put those people in our contract documents on notice that they are within that proximity of the airport, and we thought that was a good idea for our own protection as well, so we've agreed to do that in the PUD. COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: If I could -- could ask another question? CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: You've got the floor. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Okay. I -- I've been hearing about the Shamrock PUD for about 100 years, and -- and it's never been able to get off the ground, and I remembered hearing things about RCWs and environmental concerns. Did this go to EAB, or should it have? MR. VARNADOE: The project went to EAB when it was first zoned. COHHISSIONER MAC'KIE: Shamrock. MR. VARNADOE: When it was Shamrock, yes. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: So it hadn't been to EAB in this -- How will those environmental issues be addressed? I trust there -- there are 5,000 agencies out there waiting to regulate you on that point, but I just needed to know. MR. VARNADOE: There are no agencies out there waiting to regulate us on that point because we have received all of our environmental permits, and the reason we came back just to be very, very brief was because during the permitting phase, the green space got to such an extent that we needed to kind of revitalize the plan, and this plan you see has got all of its environmental permits with the exception of parcel or tract B up there which is the part we're adding. We're proposing only passive recreation uses and maybe a lake on that. Before any development occurs, we go back to the EAB with an EIS so they can take a look at that. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Thanks. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Mr. Dotrill, there are no public speakers? MR. DORRILL: No, ma'am. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: I'll close the public hearing. Commissioner Hancock. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: I was going to ask something. I forgot what it was, so never mind. Oh, oh. The-- Our packet doesn't have a PUD master plan in it. Mr. Nino, was one submitted? I assume one was submitted. It's just not here. MR. NINO: Yes. Yes. One was submitted. I'm sorry if it wasn't in your packet. It's the same plan that's on the wall. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Is that it? MR. NINO: That's correct. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. With that, I'm ready to make a motion to approve PUD-95-10. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'll second that. COMMISSIONER NORRIS: Second. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have a motion and a second to approve PUD-95-10. Any further discussion? All in favor, please say aye. Opposed? Motion passes five to zero. MR. VARNADOE: Thank you. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Nino. Item #12B4 ORDINANCE 95-75 RE PETITION R-95-8, DWIGHT NADEAU OF MCANLY & ASSOCIATES, P.A., REPRESENTING EARL FRYE REQUESTING A REZONE FROM C-3 COMMERCIAL INTERMEDIATE DISTRICT TO RMF-16 RESIDENTIAL/MULTIPLE FAMILY 16 DISTRICT FOR PROPERTY LOCATED AT 4975 BONITA BEACH ROAD - ADOPTED WITH STIPULATIONS Next item on the agenda is item 12(B)(4), petition R-95-8. Mr. Nino, you're still with us. MR. NINO: Ron -- Ron Nino, for the record. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: This one might be a tougher sell. MR. NINO: The petition that is before you seeks to have property currently zoned C-3 rezoned to the RMF-16 multi-family district classification. The future land use element actually encourages people to convert commercial zoning that is otherwise inconsistent with the future land use plan by awarding them a density of 16 -- by providing for a density of 16 units, I should say, per acre. The property immediately east of this project is the -- is the Hickory Bay condominium. It has 105 units -- 108 dwelling units in six-story build -- in a six-story building. The project immediately -- The property immediately to the west of the subject property is currently under development as a marina, containing both wet and dry slips. So you have -- You know, you have the property sandwiched between a condominium project that probably will -- that this probably will probably end up being developed much like it and -- and -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Do you know what the densities are on those? MR. NINO: -- and the commercial property. I beg your pardon? COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Do you know what the densities are on the condo property? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: The property to the east? MR. NINO: Well, the density on the condo project -- here again, the -- Let's see. I had that here. MR. NADEAU: I can respond to that for you, Ron, if you wish. MR. NINO: It's misleading because the Hickory Bay PUD includes a great mass of water area, and the net -- the gross density is somewhere in the neighborhood of four or five dwelling units per acre, but I believe we -- in the -- on the net basis, it's up around 15 or 16 on the net basis. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Mr. Nadeau, you're going to have to identify yourself. MR. NADEAU: Good afternoon, Commissioners. A pleasure to be before you again. For the record, my name is Dwight Nadeau with the firm of HcAnly Engineering, representing the contract purchaser, Earl Frye, who is also the applicant. And to go immediately to your question, the Little Hickory Bay PUD to the east of the subject property is 108 dwelling units on 24 acres. There are some mangrove lands there that would provide for that density. The gross density on that parcel is 4.5 dwelling units per acre, but when looking at the net density of the building parcel which is actually four acres with 108 dwelling units on it, you have 27 dwelling units per acre. And as Mr. Nino described to us, this is 2.93-acre parcels that we're proposing 47 dwelling units on. MR. NINO: Madam Chairman, I continue to remind you that -- to present my report, I mean, this petition did go to the EAB. It was recommended for approval. You'll notice in the resolution -- the ordinance of adoption that there are -- there are a number of conditions to that approval. Well, there's one condition, and that has to do with a common ingress and egress. I believe Mr. Nadeau will describe that later on, but one of our concerns was that -- that this property and the marina share a joint driveway to minimize the impact on Bonita Beach Road, and there is an agreement to that. The site plan was approved with that shared access driveway for the existing marina and will be made a condition of this approval solidifying it insofar as this developer's commitment to the project. The Planning Commission unanimously endorsed the petition at their meeting, and that concludes my report. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Commissioner Hancock. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Mr. Nino, maybe -- maybe my calculator is wrong, but when I divide forty -- when I divide 47 by 2.93, I get 16.04 which technically exceeds 16 units an acre. MR. NADEAU: Well, actually, the -- I don't have the actual acreage of the property right now, but it did wind up being 47 dwelling units on the subject property. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: But based on what we're given, when you run the numbers, it exceeds 16 which we can't do. So I'm -- There -- There's a -- I'm just curious that if we were to do that when it comes out to 16.04 units an acre, are we -- COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Even if it is, in my experience, staff -- with 16.04, they tell you, you get 16. MR. NINO: Let -- let -- I'm -- COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Again, I'm -- I'm just -- MR. NINO: Well, let me -- let me interject. The density rate -- The density rating system specifically provides that you round down and round up at the .5 stage. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. I just wanted to make sure there wasn't a legal problem -- CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: At where? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- with that. That's all. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: .5. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: And I -- I just wanted to point out about this too, something that I liked just in case anybody pays attention, that instead of coming in with a PUD and being clever, this is a fezone from one existing zoning district to another, and so, you know, we are complying with already established standards in the county, and I -- I just think that that's nice when property owners can do that and not try to need a break on every setback or every little regulation. MR. NADEAU: It's also unique that an applicant would come forward and try and bring a piece of property closer to consistency with the comprehensive plan. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: What a concept. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Commissioner Hancock. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: How many floors over parking do you have there? MR. NADEAU: That would be seven over one. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Seven over one. MR. NADEAU: Yes. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. I'm sitting here looking at -- even if we -- you know, if you were to -- to determine the density was too high and you wanted to reduce it, what you end up doing is taking a floor off, and you end up with pretty much the same visual product because typically when someone comes in and -- and you can request up to 16, the request is somewhere a little less than that, and in the past we've been hesitant to award 100 percent of the allowable density. Mr. Nino, have we looked fairly comprehensibly at the traffic impact to Bonita Beach Road? I know this is a two-lane road. MR. NINO: Shortly it will be a four-lane road. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Shortly, but it -- it isn't right now. Would this project have to come after the four-laning? MR. NINO: No. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. But it -- So it's not exceeding 5 percent of the level of service? MR. NINO: It's within the window, within the window that's provided. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. MR. NINO: Let me point out that your staff report doesn't iljustrate any site plan as Mr. Nadeau is iljustrating, and we do that on purpose. You're -- You're not approving that plan. You're not -- And, in particular, you're not approving those docks. That is the subject -- That is the subject of subsequent site development plan application and their requirement to meet federal and state permitting requirements. Docks are permitted as accessory uses, but whether they're going to get that many docks and that configuration, you're not approving that. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: But correct -- COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: That's good to put that on the record. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Correct me if I'm wrong though. By using that site plan and showing it as an exhibit here today, if they come back for their SDP and that building is minimum setback from -- See, one of the things I like about this is the building is a significant setback from the roadway, that it's pushed closer to the water instead of being right on the roadway and giving a tunnel effect. Now, do I need to -- to scale off that setback and make it a part of this approval in order to make that happen? Because that's -- To me, that's an attractive point of this. If you go down Bonita Beach Road, the closer you get to Lely Barefoot, some of those things are right on top of the road, and that makes a real visual impact difference. MR. NINO: I can't -- I can't conceive within the real world designing anything other than that. I mean, that's where the parking lot is going to be. I'm sure they're going to put the building right back to the water as close as they can possibly do it because that's where the value is. I don't think you can get the -- COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: No. People like it better if you sell them a -- a highway view. MR. NINO: Unless you want -- Unless you want Dwight to go out there and tear off the docks. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Well, put a -- We'll verbally put an "X" on the docks for today -- will satisfy me that we -- It was good of you to make that record that that's not included in today's approval. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I guess I want to ask Mr. Nadeau -- do you anticipate a setback consistent with what's being shown here today on that building? MR. NADEAU: I do, Commissioner. In fact, we have the engineer that's preparing the site development plan as we speak, and it is identical to that plan. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. Should staff see something different, I will expect a flag? MR. NINO: You will when you see one. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Mr. Nadeau, you said your engineers are preparing a site development plan even before you get approval? MR. NADEAU: Well, we -- we live in an expedient world, Commissioner. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Everybody is an optimist. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: He's an optimist. Mr. -- Oh, God. Mr. Weigel, are there speakers on this? MR. WEIGEL: No. None. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: I'll close the public hearing. Is there a motion? COHMISSIONER NORRIS: I'll make a motion to approve and to have the record reflect that we are in no way by this action approving any boat docks -- COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Second. COMMISSIONER NORRIS: -- at this time. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have a motion and a second to approve petition R-95-8 with the notation that we are not approving any boat docks at this time. If there's no further discussion, all in favor, please say aye. Opposed? Motion passes five to zero. MR. NADEAU: Thank you, Commissioners. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. Item #12B5 ORDINANCE 95-76 RE PETITION PUD-95-11, SUSAN HEBEL WATTS OF WCI COHMUNITIES LIMITED PARTNERSHIP REQUESTING A REZONE FROM RSF-4 TO PUD TO BE KNOWN AS TARPON COVE FOR 389 SINGLE FA_MILY/HULTI-FA_MILY UNITS ON THE NORTHWEST CORNER OF WIGGINS PASS ROAD AND TA_MIA_MI TRAIL NORTH - ADOPTED Next item on the agenda is 12(B)(5), petition PUD-95-11. Mr. Nino. MR. NINO: Yes. Ron Nino -- CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: This is your day, isn't it? MR. NINO: It appears so. Ron -- Ron Nino, for the record. It's Christmastime. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay. COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: Ho, ho, ho. MR. NINO: This petition would have you rezoning property currently zoned RSF-4 which is a single-family residential zoning district to the PUD planned unit development district. The PUD as structured presents a mixed use residential project. It allows all -- It allows all matter of housing forms from single-family to multiple-family. The number of dwelling units proposed in the PUD would have 389 dwelling units constructed on the property, exactly four dwelling units to the gross acre. The petition is consistent with the density rating system in that four dwelling units are permitted in the configuration enjoyed by this land. It is consistent with the traffic circulation element, coastal and conservation elements, and the open space element. And I would merely emphasize that this property has a substantial amount of natural conditions that need to be preserved. And you'll note on the plan, the master plan that's iljustrated, that 52 percent of that area will qualify as open space land, and given that starting point, it's obvious that more than 60 percent of the land when you include the development tracts will be in open space. This petition was referred to the Environmental Advisory Board, and they recommended approval subject to conditions which are included in the PUD that's in your package. That PUD also includes all of the other concerns that were requested by staff. They are all contained within the PUD as concluded -- included in your package. The Collier County Planning Commissioner reviewed this petition and unanimously recommended its approval. No one represented any level of objection to this petition. We did have one person speak to the commission evidencing some concern for drainage and that -- they lived in a project across the street in the Wiggins Bay PUD. We recommend approval subject to the conditions that are now contained in the PUD. The development standards are all to our satisfaction in that they are representative of standards that have been used time and time again successfully by W -- WCI, Inc., Community. I rest my case. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Are there questions of staff? The petitioner, Hiss Watts, do you have anything you need to add? MS. WATTS: Not really. If there are questions -- CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Mr. Weigel, are there speakers? MR. WEIGEL: There are none. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: I'll close the public hearing. Commissioner Hancock. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Hiss Watts, again, in a similar vein, we have RSF-4 to the north and to the west. Has the PUD taken into account bordering on those areas and what assurances do we have of compatibility on the project boundaries? MS. WATTS: On the west side of the property, there is, as you can see, all reserves or lakes. And, in addition, there's a 60-foot-wide FDOT drainage easement. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Which is always a beauty to look at when you have those '-MS. WATTS: We're hoping to make it look a little better, but from a -- from a distance standpoint, that is in place. On the northern boundary, there is over 50 percent of the property which is left in its natural preserve. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. And my -- my only concern is that those that border immediately on the boundary of the property that will be adjacent to single-family mimic those development standards within, you know, 50 or 100 feet of the property line. And, again, just perimeter compatibility is -- MS. WATTS: Sure. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- is -- is a concern. MS. WATTS: I understand that. Actually, on our more specific plan that we've been working on, we are showing single-family in that main PUD that goes to the north, although we have been looking at a multi-family product adjacent to U.S. 41. If you would like, we would be happy to include a stipulation into the PUD that says on the northern property line we would have a setback equal to RSF-4 on the north. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Can we -- And let me ask if this is acceptable, if we just state the developments that border the north and west project boundary shall mimic standards set forth in the RSF-4 zoning district within "X" number of feet of the property line -- I mean, whether that's 50 or 100. MR. NINO: If I might, Commissioner Hancock, what happens -- which -- which I can guarantee you is inevitable -- the owner of the RSF-4 land will be in here with a PUD rezoning in which there will be a mixed use residential project, and there is as great an opportunity that the north boundary of the Tarpon Cove will be -- will be -- find itself sitting adjacent to proposed to build muliple-family dwelling units. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Do you find the same environmental constraints immediately to the north that this parcel has? MS. WATTS: Yes. I -- I can comment on that. The wetlands extend to the north and to the west as well as to the southeast on the -- COHHISSIONER HANCOCK: We can anticipate cjustering regardless? MS. WATTS: Absolutely. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. I -- I'll -- I'll withdraw my -- my request then. That -- That makes sense. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Let me -- Let me ask Mr. Nino one question. Does this action -- Would this action increase the allowable density at all? MR. NINO: No, it doesn't. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: It does not. Does it actually reduce it? MR. NINO: No, it doesn't. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Actually, by one-thousandth of a CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: It's 3.9987. HS. WATTS: It's -- It's the same. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Essentially the same. Any other questions? Is there a motion? COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I move approval of the item. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Second. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have a motion and a second to approve PUD-95-11 with the stipulations, I presume. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Yes, ma'am. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: And the included stipulation that Miss Watts has offered. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Actually, no. Commissioner Hancock withdrew that. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: That was agreed. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Yeah. I -- I think bordering -- The use of properties are going to find similar situations. So -- CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- they'll probably have a similar product regardless. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Fine. If there's no further discussion, all those in favor, please say aye. Opposed? Motion passes five to zero. MS. WATTS: Thank you very much. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. Item #1286 ORDINANCE 95-77 RE PETITION PUD-93-10(1), TOH KILLEN REPRESENTING LEAWOOD LAKES DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION, REQUESTING A REZONE FROM PUD TO PUD FOR THE PURPOSES OF AMENDING THE LEAWOOD LAKES PUD FOR PROPERTY ON THE SOUTH SIDE OF RADIO ROAD EAST OF AIRPORT-PULLING ROAD - ADOPTED Next item on the agenda is item 12(B)(6), petition PUD-93-10, first amendment. Mr. Bellows. MR. BELLOWS: For the record, Ray Bellows, current planning staff, presenting petition PUD-93-10-1. Tom Killen representing Leawood Lakes, requesting to amend the PUD document to reduce the front yard setback from 20 feet to 15 feet and to allow for attached townhouses as a permitted dwelling type. As you can see, the subject site is located on the south side of Radio Road, and it's in between a mobile home park and Foxfire PUD to the west. The petitioner's also requesting to amend the PUD master plan to move tracts F and H to the south end of the lot -- of the project. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: The result of that would be what? MR. BELLOWS: Well, they wanted to put their recreational tract in front. Originally it was approved in the center of the master plan. It didn't work out that way, so they want it up front at the entrance, and there wasn't enough room with those tracts there. The environmental staff recommended to move the tracts F and H to the back and preserve the land there. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Thank you. MR. BELLOWS: The front yard setback reduction is required to allow for an increased size of the garage to meet the minimum FHA requirements. The 15-foot setback is also the same as provided in the Moon Lake PUD to the south. The Collier County Planning Commission reviewed this petition on November 16, and they recommended approval by an eight-to-zero vote. No letters have been received for or against this petition. Staff is also recommending approval of this petition. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay. Commissioner Constantine. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Does this affect -- and if so, how -- the affordable housing portion -- MR. BELLOWS: It has no effect on -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Okay. MR. BELLOWS: -- the affordable housing. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Thank you. MR. BELLOWS: They're still subject to their original agreement. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Commissioner Hancock. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Mr. Bellows, what's the name of the project immediately to the east, to the right on that? MR. BELLOWS: The mobile home park? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Yeah. Do you know the name of that project? MR. BELLOWS: I don't recall offhand. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I'm just trying to remember if -- I -- I drove on some -- into some of those areas after the floods, and they were inundated pretty heavily, and I just -- just, again, more a curiosity if this was a problem area or not. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I think it's Naples Mobile Estates, I believe. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. I don't remember them being -- Okay. Just a point of information. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Petitioner have anything to add? MR. KILLEN: Yes, please. My name is Tom Killen, and I'm an architect here in town. I was called in on this project after the project was completed, infrastructure was nearly finished. At that time the developer who had never done a subdivision who had hired an engineer who had never done a subdivision asked me to put an entry level home on the lot. Well, after I found out that the construction envelope was the average of 37 and a half feet by 45 feet and wanted a two-car garage, that equates to about 1,600 -- or less than 1,600 square feet, and we were able to come up with a 1,400-square-foot, two-story entry level home with a master bedroom down. It was actually a cute little house, 1,400 square feet. And then the question was asked, can we make any revisions to this, can we add here, and I said no. We -- We've got this thing as snugged in here as tight as we can get it, extremely snug. And later I found out that 40 -- some 40 of these lots had a ten-foot sewer easement, and the engineer, rather than split the property line with the easement, put the easement all on one -- one tract or another. So I had lots in there -- 45-foot lots with ten-foot easements. Now, that made the home smaller than that. So that -- that exceeded the setback of seven and a half feet on one side. So to -- actually we're trying to just kind of rework this thing -- and it might be a blessing in disguise with the -- the easement situation, and if they were having some problems with the affordable housing, getting these numbers to work with -- with restrictions we had, by taking the 40 lots and making these duplex or attached homes, I think they can successfully do what they've committed to do on the affordable housing. And by moving the setback forward some five feet and a little re -- little re -- reprieval on the back for an enclosed structure and so forth on the rear toward the lake, I think we can give them a little -- little nicer product and help them solve other problems out there. If you have any questions, I will be -- I'll try to answer them. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Any questions for the petitioner? Mr. Weigel, are there speakers? MR. WEIGEL: No. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: I'll close the public hearing. COMHISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Madam Chairman, motion to approve petition PUD-93-10, amendment one. COMHISSIONER NORRIS: Second. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have a motion and a second to approve petition PUD-93-10-1. There's no further discussion. All in favor, please say aye. Opposed? Motion passes five to zero. Thank you. Item #12C2 RESOLUTION 95-691 RE PETITION SNR-95-4, GARY BUTLER REPRESENTING REPUBLIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION, REQUESTING A STREET NAME CHANGE FOR THAT PORTION OF BRIARWOOD BOULEVARD RUNNING EAST-WEST BETWEEN BRIARWOOD BOULEVARD AND THE EAST BOUNDARY TO BE NAMED VINTAGE LANE IN THE BRIARWOOD PUD, UNIT THREE - ADOPTED WITH STIPULATION Next item on the agenda is item 12(C)(2), petition SNR-95-4. Mr. Bellows. MR. BELLOWS: Again, Ray Bellows, current planning staff, presenting petition SNR-95-4. Gary Butler, representing Republic Development Corporation, requesting a street name change for that portion of Briarwood Boulevard running east to west to the PUD boundary to be named Vintage Lane. Basically Briarwood Boulevard was originally planned to come around and loop around. This portion is continued to be called Briarwood Boulevard; this portion, Vintage Lane. This amendment will change this entire segment to Vintage Lane. COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: I have a question for the county attorney. This isn't administrative? This requires board approval? This isn't an addressing department concern or something? Why does this have to come to the board to change a street name? MR. WEIGEL: It currently does. And, in fact -- Harjorie, correct me, but I think it even requires a simple majority vote. MS. STUDENT: Majority. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Can I suggest that would be something that we look at perhaps modifying? Because that seems to be a little absurd. MS. STUDENT: It's an independent -- It's an independent ordinance. It's not in the land code -- development code or anything. I'd want to look at the underlying rationale -- COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Please. MS. STUDENT: -- before it coming to the board. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Believe it or not, we have actually had a couple that were controversial over -- CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Yes, we have. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: -- the last couple of years, and I think that's probably the only reason why. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: COHMISSIONER NORRIS: hearing. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: have speakers? MR. WEIGEL: No. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Is there a motion? COHMISSIONER NORRIS: COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: approve -- COMMISSIONER NORRIS: CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: COMMISSIONER NORRIS: Commissioner Norris. I was just saying close the public Close the public hearing? Do we I'll close the public hearing. Motion to approve. Second. We have a motion and a second to Excuse me. -- SNR-95-4. Motion to approve subject to the applicant bearing all costs associated with the placement of any required street signage. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: The second accept that? Certainly. Okay. Fine. We have a motion to approve with the applicant being responsible for all associated costs of street signage. Is that -- COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Yes. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: -- correct? Okay. If there's no further discussion, all in favor please say aye. Opposed? Motion passes five to zero. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: And it's a done deal. Item #12C3 RESOLUTION 95-692 AUTHORIZING SUBHISSION OF AN APPLICATION TO THE DEPT. OF COHMUNITY AFFAIRS FOR COHMUNITY DEVELOPMENT BLOCK GRANT FUNDS TO ASSIST WITH WATER, SANITARY SEWER, STORM DRAINAGE AND STREET IMPROVEMENTS IN SHELLABARGER MOBILE HOME PARK AND A PORTION OF BULLARD SUBDIVISION (IHMOKALEE) - ADOPTED CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Next item on the agenda is 12(C)(3). This is an item that we've added back on. It's a request to approve a resolution on a grant. MR. COOK: Good afternoon. Ron Cook, senior planner from the housing department. This item is a public hearing for a CDBG grant application. I see questions. Do we not have documents in the agenda? COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Not in the packet. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: This is an add-on. MR. COOK: I have some extra copies here. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: The document looks like this. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Thanks. Here we go. MR. COOK: It was inadvertently taken off and then added back on during the interim there. There's about three things we need to accomplish. We need to get public input on the grant application and the projects involved. We need to get board direction to go ahead and complete the application, submit it to Tallahassee. We need to get board authorization for the county manager to be able to sign the grant application and any other paper work involved for the continuation of the grant. This is a $750,000 community development block grant that requires no matching funds by the Board of County Commissioners. There's two projects in the Immokalee area which we've targeted. One is in conjunction with Habitat for Humanity providing infrastructure on their new subdivision off Little League Road. There's water facilities, sewer facilities, drainage, street paving, sidewalks, and a fire hydrant. Total cost of this is about $140,000. The other project that is targeted is in conjunction with the Immokalee water and sewer district. It's another infrastructure project. It's an unplatted subdivision off Immokalee Drive. There's sewer facilities, drainage facilities, and paving the streets. The total cost is 500 and -- Let's see. It's $560,000 which includes almost $100,000 for engineering, surveying, and permitting. There's an additional $54,000 that the board will retain from the grant funds to administer the grant project. If you have any questions, I'd be happy to answer them for you. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Sounds worthy to me. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: This is our annual $750,000 available CDBG grant. MR. COOK: Actually, it's more like a biannual. By the time you get it in to do the project and finish it, you've missed one funding. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: And we're -- we're confident that this is enough money to do all this work laid out, that we're not going to run into problems similar to Copeland where we had a million dollar project and $600,000 to do it? MR. COOK: No, ma'am. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay. MR. COOK: This has been looked at very closely by Boyle Engineering and also Habitat. I feel very comfortable that we'll be able to do the projects with the grant funding, get in, get out, and reapply. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay. Are there speakers, Mr. Weigel? MR. WEIGEL: I won't comment on speakers, but I did have one question for Mr. Cook in regard to this. The resolution that's before you had been reviewed and approved by the county attorney office, and it's fine, but in as much as this project area purports to be an area in and around Immokalee -- I think you mentioned something to this effect -- is the Immokalee water and sewer district also involved in making application or endorsing or somehow coordinating this -- this application in as much as water and sewer services are their province as an independent district? MR. COOK: The Immokalee water and sewer district is not making application for grant funding. They're involved to ensure that the sewer lines that are going to be put in meet the specifications, and they will be the ultimate benefactor, for want of a better word, for the flows coming from the subdivision. MR. WEIGEL: Will they become the ultimate owner of the facilities that are installed? MR. COOK: Normally a utilities division doesn't like to accept lines -- internal lines in a subdivision like this. That's going to be up to Immokalee water and sewer district. MR. WEIGEL: Right. Okay. I just wanted the record to reflect that we had the inquiry, and apparently it's been answered. Thank you. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Okay. Are there speakers? There are no speakers. I'll close the public hearing. Is there-- COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Motion to approve. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Second. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Second. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have a motion and a second to approve the petition as laid out by staff. Any further discussion? All in favor, please say aye. Opposed? Motion passes five to zero. Thank you, Mr. Cook. Item #13A1 RESOLUTION 95-693 RE PETITION CU-95-17, RICHARD D. YOVANOVICH OF YOUNG, VANASSENDERP & VARNADOE, P.A., REPRESENTING JOHN EBERT REQUESTING A CONDITIONAL USE "17" (GOLF DRIVING RANGE) AND "19" (SPORTS INSTRUCTIONAL SCHOOL) OF THE "A" RURAL AGRICULTURAL ZONING DISTRICT FOR PROPERTY LOCATED AT THE SOUTHEAST CORNER OF PINE RIDGE ROAD AND LIVINGSTON ROAD - ADOPTED WITH STIPULATIONS Next item on the agenda is 13(A)(1), petition CU-95-17. Mr. Nino. MR. NINO: Ron Nino, for the record. This petition seeks conditional use approval for a golf instructional -- for a driving range, golf driving range, and golf instructional school facilities with some classrooms, offices, and supporting building infrastructure. The property is currently zoned agricultural. The future land use plan provides for the granting of conditional uses, any urban residential designated area; therefore, from a FLUE point of view, this conditional use is consistent with the FLUE. Evaluation for other GHP relationships and consistency advised that the granting of this petition and its infrastructure relationships to highway capacity conditions, access management, open space, conservation would all be consistent with those elements of the Growth Management Plan. This petition was reviewed by the EAB, and they recommended approval subject to the conditions, many of -- all of which appear within the resolution of adoption. There are conditions A through H. So there are a substantial number of conditions. A substantial number of them address the applicant's responsibility with respect to Livingston Road and Pine Ridge Road, and those are all as recommended by your transportation director. And, as I indicated, the environmental concerns are always recommended by the Environmental Advisory Board. The Planning Commission heard this petition and unanimously eight to nothing recommended approval. The -- There were no -- There was -- I'm sorry. There was a letter of objection which you have in your -- in your executive package. I trust you've all read that letter. We also had a person at the meeting who indicated that they would like their cows fenced in. The cows reside to the southeast portion of the property, and as you'll note on the master plan, the southeast portion of the master plan is a preserve area, an area that has to be preserved. So there is, in fact, a natural vegetation separation between the contiguous property and the actual landing spot of errant golfers. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: You called? MR. NINO: Errant golfers. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Did you answer? MR. NINO: The petition -- The petition is as recommended, and -- and we're ready to answer any questions you might have. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Commissioner Hancock. MR. NINO: Let me -- Let me for the record point out, however, that there is a wording change on page 21 of your agenda page in that the wording of item F in the last sentence where it reads, "portion of the right turn lane that will provide access to the property," we'd like to change that to,"portion of the right turn lane constructed for the sole purpose of providing access to the property." So we ask you to allow us to add the words, "constructed for the sole purpose of providing" to that last sentence. Additionally, I would have you appreciate that while the master plan iljustrates a building of 3,000 square feet, it is the intent of the developer to build a larger building on the property than 3,000 square feet. I believe it's 3,500 square feet, and we don't have a problem -- staff doesn't have a problem with that, but that was not a matter that was before the Planning Commission. I don't know that it has any tremendous significance. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Constantine. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: sorry. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: answered it, and then -- COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: of operation and shielding. Any other questions? Commissioner I think -- Oh, did you have more? I'm I never got mine. I thought you asked it, and he Nope. -- started on another one. Mr. Nino, talk to me about hours HR. NINO: The property will be shielded from any possible ball striking -- COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I'm sorry. MR. NINO: -- Livingston Road -- COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I'm sorry. I'm talking about light shielding. MR. NINO: Oh, light shielding. I believe we have a provision here that light shielding will be directed immediately downward, special kind of lights standards that have to -- that don't glare on adjacent property. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. Did we address hours of operation yet? MR. NINO: I don't believe we addressed the hours of operation. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: We will today and -- Can I assume Mr. Ebert will be sending his -- MR. NINO: Mr. Yovanovich is here. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- his televised syndicated show all over the world from this location? MR. NINO: Mr. Yovanovich may want to -- may want to comment. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Hours of operation? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Just -- Just -- Yeah, we're looking for hours of operation. We typically on these driving ranges have been putting hours of operation on them so that, you know, the -- the future neighbors have some level of comfort. MR. YOVANOVICH: Sure. For the record, Rich Yovanovich, representing John Ebert. I want to clarify one thing. The lighting, to address that issue, will be ground lighting so there's very little chance that it can spill onto the adjacent properties. So it will be focusing up instead of out. On the hours of operation, we -- we -- we've requested 7 a.m. To 11 p.m., recognizing that this is going to cater to the -- the more serious golfer and also to the family so that people have a place to go after dinner to get lessons from John and -- COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: The family's out golfing at 10:45 at night? MR. YOVANOVICH: 10:45, right, actually but -- Late lessons for those people who work to address that. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Commissioner Hancock, maybe your memory is better than mine. It seems to me we did 10 p.m. on Radio Road. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Yeah. 10 p.m. Has kind of been the standard. Does the petitioner have a difficulty with that? MR. YOVANOVICH: We can live with that. COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: I just want to be consistent. MR. VARNADOE: For the record, George Varnadoe. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: This requires some expertise, Mr. Varnadoe? MR. VARNADOE: Not at all. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Ten o'clock to 11 o'clock? COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: John, are you paying for both these guys? COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Don't do it. MR. VARNADOE: Not at all. But I think we have a little different situation than the one that's on Radio Road or the one that's on 951. The one along 951 is right on the road parallel. I can see it being a problem. This one is 18 acres, and you can see we have extensive buffers. We've tried to set everything back into the project where we'd allow Mr. Ebert -- I have a hard time with that. Excuse me. It's John -- to have a little longer hours of operation for the schooling that he's going to be carry -- carrying on there. So I would ask your indulgence on that -- on that point, but I do recognize that you have been in your -- in the last two at least, you've been cutting them off at 10 p.m. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: When Commissioner Hancock asked the question if 10 p.m. Was fine, Mr. Ebert said -- COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Said yes. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: -- Yes, no problem. So I'm assuming that that's no problem. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I want to be -- I want to be consistent. I understand the configuration and quality differences. I -- I just would like to be consistent with this type of use because we really don't know what development is going to occur around it in five years and -- COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: I agree with that. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: So I -- I'm going to request that we maintain it at ten o'clock. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I had a different question. Mr. Nino, I assume that we've taken into consideration all of the construction activity that would be taking place on Livingston and that this won't impact it at all or that we won't find ourselves buying property? MR. NINO: No. A specific provision was made in the conditions to make sure that we don't incur any -- any business disruption cost. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Thank you. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: And how are we protecting those cows again? MR. YOVANOVICH: They're already fenced in. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: A natural fence. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Keeping me off the range. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Putting helmets on them? CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Actually, we'll -- we'll -- we'll build a wire cage around them. Mr. Dotrill, are there speakers? MR. DORRILL: No, ma'am. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: I'll close the public hearing. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Madam Chairman, motion to approve conditional use 95-17 with one stipulation about hours of operation of 7 a.m. To 10 p.m. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Mr. Nino had also asked for change within the development order. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: There was a change within the wording there. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Yeah. Change within the wording. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Well, allow me to amend my motion to include that. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: I will second that. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Darn. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have a motion and a second to approve CU-95-17 with the change stipulated by Mr. Nino and the stipulated hours of operation, 7 a.m. to 10 p.m. Any further discussion? All those in favor, please say aye. Opposed? There being none, motion passes five to zero. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I'll represent you when you file the complaint. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Yeah. And I'll help you do your tax work when you win it. Mr. Varnadoe just offered to defend you. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: How appropriate. Item #13B1 RESOLUTION 95-694 RE PETITION CU-94-20 REQUESTING A FIRST EXTENSION OF CONDITIONAL USE FOR PROPERTY LOCATED ON BAILEY LANE WEST OF AIRPORT ROAD, MIDWAY BETWEEN PINE RIDGE ROAD AND GOLDEN GATE PARKWAY - ADOPTED CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Let's move on. Item -- Next item is 13(B)(1) relating to petition CU-94-20, the first extension of conditional use. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Mr. Nino, is this a simple extension? MR. NINO: Yes, it is. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Nothing else involved? MR. NINO: Yes, it is. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Speakers? MR. DORRILL: No speakers. MR. NINO: Nothing else. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Close the public hearing. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Madam Chairman, motion to approve the item. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Second. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Second. Third. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We have a motion and a second to approve an extension of CU-94-20. Any further discussion? All in favor, please say aye. Opposed? Motion passes five to zero. Item #14 BCC COMHUNICATIONS I believe that concludes our agenda for the day. We are at communications. Commissioner Norris. COMMISSIONER NORRIS: Yes. Just one quick item, Madam Chairman. I had circulated this letter that I received following a conversation I had with Mr. VanBuskirk of the Big Cypress Basin Board. He suggested that we get all parties related together and have a serious discussion on improving the Lely drainage area with funding from multiple sources. I think it's a great idea. What I ask to do is just simply to direct staff to take a look at this letter and try to organize a meeting where we could all get together with these parties that are listed here. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Sounds good to me. COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: Can I just -- A little irony. I mean, that's exactly -- Part -- It's a very large part of what I had asked us to do at a January workshop. So I don't care if we do it at a workshop. I -- I would ask, though, if you would be willing to expand the discussion to a countywide discussion instead of just the Lely area. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Oh, no, you don't. Here comes the utility again. I hear it sneaking back into the discussion. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Come on. We just can have a full discussion about the Collier countywide needs. COMMISSIONER NORRIS: The difference is this is not anticipated to be a workshop. This is anticipated to be an action meeting to try to decide how we're going to do this -- how we're going to approach this project. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Have you seen the -- Valetie Boyd was kind enough to provide a draft of an agenda of a meeting that she was hoping that we could have. COMHISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Didn't we have this discussion once before? COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: No. I don't think you've seen the agenda, Commissioner Constantine. COMHISSIONER CONSTANTINE: You just asked if we had seen it. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I haven't heard your answer to the question. Have you seen it? COMHISSIONER CONSTANTINE: No. COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: I didn't think so. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Is it substantively different than what you explained to us two weeks ago? COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Back to Commissioner Norris' request -- COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: hazing. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Great idea, John. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: I think it's a good idea, Commissioner Norris. I'd like to ask Mr. Dotrill, though, one question. We had a meeting with Mr. VanBuskirk and John Boldt on the plan, basin plan. Have you and Mr. VanBuskirk been able to get together to try to find a way to accelerate that? MR. DORRILL: I have not heard back from him, but I'll -- I'll call him this week. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. I appreciate that. Commissioner Hancock, anything else? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I feel a need for a quick comment. Something in today's paper mentioned millions to fix the mangrove system. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: I read that. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I want to remind or just express to this board that I don't have any recollection of the task force talking about the millions it would take -- It may be millions. It may be thousands. We don't know yet. So I just take a little exception with that headline today and wanted to express to you that we're not -- I haven't seen anything that's talking about millions at this point. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: You're asking -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Other than the paper. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: -- us to keep an open mind. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Well, I would assume you would anyway, but I -- I just felt that -- I read that, and I thought, this is going to cause a stir. So -- So far we're not talking about millions. We're -- We're still talking about remedies and associated costs, and we really don't know where it's going at this point. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. Commissioner Hac'Kie. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Just a question for Mr. Weigel, if he had any success in his discussion on the St. Matthews House grant application. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: You were out. Yes, he -- Yes, he did, and they're awarding the grant today. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Okay. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: So there's not much else to do. COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: Okay. Sorry. I missed that. That's all. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Commissioner Constantine. COMHISSIONER CONSTANTINE: The landfill citizens advisory committee had their marathon meeting on Saturday, and after four rounds of the group -- nominal group technique -- sorry -- came up with a weighted list of priorities that virtually everyone was happy with, ranging from the environmental representatives to the residents that live nearby out there and everyone in between so -- COMHISSIONER HANCOCK: Otherwise known as the panthers versus people debate. COMHISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Yeah. It was about an eight-hour meeting but very, very productive. The intent of the committee is to -- the -- The paid consultant types will be applying all the weighted criteria between now and January seeing what sites fit that, and then they'll come back and review the whole thing with this board in January before moving on with the next step. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Otherwise known as success as we move forward. COMHISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Yeah. Going very well. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: I don't have anything to add today. Mr. Dorrill, do you have anything? MR. DORRILL: Just one thing. I had promised the board by January the proposed action agenda to go in conjunction with your five adopted goals for 1996, and we've completed that about three weeks early, and there are almost 250 identified projects that go into one of either your five or an additional column that I added that we're calling the effective management of the organization, and I've sent that to you today, interoffice correspondence about three weeks early and will actually ask you to adopt that in January, but I wanted to give you plenty of time to look at it. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Thank you. Mr. Weigel. MR. WEIGEL: Just one item, and that is that late last week we received the opinion of the federal trial court in regard to the Colony Cablevision versus Collier County MCI case, the Marco cable case, and they found against Collier County, finding that the county had not followed its own ordinance in the application approval process for MCI. I have not had an opportunity to speak with Jennifer Edwards yet. I'll be talking with David Bryant and probably Mr. Gastin on behalf of MCI and will come back next week with a recommendation as to whether I would request the board authorize an appeal or not. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: And you'll let us know further next week on that? MR. WEIGEL: By no later than next week. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: By no later than next week. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I have a question on that. Sorry. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Commissioner Mac'Kie. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: The net effect of that ruling, as I have heard about it, is that Marco Island's cable service has to be changed significantly -- I mean, that it's not authorized? It wasn't done in -- What was the net effect? Just give us the facts of -- MR. WEIGEL: You're -- You're approaching it with your last statements. It, therefore, is not authorized; that the approval of the Board of County Commissioners is a nullity in essence. COHHISSIONER MAC'KIE: MR. WEIGEL: Exactly. COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Turn off the cable on Marco. I thought that I'd make that -- So used to winning. Darn. We're still winning. Every time we hear a report from -- from Mr. Weigel in the last few months, it's been, "We won again." COHMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Darn. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: Yeah. We've gotten used to hearing that. Miss Filson, we're finished? MR. WEIGEL: Thank you. MS. FILSON: We're finished. CHAIRPERSON MATTHEWS: We're adjourned. ***** Commissioner Hancock moved, seconded by Commissioner Constantine, and carried unanimously, that the following items under the consent agenda be approved and/or adopted: ***** Item #16A1 LETTER OF CREDIT AS SECURITY FOR EXCAVATION PERMIT NO 59.553 "BRIARWOOD, UNIT THREE", LOCATED IN SECTION 31, T49S, R26E See Pages Item #16A2A RESOLUTION 95-673 RE LIEN RESOLUTION FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO. 20220-018; OWNER OF RECORD - NOREEN A. CONNOR See Pages Item #16A2B RESOLUTION 95-674 RE LIEN RESOLUTION FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO 50509-075; OWNER OF RECORD - HARIO H. BURNETT See Pages Item #16A2C RESOLUTION 95-675 RE LIEN RESOLUTION FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO 50518-065; OWNER OF RECORD - THE NEW YORK TIMES CO. See Pages Item #16A2D RESOLUTION 95-676 RE LIEN RESOLUTION FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO 50524-034; OWNER OF RECORD - BRIAN MILLER See Pages Item #16A2E RESOLUTION 95-677 RE LIEN RESOLUTION FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO 50615-058; OWNER OF RECORD - JACQUELIN ANNE EICHEN See Pages Item #16A2F RESOLUTION 95-678 RE LIEN RESOLUTION FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO 50629-002; OWNER OF RECORD - EDWARD J. & LAVERDA PELC See Pages Item #16A2G RESOLUTION 95-679 RE LIEN RESOLUTION FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO 50630-016; OWNER OF RECORD - HINDY A. JORDAN See Pages Item #16A2H RESOLUTION 95-680 RE LIEN RESOLUTION FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO 50703-012; OWNER OF RECORD - ADELA HIAZGA See Pages Item #16A2I RESOLUTION 95-681 RE LIEN RESOLUTION FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO 50711-026; OWNER OF RECORD - PHILLIP PIERRE, HENDRICK MATTHEW See Pages Item #16A2J RESOLUTION 95-682 RE LIEN RESOLUTION FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE NO. 50711-057; OWNER OF RECORD - PHILLIP PIERRE, HENDRICK MATTHEW See Pages Item #16A3 SATISFACTION OF LIEN FOR PUBLIC NUISANCE RESOLUTION 95-79; FOR PROPERTY DESCRIBED AS LOT 1, BLOCK 12 - OWNER OF RECORD - DAVID DELP See Pages Item #16A4 SATISFACTION OF LIEN FOR PUBLIC NUISANCE RESOLUTION 94-472; FOR property DESCRIBED AS LOT 14, BLOCK 198; - OWNER OF RECORD - GEORGE FACCONE, TRUSTEE See Pages Item #16A5 SATISFACTION OF LIEN FOR PUBLIC NUISANCE RESOLUTION 95-80; FOR PROPERTY DESCRIBED AS LOT 10, BLOCK 48 - OWNER OF RECORD - BEVERLY D'AQUANNI See Pages Item #16A6 SATISFACTION OF LIEN FOR PUBLIC NUISANCE RESOLUTION 89-71; FOR PROPERTY DESCRIBED AS LOT 35, BLOCK B - OWNER OF RECORD - WILLIAM L. HcDANIEL See Pages Item #16A7 FINAL PLAT OF "REPLAT OF PART OF WIGGINS BAY, PHASE 1" Item #16A8 FINAL PLAT OF "PROGRESS/COHMERCIAL PARK" Item #16A9 CASH BOND FOR SEWER FACILITIES ACCEPTANCE FOR GREY OAKS, UNIT SIX, PHASE ONE O. R. Book Pages Item #16A10 RESOLUTION 95-683 RE FINAL PLAT OF "LAKESIDE APARTHENTS SUBDIVISION" See Pages Item #16All WATER AND SEWER FACILITIES ACCEPTANCE FOR LONGSHORE LAKES, PHASE 5 B-1 O. R. Book Pages Item #16A12 CASH BOND FOR WATER FACILITIES ACCEPTANCE FOR PINE AIR LAKES, PHASE ONE-A O. R. Book Pages Item #16B1 - This item moved to Item #887 Item #1682 CONTRACT AMENDMENT NO. 1 TO ITS AGREEMENT WITH ENVIRONMENTAL CARE, INC. FOR THE GROUNDS MAINTENANCE ON MARCO ISLAND BID NO. 95-2418, AND AUTHORIZE A NEW TEN PERCENT (10e) CHANGE ORDER LIMIT FOR FURTURE CHANGE ORDERS See Pages Item #1683 YARD WASTE PROCESSING SERVICES AT THE NAPLES AND IHMOKALEE LANDFILLS AS PROVIDED UNDER THE LANDFILL OPERATING AGREEMENT WITH WASTE MANAGEMENT OF FLORIDA, INC. Item #1684 REFUND OF AN OVERPAYMENT OF ROAD IMPACT FEES IN THE AMOUNT OF $8,126.69 FOR ROYAL PALM, BUILDERS FOR THE REMOVAL OF EXCESS FILL MATERIAL FROM THE BREAKWATER PROJECT IN PELICAN BAY Item #1685 MAINTENANCE RESPONSIBILITY FOR THE WINTER PARK OUTLET/GLADES DRAINAGE DITCH Item #1686 AWARD BID #95-2454 TO CALCIQUEST, INC. FOR ORTHOPHOSHATE/POLYPHOSPHATE Item #1687 - This item has been deleted Item #1688 AWARD BID #95-2440 TO ASTOR CHEMICAL CO. AS PRIMARY BIDDER FOR CARBON DIOXIDE IN THE AMOUNT OF $19,630.00 Item #1689 BUDGET AMENDMENTS TO TRANSFER FUNDS WITHIN THE WATER DEPARTMENT TO ESTABLISH A NEW COST CENTER Item #16B10 FY95 FUNDING FOR COMPLETION OF WATER DEPARTMENT MAINTENANCE PROJECTS INITIATED IN FY95 Item #16Bll CORRIDOR PLAN FOR THE PROPOSED LIVINGSTON ROAD (RADIO ROAD TO IHMOKALEE ROAD), AND DIRECT STAFF TO CONDUCT PUBLIC WORKSHOPS AND ISSUE OF A PUBLIC NOTICE Item #16B12 AWARD BID #95-2446 TO HORVATH ELECTRIC MOTORS FOR PUMPS AND MOTORS, PARTS AND REPAIRS Item #16B13 CONTINUE THE USE OF BIOXIDE FOR CONTROL OF HYDROGEN SULFIDE ODOR Item #16B14 - This item has been deleted Item #16B15 CONSTRUCTION FOUR LARGE METERS Item #16C1 - This item moved to #8C3 Item #16C2 RESOLUTION 95-684 RE REVISED COLLIER COUNTY PUBLIC LIBRARY FINES AND FEES SCHEDULE See Pages Item #16D1 CHANGES TO THE COLLIER COUNTY GROUP HEALTH INSURANCE PLAN Item #16D2 AWARD BID NO. 95-2453 TO TWO APPRAISAL FIRMS FOR THE APPRAISAL OF GOLDEN GATE ESTATES LAND TRUST PROPERTIES Item #16D3 - This item has been deleted Item #16D4 WORK ORDER #BSW-96-4 UNDER THE ANNUAL AGREEMENT FOR PROFESSIONAL ARCHITECTURAL SERVICES RELATED TO THE ADDITION TO THE GENERAL SERVICES BUILDING (BUILDING W) See Pages Item #16D5 LEASE AGREEMENT BETWEEN BIG CORKSCREW ISLAND FIRE CONTROL & RESCUE DISTRICT AND COLLIER COUNTY FOR UTILIZATION OF A PORTION OF FIRE STATION NUMBER TEN TO BE USED BY THE EMERGENCY MEDICAL SERVICES DEPARTMENT Item #16D6 See Pages PURCHASE OF A SOFTWARE SYSTEM FOR THE BILLING OF AMBULANCE TRANSPORTS, AND AUTHORIZE THE NECESSARY BUDGET AMENDMENTS Item #16D7 BUDGET AMENDMENTS NECESSARY TO COMPLETE THE PURCHASE OF SOFTWARE AND HARDWARE FOR THE SOLID WASTE MANDATORY COLLECTION AND DISPOSAL SPECIAL ASSESSMENT Item #16D8 SATISFACTION OF CLAIM OF LIEN See Pages Item #16D9 SATISFACTIONS OF NOTICE OF PROMISE TO PAY AND AGREEMENT TO EXTEND PAYMENT OF SEWER SYSTEM IMPACT FEES See Pages Item #16D10 RESOLUTION 95-695 RE CERTIFICATES OF CORRECTION TO THE 1991 SOLID WASTE COLLECTION AND DISPOSAL SPECIAL ASSESSMENT ROLL, AUTHORIZE THE CHAIRMAN TO SIGN THE CERTIFICATES ON BEHALF OF THE BOARD OF COUNTY COHMISSIONERS, AND AUTHORIZE REFUNDS AS APPROPRIATE See Pages Item #16Dll CERTIFICATES OF CORRECTION TO THE 1994 AND 1995 SOLID WASTE COLLECTION AND DISPOSAL SPECIAL ASSESSMENT ROLL, AUTHORIZE THE CHAIRMAN TO SIGN THE CERTIFICATES ON BEHALF OF THE BOARD OF COUNTY COHMISSIONERS, AND AUTHORIZE REFUNDS AS APPROPRIATE See Pages Item #16D12 RESOLUTION 95-685 AND RESOLUTION 95-686 APPROVING CERTIFICATES OF CORRECTION TO THE 1992 AND 1993 SOLID WASTE COLLECTION AND DISPOSAL SPECIAL ASSESSMENT ROLL, AUTHORIZE THE CHAIRMAN TO SIGN THE CERTIFICATES ON BEHALF OF THE BOARD OF COUNTY COHMISSIONERS, AND AUTHORIZE REFUNDS AS APPROPRIATE See Pages Item #16El BUDGET ~MENDMENTS 96-119, 96-122 ~ND 96-126 Item #16G1 CERTIFICATES FOR CORRECTION TO THE TAX ROLLS AS PRESENTED BY THE PROPERTY APPRAISER'S OFFICE 1992 REAL PROPERTY TAX ROLL No. Date 206 11/01/95 1993 REAL PROPERTY TAX ROLL 229 11/01/95 232 11/20/95 233 11/20/95 234 11/27/95 1994 REAL PROPERTY TAX ROLL 185 11/01/95 187-188 11/20/95 192 11/27/95 1995 REAL PROPERTY TAX ROLL 26 11/01/95 94-96 11/14/95 97-98 11/17/95 115-116 11/20/95 119 11/27/95 120 11/22/95 123 11/27/95 126 11/21/95 128-129 11/28/95 133 11/28/95 134-136 11/29/95 1995 TANGIBLE PERSONAL PROPERTY 33 11/20/95 34-35 11/22/95 36 11/27/95 Item #1662 HISCELLANEOUS CORRESPONDENCE - FILED AND/OR REFERRED The following miscellaneous correspndence as presented by the Board of County Commissioners has been directed to the various departments as indicated: Item #1611 RESOLUTION 95-687 RE TRANSFER AND CONTROL OF CABLE TELEVISION FRANCHISE FROM FLORIDA CABLEVSION HANAGHENT CORPORATION TO TIME WARNER, INC. See Pages There being no further business for the good of the County, the meeting was adjourned by order of the Chair at 3:19 p.m. BOARD OF COUNTY COHMISSIONERS BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS/EX OFFICIO GOVERNING BOARD(S) OF SPECIAL DISTRICTS UNDER ITS CONTROL ATTEST: DWIGHT E. BROCK, CLERK BETTYE J. MATTHEWS, CHAIRPERSON These minutes approved by the Board on as presented or as corrected TRANSCRIPT PREPARED ON BEHALF OF DONOVAN COURT REPORTING BY: Barbara A. Donovan and Christine E. Whitfield