BCC Minutes 05/28/2019 RMay 28, 2019
Page 1
TRANSCRIPT OF THE MEETING OF THE
BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
Naples, Florida, May 28, 2019
LET IT BE REMEMBERED, that the Board of County
Commissioners, in and for the County of Collier, and also acting as
the Board of Zoning Appeals and as the governing board(s) of such
special districts as have been created according to law and having
conducted business herein, met on this date at 9:00 a.m., in
REGULAR SESSION in Building "F" of the Government Complex,
East Naples, Florida, with the following members present:
CHAIRMAN: William L. McDaniel, Jr.
Burt L. Saunders
Donna Fiala
Andy Solis
Penny Taylor
ALSO PRESENT:
Leo Ochs, County Manager
Nick Casalanguida, Deputy County Manager
Jeffrey A. Klatzkow, County Attorney
Crystal K. Kinzel, Clerk
Troy Miller, Communications & Customer Relations
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May 28, 2019
COLLIER COUNTY
Board of County Commissioners
Community Redevelopment Agency Board (CRAB)
Airport Authority
AGENDA
Board of County Commission Chambers
Collier County Government Center
3299 Tamiami Trail East, 3rd Floor
Naples, FL 34112
May 28, 2019
9:00 AM
Commissioner William L. McDaniel, Jr., District 5 - Chair; CRAB Co-Chair
Commissioner Burt Saunders, District 3 – Vice-Chair
Commissioner Donna Fiala, District 1; CRAB Co-Chair
Commissioner Andy Solis, District 2
Commissioner Penny Taylor, District 4
NOTICE: ALL PERSONS WISHING TO SPEAK ON AGENDA ITEMS MUST
REGISTER PRIOR TO PRESENTATION OF THE AGENDA ITEM TO BE
ADDRESSED. ALL REGISTERED SPEAKERS WILL RECEIVE UP TO THREE
(3) MINUTES UNLESS THE TIME IS ADJUSTED BY THE CHAIRMAN.
REQUESTS TO PETITION THE BOARD ON SUBJECTS WHICH ARE NOT ON
THIS AGENDA MUST BE SUBMITTED IN WRITING WITH EXPLANATION
TO THE COUNTY MANAGER AT LEAST 13 DAYS PRIOR TO THE DATE OF
THE MEETING AND WILL BE HEARD UNDER “PUBLIC PETITIONS.”
PUBLIC PETITIONS ARE LIMITED TO THE PRESENTER, WITH A
MAXIMUM TIME OF TEN MINUTES.
ANY PERSON WHO DECIDES TO APPEAL A DECISION OF THIS BOARD
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May 28, 2019
WILL NEED A RECORD OF THE PROCEEDING PERTAINING THERETO,
AND THEREFORE MAY NEED TO ENSURE THAT A VERBATIM RECORD
OF THE PROCEEDINGS IS MADE, WHICH RECORD INCLUDES THE
TESTIMONY AND EVIDENCE UPON WHICH THE APPEAL IS TO BE BASED.
COLLIER COUNTY ORDINANCE NO. 2003-53 AS AMENDED BY
ORDINANCE 2004-05 AND 2007-24, REQUIRES THAT ALL LOBBYISTS
SHALL, BEFORE ENGAGING IN ANY LOBBYING ACTIVITIES (INCLUDING
BUT NOT LIMITED TO, ADDRESSING THE BOARD OF COUNTY
COMMISSIONERS), REGISTER WITH THE CLERK TO THE BOARD AT THE
BOARD MINUTES AND RECORDS DEPARTMENT.
IF YOU ARE A PERSON WITH A DISABILITY WHO NEEDS ANY
ACCOMMODATION IN ORDER TO PARTICIPATE IN THIS PROCEEDING,
YOU ARE ENTITLED, AT NO COST TO YOU, THE PROVISION OF CERTAIN
ASSISTANCE. PLEASE CONTACT THE COLLIER COUNTY FACILITIES
MANAGEMENT DIVISION LOCATED AT 3335 EAST TAMIAMI TRAIL,
SUITE 1, NAPLES, FLORIDA, 34112-5356, (239) 252-8380; ASSISTED
LISTENING DEVICES FOR THE HEARING IMPAIRED ARE AVAILABLE IN
THE FACILITIES MANAGEMENT DIVISION.
LUNCH RECESS SCHEDULED FOR 12:00 NOON TO 1:00 P.M
1. INVOCATION AND PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE
A. Invocation by Pastor Greg Ball of Destiny Church Naples.
2. AGENDA AND MINUTES
A. Approval of today’s regular, consent and summary agenda as amended (ex
parte disclosure provided by commission members for consent agenda.)
B. This item continued from the May 14, 2019 BCC Meeting. Approval of
the April 23, 2019 - BCC Meeting Minutes
3. AWARDS AND RECOGNITIONS
A. EMPLOYEE
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1) 20 YEAR ATTENDEES
a) Shannon Darrow - Parks & Recreation
b) Joy Hancock - Communications & Customer Relations
c) Joe Penn - Wastewater
2) 25 YEAR ATTENDEES
3) 30 YEAR ATTENDEES
a) Jeff Walker - Risk Management
4) 35 YEAR ATTENDEES
B. ADVISORY BOARD MEMBERS
C. RETIREES
4. PROCLAMATIONS
A. Proclamation recognizing Naples Zoo at Caribbean Gardens as recipient of
the Waste Reduction Awards Program (WRAP) Award, for contributing to
the greater good of Collier County by advocating the "Reduce, Reuse,
Recycle" message, thereby helping to prolong the usable life of the Collier
County Landfill. To be accepted by Danielle Green, Director of Gardens &
Grounds, Naples Zoo at Caribbean Gardens.
B. Proclamation designating May 2019 as Drowning Prevention Month in
Collier County. To be accepted by representatives of the NCH Safe &
Healthy Children's Coalition: Paula DiGrigoli, Sue Lester, Konnie Purcell,
Annie Alvarez and Sam Molina.
5. PRESENTATIONS
A. Presentation by the South Florida Water Management District regarding the
Western Everglades Restoration Project (WERP). (All Districts)
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B. Presentation by the County's Emergency Management Director on the status
of Hurricane Irma recovery and after-action efforts and hurricane
preparedness for the upcoming season. (All Districts)
6. PUBLIC PETITIONS
7. PUBLIC COMMENTS ON GENERAL TOPICS NOT ON THE CURRENT
OR FUTURE AGENDA
8. BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS
9. ADVERTISED PUBLIC HEARINGS
10. BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
11. COUNTY MANAGER'S REPORT
A. Recommendation to exercise the second and final renewal option of the
Franchise Agreements for Solid Waste, Recyclable Materials, and Yard
Trash Collection Services with Waste Management Inc. of Florida, and
Waste Connections of Florida, Inc., for an additional term of seven years,
ending on September 30, 2027. (Kari Hodgson, Solid and Hazardous Waste
Management Division Director) (All Districts)
B. This item to be heard at 10:00 a.m. Recommendation to accept the offer
from Metro Commercial Development Group LLC in the amount of
$3,500,000 for the County-owned parcel located between Immokalee Road
and 4th Street Northeast (Randall Curve parcel) and authorize the County
Manager to negotiate a Developer Contribution Agreement with Immokalee
Road Rural Village for the development of a joint County and School
District project. (Toni A. Mott, Manager, Facilities Management Division)
(District 5)
C. Recommendation to provide staff direction on the Conservation Collier
Property Acquisition Strategy for future cycles. (Summer Araque, Principal
Environmental Specialist, Conservation Collier Coordinator, Parks and
Recreation Division) (All Districts)
D. Recommendation to authorize the creation of ten (10) additional Full-Time
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Equivalent positions in the Growth Management Department and purchase
fifteen (15) vehicles in response to increased customer demand. The
proposed positions will be funded with current user fee reserves, require no
additional fees; have no fiscal impact on the General Fund; and authorize all
necessary budget amendments. (James French, Growth Management Deputy
Department Head) (All Districts)
E. Recommendation to approve a Resolution amending the Collier County
Growth Management Department Development Services Fee Schedule, with
an effective date of October 1, 2019, decreasing fees by approximately
$335,000 annually. (James French, Growth Management Deputy
Department Head) (All Districts)
F. This item to be heard no sooner than 1:00 p.m. Reconsideration of Item
#11B from the March 26, 2019 BCC Meeting titled: Recommendation to
accept the report and suggestions from the Tourist Development Council for
next steps in regulating Short Term Vacation rentals in the unincorporated
area of Collier County. (Jack Wert, Tourism Division Director) (All
Districts)
G. This item to be heard no sooner than 1:00 p.m. This item has been
continued from the May 14, 2019 BCC meeting. Recommendation to
further discuss the adoption of a Resolution from the May 14, 2019 Board of
County Commissioners Meeting which would (1) repeal the existing
property assessment clean energy (PACE) program, replacing it with a new
PACE Program limited to commercial, industrial and multi-family rental
apartment buildings, and (2) approve a new standard form membership
agreement with PACE providers also limited to commercial, industrial and
multi-family rental apartment buildings to better protect the public by
providing for more restrictive or additional requirements not found in the
standard form membership agreement or any other applicable law. In
addition, recommendation to direct staff to (1) send written notice of
termination of all existing membership agreements with current PACE
Providers, and (2) offer the new standard form membership agreement to all
existing and other interested PACE Providers. (James French, Deputy
Department Head, GMD) (All Districts)
12. COUNTY ATTORNEY'S REPORT
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13. OTHER CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICERS
14. AIRPORT AUTHORITY AND/OR COMMUNITY REDEVELOPMENT
AGENCY
A. AIRPORT
B. COMMUNITY REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY
15. STAFF AND COMMISSION GENERAL COMMUNICATIONS
A. Proposed Future Workshop Schedule (All Districts)
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16. CONSENT AGENDA - All matters listed under this item are considered to be
routine and action will be taken by one motion without separate discussion of
each item. If discussion is desired by a member of the Board, that item(s) will
be removed from the Consent Agenda and considered separately.
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A. GROWTH MANAGEMENT DEPARTMENT
1) Recommendation to recognize and appropriate revenue to the Traffic
Operations cost center, in the amount of $107,380 for Fiscal Year
2019 and authorize all necessary Budget Amendments. (All Districts)
2) Recommendation to recognize and appropriate insurance proceeds
revenue to the Landscape Operations-Various In-House Segments
cost center (163801), in the amount of $81,000 for Fiscal Year 2019
and authorize all necessary Budget Amendments. (All Districts)
3) Recommendation to accept the findings of the "Traffic Report: Golf
Cart Transportation on Chokoloskee and Plantation Island" and to
direct the County Attorney to advertise for a public hearing an
Ordinance allowing for the use of golf carts upon designated public
roads and streets on Chokoloskee Island and on Plantation Island,
Collier County. (District 5)
4) Recommendation to approve a waiver in accordance with the
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guidelines set forth in the Advance Street Name Guidelines policy and
Resolution No. 2012-114 for the placement of advance street name
guide signs along Collier Boulevard at the approaches to Cedar
Hammock Boulevard. (District 3)
5) Recommendation to approve Change Order No. 1 with Jacobs
Engineering Group, Inc., (formerly CH2M Hill Engineers, Inc.), to
add 730 days to the project schedule for design and post-design
services on Project No. 66066.14, “Palm River Boulevard Bridge
Replacement.” (No additional funds are requested). (District 2)
6) Recommendation to accept a Multi-Way Stop Warrant Study and
approve the installation and operation of a 4-Way Stop control at the
intersection of Lely Resort Boulevard and Wildflower Way, at an
installation cost of approximately $400 with an annual maintenance
cost of approximately $100 (Cost Center 16360). (District 1)
7) Recommendation to approve final acceptance and the conveyance of
the potable water and sewer utility facilities for Coral Harbor Phase I,
PL20170000368 and to authorize the County Manager, or his
designee, to release the Final Obligation Bond in the total amount of
$4,000 to the Project Engineer or the Developer’s designated agent.
(District 1)
8) Recommendation to approve final acceptance and the conveyance of
the potable water and sewer utility facilities for Coral Harbor Phase II,
PL20170000914 and to authorize the County Manager, or his
designee, to release the Final Obligation Bond in the total amount of
$4,000 to the Project Engineer or the Developer’s designated agent.
(District 1)
9) Recommendation to approve final acceptance of the sewer facilities
for Waste Management Transfer Station, PL20180000285, accept the
conveyance of a portion of the sewer facilities, and to authorize the
County Manager, or his designee, to release the Utilities Performance
Security (UPS) and Final Obligation Bond in the total amount of
$6,839.44 to the Project Engineer or the Developer’s designated
agent. (District 4)
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10) Recommendation to approve final acceptance of the potable water and
sewer facilities for Avalon of Naples, PL20160002356, accept the
conveyance of a portion of the potable water and all of the sewer
facilities, and to authorize the County Manager, or his designee, to
release the Utilities Performance Security (UPS) and Final Obligation
Bond in the total amount of $75,061.39 to the Project Engineer or the
Developer’s designated agent. (District 3)
11) Recommendation to approve final acceptance of the potable water and
sewer facilities for Tract B at 3500 Corporate Plaza, PL20170003496,
accept the conveyance of a portion of the potable water facilities, and
to authorize the County Manager, or his designee, to release the
Utilities Performance Security (UPS) and Final Obligation Bond in
the total amount of $8,837.94 to the Project Engineer or the
Developer’s designated agent. (District 4)
12) This item requires that ex parte disclosure be provided by
Commission members. Should a hearing be held on this item, all
participants are required to be sworn in. Recommendation to
approve for recording the final plat of Brentwood Lakes – Phase One,
(Application Number PL20180001880) approval of the standard form
Construction and Maintenance Agreement and approval of the amount
of the performance security. (District 5)
13) Recommendation to approve the Second Amendment to the MPO
Lease Agreement and the Amended and Restated Staff Services
Agreement between Collier Metropolitan Planning Organization and
the Collier County Board of County Commissioners. (All Districts)
14) Recommendation to authorize proceeding with the final work
necessary for completion of the Vanderbilt Drive Stormwater
Management Outfall Recovery Project, authorize a budget amendment
in the amount of $150,000 to cover the cost of project design and
permitting and direct evaluation of inland tidal waterway shoaling
effects on stormwater runoff conveyance. (District 2)
B. COMMUNITY REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY
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1) Recommendation to approve the Three Party Escrow Agreement,
Locally Funded Agreement, and Transportation Post Project
Agreement between The Florida Department of Transportation and
Collier County for the installation and maintenance of holiday
attachments on light poles within the Immokalee Community
Redevelopment Area in Immokalee, Florida. (District 5)
C. PUBLIC UTILITIES DEPARTMENT
1) Recommendation to award two (2) Agreements for Invitation to Bid
No. 18-7479, “Lift Station Preventative Maintenance and Repairs,” to
Florida Utility Solutions, Inc., as Primary Contractor, and Advanced
Lift Station Services, Inc., as Secondary Contractor, for County-
owned lift station preventative maintenance and repair services. (All
Districts)
2) Recommendation to award Request for Proposal #18-7424,
“Hazardous Materials Management,” to US Ecology Tampa, Inc. (All
Districts)
3) Recommendation to release Golden Gate Estates Land Trust
properties from the Future Saleable List to the Active Sale List, to
reserve certain properties for governmental agencies, and to require
100% of appraised value for the sale of properties. (District 5)
4) Recommendation to approve an Agreement for Invitation to Bid No.
19-7574, “Northeast Service Area (NESA) Booster Pump
Modification at Orange Tree,” Project Number 70179, to Haskins,
Inc., in the amount of $127,550, and authorize the necessary budget
amendment. (District 5)
5) Recommendation to approve a purchase order with Tradewinds Power
Corporation for 16 portable generators in the amount of $941,318
under the Florida Sheriffs Association Cooperative Purchasing
Program Contract # FSA18-VEH16.0 as validated by the
Infrastructure Surtax Citizen Oversight Committee, Project Number
50391, and authorize the necessary budget amendment. (District 1,
District 4)
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6) Recommendation to amend existing contract with Angie Brewer &
Associates, LC under Bid #12-5839, “Loan/Grant Acquisition and
Compliance Services,” for an additional renewal period of one (1)
year, or until a new contract is awarded, whichever is sooner. (All
Districts)
D. PUBLIC SERVICES DEPARTMENT
1) Recommendation to approve and sign one mortgage satisfaction for
the State Housing Initiatives Partnership Loan Program in the amount
of $2,500. (District 5)
2) Recommendation to approve one State Housing Initiatives Partnership
Program Impact Fee release of lien in the amount of $3,929.52 for the
associated owner-occupied affordable housing dwelling unit where
the obligation has been repaid in full. (District 5)
3) Recommendation to approve an “after-the-fact” third amendment and
attestation statement with the Area Agency on Aging for Southwest
Florida, Inc., Home Care for the Elderly Grant Program for the Collier
County Services for Seniors and to increase funding in the amount of
$4,630. (All Districts)
4) Recommendation to approve “after-the-fact” second amendment and
attestation statement with the Area Agency on Aging for Southwest
Florida, Inc., to transfer funds between the Older American Act
Program Title III Services (IIIE) to Title III Supplemental Services
(IIIES). (All Districts)
5) This item was continued from the April 9, 2019, BCC meeting.
Recommendation to approve and authorize the Chairman to sign the
First Amendment to the State Mandated Agreement with David
Lawrence Mental Health Center, Inc. (All Districts)
6) Recommendation to approve a Memorandum of Understanding
between Collier County, as the provider of the Home Energy
Assistance Program, and Agricultural and Labor Program, Inc., as the
provider of Low-Income Home Energy Assistance Program, to
coordinate referrals and prevent duplication of benefits. (All Districts)
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7) Recommendation to approve the establishment of co-payment goals
and a Budget Amendment in the amount of $1,392,305.98 to allow
continuous operation of the Community Care for the Elderly,
Alzheimer’s Disease Initiative, and Home Care for the Elderly grants
for the Collier County Services for Seniors Program from the Area
Agency on Aging for Southwest Florida, Inc., prior to the execution of
the funding award. (All Districts)
8) Recommendation to approve the electronic submission of the Small
Matching Grant application to the Florida Department of State,
Division of Historical Resources, Historic Preservation Grants
Program to secure $48,300 in funding for the Budd Tavern
Observation Car located at the Naples Depot Museum and approve
$6,000 in Museum funds for project transportation costs. (District 4)
E. ADMINISTRATIVE SERVICES DEPARTMENT
1) Recommendation to ratify Property, Casualty, Workers’
Compensation and Subrogation claim files settled and/or closed by the
Risk Management Division Director pursuant to Resolution #2004-15
for the second quarter of FY 19. (All Districts)
2) Recommendation to approve Amendment #1 to Agreement No. 15-
6409, P25 Digital Radio System, with Communications International,
Inc., and authorize the payment of outstanding FY19 maintenance
invoices in the amount of $186,300. (All Districts)
3) Recommendation to approve the administrative report prepared by the
Procurement Services Division for disposal of property and
notification of revenue disbursement. (All Districts)
4) Recommendation to approve the administrative report prepared by the
Procurement Services Division for change orders and other
contractual modifications requiring Board approval. (All Districts)
5) Recommendation to approve the sale and disposal of surplus assets
per Resolution 2013-095 via public auction on June 21 & 22, 2019;
approve the addition of surplus items received subsequent to the
approval of this Agenda Item for sale in the auction; and authorize the
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May 28, 2019
Procurement Director, as designee for County Manager, to sign for the
transfer of vehicle titles. (All Districts)
6) Recommendation to accept the report for the sale of items and
disbursement of funds associated with the County surplus auction held
on April 26 & 27, 2019. (All Districts)
F. COUNTY MANAGER OPERATIONS
1) Recommendation to approve a report covering budget amendments
impacting reserves and moving funds in an amount up to and
including $25,000 and $50,000, respectively. (All Districts)
2) Recommendation to adopt a resolution approving amendments
(appropriating grants, donations, contributions or insurance proceeds)
to the Fiscal Year 2018-19 Adopted Budget. (All Districts)
3) Recommendation to approve an agreement for Invitation to Bid No.
19-7513 “Pelican Bay Tree Pruning,” to Safe and Green, Inc., d/b/a
Monster Tree Service of Southwest Florida, and authorize the
Chairman to execute the attached agreement. (District 2)
4) Recommendation to award Invitation to Bid (ITB) No. 19-7536 for
the Pelican Bay U.S. 41 Berm Landscape Restoration to Stahlman-
England Irrigation, Inc. in the amount of $477,000 and authorize the
Chairman to execute the attached agreement. (District 2)
G. AIRPORT AUTHORITY
1) Recommendation to approve the attached Access Agreement to grant
Terracon Consultants, Inc., access to the Immokalee Regional Airport
to perform a Phase I Environmental Site Assessment under the US
Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) Brownfields Assessment
Grant Program. (District 5)
H. BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
I. MISCELLANEOUS CORRESPONDENCE
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1) Miscellaneous Correspondence (All Districts)
J. OTHER CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICERS
1) Recommendation to serve as the local coordinating unit of
government for the Florida Department of Law Enforcement’s Federal
Fiscal Year 2018 Edward Byrne Memorial, Justice Assistance Grant
(JAG) Countywide Program and (1) authorize the Chairman to
execute the Certification of Participation; (2) designate the Sheriff as
the official applicant and the Sheriff’s office staff as grant financial
and program managers; (3) authorize the acceptance of the grant if
and when awarded; and (4) approve associated budget amendments
and approve the Collier County Sheriff’s Office to receive and expend
the grant funds. (All Districts)
2) Recommendation to approve the FY 2019 SCAAP letter delegating
authority to Sheriff Kevin Rambosk to be the official grant applicant
and contact person, or his designee, and to receive, expends the
payment and make any necessary budget amendments of the FY 2019
of the State Criminal Alien Assistance Program (SCAAP) grant funds.
(All Districts)
3) Recommendation to approve the designation of the Sheriff as the
official applicant and point of contact for the U.S. Department of
Justice, COPS School Violence Prevention Program Grant (SVPP)
FY2019. Authorize the acceptance of the grant when awarded,
approve associated budget amendments and approve the Collier
County Sheriff’s Office to receive and expend 2019 SVPP grant
funds. (All Districts)
4) To record in the minutes of the Board of County Commissioners, the
check number (or other payment method), amount, payee, and
purpose for which the referenced disbursements were drawn for the
periods between May 2, 2019 and May 15, 2019 pursuant to Florida
Statute 136.06. (All Districts)
5) Request that the Board approve and determine valid public purpose
for invoices payable and purchasing card transactions as of May 22,
2019. (All Districts)
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K. COUNTY ATTORNEY
1) Recommendation to approve the attached Settlement Agreement and
Release between the Collier County Board of County Commissioners
and Manhattan Road & Bridge, Inc., pertaining to the White
Boulevard over Cypress Canal Bridge Project (Project No. 66066.10).
(All Districts)
2) Recommendation to approve and authorize the Chair to execute a
Settlement Agreement in the case styled Marie Michelle Jerome v.
Collier County (Case No. 18-CA-2065), now pending in the Circuit
Court of the Twentieth Judicial Circuit in and for Collier County, for
the sum of $8,230.15. (All Districts)
3) Recommendation to approve a Mediated Settlement Agreement and
Stipulated Final Judgment to settle final compensation for the taking
of Parcel 434RDUE, in the amount of $20,832.50, including statutory
attorney fees and costs, and expert fees and costs, in the lawsuit styled
Collier County v. Kinh Thi Pham, et al, Case No. 17-CA-1473,
required for the Golden Gate Boulevard Expansion Project No. 60145.
(Fiscal Impact: $16,932.50) (All Districts)
4) Recommendation to approve a Mediated Settlement Agreement and
Stipulated Final Judgment to settle final compensation for the taking
of Parcel 445RDUE, in the amount of $26,551, including statutory
attorney fees and costs, and expert fees and costs, in the lawsuit styled
Collier County v. John R. Brunner, et al, Case No. 17-CA-1452,
required for the Golden Gate Boulevard Expansion Project No. 60145.
(Fiscal Impact: $22,851) (All Districts)
5) Recommendation to appoint four members to the Coastal Advisory
Committee. (All Districts)
6) Recommendation to appoint a member to the Parks and Recreation
Advisory Board. (All Districts)
7) Recommendation to reappoint two members to the Forest Lakes
Roadway & Drainage Advisory Committee. (District 4)
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May 28, 2019
8) Recommendation to reappoint a member to the Bayshore/Gateway
Local Redevelopment Advisory Board. (District 4)
9) Recommendation to waive the residency requirement for a member of
the Immokalee Beautification MSTU Advisory Committee. (District
5)
10) Recommendation to approve and authorize the Chairman to execute a
Retention Agreement for specialized legal services on an “as needed”
basis with the law firm of Baker, Donelson, Bearman, Caldwell &
Berkowitz, P.C. (All Districts)
11) Request that the Board of County Commissioners directs the Collier
County Health Facilities Authority to disburse grant funds to certain
nonprofit health service agencies. (All Districts)
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17. SUMMARY AGENDA - This section is for advertised public hearings and
must meet the following criteria: 1) A recommendation for approval from
staff; 2) Unanimous recommendation for approval by the Collier County
Planning Commission or other authorizing agencies of all members present
and voting; 3) No written or oral objections to the item received by staff, the
Collier County Planning Commission, other authorizing agencies or the
Board, prior to the commencement of the BCC meeting on which the items
are scheduled to be heard; and 4) No individuals are registered to speak in
opposition to the item. For those items which are quasi-judicial in nature, all
participants must be sworn in.
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A. Recommendation to adopt a resolution approving amendments
(appropriating carry forward, transfers and supplemental revenue) to the
Fiscal Year 2018-19 Adopted Budget. (All Districts)
B. This item requires ex parte disclosure be provided by the Commission
members. Should a hearing be held on this item, all participants are
required to be sworn in. Recommendation to approve An Ordinance
amending Ordinance No. 2009-21, as amended, the Esplanade Golf &
Country Club of Naples Residential Planned Unit Development, and
amending Ordinance No. 2004-41, the Collier County Land Development
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May 28, 2019
Code, by amending the appropriate zoning atlas map or maps by changing
the zoning classification of an additional 10± acres of land zoned Rural
Agricultural (A) to the Esplanade Golf & Country Club of Naples
Residential Planned Unit Development (RPUD); by reducing the maximum
number of residential dwelling units from 1233 to 1184 for the RPUD; to
modify the Master Plan; to revise the legal description; to modify
development commitments; and by providing an effective date. The property
to be added to the PUD is located just west of Collier Boulevard,
approximately two-thirds of a mile north of Immokalee Road, in Section 22,
Township 48 South, Range 26 East, Collier County, Florida, with the entire
PUD consisting of 1,668.3± acres. [PL20180002020] (District 3)
18. ADJOURN
INQUIRIES CONCERNING CHANGES TO THE BOARD’S AGENDA SHOULD
BE MADE TO THE COUNTY MANAGER’S OFFICE AT 252-8383.
May 28, 2019
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MR. OCHS: Mr. Chairman, you have a live mic.
Ladies and gentlemen, please take your seats.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Good morning, everybody.
THE AUDIENCE: Good morning.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: We are going to start off with our
invocation and pledge by Pastor Greg Bell of Destiny Church of
Naples. If you all would rise, please.
Item #1
INVOCATION GIVEN BY PASTOR GREG BALL OF DESTINY
CHURCH NAPLES
PASTOR BELL: Thank you.
God, we thank you for our Board of County Commissioners, and
we thank you for the opportunity to open this service or this meeting
with an invocation.
God, we thank you that the Bible is full of instruction on
wisdom from Exodus to Revelation and we ask, God, that you would
give wisdom in this meeting; that you would give the commissioners
wisdom to make decisions and, God, your word tells us in Proverbs
47 that wisdom is the principal thing, in all your getting, get
understanding. We ask that the people in this room would be able to
give clear understanding and that wisdom would prevail.
And, God, we ask that you would give peace in the room with
every decision. We thank you, God, for all that you're doing, and we
ask your blessing over this meeting.
In Jesus' name we pray, amen.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Fiala, will you lead
us this morning.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I will. Please put your hands over
May 28, 2019
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your hearts and say with me...
(The Pledge of Allegiance was recited in unison.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Please remain standing, please, if
you don't mind. I forgot to say that at the beginning.
Commissioner Solis.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Yes. A couple years ago we gave
an award to Carlos Anthony Ruiz, the Against All Odds Award. He
was an Afghanistan war veteran. And he came and told his story a
few times to us to help us understand the needs of our veterans. And
he passed away this week. So I'd like a moment of silence for Carlos
Ruiz.
(A moment of silence observed.)
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Thank you for that, Commissioner
Solis. I had read about that over the weekend. Terribly, terribly
troubling.
MR. OCHS: Good morning, Mr. Chairman and Commissioners.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yes, sir.
Item #2A
APPROVAL OF TODAY’S REGULAR, CONSENT AND
SUMMARY AGENDA AS AMENDED (EX PARTE
DISCLOSURE PROVIDED BY COMMISSION MEMBERS FOR
CONSENT AGENDA.) - APPROVED AND/OR ADOPTED
W/CHANGES (COMMISSIONER TAYLOR VOTED “NO’ ON
ITEM #16K6)
MR. OCHS: These are the proposed agenda changes for the
Board of County Commissioners' meeting of May 28th, 2019.
I'm pleased to announce we have no changes recommended or
May 28, 2019
Page 4
proposed for today's agenda at this time. We do have three
time-certain items on the agenda, Commissioners. The first is
Item 11B, and that is to be heard at 10 a.m., and that's listed on your
agenda as such. And then you have two items to be heard no sooner
than 1 p.m. Those are 11F, which has to do with the discussion on
short-term vacation rentals, and 11G, which has to do with a
discussion on the PACE program.
So those are all the changes that I have at this point,
Mr. Chairman.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. Well, let's go through and
do the ex parte. Commissioner Solis.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: No changes, no revisions, and no
disclosures on the consent or summary agenda.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Outstanding.
Commissioner Fiala.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yes, and the same with me: No
changes, no corrections, and no ex parte.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Taylor.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Same with me. Thank you very
much.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: And I have no changes and
no ex parte as well.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. And nor do I. So with that,
I'll --
MR. MILLER: Mr. Chair, I do remind you I have two
registered speakers for consent-agenda items.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: You do?
MR. MILLER: I have Teri Olin wishes to speak about
Item 16A3, and Charles Schumacher about 16K6.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. Those folks' names were
called.
May 28, 2019
Page 5
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Ms. Olin, can you come to the
microphone, please.
MS. OLIN: Good morning, Mr. Chairman and board members.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Good morning.
MS. OLIN: I'm here to speak on the Chokoloskee golf cart
petition that is on the agenda to make Chokoloskee a golf
community.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yes.
MS. OLIN: In my opinion, the petition will only escalate the
problems that we already have in Chokoloskee being the racing with
the golf carts and the four-wheelers, and it becomes a public-safety
issue when you have probably over 200 golf carts that -- from the
residents that come during the season from ORA, and then you have
two marinas that have golf carts also.
So you add that to the community traffic that quarter stretch
going on to Chokoloskee Island, it becomes -- it becomes very
congested, and then we have -- that's our peak time for boating
traffic, and also we have a cafe there that draws a lot of visitors and
motorcyclists.
So when you add all of that into that congested area, it becomes
a big public-safety issue. And I, myself, have been cut off by a golf
cart that -- they tend to think they're going slow, and they don't mind
the rules of the road. Not only that, there are no safety mechanisms
on them. There's no reverse, there's no turn signal, there's no horns,
there's no brake lights.
So my proposal would be to maybe consider a golf cart path that
crosses between ORA, which is the primary community that's
interested in the golf cart petition, a golf cart path crossing them and
speed bumps going through there, and then we can have low-speed
vehicles on the road which are tagged and insured for the residents in
the community and also -- because they transport visitors to our area
May 28, 2019
Page 6
on golf carts also, so that's also a public-safety issue.
So that's -- I just wanted to say that.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Thank you.
MS. OLIN: All right. Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Your other speaker is Charles Schumacher.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: You have a question for her,
ma'am?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Not for the speaker. Just a
process issue.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I'm sorry. I thought she had a
question for you. You're good.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: With this petition for these golf
carts, what exactly are we involved in to doing this? Are we studying
this area to determine if it needs speed bumps, if it doesn't? Are we
taking polls of the residents? What are we doing?
MR. CASALANGUIDA: You had a public meeting, ma'am,
and you hired a professional engineer to do a study. That is attached
to your item.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Right.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: And staff recommending allowing
certain facilities to allow golf carts and certain not. So we followed
the guidelines required in Florida Statutes, and a study was done.
And what you have in front of you on the consent is a
recommendation to allow them on ce rtain roads. So if you approve
that --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: It's done.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: -- it's done.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: The Sheriff was there. There was a
public meeting. I mean, she certainly -- I mean, folks are --
obviously have different opinions along the way, but this was -- this
was a very open -- I thought a very open process.
May 28, 2019
Page 7
And the Sheriff was there. The community was there. There
were a lot of folks that were involved to get it to a point to allow
them to have the golf carts.
MR. OCHS: Mr. Chairman, again, just for clarification, this is
step one of your typical two-step process --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Correct.
MR. OCHS: -- involved in adoption of an ordinance. So this
action would accept the findings of the traffic engineer and authorize
the County Attorney to prepare the ordinance for a future board
meeting.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And then we'll have it at a future
meeting, at which point I'd like to have a meeting with you to see if
there's any adjustments that he can -- to, in fact, make to it to address
the concerns, so...
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Thank you. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yes.
MR. MILLER: Mr. Chairman, your other speaker was for
Item 16K6, Chuck Schumacher.
MR. SCHUMACHER: Good morning, Commissioners.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Good morning.
MR. SCHUMACHER: Thank you for your time.
I'm here to speak about Item K6 for the appointment to the Parks
and Rec Advisory committee.
I've been a resident of Collier County since 1998. My wife, who
also moved here with me in 1998 as well is a teacher at Vineyards
Elementary, we have three children, so we use the parks quite a bit on
a regular basis.
Over the last five years, especially being involved in my son's
Little League team, Cal Ripken, which has now grown to over 450
children in between four and 12 years old.
We've been using the Veterans Park as our -- basically, as our
May 28, 2019
Page 8
home park. Over the last five years, that park has fallen into
disrepair. The fencing, nonworking score boards, we were down a
field last year completely, which prompted games to be pushed later.
The concern with that is that there was really no attention being paid
to that park, which being in its location and using by that amount of
kids, was concerning.
So my conversation with Commissioner Taylor, you know, she
kind of said, why would you want to be on an advisory committee?
Well, it's more of a selfish one being a dad and a coach. When you're
out there with the kids and your fields aren't set up correctly, the
lights don't work when you have to have a night game, and then you
look around and you see all the expansion we're doing, it's not so
much a question of why but that it's not getting to the right people.
So that is what prompted my interest in the rec committee.
I've been working in managing associations since 2006. I
worked with a number of committees, a number of boards. It's never
so much an issue of funding. It's more of an issue of recognition; this
is what's needed.
So my want to be on that board is kind of selfish as a dad. So if
there's funds that could be allotted towards these parks, even having
used Golden Gate's park as well and Vineyards, there is areas of
improvement that I just don't think are being identified.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I think you are on there, isn't he?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: But he hasn't been
recommended. The PARAB recommended a lady. And, by the way,
there is a mistake in the literature. She attests that she has sat on
PARAB before, but the narrative from staff says she hasn't. So
somehow there's a conflict.
But when I heard Mr. Schumacher's reasons and I think his
superb qualifications, I would like to suggest that we have him sit on
the PARAB. I think he'd be a great asset. He clearly has great
May 28, 2019
Page 9
organizational skills, and he understands the county and, more
importantly, he understands children and their needs in these parks.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I misread this. We're only filling
one position right now?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: That's right.
MR. OCHS: That's correct.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Not all three.
MR. OCHS: Yes.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And Ms. Bercher's the
recommended -- the recommended one.
MR. OCHS: By the advisory committee.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: By the advisory committee.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: And just for the record,
Ms. Bercher did serve on the PARAB.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: You remember?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: It was years ago. It was a
long time ago, but just -- you had indicated that didn't -- that was
inconsistent with staff's findings, but --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: -- she did serve.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Yeah, I didn't think that she was
putting forward something that was incorrect.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Thank you, Mr. Schumacher.
MR. SCHUMACHER: Thank you, sir.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Schumacher. Forgive me for the
mispronunciation. Okay.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: How many positions are available?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: One.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Only one.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And staff's recommended that
Ms. Bercher fill that position.
May 28, 2019
Page 10
MR. KLATZKOW: No, it's not staff's recommendation. It's the
advisory board's --
(Simultaneous speakers speaking.)
MR. KLATZKOW: -- advisory boards.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Correct. Not staff. Forgive me.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: How do we do this?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Typically, if you have an issue on a
consent agenda, you would bring that up as we're setting the agenda
and either continue that item and/or vote not in favor of the
recommendation that's coming before us.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: We have to separate it out.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Correct. You would if you have an
issue with one of the consent-agenda items.
MR. KLATZKOW: Pull it from consent and put it on regular if
you want to discuss it.
MR. OCHS: Or you can just indicate you're voting against it as
part of the vote on the consent agenda.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Okay. So that's how we would
do it.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yes.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Okay.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Unless you want it pulled; we can
have a discussion to promote Mr. Schumacher. That's up to you.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Well, what I would like to do is
see if there's support on this commission to put Mr. Schumacher on
the PARAB without Mr. Schumacher having to sit here to 5 o'clock
at night. So that's my goal.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: And my question is, do they
have an alternative member there? I don't know if they have an
alternate member. And the second is, he, of course, can attend all of
the meetings and voice his opinions about things, right?
May 28, 2019
Page 11
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Sure. And there is a
recommendation already in the consent agenda for Ms. Bercher. It
was one of the three applications, so...
COMMISSIONER FIALA: You know what, in case there's
somebody who doesn't attend regularly or something, if there's an
alternate position, he can sit in and vote on whatever it is. You make
some good points and, you know, that's something we're all
concerned with is the kids in our community and the use of the parks.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Well, and we want to have engaged
folks that are serving on these advisory committees. It's what
promotes -- and I certainly believe Ms. Bercher will as well. That's
not any slant on her by any stretch. It's just Mr. Schumacher wasn't
picked by the committee, so...
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Right.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: So with that, I'm going to start with
the agenda. Have we done the agenda? I've lost my place. Did we
make a motion to accept the agenda?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: No.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. Let's do that.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Motion to accept the agenda as
printed.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: As presented. Do I have a second?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I'll second that.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. It's been moved and
seconded that we accept today's agenda as printed. Is there any other
discussion?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Do you want to -- you want to
register your no vote on that now?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Well, I'm going to approve the
agenda except for the recommendation of the PARAB. I think
May 28, 2019
Page 12
Mr. Schumacher would be the right person at this time.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: So you're going to register a no
vote on 16K6.
MR. OCHS: Six.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: You okay with that?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: So it's not being pulled?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: No.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Okay.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: All right. We're getting to a point
here now. So it's been moved and seconded that today's agenda be
accepted as printed. All in favor?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Opposed same sign, same sound.
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: So moved. And just for the record,
reflect that Commissioner Taylor voted in the nay on 16K6.
MR. OCHS: Correct.
Proposed Agenda Changes
Board of County Commissioners Meeting
May 28, 2019
Time Certain Items:
Item 11B to be heard at 10:00 a.m.
Item 11F to be heard no sooner than 1:00 p.m.
Item 11G to be heard no sooner than 1:00 p.m.
6/12/2019 1:02 PM
May 28, 2019
Page 13
Item #2B (Continued from the May 14, 2019 BCC Meeting)
REGULAR MEETING MINUTES FROM APRIL 23, 2019 -
APPROVED AS PRESENTED
MR OCHS: Okay. Mr. Chairman, that takes us to Item 2B; this
is approval of the April 23rd, 2019, Board of County Commissioner
meeting minutes.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Motion to approve.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And a second?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Second.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Somebody say second. It's been
moved and seconded we accept the minutes as printed. Any other
discussion?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: All in favor?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Opposed same sign, same sound.
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: So moved.
MR. OCHS: Mr. Chairman, if the Board would please join us in
front of the dais for our service awards.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Here we go. You ready?
Item #3A1
AWARDS AND RECOGNITIONS – EMPLOYEE - 20 YEAR
May 28, 2019
Page 14
ATTENDEES
MR. OCHS: Commissioners, we have the pleasure of
recognizing three of our associates this morning for distinguished
long-standing service to the organization.
Our first service award recipient celebrating 20 years of service
with our communications and customer relations division, Joy
Hancock.
(Applause.)
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: When in doubt, ask Joy.
MR. OCHS: Also celebrating 20 years of service with our
wastewater division, Joe Penn.
(Applause.)
Item #3A3
AWARDS AND RECOGNITIONS – EMPLOYEE - 30 YEAR
ATTENDEES
MR. OCHS: Commissioners, our final service award this
morning is recognizing a gentleman who's given 30 years of service
to county government, our outstanding Risk Management director,
Jeff Walker. Jeff.
(Applause.)
MR. OCHS: That concludes our service awards. Thank you.
Item #4
PROCLAMATION - ONE MOTION TAKEN TO ADOPT BOTH
PROCLAMATIONS
May 28, 2019
Page 15
Item #4A
PROCLAMATION RECOGNIZING NAPLES ZOO AT
CARIBBEAN GARDENS AS RECIPIENT OF THE WASTE
REDUCTION AWARDS PROGRAM (WRAP) AWARD, FOR
CONTRIBUTING TO THE GREATER GOOD OF COLLIER
COUNTY BY ADVOCATING THE "REDUCE, REUSE,
RECYCLE" MESSAGE, THEREBY HELPING TO PROLONG
THE USABLE LIFE OF THE COLLIER COUNTY LANDFILL.
ACCEPTED BY DANIELLE GREEN, DIRECTOR OF GARDENS
& GROUNDS, NAPLES ZOO AT CARIBBEAN GARDENS -
ADOPTED
MR. OCHS: Commissioners we move to this morning's
proclamations. Item 4A is a proclamation recognizing Naples Zoo at
Caribbean Gardens as recipient of the Waste Reduction Awards
Program award for contributing to the greater good of Collier County
by advocating the "Reduce, Reuse, Recycle" message thereby helping
to prolong the usable life of the Collier County Landfill.
To be accepted by Danielle Green, director of gardens and
grounds at the Naples Zoo at Caribbean Gardens.
(Applause.)
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I can't wait to get over and see that
display you have.
(Applause.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Do you want to tell us about your
new prize? Do you want to make a little statement about the lion
cubs?
MS. GREEN: Sure.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Go to the microphone.
MS. GREEN: I'm pretty loud already, but I appreciate the
May 28, 2019
Page 16
opportunity to speak.
I'm Danielle Green, director of gardens and grounds at Naples
Zoo. If you haven't been there at all or in a long time, we need you to
come take a visit.
We just announced the birth of three South African lion cubs.
That's the first time that we've had lion cubs born at Naples Zoo, so
it's very exciting for us. It will be July before they're out on exhibit
just to make sure mom and little ones are getting well acquainted so
far. Shani, first-time mom, has done a really great job taking care of
them.
In addition, we have two clouded leopard kittens. Those are
going to be on display in our 2:30 Safari Canyon show. It's a great
time to see those up close, which is kind of a rarity.
They will be with us probably another maybe four to six weeks
before they are sent out to their future homes.
In addition, I'm biased. I'm the horticulture director. So you
have to come out and see the wonderful plants. They're always there,
big, little, and in between.
Four to six months for the clouded leopard. Okay. So a little bit
longer. But the trees are forever.
Thank you, again. I appreciate the opportunity.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Absolutely. Thank you.
(Applause.)
Item #4B
PROCLAMATION DESIGNATING MAY 2019 AS DROWNING
PREVENTION MONTH IN COLLIER COUNTY. ACCEPTED BY
REPRESENTATIVES OF THE NCH SAFE & HEALTHY
CHILDREN'S COALITION: PAULA DIGRIGOLI, SUE LESTER,
KONNIE PURCELL, ANNIE ALVAREZ, TERRI BALLOW AND
May 28, 2019
Page 17
SAM MOLINA – ADOPTED
MR. OCHS: ITEM 4B is a proclamation designating May 2019
as Drowning Prevention Month in Collier County. To be accepted by
representatives of the NCH Safe & Healthy Children's Coalition:
Paula DiGrigoli, Sue Lester, Konnie Purcell, Annie Alverez, Terri
Ballow (phonetic), and Sam Molina.
(Applause.)
MR. OCHS: And a big duck.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Okay. Guys, do you know how
to swim? You do.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Outstanding.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Wow. Congratulations.
(In unison the kids said: "Never swim alone.")
(Applause.)
MS. DiGRIGOLI: Good morning. Hi. My name is Paula
DiGrigoli. I'm the executive director of the NCH Safe & Healthy
Children's Coalition of Collier County.
On behalf of the 70 agencies and the advisory board of the
coalition, I'm honored to accept this proclamation. Thank you so
much for, once again, proclaiming May to be Drowning Prevention
Month and for taking a stand against this preventable tragedy.
Drowning continues being the leading cause of death for
children ages 1 to 4 in Florida and also in Collier County and the
second leading cause of death for children all ages, more than motor
vehicle accidents; however, in 2019, we have seen a decrease of 57
drowning deaths according to DCF.
Last year around this time we already had 35 deaths but today,
this year, DCF is reporting 15. Unfortunately, one of those 15
Department of Healths happened here in Collier County. It was a
family from Chicago visiting and rented a home, and the home didn't
May 28, 2019
Page 18
have none of the layers of protection, and the 18-month-old baby girl
died. This is a reminder why the Coalition's work is important and
must continue.
I want to share some of the Coalition's successes. We believe
that the layers of protection are important, and they need to be in
place to avoid another tragedy. The more steps that we have, we will
save a life.
Swim Central, as we can see, some of those children from
Immokalee participated in the 10-day water-safety program over the
two-week period. As of today, 6,600 children have participated in
this water-safety program, and over 57,000 water-safety lessons have
been taught. This program is possible thanks to the Naples Children
Education Foundation, founders of the Naples Winter Wine Festival,
the Schultz Family Foundation, and the NCH Healthcare System.
Also, the Kids Don't Float, Life Jackets Do, I know
Commissioner Fiala was very important in this effort. Fifteen loaner
stations we have all around the county, and we have the U.S. Coast
Guard Auxiliary 93 representative who helps us to inspect the life
jacket conditions.
Also, I'm happy to report that the Sun N Fun Lagoon still holds
the Guinness world of record for the largest women's swimming
lesson consisting of 3,000 participating -- participants. It was
achieved in June of 2014.
Plus, Stewie the Duck is our water-safety mascot who joined us
in 2016. He meets approximately 20,000 people every year. He goes
to all the preschools in town, and thanks to the Kiwanis Club of
Greater Collier County for sponsoring this.
Also, I'm happy to announce that Dr. Shepherd, a member of the
coalition, she has been appointed by the Florida Chapter of American
Academy of Pediatrics to be the cochair of the drowning prevention
initiatives in Florida.
May 28, 2019
Page 19
Lastly, I want to thank the partnering with us -- the County
Commission for partnering with us and also Barry Williams and
Richard Degalan and all his staff for the great Naples dog race and
the water-safety festival that we hosted back in February. Over a
thousand people attended, and they all learned how to be water safer.
And also, we were able to raise money that we are going to be
spending and we are already spending in water safety.
We look forward for February 1st when we're going to be
hosting the second annual.
Thank you again for helping us to achieve this and sustain zero
drowning rates in Collier County, and I know Barry Williams wants
to say a couple words on behalf of the county.
MR. WILLIAMS: Commissioners, Barry Williams, Parks and
Recreation director.
Just quickly, I wanted to say thank you for your support of our
participation with Naples Community Hospital and the water-safety
group, and Commissioner Fiala started with the Kids Don't Float, and
so that's been a great initiative and all the initiatives t hat we've
enjoyed over the years with this group. We've taught a lot of kids to
swim with the support of this group. So thank you very much.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Absolutely.
(Applause.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Goodbye, Stew.
MR. OCHS: Mr. Chairman, we move on to this morning's
presentations.
Item #5A
PRESENTATION BY THE SOUTH FLORIDA WATER
MANAGEMENT DISTRICT REGARDING THE WESTERN
EVERGLADES RESTORATION PROJECT (WERP) –
May 28, 2019
Page 20
PRESENTED
MR. OCHS: Item 5A is a presentation by the South Florida
Water Management District regarding the Western Everglades
Restoration Project. It will be presented this morning by Jennifer
Leeds, the section administrator for the district over policy and
coordination.
Good morning.
MS. LEEDS: Good morning. Again, my name's Jennifer
Leeds. I'm with the South Florida Water Management District, and
it's a pleasure to be here this morning to give you-all a presentation
on some of our Comprehensive Everglades Restoration Projects. We
call them CERP projects, so that will be your only acronym for this
morning.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: What about WERP?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: WERP is there.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: WERP was in it.
MS. LEEDS: Yes, it's at the end, but what I mean is I'll refrain
from using acronyms throughout the presentation.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And Commissioner Solis and I live
in an acronym-free zone; AFZ.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: AFZ, right.
MS. LEEDS: Understood.
So, just really quickly, the Comprehensive Everglades
Restoration Plan, or the CERP project, was first authorized by
Congress back in 2000 in the Water Resources Development Act, and
it's a 50/50 cost-share program that the Water Management District
implements with the Corps of Engineers.
The Corps of Engineers is the federal government, the federal
sponsor, and we're what we call the nonfederal sponsor. And so
together in this partnership, we both plan, design, and construct these
May 28, 2019
Page 21
various projects that are through our 16-county district. And the
primary function of this is to look at the timing, distribution, and the
quality of the water that's within the 16-county area.
So, quickly, some of the projects I'm going to talk about today,
starting with the north part of the system. I'm going to quickly go
over the Kissimmee River Restoration Project, move down into some
of the STAs that are north of Lake Okeechobee. We'll talk very
quickly about both reservoirs that are in construction; both on the east
side, the C44, and on the west side, the C43.
The Everglades STAs which are between Lake Okeechobee and
the water conservation areas, the Everglades Protection Area, and
then moving down we'll look at the EAA storage reservoir that has
been planned and is in preliminary design, then go Picayune Strand,
and then we'll finally finish up by talking about the Western
Everglades Project.
So the Kissimmee River Restoration Project is actually almost
complete. There are just a few contracts left where they are still
backfilling some channels of the river.
The District acquired over 102,000 acres of historic river
floodplain, and those areas have been, like, re-carved and 24 miles of
river have been restored. We're looking for this project to be
complete in 2021 with the Corps in the lead for the construction of
this project.
We're down -- right here in this is called the Lower Kissimmee
Basin Area, and they still have some additional backfilling to go on.
Once that is complete, the main portion of the Kissimmee River will
be redone.
Next, we're going to move a little bit further south, but we're still
north of Lake Okeechobee. And the District does have some
stormwater treatment areas in this area. All of those are north of the
lake. We have four: Taylor Creek, which is up here, small one;
May 28, 2019
Page 22
Nubbin Slough STA; Lakeside Ranch Stormwater Treatment Area,
which it has been complete, and they're currently finishing up a pump
station that will allow water from Lake Okeechobee to be pulled back
into this STA, cleaned, and then delivered back into Lake
Okeechobee; and then a small one up in St. Lucie County called
10-Mile Creek Stormwater Treatment Area.
Next, we're going to move south of Lake Okeechobee, and these
are our primary stormwater treatment areas. We call them the
Everglades Stormwater Treatment Areas. They are all located
between Lake Okeechobee and what we call the Everglades
Protection Area, and all these STAs are located within the Everglades
Agricultural Area.
There's over 57,000 acres currently of functioning constructed
stormwater treatment area, and what these do is they take in not only
lake water but also local basin runoff from the EAA and treat that
water and then deliver it down into the water conservation areas.
Then that water heads south and down into Everglades National Park.
We have two over here on the east side called STA 1 East an d
STA 1 West, in our central area we have STA 2 and STA 3/4, and
then over on the western side, we have what we call STA 5/6.
Back in 2013, we implemented a program, a state-driven
water-quality improvement program under Governor Scott called the
Governor's $880 Million Plan, and their primary focus of this project
was to improve water quality going into the Everglades, and we did
this by adding some additional what we call green technology to our
already constructed treatment wetlands. We added something called
flow equalization basins that helped to attenuate some of those large
basin runoff that we were seeing going into the STAs. And so we
broke that down into what we call flow paths.
So I'll start here on the eastern side going into Water
Conservation Area 1. We added a 45,000-acre FEB to help attenuate
May 28, 2019
Page 23
some of the flows in this area. Additionally, we just finished
substantial completion for STA 1 West, our Stormwater Treatment
Area 1 West. We added another 4,700 acres there.
In the central flow path, we have what we call the A-1 FEB
which created 60,000 acre feet worth of shallow storage.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: FEB stands for?
MS. LEEDS: You caught me on that one. Flow equalization
basin.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Thank you.
MS. LEEDS: And what does that is it acts like a big bathtub.
So when you have a big, you know, pulse of water coming in, we can
put the water into that, like, bathtub area, hold it. Once the event
passes, then we're able to then deliver that water to the STAs as they
need it for the flow time in which the phosphorus can be taken out of
the water before it goes down into the Everglades Protection Area.
And then on the western flow path we have two features that
we're putting in there. One is the C139 flow equalization basin. It is
currently in design. We're also improving the treatment performance
within Stormwater Treatment Area 5/6 by doing some earthwork in
there.
Right now all of this work is set to be complete by 2024 in
which that time each of these areas will help to improve the water
quality going through the STAs and down into the Everglades
Protection Area.
And talk about some of the --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: One second. There's a question.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: So if we go to the restoration
strategy, so this water, you're not pumping from Lake Okeechobee,
what's happening, this is the runoff for the natural flow that --
MS. LEEDS: So it takes in both. So right now currently, as we
see today, there's water from Lake Okeechobee that's flowing south,
May 28, 2019
Page 24
plus there's also local basin runoff in each of these areas that feed into
these particular STAs. So that is taking in both.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Okay.
MS. LEEDS: What this is doing is the primary function of the
restoration strategies project was to improve the quality of the water.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Okay.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And then they ran into quantity
issues.
MS. LEEDS: Yeah. And I actually have a slide on that in a
little bit.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. We'll be quiet and let you
continue. Won't we?
MS. LEEDS: So on the eastern side, we're currently building
one of our reservoirs that will take lake water and hold that before it
goes into the St. Lucie Estuary, and this is a project that we're
building with the Corps of Engineers. The Water Management
District is building one of the additional stormwater treatment areas
on the eastern side. It's about 6,400 acres, and it's planned to be
complete this fall, actually.
And currently the Corps is constructing the reservoir. It's a
3,400-acre reservoir and will hold a little bit over 50,000 acre feet
worth of water, and that will take lake water coming off and hold it
there rather than having it go directly discharge to the St. Lucie
Estuary.
On the west side is the Caloosahatchee River West Basin
Storage Reservoir. This is a little over 10,000 acres, and it is
designed to hold 170,000 acre feet worth of water. It also will
improve the timing and delivery of water coming from Lake
Okeechobee as it's heading into the Caloosahatchee Estuary.
During times when there are high flows, we can divert water
into this reservoir, and then during this dry season, one of its main
May 28, 2019
Page 25
functions is to help improve some of the low-flow dry season
freshwater delivers that the estuary needs to help with its salinity
levels.
Currently, the reservoir has let its contract out to build the
embankment, and it's planned to be complete in about 2023. So
they're doing a lot of work out there right now.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And before you go away, with the
location of that reservoir, is it not right on the Lee/Hendry County
line?
MS. LEEDS: Yes, very close to it.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yeah. Are there any plans of
diverting water out of that south through that main canal that's owned
by the East Lee County Drainage District that runs all the way
straight down through and underneath State Road 82 and into the
north end of the CREWS?
MS. LEEDS: No. It's only designed to take water from the
Caloosahatchee River and then deliver it back to it.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay.
MS. LEEDS: There's no connection to -- for it to go south.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay.
MS. LEEDS: Okay. Next, I'm going to go over the EAA
reservoir and the EAA STA.
This project is part of what we call the Central Everglades
Planning.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Did we not tell her that this is an
AFZ?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: We tried.
MS. LEEDS: Sometimes it's hard to kind of not lapse into the --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: You talk about this stuff all the
time, but the people that are watching don't.
MS. LEEDS: Yeah. So the Central Everglades Planning
May 28, 2019
Page 26
Project, the purpose of this project was to open up the central part of
the Everglades system. There are features all throughout the central
part of the Everglades here.
And what that will allow us to do is to divert some of the flows
that are currently going out to the estuaries and send them south
through our stormwater treatment areas, through this additional
reservoir that we're going to build, and into the Everglades Protection
Area.
So, currently, the reservoir right now is designed to be a little
over 10,000 acres, and it is going to hold 240,000 acre feet worth of
water. So this one is designed to bring those additional Lake
Okeechobee flows south, store them into the reservoir, and when the
events are gone, then deliver them south. And the water has been
designated to protect the environment. So the Everglades calls for
some of these additional flows, and this is what gets us there.
In addition to that, because we're bringing in so much additional
water south, it does have to meet state water-quality standards, and so
because of that, we designed a stormwater treatment area that is a
little over 6,500 acres so that additional water that comes into the
reservoir can be treated before it sends south, and in addition to that,
we need to do some canal improvements to allow some of those
additional flows to come into the reservoir.
This is just a closeup of what it looks like. It's situated just to
the west of our A-1 Flow Equalization Basin, and really the
take-away from this particular map is that it allows us a lot of
flexibility to move water in this entire complex in the central part of
the system. We can literally take in water to this reservoir, send it to
the new STA, send it over to the A-1 FEB. It can go down into
Stormwater Treatment Area 3/4, or it can go over to Stormwater
Treatment Area 2 depending on where we have capacity to treat the
water. So this particular new feature really helps us in our
May 28, 2019
Page 27
operational flexibility and in moving that water south.
So next, I just want to go down to the southwest area. This is
the Picayune Strand Restoration Project. This project is designed to
restore over 55,000 acres of wetlands and uplands. It involved three
canal -- backfilling three canals, removing some roads, putting some
pump stations in. It is close to being complete.
Currently, we're looking at, with the Corps in this area on the
southwest side, designing what they call a protection levy, and so
that's being modeled, and it's currently under design right now. Once
that is done and built, the final features for this project will be
complete, and then it will be fully functional.
And then the last one I'll finish up with is the Western
Everglades Restoration Project. This is what we call -- it's in the
planning stage. This isn't a current project that's in design or
construction. It is within the planning process, and this is, like, a
three-year -- three- to four-year planning process that we do with the
Corps.
It's approximately 772,000 acres. That's roughly the size of the
state of Rhode Island, so it's a fairly large planning area. It is
historically dominated by wetlands, and the current land use is
natural land, wetlands, and agriculture.
There's some key features in this to point out. One, we have two
native tribes; the Seminole Tribe of Florida up here kind of in the
magenta color, and we also have the Miccosukee Tribe of Indians of
Florida, which are also within the planning project here, and then just
to the west of the Seminole Tribe they ha ve a little land piece over
here.
This deals with what we call the feeder canal basin and water
that flows south down these canals towards -- through the Seminole
Tribe and into the Miccosukee Tribe of Indians of Florida
Reservation. Water then can also get out into Water Conversation
May 28, 2019
Page 28
Area 3A.
This is also looking at this canal down here in Big Cypress
National Preserve and being able to flow some additional waters
down this way. It's primarily to restore the quantity but also the
quality of the water from the north areas.
Heading south. It will also help to raise groundwater levels
within Big Cypress, which will help attenuate some of the wildfires
that have been associated with altered hydrology, and it will also
improve water-quality conditions, and it's looking to promote some
system-wide resiliency.
As you can see with this particular map, it's also designed to
help with some of the water flows that are going through Big
Cypress.
And then the last slide I have, this goes quickly over the
features. In the north part of the planning area, we're looking at two
different stormwater treatment areas to help clean some of the water
as it's leaving the feeder canal basin before it heads south through the
tribes and into Big Cypress National Preserve . We've got one here on
the western side called the Wingate Mill Stormwater Treatment Area,
and then we have another one we're putting on state land within the
C139 annex to take some of the flows from the feeder canal basin
here.
They're looking at doing some features within this particular
canal here to help with some sheet flow down into Big Cypress, so
they're looking at doing some plugging.
Further down, this particular canal area here, the Miccosukees
have requested that this is removed and we bac kfill it to help with
some sheet flow coming into Big Cypress area. As we move further
south, we're looking at backfilling this piece of the canal and then
putting some structures in here to allow some additional water flow
to come over to the west and then down into Everglades National
May 28, 2019
Page 29
Park.
So, again, this project is in the planning phase. It's getting very
close to having what we call the proposed plan. And, actually, in
July we'll be taking this project to our governing board at the Water
Management District so they can have some input on that proposed
plan prior to it going to the Army Corps of Engineers for approval.
So with that, that kind of wraps up my quick high-level
overview. I apologize for getting a few acronyms still placed in
there.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. I was just giving you a hard
time. You did a really good job, by the way.
Commissioner Taylor.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: I just wanted to compliment
South Florida Water Management. Your Picayune Strand, I've been
out there with Ms. Koehler on two occasions. First, when I was first
elected, I did the ground tour, and then just recently I got to see the
overview. It's remarkable.
MS. LEEDS: It's stunning.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: And it works.
MS. LEEDS: What's going on out there, yeah.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: That's the best part of it. I know
it's been controversial, but what you've restored and to see it just
coming blossoming back is extraordinary, and it's only going to help
us in the long run, so many, many compliments.
MS. LEEDS: Yeah. The team did a great job with that.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: We look forward to this.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Yeah. And you may not be
the right person to ask. But I understand that one of the problems
with pollution going into Lake Okeechobee at this point is the
application of treated sewage on farms north of Lake Okeechobee, in
May 28, 2019
Page 30
the Kissimmee River basin.
Is there any effort to regulate that or prohibit that? Are you
familiar at all with that issue?
MS. LEEDS: I've heard of it but, actually, I am not the right
person to address that. I don't know about the application of that onto
farmlands. I know that north of the lake they have what they call
best-management practices, which they work with t he local farmers,
the Florida Department of Agriculture and Community Services does
that. But beyond that, I'm not sure.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Solis.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Thank you for the great
presentation. And just a couple questions in relation to some
presentations that we received a couple of weeks ago from both of the
tribes.
Number one, as I recall, a lot of their information was based on
the District's data, and I recall that there was some math th at was
concerning to me in reference to how many cubic tons of phosphate
and -- or phosphorus and nitrogen and other things that are going into
the lake and then coming out of the lake and that the math seemed to
be getting worse.
I'm just wondering, are we going to be able to get ahead of it, or
what's the future look like from your perspective?
MS. LEEDS: So, certainly, some of the projects that we're
currently implementing will help. It's a complex problem. I think it's
going to take a lot of effort and a lot of thought on --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Sure.
MS. LEEDS: -- what's going to help with that and also looking
at the broad spectrum of, you know, what's currently coming in, what
are the activities going on north of the lake and getting a handle on
that. Some of that work is being done. Some of it's being done by
May 28, 2019
Page 31
other agencies as well and other state agencies, too.
So I can speak to what the Water Management District is doing,
but I know there's some other focus from some other groups on that,
maybe some other state agencies as well.
So with some of the stormwater treatment areas we have north
of the lake, with some of the other planning projects that we have
going on -- we have another one within the comprehensive
Everglades restoration realm called the Lake Okeechobee Watershed
Restoration Project. One of the purposes of that is to put some
storage north of the lake to look at attenuating some of those flows as
they're coming down the Kissimmee River and hold them there, and
then that will help not only the estuaries, but it will help some of the
lower lake levels. Projects like that, they -- but they're very large
projects, and sometimes they don't happen as fast as we all would
want them to happen.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Sure.
MS. LEEDS: But some of these projects are in the works.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: And the other thing that I heard that
kind of surprised me was there was a figure -- I think it was
$17.8 billion -- spent on the STAs. Was that -- is that about the right
number?
MS. LEEDS: I would have to check that for you --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: All right.
MS. LEEDS: -- just to be sure, but we do have right now over
57,000 acres of STA.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Uh-huh.
MS. LEEDS: But I can check the number on that for you.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Yeah, I'd be interested in that just
because the -- what I had heard was that the total cost was
$1.8 billion and that the amount of, I think it was, phosphorus that
was removed as a result of that expenditure, somehow my math --
May 28, 2019
Page 32
and, again, my phone didn't have enough zeros on it, I think, but it
was something like $750,000 per ton.
And I'd like to know if those numbers were, from your
perspective, the right numbers. And if somebody -- maybe Lisa can
help me understand those numbers.
MS. LEEDS: Yeah. We can certainly get that information for
you. We report out on this every year in our South Florida
Environmental Report that goes to Florida Department of
Environmental Protection, and it also takes -- it also calculates how
much phosphorus, like, tons of phosphorus have been removed every
year in our stormwater treatment areas, but I made a note of that, so
I'll definitely get the number back to you.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Taylor.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Just a couple of questions. Can
you please explain the hierarchy in Lake Okeechobee management?
Because there's more than South Florida Water Management District
there. Could you -- and what each entity is responsible for. I mean,
if there's a lot of subgroups, that's not important; just the main
groups, please.
MS. LEEDS: So you're probably primarily speaking of who
kind of controls the locks of the lake and the water, the discharges
coming out of the lakes?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: The whole Lake Okeechobee
issue.
MS. LEEDS: So, technically, the Army Corps of Engineers is
the one who controls the releases coming and going to the estuaries,
right, because it's part of the Central and Southern Flood Control
District, but it's also a navigation on the lake as well. So they control
that -- those locks both to the east and to the west.
The Water Management District has some smaller structures
May 28, 2019
Page 33
south of the lake in which we can let water out to the south, and then
every other week they have something called a periodic call which all
different entities can call and weigh in on. So even though the Corps
has the lead on it, they also take into account information from not
only the water managers, from the Water Management District, but
other entities that call into that, periodic scientist call as well.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: And then we heard some
testimony a couple weeks ago that it's not enough just to remove the
phosphorus, there's other issues, and that the STAs are not as -- the
best form of purifying the water or improving the water. I don't want
to -- I don't want to mislead anyone. Can you speak to that, please.
MS. LEEDS: Well, I can tell you that the stormwater treatment
areas were designed to remove phosphorus. That's their primary
function. And their primary function was remove phosphorus and
water from the Everglades Agricultural Area as it went south to the
Everglades Protection Area. It was recognized that that particular
nutrient was allowing cattails to expand at an ever-expansive rate.
And even though they're native, it wasn't the natural environment.
The Everglades is a very low-phosphorus environment, and this was
high-phosphorus water that was coming in.
So they are designed strictly to move phosphorus. Some
nitrogen may drop out as a result, but as far as some of the other
constituents and water quality, again, they were designed to address
phosphorus.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Thank you. That makes sense.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Well, that leads me right to my
questions, and that was, what type of nutrient extraction
methodologies do you have going on? Is it strictly, predominantly,
for phosphorus?
MS. LEEDS: Yes.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. Is there an opportunity to
May 28, 2019
Page 34
adjust the methodologies for other nutrients that are part and parcel to
the discharges?
MS. LEEDS: So I know in the past they've looked at, from a
science perspective, how to maybe design and treat and reduce
nitrogen coming down the Caloosahatchee River with, like, the green
technology and, like, with different plants and the water flow kind of
coming through it.
I know that the Water Quality Feasibility Study that we received
an executive order from Governor DeSantis, I believe, is going to
look at not only addressing phosphorus, but they may be looking at
nitrogen. I'm not 100 percent. I'd have to check on that for you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. Well -- and that flies in line
with what you're being asked by us. We're hearing a lot of
information and there's -- by the way, there's not a silver bullet for
this issue. There's a lot of circumstances all the way, Commissioner
Saunders, from what's transpiring north of the lake to how we're
attenuating the water on the south side.
So I just -- I just want to make it -- as we're going through this --
as we're going through these motions, I just want to make this very
clear that we're doing everything we possibly can to hit both sides of
the nutrient issues that are coming out of that lake.
I heard something from one of the -- from one of the speakers
that we had a couple of weeks ago, and that was my question to you:
Jurisdictionally, who's in charge of the lake itself? I mean, one of the
presenters two weeks ago said straight up, well, you could dump
distilled water in the north end of the lake, and it would come out
polluted on the south side.
So for and until we actually dredge that lake and take those --
the nutrients that are laying on the bottom of that, who's in charge of
that? Is there anyone?
MS. LEEDS: Again, the question about lake management, I
May 28, 2019
Page 35
think, it comes down to, you know, the Corps is the one who
regulates the discharges. The Water Management District has input
onto that, but with respect to who can go in there and implement
those projects, I mean, if the Water Management District was
directed to do that from the governor's office --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay.
MS. LEEDS: -- yeah.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. Well, just so you know,
there's a gentleman sitting in the back of the room that was part and
parcel to a very, very successful cleanup project called Lake Trafford
where they actually, in fact, went and pumped a million and a half,
two million tons of sludge out of the bottom of the lake, and now we
have a thriving Lake Trafford. I mean, they're catching eight - and
10-pounders out there now today.
So thank you very much, Jennifer. That was a fine presentation.
MS. LEEDS: You're welcome.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Thank you.
MR. OCHS: Mr. Chairman, before we move on, I failed to ask
for a motion to accept today's proclamations, if we could get that
done, please.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: So moved.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Second.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: It's been moved and seconded that
we accept today's proclamations. A good chair would have reminded
you of that.
MR. OCHS: No. My fault, sir.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: All in favor?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Aye.
May 28, 2019
Page 36
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Opposed same sign, same sound.
(No response.)
MR. OCHS: Mr. Chairman, you have your 10 o'clock
time-certain. Would you like to hear your brief --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yes, yes.
MR. OCHS: -- presentation under 5B first?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Dan's going to be brief.
MR. OCHS: This Dan?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Be brief, be brilliant.
Item #5B
PRESENTATION BY THE COUNTY'S EMERGENCY
MANAGEMENT DIRECTOR ON THE STATUS OF HURRICANE
IRMA RECOVERY AND AFTER-ACTION EFFORTS AND
HURRICANE PREPAREDNESS FOR THE UPCOMING SEASON
– PRESENTED
MR. OCHS: Commissioners, Item 5B is a presentation by the
county's Emergency Management director, Dan Summers, on the
status of Hurricane Irma recovery and after-action efforts and
hurricane preparedness for the upcoming season.
MR. SUMMERS: Commissioners, good morning. For the
record, Dan Summers, director of the Bureau of Emergency Services
and Emergency Management. And you asked for me to be acronym
free. I may have to stop talking right now, so I'll do my best.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Just answer this. Is everything
good?
MR. SUMMERS: Everything's good, sir. Right now that's
good.
May 28, 2019
Page 37
Real quick, let me take an opportunity just to -- some of my staff
is here today, and they've certainly been part of this tremendous
response and recovery effort.
Lauren Bonica, our Human Services program manager; John
Newman with our Logistics Division; Wade Halbert, our new
voluntary and unmet needs recovery coordinator; William Lang, our
alert and warning coordinator; and very proud, this is his first 15
minutes on the job, we have a transitional senior airman from t he Air
Force, Mr. Philip Paddock (phonetic), and Philip is joining us for the
summer as he attends Embry -Riddle University. We thank him for
his services, and we're happy to have him on board with his first 30
minutes on the job this morning.
I'm not going to -- we have a slide here. I have a lot for you to
read, but just real quickly, obviously, we took a major hit with
Hurricane Irma. And I think the thing I want you to take out of that
is our priority statement at the bottom is our job is to support the
survivors, restore power, bring us back to pre-disaster conditions, and
bring us back to quality of place. And, certainly, this is a tremendous
team effort on behalf of everyone in Collier County and our public
and private partners.
The significance in this particular slide besides 3.618 million
cubic yards of vegetative debris by our solid waste folks, just a
phenomenal effort. And as you know, we were on the heels of
Hurricane Harvey, so that was quite challenging.
I think the most noteworthy component here is the power
restoration. Although there were 5 million customers without power
in Florida as a result of Irma, our power restoration came back
significantly after 10 days as opposed to 18 days with Wilma.
And our after-action review process -- and a real tip of the hat to
County Manager Leo Ochs and to Nick in terms of they've really
been driving us hard countywide to make sure that we're working on
May 28, 2019
Page 38
these corrective action items, and we've enjoyed that review almost
monthly since Irma.
We had three components within our after-action review;
certainly, our independent review by the consultant that we shared
with you shortly after Irma; our ongoing agency activity and; finally,
our continuous evaluation. Three hundred sixty-five days a year is
our preparedness motto in Collier County and Emergency
Management working every day to refine policies and procedures.
There are about six major components here in after action, if you
remember, were kind of worrisome. First of all, were the fuel
strategies, both retail and governmental, shelter staffing; the nursing
homes; generator power. We'll talk briefly about that in terms of
potable and wastewater; landline and wireless communications I
know was a little frustrating for us as well. Survivor recove ry and
public messaging.
Real quick, let's talk about the fuel. This is the toughy. We're
doing good on the government side, and we have built additional
contracting capability, and Florida Division of Emergency
Management has made a real concerted effort to revisit their
strategies for emergency response.
The legislature took a close look at fuel actions this year but,
unfortunately, it died in committee. I highly suspect that we'll see
some initiatives out of Florida Division of Emergency Management
and even with the legislative package this year to revisit retail fuel
strategies during times of disaster. Unfortunately, this was only
magnified and strengthened as a result of Hurricane Michael as well.
So Florida's had two tough goes, so to speak, with retail fuel,
and I think you'll see some new strategies at the state level to make
this a little bit better.
Our successes have been we've programmed an additional fuel
wagon. We're also reaching out -- there's very limited statutory
May 28, 2019
Page 39
authority that I have with retail fuel. We were hoping some of that
legislation would change this year. We're going to poll local fuel
stations and just see the ones that meet the state requirement and see
what their kilowatt requirements are for generators. I suspe ct we'll
see the state maybe partner with the retail fuel distributors to see if
there isn't some way to bring retail fuel back.
But one point of -- comment here with retail fuel, understand
that really it's one thing to have fuel in the ground; it's anot her thing
to have power. But if they don't have Internet connectivity, point of
sale, meaning sliding your card in and out of the machine, is
problematic. A lot of these facilities, retail establishments, would
prefer not to do all that volume of fuel in cash. So point of sale is one
issue and power, certainly, is the other.
We couldn't have asked for better support with our expanding
shelter numbers from the support we had from Dr. Patton. She just
recently spoke at the governor's hurricane conference. She has
entered into a new interlocal agreement with us, and she's done
substantial training with her staff related to shelter operations. We've
expanded the number of shelters and expanded the number of county
staff that are receiving training this summer.
Yes, ma'am.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: If I may go back to your
acquisitions under fuel. You talk about new retail outlets. As I
remember, Racetrac was one of the last service stations countywide
to open up.
MR. SUMMERS: In terms of acquisitions, I'm only noting the
fact that we've had new stations come on board. We have not
addressed generator issues. They are required to have the transfer
switch, but the statute does not require them to have a generator nor
deploy. And I think as we get back into that legislative discussion, I
think -- I've been told that the state EM director's going to bring a
May 28, 2019
Page 40
new legislative package this fall to revisit some of those retail fuel
opportunities on evacuation routes.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: So we can't preempt the state;
this is in state control?
MR. SUMMERS: That was what was in the legislative package
was to prohibit local government from preemption, and we had that
conversation, if you remember, last year, with DSAC as well. So,
again, yes, ma'am, I think that might be something for future
discussion in the legislation as to whether or not we can have
preemption.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: And give it to our -- make it one
of our legislative agendas.
MR. SUMMERS: Yes, ma'am. I know you have a full slate,
but that's certainly something to consider. And I hope to be bringing
you new information when the state EM director brings his package.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Thank you.
MR. SUMMERS: Shelter's going very well. Doing a lot of
work at Palmetto Ridge to improve the medically frail shelter there as
well and rolling out in the new hurricane evacuation rezone map so
that we can do a little more targeting in our evacuation notices. Irma
certainly got the attention of everyone, but we think with the -- if you
will pardon, the average garden variety hurricane, we can really nail
down those areas that need to be evacuated and recommend to many
that they, in fact, shelter in place.
As we say, our shelters are strictly a refuge. They are not the
hotel. They're not the Hilton. But we'll do our very best with the
resources we have available to us.
In Lauren's area the nursing homes and emergency power
program that the governor put in emergency orders for is going very
well. We have all of our local facilities meeting the requirements
with either brand-new stationary equipment or on-site rental
May 28, 2019
Page 41
equipment throughout the season.
Now, we do have some local legislation or local ordinance. We
did preempt that. That was not challenged this year in the legislature
where we require third-party attestation of that generator, and we'll
have visibility on their fuel burn rates. So I think we're in much,
much better shape with our nursing homes and rest homes. This has
been a challenge for them not only from the expense, but just merely
getting the equipment.
Also, if you remember, we gave them a little bit of wiggle room
in the Land Development Code that made it easier for those
generators to be installed without an SDP modification.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Those are things we did on a local
level.
MR. SUMMERS: We did on a local level, and we don't want to
lose that preemption; that's my hope.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And do we have folks that are
actually going out after the fact and testing and making sure that
these are functioning properly?
MR. SUMMERS: The third-party attestation is the test. So we
do require a letter from a third party such as a maintenance contractor
to go out there and validate. We also have -- we're setting up a
conference call network with those facilities to check in on them so
that we have visibility on their conditions throughout the event.
Wastewater, potable water, and -- a lot's being done there with
additional infrastructure, particularly with standby emergency
equipment. As you see pre-Irma, there was roughly 100 pieces of
portable equipment; 127 in the wastewater fleet at this time; 159
units -- this is a running total here; and then we've got a large grant
application in to FEMA. Hopefully we'll get award on that within the
next 90 days, and then we'll have procurement time to use the
mitigation grant money for additional not only standby, but -- I'm
May 28, 2019
Page 42
sorry, fixed generators as well as portable. So a lot of work being
done there to make that as cost effective as possible for the lift
stations.
Wastewater strategies include making modifications to our
waste -- water/sewer district's utility manual, particularly those with
private pump stations as well, and a really good job -- a new program
with Florida Warn, which is the utilities -- pardon me, the utilities
mutual aid engagement. We deployed -- Dr. Yilmaz sent staff up to
Tallahassee. Other utilities have partnered with different disasters,
and that's going extremely well.
Landline communications. Several of us responded to
Hurricane Michael, and we saw pictures just like this with tower
failures. We saw no tower failures, structural failures in Collier
County and, for the most part, our wireless providers did a pretty
good job; however, they rely on CenturyLink, and they had a
switch-system failure and a structural failure as those calls go from
the tower through the central switching office and off into other
locations.
We've met with Verizon. We've talked with them about some
additional strategies. They've been the best carrier to come to the
table and talk with us. So we're very plugged in with them, and we
hope to even have a Verizon representative in our EOC should we
have a major event.
Survivor recovery. You know, the most important part here is
we've got this massive and lengthy transition to where government
steps aside and our human services and non-profit agencies start
working with those for long-term recovery.
And we -- thanks to your help, having the voluntary and unmet
needs coordinator -- that was a very difficult solicitation to find
someone for that position, and we do have that position filled, and
we're making really good strides in networking with these agencies,
May 28, 2019
Page 43
building team support, and really getting focus together not only to be
ready for the next event, but helping those clients right now
community wide that have some long-term recovery issues.
Alert and warning. Our Alert Collier is going extremely well
but, as you know, we have a lot of mechanisms for communication.
Our Alert Collier, Collier 311 is in place. We've got several public
outreaches scheduled. We've got opportunities -- we're speaking at
the Naples Daily News community room for a number of
presentations. We'll be doing some pieces on Facebook and Twitter
and our website, social media opportunities, and we want to
encourage folks to mark CollierCountyFL.gov as one of their
favorites, because we'll be putting a lot of information on our home
page, particularly if we have an event.
Individual and self-preparedness, family preparedness, business
preparedness. We can't speak enough about that. Hopefully folks
don't forget but, again, making sure that we have not only the disaster
kit but the financial resources. We're finding so many families being
challenged during these disaster events. And while we work on a
rainy-day fund, every family needs a rainy -day fund as well. And
public shelters, again, as a last resort.
I can't do this without the cooperation of our partners, and this is
just a partial list of those folks, and we certainly need to thank them
for assisting. We've got a very generous community that's put a lot of
time and effort and resources. All of our nonprofits, our Salvation
Army leading the way on long-term recovery for many of these
clients. And again, every -- I hate to call one out, but we've got one
agency right across the street here who's managing a phenomenal
casework environment, and we're monitoring that and assisting that
effort wherever we can.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Thank you, Dan.
MR. SUMMERS: So let me take a deep breath here and see if
May 28, 2019
Page 44
you have any questions.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Fiala does.
MR. SUMMERS: Yes, ma'am.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I hope this is just a quick question.
MR. SUMMERS: Yes, ma'am.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: When faith-based organizations
come in after the storm to rebuild, and they bring their own tools and
everything, there was a problem with where to house them here while
they slept overnight. Some would stay a week or 10 days just to
work. Where -- have we solved that problem, or can we solve it?
MR. SUMMERS: We've got some really good ideas.
Unfortunately, it does take some resources to do that. But we're
having some active discussions with a number of agencies right now
about the concept that Monroe County put together, which was
Voluntary Village. And whether that is a military type tent base
camp operation might be one way to look at it. Maybe even rent a
big box and let folks dormitory style in a big box or find other
opportunity. So we're having that discussion with a lot of the
agencies right now. I don't have any concrete plans, but we're very
much aware of that concern.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Anything else?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Thank you very much.
MR. SUMMERS: Thank you all for the support. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Appreciate your help.
MR. OCHS: Thank you, Dan.
Mr. Chairman, would you like to take an early court reporter
break before you move into your time-certain hearing, or do you want
to just break it up?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: It depends on how focused Terri is.
Let's take a break. We'll be back at 10:25 for the 10 o'clock
May 28, 2019
Page 45
time-certain.
(A brief recess was had.)
MR. OCHS: Mr. Chairman, you have a live mic.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Good morning, everybody. We're
back for our time-certain.
Item #11B
OFFER FROM METRO COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT
GROUP LLC IN THE AMOUNT OF $3,500,000 FOR THE
COUNTY-OWNED PARCEL LOCATED BETWEEN
IMMOKALEE ROAD AND 4TH STREET NORTHEAST
(RANDALL CURVE PARCEL) AND AUTHORIZE THE
COUNTY MANAGER TO NEGOTIATE A DEVELOPER
CONTRIBUTION AGREEMENT WITH IMMOKALEE ROAD
RURAL VILLAGE FOR THE DEVELOPMENT OF A JOINT
COUNTY AND SCHOOL DISTRICT PROJECT - MOTION
SETTING THE DATE AND TIME OF JUNE 14, 2019 AT 2PM TO
ACCEPT BEST AND FINAL SEALED OFFERS FOR THE
PARCEL AT WHICH POINT STAFF WILL REVIEW AND RANK
THE OFFERS AND BRING THE ITEM BACK AT THE JUNE 25,
2019 BCC MEETING – APPROVED
MR. OCHS: Commissioners, this is Item 11B on this morning's
agenda. It's a recommendation to accept the offer from Metro
Commercial Development Group in the amount of $3,500,000 for the
county-owned parcel located between Immokalee Road and Fourth
Street Northeast, commonly referred to as the Randall Curve parcel,
and authorize the County Manager to negotiate a Developer
Contribution Agreement with the Immokalee Road Rural Village for
development of a joint county and school district project.
May 28, 2019
Page 46
Ms. Toni Mott, your real estate services manager, will bring you
up to speed.
MR. MILLER: And, Mr. Chairman, we've 21 registered public
speakers for this item.
MS. MOTT: Good morning, Commissioners. For the record,
Toni Mott, Real Property Management.
At your April 23rd board meeting, the Board directed to
continue the item to May 28th to allow Commissioner McDaniel to
hold his town hall and to ask the offerers to make a presentation at
today's meeting.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And we did find out that that is a
word, by the way, offerers, yes. Sue wasn't all that sure about it.
Now, before we go into this presentation, County Manager, let's
have a little discussion. If I'm not mistaken, though we gave
direction to the offerers that we weren't going to accept adjustments,
we did at a later agenda item, on the 17 acres down off of Bayshore
Drive, suggest that any and all offers should come on all government
properties whenever we potentially can.
And if I'm not mistaken, there have been adjustments made to
those offers.
MR. OCHS: Yes, sir. Just this morning we received two
revisions to the four written offers. So two of the four proposers have
made revisions to their original offers. Ms. Mott is, you know,
prepared to talk to you about those.
But you're right, sir, this has begun to be a little bit of a moving
target. So it might be a good idea to, you know, set a final date
where we get best and final offers from any and all proposers for this
parcel, have those sealed and sent by a date certain to Ms. Mott
where we could then evaluate those and bring those back to the Board
for final consideration so you have all the latest information on some
of these revisions, or we could, you know, do it on the fly today, if
May 28, 2019
Page 47
the Board --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: We don't like doing things on the
fly.
MR. OCHS: Yes, sir.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I don't think it would be prudent.
It's not -- I don't -- I prefer to not do things on the fly, although I
oftentimes do, but not here.
I would think it would be prudent for us, because of the
adjustments that, in fact, came in after the fact -- staff gave us a
recommendation based upon the best available information as of last
Wednesday that we accept the Metro offer, but that's now been
adjusted, as so has the Shy Wolf and the Crown offer.
So my inclination is to set a time-certain -- or a time-certain
date, June 14th, I think, is a Friday --
MR. OCHS: It's a Friday, yes, sir.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: -- 2 o'clock. Everybody -- anybody
who is interested in buying this piece of property submit their best
and final offer in a sealed bid, staff opens it in a public format, at
which time we'll have a couple of weeks to review those offers, and
then they can make their recommendations, and we can decide on our
second meeting in June.
I see you tapping your desk down there, County Attorney. How
you feeling about that?
MR. KLATZKOW: I think it's an excellent idea. Do you want
to give a deadline for all submittals?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: June 14th. I mean, we'll actually
make that in the form of a motion.
And I want to say, there are a lot of people that came here to
speak today on this item. We're only 30 minutes behind on a
time-certain at 10, and we will hear the public comment, because
folks take off work to come here and speak. But it would be my
May 28, 2019
Page 48
inclination that that's the path that we travel.
So if you want me to make that in the form of a motion, I will do
so.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I'm number three, but I just want to
comment on that.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. Commissioner Taylor's first.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Am I going -- am I -- are you
calling upon me? Okay.
So what I'd like to understand is so these folks -- they have until
the 14th.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Correct. Do you want me to make
a motion -- are we going to talk about semantics or --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: No, I just need one point of
clarification. After the 14th we are not -- they're not going to come
here on the 25th and say, oh, you know what, I know I wrote that on
the 14th, but I'm going to change that.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: That's correct. That's going to be a
portion of my motion.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: It's a final offer.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Final offer. Sealed bids in by
June 14th at 2 p.m. He's waiting.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Am I next or --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: No, but you were thinking, so
I'm curious about what -- as an attorney.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Well, didn't we have a date -- I
mean, we're redoing the process that we did before. Didn't we have a
date by which all offers had to be in?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: We did.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: And so this will be the "we really
mean it" deadline? And I'm being serious.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Without making a joke. And it's
May 28, 2019
Page 49
something -- we have a process that would eliminate this, but it's an
enormously arduous time-consuming process and that's physically go
through an RFP process where we put out an RFP, we accept bids,
they're sealed bids, and as we go through that, but it takes -- we can
do that, necessarily, here ourselves with direction, if I'm not
mistaken, County Attorney.
MR. KLATZKOW: I'm just trying to think of dates, because I
wanted to get it back to the Board, but that's all I'm trying to think
sitting here. But I'm listening to the conversations.
MR. OCHS: Yeah. Staff is comfortable with the June 14th
deadline for best and final sealed proposals. That gives till the
following Wednesday to prepare that for your agenda of June 25th.
What we would propose on the 25th is to bring you back a rank
list of final and best offers with a recommendation, and then you'll
decide what you want to do as a board on the 25th. Hopefully pick
one and send us back to, you know, negotiate a purchase and sale
agreement.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: But what if -- and I'm just -- I
mean, I'm doing a "what if" here.
MR. OCHS: Yes, ma'am.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Okay. So what if we have
someone who comes up who's written this offer, and said, you know
what, I forgot or, you know what, I meant to add this or, you know
what, what happens then?
MR. OCHS: We would point that out in the --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: We have the discretion of saying
thanks --
MR. OCHS: -- executive summary and say that, you know,
these are the best and finals, and if someone after that time makes a
change, I would think that that would probably disqualify that
proposal.
May 28, 2019
Page 50
MR. KLATZKOW: It depends on three votes. I mean, this is
like -- getting back to Commissioner Solis' point, I mean, as long as
at least a majority of you agree that this is best and final, we're not
going to hear any more changes, that's the end of it. But if you hear
something during the presentation that really catches your interest...
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And here's my thoughts for --
reason that I'm proposing this is I don't want to go through the entire
RFP process, number one; number two, the original offer process was
an open, public format. Everybody knew what everybody else was
bidding. And so there was -- it really wasn't a highest and best sealed
bid with privacy of process. There was that type of privacy offered to
the offerers.
So this way here we have the capacity of saying highest and best
by June 14th, 2 p.m., and if someone chooses to, they can ask, and
with a vote of three, we can make adjustments, but we also can say
"thank you, but no."
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Yeah. And I think we need to
send a pretty clear message that preferably what you wrote is what
you're intending and there's no changing it --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: -- substantially.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: No.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Now, is there any legal issue with
saying that the best and final offers by the 14th need to be sealed?
That won't require some RFP process, will it?
MR. KLATZKOW: Well, I'm not sure what sealed means. I
mean, you're going to get three proposals either mailed or given to
the County Manager, and he'll review them and prepare an executive
summary and bring it back to you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Well, sealed is sealed. To me, it's
an envelope that's sealed that's opened at 2 o'clock, and nobody
May 28, 2019
Page 51
knows what nobody (sic) else is offering until the 2 o'clock public
opening at which point, boom, there they are, and then staff can go
through that recommendation process.
Yes?
MR. KLATZKOW: Yes.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: What would make this come to an
end?
MR. KLATZKOW: Three votes.
MR. OCHS: Yeah, I think this would --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Logistically.
MR. OCHS: -- hopefully get us to the end.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: We have a process called an RFP
process that staff does but, then again, three votes can change that.
We regularly vote on those things in our consent agenda and can
change those. The County Attorney's absolutely correct, this could
go on for quite some time, but --
MR. KLATZKOW: You've got the right to reject all bids.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Sir?
MR. KLATZKOW: You've got the right to reject all bids at the
end of the day. You don't have to accept any of the bids.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And/or accept one.
Let's do this then: I'm going to make a motion that we allow for
highest and best bids to be received in a sealed format by June 14th at
2 p.m. at which point staff will host a public opening for those who
choose to attend.
MR. OCHS: Then the staff with evaluate those proposals and
bring them back --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Well, of course. Do you want me
to put that in my motion?
MR. OCHS: We'll bring it back on June 25th so that everyone
knows --
May 28, 2019
Page 52
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Correct. Staff will review, rank
them, and bring them back to us as you've delineated on the 25th for
us to make a decision on, heads or tails.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I'll second that.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: And we really mean it.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And we really mean it.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I'll second your motion. I
assume we're going to hear from the public.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: We are going to hear from the
public, but it's -- again, there are a lot of folks that have came here to
speak today, and I would welcome that public input. But that -- it's
been moved and seconded that we set the highest and best bids in for
June 14th at 2.
And you want to hold off on voting until we hear from the
public?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Yeah, let's hold off on the
vote until after the --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. Let's do that. Let's move
into the public --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: For clarification, who were the
two -- who did the two offers that were made this morning -- or
amendment to offers, who did they come from?
MR. OCHS: One came from Metro Commercial Development
and one came from --
MS. MOTT: Crown Management.
MR. OCHS: -- Crown Management.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Okay.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Just a brief synopsis. Metro added
contingencies to their offer for rezoning. Previously it was cash, 90
days to close, and Metro joined forces with the Shy Wolf folks.
MS. SWIDERSKI: Crown.
May 28, 2019
Page 53
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Excuse me. Thank you, Beth.
Crown joined forces with the Shy Wolf folks and raised their
offer of cash in as well in the exchange process as we ll. So there's a
lot of moving targets out there.
MR. MILLER: All right. Mr. Chairman, as I said, we have 21
registered speakers. I'm going to ask the speakers to use both
podiums. I will call two names. Please be standing by for your turn.
Our first speaker is --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Hold on. Before we go into that --
MR. MILLER: Yes, sir.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: -- folks that are here to speak, you
have heard the motion of the Board that we are moving down this
process. If you choose to waive and say you're in consent with
what's, in fact, going on, we would welcome that as well. And if
someone comes to the podium and has said what you have already
heard and agree with, say "I agree with that speaker." You'll be
named and registered as a public speaker, but you don't have to take
up your three minutes.
MR. MILLER: All right. Our first speaker is Richard
Yovanovich, and he will be followed by Deanna Drapper.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Waive?
MR. YOVANOVICH: Yes.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: How you doing? Did you see how
he did that?
MR. MILLER: Mr. Yovanovich waives. Deanna Drapper. She
has been ceded -- I'm sorry. She's been ceded additional time from
seven speakers, for a total of 24 minutes.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Do you want to waive?
MS. DRAPPER: I'm not going to take that amount of time, but I
would like to go on --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Come to the podium if you're going
May 28, 2019
Page 54
to speak, Deanna.
MS. DRAPPER: I did bring a presentation of what Shy Wolf
would propose to do. If the commissioners would like to see it, I
would be willing to do it. But I thank you for giving us the
opportunity to speak and move through this process. I keep hearing
"highest and best offer." Things have happened that make our
highest and best offer different and the situation different, and so I
appreciate the process of being able to move that down so that we can
modify that and do what's best for the Golden Gate Estates
community as well as Collier County as a whole.
Thank you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Thank you, Deanna.
MR. MILLER: All right, then. The next registered speaker is
Beth Swiderski.
MS. SWIDERSKI: I waive.
MR. MILLER: Tim Wallen?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: How you doing, Tim?
MR. MILLER: Waiving his time, okay. Cindy Mackey.
MS. MACKEY: Yes, I'd like to speak.
MR. MILLER: Either podium, ma'am.
MS. MACKEY: I'm Cindy Mackey. I'm a Golden Gate Estates
resident. I also have lived in -- my family has lived in Collier County
since 1971.
And good morning to everyone.
I first want to thank you for not having the school bus barn and
the transportation maintenance facility put on the 47 acres. I
appreciate that, and I'm sure all of the Golden Gate Estates residents
do also. And I'm a little nervous.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: You're doing a really good job,
Cindy.
MS. MACKEY: Well, thank you.
May 28, 2019
Page 55
However, I am concerned about the funds of the sale from the
47 acres that are going to help in the construction on the Immokalee
Road Rural Village.
This is not within the Golden Gate Estates area and is in
violation of the Land Trust Agreement, also both the Collier County
schools and Collier County Transportation Department receive
money from federal, state, local entities, and they have fair
distribution from the ad valorem taxes from all citizens.
If the money from the sale of the 47 acres is used to build the
bus barn and the maintenance facility, it would be an unfair,
disproportionate burden on the Golden Gate Estates residents.
Please follow the intent of the original Golden Gate Land Trust
Agreement and place the funds of the sale in an appropriate account
of the GAC Land Trust account for the benefit of the Golden Gate
Estates citizens.
Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Your next registered speaker is Donna Saddler.
(Waves hand.)
MR. MILLER: Waiving.
Richard Hoffman?
MR. HOFFMAN: Speaking.
MR. MILLER: Mr. Hoffman will be followed by Enrico
Avallone.
MR. HOFFMAN: Good morning, Commissioner McDaniel and
County Commissioners. My name is Richard Hoffman. I live in
Valencia Lakes, which is about a mile from the 47 acres, the Randall
Curve that we're talking about.
With regard to the 47 acres, again, the Randall Curve, the
Golden Gate Land Trust maintains that that piece of property belongs
to the Golden Gate Land Trust and any proceeds from the property
should be going to the Golden Gate Land Trust.
May 28, 2019
Page 56
The county administration believes that the county is entitled to
the proceeds from the sale of this property, and the county wants to
use the money as they see fit. In my opinion, this has created some
uncertainty as to who really owns the property and who should get
the proceeds from the property; however, I think there's a simple
solution. I think the county and the Golden Gate Land Estate Trust
should get together and decide who to give the funds to and how to
allocate the funds.
Nobody wants to purchase property from the county if the policy
exists that the purchaser will not get good -- will not get good title
from the county.
So let's be clear -- and I address this comment to the purchasers.
There are potential challenges to the title of this property.
Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Enrico Avallone. He will
be followed by Lane Beatty.
MR. AVALLONE: Hello. Enrico Avallone.
First, everything that I was going to say kind of got messed up
with the change of plans. I remember last time we were here there
was actually a discussion about not accepting new offers. I don't
remember exactly what was said about it, but I thought it was offers
are final, everything was final. But you guys can change your mind;
obviously, you've discussed that. Three votes it's changed.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: We really mean it this time?
MR. AVALLONE: You really mean it? You sure? Because, I
mean, you could maybe mean it next time, too.
Anyway, basically, I just want -- you know, everything I was
going to say is kind of thrown out the window, but make sure that,
you know, you think about what the community needs, what is best
for the community. That's -- I mean, I was going to say a whole
bunch of things about the benefits of this and that project, but we will
May 28, 2019
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hear it next time after an offer.
I was going to talk about Shy Wolf and, you know, some of the
benefits of that, and also the one thing that I want to make sure is
stressed is that there will be community involvement after we make a
decision as to who is purchasing it, whoever gets it. We need to have
the people who live in that stone's throw, you know, area be involved
in making decisions as to how it's going to be. Whether it's Shy
Wolf, we need to know; you know, we need to be involved. If it's
one of the other companies, we need a voice. So just make sure that
that happens.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Amen.
MR. AVALLONE: Outside of that, I will be done because I'll
have something to say next time we're here.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Outstanding. Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Lane Beatty.
MR. BEATTY: Waive.
MR. MILLER: He's waiving. John Pelletier. Mr. Pelletier will
be followed by Jill Rosenfeld.
MR. PELLETIER: Good morning. Good morning,
Commissioners. Thank you for letting me speak here today again.
My name is John Pelletier, and I live a few hundred feet away from
this property.
You know, when I first came to speak to you all about the bus
barn, that was my focus, industrial use. As soon as that meeting
ended in December, we did do quite a few rallies against this, and
thank you for listening. I think that was a good -- great, great choice.
You know, when I first spoke in December I also mentioned
that, you know, to go have some fun for family entertainment, we'd
have to have a two-hour round trip to Blockbuster Video, and the
closest Publix was about an hour round trip.
So taking into account this property is the center hub of our
May 28, 2019
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community, I still believe that this is the perfect opportunity for
pleasant amenities, and also during our street meeting, that was
exactly what the residents had expressed, amenities.
In addition, Commissioner McDaniel's meeting, town hall
meeting was terrific. You know, 45 percent of the people were in
favor of amenities, commercial retail and commercial entertainment,
restaurants being at the top.
So thank you for taking comments into consideration here today,
and I would appreciate community involvement moving forward.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Thank you, John.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Jill Rosenfeld. She's
waiving time. Your final speaker is Michael R. Ramsey. He was
ceded additional time from Linda Wallen. Ms. Wallen, are you here?
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: Michael, do you want your PowerPoint?
MR. RAMSEY: Yeah.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yes, please.
MR. RAMSEY: Yes, please.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: There you go.
MR. RAMSEY: Sorry.
Good morning. My name's Michael Ramsey. I'm the president
of Golden Gate Estates Civic Association.
First of all, I'd like to -- we very much like the decision this
morning to extend this to June 14th and then look at some new offers.
I have to tell you that in the conversations we've had in probably
the last four weeks in the meetings we've been to, it's been very
interesting to watch the Estates residents come up to speed on where
the land is and the options available and the somewhat complex
issues that are involved being a part of the GAC Land Trust.
We've had probably three or four months of meetings with our
groups to get people up to speed on this and how it works. One of
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the more interesting aspects about all this stuff is that we have come
to the conclusion that the Estates residents in the last -- especially the
last eight meetings are very interested in this issue and very much
want to participate in it, because they see an option to materially
participate in our community and improve -- have the option to
improve the quality of life in a community in two different locations.
However, we can only have this option based on our opinion
that the 2005 BCC agreement, the stipulations have not been met and
we, therefore, think that the reverter release and discharge is invalid
based on not meeting that agreement.
So we want to ask the commission to help us in this pursuit to
help us improve our community because we're looking at -- right
now, based on the proposals that are out there, at the intersection of
Wilson and Golden Gate Boulevard, the Crown proposal, is offering
to donate 30 acres to the GAC Land Trust if we can get your help on
that issue.
On that -- if we get this 30 acres for the GAC Land Trust, we
feel like we could really come up with some good community
improvements and some good activity with the community. They're
very interested in this area.
We've got the ability here to have a passive park, a conservation
area, a recreation area, a community center, a community building
that's really needed. We're looking at trying -- one of the things that's
missing we think is necessary is a senior center and some areas for
that, and we're willing to look at some of the other activities we could
put on this.
So after all the conversations and all the meetings, coming up
here and listening to all the items that we have to deal with, the
community believes that the best option so far is a donation of
property to the GAC Land Trust and let us work with our community
issues, and that's what we would like for you-all to help us with and
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consider that when we come back on this issue.
So thank you very much.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner, did you have a
question for him?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Point of clarification to our
County Manager and to our County Attorney. Didn't Mr. Ramsey
just make an offer? Because if you did, it needs to come to us in a
sealed envelope, or we're not going to consider it. So that -- right? I
mean, did he just make an offer? Donate the land.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: No. He is not -- he is not one of the
offerers. He's making a suggestion as to what we do with one of the
folks who is, in fact, making an offer.
He is the president of the Golden Gate Estates Civic
Association. He is not one of the offerers.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Well, when there's a transfer of
land, that's certainly a substantial amount of money. So somehow
this has to be -- somehow this controversy over who really owns the
land and who --
MR. KLATZKOW: Well, wait a minute. It's not a controversy.
We own the land. You can do whatever you want with it.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: That's correct. And I'm going to
just say this: Regularly we get caught in leading information that is
given to us by a public speaker, and we have to be careful and
cautious of that because sometimes, without malice, things are
represented that aren't absolutely correct.
We had another public speaker represent that there was issues
with the title. Those are representations of a public speaker. They're
not here -- this isn't a quasi-judicial process. This isn't a court of law.
This is -- these folks have the right to come up here and tell us the
sky is purple.
May 28, 2019
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COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: No. I just think it would be very
helpful just to put it on the record, at this point the county does not
agree with the idea that the -- that the Golden Gate Land Trust can
participate in any part of this transaction.
MR. RAMSEY: And that's the clarification I'd like to make. It
is our opinion, legally, it does belong to the GAC Land Trust --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Right.
MR. RAMSEY: -- because of us not meeting the stipulations in
the agreement.
Secondly, on the other issue brought up, my comment from our
group is that we favor proposals for the land exchange, for land
exchanges, and the 30 acres is a good proposal.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Okay.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And as a point of clarification,
Commissioner Taylor, when we, in fact, make a decision on what
we're going to do with the disposition of this asset, we can also
delineate and staff can make recommendations, as they have so far,
as to what to do with the proceeds of those funds.
There's certainly a difference of opinion as to where those
proceeds should, in fact, go, and we'll move through that process
when we come back in June to make the decision on what we're
going to do.
Everybody else okay?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: All right. It's been moved and
seconded that we proceed as the prior -- you want me to repeat that
motion? You want me to --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: No.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: It's been moved and seconded that
we receive the bids by June 14th at 2 o'clock, and we really mean it,
Alex.
May 28, 2019
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Any other discussion?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: All in favor?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Opposed same sign, same sound.
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: So moved. There you go.
Thank you all very much.
Item #7
PUBLIC COMMENTS ON GENERAL TOPICS NOT ON THE
CURRENT OR FUTURE AGENDA
MR. OCHS: Mr. Chairman, this takes us to Item 7 on your
agenda, public comments on general topics not on the current or
future agenda.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Mr. Chairman, we have three
registered speakers for this topic. Your first speaker is Garrett
Beyrent, and he will be followed by Julio Garcia.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: What's Garrett got for us today?
He doesn't have any prizes. Garrett, you're up first. He's going to the
back. He does have a prize. I thought we were going to get away
without any gifts.
MR. BEYRENT: No way.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: No way. Okay.
MR. BEYRENT: For the record, Garrett F.X. Beyrent, lobbyist,
May 28, 2019
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and I do not represent the Panera Bread company. I just hang out
there.
Inside this I have an award for a job that I gave to Andy Solis,
okay. It's actually a pickleball, and I replaced the item that was on
top of your trophy because, unfortunately, I have to go to two
funerals. I lost my nephew and my niece to heroin overdoses. I have
to go to Livingston Road, New Jersey and bury them.
And this actually is going on the top of the trophy I awarded to
you several months ago, and you know, you and I both lost friends
today, right? You do.
And this has got a name on the pickleball. And it's
self-explanatory, but I'll give it to you. Then I've got to catch an
airplane and go to Livingston.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: God bless you.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I'm sorry for your loss.
MR. MILLER: Your next public speaker under public comment
is Julio Garcia. He will be followed by Joe Popp.
Speak into the microphone, sir.
MR. GARCIA: Yes, sir. The complaint I got over here is
against Code Enforcement. I don't know if you take this under
consideration, but they've been -- I've seen complaints, like 10 of
them, you know, they showed up, with no compliance report, and
they kept actually harassing me, you know, since back in December,
you know.
And right now I have an appearance, you know, on 6/7 next
month, you know.
And I don't know who overlooks all this, but I don't have any
other place to go to for -- you know, to overlook these issues, you
know. If you have any suggestions, you know.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Where do you live?
MR. GARCIA: East Naples.
May 28, 2019
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CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. And what part of East
Naples?
MR. GARCIA: Naples Manor.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Fiala is your -- is the
commissioner for that area. And I would suggest before you go to
your hearing that you reach out to her, her office, and see if you can
schedule an appointment to find out if you can work through these
issues.
I mean, there is a process with regard to our Code Enforcement,
but you have an opportunity to speak with her and then -- and see if
you can work through these.
MR. GARCIA: Okay. That's what I want to find out. I wanted
some answers, you know, to who's overlooking all this, you know.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Well, I would ask you to go right
next door. When you go out this door, just turn right, go in those
other doors, and there's a lady sitting right there.
MR. GARCIA: Right.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Ask her if you can please speak to
Mike, he is my assistant, and he'll take notes and we'll work on it.
I'm not quite sure what the issue is, but we can handle it.
MR. GARCIA: I have a paper here for all the --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay. And give it to Mike. He'll
meet you out there.
MR. GARCIA: Okay.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: And, Thaddeus, are you here to
help?
MR. COHEN: Yes.
MR. OCHS: Mr. Cohen will help this gentleman as well.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Thaddeus, you'll make sure he gets
taken care of?
May 28, 2019
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MR. COHEN: Yes.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Thank you very much.
MR. GARCIA: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yes, sir.
MR. MILLER: Your final speaker for public comment is Joe
Popp.
MR. POPP: Hello, Joe Popp.
I represent a group that owns property on Rivers Road, 19 acres
which is contiguous to the Rivers Road Preserve. And I just wanted
to let you folks know that I believe it should be part of that park, if
possible. I know you don't have a funding cycle going on. But the
property's currently on the market.
I just wanted you to know that I am open to making it part of the
preserve, and I think it would be a shame if somebody came along
and bought it before your next cycle.
I don't know if there's any methods that could happen, but I just
want to throw it out there that it's a good piece and something the
county should look at.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I believe the county already knows
about it. If I'm not mistaken, Toni -- Toni Mott sent that piece of
property to the folks at Shy Wolf as a potential location for them. I
know the county's actually aware of the site, so...
MR. POPP: I'm sure they are. I have an application in. There's
an urgency; the group wants to move the property, and I feel it should
be part of the park. So if there's anything I can do to speed it up, I'm
trying to.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Where is the property?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Rivers Road.
MR. POPP: It's at the end of the Rivers Road. It's 19.4 acres.
It's contiguous to the preserve that's already there.
May 28, 2019
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CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Rivers Road, south of -- is a road
that goes -- it's a private road.
MR. POPP: It dead ends right into the property.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: We say cul-de-sac; dead-end is...
MR. POPP: Oh, okay. Cul-de-sac.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: It's a private road off of Immokalee
Road. It goes south, correct?
MR. POPP: Correct.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yes.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: At some point today, if you can
stay with us, we are going to be discussing a Conservation Collier
process.
MR. POPP: Okay.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: And you may find that
interesting, and you may be able to contact folks, staff people who
will present to that.
MR. POPP: Okay, great.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I think he already has an
application into Conservation Collier, if I'm not mistaken.
MR. POPP: That's true.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: That's true.
MR. POPP: It's true. You know, it's just in limbo, I guess.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right, thank you.
MR. POPP: Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Mr. Chair, that was your final speaker for public
comment.
Item #11A
EXERCISE THE SECOND AND FINAL RENEWAL OPTION OF
THE FRANCHISE AGREEMENTS FOR SOLID WASTE,
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RECYCLABLE MATERIALS, AND YARD TRASH
COLLECTION SERVICES WITH WASTE MANAGEMENT INC.
OF FLORIDA, AND WASTE CONNECTIONS OF FLORIDA,
INC., FOR AN ADDITIONAL TERM OF SEVEN YEARS,
ENDING ON SEPTEMBER 30, 2027 - MOTION TO APPROVE –
APPROVED
MR. OCHS: Commissioners, that moves us on to Item 11A this
morning. This is a recommendation to exercise the second and final
renewal option of the franchise agreements for solid waste recyclable
materials and yard collection services with Waste Management,
Incorporated, of Florida, and Waste Connections of Florida,
Incorporated, for an additional term of seven years ending on
September 30, 2027.
Ms. Kari Hodgson, your Solid and Hazardous Waste
Management division director, will make a brief presentation.
MS. HODGSON: Good morning, Commissioners. My name is
Kari Hodgson. I'm the director for Solid and Hazardous Waste
Management.
We're here today to ask you to exercise the final renewal option
for the current franchise agreement as it relates to the curbside
collection for recycling and solid waste for Collier County residents.
We offer this exercise with no changes or amendments.
Consulting, benchmarking, and best-value reports have
determined that the services provided to Collier County residents is
the best value. The existing franchise services collect approximately
141,000 tons annually of solid waste management -- I'm sorry -- of
solid waste from the residents of Collier County and guarantees the
disposal of the recyclables.
Third-party benchmarking has also determined that these
franchise agreements are the best value for the county compared to
May 28, 2019
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other jurisdictions in Florida.
The county maintains a solid waste mission to deliver
best-value, high-quality sustainable solid waste management services
that meet our customers' expectations.
With that being said, the Board approved the county's solid
waste management strategy in 2006 with important guidelines,
including environmental growth and management. The franchise
agreements that are in place have maintained and upheld these values
from everything from participating in pilot studies, offering best
service, airspace preservation, operational excellence, and best-value
service.
This contract over its term is approximately $110 million;
however, this contract also has in place many stipulations that save
the county residents money, including a CPI adjustment that saves
about $3 million over the term of the contract.
So with that being said, we do recommend that this franchise
agreement be renewed for its last renewal option for seven years.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Thank you.
Commissioner Fiala.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yes. Well, I'm going to just step
right in and say we have about the best service anybody could ever
have around the state of Florida. And I can't even see of any
improvements that can be made. Although, if I did, I would present
it, and they would probably try and see if they could make it happen.
But we have great service. And when I talk with other people,
not only around the state of Florida but in other states, man, we beat
them hands down, so why mess with something that's already
perfect? I make a motion to approve.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Second.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: It's been moved and seconded.
Is there any other discussion?
May 28, 2019
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And approximately how many collections do we do a day?
MS. HODGSON: On a day -- it's about -- it's over 13,000 --
613,000 collections a week; about 204 million a month. That's
commercial and residential.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I'd just like to add a little number.
Do you have enough zeros on your calculator to do that?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: No.
MS. HODGSON: It's a lot. Twice-a-week collection is a lot.
It's great.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: It's been moved and seconded that
we accept the recommendation. Any other discussion?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: All in favor?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Opposed same sign, same sound.
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: So moved.
MS. HODGSON: Thank you. Thank you for your time.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Thanks for the great service.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Thank you, Kari and Dan.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: And Waste Management.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And Waste Management and all
those other folks.
Item #11C
PROVIDE STAFF DIRECTION ON THE CONSERVATION
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COLLIER PROPERTY ACQUISITION STRATEGY FOR
FUTURE CYCLES - MOTION TO ADOPT STAFF’S
RECOMMENDATION WITH DEVELOPING A STRATEGIC
ACQUISITION PLAN INCORPORATING BCC DIRECTION –
APPROVED
MR. OCHS: Mr. Chairman, that moves us to Item 11C this
morning. It's a recommendation to provide staff direction on the
Conservation Collier Property Acquisition Strategy for future cycles.
Summer Araque, your principal environmental specialist with
the Conservation Collier Program, will present.
MR. MILLER: And, Mr. Chairman, I have three registered
speakers for this item.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Thank you, sir.
MS. ARAQUE: Good morning. I'll just wait a minute.
Good morning. Hello. Summer Araque, Conservation Collier
coordinator.
During the January 22nd BCC meeting, the Board requested that
if staff has a plan for acquisition, that we distribute it to the Board. In
February we compiled the Conservation Collier History of Property
Acquisitions Strategy Document and were requested in March to
schedule to report back to you in May, so we are here today.
Some of the questions that you had in the January meeting were,
and comments: Do we have a plan? We'd like to have a strategic
plan. If we do have a plan, please distribute it to the BCC. And also
that you would like us to be actively identifying where we want to
buy the property.
So I'm here today to answer your questions and continue
discussion -- the discussion and obtain further direction from you.
So with that, we'll get started. So an overview. Today I will
provide you a brief presentation addressing the history of
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Conservation Collier Acquisition Planning, an update on the
Referendum Ballot Language Task Force, and acquisition strategy
that would only be necessitated if additional funding is provided, and
staff is seeking direction on a proposed acquisition strategy if you
choose for us to do one.
The document you were provided titled the "History of
Conservation Collier Strategy for Property Acquisition" provides a
history of the Conservation Collier program, property acquisition
strategy since program inception.
In the past, acquisition planning has been done on a
cycle-by-cycle basis, starting with Cycle 1 in 2003. After Cycle 8
was completed in 2010, no further cycles were contemplated as land
acquisition funds were limited.
In Fiscal Year 2013, Conservation Collier acquisition operations
were formally phased out, and accumulated reserves were moved to
Conservation Collier Management Trust Fund to manage our
preservation.
On February 14th, 2017, the Board directed staff to restart the
Conservation Collier land acquisition phase and authorize up to $17
million from the Management Trust Fund.
In regards to the process for identifying properties for
acquisitions in Cycles 1 through 8, the acquisition plan for each cycle
was used to -- used with the criteria for evaluating lands for
acquisition and management from the Conservation Collier
ordinance.
We used the target protection areas, which are larger areas of
environmentally sensitive land. These TPAs are generally broad
areas within Collier County, and next I will show you the map.
This is our target protection area map that has existed for many
years, and this shows the target protection areas, including the urban
area in the yellow, North Golden Gate Estates in that peach col or,
May 28, 2019
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rural fringe sending lands in the light green, and then your rural lands
habitat stewardship areas and the rural lands flowway stewardship
areas.
The process for identifying properties for these acquisition
cycles went through the Land Acquisition Advisory Committee
which determined properties to target for acquisition. After that, the
CCLAC considered the target protection areas, and letters were sent
to these property owners to determine if they were willing sellers. It
is important to note that this has always been a willing-seller
program.
In summary, staff has operated from the current goals and
objectives of the Conservation Collier ordinance consistent with the
target protection areas. We have solicited interested voluntary and
willing sellers through direct mail contact, and in Cycle 9 we focused
on the remaining properties related to Cycle 8 per Board direction.
With that, there are at least $6 million worth of property remaining
on the A list from Cycle 9.
And I would also like to provide you an update on the
Referendum Language Task Force. This is part of the reason why we
would do an acquisition strategy document is if we receive further
funding. We do not need an acquisition document if we're not further
funded.
So moving forward -- the task force is moving forward under the
following assumptions that we would take the referendum language
to the November 2020 election and, two, that the funding source
would be ad valorem as done previously.
Did you have a question or a comment?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: No, ma'am.
MS. ARAQUE: So they are on target to bring the language to
you in December 2019. And if, again, if you choose for staff to do a
property acquisition strategy in advance of the referendum, we would
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propose to bring the acquisition strategy document back to you in
advance of the ballot language, and the strategy would assist you in
informing on the funds that would be needed and the resultant
millage rate and the term.
So the way that staff is envisioning this is that you would have
the strategy document if you choose for us to do one, and then what
we provide to you in that strategy document would show you an
overview of the lands that are remaining within Collier County for
development.
We would not be providing information such as what the cost is,
the appraisals, or if they're willing sellers. That would all be done
with a cycle. But it simply would be an overview of the lands -- the
undeveloped lands remaining in Collier County so that you are aware
of what we have left going into the approval of the referendum
language.
Do we have any questions?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: There are several lights up here.
Are you done yet?
MR. OCHS: Keep going.
MS. ARAQUE: I believe I have one or two more slides.
Moving forward, staff is seeking direction from the Board as to,
one, do you want staff to continue with the same strategy of doing
cycle-by-cycle evaluation, or do you want staff to do a more detailed
long-range analysis referred to as an acquisition plan to determine
remaining undeveloped land in Collier County.
With that, here is staff's recommendation as provided to you in
the executive summary, and now I'm open for any questions.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Very good. Thank you.
Commissioner Fiala.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I would love to hear the speakers
first. I do have some questions, but I'd love to hear the speakers first.
May 28, 2019
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CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: You want to hear the speakers first?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yes, please.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: How about you, Commissioner
Taylor?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: I just have a point of
clarification, if you would. This history was remarkable --
MS. ARAQUE: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: -- because it really detailed the
thought process, I thought. And what I saw from the first cycle going
back into two thousand and -- well, I guess it was Cycle 1, and then
you -- Cycle 1 was targeting certain areas in the county and certain
sizes. Then you moved to Cycle 2 -- and help me with this -- again,
areas but certain coverage of the property.
I mean, you had a foundational information that you base this
on, but those cycles, those early cycles really looked around the
county for different areas.
And we've heard comments from Audubon. Brad, who has said,
you know, why aren't we building on what we have? And I find
this -- it's sticking in my mind as I review this, because we are now
maturing. If this program goes forward, we've got a substantial
amount of land.
So what I'd like to see, if there is a strategy developed, is to see
where we own lands and the potential for acquisition around those
lands. We heard testimony today about a preserve and there's
19 acres and wouldn't it be great to -- that kind of thing, flowways,
things that make a lot of sense for our environmental health of this
county. So that's all I have to say at this point.
MS. ARAQUE: Okay. So that would fall under Staff
Recommendation No. 1 at the very end after the semicolon "and any
areas surrounding existing Conservation Collier's preserve." So, yes,
we do agree with you on that.
May 28, 2019
Page 75
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Okay. Good. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Fiala, do you want
to speak now?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: No, I really want to hear the
speakers.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I have some comments, but I'll
wait.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okie-doke.
MR. MILLER: Your first speaker is Gladys DelGadillo. She'll
be followed by William Poteet.
MS. DelGADILLO: I'll waive speaking.
MR. MILLER: All right. Mr. Poteet will be followed by
Alexandra Sulecki.
MR. POTEET: Good morning, Commissioners. I'm here just
basically to answer any questions you may have of the Conservation
Collier Land Acquisition Committee that I have the pleasure of
chairing.
I will answer Commissioner Taylor's question. On every
strategy, we've gone out there and we've put certain
recommendations that we were looking for in each strategy, and at
the annual report we gave the Commission each year that was
outlined in the annual report of what we've been doing.
We did look at properties that were adjacent to existing
preserves over the last four or five different acquisition cycles as a
priority for us to do that.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: That's already part of the ordinance,
isn't it?
MR. POTEET: Well, it's -- you know, we set the strategy, and
that's one of the things we try to do.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: It's part of the target.
May 28, 2019
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MR. POTEET: I can't tell you verbatim what's exactly in the
ordinance, but I can tell you that is what we've been doing over the
last few years, trying to do.
The last cycle, there was a lot of examples of properties that
were recommended to us that we sent back to you as eight properties
that were adjacent to existing properties. We had the properties in
the Immokalee area that were adjacent to Pepper Ranch which are
beautiful properties.
And there's no lack of individuals submitting properties for
purchase at this time. And we had $17 million worth of purchases,
and that would have wiped out a normal year on any type of funding
that we would have.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Just a quick question for
Mr. Poteet then. A few months back we authorized the acquisition of
a couple parcels.
MR. POTEET: Yes.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: And we were utilizing a
portion of that $17 million that was set aside. What is the status of
going forward with continuing acquisitions utilizing that fund?
MR. POTEET: Well, the Commission put us on hold. They
specifically said no more acquisitions until we go to the referendum.
So we're dead in the water when it comes to that.
MR. WILLIAMS: You did authorize four properties.
MR. POTEET: We were authorized to purchase four properties
of which I think we're working on three out of the four.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Well, my recollection may be
incorrect, but my recollection is that we authorized those purchases
but we didn't say, after we acquire those purchases, there are not
going to be any further purchases. I don't believe that was the --
MR. POTEET: That was the direction that we took from y our
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meeting. So whether it's correct or incorrect, that is exactly what
we've been doing. We're working on, right now, the referendum
language trying to bring it back so we can go into a full acquisition
cycle.
MR. OCHS: That is correct, sir. We brought you the full list of
recommendations, and then the Board --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: If we take a look at the
record, the reason -- as I remember, I believe I made the motion, but I
may be incorrect on that.
The thought was that you couldn't acquire more than three or
four at one time because of the appraisal process or the process you
had to go through.
MR. OCHS: I'll check the record, but that's not --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: It doesn't matter. If the will
of the Board is that there be no further acquisitions, it doesn't matter.
MR. POTEET: I can tell you Cindy Erbil (phonetic) of the real
estate department is extremely efficient. You tell her to go buy
properties, she will do them one after the other consistently.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Let me ask the Board then
whether or not there's any willingness to continue with the
acquisition process. Remember, we set aside the 17 million for the
purpose of continuing to acquire properties during the time period
prior to the referendum.
My understanding is we acquired -- directed staff to acquire a
few of those parcels, but I didn't understand that that was going to be
the end of the program till the referendum.
The question I would pose is, is there a majority of the Board
that would like to continue to acquire some of these highly ranked
parcels? And if not, that's fine, but my understanding is we would
continue with that.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: My recollection of that meeting was
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that we do make -- we made the offer to buy those four, I think, and
three approved or something along those lines, but there was
hesitation on the Board to continue on with the acquisitions until an
alternative or another funding source was found.
We had set aside that 17 million as a compromise, if you will,
several years ago to a referenda to add to the ad valorem and such to
allow for acquisitions to come, but there's resistance with the Board
to continue on with acquisitions until an additional funding source
was found.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Just one other quick question
then. Of the 17 million, how much has been spent?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: None.
MR. POTEET: There's been some. You bought three out of
four properties.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: We've contracted to buy. I don't
think we bought any yet.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: How much is under contract?
How much is --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: 1.5, 1.6.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: How much is obligated?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: That was one of our earlier slides.
MS. ARAQUE: It was in one of them, and I have this as well if
you want to look at Cycle 9. There. It's 1.5.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: 1.6.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: That's how much has been
spent?
MS. ARAQUE: Yeah. Well, that's currently -- that's what you
approved, so I can give you a quick status. We've purchased -- one
is -- actually Gore was purchased.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Yeah, I just wanted to know
how much had been --
May 28, 2019
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MS. ARAQUE: Yeah, but that's the total. And then one is
under contract you've reviewed, and then we have another contract
coming to you in June. But thi s will be the total will be the 1.5.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: 1.5 out of the 17. And so the
will of the Board is not to continue --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Well, we're in the public speaker
processes right now. I mean, I think we're going to ultimately give
direction. That's why staff is here today to give direction to -- to go
forward or not.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: As we listen to the rest of the
speakers, I'd like to ask the Board to keep in mind the fact that we do
have funds available. We set those aside for continuing acquisitions.
And there are some parcels that have been identified as being very
valuable from an environmental standpoint. So we might want to
continue to acquire properties as we go through the ballot question.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: You lit up. Do you want to speak
to him directly, or do you want to just --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Well, I think -- I mean, I would just
like to say again that we're using the management funds to purchase
property which I think I've said consistently is, in my opinion, a very
bad idea.
We have the referendum coming up. I don't know what the
urgency is to continue to use the management funds if it's going to be
in a referendum next year. There doesn't seem to be any urgency
on -- in regards to the properties that are on the active acquisition list
now, because the ones that we bought were the ones that there was a
concern about purchasing. That's why we didn't buy any other
property.
So I understand the concern and the desire to move forward and
purchase more properties, but let's put it on the ballot and see what
everybody thinks.
May 28, 2019
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COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: That's fine.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Thank you, William.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Alexander Sulecki. She'll
be followed by Meredith Budd.
MS. SULECKI: Good morning, Commissioners. Nice to see
you again.
I'm here today as a citizen from District 4. I've lived in the City
of Naples for 40 years. And I'm also going to draw on my experience
of 25 years working at Collier County and 15 years of those in the
Conservation Collier program.
So I really want to -- I'm here today to support staff's goal of
getting a strategy together. We started in 2003 with nothing. We had
an ordinance, which I didn't participate in creating so I just worked
what others had developed, and we acquired over that time
4,200-plus acres. I think we have good properties. We have a great
citizens advisory committee, and you have a great staff.
But I think now is the time to step back and evaluate, as
Commissioner Taylor said, that basically was my message, too, that
we can step back and evaluate how what we have already can be
made most valuable for conservation through some kind of additional
targeted acquisition if that's what the citizens of Collier County
decide in 2020.
But I think good planning and a strategy is critically important
now because, as you know, it's expensive to buy, to maintain
conservation land and then provide access for it. So we need to, you
know, get the bang -- best bang for the buck out of that money.
So as a citizen now, I'm here to tell you that my support in 2020
for Conservation Collier would depend on whether you have a plan
and a process to do that very thing.
And that's all I have to say to you today, and I'm happy to
answer any questions.
May 28, 2019
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CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Good seeing you, Alex.
MS. SULECKI: Nice to see you.
MR. MILLER: Your final registered speaker for this item is
Meredith Budd.
MS. BUDD: Good morning, Commissioners. Meredith Budd
on behalf of the Florida Wildlife Federation. Thank you, as always,
for the opportunity to speak to you and your consistent support for
the Conservation Collier program.
I want to commend staff for the hard work that they have put
into this successful program. The acquisition strategy that's been
utilized to date that Summer had articulated in her presentation, it's
been effective. But as she noted and as Commissioner Taylor noted,
there's ways that we can maximize that effort that we have for the
program and make it even more effective.
And so I really do support the staff's recommendation to move
forward with an acquisition strategy, and I just wanted to let you all
know that the federation supports it and that we hope that we can act
as a resource to you all, to CCLAC, as we move forward to that 2020
referendum.
Thank you so much.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: All right. Commissioner Fiala.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yes. First, I've got a few questions.
How much money do we have left in the bank, if you will, for either
purchase or maintenance or whatever?
MS. ARAQUE: Well, going on track with what you were doing
previously, if you were going to go back to that authorization of up to
$17 million, I would say we would have somewhere in the range of
15 to 16 million dollars.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: No. I'm -- total.
MR. OCHS: Commissioner, you have about $33 million.
MS. ARAQUE: Total, total.
May 28, 2019
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COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay. I want to make sure that we
have --
MS. ARAQUE: Yes.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: -- money remaining that we can
always maintain the land, and we're always talking about the 17, but
you've got to have money in order to maintain all of that stuff. Okay.
That's my first question.
Second of all, I haven't heard anybody mention -- and maybe I'm
not hearing it correctly. I felt for ever so long that we ne ed to -- land
that is urbanly located -- I don't know if that's -- urbanly located is a
proper comment, but urban land that we can -- somebody offers us to
buy this urban land, and we would never get it otherwise. We don't
have much of anything to preserve right now in urban, and
everybody's complaining about there's so much building and
everything going on, and that's, I think, because they don't have
pockets of green, whether it be parklike space or whatever. We don't
preserve that. We preserve stuff that nobody can ever really see
important things when it comes to the ecology or, you know, to
preserving our future water sources. You have to have that, and I'm
delighted that we're doing that, but I think we need pockets of urban
land also to be presented.
And I don't remember if we have any on that list. I remember
there was something about, like, a little island area. People -- it was
right, like, in the City of Naples or right there. That was a good one
that was urbanized, and I think we went about buying that, didn't we?
I know that there's another one that's over on 951. And, again,
that's -- I don't see anybody trying to buy it because you can't really
use it, but still, I don't think we should spend as much money on
buying things that nobody else would ever want when we could buy
something urban, if that's -- if the opportunity presents itself.
But, anyway -- but I also feel we should move forward and buy
May 28, 2019
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the properties that we identified the last time we talked, because they
were good properties to put in preservation forever.
This is an important project, and I just hope that when we get it
on the ballot, I hope everybody realizes how important this is to the
future of Collier County, because you never can replace what is sold
off and then built on. You know, you can't bring that beautiful
natural feeling back again.
MS. ARAQUE: Okay. So the proposed strategy document
would show you what is remaining in the urban area, and that would
be number one, actually, on our recommendation. Her e's a
breakdown of the existing preserves and how many you have in the
urban area.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I'd like to see it on a map. That
really doesn't show me.
MS. ARAQUE: Yeah, we have that as well. I know this is kind
of hard to read.
So we did have a few urban preserves on the last cycle, and just
for your information that the Hack property in the city did reject our
offer.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: They did?
MS. ARAQUE: Yes, yeah.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yeah, see, we didn't even know
that, I don't think.
MS. ARAQUE: Right. We're always happy to provide you an
update on that.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Taylor, you're still
lit up.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Oh, I am? Okay. So I would
like to see the acquisition strategy worded that in order to enhance --
maybe that's not the correct word, and I'm struggling here because
May 28, 2019
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I'm wordsmithing kind of on the fly. But in order to enhance the
current acquisitions that we have in Collier County under
Conservation Collier that are evaluated, and then we've got 2A and B,
we are -- if you -- are you intending to identify these lands? Not so
much, right?
MS. ARAQUE: So if we go back to the target protection area
map, if you look at that, it's very large, broad-based areas, right? The
urban area's pretty much the entire urban area. So we would identify
within the urban area what we find are actually undeveloped
properties that remain undeveloped. The same thing in the other
areas.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: But are they contiguous to other
acquisitions of Conservation Collier?
MS. ARAQUE: That is on our recommendation as well. So we
would look -- the recommendation includes to look at the target
protection areas urban, Golden Gate Estates, and rural fringe sending
and any existing areas surrounding Conservation Collier properties.
So we would be looking at all our preserves and look to see
what's surrounding. Like, for example, the gentleman that's here
today regarding our Rivers Road Preserve --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Right.
MS. ARAQUE: -- there is still land surrounding that, so we
would identify what remains undeveloped.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: And let's just say that -- on the
fly. That would be the strategy, and that would be what we present to
the voters that if you agree to raise your taxes, this is the process
understanding that the committee will still rank and evaluate --
MS. ARAQUE: Yes.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: -- these. So it's -- so we are
moving towards, instead of using the basis of, okay, this is what we're
looking for to -- these are our lands, these are the area the lands are,
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and we want -- if you agree to pass this referenda, if you agree to tax
yourself, we are going to purchase these lands in these areas; is that
correct?
MS. ARAQUE: We would go to willing se llers, but I would
consider this a planning document, essentially. So it would be not as
broad as your target protection area map but more specific to show
the remaining undeveloped lands that you could --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Contiguous.
MS. ARAQUE: -- yeah, contiguous would definitely be one of
them that we could focus on when a cycle does occur, that we follow
the criteria that they've done in the many cycles past. Now we have
got a document to go to to say this is what we've identified
previously, and then -- nothing is excluded. So if there's something
that's not identified in the plan and -- in the strategy document and
something is nominated or somebody brings it to our attention, that
would always be under consideration. It doesn't exclude any
properties.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: But the foundation is this is what
we've got, these are the areas we have it in, what we want to do is
look at acquisitions contiguous to these lands.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: That's a portion of it, yes, ma'am.
MS. ARAQUE: Yes.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: That's the strategy.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: That's a portion of the strategy.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: What else is the strategy?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Oh, there's a whole bunch. We
haven't even got to hear Commissioner Solis, Commissi oner
Saunders, or myself yet so --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: No, no. I'm not -- this is just -- I
just wanted to understand what staff is presenting. I'm not suggesting
that I have three other -- two other votes to agree to this. I just know
May 28, 2019
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we need to have a strategy. I know we do. We have to.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right.
Commissioner Solis.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I agree that we really do need to
have a strategy for how we're purchasing the properties. I think it
would be the best thing for voters to unde rstand that when they're
asked to consider the referendum. And one of the things I don't think
I saw that is in there is -- and I think Commissioner Taylor had
brought this up a while back, and I thought it was a good point, is to
look at maybe even properties that we currently own --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Yes.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: -- that maybe aren't productive or
usable just because of what's happened around them and evaluate
those as well. Is that going to be part of the strategy?
MS. ARAQUE: I had not considered that, but I will take your
direction.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Okay. And maybe there are none
of those, but I think it's a valid point to consider whether or not, just
over the passage of time and what's developed around one of these
properties, if it's still, for purposes of conservation, worth
maintaining, or would that money be better spent somewhere else.
And, you know, I'm not saying that there are or aren't. I'm just
saying that that might be something that we would want to include in
the strategy.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: One of the -- if I might. Just one of
the requisites was that there would be public access to the
Conservation Collier owned properties, and there are several that
don't have access as of yet, if I'm not mistaken, correct?
MS. ARAQUE: Yes, that is correct.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And so I think valuation of those
parcels that are not as cost effective for access for the public and the
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like maybe need to be given consideration. So that, I've got it on my
list of refinements to the process, so...
Commissioner Saunders.
Are you done, Commissioner Solis?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Yes.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I also agree that we should
have the acquisition strategy document well in advance of the
referendum, because I think people are going to want to see what that
strategy is.
In terms of the different elements of that strategy, I have no
issue with there being some emphasis on properties that enhance our
current acquisitions, but I certainly do not want us to tie our hands
and have that as the strategy. We should be able to acquire properties
wherever they are, whether they're adjacent to current acquisitions or
not. That's, you know, an issue for staff and for the committee to
bring to us. But I do agree that we should have an acquisition
strategy.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: That's a huge difference
because -- from what you're saying from what I'm saying. And I'm
not trying to play devil's advocate at all, but to me there's a
foundation out there. We've already purchased the lands. The
amount of money that's going to maintain these lands is going to be
part of this initiative, this next tax, and we don't have all the money in
the world.
So I'm not saying this is the end of the program, but I am saying
that, let's build on what we have instead of going far afield, unless
there's something exceptional. Let's have an overriding or
overarching strategy that tells the voters simply. We've got a great
program. We've made some great acquisitions. We want to build on
those acquisitions.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I had intend -- I made the
May 28, 2019
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statement because I had intended it to be different than what you had
said.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Okay. No, no.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: That was not accidental,
because I wanted to make sure that -- that's an issue that we have to
decide, but -- and I understand the benefits of building on the
acquisitions that we've already accomplished. But this will be a very
large program going forward, and I don't think it's appropriate to say
to the voters, we're going to -- we're going to take our existing
acquisitions, and that's where we're going to focus all of our attention
and exclude the potential for other areas that may very well be
valuable from an environmental standpoint.
So I had intended to make the distinction. I would agree that
that certainly should be part of a strategy, but it shouldn't be the sole
determination as to whether we acquire a piece of property or not.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Can it be ranked in the level of
importance?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: As far as I'm concerned, no.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Okay.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: But I'm just one vote.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: All right.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: I would disagree with you, but
I'm just one vote.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: As am I, just so you two don't feel
like the Lone Ranger down there.
Commissioner Fiala.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yes. How much did we pay for the
Hack Property? I didn't realize that deal had been completed.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: We didn't pay.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Oh, we didn't?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yeah. They turned down our offer.
May 28, 2019
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COMMISSIONER FIALA: I'm sorry. I thought you said they
took the offer.
MS. ARAQUE: They rejected our offer.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I am so sorry. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: No, no. They accepted the Gore
offer. I think we -- did we close on the Gore piece yet?
MS. ARAQUE: Yes, in November.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: The Gore piece out in Eastern
Collier County that's very close to all of the multi-parcel location and
the Estates, yes, we did close on it.
MS. ARAQUE: I can send you our current spreadsheet to the
County Manager to pass along to you if you'd like.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay, thank you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: So -- and I have one point that I'd
like to say and I'd like to see if we could give some consideration to it
which will -- I would like to see it become part of our -- part of our
thought processes going forward.
I would like to see us be moving towards an acquisition of
development rights and not fee-simple purchases. We've been
burdened extensively in the fee-simple process with the continuing
ongoing maintenance that travels along with the ownership to the
tune of a million dollars a year, and that's caused a lot of disparity
with regard to the perpetual 30-some-odd-million dollars of
maintenance fund which isn't perpetual at a million dollars a year.
There's a term.
And I would like for us to -- and it was touted in the original
referenda question -- curtail development, reduce development, so on
and so forth. Why don't we pursue that as an alternative to actually
buy development rights, reduce the population of Collier County
overall, allow the land to stay in fee simple with the ranchers, with
the farmers, with the people who use it from an agricultural
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standpoint but not have it turn into development at some stage, and
have that be a portion of the capacities of the acquisitions.
If, in fact, the referenda goes forward and the electorate votes to
tax themselves, then that is a -- that is a portion of the utilization of
those funds and not just a strict fee-simple acquisition.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: If you're looking for
reactions, I certainly agree with that. I don't think it should be the
sole strategy.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: No. And, again, and I tried to
convey this to Commissioner Taylor earlier, and this isn't a
sole-strategy discussion. I think staff is here today to find out which
way to, in fact, go. And we've heard in refinement of the -- in
refinement of the strategy, an emphasis on urban locations of
properties that are environmentally sensitive, contiguous properties to
already owned conservation lands, currently owned properties up for
review as to whether or not they're worthy to stay in the program and
accessible and so on and so forth. Certainly having an acquisition
strategy per se so that when we do go, if, in fact, a referenda comes
forward that the electorate feels comfortable that there's a process,
and certainly there is a process, but the electorate is comfortable with
the process that we have going forward.
Commissioner Saunders, you know, if you read -- and I know
you have read the Conservation Collier ordinance -- there are target
areas which sometimes get confused, or not confused, but prioritized
if you will.
But if you read the Conservation Collier ordinance, if the staff
decides a piece of property is valid for purchase, they can buy it.
They'll make a recommendation; they'll make a recommendation to
us.
The target area that Summer showed us is just, in fact, a target
area. But the language that's in the actual ordinance allows us,
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Commissioner Saunders, to consider any and all acquisitions that are
within Collier County's bounds. So that's a synopsis, if you will, of
the redefined focus.
Do you have -- do you have any -- do you need an actual
motion, or are you -- are you okay with what's been discussed today?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: We need a -- shouldn't we make a
motion to adopt the staff's recommendation on developing the plan,
an acquisition strategy plan? Isn't that what we're --
MR. OCHS: Incorporating all of the discussion points --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Yes.
MR. OCHS: -- that were made this morning. That would be
fine, sir.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: So moved.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Second.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: What he said. It's been moved and
seconded that we accept staff's recommendations with the
suggestions that the Board's made today. Do you want to bring it
back as a review -- I think -- I hear what you're saying.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I think once the --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I know you said no.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Logistically, it will come back after
it goes to the CCLAC, right?
(Simultaneous speakers speaking.)
MR. OCHS: Yeah, that would be our recommendation.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. It's been moved and
seconded that we utilize staff's recommendation with our input today.
Any other discussion?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: All in favor?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
May 28, 2019
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CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Opposed same sign, same sound.
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: So moved.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Mr. Chair?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: May I ask Summer, what is the
formula for maintenance? What is it? What is it; 25 percent of the
cost per acre? Is it -- what is the formula?
MS. ARAQUE: Well, there's -- one thing is, like, if you look at
our funding, 25 percent of that is for the maintenance; is that what
you're asking?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Yes. Is that a fair --
MS. ARAQUE: Correct.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Okay. So whatever we collect.
So if I'm looking at -- and I was just looking at the cost for the cycles
is 13 million, 281 for all the cycles; 13 million. Is that correct?
MR. SUMMERS: The cost --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: The acquisition costs --
MS. ARAQUE: -- for all of the cycles?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: -- to date.
MS. ARAQUE: Is there.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Right. Oh, no, no. I made a
mistake; it's 106.
MS. ARAQUE: You're looking at the -- you were thinking
about the average. The average for each cycle was 13 million and,
yeah, our total was 106 million.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: So that's -- so if we divided by
four, let's just divide it by four, that would be 50 million? No, I'm
doing this wrong.
May 28, 2019
Page 93
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Where are you going?
(Simultaneous speakers speaking.)
MS. ARAQUE: I have all that information.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Twenty-five million.
MS. ARAQUE: Would you like me to provide that to the
County Manager?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Is that an annual basis, or is that
overall for the life of the program is what I'm trying to figure out.
MS. ARAQUE: So for monies that were collected, 25 percent
were set aside. So if we think about moving forward --
(Simultaneous speakers speaking.)
MS. ARAQUE: Moving forward, you were to be collecting an
ad valorem tax, 25 percent of that would go, is the -- as the ordinance
is currently written, 25 percent of that would go to management. And
we have pooled all of the information regarding what the staffing
costs have been to date as part of your referendum task force, so we
do have all that information, and I can get that to you.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: And in your opinion -- and I
know this is risky for you as a staff member -- are we maintaining the
acquisitions that we have on a level that you're satisfied with, or
could we do better?
MS. ARAQUE: I definitely think that we are managing them
very well, yes.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Could I ask --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Solis, I mean, we're
already out of the agenda item, and we're going back asking
questions again. So Commissioner Solis first.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Oh, I'm sorry.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: No. I just wanted to actually thank
Alex Sulecki for coming and sharing her --
May 28, 2019
Page 94
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Thank you, Alex.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: -- understanding about the program.
Thanks for sharing that.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Just a quick question for staff
then. In terms of the ongoing expenses, how much are we spending
in a typical year on maintenance on what we already have acquired,
just a rough --
MS. ARAQUE: I do not have that information off the top of my
head. Maybe Barry remembers.
MR. WILLIAMS: Your operating budget is roughly $750,000.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: To a million, plus or minus,
depending on where we're going.
Okay. Let's move on here. I think we've already voted, and --
MR. OCHS: Yes, sir.
Item #11D
AUTHORIZE THE CREATION OF TEN (10) ADDITIONAL
FULL-TIME EQUIVALENT POSITIONS IN THE GROWTH
MANAGEMENT DEPARTMENT AND PURCHASE FIFTEEN
(15) VEHICLES IN RESPONSE TO INCREASED CUSTOMER
DEMAND. THE PROPOSED POSITIONS WILL BE FUNDED
WITH CURRENT USER FEE RESERVES, REQUIRE NO
ADDITIONAL FEES; HAVE NO FISCAL IMPACT ON THE
GENERAL FUND; AND AUTHORIZE ALL NECESSARY
BUDGET AMENDMENTS - MOTION TO APPROVE STAFF’S
RECOMMENDATION – APPROVED
MR. OCHS: Commissioners, that moves us to Item 11D. This
is a recommendation to authorize the creation of 10 additional
May 28, 2019
Page 95
full-time positions in the Growth Management Plan Department and
purchase 15 vehicles in response to increased customer demand
primarily for inspection services. These positions will be funded
with current user-fee reserves requiring no additional fees, and
Mr. French can elaborate or respond to questions from the Board.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I'd make a motion to approve this
item.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Second.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Second.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: It's been seconded and thirded, and
Commissioner Saunders is lit up.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Yeah. I would like to have
an explanation as to why this would be the best approach as opposed
to contracting to do some of these, if it's for inspection services. And
the reason I raise that is, we've been in an upswing in the real estate
market for the last 10 years now, and there are all sorts of predictions,
if you will, that there's going to be a little bit of a slowdown. It
always happens in cycles.
I think we're at the -- personally, I think we have to be close to
the top of a cycle. I mean, it's been going on for so long, and here we
are getting ready to hire 10 more people and acquire 15 vehicles. I'm
not sure if that's the wisest approach, so I need an explanation.
MR. OCHS: Jamie.
MR. FRENCH: Good morning, sir. Good morning,
Commissioners. For the record, my name's Jamie French. I'm your
deputy department head for Growth Management.
Commissioner Saunders, to address your question, if I might, on
the overhead -- and, yes, sir, you are absolutely right. And what this
chart identifies is the risk of our current staffing level. Now, if you
remember back in January, we did piggyback to the City of Naples
contract and brought on four additional contractors as an augment
May 28, 2019
Page 96
approach for staff.
So we not only look at what our current business trends are, but
we look at a risk analysis based off of the age of our inspectors as
they come into our employment. And, typically, they're roughly
around their mid to late 50s. So these are inspectors in critical
positions that have identified their retirement date ahead of time.
So to follow up on what I said earlier with regards to bringing
on the contractors, if I could advance the slide just forward, what
you'll see, sir, is that we brought on -- we went from one with Nova
Engineering, til we brought on four additional. We've actually lost
the ability to hire contracted services, sir, because there is no one out
there.
So the only alternative that we have -- and the one employee that
shows there with the asterisk next to that one number, that is a
non-licensed person that does permitting extensions for us.
There's no one in the market that we can find of the five
contractors. And Rich Long, our building director, is here, along
with Ken Kovensky, our operations director for Growth Management
on the development services side.
We've had numerous conversations with the contractors. We
have a standing order: Send us what you have. And you can see, sir,
where our overtime -- we're now working weekends, nights, holidays
where we're spending better than a quarter of a million dollars a year
just on overtime services, and we're well into nearly a quarter million
dollars a year just into Fiscal Year '19.
So we believe that with the attrition that's scheduled plus the
ability -- and, quite honestly, sir, it's going to take us probably eight
to 10 months to hire these inspectors, because we're looking at folks
that are either going to retire from the market that are currently
licensed that are looking for that second career or looking to relocate
to our area. The last time we were in front of the Board, it took us
May 28, 2019
Page 97
eight months to hire those inspectors that you granted us.
So we don't believe that this is going to be advertise the jobs and
they're going to be here. We think we're going to have a good long
period of decision-making and searching for staff. And so this is not
an overnight fix. But since January, sir, we've not been able to hire
any contract employees whatsoever or even job bank temporary
employees.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: So there's no ability to
contract with some of the companies that do these types of
inspections?
MR. FRENCH: No, sir. We've approached all five approved
bidders by this board, and there is no staff available to us.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: The approved bidders, is
that --
MR. FRENCH: I'm sorry. The approved contractors that --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Who's on that list?
MR. FRENCH: Calvin Giodano, Nova --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Are they gobbled up by what's
going on up in the panhandle as well, though?
MR. FRENCH: That, plus the private industry is hiring them
for some of the larger projects to do private inspections, and we're
paying them $75 an hour. So if we were to employee them, it's
$150,000 a year just for that employee, and they're getting much
more than that from the private industry.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Okay. Then in terms of what
it costs us, you indicated that if we have a contractor that's $150,000
a year, what does it cost to have one of the full-time equivalent
positions in terms of salary, benefits; what cost do you have there?
MR. FRENCH: Weighted cost is about 70- to $72,000 with a
truck, sir.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Salary and benefits?
May 28, 2019
Page 98
MR. FRENCH: Yes, sir. They come in just under $50,000 a
year plus their benefits, the cost of the truck and the computer.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Do you know, Commissioner
Saunders, I read through this information over and over and over
again. I'm exactly -- feeling exactly like you are. But one of the --
one of the things -- my notes say that this is well thought out, it's --
they've -- you know, staff's consulted with the DSAC. They have --
they have a plan. It's not -- I don't perceive this as a knee-jerk
reaction. This has to do with employees that are up for and going to
inevitably retire as we go along.
So I do concur with you that, you know, here we are
theoretically at the top of a cycle, but we're not running out and
hiring -- this is a -- this is a replacement process.
MR. FRENCH: Inspectors only. This is not administrative
staff. These are not plans reviewers.
And, if I might, this last chart indicates this was February of this
year where you're saying this is one day in February, average day
where our inspectors to the far left, 615 inspections were
accomplished amongst those structural inspectors. That little
highlighted area in the center, that's where we might have contractor
overtime was utilized just to be able to get that done on that day, and
the 1,230 is the remaining backlog that was not addressed tha t day.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: It falls to the next.
(Simultaneous speakers speaking.)
MR. FRENCH: That falls to the next, and that's one day. So
based off this plan, what we have is where we would increase the
staffing level to 28 inspectors. We're at 875 inspections today -- I'm
sorry -- 875 inspections per day that we can eat into that backlog.
We would still utilize some overtime and contract labor as it came
available. So you see that number reduces over time to ultimately, if
we just took a very small 4 to 5 percent increase daily or -- I'm
May 28, 2019
Page 99
sorry -- monthly year over year.
We would be able to maintain an average of 636 or more, and
that would take us closer to your ISO, your B segs, and the other
ratings that we're measured against for insurance purposes.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Fiala, I'm sorry.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yes. I think that the job market, as
it stands today, we have very few people that are specialized that can
even do this. And to try and get them from another company rathe r
than working for us, we don't even have any control over who can
and cannot come in. We need specialized people for these
inspections. I just think we need to go forward with it, and I think
that this is a perfect time. We need them to work for us. W e don't
need them to work for somebody else who then can just go off and be
hired by another person.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Solis.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Yeah. And I've looked through the
material. It was very well done, very well thought out, and it jumped
out at me as we need to have a sense of urgency on this, because the
sheer number of overtime and the sheer number of inspections over
what's -- our risk management folks feel is safe.
I think we need to address this right away. And my first reaction
was, well, if there are these employees that have already indicated
they're going to retire, working that much overtime may hasten that,
and that would be a worst-case scenario. That's what I think.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Get to it.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Yeah. This is an urgent thing that
we need to take care of right away.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Based on what I've heard, I'll
support staff's recommendations, but I think that we do have to keep
an eye on where the economy's going. I do believe that we will see a
May 28, 2019
Page 100
downturn in the economy, and we just -- I'd rather be proactive in
dealing with that than reactive. So I'll support that based on what has
been stated.
I will also say, folks are working a lot longer than they used to.
So the fact that we have employees that are in their -- I think you said
in their late 50s?
MR. FRENCH: They're typically in their late 50s when they
join us.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I would expect those folks to
work for a lot longer than what has been pretty typical in the past.
But I'll support staff's position on this.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: It's been moved and seconded that
we accept staff's recommendation. Any other discussion?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: All in favor?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Opposed same sign, same sound.
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: So moved. It's 11:59.
MR. OCHS: Yes, sir.
Item #11E
RESOLUTION 2019-96: A RESOLUTION AMENDING THE
COLLIER COUNTY GROWTH MANAGEMENT DEPARTMENT
DEVELOPMENT SERVICES FEE SCHEDULE, WITH AN
EFFECTIVE DATE OF OCTOBER 1, 2019, DECREASING FEES
May 28, 2019
Page 101
BY APPROXIMATELY $335,000 ANNUALLY – ADOPTED
MR. OCHS: Commissioner, that take us to Item 11E, which is a
recommendation to approve a resolution amending the Collier
County Growth Management Department Development Services fee
schedule decreasing fees by approximately $335,000 annually.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: He wants to hire more people and
cut fees.
MR. OCHS: Right.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: So I make a motion to accept.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: And I would second it with the
comment that that means somebody's doing something right.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right, exactly. That was a joke that
I was making.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Great job.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: It was a good job. So it's been
moved and seconded for approval.
Commissioner Taylor.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Okay. I have some questions. I
did read it a couple of times. In the first one I have no idea why $15
less to the county is going to increase the incentivization for folks. I
understand the county doesn't want to look like, you know, their big
brother, so to speak, but it's worked before. It's a huge amount of
money. It's $290,000 less into the funds. And I cannot support that.
I think it needs to stay at 60.
The after-the-fact environmental landscape permitting, how are
these after-the-fact permits discovered when someone's done
something? How do you discover them?
MR. FRENCH: Thank you.
Commissioner, again, for the record, Jamie French, Growth
May 28, 2019
Page 102
Management Department, deputy department head.
Commissioner, what happens is that we find this after a sale of
the property when they're trying to clean up a permit that may still be
open or if they're coming in to do some expanded services or
construction or, perhaps, what we find is that where the contractor
has gotten a little over -- they've overworked their property.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Ambitious.
MR. FRENCH: Overambitious, yes, ma'am. And so they've
cleared well beyond the one acre. So we never -- it's very rare that
we find that it is -- it turns into a code enforcement violation, but it
could very well be an additional half an acre of land, and it may have
only been -- beyond the exotics, it may have been one of the lower
strata, or it could have been a couple of trees that were affected by
hurricane or pine bore, or it could be just cut because they didn't like
them.
So what we -- what we do is we bring them through that
vegetation removal permit process, and even though we can't prove it
was done on purpose, that four times the fee, as currently written, that
does impact some homeowners. So you go from a $250 permit to
where you had an owner/builder or a mom and pop just clearing their
yard. Now they've got to apply for a permit at $1,000, and we're
doing the same level of work.
So what we did is that we followed suit with what we do in
building currently and, based off state law, the contractor. So if a
contractor's involved, they know better. They're licensed. They pay
twice the fee. But in the event if it was an owner/builder or a private
property owner that was seeking voluntary compliance, t here's no
additional work, and because we work in an enterprise fund
environment, what we felt like is that the additional thousand or, I'm
sorry, the additional $750 is really punitive, and the punitive process
should follow our consolidated code enforcement ordinance.
May 28, 2019
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So in the event that they would want to -- let's say they want to
take a position against the county or a position against getting the
permit, at that point we would take them through the code
enforcement provision, and that would allow for us to be able still to
have them follow the process and get the permit, but there may be a
fine incorporated with it that would be cited by the Code
Enforcement Board or Special Magistrate. But that's how we came to
that conclusion as far as four times the fee versus two times the fee.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Having watched this in the City
of Naples on numerous occasions -- and I understand your rationale,
but I would agree with the four folks on DSAC that wanted to keep it
at four times. So I can't support the motion unless these changes are
made, but I'm only one person here.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I just wanted to make sure
that this department or these activities are totally fee driven in terms
of what the costs are and that those costs are all-inclusive, not just
salaries of people, but all costs associated with taking care of these
different activities.
MR. FRENCH: Yes, sir. So there's a fee study that we bring to
you or that we go through about every three to five years to make
sure that our costs line up to what -- actually what we're collecting.
So we're constantly going back through on an annual basis to
determine what our costs are, and that was part of the Plante Moran
study and some of the process improvements that we do on a daily
basis, that we look at what's our true costs and where we could
actually capture some savings that we could pass on to the client or
back to the community.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Saunders, they
brought that study forward, I think, our first year in, and I had issues
with it because it was -- I wanted to retroactively go back and give
May 28, 2019
Page 104
money back to people that we had overcharged and found that that
wasn't a fruitful path for us to travel whatsoever.
So this is as close as we can approximate to what our ongoing
operational expenses that are attributable to these jobs are and then
fairly pass that onto the consumers that are about to transact business
with us.
So my thought was, well, let's give it back to the people that
have already paid. We really can't do that.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: So you're the impetus behind
this?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: What?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Are you the impetus behind this,
or was this done -- you know what I'm saying, is this at your urging
this --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: No, I didn't urge it.
MR. OCHS: Staff initiated it.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Staff's bringing this forward. And,
you know, there again, when they brought it forward two years ago, I
wanted to give the money back to people who had already paid, but
that's not -- that's not a possibility.
I do concur with the staff's recommendation. I think we have
larger looming issues here in regard to the after-fact permitting
expenses that are associated.
There are an enormous amount of after-the-fact permit requisites
that are out there that are not being taken care of right now at this
stage. So that's something, and maybe a reduction in the penalization
for those after-the-fact permits will incentivize folks to come forward
and come into compliance.
MR. FRENCH: Commissioner, we've seen a great deal of
cooperation through the code enforcement process, especially on
those structures that were built without permits, because we did lower
May 28, 2019
Page 105
the fee, and we've become much more accommodating to the public.
We've had a great deal more communication and, really, compliance
and education opportunities with the community, so...
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: What about the incentivization
of $15 that takes almost $300,000 from your fund?
MR. FRENCH: Which line is that, ma'am?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: That would be the first one, the
permitting, where you reduce it from 60 to $45.
MR. FRENCH: That's on building, and that's tied back. So
what that is, that is a -- it's more of a punitive where we would go
out, we'd do a partial inspection, or the inspection cannot pass. So
we're actually going back out and doing the same exact inspection.
So this is on a building permit that's currently active.
Our costs whether to show up the first time or the second t ime,
we know our built-in cost is $45. That's what it costs us to have that
employee and that truck there. So we simply just went back and
looked and tried to true up the cost versus taking more of a punitive
effect.
In the event that the permit expires or in the event that a
contractor doesn't follow the rules or the law, we have the ability to
come through a fining mechanism.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Okay.
MR. FRENCH: Yes, ma'am.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: All right. Then thank you for
that clarification.
MR. FRENCH: No problem. I'm sorry for the confusion.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: No, no. You don't have to
apologize at all.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: All right. It's been moved and
seconded that we accept staff's recommendation. Any other
discussion?
May 28, 2019
Page 106
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: All in favor?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Opposed same sign, same sound.
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: So moved.
MR. FRENCH: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Now we're going to go to lunch.
We will be back at 1:10.
(A luncheon recess was had.)
MR. OCHS: Ladies and gentlemen, if you'd please take your
seats. Thank you.
Mr. Chairman, you have a live mic.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Good afternoon, everyone. We are
starting on time at 1:10 for our after -- not to be heard before
1 o'clock session.
So, County Manager, which one are we going to go with first?
MR. OCHS: The Board's call. Probably the 11G, I would
suggest we take first.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Did you say 11G?
Item #11G
RESOLUTION 2019-97: FURTHER DISCUSS THE ADOPTION
OF A RESOLUTION FROM THE MAY 14, 2019 BOARD OF
May 28, 2019
Page 107
COUNTY COMMISSIONERS MEETING WHICH WOULD (1)
REPEAL THE EXISTING PROPERTY ASSESSMENT CLEAN
ENERGY (PACE) PROGRAM, REPLACING IT WITH A NEW
PACE PROGRAM LIMITED TO COMMERCIAL, INDUSTRIAL
AND MULTI-FAMILY RENTAL APARTMENT BUILDINGS,
AND (2) APPROVE A NEW STANDARD FORM MEMBERSHIP
AGREEMENT WITH PACE PROVIDERS ALSO LIMITED TO
COMMERCIAL, INDUSTRIAL AND MULTI-FAMILY RENTAL
APARTMENT BUILDINGS TO BETTER PROTECT THE
PUBLIC BY PROVIDING FOR MORE RESTRICTIVE OR
ADDITIONAL REQUIREMENTS NOT FOUND IN THE
STANDARD FORM MEMBERSHIP AGREEMENT OR ANY
OTHER APPLICABLE LAW. IN ADDITION,
RECOMMENDATION TO DIRECT STAFF TO (1) SEND
WRITTEN NOTICE OF TERMINATION OF ALL EXISTING
MEMBERSHIP AGREEMENTS WITH CURRENT PACE
PROVIDERS, AND (2) OFFER THE NEW STANDARD FORM
MEMBERSHIP AGREEMENT TO ALL EXISTING AND OTHER
INTERESTED PACE PROVIDERS - MOTION TO REPEAL THE
EXISTING PROPERTY ASSESSMENT CLEAN ENERGY (PACE)
PROGRAM, REPLACING IT WITH A NEW PACE PROGRAM
LIMITED TO COMMERCIAL, INDUSTRIAL AND MULTI-
FAMILY RENTAL APARTMENT BUILDINGS, AND APPROVE
A NEW STANDARD FORM MEMBERSHIP AGREEMENT
WITH PACE PROVIDERS ALSO LIMITED TO COMMERCIAL,
INDUSTRIAL AND MULTI-FAMILY RENTAL APARTMENT
BUILDINGS; AND BRING BACK A CONSUMER PROTECTION
ORDINANCE AT THE NEXT JUNE 11, 2019 BCC MEETING –
ADOPTED
MR. OCHS: Yes, Commissioner. This is Item 11G that was
May 28, 2019
Page 108
continued from your May 14th, 2019, board meeting. It's a
recommendation to further discuss the adoption of a resolution from
the May 14th board meeting which would repeal the existing
Property Assessment Clean Energy PACE program, replaci ng it with
a new PACE program limited to commercial, industrial, and
multifamily rental apartment buildings, and Mr. French is available to
make the presentation if you'd like to hear it again.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: No.
MR. OCHS: Essentially, the Board had asked this item be
brought forward for additional board discussion about whether or not
you want to continue the PACE program in its current form or
whether you want to amend that or eliminate it.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right.
And, Troy, when you get done, you need to come turn on my
dilly whopper here.
MR. MILLER: Yes, sir. Will do that, sir.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And then, Commissioner Saunders,
I'm going to call upon you to have this discussion. It was between
you and Commissioner Taylor that we actually have the -- have this
discussion today as to whether to continue the residential portion of
the PACE program.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: All right. I appreciate that,
Mr. Chairman. Thank you. Just kidding about that.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: You don't appreciate it?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: No, no. I'm just kidding.
I was in agreement with having this hearing really for the
purpose of having the PACE providers respond to some of the
testimony that occurred at our last meeting.
I did listen to audio recordings of the typical telephone
conversations that one of the PACE providers has with all of their
PACE customers. I don't want to indicate -- I don't want to say
May 28, 2019
Page 109
anybody was saying anything intentionally incorrect, but I do believe
that the information that is provided by that one provider in those
telephone conversation is very, very clear that it's not a government
program; that it goes on the tax bill as an assessment; that there is an
interest rate and what that interest rate is and what those payments
are. I listened to several of those telephone conversations, and it was
perfectly clear.
There was one individual who indicated he was under the
impression this was a grant program. That particular individual was
actually on one of those calls that I listened to, and I think the
information was provided that was very clear. He may not have
understood it, but it certainly sounded like from the dialogue it was
well understood how this whole program would work. My
understanding is those type of phone calls go to every customer.
And so I wanted the PACE providers to have an opportunity to
respond to those allegations that were made. There were serious
allegations, but I think that's a lot of misinformation out there.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right. And I just would like to
say -- I mean, we're going to proceed with the item. There are folks
that are here that have signed up to speak and all, but this goes back
in line with -- I'm sorry?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I'm sorry.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: No, that's okay.
This goes back in line with our -- we need to remember that
when folks come as public speakers to the podium, that verbatim
representations and things that are alleged aren't necessarily as
accurate as they could be, and I think that's what led us down this
path.
There was one particular respondent that made a lot of -- a lot of
accusations that could be or could -- may be factual or may not be
factual. And I would like for us to, if we can, going forward, to try to
May 28, 2019
Page 110
hold back on -- until further investigation is, in fact, done, hold back
on credence given to those people.
I mean, when you and I did -- Commissioner Taylor, when you
and I did the mock County Commission meeting with the kids, the
fifth graders, Mark Strain was one of our speakers. He had some
really fluffy slides that he put up there with regard to chickens and all
that sort of thing along those lines. And it's easy; I mean, we want to
give credence to those folks that are speaking, and they certainly have
the right to speak. But I think we just need to be careful about
reaction to those presentations.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: May I speak?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: But of course. Your light's up.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Let me put another wrapping on
this shift in position on this commission or trying to discredit certain
speakers that came before us at great public embarrassment and great
affront to their personal dignity.
There's a reason this program targets your district, sir, and your
district, sir, and does not target my district, and that is probably --
have a lot to do with their ethnicity, their lack of sophistication in
business areas, their lack of awareness or perhaps their great need
after Irma to make their homes a little bit better.
When you're spending, for an air-conditioner and a roof,
$46,000 on a Habitat for Humanity house, you know that there's a
level of sophistication that is lacking in them.
I am not surprised but greatly disappointed at the way this is
going, but I think in time, there will be clear evidence, again, that this
program is very harmful for citizens in our community.
Thank you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And you started that off with an
analogous statement. I want to be very clear: I'm not discrediting
anyone. People have the absolute right to come up and speak at t hat
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podium and the absolute right to say whatever they want.
Credence is at the decision of this particular board as to whether
or not we give credence to that particular presentation.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: That's right.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Just to be clear, I was not
discrediting anyone.
Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Yeah. First of all, we haven't
heard from the PACE providers, so I think it would be a little bit
premature to say where this is going. I just wanted to point out to the
board members that I did listen to the tapes, and I think I indicated
that there may have been some misunderstanding from the people
that received those phone calls, but the information that was
provided, at least in the phone calls I listened to, was very, very clear.
So I want to hear from the PACE providers on how we deal with
these issues and see what their reaction is before I make any decision
on how to go forward.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Let's go.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: I'm glad that you're open, sir.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Oh, absolutely. And so who do we
have first presenting?
MR. MILLER: Mr. Chairman --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Are the PACE providers on the list
of public speakers, or are we going to to have staff make a
presentation, Leo?
MR. OCHS: Pleasure of the Board, sir. We didn't really plan a
long presentation.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: We invited the PACE providers to
come --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: -- give a presentation, didn't we?
May 28, 2019
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Isn't that what it was?
MR. MILLER: I will say, if I might, I have a presentation from
one of the PACE providers. I don't think they've entered slips
because I think they're under the impression they're presenting.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Let's do it that way. They were the
ones that were invited to come --
MR. MILLER: I have received a presentation from Ygrene. I
have it up and ready for you.
Mr. Chairman, is there a time you want me to associate with this
presentation?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: No. I don't think there's a need.
MR. LEMYRE: Okay. Mr. Miller, may I control it from here
or --
MR. MILLER: Yes.
MR. LEMYRE: Okay. Good afternoon, Commissioners. My
name is Mike Lemyre -- and staff. Name is Mike Lamyre. I'm senior
vice president of Ygrene Energy Funds responsible for government
affairs and public relations. And I thought after hearing from folks in
the community and my staff and watching the last -- your last
meeting that it was important, in fact, critical enough for me to come
from our headquarters to address you and some of the statements and
allegations and misinformation around the program.
I'm also going to be joined by colleagues, Ben Taube and Kate
Wesner, who are local to the state and have additional perspective to
share. But we'll go through our information and presentation, and
please interrupt me if you have questions. So thank you very much
for the time.
First of all, I just want to start off by saying that I think the
option or the idea of removing PACE entirely, residential PACE from
the community, is just simply too extreme of a reaction given the
facts that we have researched and can substantiate and will do so
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today.
These unsubstantiated allegations -- again, I agree with you,
Chair McDaniel, we're not impugning anybody's reputation or
personal, but it has taken me almost 10 years to understand as much
as I do about PACE, and so I honestly don't expect somebody who's
looked at it in the last few weeks or months to interpret everything
accurately.
But the -- many, if not all of, the claims and charges that we
have heard recently or read recently are, in fact, unsubstantiated and
undocumented and inaccurate.
Ygrene's provided financing for 401 projects in the county since
being approved by this commission, by this board, in October of
2017. In that time, there have been approximately 20,000 permitted
projects throughout the county. So the 401 projects is a fraction of an
aspect or niche of home improvement financing that is occurring in
your jurisdictions.
In that time, we have received from our customers, from your
constituents, three complaints; three, out of 401 projects. That track
record I would hold up against any consumer finance or home
improvement finance business. We strive for zero complaints and,
where there are complaints, 100 percent resolution. But nobody's
perfect, and we've never put the program out there to be perfect;
however, that track record alone, that statistic alone, which is backed
up and verified by our records, you know, should reinforce that
complete removal is too extreme of an option.
I also assert that PACE has the strongest consumer protections
in the home-improvement market, in the finance. Absent the PACE
option, homeowners, your constituents, actually have fewer
protections when it comes to contractors, when it comes to financing,
when it comes to problem resolution and recourse. And as we see,
the so-called tip of the spear in terms of recourse is right here, right
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here at the local level, not complaints to a state or federal agency. So
your constituents have far greater protections, and we'll talk about
those as well.
And then, also, PACE is working, and we'll demonstrate that. It
is working in terms of improving homes, hardening them against
storms, against hurricanes, making them more efficient from an
energy perspective. People in Collier County, residents in Collier
and across the state are saving money, real money, on home
insurance -- property and casualty insurance premiums, on energy
costs, and utility bills, and they're hardening their homes and
improving health and safety not only of their homes but of the
community and the state.
And then, finally, I'd like to make the point that because of these
consumer protections being stronger than any other product in
home-improvement finance and the success and the benefits derived
by the homeowners in the community, that PACE is, in fact, essential
public policy. It is exactly why local government has gotten involved
to provide a valuable option, a voluntary option, to homeowners, and
removing it is just simply too extreme.
So we'll walk through some information that, as requested,
addresses the unsubstantiated allegations or claims made in previous
meetings, and then I'll also be joined by my colleagues.
So just a snapshot of PACE in Collier County. Recently, the
University of Southern California's Public Price School did an
in-depth study of over 50,000 projects and created a number of
models and delved into the types of projects that PACE finances and
how it encourages that financing and the fact that we only finance the
resiliency and energy efficiency projects. We can track that and
measure that.
And so you can see some of the statistics of the improvements
and benefits that homeowners in Collier County, right here in this
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county, have received or will receive over the lifetime of their
project.
And then statewide the metrics are even more dramatic where
just through -- about 13,000 projects completed in Florida through
March of this year, homeowners over the life of their improvements
are going to save nearly a billion dollars on premium insurance alone
as well as the energy and hazard-loss mitigation, kilowatts saved,
utility bills saved, and contribution to the jobs and economic
development in the state and in the county.
So there's been a lot of critique and commentary on the process
and the role of contractors specifically. And one thing I want to
clarify on the record is that while contractors may refer or introduce
PACE as a financing option, a voluntary option to homeowners, no
homeowner can bind themselves in a financial agreement for PACE
financing without dealing directly with Ygrene, under contract, an
approved and authorized program administrator, or another program
administrator in such an arrangement, all of whom have been
approved by this commission as well as other jurisdictions in the
state.
So let me repeat that. No homeowner can execute a financing
agreement and bind themselves to the financing which results in a
lien being recorded and results in a project proceeding without
interacting directing with a Ygrene representative. That is not done
by a contractor regardless of what insinuation or statements have
been made.
As Commissioner Saunders pointed out, you know, earlier he
listened to, and I think others may have heard some of the confirmed
term calls, which is just one of the steps that we take, and we record
those and save them for posterity, that ensure the homeowner
understands very clear basic terms, but it's by no means the only step
that we take.
May 28, 2019
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Once the homeowners applies -- and only the homeowner can
complete all of the application data needed -- they move to approval
or conditional approval, which means needing further data. That
step, that underwriting of the project of the property and of the
homeowner who currently owns that property is conducted by an
underwriting team or an underwriter specifically at Ygrene. It is not
conducted by a contractor or any other party.
Before there is what we call a notice to proceed or a permission,
basically, to move ahead with the project and relying on the
financing, all of those underwriting criteria must be met, and those
underwriting criteria include what is in the state statute, for instance,
maximum 20 percent of just value, but it includes many other criteria.
The underwriting also includes a number of criteria and required
steps as required by the special district that is the government entity,
in this case Green Corridor, that oversees the program, and then that
underwriting may also include local requirements that a local board
or jurisdiction places on the program.
All of those steps are followed and all of them are documented
and verified. In fact, they're confirmed by a third party in many
cases, and they're all performed by Ygrene, not a contractor.
Finally, as we move to the payment, the completion of the
project and making a payment request and reviewing before funding,
homeowners complete what's called a certificate of completion.
What that really does, though, in practice, is give the homeowner the
authority and the ability to say, yes, the project's completed to my
satisfaction and, yes, Ygrene, you may pay the contractor. And when
I say "pay the contractor," it's important to note, pay the contractor
100 percent of the cost of the financing (sic).
Normally, or what is typical in home improvement financing, is
the homeowner pays some sort of deposit or maybe makes some
progress payment along the way. One of the unique aspects of PACE
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is that all of the monies to the contractor are withheld until the
homeowner signs off on the completion of that project, and that is
ultimately another step.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: When you get to a --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: That's all right. Just to be clear,
they're paid 100 percent of the cost of the improvement?
MR. LEMYRE: The improvement.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Not the financing. The
improvement.
MR. LEMYRE: No, no. The portion -- no, the cost of the
improvement --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Right.
MR. LEMYRE: -- that goes to the contractor.
So just as a related sidebar note, there is -- the homeowner signs
a contract with their installer -- a contract with their contractor for the
installation of goods. You would sign that agreement regardless of
how you pay for your improvement: Cash, home equity loan, PACE
financing, credit card, so...
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Yeah. I only asked that because
you said they would be paid the 100 percent of the amount of the
financing.
MR. LEMYRE: If I misspoke, thank you for clarifying,
Commissioner Solis.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Yeah.
MR. LEMYRE: Yeah, 100 percent of the cost of the project that
the contractor is charging the homeowner.
So I made the statement earlier that PACE has the strongest
consumer protections in home-improvement financing space, these
are a few of the common products to the right: The home equity
loan, HELOC, line of credit, various unsecured personal products,
and in the case of solar, a homeowner may use a lease or a power
May 28, 2019
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purchase agreement.
So these are just a sample of some of the more common ways
that somebody might pay for a home improvement. I mentioned
before, PACE has been used before on projects in Collier. I believe
there's -- one statistic I saw was roughly 20,000 permitted projects of
all sort, PACE eligible and ineligible, in Collier County just in the
last 18 months.
So people are using all forms of payment for all sorts of home
improvement financing where we're talking about a narrow slice of
the market. But as you can see, from underwriting criteria at the top
to customer support to disclosures, a certificate of c ompletion,
contractor oversight, PACE has been built not just by statute, but by
policy and, frankly, by the program administrators, myself, my
colleagues, our peers in the industry, specifically to provide a better
product and a greater protection and greater recourse for the
homeowner. It is a public policy initiative. It's not a pure private
market financing option.
Our obligation, which we take very seriously, is at a much
higher bar, and that is one of the things that you see reflected in here.
And, frankly, all of these other options, save for a few examples, do
not provide anywhere near the comprehensive protection that PACE
is.
Again, are we perfect and have we executed perfectly in
100 percent of the circumstances? No, but I don't think you'd find
any program or any product or any industry or company, for that
matter, that does. Again, 401 projects funded and completed and
three complaints.
And then, lastly, again to some of the specific points before I ask
my colleagues to continue this. I mentioned some of the specific
consumer protections and standards, and I also talked about the
process from application to funding. This shows you where in the
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process these items occur.
So I talked about the underwriting process. Commissioner
Saunders referenced a confirmed terms call. We also call it a
welcome call, all right; welcome to PACE. Welcome to Ygrene.
This is how -- this is how we interact with homeowners seeking
financing for their projects.
It's different than other forms of financing. All right. Do you
understand that you'll be repaying this? Yes. With interest? Yes.
Do you understand the interest rate? Yes. The amount you're
paying? Yes. And so forth.
All right. If you listen to these calls, which my staff and I do on
a regular basis, we have a team of people who do this every day
hundreds of times. It is clear when somebody understands and when
they don't and whether they can go forward and where they can't.
We also perform an identification verification process as
performed by a third party. It is specific to the individual. You have
to answer a majority of five questions to identify yourself. Industry
standard, fraud, prevention, metric -- measures. That is executed
before the project is approved and can proceed to fund and anybody
could have a lien attached.
And, finally, the finance agreement, which can be signed in
person, wet signature, electronically in compliance with all laws;
however, again, it is tied to the homeowner, the location, and time of
day using third-party industry standard software and requirements.
All of that happens before the project is approved and finalized and
can proceed.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: One question.
MR. LEMYRE: We have further steps through here, but that --
I think you got the point.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Taylor has a
question.
May 28, 2019
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COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Could you please repeat your
confirmation terms call.
MR. LEMYRE: The confirmation -- well, I didn't articulate
every question, but the confirmation-of-terms call includes
confirming that the homeowner understands that they will have to
re -- the amount that they're applying for and have been approved for;
that they'll have to repay that amount; that they'll have to repay it
with interest; that the interest rate is X, whatever is stated in the
agreement; that the term is Y: 10 years, 15 years, 20 years, and so
forth.
They also are asked if it's --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: What's "so forth"?
MR. LEMYRE: For example, if they understand that a lien will
be placed on their property.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Do you tell the call -- one of the
parts of this call, you say, this is the amount of your loan; you
understand that? This is the interest that you're going to be charged;
you understand that? This is the entire amount that you're going to be
required to pay; you understand that?
MR. LEMYRE: Correct. And we'll submit, you know, the call
confirmation and terms call script so the members of the Board can
see all of the questions that are asked and confirmed prior to moving
it forward.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Have you listened to the calls, any
of them?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: It wasn't offered to me. They
know who the swing vote is.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I'm sorry. I just -- because I, like
Commissioner Saunders, have listened to several of the calls. Did
you have something you wanted to say?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yeah. You had mentioned
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originally in the first part of this thing, just in the same subject you
said standard interest rate, but now when Commissioner Taylor asked
you a question, you didn't mention standard interest rate anymore.
What is standard?
MR. LEMYRE: No. I didn't say standard interest rate. The
stated interest rate.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Oh, you said "stated"?
MR. LEMYRE: Yeah. So the homeowner receives -- the
homeowner receives a financial disclosure form. It is modeled after
the "Know Before You Owe," KBYO, template that the Federal
Consumer Financial Protection Bureau has developed for the real
estate market, and that is an extensive -- I believe it runs two to three
pages. We'll submit a sample of that as well in detail -- that has all of
the financial components and necessary disclosures for the financing.
In that is the stated interest rate as well as the annual percentage
rate, the APR, inclusive of all fees. Also, all the fees are detailed out.
So the stated interest rate, which would be, let's say, 7 percent, for
example, and so that would be the stated rate. If there is $500 of fees,
when you add that to the amount of the project, you get an APR that's
slightly higher because you count certain fees as part of that.
So I made the comment "stated rate." It's the rate that is stated
to the homeowner. But they also receive the financial disclosure that
has all the other terms in it. And, again, we'll provide that template
as well.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: No, I was just going to point
out that I have a copy of one of the scripts, and you indicated you'll
provide a copy of the script of the confirmation terms calls, so that
covers all of the issues that have been discussed.
MR. LEMYRE: Okay: So Ben? So I'll ask Ben to walk
through a few more key points.
May 28, 2019
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MR. TAUBE: Thank you, Commissioners. Again, Ben Taube
with Ygrene Energy Fund. I'm happy to be here today.
I'm going to walk you through contractor management, and I'll
make this relatively quick, and please ask questions if you have them.
So as you've heard -- and Mike laid out the groundwork -- when
a contractor participates in a program, there are a variety of steps that
a contractor's taken through. So, number one, there's a registration
process, there's a validation process, there's a training procedure, and
there's an activation, and I'm going to walk through each of the steps
so you understand what these are.
So from a standpoint of what's required of a contractor: Number
one, a contractor can participate in this program if they have the
appropriate licenses: State and local licenses. So when a contractor
does apply, we do an exhaustive background search. First thing that
happens is we check their license. Are they up to date? We do a
criminal background check. We do a social media check and a
variety of other things that occur in that process to ensure that the
contractor participating has the appropriate criteria to participate in
the program.
We do on-site training, and we take them through how PACE
works. We take them through the disclosure process. We take them
through the ethics of how to use this type of product. We t alk about
what we do from a consumer-protection standpoint. We talk about
nondiscrimination. We talk about a variety of things to ensure they
understand how this product works and what it's being used for in the
marketplace, because it's specific to what the state statute says.
We take them through not only via online and webinar trainings,
we also do this in person where our existing team goes and visits
these contractors and sits with their team to walk them through
how -- the programs and how they should operate under the structure
of each of the programs operating. There's over 175 programs in the
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state of Florida, so not every one of them is exactly the same, but for
the most part they are.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Before you go on. Commissioner
Taylor.
MR. TAUBE: Yes.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: So how did the gentleman, I
believe it's Summit, out of Jacksonville or -- no, out of Tampa, how
could he -- if you go through all these comprehensive training
protocols for contractors, how could he have been employed by you?
MR. TAUBE: He was licensed by the state.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: He had a criminal background.
MR. TAUBE: And he -- from our understanding, he was
licensed by the state to perform the work he was doing. Potentially
his subcontractors he was using, that's where the issue arose. And
when we saw the issue arising, we took action and terminated.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: He had a history. You missed it.
MR. TAUBE: I can't tell you we missed it or not.
(Simultaneous speakers speaking.)
MR. TAUBE: When we did the research --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: So when this contractor gets
sued or goes through these things, which this gentleman from the
Tampa area did go through, he goes through that alone. Ygrene's not
beside him saying he's our employee, we like him, he's worked for us.
He goes through that alone, right?
MR. TAUBE: Yeah. I'm not sure I follow your question.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: The gentleman from that area,
from the Tampa area, was -- had several -- he got into a lot of serious
trouble by working for whatever he was working for. There was a
history there; the history that was a record; we were able to find it.
When the law comes after that contractor, he doesn't come after
Ygrene, does he? Does it? The person that gets charged for the
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problems that the contractor causes when employed by you is the
contractor.
MR. TAUBE: You have --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Except in the state of California
when they're coming after Ygrene on numerous occasions, which I'll
bring up later.
MR. TAUBE: You have two distinct issues: You have a
homeowner signing an agreement with a contractor to do a job, and
you have a --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Could you talk into the
microphone a little bit more? I can hear you but not very well.
MR. TAUBE: Yeah.
So I'm saying, you have two distinct issues. You have the
homeowner signing an agreement with a contractor to perform a job,
and you have a homeowner signing an agreement with a company
like Ygrene to finance such job.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: And we have contractors that are
hired by that company that finances the job. So you're washing your
hands like Pontius Pilate.
MR. TAUBE: I would say that we stick through the process
with the homeowner through a very long duration. I think there's
more that we do with the homeowner through processes and
procedures to assist homeowners that's not -- that you're not -- we're
not bringing out in this conversation. I don't know -- we're trying to
connect two different things.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: I'm just curious where -- if you
take any responsibility for the contractors you hire and the bad actors.
MR. TAUBE: We take responsibility for maintaining,
managing, suspending, monitoring, and terminating contractors every
day. We have a team that actively does this on a da ily basis.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: But there's no financial
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renumeration (sic) to the homeowner that's been preyed upon; is that
correct?
MR. LEMYRE: I'll take that, yes.
So first of all, no contractor's ever employed by Ygrene, but
they're authorized to perform the financing. So I just want to make
that clear on the record, not to split hairs.
(Simultaneous speakers speaking.)
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: -- authorized.
MR. LEMYRE: Yeah. But in the specific case of Summit
Wood, not dissimilar to a broad swath of the contracting where they
use subcontractors, marketing agents, et cetera.
So the principal who applied and the company that applied was
duly licensed and passed all the screens; however, when we started to
hear the different names of companies, subcontractors or other
individuals who are not listed as employees or not part of -- officially
part of that individual's company but were involved in the
transactions, we looked into those, and that is when Ygrene
proactively suspended and ultimately terminated that contractor, and
we did so before there were news reports and before there were
allegations. That's the process working.
But the marketplace is dynamic, and there are different parties
involved. When we -- when those bear out -- and our process does,
by and large, ferret those out, we take the appropriate action.
To your second -- your last question about financial
renumeration (sic), Ygrene resolves all of our complaints to the best
of our ability and to the letter of the law and often beyond and up to
and including financial renumeration (sic) to the property owner
where warranted.
And we have a track record, and I can submit, you know,
evidence of the fact; not that this is a court of law, but I understand
the standard we're being held to -- that we have removed liens where
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appropriate and renumerated (sic) homeowners in whole or in part
where appropriate and where deemed necessary.
And so that is part and parcel. But I think what you're hearing
here is the overall process. And, again, with 400 projects and three
complaints, overall this process by and large works. Where there's
something we can improve or where something comes to light after
the fact, we also have a process to address that quite effectively.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Are you aware of the
FoxBusiness.com news story dated May the 28th, 2019, titled "More
borrowers defaulting on their green PACE loans"? If not, I'll make
sure you have copies of it.
MR. LEMYRE: Is that today, May 28th, 2019, you said? So I
haven't had a chance to read this. I was preparing for this.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: I find it very interesting. We
can talk more about that later. Thank you.
MR. LEMYRE: We'll also submit to staff, in our performance
data, the delinquency and default rate associated with PACE. They're
extraordinarily low.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Sorry. This was published
August 15th, 2017, so this was two years ago.
MR. LEMYRE: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Dow Jones Newswires. I'll get it
to you.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Could you send it to my office, too.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Yes. We'll have copies now. If
Sherry's listening, I need copies for everybody out here, Sherry.
MR. TAUBE: Okay. To continue on is to talk about the
process we take contractors through, monitoring standpoint.
So the contractor -- we have basically a green, yellow, red,
right? They're monitored. In monitoring, there's a variety of things
that we do in terms of watching what the contractor does. We ask for
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additional information, and if they're in that stage, they're in that
stage for a reason.
If they get to the point of suspension where we suspend the
contractor, obviously that speaks for itself. What happens? The
contractor gets suspended; no more projects can go forward.
And then, thirdly, termination, right? So termination does
occur. In Collier County, we have nine contractors that have been
removed and -- or inactive from the program. So it does happen, and
we do take that through from a very regular process. We do monitor
this on a detail basis with a team that looks at contractor compliance.
I'm going to turn this over to Kate Wesner now.
MS. WESNER: Good afternoon, Chairman, Commissioners.
Kate Wesner, Ygrene Florida.
I've lived in Florida since 1995. I went to high school in
Broward County just across the Everglades at Marjory Stoneman
Douglas High School.
So I wanted to provide you a comparison of the PACE program
versus other types of lending. But to speak to some of your questions
earlier about our finance documents, I did bring copies of that for all
of you commissioners in all of the languages that we provide them.
So I'll leave a copy for each of you before we go. Okay? Okay.
All right. So the PACE assessment, a typical PACE assessment
could be $20,000, unsecured home loan $20,000. You see where this
is going -- your home mortgage, $260,000.
The next column will show your interest rate so you can
compare PACE is somewhere in the middle. The terms: Your home
mortgage is 30 years. PACE assessment could be 20. Your other
types of financing: Five or 10 years.
Now, monthly payment; this is what's important. This is what I
want you to remember.
Your PACE assessment is a monthly payment if you have a
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mortgage or you escrow your taxes. So in this example, your PACE
assessment is $169. That is equivalent to some of your cell phone
bills, electric bills, cable bills.
The reason PACE is affordable for many homeowners and why
many property owners choose PACE is because you've got a longer
time to finance it, right, makes your payment smaller, more
affordable on a monthly basis. That is why PACE works for so many
property owners in Collier County.
And so over time, as you could see your home mortgage, you
paid $15,000. At the end of the year, your PACE assessment, $2,000.
To put it in perspective: If you all took out your amortization
schedule for your home mortgage now and saw 30 years from now or
just 15 years from now how much money you're paying in interest for
your mortgage, it would shock you. And I think that's wh at's
happened to a lot of property owners.
When they borrow money, they look at the bottom line and then
they think, ooh, did I really want to do that?
And, look, we're an option. This is a voluntary program. It
works for a lot of people. We've got some great testimonials that
you'll see in another slide. We just want this to continue to be an
option for those property owners who value the PACE program.
Okay. Here's some stats, okay, customers. Some of the stats for
Ygrene: The average -- so as you could see where these dots are,
these are where your customers are in Collier County. So they're
spread out across the county, all different -- the coast and inland
areas.
The average PACE assessment with Ygrene is 19,000. Low
end, 2,500; high end, 97-. Now, the average is 19-, and that's what I
showed you on the previous slide, right? So your annual PACE
assessment is about $2,000 a year, a little over a hundred dollars a
month, approximately.
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Your post-assessment, your post PACE LTV, 62.6. So that is
showing you property owners are not over-leveraging their
properties. Typically --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Everybody in this room knows
what LTV is.
MS. WESNER: Okay. Yeah, that's right. You've got your
short-term rentals next.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: No. Yeah, so say what LTV stands
for.
MS. WESNER: Oh, loan to value, apologies. Yes; so however
much you borrow compared to how much the value of your property
would be it if you sold it today.
And the PACE LTV percentage means what the PACE porti on
is compared to your total loan to value. So being 6 percent is under
double digits, and I think that's important to note. Most mortgages
are going to be quite a bit higher, right? So you can get mortgages
with the VA up to 100 percent. Most conventional mortgages,
20 percent. PACE is 6 percent.
And the law states that you can borrow up to 20 percent of your
assessed value in the state of Florida. So if property owners are only
using 6 percent, they're, by no means, over-leveraging or going above
what is allowed under law.
And then on the right you'll see some stats for the Habitat for
Humanity group, and those are a lot smaller in proportion.
This is our net promoter score we wanted to show you. This
shows you the customer service -- I'm sorry -- customer satisfaction
surveys from property owners, and this is across Ygrene, not just
Collier County specifically, but that includes property owners who
are dissatisfied and satisfied. So it is the net of that. And USAA is
the number one customer satisfaction lending institution, and Ygrene
falls right behind that. I think that will speak volumes to our service
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in Florida.
Okay. And here's some testimonials. At the top it says, Ygrene
is very needed. I'm a widow and on a fixed income. So for many
property owners, they may not have that ability to walk into a bank or
may not have access to credit, necessarily, and Ygrene may be one of
their options to use, and so this helped that widow there.
The next one says outstanding customer service. Very happy
with the way the project has been handled. So glad we were able to
get a new air-conditioner. Everyone from Ygrene was professional,
on and on and on. Now, these were just from Collier County. And I
think when I was here last time I told you I had 50 homeowners that
were happy homeowners who did customer satisfaction surveys with
Ygrene post the project, after everything was done, and that's where
they tell us if they would recommend us again, if they would use us,
if they would recommend the contractor. We do a thorough customer
satisfaction survey with them to find out where deficiencies are and
where we can improve.
Okay. Let my colleagues finish.
MR. LEMYRE: Yeah. So thank you, Kate and Ben.
So just to kind of wrap it up, again, appreciate all of the time
that you've given us here. On the lower right is the, kind of,
summation of Collier County PACE only. So we've talked about --
mostly about the county, but we've talked about Ygrene's process
overall, we've talked about the state level. This is specific to Collier
County; obviously, the jurisdiction we're in.
Also, to the directive we received of responding to or the
Commission -- the Board wanting to hear from us regarding specific
allegations that -- unsubstantiated allegations made in the past, one of
the things that -- and we take this very seriously. We've led the
industry with the policy of providing notice to lender 100 percent of
the time. We've done that from day one going back to the very
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beginning of the program.
So on the upper right you see from August of '17 when we were
first approved here through May the volume of notice to lenders
mailed out -- mailed in those months coincidental with the
application for financing. It's done in that upfront process as I
outlined earlier.
I've highlighted the Habitat for Humanity ones. Again, not to
impugn anybody's reputation, but there's been statements made that
we have not sent those. In fact, the chart on the bottom left shows
you the date delivered, and these went to 11145 Tamiami Drive (sic)
in Naples, I believe the headquarters for Habitat. And they were
done by a third party that transmits them for us, and they're verified.
So that, again, is verifiable information. Again, just to provide the
Board with the details that it had asked for.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: One second. Did you have a
question, Commissioner Saunders?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Yeah. Just one question for
this gentleman, then one question for Ms. Wesner.
You said there were three complaints.
MR. LEMYRE: Correct.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Can you tell us what those
complaints were and what happened with them?
MR. LEMYRE: Two have been resolved; one is open. The
open complaint is a complaint that the homeowner had after
approving the completion and the funding but stating that the project
wasn't completed to their satisfaction. I don't have the specific detail
on hand in terms of what the -- why they thought after the fact it
wasn't 100 percent completed but, certainly, I can provide that. But
there's one open one, and two have been resolved.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: When you say "resolved,"
what does that mean?
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MR. LEMYRE: Well, it depends on the situation, but the
either -- typically, the majority of the complaints that we receive
revolve around workmanship. If anyone has done a
home-improvement project, whether warranted or unwarranted, you
have an issue with some form of completion. It could be the
installation of the HVAC unit or the roof itself, or it could be a
"finish it" item such as painting the facing board or reattaching the
gutter properly.
So we receive the whole range of complaints, including the
financing, but they're by and large related to the workmanship. And
we use -- again, this is another advantage of having PACE in the
community. We use the leverage we have over the contractors who
like offering their customers this option, right, and have -- and it's a
right, not -- it's an -- it's a choice, but they don't have a right, the
contractors, to participate in this. They have to meet the rules. So we
use that leverage to force them to, essentially, resolve it to the
homeowners' satisfaction if they want to continue -- the contractor
wants to continue in the program, and so that's typically what occurs.
The specifics of those three we'll provide you.
I just want to say we provide this information or a high level of
detail routinely to staff in all the said jurisdictions. We're happy to
follow up with staff and provide more detailed reports. We do that
upon request, and there are a number of jurisdictions where we do
that more extensively than others. So this needn't be -- I mean, I'm
perfectly happy, and my team is perfectly happy, to respond on the
record to any and all questions the Board has. We're fully
transparent, but we're also happy to do this on an ongoing basis,
provide these details in a manner where it's more conducive to dig
into specifics and resolve specific issues or address them. That
occurs all the time.
Again, the summary of this -- so, I'm sorry. The number was
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410. I quoted 401 earlier. But 407 customers who have not
complained who are presumably satisfied who signed off on their
financing and just three complaints. That's the bottom line, sir.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: And a quick question for
Ms. Wesner.
I'm a little concerned about how you may have handled
contacting all of us. Obviously, all five of us have an equal vote
here. And Mrs. Taylor indicated that she was not given an
opportunity to listen to those tapes. She indicated that you guys
knew where the swing vote was which, quite frankly, I find to be a
little bit offensive, but that's another story, because I always have an
open mind to how I'm going to vote on an issue.
The question is: Did you offer all five of us the opportunity to
listen to these tapes? And if you haven't, then I need you to make
that offer. But first of all --
MS. WESNER: Yes, Commissioner, we did request meetings
with all the commissioners. Last week was the first time
Commissioner Taylor afforded us an opportunity to meet with her.
We did ask her, what did she want to hear from us, and she just said
be prepared to answer the accusations.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: No, ma'am. I said you need to
refute the allegations against you one by one.
MS. WESNER: Yes, ma'am.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: That's what I said.
MS. WESNER: So other commissioners had asked for more
specific information, so we did provide, but I would be happy to sit
down with Commissioner Taylor as well as Commissioner Fiala if
she'd like to meet with us and to listen to those calls. I'd be happy to
do that.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: So you are offering and have
offered --
May 28, 2019
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MS. WESNER: Every time we've been here I've asked to meet
with the commissioners, and I met with Commissioner Fiala once and
Commissioner Taylor only once last week, so yes.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I just want to make sure
everybody has an actual opportunity to listen to --
MS. WESNER: Absolutely. I'm happy to do that again.
I'd like to make one correction for the record. Last time I was
here, I made a misstatement. If you'll give me a second to just clarify
that. I said that air-conditioners could be financed for 10 years, and I
misunderstood. My A/C only lasted 10 years, so forgive me. But we
have clarified that. According to the U.S. Department of Energy,
A/Cs useful life can be up to 20 years. I think that was something
that was said last meeting that we're financing A/Cs for 20 years and,
yes, according to the Department of Energy, their useful life is 20
years.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: But, sir (sic), you have a
transcript of those calls. You could have dropped me a transcript.
MS. WESNER: Could I just offer, I could give you -- that's not
the call with the property owner. That is the questions and the things
we say. I'm happy to give that to you again. I know I've emailed all
commissioners going back as far as March. So I don't know -- staff
has this information as well. I don't know what's been reviewed, but I
will be happy to drop that off to you today.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: And I do not have a copy of a
transcript.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: It's just the questions. They've sent
us the copy of their standard questions when they do the welcome
call.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Correct.
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CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: They've sent those to us. That's
what we have a copy of.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Not the answers, okay.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: No.
MR. LEMYRE: The actual -- the transcripts of the calls with
the responses from the homeowner -- in fact, I have the two here that
confirm all the calls to the two property owners that spoke at the last
meeting. They do contain personal identifiable information, and
they're marked as such. They would have to be redacted to some
extent before distributing them in print, which we would do between
legal counsels. I wanted to understand what the question is so we can
make sure we comply specifically.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Talking about them.
So with that, thank you.
MR. LEMYRE: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Very good.
MR. MILLER: Mr. Chairman, we have nine registered speakers
for this item. Your first -- I'll remind the speakers, you can use both
podiums. I will call two speakers' names. If the second speakers
could be standing by.
Your first speaker is John Harney. He will be followed by Mike
Schumann.
MR. HARNEY: I'd like to cede my time to Elena Mola.
MR. MILLER: Okay. Mr. Schumann will be followed by Lisa
Lefkow.
MR. SCHUMANN: Commissioners, my name is Mike
Schumann. I have been involved in this PACE stuff for almost 10
years now.
And this is a very hard act to follow. I think what you just
witnessed is the kind of misleading presentations that many
homeowners in this county have been subjected to. And I'd like to go
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through it, but it's kind of difficult to go through this without,
essentially, doing a cross-examination.
I don't know whether you would permit me to ask the presenters
some detailed questions so we can really flesh out how misleading
some of the statements that we've heard today are.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Mr. Schumann, ask me those
questions, and I would be glad to ask the providers.
MR. SCHUMANN: Okay. Let's start with the last slide that
came up that talked about welcome letters, okay.
So my question is, is the welcome -- not the welcome letter but
the notice to lender. Is the notice to lender that they indicated on that
slide, is that the notice to lender that the state statute requires?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And your next question?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Well, I think we need to do these
one at a time, because I've got a lot of questions.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: We're not going through this. This
is not a judge and jury. You have three minutes to ask your
questions, sir.
MR. SCHUMANN: Well, the reality is, depending on what the
answer to this question is, then there's followup questions specifically
with that slide, but there's also a lot of other issues that they talked
about.
Okay. Like, for instance, the way they talk about loan to value,
okay. They keep talking about loan to value in terms of how much
their loan is compared to the value of the property. The way a
normal banker talks about loan to value is how much the total loan is
to the equity that the homeowner has in the property, all right.
And that's the fundamental problem with this program is you
can have a homeowner that basically has, essentially, no equity, and
under this program, they can basically -- you can still borrow
20 percent of the value of the home and be way underwater when
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you're done, and that's why this program is such a magnet for the
kind of bad actors that we've been seeing, because you don't have to
worry about whether or not a consumer actually is creditworthy.
You know, in fact, they don't make any -- they talk about
underwriting. What kind of underwriting are we talking about?
They're not even bothering to look at income. They're not looking at,
you know, the outstanding loan balances that these customers have,
there's no underwriting going on here at all. They're just basically
going through the basic criteria to see if the loan meets the standard
required by the state statute, and even in that case, many of the loans
we've looked at violate the state statute.
But I would like to follow up on this notice to lender, because I
think that there's some big questions there in terms of what that slide
is all about.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Thank you, Michael.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Lisa Lefkow. She'll be
followed by Elena Mola.
MS. LEFKOW: Good afternoon, Commissioners. Lisa Lefkow,
Habitat for Humanity.
As we've identified today, Habitat homeowners are a very small
portion of the number of homeowners that have been impacted by
PACE loans.
We can respond to individual issues here. The notice to lender, I
had a conversation with Mr. Lemyre just after the March meeting and
the ensuing article in the newspaper. When he reached out to me at
that time, he identified that Habitat was not being noticed because we
were not a part of their national lender database. They have since
corrected that.
He also patiently listened to the experiences of our Habitat
homeowners and identified that there were, indeed, issues with
contractor controls which he promised to address. So I appreciate all
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of that.
I think there are so many issues here, the timing of notice of
commencements, the timings of financing approval letters, the
self-reported income verification. Even the confirmation calls, these
are not conducted in homeowners' native language. And so if you're
a non-English speaker, these conversations are not well understood,
and many of our homeowners have reported having been coached on
what to say on those confirmation calls in order to be approved for
financing.
So as you heard from several folks last week and have heard --
last month and you have heard in the past, there are continuing issues.
You only have to Google PACE financing to see the incredible list of
articles and lawsuits and questions and concerns being raised by this
program.
So my question to you today -- this is the third time now that
we're spending valuable County Commission time to address this
issue -- why are we sitting with something that is so mired in
controversy and allowing for vulnerable homeowners to be taken
advantage of? Indeed, not every one, not every one. But there are
too many instances. In many of our own cases -- again, small
number, Habitat families -- I've asked, have you issued a complaint,
these that have concerns? They have no idea how to do that.
If you'd like me to coach them through that, I'll be happy to, and
then you'll have your complaints.
So this is the issue. Friends, let's just be done with this. This is
not an appropriate program for us. It is being examined on a federal
level. There are way too many questions.
Mr. Lemyre again identified that in 10 years he hasn't
understood the entire program and, yet, we're asking naive and
unsophisticated, sometimes uneducated homeowners to buy into a
very complex and complicated program with a simple signature on an
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iPad. Let's stop.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Elena Mola. She has been
ceded additional time from John Harney. Can you raise your hand to
indicate you're here, sir?
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: Jury Paulson?
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: Peter Greenberg?
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: Bill Shade?
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: And, Edward Hubbard?
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: That is a total of 18 minutes. She will be
followed by Flori Gutierrez.
MS. GUTIERREZ: I cede my time.
MR. MILLER: Oh, you're ceding your time as well. That will
be a total of 18 (sic) minutes.
MS. MOLA: Thank you very much. And I certainly appreciate
you undertaking this bit of due diligence on this program because, as
you can see, it affects a significant number of Collier County
homeowners.
And I am not, and I want to clarify this, the person who should
be so worried about Collier County homeowners. That job is yours.
With that, I would also like to say that I appreciate the
presentation that Ygrene made, but I did not hear them at all address
the exact allegations that I made in the last meeting and the numbers.
None of them were addressed.
With that, I want to clarify a couple of things. Only
municipalities and counties in three states, Florida, California, and
Missouri, have actually authorized PACE programs for residential
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properties. In Florida, only 31 or 33 of the 67 counties have
deployed residential PACE programs.
The acceptance of residential PACE programs has been
controversial and its general deployment delayed for many reasons in
many states.
In Missouri, the other state besides California and Florida where
the residential program is in -- has been deployed, Missouri Senator
Tom Cotton has stated that residential PACE loans are a scam and
called for the protection of homeowners from PACE predatory green
energy lenders who are changing state and local laws to trick seniors
into taking out high-interest-rate loans for up to 20 years along with
liens on their homes.
In April of 2017, Senator Cotton, along with our senator, Marco
Rubio, along with Arkansas Senator John Boozman, and
representatives from California introduced Protecting Americans
from Credit Exploitation PACE Act. Specifically, the bill required
disclosures that in Senator Cotton's words, would reduce the
advantage the PACE loan sharks have over hardworking Americans.
By requiring Truth In Lending Act disclosures for anyone
attempting to market PACE loans and instruct that the Consumer
Financial Protection Bureau to implement regulation to strengthen
protections from homeowners.
Congress passed what is now known as the Economic Growth
Regulatory Relief and Consumer Protection Act of 2018 that
amended the Truth In Lending Act to require the applicability of
TILA, ability to repay standards, to PACE loans.
Similarly, in California where the largest PACE administrator's
doing business in Collier County, Ygrene Fund, and Renew Financial
headquarters, PACE-related program abuses were so rampant that
homeowners, political representatives, a myriad of consumer and
senior advocacy groups as well as the California Association of
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County Treasurers and Tax Collectors advocated for either the
termination of the PACE program for residential homeowners or the
enactment of strong state legislation to increase consumer
protections.
In Los Angeles -- oh, no. Even with the 2017 amendment to the
California PACE statute to include additional consumer protections, a
number of California cities and counties terminated or are in the
process of reviewing their residential PACE programs. This is
primarily due to the alleged continued deceptive and fraudulent
practices and predatory lending on the part of PACE contractors and
providers that specifically target the elderly, non-English speaking,
and disadvantaged communities.
Additionally, there is now concern over the disruption in local
real estate markets resulting from a jump in defaults, the inability of
homeowners to refinance or sell their properties, homeowners being
forced to use equity in their home to pay off the PACE lien before
selling, and homeowners -- and home sellers deceiving or defrauding
cash purchasers by failing to disclose PACE liens.
Examples of California counties and cities that terminated the
PACE residential program are Kern County where as of June 30,
2017, 42 borrowers were in danger of losing their homes. In
Bakersfield, California, the ninth largest city in California,
California's Tax Collectors, all of whom, again, either opposed the
deployment of PACE residential programs or requested stronger
consumer protections, said that they are now left with the unpleasant
job of having to confront homeowners, collect penalties and interest
in defaulted tax assessment, and undertake the tax sales of their
homes.
Riverside County, where 227 PACE borrowers were in default
as of August 2017, Tax Collector Christensen stated, for us to be the
heavy hand and make borrowers go through the tax sale process is
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onerous on us. In Los Angeles, where just one PACE contractor
appears to have defrauded hundreds of homeowners now at risk of
losing their homes, the city's attorney stated that -- stated that
would -- would be -- that that would be among the most devastating
scams that he could recall in his career and has now filed a lawsuit
asking for civil penalties and restitution for homeowners, including
the PACE loans obtained through what he, quote, called unfair,
unlawful, or fraudulent practices, that those be canceled. And that
was filed in April of 2019, okay. Look at the LA Times April 4th,
2019.
An analysis by the Wall Street Journal of tax data in 40 counties
in California showed that PACE loan default, i.e., borrowers that
have missed two consecutive payments, had jumped approximately
450 percent from 245 to approximately 1,100 borrowers from 2016
through June 30th of 2017.
And past-due PACE loans increased by over 711 percent from
approximately 527,000 in 2015 through 2016, to 3.7 million through
August of 2017.
Since the aforementioned PACE default rates apparently do not
capture borrowers whose missed payments are covered by mortgage
escrow accounts, such could even be higher. Such unpaid tax
assessment balances accrue penalties and significant additional
interest, making it even harder for homeowners to pay off their
assessments.
Apparently, as a result of California's strength in homeowner
protections, there was a significant drop in the business of the PACE
lenders. Consequently, they are now quickly attempting to make up
the drop in their California loan portfolios through a concerted effort
in Florida where consumer and homeowner protection laws and
regulations are weak or, as one former Ygrene employee put it,
unsuspecting customers still reside and PACE laws are lax.
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In 2018, Renew Financial confirmed that its California
residential PACE volume had dropped by 42 percent in the first
quarter compared to the same period in 2017 and that, overall,
California residential PACE applications had dropped by 49 percent
by the end of the second quarter of 2018. Similarly, it appears that
Ygrene is betting its continued viability on Florida.
At its most recent bond transactions -- as its most recent bond
transactions show, that 70 percent are secured by Florida residential
properties and 30 percent by properties in California. Excuse me.
The overwhelming majority of financing agreements filed in
Collier County, PACE finance agreement, are related to homes
located in Golden Gate City, Golden Gate Estates, Immokalee, and a
dozen or so concentrated in Naples Manor section of East Naples
with no more than a handful dispersed through each of Commissioner
Solis and Taylor's District 2 and 4.
The great majority of Ygrene home-improvement projects and
related financing in Collier County were marketed, originated by, and
related to home-improvement projects undertaken by non-Collier
County companies who are or were authorized and certified by PACE
administrators as PACE contractors. These PACE contractors come,
some more notorious than others, traveled from as far as Tampa,
Brandon, and Fort Lauderdale in some cases allegedly bringing crews
as far away as from Tennessee to undertaken PACE
home-improvement projects in Collier County.
Specifically, the following companies were the ones who
undertook the majority of those projects: Bruno Air-Conditioning
and Bruno Total Home, Florida Home Improvement Associates,
Summitwood Works, Energy Renovations, basically the same
company, and U.S. Solar in Brandon.
It should be noted that except for two all of the 129 notice of
commencements filed by U.S. Solar for the installation of solar
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panels are for homes concentrated in two of the most disadvantaged
neighborhoods in Collier County: Golden Gate City and the Naples
Manor section of East Naples.
Moreover, 119 of the 129 notice of commencements recorded by
U.S. Solar are associated with Hispanic and Haitian homeowners.
Two of the aforementioned four approved PACE contractors
and/or their owners are or have been the subject of investigation by
law enforcements, have been forced to cease all PACE-related
operations, have been dissolved, and are currently the subject of a
significant number of consumer complaints.
In addition to the apparent targeting of the most disadvantaged
and working-class neighborhoods of Collier County by PACE
contractors, an analysis of over 124 to 150 homes with Ygrene/Green
Corridor 2018 assessments shows -- and I'm not going to repeat that.
I said that last week -- show an average increase in property taxes due
to the PACE assessment of over 106 percent, which range from as
low as 37 to a high of 2,327 percent increase.
It showed also that the average loan to fair market value ratio
was approximately 16 percent with some over 26, 29, 37, 39 percent.
Again, I have all the numbers. I've checked all the numbers. I did
not see them respond to any of this in their presentation.
With less than 18 months of operating in Collier County, just
one green certified PACE contractor and one of the contractor's
material suppliers have recorded at least 16 claims of liens on Collier
County residential properties, at least one lis pendens foreclosure
action against Collier County homeowner wherein the PACE
contractor is also a named defendant.
The aforementioned findings cannot be ignored, and it appears
that the most significant and egregious impact from PACE
assessments, a fear have fallen on the elderly, widowed, and/or
disabled living on pensions or fixed incomes, as well as homeowners
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concentrated in low-income neighborhoods.
Given the seniors, widows, and widowers, and those with
military service-related disabilities or qualified -- or other identified
disability have traditionally been granted certain property tax
exemptions from Collier County. The impact of a PACE assessment
renders many of them immediately unable to pay the PACE
assessment unless they have significant changes or sacrifices to their
quality of life or have the ability to refinance their home.
For example, the property taxes of a senior veteran with a
service-related disability increased by over $3,960 per year, rising
from a little over 210 to $4,177 per year.
I have here every single PACE lien financing, the increase in
their property taxes. I also have where the -- all the liens, claims of
liens, the foreclosures. I have everything noted. And I did go, by the
way, to -- and inform some of the Commissioners, I think all of the
Commissioners, that I had done the research, and they were more
than welcome to call me and, unfortunately, only two did.
Continuing. Sorry.
Okay. So in the -- in the case -- another disabled veteran was
impacted by a PACE assessment that resulted in an over
2,300 percent increase in his property taxes, rising from a little over
210 to over $5,175 per year.
Then there's the example of the Habitat for Humanity
homeowner whose property taxes increased from a little over $720
per year to $6,135 per year. Many less -- but no less -- many less
extreme but no less egregious examples of PACE increases can be
found through Collier County. In fact, there appears to be a direct
inverse correlation among the homes with lowest assessed tax values
with the highest percentage property tax increases resulting from the
PACE assessments.
Excuse me. I'm rushing because, obviously, I don't have much
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time.
Examples of instances where the 20 percent limitation has been
exceeded and should there be scrutinized for, A, consent of
loanholders if applicable or, B, is supported by an energy audit, are
set forth in this spreadsheet which, again, you're all welcome to.
If any thereof are supported, and I -- hold on. Are set forth in
the spreadsheet that I just mentioned, if any thereof are supported by
either, A, the consent of the holders or loan servicers of any mortgage
encumbering or otherwise secured by the property or, B, an energy
audit such must be determined; there is no record thereof recorded in
the Collier County records.
Moreover, in the case of the requisite energy audit, a
determination should be made as to who undertook the energy audit
on which the homeowner should reasonably have been expected to
rely. Was it the certified PACE contractor that undertook the home
improvement who was expected to undertake the energy audit and
disclose the associated energy and/or cost savings to the homeowner?
Alternatively, was it a certified independent energy auditor who
undertook the audit and made such disclosure to the homeowner?
Furthermore, under any of those scenarios, did the PACE
provider lender verify and/or confirm -- you know what, guys? I'm
not going to be sitting here rushing through this when I only have two
minutes.
I will tell you once again, if you want my information, you can
have it. I think that all of you who are making decisions for Collier
County should have undertaken significant and in-depth due
diligence on this program before basically deploying it in Collier
County.
I don't know how many people need to come up and say that
they were deceived, misrepresented, or defrauded. I don't know if
Ygrene is going to stand up and say, hey, when I'm talking about all
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of these Summitwood projects, notice of commencements, they were
procured through fraudulent notices of commencements where their
signatures are forged -- and I can go on and on, but everything is in
here, okay? And I stand by everything that I said, and I stand by all
my research.
And all I'm going to ask is if Ygrene really believes that it has a
great program, that it has vetted, authorized, and certified contractors
to work and act as their agents here in Collier County, are you then
going to stand and be responsible by doing away with the financing
in those cases of those contractors who obviously procured through
some sort of deception, misrepresentation, or fraud?
Thank you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Question for her?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Yes. Ms. Mola, you brought
forth some statements at our last meeting.
MS. MOLA: Yes.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Allegations of --
MS. MOLA: Yes.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Did you ask anyone -- did you
give it to anyone in the government to verify?
MS. MOLA: Absolutely.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Who did you give it to?
MS. MOLA: I gave it to the Clerk of the Court, all of my
research, I gave it to the State Attorney, and so they have it, and I
also gave it to staff.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Ms. Kinzel, have you had an
opportunity to review the work that Ms. Mola did?
CLERK KINZEL: Yes, Commissioner. We are in the process
of looking at the schedules that she provided.
For the preliminary work that we've done, we've been able to
validate her spreadsheets on the ratios and the mortgages and the
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amounts, but we have not spoken specifically to clients. We've not
done that legwork at this point.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Okay. In your opinion -- and
this is not opinion -- but from what you reviewed, is there enough to
substantiate questions on the program within Collier County based on
what you've reviewed?
CLERK KINZEL: Yes. I mean, the Clerk of Courts and the
Tax Collector brought forward to the Board -- and I don't think all of
you were even on that board, previously, before this was ever
implemented, and we had grave concerns, because we saw what was
happening in California. That was as early as, like, 2014. So that
was before any of this happened.
When this arose in your commission meeting, I went back and
pulled out my old notebook of information. It is set up --
unfortunately, it seems to have caused these problems in almost every
community for residential.
So I can't say that we have completed an audit. I can't say that
we have vetted every one of the accusations or information,
whatever, but we have done a sampling of the vetting of
loan-to-value ratios, those kinds of things, that would substantiate her
spreadsheets.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Thank you.
MS. MOLA: Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Mr. Chairman, that was your final registered
speaker for that item.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Very good. Thank you, Troy.
Commissioner Taylor.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: At this point -- and I'd like to
reserve the opportunity to speak again. On April 24th, 2017, a letter
was written to the Honorable Brad Sherman at the U.S. House of
Representatives and the Honorable Edward Royce of the U.S. House
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of Representatives, and it was signed by folks that basically said, the
undersigned trade associations representing, collectively, real estate
professionals, home builders, and mortgage lenders and services --
servicers, write today to express strong support for your recently
introduced legislation, which is HR 1958, Protecting Americans from
Credit Entanglements Act of 2017.
And it goes on to say, while energy efficient home
improvements can be beneficial for homeowners, we have serious
concerns with the Property Assessed Clean Energy, PACE, program
construct. Residential consumer-protection requirements, HR -- I'm
sorry -- residential PACE loans are, in substance, mortgaged
financing and should be subject to federal consumer-protection
requirements.
It is my understanding they're not. I will give you the -- I will
read the associations that wrote this letter -- I have this as a copy if
anybody wants it -- the American Bankers Association, the American
Land Title Association, the Appraisal Institute, the Arkansas Land
Title Association, the California Association of Realtors, and the
California Bankers Association, the California Credit Union League,
the California Land Title Association, the California Mortgage
Bankers Association, the Connecticut Mortgage Bankers Association,
the Credit Union National Association, the Florida Land Title
Association, the Housing Policy Council of Financial Services
Roundtable, the Independent Community Bankers of America, the
Missouri Land Title Association, the Montana Land Title
Association, the Mortgage Bankers Association, the Mortgage
Bankers Association of Arkansas and of Florida and of Missouri, the
National Association of Federally Insured Credit Unions, the
National Association of Hispanic Real Estate Professionals, the
National Association of Homebuilders, the National Association of
Real Estate Brokers, the National Association of Realtors, the New
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England Land Title Association, the Real Estate Service Providers
Council, and the Reality Alliance. Obviously, these loans are not
secured by federal consumer protections.
And so at this point I'd ask -- I'd like to ask Mr. Lemyre, if I
may -- I'd like him to answer two questions. Does the notice to
lenders follow state statutes in its requirements?
MR. LEMYRE: Yes.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Okay. And do you assess the
creditworthiness of the people that you interview?
MR. LEMYRE: Yes.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: So your loans are made as a
bank would be made on the total loan to the equity in the house?
MR. LEMYRE: I don't know if I can characterize it the same
way. Different banks make it different -- different loans in different
manners. So what -- I mean, are you asking what data we --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: How do you assess the
creditworthiness of the person who is taking out the loan?
MR. LEMYRE: Creditworthiness, different from loan to value.
Creditworthiness, their history of paying their mortgage, their
property taxes, the lack of involuntary liens over $1,000, et cetera.
Like, basically, their payment performance associated with the
property. So debts on the property or absence of liens.
We also look at the loan to value prior to PACE that is
associated with the property. So -- and that could be either based on
just value or fair-market value. There are caps on the percentage of
either one of those.
So we look at the outstanding debt of the property, a first
mortgage, a second mortgage, for example, versus its market value to
determine a pre-PACE loan to value.
We calculate the amount of PACE financing being requested as
a percentage of the same underlying value, and that is the estimated --
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like, 6 percent on average that you saw before, and then we add the
two together to get the combined LTV or CLTV which would be all
prior -- all property -related debt prior to the PACE plus the PACE to
come up with the result. In one, I believe, the average of 68 or 66 --
whatever the slides that we submitted. You know, I'll stipulate to
that.
And then we also collect income and debt data or use credit
bureau as a third-party data and modeling on those aspects to
determine creditworthiness.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: So my final question to you.
You made the statement that it has taken me almost 10 years to
understand PACE. Why do you think that you can -- one of your
contractors can knock on the door of someone and understand what
they're getting into if it's taken you 10 years, sir?
MR. LEMYRE: The contractors have to -- a contractor's role in
this is to introduce the product as an option and the basic
characteristics of it and how it could be used should the homeowner
choose that option over another option.
I have to understand the policy, the statutory requirements, the
law, essentially, and understand and work with the, you know, over
620 cities and counties across the state that Ygrene partners with, and
there's more than 700 across the country that the entire industry
engages with and understand those policy and statutory requirements
as well as the requirements and positions of the various PACE boards
and districts.
So it's far more complex to actually operate the program,
represent the program, and interact at a local, state, and federal level
than it is for a contractor to represent it just as if it -- and the same
would go for different staff either at the city or county level or within
Ygrene or any PACE administrator in terms of their scope of
authority. I was merely representing the amount of time that I have
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invested in PACE and where my knowledge and expertise and
answers that I submitted to the Board come from as opposed to
someone who has little or no, you know, interaction with PACE or is
on the periphery, not just contractors, but others that have made
statements to the fact. So that -- that's the difference.
Now, there was a comment or question made before about
whether we answered all of the questions. I think we've answered
every question that was put before us by the Board. Honestly, we're
at a difficult position --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: I asked a representative to
respond to the allegations one by one, not give my colleagues
opportunity to listen to calls made to customers. It's one by one; I
said that's what I'd like.
MR. LEMYRE: Well, we never received any specific detail --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: There's transcripts.
MR. LEMYRE: Yeah, but I can't -- yeah, I mean, those
transcript don't include -- and I'm sorry, I don't want to be
argumentative, but I submit, though, that the transcripts do not
include the spreadsheets or the copies of the liens or the records.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: All public records.
MR. LEMYRE: Well, we have our records, too, that are also
part of public records. So what -- how this process often typically
plays out and in a productive manner is that we sit down with staff or
those designated by staff or a party who is representing in the
capacity, legal capacity or otherwise, the homeowner and we
compare the data.
So I have -- Ygrene has in its possession, the property -- the just
values, the fair market values, the project amounts, and I would
submit that we follow the statute and the program policies in every
one of those cases.
And if somebody else has other information, we would sit down,
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compare that information, compare the sources. If we made an error,
we'll own the error. And if we did not make an error, there are at
least four different numbers that people can describe as a value to a
property: Just value, assessed value, appraised value, fair market
value.
So there's a lot of misunderstanding. And I'm saying this, like,
not to impugn anybody. There are a lot of variables when you look at
a property and a project, and there's also a point in time. And so we
underwrite at the point in time when the application is submitted, and
we follow the statutory and the policy guidance at both the state and
local level.
And when the CFPW at the federal level does issue its rules, we
will comply with all Federal Rules, but the outcome of the letter and
the process that you described before was the passage of the Growth
Recovery Act, Senate 2155 that Ms. Mola referred to earlier, and that
has resulted in a rule-making process that is underway. So we
comply with state, local and, when they exist, federal laws.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: This isn't state. This is --
MR. LEMYRE: I said local.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: I asked your representative to
respond to the allegations one by one. We had very moving and
very -- I considered very credible testimony from individuals who
took great risk at coming in here and explaining how they feel like
they'd been abused, and no one likes that. No one likes that feeling
of feeling that you've been taken, that you've been made a fool of, but
they did it publicly.
MR. LEMYRE: Absolutely.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: There's also other allegations
in -- it's a -- she read it word by word. It's available to you. It's not
here before us.
You gave us a lot of slides. You talked around. I made that
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very clear to the representative who came and talked to me this week.
What do you want? I want you to respond to the allegations. I think
that's what my colleague to my left did. He said, I want you to
respond to these allegations. You're going to have another meeting.
MR. LEMYRE: And the -- I'm sorry, go ahead.
The two homeowners that made allegations when they spoke on
the record, those were the two confirmed terms calls transcripts that I
have with you (sic), and I noted that they do include personal
identifiable information that we'll redact and provide to you. Those
are the contents in the calls that we played for those, you know,
members that we met with.
So that was -- my understanding, that was the specific
allegations of the homeowners who use PACE, and that is how we
responded specifically to those --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Ms. Mola brought more
challenges to your program that you have not addressed on a very
direct, precise basis. You have not addressed those.
MR. LEMYRE: With all due respect, Ms. Mola has made some
broad allegations, some specific, but not submitted the specific files.
As I said, if we had the spreadsheets and files that, you know, she
refers to, I'd be happy to go through them in detail. But the -- I think
we've addressed those allegations of the notice-to-lender details not
being submitted. We have a notice-to-lender form that has complied
with the state statute from day one, and that has been sent, and I have
never said that we didn't send them and we forgot and mistaken, then
we corrected it.
I said from day one that we have sent it. If we didn't, we'll fix it.
I confirmed that we did, so that was specifically addressed.
The underwriting criteria, you know, allegation was general,
was nonspecific as we heard again today. I said, I don't know how
else to respond other than to say that we comply with all the state
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statutes as well as all the local government requirements that are put
on the program. It's a blanket response to those allegations.
So I don't -- other than having specific data on specific projects,
again, which, if we can sit down and have that, more than happy to
go through that and verify any discrepancies that may exist. But we
have that. When we see those specifics, then we'll be happy to do
that.
I'm happy to go on. I have the notes from Ms. Mola. If we have
to fill in any gaps in the information that we supplied then, again,
happy to do that.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Fiala.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Just, you're considered -- Ygrene is
considered not a lending institution but a financing institution, right?
MR. LEMYRE: Yeah. We're a program administrator that
provides financing and administration services to local governments.
So, yeah, we're not a bank -- we're not a chartered bank or credit
union, if that's what you mean by lending institution.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yeah, that's kind of what I mean. I
know in years gone by when I've wanted a loan or financing for
whatever, I went to an institution and if -- then each month they
would send me my little notification or send me something that I paid
every month, and if I didn't pay, they would send you a letter and say
you didn't pay, da, da, da, da.
In this case, it just so happens that we're the collection agency
for you rather than you being your own collection agency, so -- we,
meaning the county, is your collection agency.
So if that doesn't happen and if the county just said you go on
with your business, whatever you want to do, but we don't want any
part of it, we want to step out of that business, and you do your own
collection, how would that work?
May 28, 2019
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MR. LEMYRE: I think that would be subject to discussion with
the county tax collector. One statement that was made before were
referenced to the objections of county tax collectors in bank, or, you
know, his entire group. We work with -- we're authorized in at least
70, 75 counties nationwide. We have collection agreements with
those collectors to specify the statutory requirements and obligations,
so we understand what everyone's doing. So that would be the
process so -- for making any changes to that, but also just makes the
point that if so many collectors were opposed to PACE -- and I'm not
sure why they entered into agreements with PACE programs to
collect. But that would be the venue, I think, with -- and we do work
with the collectors on a regular basis.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Pardon me?
MR. LEMYRE: And we do communicate and work with
collectors on a regular basis.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yeah. I know that our Tax
Collector didn't come before us, although he spoke to a few of us
privately and told us of his displeasure with this but, on the other
hand, he didn't come up in this format and say to us that he did not
like this format.
I personally, when you've had problems throughout the United
States -- not every day. I don't know how often except that
everybody's heard of this PACE program, and it comes with some
bad connotations. And I'm sure there are some good, but nobody
ever writes and says, oh, yeah, I really like your program. They only
tell you what they don't like. I understand that. But if we as a county
feel a little uneasy about being your collection agency and we backed
out, could you still work with the people in the community and do
your own collections?
MR. LEMYRE: I don't know the answer to that with precision,
but we'll research that.
May 28, 2019
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COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yeah. See, that's something -- I
just don't -- I don't feel comfortable about being your collection
agency, quite frankly. If you want to run your own business and you
be your own collection agency, maybe that would be a better way to
do it. Then we wouldn't have to take anybody's home or anything
either.
MR. LEMYRE: Well, yeah. So it's kind of inherent in PACE in
the number of communities and then expanded to 175,
approximately, across the state, including Collier County. They put
out an RFP and wanted to -- proactively wanted to develop a PACE
program. We were selected, amongst others, and then developed the
PACE program.
So the -- you know, the local governments in Florida came to us
as they have gone to other providers. So we didn't create a finance
business. I just want to -- I just want to make it -- to make sure that
the order is right here. We didn't create a private business and then
approach the counties and say, hey, we'd like you to collect for us as
opposed to us collecting ourselves.
The local governments wanted to create a PACE program, and
they selected an administrator and financer, and because of the nature
of PACE, it's collected with the taxes, which is precisely why we
provide multiple documents and communications to homeowners and
email and regular mail, letters, postcards throughout the process, not
just during the approval process, but subsequent to that to ensure that
people understand this is different tha n, as you said, getting a
monthly statement. It's going to be added to your annual tax bill.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: So you're saying that you never
thought of coming here. It was our people that brought you here?
MR. LEMYRE: I didn't say Collier County. I said local
government in general. Local government created -- and state
government created the PACE program and in the way -- in doing so,
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there's a number of unique aspects, one of which is that it's collected
on the property taxes.
But what I'm saying is Ygrene's been in the state of Florida since
2011. We have not just entered Florida to make up for some decline
in business elsewhere. I have more employees or about as many
employees in Florida as I have anywhere else.
We're part of the community here. We've been throughout the
state for seven years, going on eight years.
What I'm saying is that the local governments that wanted to
create a PACE program did so and then selected private operators,
whether it's Ygrene, whether it's my competitors, and with that
unique aspect of PACE, one of which is the collection of the taxes.
So I just -- I don't -- I just want to be clear the characterization.
We did not approach and say, hey, we'd love to create this business
where the tax collectors collect for us. That's not the way --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: You said the local governments
reached out to you.
MR. LEMYRE: Yes.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Jamie, who in our local
government reached out to them?
MR. LEMYRE: I said not specific to Collier County. I said
when we entered --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I heard that, but then you said local
governments reached out to you, and I'm figuring you're standing in
our boardroom.
MR. LEMYRE: No. I can provide a list of the local
governments who initiated the program that we administer here in
Florida.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yeah, I understood that part --
(Simultaneous speakers speaking.)
MR. LEMYRE: That grew to include Collier County, amongst
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175 --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: The people that you solicitated to
rather than us solicitating to you, right? Is that what you're saying? I
mean, we didn't ask you to come here; you asked us.
MR. LEMYRE: I would have to ask my staff who works here in
Florida, like, how Collier County --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Good. Jamie has the answer.
Thank you.
MR. FRENCH: Thank you?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: No, I'm talking to Andy. I mean,
Commissioner Solis.
MR. FRENCH: No. Thank you for putting me on the spot. I
was introduced to -- and I hate to mention him, but Mr. Jones here to
my left, and Bobbie Dusek, and a gentleman from Florida Ygrene by
Mr. Larry Ray and Rob Stoneburner, and they were soliciting us to
come forward with a PACE item.
And I hate to say, ma'am, but I -- it was a three-year arduous
process before I even brought it to the Board. But it was not staff. I
had never met the PACE providers before, and -- but they had
approached us.
MR. LEMYRE: With those gentlemen that you mentioned,
though, those names, I don't believe that they --
MR. FRENCH: I think Rafael Perez was probably the first, and
Rafael and I worked together a couple years ago.
MR. LEMYRE: Okay.
MR. FRENCH: But at no time did staff solicit.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Crystal, did you have something to
tell us?
CLERK KINZEL: I guess it's the credit of having been here
forever. But you were first approached in probably about 2010, I
think, or '11, and Steve Hart, who had been here locally, brought it to
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the Commission the first time. Then there was some legislation, I
think, that precluded it from that period. And I'm going from
memory of what I looked back on my old records. And then
probably about 2014 it came forward again.
But it was brought to the Board to adopt this program and accept
it for use in Collier County by either a citizen or a representativ e. I
think Steve might have been acting in a citizen, you know, role, but
that's the first recollection that came to here. And that's my history
from the very first presentation to the Board.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Well, personally, I feel
uncomfortable about it continuing. I know if we were helping a lot of
people and if it weren't so controversial and we didn't have to be in
the collector's position, I might look at it differently, but I don't like
being the collecting agency, and I don't like having to take anybody's
home that didn't pay.
And it seems that the only people that you guys approach are
people who are, naturally, financially having problems, and they can't
go out and get a loan, as it said in the beginning when they presented
to us, they can't get a loan at a conventional bank, and they can't use a
credit card to buy things at Home Depot or whatever, so they need to
use you. And so if that's the case, I don't like being the bank, to be
perfectly honest.
MR. LEMYRE: The average FICO score, credit score of a
PACE customer in Florida is 702, so I'm not sure where the
characterization from the -- people who are unable to get any other
form of financing. But the average PACE --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: It's been represented that --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay. It was represented that way,
that's a better way of saying that, yes, and that's what we understood.
We were trying to help people who couldn't get a loan any other way
and then wouldn't be having the security of hurricane preparedness
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wrapped around them. So being that they couldn't get a loan and they
couldn't get it from a Home Depot -- because I even asked the
question. Well, let them go down to Home Depot or something and
get it, and they said, no, they can't get credit cards. So that's -- I don't
know where 702 came into that --
MR. LEMYRE: That was an average. There are certainly
homeowners that fall more in the spectrum that you're describing, and
the other end. Again, it's an option that -- and according to the
permitted data in the last 18 months in the county, it's an option that's
used a fraction of the time, but for some homeowners it's -- you
know, it's a viable or attractive option.
We do offer the paperwork and the confirmed terms calls in
their language of choice. I think we support at least three languages
including Haitian-Creole, Spanish, and English.
You know, so I think it is -- it is, like I said, an option, and
there's a range of homeowners who take advantage of it.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Well, I'll tell you, we were
discussing bringing this back today and eliminating part of the
program but keeping a part in place for the businesses who might
want to use this program, and I'm still in favor of that. So I'll make a
motion to approve the agenda item as it was written for us.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: I'll second that.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: All right. It's been moved and
seconded that we accept staff's recommendations per the agenda. I
have two more commissioners to speak.
Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Before I begin to speak, in
terms of --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And we need to give the court
reporter a break, so...
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: We can't just accept the staff
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recommendation. There's two different ways to go there. So
whatever the motion's ultimately going to be, it's going to have to be
clarified a little bit.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay. Will do.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: One of the attractive things
about this program was the fact that it was a state-sanctioned
program. Now, having been in the legislature for a number of years,
that doesn't necessarily mean it's a good program just because the
state sanctioned it and it passed a statute to implement it.
And I'm going to make a statement, and tell me where this is just
not correct or why it's not correct. We've been talking about loan to
value, ability to pay. And as I've listened to all this dialogue, because
I said right at the beginning I came to this meeting with an open mind
in terms of where I might ultimately go.
But I've got some very significant concerns. So you have loan
to value, you have the ability to pay. But the way this program is set
up, it seems to me it doesn't make any difference because you get a
first-priority lien. So if there's a house that's worth $200,000 and
there's a $200,000 mortgage on it and you place a $30,000 lien on it,
you're ahead of the mortgage holder.
MR. LEMYRE: Well, we would never do that, sir.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: No, I understand. But just
tell me why is that not an essential -- or just an absolute defect in a
program.
MR. LEMYRE: Well, no, but, I mean -- so you just -- just so I
heard it correctly, a $200,000 home; is that a home value?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Yeah. Just say there's a
$200,000 home, and it's got a $150,000 mortgage.
MR. LEMYRE: Oh, 150,000, okay.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Then you don't really -- it
doesn't make any difference what the loan to value is, because you're
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ahead of that mortgage.
MR. LEMYRE: Yeah, but we -- the loan-to-value limitations
aren't the only criteria, right. So, you could be -- you could have a
homeowner who has enough equity to qualify but doesn't have --
doesn't have a satisfactory pay history, has -- you, lates (sic) on their
mortgage, lates on their -- is behind on their taxes or, you know,
some other ability-to-pay criteria.
So the loan to value is just one aspect. That's the initial screen,
perhaps. But if you had somebody with a $200,000 mortgage and
$200,000 home, they're 100 percent, they have no equity, they're not
going to get approved for PACE.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: No, I understand.
MR. LEMYRE: I'm sorry. I just --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: It just seems to me that that's
kind of an inherent -- and I understand that that's the only way the
program will work, and I understand also the letter that
Commissioner Taylor was reading. I understand why all the
mortgage bankers and those folks are opposed to this. They wound
up being in a second position from being in a first position, so I
understand.
But it just seemed to me that that is kind of an inherent problem
that gives -- I'm not suggesting Ygrene would do this, but gives
PACE providers and PACE contractors the ability to prey on people
that simply don't have the ability to make their payments.
In what states is this program operating? It sounded like there
were only three.
MR. LEMYRE: PACE is operating in at least 19 states, three of
which have residential and commercial, and the others have
commercial. So it's in -- it's in more than half the --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: So there's three residential --
MR. LEMYRE: Population-wise.
May 28, 2019
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COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: -- three states that have
residential programs.
MR. LEMYRE: Correct, and over 700, perhaps almost 800
cities and counties across those states.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: All right. You know, there's
the old saying, you know, "Where there's smoke, there's fire," and
I've kind of gone back and forth on this thing. I have some very
serious concerns about what happens to individual homeowners that
they may be fully aware of how this program works but not have the
ability to pay. And, you know, a bank is going to make sure they
have the ability to pay, but I don't think you have to.
Now, I'm not saying that Ygrene wouldn't (sic) do that. I just --
I have some concerns about it.
MR. LEMYRE: We do evaluate ability to pay across a number
of criteria and, you know, the banks don't voluntarily, you know --
and I'm not sure you equate the two, frankly, because a mortgage is a
significantly larger transaction, but the -- and the amount of PACE
that comes before the mortgage is actually equivalent to the one -year
tax lien. It's not the entire amount. It just goes each year.
So the entire, like, say $20,000 average, you know, PACE
assessment, you know, can't foreclose on the mortgage. So, I mean,
critical difference with PACE when you start to compare the
mortgages is that your mortgage company can accelerate and demand
payment on the mortgage. That's what, effectively, they do with
foreclosure.
The PACE administrator or, frankly, the county, in this case, can
accelerate the payment. The only -- you know, as long as the
homeowner's paying annually, no party can accelerate. So that's a
critical difference between mortgage and --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: One more question. Maybe
you can help me out. If you have an individual who meets all of the
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requirements in terms of loan to value and ability to pay, they get a
substantial PACE loan for a new roof and whatever and they stop
making their -- they can't make their payments, what happens after a
period -- after a couple years? What happens to that property owner?
MR. LEMYRE: Well, it would depend on the -- you know,
whether they had a mortgage or not, what that mortgage balance was,
how the servicer and mortgagee handled it. Ultimately, if the
mortgage company didn't -- you know, it's speculation, sir.
But just, for example, they might cover the tax payments for a
period of time until the homeowner can cure it and come into
currency, which happens in the vast majority of the cas es, and then if
they can't, they might ultimately pursue, you know, foreclosure, and
if that's the case, it would be a tax sale, a tax intubate (sic) sale in
Florida, but I want to point out, there's never been a foreclosure --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: At that point in time, does the
entire PACE loan get paid off?
MR. LEMYRE: No, only the arrearages. So the mortgage
company for a buyer could ask that it get wrapped into the mortgage,
but the PACE administrator nor the county nor the district can force
the entire amount.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: The PACE lien would stay
with the property?
MR. LEMYRE: Until it's fully satisfied, correct, yeah. It's a
local government tax lien, so...
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Solis.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: As I understood it, we were going
to hear today from the PACE providers in terms of a response to the
allegations that were made by some of the PACE participants at the
last meeting. This item or at least the ordinance is on the agenda for
the next meeting.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Correct.
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COMMISSIONER SOLIS: There's been a lot of documents and
reports. There's an LA Times April 4th article, an April 2017 letter,
and then there's pending federal rule-making that somehow relates to
PACE; is that correct?
MR. LEMYRE: Correct.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Okay. Sitting here today, I don't
know what is in the federal rule-making in terms of protections. You
know, from my perspective, there are a couple things that are of
concern. I mean, there's been a lot of things of concern an d a lot of
allegations, some of which have been addressed, some of them
maybe which have not.
I think the question of what happens to somebody if they're not
able to obtain a conventional loan to fix their roof because it was
damaged by a hurricane is a question that I haven't really heard an
answer to, because if somebody needs to fix their roof and they can't
obtain a traditional mortgage from a commercial lender, what are
their options? Well, one is to use a credit card, which the interest rate
on a credit card is 21, 22, up to 25 percent.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Those are usurous rates; 18.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Well, what credit card might that
be? I mean, most of them are in the 20s. And they're not -- they go
up to 25 percent.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: If they have a credit card.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: If they have a credit card. So, you
know, I think we were -- my understanding what we were doing
today was listening to the response from the providers. We've heard
from Ygrene. I don't know, is there another provider that would like
to speak?
UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: From a district. I was here at a
previous meeting. We have two providers that are underneath our --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: You know what, poor Terri's
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fingers are going to be bleeding here in a second. We're going to take
a 10-minute break. Be back at 3:15.
(A brief recess was had.)
MR. OCHS: Ladies and gentlemen, if you'd please take your
seats.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. We were in the process of
somebody coming to address you or you were -- did you have more
questions?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Well, we'd heard from one of the
providers. I didn't know if any other providers were going to share
anything.
MR. MILLER: Someone just handed me a slip. It was another
provider. Devesh Nirmal.
MR. NIRMAL: Yes. Good afternoon, Commissioners and
Chair. I represent the Florida PACE Funding Agency and our
residential program and commercial program.
James and his staff had carried out an analysis. We submitted
quite a bit of data in a short amount of time. All the PACE districts
did. Based on the report that we saw from last -- two weeks ago, we
didn't see any issues that we had to address specifically.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Okay.
MR. NIRMAL: We had a pretty robust -- our volumes are not
as high. Certainly, we'd like the program to be more robust in that
respect. We looked carefully at all the types of projects that were
completed, and we're satisfactory with our performance.
We welcome suggestions on improvements, but I think more
importantly, my experience with PACE over the past three years, and
several of the districts actually. You know, this was enabled
specifically to deal with the situations we've had in Florida at the
state level. So it wasn't sort of a copycat of another state. We have
serious issues with wind mitigation not being addressed on a lot of
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property in Florida. Indeed, that's where a lot of the focus has been.
I hear from people who lived through Hurricane Andrew, and
they go -- they may be living in another part of the state, and they'll
say, look, if you don't enable this at this point and we have another
set of storms that comes through, the landscape of that community
will look very different than it did before. The people that will buy
that land that has been totally destroyed, the property's gone, et
cetera, there is that aspect of it, and there's the aspect of the energy
code being ratcheted up, and a lot of home just are very inefficient.
So there's a purpose behind it. And what we see -- let me just
give two examples. In Levy County we had a woman come speak
from the City of Williston about a year and a half ago when the
county was looking at PACE. The same contractor was offering a
29 percent lender of last resort to get the A/C fixed, or she could
choose PACE. That property owner was so compelled by value
proposition, she actually came out to speak on that. And so it goes
back to, what's the alternative for these homeowners?
The other one is -- I think another experience is a recent
divorcee. Credit score dropped going through a divorce. Needed a
new roof. Insurance company said we're going to drop your policy.
And typically what happens if you don't get a new policy, your bank
will provide a lender-of-last-resort policy.
And this relates back to the real estate market. I'm from Tampa
Bay. We've got a really tight real estate market in some of our cities,
and I understand the situation where people that tend to run
themselves in that situation may end up having to sell their house.
So what does that mean? If you keep your roof and you keep
your home, that's two less commissions for realtors. When it comes
to the mortgage side, I mean --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Be careful.
MR. NIRMAL: Yeah.
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COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Just so you know, there's a lot of
them in the room.
MR. NIRMAL: I get it. But we hear the other side, we hear the
other side is that the realtors are also telling us at the agent level they
can help the homeowner, when they get into a home, put all that
equity, put all that cash upfront to make upgrades by using PACE
after they've bought the home, or the homeowner trying to sell the
home.
So I think there's -- we get one side of the story when it comes to
why it doesn't work. There's plenty of reasons why it does work. We
don't see any need for our program to not continue. It's working fine.
And we are -- we're happy to work with the staff on provisions to
support a better program, but they can't be those designed to stop the
program from working, so...
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: What does that mean?
MR. NIRMAL: Well, in terms of, you know, the features of the
ordinance that's on the table right now, we've already -- I mean, I've
emailed the entire Commission to say this is untenable. It's not going
to allow for a successful operation. And when you look relative to
other financing mechanisms available in the marketplace, alternative
financing, what is that comparison? You saw the chart on how we
compare to credit cards, HELOCs, et cetera.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Again, I wasn't requesting people to
come up. I just wanted to make sure that if there was another
provider that was going to speak or something, that I'd heard it all
before we --
MR. MILLER: And I'm sorry to do this, but you having said
that, I was handed slips from two other gentlemen, Bill Spivey and
Ryan Bartkus, who say they represent another provider. You'll have
to come to the mic, sir.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: And if you're in agreement with
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everything that's been said about the program, just tell me that, and
that's fine.
MR. BARTKUS: No, that's fine. We're in agreement.
THE COURT REPORTER: Your name? I don't have your
name.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Your name?
MR. BARTKUS: Oh, I'm sorry. My name's Ryan Bartkus. I'm
with the Florida Development Finance Corporation, and we
administer the Florida Resiliency and Energy District.
Spoke with you guys about four weeks ago and, you know, I
don't want to take up any more of your time. I just wanted to let you
know that there are other providers. Ygrene is not the only provide r
in the marketplace. So I just -- I would like the opportunity for us to
have more conversation. Before there's an opportunity for this to
have residential PACE removed, I think we should have more
opportunity to speak.
We had a good discussion with Jamie. I thought we were going
to have further discussions. They did not happen, and now we're at
this point where if you guys remove it today, we just don't have any
other opportunity to have discussion, and I would like to have that
opportunity.
Thank you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: How about the other speaker; same
thing?
MR. SPIVEY: Same thing.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Very good, okay.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Okay. So we've heard from
everybody. You know, I don't know where, Commissioner Saunders,
you stand on this. I mean --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: That's two of us.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: There's more that I would -- that
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I've heard today -- there's more that I've heard today that I would look
at. I was expecting this to be kind of an informational meeting, a nd
then we would be deciding this at the next meeting when we're going
to be looking at the specifics of the ordinance that was proposed, I
think, by Commissioner Taylor and Mr. French at the last meeting.
So, you know, there's references to things that I haven't seen that
I would go and read, and -- you know, if we're going to make a
decision. But if we're going to make a decision today, then so be it.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Taylor.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: I heard something at the break. I
don't know if Lisa Lefkow is here, Reverend Lefkow. I'd like her
to -- with the agreement, the consensus of my colleagues, I'd like you
to come up.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Please.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Specifically about the due
diligence or the financial research that Ygrene does for a homeowner
to make sure that the homeowner can pay for the loan that they want
for this equipment. Could you speak to that?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I mean, you're asking Ms. --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: She's the head --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: -- Lefkow with regard to Ygrene's
due diligence?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I mean, I love her, but I don't think
this is appropriate.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: She is the financial institution
for homeowners.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I understand what she is, but you're
asking her to render an opinion about a third party who's --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: No, no, a fact, sir, a fact.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: You're asking her to render an
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opinion about a third-party lender on a home, not -- you're asking her
opinion as to what a PACE provider's doing.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: No, I'm not. I'm asking her --
MS. LEFKOW: May I answer the question?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: That was the question.
MS. LEFKOW: The question was regarding the underwriting
that Mr. Lemyre was just speaking about. So he talked about the
underwriting process that is conducted before a loan is financed.
I believe, Commissioner Saunders, you asked about a home that
was valued at $200,000, $200,000 of mortgage on that home; could
that be underwritten. So the reality is that in Habitat homes, you are
aware of this already, we have a first mortgage, which is the cost that
has been incurred to build the home. We also secure the home and
lock up any equity with a silent second mortgage. In addition, there's
a Shared Appreciation Agreement. So, in essence, there is no equity
on Habitat homes, and yet we have a number of Habitat families that
have been provided PACE loans, some of them very substantial.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: And that PACE loan would
be ahead of your first mortgage and your second mortgage.
MS. LEFKOW: As well as your down payment assistance and
impact fee deferral.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: That's why I was saying, you
know, it just seems to me that there's an inherent problem with the
way the program has been structured.
MS. LEFKOW: You are correct.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: We have -- that has been talked
about. One of the things with the resolution for -- I was under the
perception that the resolution that we were bringing forward from an
ordinance perspective was to enhance the consumer protections that
were somewhat or -- or in some cases very much lacking with the
program, but there isn't an impetus for the provider, for the lender to
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secure the ability of a borrower, the people who have sought the
PACE financing, to be able to make those payments, unlike a
conventional lender that sends you notices and payments, statements,
and so ons and so forths.
The PACE providors aren't requisite to do that. That was one of
the hopes that I had had. I'd said this back in February or March
when this came about that if we can enhance the consumer-protection
capacities of this program, I think the greater good can, in fact, be
served.
My goal wasn't to shut the program down. My goal wasn't to
preclude anyone, because I really feel that there are folks that need
this type of assistance, so...
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Go ahead.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Well, you're next.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I'm first, but you were going to
respond to what --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Well, no, I was just going
to -- you know, we're going to have a motion, or --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: There is a motion.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I already made a motion.
(Simultaneous speakers speaking.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Fix it.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: -- needs to be fixed.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Because there's two choices here.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: There's going to be a motion
made to terminate the residential program.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: We have a hearing coming up
in two weeks on these consumer protections. I think the message I
would send to the PACE providers is that I'm prepared not to support
a motion to terminate today under the assumption that in two weeks
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we'll come back with consumer protections that are satisfactory. If
they're not, then I would vote to terminate then. But I think let's -- I
think the fair approach is, is there a way to fix this program? And
I've got my doubts. But I don't think a two-week delay is going to
make a whole lot of difference. So I'm just throwing that out as a
thought.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: That's a nice thought.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: My motion stands, although I'll
read it. I'll read what it says in here, because every time we delay it
for another two weeks, then we come into a whole new different
program. We can always reconsider it in two weeks if there's some
reason that we should add residential, but I doubt it. I don't think that
I want to see residential added to this until they've fixed the program.
It's going to take them more than two weeks to fix this program, in
my opinion.
So my motion stands that we adopt -- we -- let's see.
Recommendation to consider information provided to adopt a
resolution which repeals the existing Property Assessment Clean
Energy program, the PACE program, replacing it with a new PACE
program limited to commercial, industrial, and multifamily rental
apartment buildings and approves a new standard form membership
agreement with PACE providers also limited to commercial ,
industrial, and multifamily rental buildings. That is my motion.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: That's Options 1 and 2 in the
recommendations --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yes.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: -- of the staff.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Right. I think there's --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: The first 1 and 2. There's a total --
there was two 1 and 2s, but it's the first.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Two 1 and 2s, yeah --
May 28, 2019
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COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: I'll second that motion.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: -- in the staff recommendation.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I think that the PACE program has
a lot more fixing to be done than we can ever do, not only in two
weeks, but possibly in a year. Right now I'd like to see the program
offered to people that -- you know, in the buildings, in apartment
buildings and so forth. I'd like to see it still offered to them, but right
now I don't think to residential because we've heard too many things
happening to people that -- and they don't understand it; whereas, you
get into the business area, and they probably have some business
consultants and so forth to guide them along. And so my motion
stands.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: And, Mr. Attorney, that
would be, basically, a 90-day termination notice, and the program, as
it would relate to residential, would be frozen until i t's ultimately
terminated; is that correct?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I didn't mention anything about
frozen, did I?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: No.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Sorry. I'm just asking.
MR. KLATZKOW: Depending upon the vote you're going to
have to terminate the agreements, yes.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: But there's a 90-day --
MR. KLATZKOW: There's a 90-day, but that stops any new
applications.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Right. That's what I just said.
So there would be no residential loans made.
MR. KLATZKOW: There would be no loans of any sort,
commercial or residential.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: That might be an opportunity for
these lenders who think they have a new plan that they could, you
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know, start working on a plan so that you can serve the communities
that you feel are not being served at the present day. But we don't
have to --
MR. KLATZKOW: You've got a contract that's both residential
and commercial. Ninety days notice to terminate the contract; it's
both.
What we had talked about before was if y ou wanted to do that,
we could terminate the contract and then come back with a new
PACE program for the commercial --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: In two weeks?
MR. KLATZKOW: -- as a replacement. I mean, it's easy.
You're just dragging out a couple of words from each. It wouldn't be
a difficult process.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I'd like to hear from
Commissioner McDaniel and Commissioner Solis on what your
opinions are in terms of how to handle this over the next couple of
weeks.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: You want to go first?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: You know, I will go along with
the -- with what the majority of the Board is going to come up with,
but I will say, it seems to me that while we have heard issues
specifically with the Habitat for Humanity financing, that it's
specifically a problem for Habitat because of the way they have their
specific loan structure. They've got a first, they've got a second, and
they've got this equity sharing.
So, you know, is there -- is there a way to carve that out? I don't
know. I'm throwing this out here. And I want to at least bring that
up. Is there a way to carve that out and protect -- put in the
protections to address exactly what we're hearing, or isn't there? I
don't think we're going to resolve that today.
It seems that there are people -- we have 400, at least, Ygrene
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agreements. We don't have 400 complaints. I think we have -- we
have a handful of complaints and, obviously, that's significant and it's
made us concerned about it. But I think we are -- if we just terminate
this this way, we are going to be precluding people that do benefit
from this program from being able to make improvements that they
otherwise could not because of their situations, because of their
whatever.
So, you know, I'll vote with the majority on this, but I think if
we don't at least consider some additional changes to the ordinance,
which is what I thought we were doing at the next meeting, that if we
don't do that, then we're missing an opportunity, and I don't know that
we've done as much homework as we probably can.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Could I ask Mr. Solis --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Sure.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Well, the reason I was asking
where you guys might be on this is because there's going to be a
majority vote one way or the other.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Right.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Exactly.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I'm not sure which way I'm
going, but I was curious as to which way you guys might be going,
because if there's a good reason to continue the program while we're
working on the ordinance, then I'm kind of open to that. And if
there's not, then I'm supportive of the motion.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Well, I think that there have to be --
there's four -- if there's 400 of these, we've heard that there are
situations and a couple of bad contractors, and there are bad
contractors out there that are doing conventional financing, right, that
talk people into all sorts of things.
And so I think there's still some benefit to somebody that really
needs it. And I think it's incumbent upon us, as doing what we can,
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to still help those people and yet do what we can to protect the people
that have been mistreated through the program.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Okay. This is a question for
the providers. Obviously, we're struggling with what a consumer
protection ordinance might entail. Would you be willing, all of the
providers that are here -- and, obviously, Ygrene is the most
significant in terms of numbers, but all the providers, would you be
willing to hold the program in abeyance while we work on this
ordinance? That's a voluntary request, but I think there's a potential
that your program's going to be terminated today. And the concern is
that while we're working on this ordinance, there may be other people
that might be hurt. And so if I can get a statement from the providers
that you're willing to not do any PACE financing until we fix this
ordinance --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Can I step in here? I see where
you're going, but all of the PACE providers are not here. And you're
asking for consensus of those that are, in fact, here to obligate those
that are not here to not do any more PACE loans while we're working
this theoretical ordinance to protect consumer protections to
enhance --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I can see where that would --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yes. I like the thought, but I --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I just had one other -- and, you
know, maybe this is a crazy idea. But we keep hearing that this is
problematic for Habitat owners. Excuse me. Let me finish.
And if that's the case, then can't we define this program as being
available to people that aren't in the Habitat financing mode? So this
is the kind of discussion I would like to have.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: In an ordinance. In an ordinance
that we develop for consumer protections, we can stipulate virtually
anything.
May 28, 2019
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COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: There may be some
equal-protection issues there, but that's --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Well, maybe there is. I don't know
the answer to that today, so...
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: What about -- we saw people --
we heard from some -- at least one person that wasn't a Habitat
person. We also heard testimony there's a woman in Immokalee that
can't even read or write and signed her name with an X and her
signature was forged.
MR. KLATZKOW: You know, I don't know how you limit it to
everybody but Habitat people; I don't know how you do that.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Well, I don't either.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Well, here's another way. Now, we
all have read in the newspapers about other communities, other states
who have had problems with the PACE program. There have got to
be other programs that have been identified, created to help people of
lesser means to be able to fix their homes and reasonably and with
respect and not taking advantage of these people. They've got to be
out there.
And I would guess that if we drop this program right now and
then put an RFP out there to what other providers around the state of
Florida who provide the same thing that we're just talking about,
doesn't have to be PACE, though it can be any program that will then
provide help to these people in whatever manner, and let's hear about
them.
Now, we won't have them in two weeks, but at least we get the
ball rolling to see what else we have available to help peo ple.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Taylor. We're going
back to the list.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Oh, we're going back to the list.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yes.
May 28, 2019
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COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Well, I wanted to hear from
Commissioner Saunders.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Are you going to waive your time?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: No.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: We never waive our time,
and if we do, we change our minds.
Mr. Lemyre, I had made a statement which may have been
incredibly stupid in terms of can we just hold the program in
abeyance while we work on this ordinance as opposed to approving a
termination of the program.
MR. LEMYRE: I can only speak for Ygrene, but I'd like to
answer your question combined with Commissioner Solis'. I would
propose that we would suspend accepting applications because,
you're right, there is potential Equal Protection Act, not necessarily
for Habitat homeowners, but we will suspend accepting applications
where there is a first, a second, and an equity-participation agreement
or equity-sharing agreement. That would cover the Habitat situation,
I think.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: That's not my question.
MR. LEMYRE: Okay.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: My question is, will you
voluntarily suspend any further applications for residential PACE
programs pending the time that we're working on this ordinance,
which is going to be another couple of weeks?
And if the answer's no, the answer's no.
MR. LEMYRE: Is that two weeks time certain? I mean, is
there an item, because --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: We have an item coming up
on the ordinance which is our next meeting, which actually is a little
longer than two weeks.
MR. KLATZKOW: And it could be a while. Look, you could
May 28, 2019
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terminate the contracts right now and then get your ordinance done
and then reinstitute the program again. That's another approach you
can do.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Okay.
MR. KLATZKOW: I mean, if you don't want to consent to
stopping the applications, that's what they can do. All right, so...
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: There again, I don't see how they
can do that without violating federal law for people's rights to be able
to apply for. Now, if we suspend it, if it is suspended here, it's over,
so...
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: But my understanding is no
one's knocking on their doors. They're the ones who are knocking on
the people's door. They're the ones who are going door to door in the
middle of the night at 9 o'clock or 10 o'clock knocking on people's
doors, at least in Golden Gate City.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Am I calling on you? I'm calling
on you.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Yes, you are calling on me.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yes, I am.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: There is a tax collector in Pasco
County -- Ms. Mola; is that correct? -- Pasco County --
MS. MOLA: Yes.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: -- who has taken under his
jurisdiction, which I know our Tax Collector doesn't want to do, and
has submitted, and that county operates for -- as an ordinance.
There's an ordinance that the man created that Ms. Mola handed
directly to staff, and that is already -- it's Pasco County, but they're
kind of up the road. We could start there and look at that.
It's my understanding, though, we just heard testimony that
anything -- even the ordinance that might be proposed here could
close them down, and the PACE wouldn't agree to that.
May 28, 2019
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So we have a problem. We have a problem because we aren't
dealing with the reality that this program was designed to take
advantage of people. And we have a very viable commercial part of
this program, but the residential is fraught with pro blems and
lawsuits, and there's only three states in the entire United States that
even have it.
So I think I'd like to call the question.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: We're not done discussing it yet.
You can call the question if you'd like, but I'm not done. I haven't
spoken -- I haven't had an opportunity to speak myself yet. I've been
allowing this to be going on, so...
Commissioner Fiala.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Just an odd thing to -- before when
we asked to hear from the other people who might be a funding
institution to help, and the gentleman with the glasses back there
stood up, and then this gentleman here from Ygrene came over and
whispered in his ear, and then the gentleman decided he didn't want
to say anything after all. And I was wondering what you had told
him -- why he didn't come up and --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: He was in agreement with what the
other two had said.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: No. This was supposed to be
another lending institution.
MR. SPIVEY: I'm Bill Spivey from the FRED district as well.
So the conversation was just a reminder that FRED is not a PACE
provider. We are a district, and so just he was wanting to --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And what's FRED stand for?
MR. SPIVEY: Florida Resiliency and Energy District.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. The AFZ.
MR. SPIVEY: That's all it was; just a clarification on it.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Saunders.
May 28, 2019
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COMMISSIONER FIALA: I thought it was interesting.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I'm sorry. Commissioner Saunders,
you're still up from before.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I'm done for the moment.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. All right. I have said from
the beginning that if we -- if an ordinance were brought forth that
would protect the consumers better, I would be in support of it.
We have allowed you to be in charge of the preparation of the
ordinances. You brought forward an ordinance before that I couldn't
get happy with because it commingled and put obligations on third
parties that weren't participatory in the process.
Then erroneously -- and I misunderstood it when Commissioner
Saunders made the motion a month or so ago to put you in charge of
the ordinance to provide for consumer protections, I actually -- I saw
you flinching while he was making the motion, and I actually even
said, if she doesn't want to do it, I'll do it. But you did do it.
And the ordinance that you brought forward, again, commingled
obligations of lenders, overseeing and managing contractors in a
fashion that wasn't plausible for any type of -- forget about PACE,
forget about Ygrene. There was no real mesh for that to actually
transpire. Again, I couldn't support that ordinance.
The folks that -- the folks that I spoke with, the PACE providers,
brought forward suggestions and amendments to that ordinance that
were there. They talked with me about consumer protections that
could be put in place to better protect the public and the folks that are
participatory in PACE program lending, but that never got through to
our staff and/or our staff didn't bring forward those suggested
adjustments.
Kate from -- you can come to the mic if you want to. I mean, I
had meetings with both Kate and --
MR. NIRMAL: Devesh.
May 28, 2019
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CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Devesh, forgive me. I had
meetings with them. They provided suggestions that could enhance
consumer protections, but that never got to us. What got to us was an
ordinance that was put forth as that, but it was complicated and
fraught with overlap in responsibilities that couldn't be put upon a
third-party provider and the lender from a lender's perspective, so I --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: You're a lender?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I used to be.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Okay. Just checking.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I used to be. I served on the bank
board for over 10 years, ma'am. So I've looked at it. I've looked at it
from both sides.
I concur with Commissioner Solis; I think that there are
consumer protections that need to be done. I think I shared with you,
when I was in Washington, D.C., in March, there was a presentation
at one of the -- at one of the luncheons that I was at that this is being
reviewed by the Federal Consumer Protection Agency, because it's
not regulated by them right now. There are complaints that are
coming in and issues that are being brought up.
But the ordinances that you've brought forward twice haven't put
in place consumer protections. It's -- there's been more -- there's been
more -- there hasn't been those protections that I felt were necessary.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Well, let me bring forth the
Pasco County one that is actually working and then let you look at it.
How's that?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Well, that would be fine, but I
don't -- but in the same time, I'm not in favor of discontinuing the
residential program until we've had an opportunity to review that.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: May I put something up on the
visualizer for everyone to look at?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay.
May 28, 2019
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COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: We've just heard testimony from
PACE providers about how they know what the credit rating of the
people that they go to, the doors they knock on, at 8 and 9 o'clock at
night. They know what their credit rating is.
Read this: This is an advertisement from one of the PACE
contractors in Pasco County. You're receiving this notice because
major roof concerns were visibly noted this week. That was a
drive-by. As a coordinator for the Pasco County approved
programs -- and please notice, State of Florida, government
approved. We can approve anyone with zero down and zero payment
until March 2019 regardless -- regardless of your credit score or
employment status.
Eligibility. Are you going -- are you behind in your mortgage?
Are you currently going through bankruptcy? If you answered no,
then congratulations; you can get that new roof.
Call today to schedule your install.
I think this is -- clearly, there has been a misrepresentation on
the part of the PACE program about exactly what they do and how
they oversee it.
Thank you.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I think that says it all, doesn't it?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I think that's a notice -- a fraudulent
notice from a contractor.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yes, absolutely.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I mean, this is -- Commissioner
Taylor, I mean, with all due respect, this is like getting, you know,
fraudulent emails from all sorts of people in your in-basket on
Outlook and saying we should end the Internet.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: No, sir.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I mean, if that's coming from a
contractor, that's --
May 28, 2019
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COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: That's an example of the
marketing that they do.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: The contractors. And I agree with
it. It's totally fraudulently.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Oh. So now we're separating
PACE from the contractors which, of course, is --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Yes.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: -- what they do.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Well, it is. That's one of the
reasons I had issues with the ordinance you brought forward. You
were commingling responsibility of management of fraud by
contractors, general contractors, with the lender, and you can't do
that. There's zero opportunity for that to transpire in the real world. I
don't care what kind of lender you are.
(Simultaneous speakers speaking.)
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: You know, I would call the
question. It's 4 o'clock almost.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: We should vote for this now, and
let us solve all those problems. We're not going to solve them today,
and we're not going to solve them in two weeks. So rather than
sustain it and let it continue on, let's fix it, but we have to stop it first
in order to fix it. And so my motion stands as read.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Let me ask my question. In
terms of the -- now, this will be a 90-day termination notice. Are we
still going to deal with a potential ordinance to fix this program?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: I would agree to that.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: If there's an agreement to do
that, bring this forward at the next meeting to try to fix this using the
Pasco County ordinance as an example, I'd like for staff to distribute
that, I'll support the motion this afternoon with the understandin g that
we're going to take a look at -- that stops the program basically.
May 28, 2019
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CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: From a residential perspective.
We're still doing commercial and --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Well, unfortunately, it stops
everything.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Commercial and residential.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: It stops everything.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: So we bring back at the next
meeting a redraft of the contract to permit the commercial program,
we bring back the Pasco County ordinance. If the Pasco County
ordinance is satisfactory, then I'll support a motion to eliminate or
rescind the termination so that we're back to having both programs.
My question was to stop the program during this time period. I
wanted to do it without having to terminate the program, but w e're
not able to do that. And so this is a little bit of a middle ground, but it
gives everybody an opportunity at the next meeting to take a look at
the Pasco County ordinance, to do one of two things at that point:
Reinstate just the commercial program or indicate that we're adopting
the Pasco County ordinance and eliminating the termination.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: So --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I assume we could adopt the
Pasco County ordinance on an emergency basis and then readopt it in
a regular process.
MR. KLATZKOW: You could if you want, yes.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I was just going to say we can do
whatever we want with a vote of three.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Oh, no. There's a statute
dealing with emergency ordinances, so we can't really --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: County Manager? Excuse me one
second.
MR. OCHS: I just want to remind the Board, based on your
direction from the last meeting, you're scheduled to hear the
May 28, 2019
Page 188
consumer protection -- PACE consumer-protection ordinance that
you first heard at your last meeting on June 11th. That was the
direction that we're working under right now.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: You're going to distribute the
Pasco County ordinance, and we may just substitute that.
MR. KLATZKOW: Do you want to substitute the Pasco, and
we'll just advertise that ordinance?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I haven't reviewed the Pasco
County ordinance.
(Simultaneous speakers speaking.)
MR. KLATZKOW: I don't know off the top of my head what it
is.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: We have to see both of them.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: If you've advertised and
ordinance --
MR. KLATZKOW: We'll advertise --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Let me ask a question.
You've advertised an ordinance. We come back with a language
that's in the Pasco ordinance; we amend that ordinance that you've
already advertised to contain that language.
MR. KLATZKOW: We will implement the Board's will.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: So we can accomplish that
objective if we want to?
MR. OCHS: The action that was continued to the next meeting
was to advertise that ordinance and bring it back for a public hearing.
So you haven't yet directed that it be advertised yet. So you still have
this two-step process.
MR. KLATZKOW: No, no. We're going to advertise -- we're
going to advertise the proposed ordinance, because I understand the
concern, because you may be terminating the agreements today. We
will advertise it for the next board meeting. So you'll have the two
May 28, 2019
Page 189
weeks where you will not have a program.
And then you'll see. The discussion's in two weeks.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: So we haven't adjusted my motion
at all.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: We may want to -- do we want
to amend the motion to include the review of the Pasco County
ordinance?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Yeah, if this is not --
MR. KLATZKOW: We'll put it on the --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Make a separate motion to do that,
eh?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Well, let's do it all as one
motion; that way no one's at risk.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay. It's my motion, though,
understand?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Right.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: And I'm not a lawyer, so I'm not
lawyering into this thing.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: What I'd like you to consider
adding to the motion --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Let's place it simply, okay.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: What I'd like you to add to
the motion is that at our next meeting we will consider an ordinance,
consumer-protection ordinance, staff will provide us the Pasco
ordinance as a possible consumer-protection ordinance. At that time
if we -- a majority of the Board decides to go with the consumer
protection, then we can withdraw the termination, which the majority
could do anyway without that. So it's not like you're --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: You know, I think we're all
concerned with doing something to help people. That's what it's all
about.
May 28, 2019
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COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: That's why I --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: And we want to -- but we want to
make sure not to hurt them. And so if we cannot come up with
something by the next meeting -- and we don't know that we can or
can't -- let's at least get rid of this, okay.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Well, that's what your motion
does.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: As long as it that says that.
MR. KLATZKOW: You will be terminating the program if the
motion's adopted.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right.
MR. KLATZKOW: You can always resuscitate it later, but you
will be terminating the program.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: That's right.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Solis.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I would, again, just suggest that we
stick to what we had decided at the last meeting, that today would be
more of an informational meeting and opportunity for the providers
to address the allegations that were made so that then at the next
meeting we would consider the ordinance and the
consumer-protection provisions that we want to add to it.
You know, we're changing in midstream what we had agreed
and represented we were going to be doing at the last meeting.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: That's right. I agree. There's been
a motion and a second to -- you want me to reread it?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: No. Adopt a resolution which
repeals the existing Property Assessment Clean Energy, PACE
program, replacing it with a new PACE program limited to
commercial, industrial, and multifamily rental apartment buildings,
and approve a new standard form membership agreement with PACE
providers also limited to commercial, industrial, and multifamily
May 28, 2019
Page 191
rental apartment buildings.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Okay. And as I said, I will
support that motion if added to it is bringing this back at our next
meeting to consider a consumer-protection ordinance. If we adopt
that, then I'm going to support eliminating the termination.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Eliminating termination what?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: If we adopt a consumer
protection ordinance that we all feel comfortable with, then I would
vote at that point to reinstate the residential program.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: No. That's not part of my motion.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: All right.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: It's been moved and seconded --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: We're going to hurt people.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: No, no. The idea is to suspend it
for these two weeks --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yes.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: -- and to bring back an
ordinance that's already working in a county which is called Pasco
that has consumer protections in it.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay, okay. I understand that.
MR. OCHS: Mr. Chairman, and I'm sorry but this is, I think, a
significant clarification. I'm told by staff -- and, Jamie, correct me if
I'm wrong -- that the Pasco County ordinance has not been adopted in
Pasco County. True?
MR. FRENCH: That's correct. If you'd allow me, I'll offer
some clarification.
So the language does exist. It appears to be legally sufficient.
And, by the way, Commissioner, Mr. Chairman, most of the
consumer protections that we brought forward to you were based off
of that as well as some of the working programs that currently exist
in West Palm Beach. It is very laborious, and it does exactly what
May 28, 2019
Page 192
the PACE provider has said. It really does put a great deal of
pressure on their program that would prevent them from moving
forward.
However, Commissioner Taylor didn't influence me. I wrote
that. And we worked with the County Attorney's Office, and we
worked with the PACE providers, and the PACE providers did
provide us feedback. But it was a collaborative feedback, and it was
an ordinance that they felt should be drafted, and that was it. That's
the response we had from the PACE providers.
So just to clarify the record, we did use the Pasco County
language, we used the current West Palm Beach that is currently
enacted, as well as direction from the Board from meetings past.
So we did take a very measured approach and, yes, there was
some repetitiveness in the nature that included some language that
was already in the membership agreement.
But we can move forward with the Pasco County language, but
it is exceptionally laborious, and it is not currently active. It doesn't
mean that it won't be adopted. It just means that it's n ot been
currently active. It's got some good language to it.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: There was good language. Excuse
me. He was addressing me. There was -- there was good language in
there, Jamie. I'm not refuting that. But there were points in that
ordinance that was brought forward that were -- no real-world sense
could be made of.
And I'm not prepared today to debate that with you. I'd be
happy to do that --
MR. FRENCH: We're just looking for direction, sir.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Well, I'm trying to get there.
MR. FRENCH: Yes, sir.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: So I just -- I recall there were
stipulations put upon the lenders to regulate a third party that were in
May 28, 2019
Page 193
any real-world sense not attainable.
MR. KLATZKOW: Commissioners, we have a draft ordinance.
I can -- and if all goes this way, I'm going to have to run upstairs to
make sure we can get it in. I can advertise that draft ordinance, and
you can argue about the ordinance at your next meeting.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Well, that's what we were -- I
thought we were, per Commissioner Solis --
(Simultaneous speakers speaking.)
MR. KLATZKOW: I need to advertise something.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: But if the program's going to be
killed today, then there's no point in even having that discussion on
the 11th.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: No, that's not true.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Well, it certainly is.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Why?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Why do you mean why? Because
there's --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Because it's a majority vote.
You've already heard from one commissioner --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: A majority vote --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: We would simply be in a
90-day termination period.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I would just say, can we call the
question. We've got another long hearing --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yeah, we do.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: -- afterwards.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: All right. It's been moved and
seconded that we move, per the first 1 and 2 of -- now, are -- you
made an amendment to -- are you in consent with the requested
amendment?
May 28, 2019
Page 194
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yes?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yes.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Yes, she's in consent with it.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. It's been moved and
seconded that we repeal the existing per 1 and 2 and bring back on
the 11th a consumer-protection ordinance.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Exactly. We're making
sausage.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yes.
MR. KLATZKOW: So the County Manager will be getting out
a letter of termination on this vote?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Yes.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: That's correct.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: That's correct.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: We're terminating the program as
of this vote with the 3-2 vote.
All in favor?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: All opposed?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Aye.
So moved.
All right. Let's move right along here, County Manager.
MR. OCHS: Yes, sir.
Item #11F
RECONSIDERATION OF ITEM #11B FROM THE MARCH 26,
May 28, 2019
Page 195
2019 BCC MEETING TITLED: ACCEPT THE REPORT AND
SUGGESTIONS FROM THE TOURIST DEVELOPMENT
COUNCIL FOR NEXT STEPS IN REGULATING SHORT TERM
VACATION RENTALS IN THE UNINCORPORATED AREA OF
COLLIER COUNTY - MOTION TO RESEND THE PRIOR
MOTION FROM MARCH REGARDING DURATION OF
SHORT-TERM RENTALS – APPROVED (COMMISSIONER
FIALA AND COMMISSIONER TAYLOR OPPOSED); STAFF TO
ENFORCE CODE VIOLATION ENFORCEMENT COMPLAINTS
SUCH AS NOISE, PARKING, AND SIGNAGE – APPROVED;
STAFF TO BRING BACK ANALYSIS FROM OTHER COUNTY
ORDINANCES THROUGHOUT THE STATE AT THE JUNE 25,
2019 BCC MEETING – APPROVED
MR. OCHS: Commissioners, we move to Item 11F on today's
agenda, and this is a reconsideration of Item 11B that appeared at
your March 26th, 2019, commission meeting that was titled a
recommendation to accept the report and suggestions from the
Tourist Development Council for next steps in regulating short-term
vacation rentals in the unincorporated area of Collier County.
Commissioners, as a result of that discussion, the staff received
some direction from the Board that subsequently the Board voted to
reconsider that, and that's, essentially, where we are today.
MR. MILLER: Mr. Chairman, we have 37 registered speakers
for this item.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Nice.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Point of order.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I didn't realize that we had that
many realtors in the audience. I thought they were all from the one
program. Oh, we've got lots of people here.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Point of order. Mr. Chair, when
May 28, 2019
Page 196
will the court reporter have a break so that --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: She already had one at 3:10. I'm
not sure if we're going to give her another.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: With 37 speakers.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Go ahead, Jack.
MR. OCHS: Sir, we don't really have anything new to report.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I understand. There's a couple of
questions on the report that I'd like to see, if you would, please. It
was represented to me at some stage during this process that there
was duplicity with regard to the registered landlords, 15,000
plus-or-minus registered landlords that are conducting business in
Collier County advertising short-term rentals and that that number
was -- there were duplications in that amount. Have you verified that
or had a chance to look at that?
MR. WERT: Yes, sir. We have actually two sets of
information. The slide that I have up there right now was
information provided to us by the Collier County Tax Collector in
terms of, by year, in those categories of hotels, realtors, and
individuals, how many registered collectors they had, so --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: That's a tax revenue collection.
MR. WERT: Okay. The next one, then -- let's get to this. This
is the one I was looking for.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: There you go.
MR. WERT: That shows, first of all, the number, based on what
we see on websites, how many different listings there are in each of
the providers, and these are the major ones. There are, obviously,
more of those. The point is, any one condo or single -family home
could be listed on all of those. That's why we're saying there is
duplication in listings; however, what we see from the Tax
Collector's records is 10,800 units are total, and of those you've got
condos at 7,900, single-family homes --
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CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I got all that.
MR. WERT: So that's what we know.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: The ones that are a matter of the
Tax Collector's records, those are the ones that are legally conducting
business, and the ones that are represented in the 14,650, they're
advertising on a site but could be on VRBO or Airbnb, on multiple
sites, and you would count them twice.
MR. WERT: Correct.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: They're not, necessarily, a portion
of the Tax Collector's records as well.
MR. WERT: That is correct.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: So that's the point that I was trying
to make. Thank you.
MR. WERT: Yes, sir.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Thank you. All right. Does
anybody have any questions of Jack before we go off into the public
speakers?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. Thank you, sir.
Go.
MR. MILLER: Mr. Chairman, I will remind our speakers to use
both podiums. I will call two names. Please stand by when you're
the next speaker in line. Your first speaker is Doriel Hess. She will
be followed by Kristen Jasinski.
MS. HESS: My name is Doriel Hess. I live at 7127 Falcons
Glen Boulevard in Lely Resort. First, thank you so much for
addressing this issue that has people upset on both sides.
But I do think many of the voters that are here today want the
same thing. They want to have monthly and seasonal rentals to
continue, but they want to stop the daily and weekly rentals.
A few years ago this issue was not a problem. People went
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through a friend or a real estate agent to rent for the season or for a
month. Those people became part of the community, and many went
on to become homeowners here in Collier County.
But VRBO and Home Away have changed what is happening in
the rental market. They're turning neighborhood communities into
transient or motel developments.
In my development, Falcons Glen and Lely Resort, we have
people buying a home and never moving in. They make settlement
and immediately put the house on VRBO for weekly rentals. Now
we have owners advertising daily rentals.
In Lely Resort, there's an area called GreenLinks. It's zoned for
daily and weekly rentals. Golfers come in for a few days, enjoy the
area. It was built for that, and owners were aware of that when they
purchased their condo unit.
In Falcons Glen, a community of single-family homes, people
rented for a month or for the season. These renters, who have
become friends over the years, would join in our community
activities.
Now, we still have the seasonal and monthly rentals, but we
increasingly have weekly and now daily rentals. Out of the 87
homes, we have over 20 renting weekly. We're losing the battle as
more investors buy into the neighborhood.
I know the State of Florida, under the former governor, passed a
ban to -- you couldn't restrict the short-term rentals, but I think that
you, the commissioners, would have the right to change that from six
months to one month, and if there was, you know, someone
complaining about it, you could say you're following the spirit of the
law in making it less restrictive.
I'm not a lawyer, but I appreciate any help you can give us. I
want to thank you for your patience in listening to my comments
today and to thank you for trying to save Falcons Glen and other
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communities like us.
Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Kristen Jasinski.
UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: She left.
MR. MILLER: Pat Cogswell. She will be followed by Tom
White.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: One second.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I think -- I keep getting a lot of
emails about this, and most of the emails want us to somehow change
the length of time of a short-term rental.
Mr. County Attorney, we're not able to do that, right?
MR. KLATZKOW: You are not able to do that.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: By state statute, we've been
preempted by the legislature.
MR. KLATZKOW: I could put the language on the monitor if
that would help the discussion.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: We don't need to do that.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I just wanted to bring that up at the
beginning. We've got 30 speakers. You know, however much we
would like to do that, we're unable to do that because the legislature
has preempted us. I hope that helps.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yeah. Do put that up on the -- so
that people in the audience can read it, the ones at home, what we're
confined to approving, right?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Right. We cannot change that. So I
know there's going to be a lot of people requesting that we somehow
change the definition of what a short-term rental is and how long that
is, and we're just not able to do that.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: So we're not able to do that at all?
MR. KLATZKOW: You are frozen in time into whatever you
had as of 2011.
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CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Without breaking the law ourself,
and that needs to be said. Just because other communities have
enacted an ordinance after the preemption's gone into effect doesn't
make it proper, and you certainly cannot recommend that we violate
the statute.
MR. KLATZKOW: Any ordinance that you would pass in
violation of this ordinance would be null and void at its inception.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right. So we can't do it.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Yep.
MR. MILLER: Ms. Cogswell, please.
MS. COGSWELL: Yes. Good afternoon, Commissioners. My
name is Pat Cogswell.
The Florida -- the state Florida Statute 509.0327 was amended
in 2014 stating local governments are prohibited from prohibiting the
vacation rentals or regulating the duration or frequency of rentals, but
local governments are free to impose other reasonable regulations.
How could Collier County Commission go against the state
legislature and vote to restrict duration and frequency of rentals?
In doing so, it would require a -- in doing so, it would require a
supermajority vote of 4 to 5 (sic) to rescind the regulation that was
unconstitutional to begin with. I know it indicated that -- it indicates
that the regulation and duration whic h you just stipulated as six
months or more. So you are stipulating the regulation.
Also, to go from short-term rentals or one day -- or to less than
one week to the new regulation which increases rentals to require a
minimum duration of six months or more is excessive.
Real estate, in all of its aspects, is the major industry of Collier
County. That affects the following: Home building, remodeling,
repairs, cleaning, landscaping, mortgages, insurance, retail purchases,
selling, buying, and renting, just to name a few of the jobs which
employ the majority of the people in the county.
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So for a regulation basically not allowing vacation rentals
because the vast majority of vacation rentals are less than six months
in duration, it can devastate the overa ll economy of Collier County
when so many people rely on the housing industry for their
livelihood. All of this because of only about 1 percent of all the
affected people complained. Any change like this regulation can
have a massive negative ripple effect.
Thank you for your time.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Tom White. He'll be
followed by Colleen Irral (sic).
MR. WHITE: Yeah, hi. My name's Tom White. I come to you
as representing the Florida Restaurant Lodging Association of Collier
County. The Florida Restaurant Lodging Association's goal is to
protect and educate the community about the hospitality industry.
We are not opposed to short-term rentals. We understand
they're an important part of the industry, but we think they need to be
more regulated. We think they need to have -- adhere to the safety
situation -- the safety and sanitation standards in place, and we want
them to be zoned -- we want them to stay within the ordinances that
are there. We want to make sure they're paying the same taxes, too.
So basically, in summary, we are in favor of your original
recommendation to enforce the ordinance as it is in place, and if you
decide not to do so, we would like to be involved in helping steer
how we manage it going forward.
So thank you.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Colleen Irral?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL:
MR. MILLER: Patricia Dailey. She will be followed by Linda
Whitmam (sic).
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And, Linda, if you're here, come on
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up.
MR. MILLER: Witham, excuse me. Linda Witham.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: To the other podium.
MS. DAILEY: Thank you very much, Commissioners, and for
all that you do and allowing us to speak today.
My husband and I are permanent residents here in Naples. We
live in a single-family home in what was once a very quiet residential
neighborhood. There were some rentals; mostly by snowbirds, but
that is certainly changing.
Realtors have been pushing our community to potential buyers
as a great investment property. Great for the realtors' pocketbook,
but not so much for us.
They claim they have rights. Well, what about respecting ours?
There are plenty of condominiums, hotels in areas designated for
rentals, and they do not have to come into single-family home
residential communities and turn them into hotel communities.
We are now at over 27 percent rentals. And the last at least six
or seven homes have all been bought by investors.
So our permanent residents are dwindling. We do a lot of our
own home property management, and we are now down to only three
able-bodied men, and the rest being single women. We have only 11
homes where we have permanent residents left.
So, realtors, you are destroying us. Making money is nice for
you, but please not at our expense. Dear Commissioners, please take
our plight into consideration and go back to your first ruling about
enforcing short-term rentals.
Thank you.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: What community do you live in?
MS. DAILEY: Lely Resort.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Lely Resort?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Thank you.
May 28, 2019
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MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Linda Witham. She'll be
followed by Kathi Kilburn.
MS. WITHAM: Hi. My name's Linda Witham. I'm a full -time
resident of Collier County.
I don't understand why you would put credence in real estate
agents' opinions regarding short-term rentals. They knew when they
sold the houses in single-family neighborhoods that the
neighborhoods were zoned residential, which meant there was a
policy of minimum six-month rental. The same way the investors
knew the neighborhoods were zoned residential when they chose to
ignore that and purchase the property they plan to use only for
short-term rental.
I don't understand why you feel the need to protect them when
they knew what the rules were up front and chose to ignor e them.
There are neighborhoods that are zoned transitional lodging
which allows for short-term rentals. If someone was interested in
investment property, the investors could have purchased property
there, and the real estate agents could have recommended that that
was the neighborhood that was appropriate for them to purchase
property. Instead, they chose to invest in a residential neighborhood.
I feel as a full-time resident of a neighborhood that is zoned
residential I should be able to count on that zoning to protect me
when I purchased my home.
Unfortunately, in my neighborhood we have a lot of widows.
We are very close, and we try to watch out for each other as best we
can; however, it is very difficult to feel safe in our homes at night
when we have no idea who is in the home next door or across the
street from night to night.
I think you were on the right track when you were going back to
enforcing the six-month minimum in residential neighbors. I ask you
to consider enforcing the residential zoning. I live in what used to be
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a nice neighborhood that is close to becoming a "short-term rental
only" neighborhood. That has repercussion not only for those of us
who will being forced to sell our homes at a loss, but to real estate tax
collections due to lower property valuations.
Thank you.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Where do you live?
MS. WITHAM: Lely.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker Kathi Kilburn. She will be
followed by Jeff Jones. Ms. Kilburn has been ceded additional time
from Alex Petrovsky. Could you raise your hand to indicate you're
here?
UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: She had to leave.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: She's not here.
MR. MILLER: Sue Thackston?
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: Donelda Graham?
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: Gerard McGowan?
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: Joan McGowan?
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: And Mary Yacobian?
(No response.)
MR. MILLER: Okay. So that's going to be a total of -- herself
and four other speakers that are present for a total of 15 minutes.
MS. KILBURN: Kathi Kilburn. I thought I would take the time
handing these out while they were finding out who was conceding
(sic) my time.
Commissioners, staff, Naples Area Board of Realtors, Realtor
Political Action Committee, and ladies and gentlemen, my name is
Kathi Kilburn. I am a Florida licensed realtor, and I am a member of
May 28, 2019
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NABOR.
Today, however -- how does this work? I am a realtor, but
today I am here as a homeowner, and I am a homeowner who has
been affected by daily and weekly rentals.
For those of you who do not understand -- whoops, wrong way.
For those of you who do not -- haven't been affected by this in your
neighborhood cannot possibly comprehend the mental anguish that
this can cause.
By a show of hands, Commissioners, staff, NABOR, and ladies
and gentlemen, who here has been affected by a daily rental next to
your house?
(Show of hands.)
MS. KILBURN: Thank you.
When I have come home, I have experienced nauseous (sic),
anxiety, anger, and been concerned over who I don't know is coming
in and out of the home next to me. It's caused sleepless nights and
much stress.
As a single woman, I am now subject to not knowing who is
living by me. When I moved there, there was an annual tenant.
When their lease came up, it was turned into a daily rental.
It is widely known that a vacation rental is the renting out of a
furnished apartment, house, or professionally managed resort condo
complex on a temporary basis to tourists as an alternative to a hotel.
This term "vacation rental" is mainly used in the United States.
So let's not split hairs over words that mean the same thing.
Let's not get caught up in the semantics of what things do and don't
mean in our Land Development Codes. Let's not get caught up in
what one says there isn't and what one believes there is.
Transient lodging, vacation rental, seasonal rental, short-term
rental are synonymous, period, and to believe otherwise is beyond
reckless, unethical, and harm to others.
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As a rental agent myself, sales and rentals, I have access to MLS
and know what things are defined by. We do use the words "vacation
rental," "seasonal rental," short term," and "annual." Does it have
anything to do with hotels and motels? No. But is, essentially, that
what it is? Yes.
Our MLS input form for the listing of a rental property only
shows three categories: Monthly, seasonal or off season.
Season -- seasonal, as we all know, is January through April.
Off season is the other months. But in our input we can show daily
or weekly.
The dictionary for transient means "is passing especially quickly
and into and out of an existence, passing through or by a place with
only a brief stay." That is what is happening in our town.
Zoning laws is why we are here today authorizing Code
Enforcement to do their job because we have a problem. So let's talk
about their job. Code Enforcement, by their own admission, does not
go out seeking violations from anybody for any kind. As I
understand Chapter 162, specifically 162.09, the administrative fines
and costs of repair and liens, Code Enforcement's job is to respond to
a complaint and, in this case, an illegal transient lodging out of a
private home. If a violation is found, then the violator, in this case a
landlord, is given a warning.
If there is a repeat offense, they could be fined. If there are
continuing repeated offenses, the code enforcement officer, from
what I understand, can give a notice to the Enforcement Board for
noncompliance which could result in a higher fine and, if unpaid, a
lien on said property.
I feel comfortable in saying that I have confidence in what
procedure our Code Enforcement takes to determine these kinds of
violations and am very confident that our vacationers will not be told
to leave property, will not be made felt uncomfortable or held
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accountable for these violations. It is the landlord that will be held
accountable and those violations sent to them no matter where they
live.
So to make this perfectly clear, by voting to enforce the law
authorizes our Code Enforcement to do their job: Warn, fine, and, if
repeated, higher fines to the landlord.
Private residents who are calling in code violations, who are
they and where are they coming from? You heard Falcons Glen.
You heard Lely.
Are they private and primary and secondary residences affected
by landlords abusing our codes with a vacation rental business being
run in their private residential single-family homes? Yes.
Are most complaints coming from the worst offenders, daily and
weekly? Yes. Are the homeowners in non-PUDs, planned urban
developments? Yes. Are they also homeowners in planned urban
developments? Yes. And are they homeowners in both the city and
county? Yes.
Does the City of Naples and our planned urban developments
have their own rental policies outside the unincorporated Collier
County? Yes. Are they abiding by their own policies? No.
So let's not say this is a county or a non-PUD thing. Let's call it
out for what it is: A violation of our own ordinance across the city
and county with no regard for their neighbors' rights who are law
abiding citizens that deserve private and quiet enjoyment.
A planned urban development is created by our developers who
draft their own declarations, rules and regs, and who dictate rental
policy within their planned urban developments. But who creates
these policies? Mr. Klatzkow, I asked you this several times, and we
said we would address this today. The developer and their attorneys,
but are they required to seek zoning approval, or can they draft
whatever they want? Who approves the rental policies? Does our
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zoning Planning and Review Departments have any role in this?
As per a letter to me dated January 28th, 2019, Mr. Klatzkow
says, a general rule, HOA rules do not supercede county ordinances,
including zoning; however, the county does not get involved in
drafting or amending HOA policy.
So if our zoning Planning and Review Departments do not get
involved in drafting or amending association rules that include rental
policy, who is drafting them and what restrictions must they comply
with?
More importantly, if you vote not to enforce today, could that
lead to other larger hosts of developers amending policies for daily
and weekly rentals because they know nothing will be done about it?
That is my fear where I live.
Today the conversation is about homes in the unincorporated
Collier County and is not supposed to include the City of Naples or
planned urban developments because they have their own rental
policies. That is both unfair and isn't addressing the problem as a
whole.
The City of Naples and our planned urban developments are
being affected also. And besides standing in front of you myself
today as a homeowner, I speak for other homeowners who happen to
live in the city and Naples and planned urban developments. We
stand united in our message, and that is to enforce.
Winding Cypress, still under developer control, changed their
rental policy. Those homeowners understand the developer had
control; however, as per Michael Bosi and Jeff Klatzkow, zoning
outranks HOA policies, so we believe their presence here today is
important. Those living in Winding Cypress, please stand up.
Tell your commissioners what you'd like them do it.
MS. McGOWAN: Enforce it.
MS. KILBURN: Mr. and Mrs. McGowan bought in Naples
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versus, I believe, South Carolina and may now be regretting that
decision because the rental policies are out of control and not being
enforced.
Mr. and Mrs. Schmitt bought in Winding Cypress because
Falcons Glen in Lely rental policy was so out of control that now he's
having the same situation. Are they, too, questioning if they stay in
Naples?
Our primary and secondary residents deserve to live in a
lifestyle they thought they bought into. We pay taxes and are asking
local governing bodies to do their one job when asked by the public.
That job, again, is for Code Enforcement to take our calls for those
violating the zoning laws and to take our calls seriously.
I have a listing, because I am a rental agent, in Tiger Island in
Lely, residential single-family homes. I don't have the letter with me
today, but the HOA president sent out a letter to all the homeowners
alerting them that people were not even following the 30-day policy
and to please conduct themselves appropriately.
Who's violating these zoning ordinances? Airbnb, VRBO,
HomeAway, and the likes of those online booking companies, yes.
However, the responsibility falls on those who own the property
because, essentially, they're allowing this to take place, and online
booking companies are a vessel for them.
Private citizens buying Naples real estate for the sole purpose of
income-producing properties? Yes.
Realtors who purchase their own real estate for passive income?
Yes.
Realtors who are marketing Naples real estate for sale or for rent
on MLS that do not meet our zoning laws are essentially telling
buyers we have investments for you to purchase either not knowing
our laws or blatantly disregarding them? Yes.
I will stand here right now and say, I am your colleague, and I'm
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not here to throw myself or you under the bus, but we all must
address the problem and, I'm sorry, the real estate trade is part of the
problem.
NABOR and RPAC, Realtor Political Action Committee, come
to you today armed with attorneys, code and industrial professionals,
to argue the language and words in our LDC that do not say anything
about vacation or rental -- seasonal rentals. Besides those neighbors
of NABOR here today, many of the members do not agree with them
nor have they authorized to speak for them on their behalf. So please
understand, not all realtors stand behind NABOR's position today, yet
they are here today to ask you not to enforce the law because the law
doesn't exist.
Real Estate 101 is to protect the public. We have a code of
ethics to disclose what we know, and that inherently affects the value
of real estate.
I handed out pamphlets. What this shows is a list of 74 homes
for sale on our MLS system within 10 communities that are not
within a PUD zoned nothing less than six months or not less than 30
days if it's in the city limits. They are marketed as one-day minimum
365 days a year or seven with a minimum of 52 times a year. Those
communities are not limited to Naples Park, Pine Ridge Estates, Park
Shore, Moorings, Olde Naples, Royal Harbor, Kings Lake, Lake
Park, Flamingo Estates, and Livingston Woods.
In the same packet there are 30 listings for rent on MLS in 10
communities zoned not less than six months or 30 days in the event
of City of Naples marketing them as one-day minimum rental period
365 times a year or seven-day minimum 52 times a year. In those
communities: Aqualane Shores, Brookside, Kalea Bay Woods,
Conners, Naples Park, Decker Highlands, Lake Park, Golden Shores,
Gulf Acres.
It's important for me to point this out as a realtor. We are
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protected by errors and omissions, and while we have over 6,500 real
estate agents, most whom do pay dues to NABOR for access to MLS,
have no guidance, education, or knowledge provided to them about
land development or use codes of zoning restriction. This is
obviously based in MLS itself.
I'm very sorry to say that I have to point this out. This
information has been pointed out purely to show that the industry,
indeed, is part of the problem.
Homeowners here today, including myself, do not have
attorneys, code, or industry professionals behind us. We stand by
ourselves, hold to our convictions for the truth and hope that the law
will be on our side. We feel that transient lodging, indeed, is
synonymous with vacation, seasonal, and short-term rentals, and we
want our voices heard.
Although many could not be here today -- and perhaps you will
find my numbers insignificant -- but their votes do count and will be
shared. I sent over --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Thirty seconds.
MS. KILBURN: Thirty seconds.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: See the little timer there?
MS. KILBURN: Yes.
In closing, I'm going to ask that you enforce the law. We have a
problem. The problem is not going to be fixed if we don't stop,
enforce, and try and fix it ourselves.
Donna Fiala just said, stop everything until we fix it regarding
PACE. That applies to this today.
Thank you.
(Applause.)
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Jeff Jones.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Please, ladies and gentlemen.
Please.
May 28, 2019
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MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Jeff Jones. He's been
ceded three additional minutes from Marty Manion.
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: And Mr. Jones will be followed by Lauren
Melo.
MR. JONES: Good afternoon, Commissioners. It's opportune
that I followed a member of our profession that criticized us
extensively.
We are not here to ask you not to enforce the law. We are here
to tell you we want to be part of the solution to address the vacation
rental issue.
I'm the 2019 president of NABOR. I've been a res ident of
Naples for more than 20 years. And our board, serving more than
6,500 members, is the largest trade association in Collier County.
NABOR and its members undersign that a diverse thriving
tourism industry is a major economic driver for our area, which also
attracts many new full-time residents as a result.
As realtors, we understand firsthand the important role vacations
(sic) play in our community as well as the importance of protecting
and balancing the private property rights of homeowners.
Based on the comments of prior speakers, please understand that
realtors are not often involved in online rentals, and we are not
responsible for what property owners put on Airbnb and the online
sites such as VRBO.
Our members live, work, and raise our families in this
community. We are part of the fabric of this community and,
specifically, we want to address the abusers and abuses of vacation
rentals. We want to be part of the solution. We believe that by
addressing the abuses and the abusers we can greatly cut down on the
problem without having to worry about a rule of law, a new
ordinance, or other governmental actions.
May 28, 2019
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The vacation rentals often proceed without any issues; the
majority of them do. We don't hear about them, we don't notice
them, and they generate millions of dollars of income in support of
our Tourist Development Council, merchants, restaurants, and
destinations.
As a matter of fact, in 2018 revenues -- TDR revenues from
rentals exceed $9 million, which resulted in more than 25 million in
an estimated economic impact on our community.
NABOR clearly wants to be part of the solution. We are
working on a plan to partner with the Collier County Sheriff's Office
to work on substantive issues that relate to quiet enjoyment of
property and look forward to help craft a solution to address the
abusers.
We urge you to create a stakeholders group to join us to address
the issues of vacation rentals and, with input from various community
groups, we believe we can come up with a solution that actively
addresses the abuses that have been talked to you about today.
While our collective efforts to implement solutions are
underway, we urge you to take some action to calm our real estate
markets. As was pointed out today, there does not appear to be a ny
way to enforce duration or frequency. Those messages would be
helpful to get out into the community.
As a result of the motion on March 26th and your
reconsideration on April 8th to return to the status quo, a tremendous
amount of uncertainty has rippled through the real estate market,
sellers, buyers, landlords, and tenants alike. There are many real
estate contracts for sale that have been lost or are in limbo because
people do not know what their options are.
Similarly, there are thousands of committed rental contracts for
2019. They're in jeopardy because there's uncertainty in the real
estate market what can and can't be done with rentals.
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We at NABOR pledge to participate in all possible ways to
implement solutions to the vacation rental issues that have been
presented today. We also ask that you take action to try to create
some calm in our real estate markets, which exists as it is today.
Thank you for your consideration.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Don't go away, Jeffrey.
(Applause.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Jeffrey, don't go away. Hang on a
second, Ms. Lauren.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: I was greatly encouraged by
your comments. So you have realtors advertising homes for daily
rentals -- I've got 76 of them throughout the county -- when our
ordinance says six months?
MR. JONES: The listings that were referred to in the MLS are
based on information that's provided by the realtor or by the seller.
And it says right in every MLS listing that this should be
independently verified. There's PUD rules; there's HOA rules; there's
condo rules. We try to report that information in the MLS, but it's
not always correct.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: So -- and, again, I like your idea
of coming together to try to address this, but the first thing that would
be addressed is the communication from NABOR to their agents that
we have a six-month rule that can be enforced. There's nothing that
can't be enforced. We have an ordinance that says six months
minimum.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Correction.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Rental.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Whoa.
MR. JONES: I believe the County Attorney just put up Chapter
509 which says you don't. So that's what's happening.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: No, no.
May 28, 2019
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MR. JONES: The real estate market is in turmoil.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: That's why I brought this up so it
could be very clear from our County Attorney.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right.
MR. JONES: So if we are part of the solution, we deal with the
abuses.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I'd like to hear from the County
Attorney.
MR. KLATZKOW: I'll put up your ordinance.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: There's an ordinance.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Is this our ordinance or the state's
ordinance?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Ours.
MR. KLATZKOW: All right. If you could put that up.
So what the State is saying is that you are now barred from any
new ordinance, all right; that the only thing we've got is any local
law, ordinance, regulation adopted on or before June 2011.
What you have is this: Our Land Development Code, since at
least 2004, has defined a transient lodging facility as anything less
than six months occupancy. So any zoning district does not authorize
a transient lodging facility, and that's most of your residential areas,
all right; you cannot have a rental less than six months occupancy.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: But that's a definition out of RT.
MR. KLATZKOW: That is the definition out of your Land
Development Code on destination resort hotel which, in turn, defines
a transient lodging facility as anything less than six months
occupancy.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And our staff has been interpreting
that to be applicable -- the six-month definition is -- our staff's been
interpreting that definition over to residential between -- to delineate
May 28, 2019
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between short term and long term?
MR. KLATZKOW: Yes, sir.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: So it's an interpretation; not part of
the ordinance.
MR. KLATZKOW: No. The ordinances are right up there.
The ordinance says six months.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Six months. It's right there.
MR. KLATZKOW: And staff's interpretation -- and staff is here
if you want to talk to them about this -- is that, as I said, a transient
lodging facility is anything less than six months occupancy. Unless
you are zoned to have a transient lodging facility, you may not do so.
That has been the long-standing staff interpretation, and Code
Enforcement has had that understanding for many years as well.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay. So in other words, the
people from Lely --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner, wait a second here.
We've got -- three lights are up, and, Commissioner, we're in the
process here -- Commissioner Taylor had a question for one of the
public speakers, and then we went over into this direction.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Well, I wanted to -- but I -- but,
no, that's part of it, to define what our current ordinance -- what the
law says right now.
MR. KLATZKOW: Also understand you do not have the
short-term rental ordinance, all right. You do not.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Right.
MR. KLATZKOW: What you have is a definition of what a
transient lodging facility is, and the argument is that unless you're
specifically authorized to do something in the Land Development
Code you may not do so, and only in districts that authorize transient
lodging facilities may you have one, and that's done with the RT
zoning.
May 28, 2019
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CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right, which is a very small portion
of our community. We're saying the same thing.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Right. And so can we -- with
this definition right here, the destination resort hotel -- does that --
can you go into HOAs and PUDs with this definition also?
MR. KLATZKOW: What an HOA can do is they can bar
short-term rentals in their community if they want to do so. They
cannot authorize them. That's your Land Development Code.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Okay.
MR. KLATZKOW: They can be more restrictive. Just like we
can generally be more restrictive than the state. An HOA can be
more restrictive than we are if they choose to be.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. Commissioner Solis -- or,
excuse me, Commissioner Fiala was first.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yes.
So, in other words, the people here from Lely Resort who say
there's transient rentals or, you know, overnight rentals or short-term
rentals actually, that's illegal then, right?
MR. KLATZKOW: Yes.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay. So that gives them -- we
need to have something in writing, and if you would send that to me.
And anybody who wants it, I'd be happy to send it to you. Just notify
my office, or you can even call the County Attorney's Office, and
he'll send it to you.
MR. KLATZKOW: No. The appropriate venue is to lodge a
complaint with Code Enforcement.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay. And Code Enforcement is
also in this room.
But, second of all, if somebody is renting a house, I don't care if
it's for a week or a month or whatever, and you're renting your place
out as a business, do you have to have a commercial license for that
May 28, 2019
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house?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: You're not allowed to do
commercial in a house.
MR. KLATZKOW: That I do not know off the top of my head.
It doesn't much matter from your zoning perspective. At the end of
the day, if you wanted to regulate that, we can get into those issues,
all right. At this point in time the use itself is not authorized. You'd
be asking somebody to get a license for a business you can't do.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Well, Mike is listening. Okay.
Okay. That's what I wanted to know.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Solis.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Okay. It seems like I heard
something different all of a sudden.
So this is a definition of transient lodging facility within the
definition of a destination resort hotel.
MR. KLATZKOW: That is correct.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: And what I thought I just heard was
that unless you are within a transient lodging -- an area that's zoned
for transient lodging, not destination resort hotel but transient
lodging, that this six month -- anything being less than six months is
inapplicable? Is that --
MR. KLATZKOW: Staff's interpretation of this --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Right.
MR. KLATZKOW: -- paragraph, okay. This is all we've got in
the code.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I know. I know. I'm trying to get --
MR. KLATZKOW: This is all we've got. I wish we had
something more.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I'm trying to put my arms around
what the interpretation was.
MR. KLATZKOW: Okay. I wish we had a short-term rental
May 28, 2019
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ordinance in the county, but by the time it became an issue, you were
preempted.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Right, right, right.
MR. KLATZKOW: The industry got there quick.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: And I'm not -- I'm not questioning
the interpretation. I just want to really understand.
MR. KLATZKOW: So the staff's interpretation is: By
definition, a transient lodging facility is anything less than six months
occupancy.
Our code says that unless a use is specifically authorized, it's
prohibited.
So unless your zoning district authorizes a transient lodging
facility, you may not operate a transient lodging facility in that
zoning district.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: So unless -- so anything that's not
zoned for transient lodging cannot be --
MR. KLATZKOW: Cannot -- that's most of your residential.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: That's most of the residential.
MR. KLATZKOW: Yes.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Okay.
MR. KLATZKOW: Why wouldn't it be, by the way?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Do you know -- and I don't know if
Mr. Bosi's here, but are there any other references to transient lodging
other than this one reference in the definitions?
MR. KLATZKOW: I wish we had more.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Okay. I'm just -- I just want to
make sure I've got the facts right.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Okay. That's all I've got for now.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Good questions.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: You know, but, again --
May 28, 2019
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CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Back to the public speakers.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Let's go back to the public speakers.
I'm sorry.
MR. MILLER: Your next public speaker is Lauren Melo. She's
been ceded additional time from William Poteet for a total six
minutes. She will be followed by Ray Placid.
MS. MELO: Commissioners, Lauren Melo, president elect of
NABOR.
And I'm going to get right to the point here. Keyword
"interpretation." A definition in the LDC, Land Development Code,
needs an ordinance to enact it. There is no ordinance.
We recently spent taxpayer dollars to let the world know we're
open for business in order to compensate for the hurricane followed
by the algae crisis, both of which gave a national narrative that
Collier County was closed for business.
For those funds to continue to work, we must acknowledge that
hotels cannot accommodate every visitor. The money you invested
has worked; it has worked too well. We need to ensure there is
enough places to support our tourism needs. Vacation rentals are one
of those solutions.
The state law is clear and prohibits a local government from
regulating the frequency or duration of vacation rentals if the
ordinance was not in existence on July 1st, 2001. Under this statute,
local governments also may not prohibit vacation rentals unless the
ordinance existed prior to that date.
It is our position that the Collier County code does not contain
any provision that would fall under the protections for pre -July 21st,
2011, ordinances.
I believe the county is in agreement, as they would not have
collected over nine million in 2018 in unlawful tourist tax dollars
generated from short-term vacation rentals.
May 28, 2019
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The last thing we want is to be part of any problem. Instead,
NABOR wants to be part of assisting in the solution for vacation
rentals; therefore, we urge the Commission to create a task force
made up of stakeholders to fully study the vacation-rental issues and
make recommendations; then use those recommendations to create
ordinances that respect the rights of all property owners while
allowing the vacation rental industry to operate.
We are taking this seriously and hope that you do, too. We look
forward to your consideration.
(Applause.)
MR. MILLER: Mr. Chairman, your next speaker is Ray Placid.
I've gotten quite a few additional slips here for Mr. Placid; 14 to be
exact, 14 in total. He tells me he doesn't know if all these people will
be here. Bear with me a minute.
Monika Haven?
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: George Patel?
(Raises hand.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: He's here.
MR. MILLER: Dharmendra Patel?
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: Lauren Pla -- I can't read the last name here.
Po -- begins with a P, I think. I'll come back to that.
Rakesh Patel?
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: Laurden Patel. I don't know. Okay.
Chiraq Patel?
(Raises hand.)
MS. McGOWAN: He put his hand up twice. You can't put it
up twice.
MR. MILLER: All right. Richard Brackett?
May 28, 2019
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(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: Mr. Desai?
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: Thank you. I'm not going to attempt the first
name.
Bijal Desai?
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: Thank you.
Laura Radner?
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: Lois Croft?
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: Ruhul Patal?
(Raises hand.)
MR. PLACID: That's enough.
Could you show me how to get this going?
MR. MILLER: Yeah. I'll take care of that, sir. It's ready for
you. That's at least 13 speakers ceding time for him.
MR. PLACID: I'm not going to need that much time. I, at best,
need 15 minutes depending on what happens with how we interpret
this law.
MR. MILLER: I will put up 16 minutes, sir, and we'll go from
there.
MR. PLACID: Okay. The PowerPoint.
MR. MILLER: Yeah. It's on and ready. You just need to
advance it on -- the keyboard slides out, sir.
MR. PLACID: All right. I disagree with what was said. We're
talking about zoning here, and which is a very powerful tool
governments have.
This is a use issue, and I'm going to make it as simple as I can in
terms of the interpretation of this Land Development Code, because
May 28, 2019
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I've read it, written myself a memo on it, and I've read the cases
underneath it.
So with that said, this is a use issue. And I'm going -- to make it
simple, when they built the Ritz -Carlton, if they would have come
before the County Commission and said, we want to put a hotel on
my street, you'd have said no. That's a single-family use. That's what
this is. We're talking about a use.
And so when you got into the definition of destination resort
hotels, that's a use issue, and the use of less than six months is
prohibited; prohibited in single-family neighborhoods.
So this is a zoning issue. And if you don't believe me, Daytona
Thursday -- actually, it was Wednesday night. The judge issued an
order in favor of the City of Daytona upholding their zoning code;
said you cannot rent for less than six months.
And that was a class-action suit, and there were two major law
firms against the City of Daytona, and I spoke to the city attorney
about three times already, and I'm walking through his Land
Development Code, because I'm going to file an amicus curiae brief,
so I will be there.
But this is a use issue, so let's not get distracted by ordinances.
We are grandfathered in. We have a law on the books; we are
grandfathered in.
And with that said, let me get to the balance of what we need t o
address. This is no longer -- you know, I knew very little about this
vacation rental stuff until I had one move in 15 feet from me, and
that's when this becomes personal, and that's when you start to
understand this stuff.
I have met a ton of people. I've been passing around flyers,
knocking on doors. And I've talked to Airbnb users. As a matter of
fact, this week when I was passing around a flyer, and I said, hey,
you know, there's a big hearing here. Why don't you show up?
May 28, 2019
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And I said, well, before I get started, you know, do you own?
And he says, no, I'm here for the weekend. I was talking to an
Airbnb guy in my neighborhood which I didn't even know. I didn't
even know that house was an Airbnb house.
With that said, I ran into a landowner. He's got about 20 houses
in Naples Park. And he said, Ray, why are you so opposed to this?
And I said, because I live next door to one.
He says, I agree with you. I wouldn't want to live next door to
one, but I want to operate them, and that's the problem here. When
you live next door to this stuff, it adds a different dimension to it,
guys.
And, you know, I have a lot of friends and neighbors, and I
understand we don't want to disrupt this tourism. I want the tourists
down here. We can figure out a way -- and I will help you with this
task force group. If you want me on it, I will help you, because I
figured it out. I figured it out, how to do this.
I've ran it by a couple city attorneys. I think we can do this and
still keep the tourists down here, but we can't -- we have to enforce
this. We've got to shut down the most egregious, which is what I
thought we were talking about. We didn't come down here to shut
down the tourism industry. That's not what this is about. And it's not
just about the house next door to me. There's 2,600 homes that Jack
Wert said that are living next door to hotels.
So -- and let me just understand -- so you can understand what
happened on the 26th. I read the paper. There's just nothing but
misinformation about this. What happened is he said, we're going to
have to get frequent fliers, the most egregious people. Is that what
we said?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: That's what we said.
MR. PLACID: Yeah. So with that said, we have people
speeding right now down U.S. 1 (sic). The cops can go down there
May 28, 2019
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and set up the radar system, and they will catch the frequent fliers.
Does that mean people don't speed? You're going to go home
tonight, and you're going to speed.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Not me.
MR. PLACID: I'm not going to stop you from doing your
vacation rental, but I'm going to stop you from doing 70 miles an
hour, and that's what these hotels are; they're 70 miles an hour in a
50-mile-an-hour zone, and that's the problem.
I don't want to shut down the guys that are doing 50 in a
40-mile-an-hour zone. That's not my issue. My issue is the hotels.
And I think that's -- you agree with me. I spoke to you about this.
But somehow I watched your Call to Action and I watched your
video, and somehow there's just misinformation. If we could just sit
around and figure this out as a community -- I'm in Florida my whole
life. I don't want to lose tourists. I love my snowbirds, and I love
when they leave, for God's sakes, okay? But we can't destroy
single-family neighborhoods. That's what this is about.
You don't want to live next door to this nonsense; trust me. You
don't want to do it.
So with that said, this is a summary. You know, I showed this
to my wife. She says, you know what, this is what -- this is what my
neighbors -- I've experienced this, and this is with my neighbors.
People leave dog -- you know, these people bring dogs. These
vacation guys bring their dogs down, they let them out at night, and
they leave dog poop, and they don't pick it up.
This guy next door to me rented the house. His kids were out
there fishing. My boat was covered with fishing line. I went and I --
you know, I knocked on the door. I said, you know you just covered
my boat with fishing line.
He says, oh, you don't have to worry about that. We're leaving.
He took his suitcase, and he left.
May 28, 2019
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I went in there and got the fishing line off the boat, and then I
jumped into the canal and to get it out of the canal because there's
manatees in the canal. These people just -- these vacation guys just
don't think like we do. They're here on vacation.
One of my neighbors was home mowing his yard. The guy in
the motel next door said, hey, can you stop mowing your yard?
We're on vacation. And my neighbor almost went, are you kid ding
me?
You don't mix transients with single-family homeowners. You
don't mix tourists, and that's the problem.
It hit me last night. What is the problem here? They are
marketing to tourists to stay in single -family neighborhoods. We
never did that in the last 50 years in this county. We put them in
areas where they belong.
The problem is, we don't have enough areas where they belong.
You need to change some of your zoning areas so we can expand this
stuff. We don't have enough places for these people to stay. We
don't have enough hotels.
Miami Beach has tons of hotels. That's why they can shut down
the short-term rental business, and they did with a $20,000 fine. We
don't have enough hotels to hold all these people.
And there's a lot -- there's a couple hotel owners here that
operate the hotels. They will say they need the business. So why not
help them out? Help everybody out.
We can do this as a community. I'm not here to destroy this
community. I'm here to shut down this vacation rental, daily rental.
And I don't want anything less -- this is my opinion. I would
prefer three months, but I will compromise at a month because, by
definition -- by definition under the architectural standards of fire
codes, transients is defined as anything less than 30 days. That's the
definition. I asked an architect about this.
May 28, 2019
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So that's what they use for architectural standards. When they
design a hotel, they said, are you renting for less than 30 days?
You've got to have the special fire code equipment in here. That's my
understanding. I'm not an expert in architect, but that's what they
explained to me.
With that said, let me give you another dimension, and I may
need a little more extra time. But this is the zoning law that we have.
You can sit there and debate whether that's a proper interpretation. It
is an interpretation, but that's what attorneys do, and NABOR has
known about this interpretation for over a decade, and they live by it.
Zoning used to go to the NABOR hearings back in 2008 during
the foreclosure crisis and says, guys, you can't rent for less than six
months, because we had a real problem in this county. You
remember during the great recession.
All right. Well, they went there. NABOR said no problem, and
your Code Enforcement has used that law to issue notice of
violations, and I'm going to say prosecute, but take people to hearings
on that interpretation. Nobody's ever challenged it before. That's
fine. If they want to challenge it, let them challenge it.
I don't want to get into the lost revenue and the impact. I do
want to touch upon this impact on tourism because, yes, if you shut
down the vacation rental business, you will impact tourism. But I
have looked at two studies on this. One study says you're just
robbing from Peter to pay Paul. You're taking long-term rentals --
you're taking short-term and replacing it with long-term rentals.
So they said overall it's about a 2 to 4 percent on any local
economy. I called the realtors over in Miami. They said, we didn't
lose anything, Coral Gables said they didn't lose anything, and Miami
Beach said they didn't lose anything. But, yes, that is a concern. You
should consider that.
But I will tell you it's not as bad as it can be. I mean, look, if
May 28, 2019
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they don't come down by the day, they'll come down by the week or
the month.
There's two sides to this story. Sure, there's some good sides to
this, and they can tell you the good sides. I don't have time for that.
I've got to go to work.
But the dark side of this. You know, Donna, you hit it on the
nose. I re-watched the hearing on March 26th. I wasn't listening
because I was so caught up in what I was going to say. But you said,
who's living next to me? And that's -- I said, well, who is living next
to you?
I Google -- well, let me deal with the fire. I called the fire
commissioner, one of the fire commissioners. I said, do you inspect
these single -- you know, these short-term rental things?
He said, no. We don't jump into single-family homes. You
know, these things were built to be -- to accommodate single
families. They weren't built as hotels. That would be like taking --
we're going to take a car dealership that was built to be a car
dealership and turn it into a hospital. It wasn't built to be a hospital.
And these areas in Naples Park, some of those homes are 40
years old. That's a fire from Naples Park. That was not a short-term
rental, but that was for a homeowner. You burn up a transient
lodging -- they're putting 18 people in Naples Park homes. I'll show
you the ad in just a second.
They're listing homes for 12 people in Naples Park. And if that
thing burns down, it's going to be on your shoulders. They're going
to say, why don't you enforce the law? That's what's going to
happen. Do you think these guys are going to come to your rescue
and say, oh, we're going to regulate this? No. It's going to be you.
Okay. Who's living next door to you? So I Googled Airbnb and
crime. Listen to this. And I'm not -- we don't have a lot of crime
here. There was a study for the 67 counties. It was done by a guy
May 28, 2019
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out of the University of Florida, and they said, how does Airbnb
impact us? I'll give it to you.
So far they've found a direct relationship between Airbnb and
crime. Where there was Airbnb or vacation rentals, there is crime,
because the crime follows it. But so far in Collier County, it was
minimal. That just came out, I think, two years ago, okay.
But the big cities, L.A., New Orleans, Boston, New York, this is
the reason they're shutting down this business, because they're having
too much problems with crime.
Charleston, South Carolina; Savannah; London; Paris;
Barcelona. I've researched all this. All of them, it's all about crime,
and there was a lot of it, and you don't hear about it because Airbnb
doesn't report it, but the people do.
And here's what they -- here's what -- some of the headlines.
Police say Airbnb rentals are increasingly being used for --
increasingly used for human trafficking. Hookers are turning to
Airbnb --
THE COURT REPORTER: I'm sorry. You've got to slow
down.
MR. OCHS: You've got to slow down a little bit so she can --
MR. PLACID: I'm trying to speak quickly so I can go home and
these guys can go home. I'm sorry. And I pity your job. You have a
tough job.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: How much time does he have left,
Troy?
MR. PLACID: I need about six more minutes, and I want to be
done, please. If you can just listen to me for six more minutes.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: We've got to give her a break. I'm
just -- I was asking Troy how much time you had allotted left.
MR. MILLER: Mr. Chairman, we had set the timer at 16. He
was allotted several more minutes than that.
May 28, 2019
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CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. And I'm not pushing you,
Ray.
MR. PLACID: I know. Just, please, I want to get done. I want
these folks to give their story, and let's go home.
At any rate, there is a crime problem here, guys. If you don't
believe me, just Google Airbnb and rape and Airbnb and drugs, and
you'll get 50 or 60 hits, okay? It's there.
All right. You know, I've already said that, you know, this stuff
follows Airbnb. Here's the flip side of this: If we don't enforce, then
if we do get a crime problem, crime can hurt tourism. So you're
running -- you're doing a balancing act here, guys. And so that's why
we need to work together, because I want them to be able to book
their bookings, but I don't want a criminal next door to me, and I
don't know who is next door to me.
And you know, I want to tell you, the realtor that rents that
house next door to me, she's about as professional as you can get, and
as professional as she is, I still have problems.
And the landlord, I've met him. They're good people, okay.
They're good people. But you can't control this business, because
you guys don't show up after these -- I'm the first one that sees them.
You book them virtually. That's what happens. And they show up.
And sometimes they're good and sometimes they're bad. Not always.
When they're bad, they're bad.
All right. Now, here's the question: Who should regulate? I
know at one of the other hearings, April 9th, April 28th -- I've been
re-watching all these tapes -- I know one of the realtors said, well, let
the realtors regulate this. I think there's a huge c onflict of interest.
I'd say no.
I don't like government getting into anything. I'm not a big fan
of government, but I'll tell you right now this is the time for it.
You've got Code Enforcement, you've got fire marshals, you've got
May 28, 2019
Page 231
the police. Take care of it.
And then when we finally clean up the daily rentals, back off
and let the realtors take care of this. But right now it's out of control.
Now, what do I mean by out of control?
I've got to speed up.
I'm going to go to Naples Park. These will the listings. You can
look them up. This house is for 12 people. This is a house in Naples
Park. This is a big house. I think it's a six-bedroom, six-bath house;
18 people. If there was a fire there, God forbid.
On my street or two streets down, there's a big -- you know, I
live on the water, okay. These houses are much bigger than these
Naples Park houses. They're marketing those houses for 16 people a
day.
And I talked to the owner next door, and I said, this is driving
me crazy, okay. This is a problem.
And I'm not going to sit here and blame on anybody. I mean,
there's good realtors and there's bad realtors, and I'm not saying these
are bad realtors. They're just trying to make a buck.
Anyway, oh, I know. Here is a slide I want you all to see. This
is Naples Park. All those blue dots are daily -- daily rentals.
New Orleans -- I read an article. New Orleans was complaining
because the French Quarters was being turned into a motel district.
This is Naples Park. Somebody told me the number was up to 1,200
homes. There's 2,600 homes in Naples Park, 300 multifamily. Up to
1,200 are daily. That's incredible.
And if you look across the street, I think about 20 percent of the
houses -- there's five on my street; five. We just went to one of the
homeowners and said, could you please stop doing this? He said,
yes. He put his daughter in there, but then the very next day
somebody sold their house, and they turned it into a vacation rental.
So we were down to four. Now we're back up to five.
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What can I say? And I just talked to a realtor -- and I'm done.
This is a true story. I just talked to a -- I ran into a guy. I said, hey,
you know, are you coming to a hearing? He says, no, I rent. He
says, I'm trying to find a place to rent.
And I said, well, you know, talk to the guy just across the street.
He says, well, no, it's a monthly rental. It's a daily -- it's a weekly
rental. They want 5,500 a month. They want whatever for the
season. I'm trying to rent it for three years, but they won't do it
because they want to keep it short term.
And I said, maybe I'll talk to the realtor. I'm not going to
mention the name, but I know her. This guy's a lawyer. He's be a
perfect tenant. But, no, I might have to be living with to urists. And
like I said, I love my snowbirds, but I don't want to live next to them.
Thank you.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Ray, what is your name, please?
MR. PLACID: What's that?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: What's your name again.
MR. PLACID: That depends who's asking.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: You're on TV.
MR. PLACID: My name is Raymond Placid, like the lake,
P-l-a-c-i-d.
And, guys, let's -- Jeff, I'll be happy to work with you. Okay.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Thank you. Excellent presentation.
(Applause.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Terri, are you ready? We're going
to take a 10-minute break and be back at 5:17.
(A brief recess was had.)
MR. OCHS: Ladies and gentlemen, if you would please take
your seats.
MR. MILLER: Mr. Chairman, are you ready to return to public
speakers?
May 28, 2019
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CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yes, I am.
MR. MILLER: Your next public speaker is Brad Estes. He will
be followed by Rich Townsend.
MR. ESTES: Good afternoon, Commissioners. I'm Brad Estes,
Poinciana Civic Association. Thank you for having this hearing.
I really have nothing to add. Each of you have got a copy of our
email, and that outlines our opposition to short-term rentals, so thank
you.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Rich Townsend. He will
be followed by Henry Patel.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: What did he say?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: They're opposed to short-term
rentals.
MR. TOWNSEND: Hi, there. Good afternoon. First time here
at a meeting. This is an education.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: How about that?
MR. TOWNSEND: Yeah, I'm here -- just the short term of it is
to say I support some sort of bringing the stakeholders together. This
is a really big deal for the community for so many things. Let's get --
let's get calm minds together and figure something out. I'm sure we
can do that.
I don't know anybody who wants a party going on next to their
home. No one wants that. I think we can work this out and figure
something out. So that's what I invite you to do. I know there
were -- there have been some conversations here which I'm really
concerned about like a hasty decision. Let's just go ahead and
enforce this thing. I think that's really short -sighted. That's throwing
the baby out with the bathwater. You've got a few people that are
causing a problem. Let's deal with that and get that sorted out.
I've got to say, also, I am a bit offended by the comments that
have been made about realtors. I'm a realtor. I'm here as a
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homeowner. I've made maybe $1,000 in 10 years renting -- as a
commission renting a rental, but there's a tone here that realtors are
here to -- they're only here to make a buck. That's really
inappropriate. So that's what I've got to say. Thank you.
(Applause.)
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Henry Patel, Mr. Patel has
been ceded additional time from Nick Patel.
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: Jayesh Patel?
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: And Mike Patel for a total of 15 minutes.
Mr. Patel will be followed by Laura Puckett.
MR. PATEL: I'm just going to ask my friend hotel owners to
just stand up in support so they can see that we represent a group of
hotel owners.
Gentlemen -- ladies and gentlemen, thank you for your
community work, because I'm actually working just like you in City
of Miami.
But I'm past chairman of the Asian-American Hotel Owners
Association. I'm from Miami, Florida.
I happen to represent one of the most burning issue. I moved
into this country in 1986, and now this is my adopted motherland.
One of the things I uphold the most in the world when I travel as
an American now is that the law and justice and judiciary is the most
transparent I can ever find in the world.
I'm kind of baffled when this whole vacation rental and Airbnb
came in and claiming the short-term rental and whatnot, but the fact
is the zoning law supersedes.
Why should anybody punish the people who have followed the
law in the books for years and years? We followed the rules in the
books the day we bought our properties, which is the zoning rule.
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Now all of a sudden there's a collapse in that real estate market and
some investors -- and God knows from where. We don't even know.
These investors are either from Russia, from China, from Brazil,
from Chile. They might not be one of your borders (sic), sir, but they
happen to invest money and make the money online sitting in their
home in other country. Now they should be rewarded for the actions
which are -- we followed the rules. We followed every zoning rule.
As a hotel industry we are overregulated, in fact. We have fire
laws. We have ADA laws. We have every other law including audit
laws from state and county for the taxes we collect. Anybody can
walk into our hotel and ask for our guest ledger, and we have to
produce every document. And now somebody saying that we should
be compromising? I don't think so.
The crime statistics, if you look -- and I don't want to be
redundant to the previous speaker, Mr. Ray, but the crime statistic
speaks for itself. Record number of crimes have been contributing
factor to Airbnb, and the reason being is simple: A lot of people who
don't stay at hotel and go Airbnb, there's easily accessible information
for people who are perpetrators of crime. They going to a
neighborhood in Naples looking for an Alabama tag in a non-hotel
district. He knows this person is not living here. While at hotel, we
have adequate security, lighting for our guests.
One of the incidents which happened about last year in Miami
when a young lady was staying in a condo, she found cameras in her
bedroom. And this is online. You can Google it, ma'am. It's twice
happened already. It was on media.
When police was called, the answer was, ma'am, you have
rented somebody's private home. This is not a hotel. Nothing I can
do about it. Guess about that -- think about that.
Another big impact -- because of some of the trade we don't do,
we don't understand the impact, but there is -- we had a good
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dialogue, and I've been a very active participant in what's going on at
the state level of this -- of Airbnb. And I'll tell you how quickly the
theme changed, because I've been there last four hearings in state.
When the first time the bill was presented was, our servicemen, our
senior citizens need some extra income, so they should be allowed to
share their home, which I'm fine. I do agree with that.
But, you know, same people who proposed that bill next year
went for five extra condo rentals -- from the language of servicemen
and police and senior citizen need money to five additional renters.
Same people. And I've been there every hearing at the state level.
The objective was not to help our seniors, but objective was to
allow more money, more condo investments to make money and
don't report income.
But the impact on job market, just think about this. From a
housekeeping job to a marketing job in industry. We hire a lot of
people. When you rent an Airbnb, do you see any middleman in
this? No. You rent a room online, and you grab a key, and you go to
a condo. What happens to the people?
What do we promise to our youngsters who are going to Gulf
Coast University or who are going to University of Florida or FSU
who are literally spending their lifelong career in hotel, tourism, and
resort management, and they're losing their jobs because of it.
And there is research going on, because we're going to submit
the numbers to State of Florida. There was a request by a state
senator, and I'm going to submit that. By the way, I did run for state
house in 2016.
So I heard a story. One of my friends and I go to a gym in
Miami, and he didn't know that I'm a hotel owner. But while
walking -- while running on the treadmill, he makes a comment. Oh,
by the way, I own Airbnb. He goes, I own two Airbnbs.
I said, what do you do?
May 28, 2019
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He says, one I rent it for monthly, and the other one I do daily.
So I said, so what does -- how do you manage it?
He says, the guy who goes daily, the monthly one cleans it, and I
pay them cash.
So just think about the impact of the dark economy which this
industry is creating, because there's no regulation of audit on this,
absolutely not. And there is -- even at state level, they are not willing
to say, let's get every record of people who do vacation rental on
audit.
I'm pretty sure all of you will agree there has to be a fair level
playing field on everything if you allow that, right? How can you
have hotel who is all regulated ADA -- and, by the way, we have a lot
of frivolous lawsuits on hotels.
But ADA regulation, fire regulation, audit regulation,
everything, and they have no regulation to follow, period, not one.
And just think about your city. Everywhere you go in America,
somebody said, my parents will be moving to Naples, Florida,
because this is a very well-admired retirement community all over the
country. Guess what? You're losing that charm.
There will be people drawing an ugly picture. Oh, by the way,
the tourism will go down. By the way, people -- no people come to
Naples, Florida. When I -- I already have gray hair, but when I want
to move, I'll move to Naples. I love Naples.
People have real good sense of liking for Naples as a retirement
community. But, again, some of the people made comment, do you
like to see somebody next door every other day?
We get incidents in Miami every other week on media, 20, 30
people partying, smoking, illegal parking and, of course, loud music
and noise. Just think about it. If we make a -- if we make a leniency
to the zoning law now, would you like to have a nightclub next to
your house because we made -- we set a precedent of allowing a
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leniency on our zoning law? No. Nobody would like that. So why
should you allow somebody else to do this? Why?
I gave an example at state hearing when one of the state senators
or state representatives asked me a question. I said, just think about
it. Us hoteliers, as soon as a law enforcement officer walks in, we
provide the guest ledger and a guest registration card so they have
every information of person staying in. Think about in a
neighborhood of 50 or 70 homes. There is one person who is a serial
killer loose. How the police is going to find it? How is -- it happens
to be one of the Airbnb renters. At least hotel take responsibility for
their guests' security, and we are on 24-hour management where we
keep eye on them.
Another scenario: Our industry has been contributor to the
major taxes throughout the years. If you see the infrastructure and
development come from our hard work, our blood and sweat, our
investment, but we have raised all -- we have collected all these bed
taxes where you see the developments like the Marl in's Stadium in
Miami or the Dolphin's Stadium. That comes from the bed tax
money which we work hard for. We have been contributor, but we
have been taking risk with that money, our own investment.
Only work people because ignoring us as hotel owners, we have
worked hard for this. Our wives, our kids have worked hard for
many years to get where we are, but today we are losing business
because of this unfair competition.
We've survived the BPR spill, barely. We survived the
recession in 2008, barely. So many of our guys turned their keys
back to the bank, while I turned a key back to one of my friend's
property to one bank. I don't know. So this is unfair.
So I request all of you, gentlemen and ladies, to uphold the law
which is a zoning law. Yes, they will be saying, oh, we'll have
challenges. No. Daytona, Miami, both were challenged in a court of
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law, and both the cities prevailed in the law based on zoning issues.
So I think you should be bold enough to state whatever our
zoning laws says, we're going to follow. Because at the end of the
day, what is leadership? Leadership is not where the masses stand.
Leadership is where the leader is going to stand even if there's one
person who is right.
That's the example we learned from the life of G andhi, and I
want you to take a leadership and stand on the right side.
Yeah, there will be lawsuits but, of course, we have a lot of
attorneys. And no offense to any attorneys, but we should stand for
what is right. That is the leadership. People voted for you looking at
your leadership skills, and you should stand and uphold the zoning
law to protect the people who have followed the rules for over years
and years again.
Thank you and God bless you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Before you go, Mr. Patel. One
second, sir.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Just a quick question. And
you may not be the right person to ask.
MR. PATEL: I'll try.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: But you've obviously
followed the legislature for several years --
MR. PATEL: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: -- on this, and you're
obviously familiar with the hearings; you've participated in those.
Do you see any possibility that the legislature may backtrack on
the restriction on short-term rentals that they have in place right now,
the law that went into effect in, I think, 2011?
MR. PATEL: I'll give you the facts. Not the fiction, but facts,
what I know.
It's been three years they've been trying, right, but I have seen
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more and more bills being turned in support of our industry, even this
year.
I'll tell you, Chip LaMarca, Representative LaMarca, then there's
state senator from Jacksonville. He entered his bill. That was a bill
entered from one of the state senators from -- I don't remember the
name, sorry. I apologize. But there are more bills being entered,
because this 2011 law, to be very candid -- this is my opinion -- was
written in a strong knee-jerk reaction by state. I'll be very candid.
How can you write a law when you know every city/county has a
zoning law which supercedes? How can you write a law like that?
Just think about it.
Don't you think the zoning law is written for a reason that -- not
to have a big industrial complex next to your single-family residence?
But this was -- and it is vaguely written, if you look at it. "May."
The attorneys understand what the meaning of "may."
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Thank you. I was just
curious as to --
MR. PATEL: Right? And there have been a lot of bills entered,
as I -- if I can send information. I don't know off top of my head, but
all the bills which were entered, I can send information for more
knowledge.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: That's all right. I was just
curious as to your opinion as to whether or not there may be a change
in attitude in Tallahassee over this issue.
MR. PATEL: Yes, there is. Governor Scott didn't sign any bill
because it never made it to the first -- it never made it past the first
committee; the preemption bill, I'm talking about.
The bills which I'm talking about in support, they made it to the
second committee. The preemption bill made nowhere. Three times
in a row preemption bill made nowhere.
And, of course, they're getting big resistance from City of
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Miami, Miami Beach, even now Orlando is waking up, and if Collier
County wakes up, then we have bingo.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I think we're awake.
MR. PATEL: Okay. Thank you. God bless you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Bingo, is that what he said? We
have bingo?
MR. MILLER: Mr. Chairman, your next speaker is Laura
Puckett. She will be followed by Dorothy Gill.
MS. PUCKETT: Hello, everyone. Thanks for staying here so
late tonight, and appreciate everything you guys do.
My name is Laura Puckett. I'm an owner of a vacation rental
management company and a real estate company in town, and I'm
also the president elect of the Vacation Rental Managers Association,
which is a statewide organization. We represent over 400,000
vacation rentals in the state of Florida, and our chapter here in
Southwest Florida is also very strong.
So I just want to step up and say that we work with
municipalities across the state on this same exact issue. We -- our
board meets with County Attorneys and staff, and we have model
regulations that can be put into place. We can work around existing
ordinances that -- hopefully I'm going to talk to the County Attorney
about some of the model ordinances that we have. And we have
enacted them successfully in different municipalities, and they're
working. So we have those to point to.
The other thing I'd like to say is, personally, my family's been in
Collier County since the 1950s. Always been having -- always been
renting homes and different real estate properties.
Nothing's changed in the zoning ordinances in all these years.
The only thing that's changed is now we're being told that we're not
legal.
So -- and when we talk about changing the fabric of the
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communities, I grew up in the Moorings, and half the houses in the
Moorings were empty most of the year. They had people come in
three months out of the year, and the rest of the time all the houses
were empty. So now at least some of these are getting used.
We're contributing over $9 million to the TDC coffers to help
support tourism. The exponential effect of the money that we're
bringing into the city economy is just incredible.
So let me just check my notes here. I'm sure I have a lot more to
say. I want to mention to Mr. Patel and the rest of you that vacation
rentals now house more heads and beds in the state of Florida than
hotels. And Marriott is now the largest manager of vacation rentals
in the state of Florida they just acquired a zillion, so they will now be
the largest manager of vacation rentals in the state of Florida.
This is Uber guys. We need to evolve. We need to come up
with reasonable regulations. I've reached out to all of you. I've
reached out to the TDC, and hopefully I can help be a part of the
solution.
Thank you.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Dorothy Gill. She will be
followed by Alan Dalton.
MS. GILL: Hello. I am a homeowner in Golden Gate City.
Thank you for letting me speak.
And I have been participating with Airbnb. I represent a lot of
people who are not here just for vacation. I have had many guests
who were traveling nurses, physicians. There were medical
technicians, and many -- like firefighter trainers, trainees who did not
need one-month, three-month six-month stay.
One of the firefighters in training, her parents -- she was young.
She's going into firefighter training. Made no sense, but they didn't
want her to stay in a hotel. They wanted her to stay in a place where
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they could, you know, check everything out. But, you know, they
liked our place. They went through several different Airbnbs to
check which one they liked, so...
But it's not just about making it so that -- there are bad apples. I
agree with that. This task force they're talking about doing, that
would be great. I'd love to be a part of it, but stopping it completely
is not going to make a difference. I t's not going to help. So that's
basically what I have to say, so...
But I would like to be a part of it, and I hope that you guys will,
you know, not stop it, like rescind what you had voted for before. I
would appreciate that, and so would the people who, you know, don't
need to stay for a month. They have sporadic schedules. A lot of
hotels wouldn't, you know, agree with the times they can check in,
stuff like that, so...
All right. Thank you.
(Applause.)
MR. MILLER: Mr. Chairman, your next and final speaker on
this item is Alan Dalton.
MR. DALTON: Good afternoon. And, again, thank you just for
a few minutes.
I just wanted to just offer a voice to support the task force option
that's been laid out for you. I think it's a smart thing to do. I think it's
brave that you're taking this on. Obviously, this is -- around the
country, this is something municipalities are trying to work with.
I've got properties in Washington, D.C., and Denver, Miami, all
different control measures that the municipalities put in place, but the
bottom line is that I would just like to offer I think a lot of people
who are challenged by or uncomfortable with the whole concept of
vacation rentals, I will say probably the vast majority of those have
never stayed in one.
I travel to Europe; I travel all around the country. I prefer to
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stay in a vacation rental. It's a different experience. This is why
people are doing it. They prefer it. We call an Uber now instead of a
taxi.
There were times in other meetings where you could have a
whole lineup of taxi drivers instead of hotel owners, right?
People don't want that now. There's a place. There are people
who want that; other people don't. Times are changing.
So we have to adapt. And I think you're brave to take this on.
The task force, I think, is a great idea. Let's put the heads together
and come up with something that works for everybody. That's all I'm
saying. I thank you.
(Applause.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Mr. Chairman, I called this name earlier; I could
not read it properly. It's Kathleen Elrol (sic).
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Elrod.
MR. MILLER: Apparently she was present, and I
mispronounced the name.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: She's been very patient sitting there
glaring at me. I'll say that. You want to speak? Come on.
MS. ELROD: They wouldn't let me bring the dagger. All right.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: She is our final speaker.
MS. ELROD: Kathleen Elrod.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yes, and our final speaker.
MS. ELROD: Collier County native, realtor, and sitting
member of the Code Enforcement Board.
As I watched the shenanigans of our elected officials, I can't
help but wonder who you are serving. Is it Naples? Collier County?
Investors? Home buyers? Sellers? Tourists? I'm confus ed.
If the short-term rental is unlawful, then where is over the
$9 million you collected from the tax from the short-term rentals?
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These monies were used to market Naples on the Gulf to visitors with
the hopes that they would become repeat visitors and residents either
for full or part time.
The fact that the community has come here on three different
dates to just adjust this issue is a waste of our time, too.
I also host on Fifth Avenue South. I talk to tourists every single
day. These people are not going to stay 30 days or more. They're on
Visas. They're from other countries. They're looking for investment
properties to move to when they retire. They don't have the kind of
time where they can rent this much space for that length of time.
You cut off our short-term, they're going to go to other counties.
Everybody says that we don't need the revenue. We keep
raising taxes on everything else. Where's the shortfall going to come
from?
Marriott has just become the biggest renter of short-term rentals.
I don't know.
I know that some hotels are going to -- are losing revenue for the
short terms for Airbnb and stuff, and that's their problem, but you've
created a lot of distrust and insecurities in our rental markets and our
real estate. You need to fix it -- find a solution before you undo
everything else.
With your vote today for the previous case, did anybody think
that they just put a whole bunch of people out of work when you
decided to rescind that and -- or cancel it and think about it for two
weeks? That's it.
(Applause.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: So with that --
MR. MILLER: That is it.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And that's the reason she was
glaring at me.
Any discussion, or you want me to go?
May 28, 2019
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(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I don't have anybody lit up.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Oh, I'll light up.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. Well, then go ahead,
Commissioner Fiala.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: You can go first.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: No. I always like to hear from my
colleagues first, and then I'll try to herd afterwards.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Well, I liked the idea that --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Speak into the microphone, please.
Please.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I wasn't very far from it. Do you
want me to get closer?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: No, you're doing fine now.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: All right. I like the idea of maybe
seeing about one-month, three-month rentals. I don't like the idea of
making it any shorter than one-month rentals. You hear people
coming to town all the time who fly in for a month. They do n't want
to stay in a hotel for a month. They want to stay in a short -term
rental.
But I think that everybody should -- I think everybody should
have to have some kind of an occupational license or a commercial,
license because that's a business now. It's not a neighborhood
anymore. It's a business.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right.
Please, we're going to ask for -- we've closed the public hearing.
Thank you.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: And that way then people in the
neighborhood, if you're going to buy a home -- I know if I was going
to go and buy a home, I certainly wouldn't buy one in a neighborhood
where they have a bunch of short-term rentals.
May 28, 2019
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I don't want to live in a neighborhood and buy a brand-new
home for my family but in a house where there are people moving in
and out all the time. I would want to make sure that I knew that there
were short-term rentals in there. Maybe to do that would be to have
one month or more or two months or three months. No less than one
month, though, a commercial license. So that's just my offering at
this moment.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Solis.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: You know, the problem we have
is --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Several.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: We have lots of -- we've got a lot of
problems. But, you know, everybody's right is the problem; that the
short-term rentals are changing the nature of single-family
neighborhoods and condos and things like that. I'm not that
concerned with areas that have HOAs and associations, because they
control their own destiny. They may not like that, but HOAs have
the ability to enforce their own documents. In fact, they're in a better
position than we are, because our hands are so tied.
But we've got these areas of Collier County that are -- there's no
mechanisms, no HOAs, no ability to address this. I mean, I
understand Mr. Placid's situation. It's in my district. It's bad;
however, if we can't change the definition of what a short-term rental
is, we can't say it's a month or more than a month or less than a
month. Our County Attorney has told us that repeatedly.
This is too important a decision to make, I think, today. There
are other ordinances, I've heard, from several and other places that
may offer some help for us to do something that will address it in a
productive way as opposed to a nonproductive way.
I am very concerned that if we just say we're going to enforce
six months, you know, the seasonal rental market --
May 28, 2019
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CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Will collapse.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: -- I would say that the majority of
people that come to Naples that become great residents of Collier
County, that purchased waterfront homes, you know, homes on golf
courses, really expensive properties that become great residents of
Collier County, they don't do that just walking in here col d. They
come on a seasonal rental for four months several times in a year -- I
mean several times before they purchase a property.
What we're talking about is, if we can't go and say we're going
to enforce this six-month rule, we're going to kill that, and that scares
me, because that is a significant part of not only the current real estate
market but the future real estate market, because those are the people
that invest in our community.
We have to figure out a way to address the most disruptive
players. I don't think there's that many of them. I think they're
somewhat limited compared to the number of people that come -- do
a season here to make sure it's where they want to live, and then buy
a home.
I think that we need to -- and I was going to ask the staff this. Is
there -- do we have any kind of advisory committee, a standing one,
that could help us vet this? Is there any mechanism for doing this?
MR. CASALANGUIDA: TDC is your advisory board for
tourist development, but it would probably be some sort of task force
that would be specifically for this one item, I could think of, sir.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I mean, I hate to say this, because
it's going to involve more staff time, but this is, in my opinion, way
too important an issue to kind of do this on the fly, yes or no, you
know, it's all or nothing. I just don't think we can do that.
I think we have to create some kind of a task force. They can
look around the state, look at the ordinances, look at our Land
Development Code, work with our staff, and come up with something
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that's viable. We can't just say it's all or nothing because, one way or
the another, I think Collier County's going to lose. That's it.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: But the composition of that
committee would have to be very carefully planned.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Absolutely.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Well, Commissioner Taylor.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Well, I'm going to defer to our
commissioner next to me, Commissioner Saunders, who basically
said at the last time we heard this -- sir, what was your
recommendation?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Well, what I had tried to
accomplish back in March was to take a look at these daily rentals,
primarily, maybe weekly rentals, but certainly the daily rentals, and
have our Code Enforcement folks really be aggressive in dealing with
the most -- and I used the term egregious -- the most egregious
violators.
There are a few, apparently there are not a whole lot, but there
are a few owners of these rentals that will rent on a daily basis, and
they don't care who they rent to, and the tenants that are renting don't
care how much noise they make; they don't care where they park
their cars. And so -- and they don't care about -- some of those
renters don't care about whether they're violating any sign o rdinances
in terms of the signs that they use.
So I thought that if we just focused on complaint-driven issues.
We're, again, using the term most egregious, the most egregious
violators were, that we could send Code Enforcement out to deal with
them.
Now, it sounds like we can't really -- I don't want to send the
signal that any rental less than six months is a violation, but I do want
to send a signal that perhaps we can send Code Enforcement out to
deal with anything dealing with noise and all of the codes that we
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have, while we're doing that, develop some more stringent codes, and
those codes would apply to all rentals.
Under the state law, we can't pick out short-term rentals and say,
these ordinances apply to them. It would have to apply to all rental.
But begin to crack down on at least the turmoil that's being created in
some of these neighborhoods.
So I think that's where I'd like to see us go, perhaps. We're not
going to try to regulate the duration of a rental, but we're going to try
to --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: We can't.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: -- crack down on any code
violation and at the same time develop stronger codes.
I do have a question for the County Attorney, procedurally, as to
where we are, because we had a motion to reconsider the motion that
I had made back in March dealing with enforcement, and so I'm not
sure whether we have to unwind that or where we are procedurally.
But once we deal with that procedural issue, I'd like to see us at
least go after all of these code violations that we can that are driven
by complaints from neighbors.
MR. KLATZKOW: Well, my office was working with Mr.
Ossorio. We were in the process of identifying the most egregious
code violators when the motion for rehearing came, and we just
stopped. So it's the will of the Board what we do.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: So where are we
procedurally?
MR. KLATZKOW: Procedurally -- procedurally we're frozen
until the Board makes this decision. Which way do you want to go?
Do you want us to --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: We voted to reconsider.
MR. KLATZKOW: Right. And if the direction here is no, we'll
continue with your original direction on that motion to go after the
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more egregious short-term rentals. That's what we will do.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: But the original motion
which created all the problem dealt with the duration and, apparently,
we're not able to deal with the duration of a rental.
MR. KLATZKOW: That's right.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: So we would want to unwind
that motion and then deal with the code.
MR. KLATZKOW: Well, when you're talking about the code,
the problem we're creating is uncertainty in the market, because as
long as we say these things are unlawful, there's uncertainty in the
market now, all right. If you're talking about as far as going after
other code violations, such as noise, for example, clearly we can do
that.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: That's what I'm talking about.
MR. KLATZKOW: And we can always do that.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: That's what I'm talking about.
Let's unwind of issue of whether the short-term rental is legal or not.
Just unwind that motion. Not taking a position one way or the other
on that, but just unwind that motion, and then direct staff to utilize
Code Enforcement for any type of violation that occurs on these daily
and weekly rentals, again, being driven by complaints. And while
that's occurring, have staff come back to us with ordinances where
we can kind of crack down on problems that are being created in the
neighborhoods. Not dealing with the duration.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Right. Non-duration violations:
Noise, parking, anything else.
MR. KLATZKOW: So in other words, a code complaint based
solely on the rental, staff would not prosecute?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: That's correct. Based solely
on the duration.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Could I just make a suggestion?
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And maybe the way to frame it is that we entertain a motion to direct
staff to return to the practice prior to Commissioner Saunders'
motion, whatever that -- whatever that was, and that we're directing
staff then to also look at the most egregious violators of the other
parts of our code: Noise, parking. Can we do that? Is that clear
enough?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: And I would ask a question
while we're dealing with that issue. Do we have any current
regulations dealing with the number of people that can be in a home,
in a rental home, and do we have any regulations dealing with the
number of unrelated people that can be in a home?
MR. KLATZKOW: We do not. In this instance we're going to
have to cobble whatever regulation we have so that it's consistent
with state law on this. And I'm going to tell you, it's going to be a lot
of people in a house.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: And one other thing -- and while
we've fixed this -- figure out what the motion needs to be -- and I
would ask staff if somebody could help me. There was a reference to
fire codes. Somebody -- and I don't know if that's accurate or not, but
there was a reference to fire codes --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Here in front of you.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: -- relating somehow to what a
commercial use is or not. But, anyway, I didn't know if there was
anything there.
So I would make a motion, as I said before, that we reverse the
direction that was made in the motion that was approved that
Commissioner Saunders made and direct staff to go back to the
policy that we had before that and also that we direct the staff to look
at other codes that we can use to enforce, you know, our other codes.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Can I make a suggestion,
Commissioner Solis? Let's take the motions or the actions one --
May 28, 2019
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COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Okay.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: -- at a time as opposed -- and I
think -- I don't know if there's consensus or not, there is with me, to
rescind the prior motion that started this.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: And what was the prior motion?
Could you say it?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I think the prior motion that I
made was for staff to -- if there was a complaint about a short-term
rental for, like, one-day or one-week rental, for Code Enforcement to
basically give a notice of violation that that rental was not lawful.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: We are going to rescind that
and deal only with code, and I'll second that motion if there's a
motion.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: That's -- I'll separate the motion into
two. So that's my first motion.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I'll second that.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: And then we go back to -- do you
know what we go back to then?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yes.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: We go back to where we were
before --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Which is?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: -- but my next motion will address
that, because we have to have a way of having someone help us come
up with what we can do that's not going to ruin our real estate
industry.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: And ruin our real estate industry or
ruin our -- what is our -- see, that's kind of nebulous again with me,
real estate people here say their industry says they want short -term
rentals.
May 28, 2019
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COMMISSIONER SOLIS: If the people that come here every
year on a short-term rental for the season, for four months, which
now wouldn't be allowed, stop doing that, I'm going to suggest that
we're going to have a real problem in our real estate market.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yeah, that's what I wanted to hear,
because if you were saying it depends on --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Anything under six months, right?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: All right. The motion's been made
and seconded that we rescind Commissioner Saunders' prior motion
to enforce the code and penalize those most egregious offenders --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Dealing with the duration.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: -- dealing with the duration.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Duration.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Dealing with the duration.
You okay with that?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: This motion does not address
anything about security.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Right.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: This doesn't address anything
about privacy for the people next door.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: We're getting ready to go there.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: That's next.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: We're getting ready to go there.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: So what are you going to do?
You're going to say anybody who rents on a daily basis on Airbnb
has to be screened because we have to know they're not pedophiles or
they're not going to do drugs in the house? This has -- this will not
address the issue of having strangers next to you on a daily basis. I
just want to put that on the record.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Well, I understood that when we
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eliminated what the other -- tell me what you had said. When we
eliminated Burt Saunders' motion, we get back to what?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Where we were before.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Which was?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Which was we enforce what we can
in terms of codes, parking, noise.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Occupancy.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Where we were before we
entertained that first motion. And that's just the first part of the
motion, because my motion had a couple parts, but --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I asked him to split it up.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: -- the Chairman was correct, I
think.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: So people could rent it out every
day or --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Yes.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: -- so forth; is that where we're
going back to?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: That's exactly right.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: That's what you're trying to say. I
didn't hear that part, because I didn't even think we could rent places
out.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: We're not -- we can't, but we
haven't been enforcing it.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: And so we're going back to not
enforcing what we have right now on the LDC. Capitulating.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I guess it depends on what kind of
a motion you're going to make afterwards.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I agree, but we've got one at a time.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yeah, but right now we have the
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bird in the hand.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: There will be subsequent
motions made, and I think Commissioner Solis will be making those
but, if not, there will be some additional motions being made.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Or I will, either one. He's doing a
good job so far. This rights the ship and, I think, heads us down a
path where we can go.
So it's been moved and seconded that we repeal the
Commissioner Saunders' motion from back in March, correct?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Correct.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. All in favor?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Opposed?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Opposed.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: 3-2.
Next motion? Hurry.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I would make a motion -- as long as
the County Attorney does not have any heartburn, I would make a
motion that we direct staff to enforce vigorously the ot her code
provisions such as our noise ordinance, parking ordinances, the codes
of that nature in relation to rentals that are less than six months.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: You can't do anything with the
term.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Right.
MR. KLATZKOW: You're going to be getting complaints on
noise whether the complaint is from a short-term rental or a drunken
neighbor.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Okay.
May 28, 2019
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MR. KLATZKOW: I mean --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Just that we vigorously pursue
the -- our other code --
MR. KLATZKOW: I think staff understands where the Board
wants to go on this.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Well, that's my motion then.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I'll second that. And I have a
question for our County --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And then Commissioner Taylor's
been lit up here for a minute, or is that from before?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: No, that's quite all right.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Are you done?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Yes, I'm done.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Now, if there's a short -- if
there's a rental and there's a noise violation or parking violation, I
want to make sure that the violator is both the tenant that's in there,
and that tenant's not going to care about the violation, but the
violation also goes to the property owner, but also goes -- once there's
a fine assessed, that that lien is on all the properties owned by that
particular property owner.
MR. KLATZKOW: Yes.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: That's what the state statute
says. I just want to make sure that we're not only going after the
actual violator but the property owner.
MR. KLATZKOW: Yes.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Can I interrupt a second during the
middle of your motion? Because one of the things I'd like to see us
do is create -- it's been recommended -- almost everyone that talked
about it -- I'm sorry?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: That was going to be the third one.
May 28, 2019
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Go ahead.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Well, I mean --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Create the task force.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yeah, because, necessarily, we
really don't need to give direction to staff to enforce against the
ordinances that we already have with regard to noise and parking and
everything else. They're doing that.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I think they understand that
this is an urgent problem.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: So --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Now, just to make sure I
understand. So this motion now means that anything -- people can
rent from six months to a year to two years or whatever but not less
than six months right? And, of course, we're vigorously going to
protect, well, all code enforcement laws.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Right.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay. Just so I make sure.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: So your motion is to -- and just -- as
far as that goes, as far as the existing ordinance we have, I mean, a
really easy thing for enforcement is the signage aspect. You
mentioned that back in March --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Yeah, signage.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: -- that people were waving a flag at
us about daily rental and having signs in front of short-term rentals.
That's an easy code enforcement, click, so...
MR. OCHS: Excuse me. So you want us to enforce the sign
ordinance?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yes.
MR. OCHS: Okay.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: That's incredible. Isn't that an
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incredible question to ask? No, that's not a criticism to you, sir.
That's how absurd this whole thing is becoming.
MR. OCHS: I mean, if you drive down the road and you see a
sign advertising daily rentals --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: That's a violation.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: It's a code violation.
MR. OCHS: Okay. Okay. Thank you for the clarification.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Now, just before we vote
anymore -- but that doesn't include, like, people who wanted to rent
for one month or three months, seasonal rentals, right?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: No. We're going to get there in a
second.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Well, that's what I was wanting to
know.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: We can't -- we are preempted from
melding with the term. We are not preempted from regulating the
industry. We are not preempted from enhancing penalties against the
frequent flagrant fliers.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: His motion. I was just asking
about his motion.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Right?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: The motion right now is just to
direct staff to vigorously pursue enforcement of our other codes:
Noise, parking, the sign ordinance.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: To give them some guidance that
this is really important.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Is there a second? If not, I'll
second that.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yes, it's been seconded.
May 28, 2019
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COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: It's an easy vote. Why don't
we just call the question on that.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I'm ready. It's been moved and
seconded that we vigorously enforce against the ordinance as with
regard to our codes, correct? Is that what I said, or is that what you
said?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Yes.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Close.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Close enough.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Any other discussion?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: All in favor?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Opposed same sign, same sound.
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Now your third motion.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: A third motion I would make is
that -- if we have to bring back an ordinance or a resolution to create
a task force made up of a representative group of county residents to
look at what we can do in detail and what other counties have done in
similar situations to address the problems on both sides of this issue.
MR. KLATZKOW: So you want to regulate the industry?
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Correct.
MR. KLATZKOW: So you're -- you're looking for an ad hoc
committee appointed by the Board who would come back to the
Board with recommendations to regulate the short-term rental
business?
May 28, 2019
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CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Correct.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I wouldn't -- I don't know that --
regulation of the industry would be the right term. I would say it's an
ad hoc committee that would come back with recommendations as to
Land Development Code revisions.
MR. KLATZKOW: As an example, if you're going to be doing
a rental less than six months, you have to have a fire extinguisher.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Things like that, okay.
MR. KLATZKOW: So it's a regulatory ordinance --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Okay. Fair enough.
MR. KLATZKOW: -- on the industry.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Enhanced penalties.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: But this would not
necessarily have to go into the Land Development Code.
MR. KLATZKOW: No, it would not be Land Development
Code.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: But in terms of coming up
with a regulatory scheme for -- and it would not have to -- it can't
deal just with short-term rentals. It has --
MR. KLATZKOW: You're going to be -- I'm going to tell you
right now, you're going to be following what the -- the same rules the
hotels have are now going to be with these short-term rentals.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Potentially, but i t would be
all rentals. We can't discriminate. We can't say it's going to apply
only to short-term rentals.
MR. KLATZKOW: Well, no, you can because you say
short-term -- basically you're saying all short-term rentals, and you'll
define it, will have to follow these minimum safety guidelines, and
they're going to essentially follow the same guidelines as hotels and
motels do.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Well, not necessarily. It's whatever
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the committee's going to recommend.
MR. KLATZKOW: You're sort of preempted on this one to a
degree.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: In what sense?
MR. KLATZKOW: You can't have -- you can't have more than
what the hotel industry is regulated on.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: No, but we could have less.
MR. KLATZKOW: Yes.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: And, Commissioner Solis, I
like -- I support coming back with some regulation and trying to
determine what those religions should be, but I don't want to be
sitting here for six months doing that.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Oh, I agree.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: And creating a task force
certainly is -- has been recommended and, you know, setting that up
and having the task force come back, it could take a long time to do
that. And I'd like to -- I'd like to -- I don't have a problem setting up a
task force and having them do their business, but I'd like to see staff
coming back to us with some recommendations. A lot of
communities are regulating these. We would not be the only one, so
there's plenty of ordinances out there that meet state standards, and
I'd like to start taking a look at those.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Well, then we can do it -- a
two-step process. We'd have staff come back even though I think
they've done that already.
MR. KLATZKOW: Staff's largely doing that now. They're
going to get back to you next meeting.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Good.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Okay. Well, let's -- I'll back up.
Let me amend my motion then.
It will be to give staff some direction to come back to us with
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whatever the analysis they've performed in terms of looking at these
other ordinances from other counties to see what we can do in
relation to the short-term rental industry.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Good. I'll second that.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I also want to make sure that
somehow somebody helps to -- when they start advertising for
people, we don't want to overload this committee on somebody who
has a financial interest or --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: We're not going to have a
committee yet. That was the whole -- I changed it. We're going to
take a step back, and staff is going to bring forward their research
first --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: -- and then we'll decide whether or
not we need a committee.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Oh, okay.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Okay. Oh, no.
MR. OCHS: We're good.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: You're good?
MR. OCHS: Oh, yeah.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Okay. So that's my motion, and
please don't ask me to repeat it.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I think Commissioner Taylor
seconded it already.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: I did.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. And we're going -- and
staff's going to come back to us when?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Next meeting.
MR. KLATZKOW: You can do it next meeting or -- we've
done the research. It's already done. If you want two meetings, we
can do two meetings; two meetings.
May 28, 2019
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COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Next meeting.
MR. CASALANGUIDA: I think we want to reach out to the
industry and some of the people we spoke to as part of that. That
would help.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Please.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Second meeting in June.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Second meeting in June.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: June is next week.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: I understand. Our second meeting
in June.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: 25th.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Is it June 25th?
MR. OCHS: Yes.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay. So they'll come back to us
on the June 25th meeting with the recommendations; is that your
motion?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: That's my motion, sir.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And it's been seconded. Any
further discussion?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: All in favor?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Opposed same sign, same sound.
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: So moved.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Could I ask a -- I hate to
prolong things, but let me just ask the County Attorney a quick
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question, if I might.
There's a new state law that basically provides that if the county
adopts an ordinance in an area that's been preempted, then we would
have to pay attorney's fees to a party that contested that. That goes
into effect, I think, July 1st.
If we -- and this is -- maybe I should just ask you off-line here
instead of wasting everybody's time. But I was just curious as to how
that type of an ordinance -- statute might apply to anything that we're
doing.
MR. KLATZKOW: We're not going to bring back an ordinance
that's unlawful.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Okay.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right. You know, there again, I
think it's important that we put forth that there are -- there are
property rights that are here both from the landlords' standpoint and
from the neighbors' standpoint. I've said it on a regular basis that you
should and do have the right to do within the four bounds of your
property that which you choose as long as it doesn't negatively
impact my rights of quiet enjoyment being next door. And that's
what I've heard from the majority of the people that are here and were
looking for a solution to get to that particular point. So it's a basic
property-rights discussion.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: It is.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And we are handcuffed. This
board, this county, our county's been -- we are handcuffed by that
preemptive statute that came out in '14 that doesn't -- because I
think -- well, I'm hearing that, you know, if we could come up with
some sort of a term to allow for the definition or redefinition of a
short-term rental, we could come to a consensus and get there, but we
can't at this juncture.
MR. KLATZKOW: You can't. You can't regulate the -- you're
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frozen in time. There was legislation that was introduced in
Tallahassee that would have given you that opportunity to do it. It
did not pass.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: This year.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: This year.
MR. KLATZKOW: This year.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: So we'll see you all on the 25th
again.
MR. OCHS: Yes, sir.
Item #15
STAFF AND COMMISSION GENERAL COMMUNICATIONS
MR. OCHS: That takes us to Item 15, staff and commission
general communications. Let me make sure I've got nothing else.
Mr. Chairman, I have three quick things. The first is a reminder
that next Tuesday, June the 4th at 9 a.m., is your BCC county
facilities master plan workshop. Look forward to that at 9 a.m.
Second thing is to advise the Board that we have gone ahead
and, as directed, made the formal offer for purchase of Station 40 to
the North Collier Fire Control District. We've received
acknowledgment of our offer letter from them and that they'll be
taking that up at their June 20th fire commission meeting. So we'll
keep the Board advised.
And the last thing is I received an email request from
Commissioner Taylor for a presentation from Dr. Savarese and
Dr. Sheng on June 25th. My only clarification that I need,
Commissioner, is you had asked to reserve about 30 minutes for that
presentation. We usually try to limit those to a little less time than
May 28, 2019
Page 267
that, but if everyone's comfortable with that, we'll tell them 30
minutes.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: It may not go that long, but I
think it's very important because there will be a demonstration.
Dr. Sheng will be at the University of Florida, but there will be a
demonstration, a visual demonstration of how this program works.
So it may not go that long at all.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And I think as long as you don't
jam in two presentations, just keep it to that one. You know,
oftentimes we run into multiple presentations and so --
MR. OCHS: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I had a presentation, too, same,
with the 25th of July -- or 25th of June.
MR. OCHS: That's -- the 25th of June is that one, yes, ma'am.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: That was the one from the
pickleball that I sent to you from --
MR. OCHS: I know. You sent me that one as well.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay. They're just talking about --
not two presentations, but --
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Right. Well, that one there's --
well, I didn't realize you had one in there. This was --
MR. OCHS: The pickleball is not 30 minutes.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: No, no, not at all.
MR. OCHS: It's more your typical 10-minute; more of a back
brief on the tournament and how things went.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Is it imperative that we have it on
that day or could we do it in our --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: They're flying in for that day.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Oh, they are? So we're going to get
to do both.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Wrap-up.
May 28, 2019
Page 268
COMMISSIONER FIALA: A wrap-up, that's right. That's what
it is.
MR. OCHS: That's all I had, sir.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: County Attorney.
MR. KLATZKOW: Nothing, sir.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Madam Clerk.
CLERK KINZEL No, thank you; nothing.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Solis.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Nothing from me. I think I've said
enough today.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Yes.
How about Commissioner Fiala?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I think I'll say the same thing.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Nothing, sir.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And, Commissioner Taylor.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Yes, just one thing.
The difference in agreement between the property owners that
own the tip of the Triangle and the Triangle is heading in a direction
that I think it would be very helpful if the Commission could clarify
it.
And I know that the Hearing Examiner has started a process, but
I don't think he's written his report yet. And I think that it would be
beneficial to all the parties if we hear it rather than wait for the
Hearing Examiner's report and allow an open and, you know,
deliberative investigation and, certainly of us, by what is presented to
us.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Like, in the first meeting in June or
something? That's going to be up to our County Manager.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Well -- and my only -- and I don't
disagree. Transparency's the key to success, but we have a process,
May 28, 2019
Page 269
and I'm leery of deviating from the process because of a difference in
opinion of two private property owners.
MR. KLATZKOW: The Board originally remanded this to the
Hearing Examiner. You could have heard it originally. What you
would be doing is simply taking it back.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Okay.
MR. KLATZKOW: So there's no process issue.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Say that again.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: But we're not going to take it
back and hear it in June.
MR. KLATZKOW: I think that's precisely what Commissioner
Taylor's suggesting.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I don't understand. You better tell
me, because I don't understand very clearly.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Well, apparently -- and I didn't
remember that, but we were going to -- there's a difference of issues
in terms of a zoning issue between the two properties and, initially,
we were going to hear it, and then we remanded it to the Hearing
Examiner, but being of the -- you know, the commissioner of the
district and fairly close to this, I'm not very comfortable where it's
going, and I think it needs to come back to us to be heard before the
Hearing Examiner issues his opinion. Not that he hasn't heard -- he
has heard testimony, but I think it's -- the timing is, I think, important.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: In other words, what you're
saying -- let me just make sure I understand. What you're saying is
we're going to discuss where it is now and what their plans are; is
that --
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: And basically rule as -- would it
be quasi-judicial?
MR. KLATZKOW: This was a staff interpretation of floor area
ratio, Board -- it was administratively appealed to the Board of
May 28, 2019
Page 270
Zoning Appeals. You decided to send it to the Hearing Examiner to
hear it instead, so you're taking it back. So the issue was an
interpretation issue.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: So it's not quasi-judicial.
MR. KLATZKOW: It's not quasi-judicial.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: So it's an interpretation.
MR. KLATZKOW: Interpretation of the Land Development
Code. What's the floor area ratio for this particular parc el?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yeah. I remember when they came
in for that and they wanted to change it, and -- but they contacted us,
kind of, and wanted to change it, and then we weren't -- then it didn't
go there.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: I think at that point we
remanded it to the Hearing Examiner. You have a better memory
than I do.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yeah. And so now it's -- instead of
going to the Hearing Examiner, they want to bring it to us?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: I want them to bring it.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Oh, you wanted to.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Yeah, I want it before us.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay. Oh, okay. I just had to
understand what we were talking about.
MR. KLATZKOW: So you're going to hear it. You will hear
and make the final decisions rather than the Hearing Examiner.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: It's kind of an all-or-nothing issue.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I haven't spoken to the person, so...
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: We'd end up hearing it anyway
because it's an all-or-nothing issue, and so one or the other's going to
appeal whatever the Hearing Examiner does, so...
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: Well, that's true, too.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Yeah. I mean, we'd hear it anyway,
May 28, 2019
Page 271
so I would be in favor of that.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: We'll get it done early.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Yeah.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: And proposition of time?
MR. OCHS: June 25th, I believe.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: The same day as we're having the
other presentations.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: So two days. We might as well
plan for a two-day meeting or dinner.
MR. OCHS: You're down to three meetings before the --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: That's right. Three meetings left.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: It's the old days. It's the old
days.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: We could always have more.
MR. OCHS: Oh, yeah, you can.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: We can do them by telephone.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Sure. We'd let you call in.
Commissioner Taylor, do you have anything else?
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR: That's all I have to say.
CHAIRMAN McDANIEL: Words of wisdom.
Okay. That's all you have to say, and that's all I have to say as
well.
So, see you all in June.
*****
**** Commissioner Fiala moved, seconded by Commissioner
Saunders and carried that the following items under the Consent and
Summary Agendas be approved and/or adopted (Commissioner
Taylor voted in opposition on Item #16K6) ****
May 28, 2019
Page 272
Item #16A1
RECOGNIZE AND APPROPRIATE REVENUE TO THE
TRAFFIC OPERATIONS COST CENTER, IN THE AMOUNT OF
$107,380 FOR FISCAL YEAR 2019 AND AUTHORIZE ALL
NECESSARY BUDGET AMENDMENTS (ALL DISTRICTS) –
FOR THE REPLACEMENT, REPAIR, AND MAINTENANCE OF
THE COUNTY OWNED TRAFFIC SIGNALS, SIGNS, AND
STREET LIGHTS
Item #16A2
RECOGNIZE AND APPROPRIATE INSURANCE PROCEEDS
REVENUE TO THE LANDSCAPE OPERATIONS-VARIOUS IN-
HOUSE SEGMENTS COST CENTER (163801), IN THE
AMOUNT OF $81,000 FOR FISCAL YEAR 2019 AND
AUTHORIZE ALL NECESSARY BUDGET AMENDMENTS
(ALL DISTRICTS) - FOR THE REPLACEMENT, REPAIR, AND
MAINTENANCE OF THE COUNTY OWNED LANDSCAPE AND
IRRIGATION
Item #16A3
ACCEPT THE FINDINGS OF THE "TRAFFIC REPORT: GOLF
CART TRANSPORTATION ON CHOKOLOSKEE AND
PLANTATION ISLAND" AND TO DIRECT THE COUNTY
ATTORNEY TO ADVERTISE FOR A PUBLIC HEARING AN
ORDINANCE ALLOWING FOR THE USE OF GOLF CARTS
UPON DESIGNATED PUBLIC ROADS AND STREETS ON
CHOKOLOSKEE ISLAND AND ON PLANTATION ISLAND,
May 28, 2019
Page 273
COLLIER COUNTY (DISTRICT 5)
Item #16A4
A WAIVER IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE GUIDELINES SET
FORTH IN THE ADVANCE STREET NAME GUIDELINES
POLICY AND RESOLUTION NO. 2012-114 FOR THE
PLACEMENT OF ADVANCE STREET NAME GUIDE SIGNS
ALONG COLLIER BOULEVARD AT THE APPROACHES TO
CEDAR HAMMOCK BOULEVARD (DISTRICT 3)
Item #16A5
CHANGE ORDER NO. 1 WITH JACOBS ENGINEERING
GROUP, INC., (FORMERLY CH2M HILL ENGINEERS, INC.),
TO ADD 730 DAYS TO THE PROJECT SCHEDULE FOR
DESIGN AND POST-DESIGN SERVICES ON PROJECT NO.
66066.14, “PALM RIVER BOULEVARD BRIDGE
REPLACEMENT” (NO ADDITIONAL FUNDS ARE
REQUESTED) (DISTRICT 2) – REVISING THE PROJECT END
DATE TO MAY 28, 2021
Item #16A6
ACCEPT A MULTI-WAY STOP WARRANT STUDY AND
APPROVE THE INSTALLATION AND OPERATION OF A 4-
WAY STOP CONTROL AT THE INTERSECTION OF LELY
RESORT BOULEVARD AND WILDFLOWER WAY, AT AN
INSTALLATION COST OF APPROXIMATELY $400 WITH AN
ANNUAL MAINTENANCE COST OF APPROXIMATELY $100
(COST CENTER #16360) (DISTRICT 1) – LELY CDD MAY
May 28, 2019
Page 274
MAKE CHANGES TO THE SIGNAGE POSTS TO DECORATIVE
POSTS; THEY WILL AT THAT TIME BECOME RESPONSIBLE
FOR ALL FUTURE MAINTENANCE
Item #16A7
FINAL ACCEPTANCE AND THE CONVEYANCE OF THE
POTABLE WATER AND SEWER UTILITY FACILITIES FOR
CORAL HARBOR PHASE I, PL20170000368 AND TO
AUTHORIZE THE COUNTY MANAGER, OR HIS DESIGNEE,
TO RELEASE THE FINAL OBLIGATION BOND IN THE TOTAL
AMOUNT OF $4,000 TO THE PROJECT ENGINEER OR THE
DEVELOPER’S DESIGNATED AGENT (DISTRICT 1) – THE
FACILITIES WERE FOUND SATISFACTORY AND
ACCEPTABLE BY STAFF ON APRIL 11, 2019
Item #16A8
FINAL ACCEPTANCE AND THE CONVEYANCE OF THE
POTABLE WATER AND SEWER UTILITY FACILITIES FOR
CORAL HARBOR PHASE II, PL20170000914 AND TO
AUTHORIZE THE COUNTY MANAGER, OR HIS DESIGNEE,
TO RELEASE THE FINAL OBLIGATION BOND IN THE TOTAL
AMOUNT OF $4,000 TO THE PROJECT ENGINEER OR THE
DEVELOPER’S DESIGNATED AGENT (DISTRICT 1) – THE
FACILITIES WERE FOUND SATISFACTORY AND
ACCEPTABLE BY STAFF ON APRIL 11, 2019
Item #16A9
FINAL ACCEPTANCE OF THE SEWER FACILITIES FOR
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Page 275
WASTE MANAGEMENT TRANSFER STATION,
PL20180000285, ACCEPT THE CONVEYANCE OF A PORTION
OF THE SEWER FACILITIES, AND TO AUTHORIZE THE
COUNTY MANAGER, OR HIS DESIGNEE, TO RELEASE THE
UTILITIES PERFORMANCE SECURITY (UPS) AND FINAL
OBLIGATION BOND IN THE TOTAL AMOUNT OF $6,839.44
TO THE PROJECT ENGINEER OR THE DEVELOPER’S
DESIGNATED AGENT (DISTRICT 4) – THE FACILITIES WERE
FOUND SATISFACTORY AND ACCEPTABLE BY STAFF ON
APRIL 9, 2019
Item #16A10
FINAL ACCEPTANCE OF THE POTABLE WATER AND
SEWER FACILITIES FOR AVALON OF NAPLES,
PL20160002356, ACCEPT THE CONVEYANCE OF A PORTION
OF THE POTABLE WATER AND ALL OF THE SEWER
FACILITIES, AND TO AUTHORIZE THE COUNTY MANAGER,
OR HIS DESIGNEE, TO RELEASE THE UTILITIES
PERFORMANCE SECURITY (UPS) AND FINAL OBLIGATION
BOND IN THE TOTAL AMOUNT OF $75,061.39 TO THE
PROJECT ENGINEER OR THE DEVELOPER’S DESIGNATED
AGENT (DISTRICT 3) – THE FACILITIES WERE FOUND
SATISFACTORY AND ACCEPTABLE BY STAFF ON APRIL 19,
2019
Item #16A11
FINAL ACCEPTANCE OF THE POTABLE WATER AND
SEWER FACILITIES FOR TRACT B AT 3500 CORPORATE
PLAZA, PL20170003496, ACCEPT THE CONVEYANCE OF A
May 28, 2019
Page 276
PORTION OF THE POTABLE WATER FACILITIES, AND TO
AUTHORIZE THE COUNTY MANAGER, OR HIS DESIGNEE,
TO RELEASE THE UTILITIES PERFORMANCE SECURITY
(UPS) AND FINAL OBLIGATION BOND IN THE TOTAL
AMOUNT OF $8,837.94 TO THE PROJECT ENGINEER OR THE
DEVELOPER’S DESIGNATED AGENT (DISTRICT 4) – THE
FACILITIES WERE FOUND SATISFACTORY AND
ACCEPTABLE BY STAFF ON APRIL 11, 2019
Item #16A12
RECORD THE FINAL PLAT OF BRENTWOOD LAKES –
PHASE ONE, (APPLICATION NUMBER PL20180001880)
APPROVAL OF THE STANDARD FORM CONSTRUCTION
AND MAINTENANCE AGREEMENT AND APPROVAL OF THE
AMOUNT OF THE PERFORMANCE SECURITY (DISTRICT 5) –
W/STIPULATIONS
Item #16A13
SECOND AMENDMENT TO THE MPO LEASE AGREEMENT
AND THE AMENDED AND RESTATED STAFF SERVICES
AGREEMENT BETWEEN COLLIER METROPOLITAN
PLANNING ORGANIZATION AND THE COLLIER COUNTY
BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS (ALL DISTRICTS) –
EXTENDING THE TERMINATION DATE TO JUNE 30, 2022
Item #16A14
PROCEEDING WITH THE FINAL WORK NECESSARY FOR
COMPLETION OF THE VANDERBILT DRIVE STORMWATER
May 28, 2019
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MANAGEMENT OUTFALL RECOVERY PROJECT,
AUTHORIZE A BUDGET AMENDMENT IN THE AMOUNT OF
$150,000 TO COVER THE COST OF PROJECT DESIGN AND
PERMITTING AND DIRECT EVALUATION OF INLAND TIDAL
WATERWAY SHOALING EFFECTS ON STORMWATER
RUNOFF CONVEYANCE (DISTRICT 2) – AS DETAILED IN
THE EXECUTIVE SUMMARY
Item #16B1
RESOLUTION 2019-88: THREE PARTY ESCROW
AGREEMENT, LOCALLY FUNDED AGREEMENT, AND
TRANSPORTATION POST PROJECT AGREEMENT BETWEEN
THE FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION AND
COLLIER COUNTY FOR THE INSTALLATION AND
MAINTENANCE OF HOLIDAY ATTACHMENTS ON LIGHT
POLES WITHIN THE IMMOKALEE COMMUNITY
REDEVELOPMENT AREA IN IMMOKALEE, FLORIDA
(DISTRICT 5)
Item #16C1
AWARD TWO (2) AGREEMENTS FOR INVITATION TO BID
NO. 18-7479, “LIFT STATION PREVENTATIVE
MAINTENANCE AND REPAIRS,” TO FLORIDA UTILITY
SOLUTIONS, INC., AS PRIMARY CONTRACTOR, AND
ADVANCED LIFT STATION SERVICES, INC., AS
SECONDARY CONTRACTOR, FOR COUNTY-OWNED LIFT
STATION PREVENTATIVE MAINTENANCE AND REPAIR
SERVICES (ALL DISTRICTS)
May 28, 2019
Page 278
Item #16C2
AWARD REQUEST FOR PROPOSAL #18-7424, “HAZARDOUS
MATERIALS MANAGEMENT,” TO US ECOLOGY TAMPA,
INC. (ALL DISTRICTS) – FOR THE COLLECTION,
IDENTIFICATION, PACKAGING, SHIPPING,
TRANSPORTATION AND PROPER DISPOSAL OF ALL
HAZARDOUS MATERIALS THROUGHOUT THE COUNTY
Item #16C3
RELEASE GOLDEN GATE ESTATES LAND TRUST
PROPERTIES FROM THE FUTURE SALEABLE LIST TO THE
ACTIVE SALE LIST, TO RESERVE CERTAIN PROPERTIES
FOR GOVERNMENTAL AGENCIES, AND TO REQUIRE 100%
OF APPRAISED VALUE FOR THE SALE OF PROPERTIES
(DISTRICT 5)
Item #16C4
AN AGREEMENT FOR INVITATION TO BID NO. 19- 7574,
“NORTHEAST SERVICE AREA (NESA) BOOSTER PUMP
MODIFICATION AT ORANGE TREE,” PROJECT NUMBER
70179, TO HASKINS, INC., IN THE AMOUNT OF $127,550, AND
AUTHORIZE THE NECESSARY BUDGET AMENDMENT
(DISTRICT 5) – STAYING IN DEMAND, IN COMPLIANCE,
AND SERVE CUSTOMERS EFFICIENTLY
Item #16C5
A PURCHASE ORDER WITH TRADEWINDS POWER
May 28, 2019
Page 279
CORPORATION FOR 16 PORTABLE GENERATORS IN THE
AMOUNT OF $941,318 UNDER THE FLORIDA SHERIFFS
ASSOCIATION COOPERATIVE PURCHASING PROGRAM
CONTRACT # FSA18-VEH16.0 AS VALIDATED BY THE
INFRASTRUCTURE SURTAX CITIZEN OVERSIGHT
COMMITTEE, PROJECT NUMBER 50391, AND AUTHORIZE
THE NECESSARY BUDGET AMENDMENT (DISTRICT 1,
DISTRICT 4) – THESE GENERATORS WILL BE USED AS
PUMP STATION EMERGENCY BACK-UP SYSTEMS
Item #16C6
AMEND EXISTING CONTRACT WITH ANGIE BREWER &
ASSOCIATES, LC UNDER BID #12-5839, “LOAN/GRANT
ACQUISITION AND COMPLIANCE SERVICES,” FOR AN
ADDITIONAL RENEWAL PERIOD OF ONE (1) YEAR, OR
UNTIL A NEW CONTRACT IS AWARDED, WHICHEVER IS
SOONER (ALL DISTRICTS) – EXTENDING THE CONTRACT
TO JUNE 21, 2020
Item #16D1
SIGN ONE MORTGAGE SATISFACTION FOR THE STATE
HOUSING INITIATIVES PARTNERSHIP LOAN PROGRAM IN
THE AMOUNT OF $2,500 (DISTRICT 5) – LOCATED AT 614
10TH STREET NORTH, IMMOKALEE
Item #16D2
STATE HOUSING INITIATIVES PARTNERSHIP PROGRAM
IMPACT FEE RELEASE OF LIEN IN THE AMOUNT OF
May 28, 2019
Page 280
$3,929.52 FOR THE ASSOCIATED OWNER-OCCUPIED
AFFORDABLE HOUSING DWELLING UNIT WHERE THE
OBLIGATION HAS BEEN REPAID IN FULL (DISTRICT 5) –
LOCATED AT 614 10TH STREET NORTH, IMMOKALEE
Item #16D3
AN “AFTER-THE-FACT” THIRD AMENDMENT AND
ATTESTATION STATEMENT WITH THE AREA AGENCY ON
AGING FOR SOUTHWEST FLORIDA, INC., HOME CARE FOR
THE ELDERLY GRANT PROGRAM FOR THE COLLIER
COUNTY SERVICES FOR SENIORS AND TO INCREASE
FUNDING IN THE AMOUNT OF $4,630 (ALL DISTRICTS)
Item #16D4
AN “AFTER-THE-FACT” SECOND AMENDMENT AND
ATTESTATION STATEMENT WITH THE AREA AGENCY ON
AGING FOR SOUTHWEST FLORIDA, INC., TO TRANSFER
FUNDS BETWEEN THE OLDER AMERICAN ACT PROGRAM
TITLE III SERVICES (IIIE) TO TITLE III SUPPLEMENTAL
SERVICES (IIIES) (ALL DISTRICTS)
Item #16D5
THIS ITEM WAS CONTINUED FROM THE APRIL 9, 2019, BCC
MEETING. AUTHORIZE THE CHAIRMAN TO SIGN THE FIRST
AMENDMENT TO THE STATE MANDATED AGREEMENT
WITH DAVID LAWRENCE MENTAL HEALTH CENTER, INC.
(ALL DISTRICTS) – CHANGING THE DUE DATE FOR THE
SUBMISSION OF ANNUAL FINANCIAL STATEMENT AND
May 28, 2019
Page 281
AUDIT TO NINE MONTHS FOLLOWING THE END OF THE
FISCAL YEAR
Item #16D6
A MEMORANDUM OF UNDERSTANDING BETWEEN
COLLIER COUNTY, AS THE PROVIDER OF THE HOME
ENERGY ASSISTANCE PROGRAM, AND AGRICULTURAL
AND LABOR PROGRAM, INC., AS THE PROVIDER OF LOW-
INCOME HOME ENERGY ASSISTANCE PROGRAM, TO
COORDINATE REFERRALS AND PREVENT DUPLICATION
OF BENEFITS (ALL DISTRICTS) – PROVIDING EMERGENCY
HOME ENERGY ASSISTANCE TO THE ELDERLY
Item #16D7
THE ESTABLISHMENT OF CO-PAYMENT GOALS AND A
BUDGET AMENDMENT IN THE AMOUNT OF $1,392,305.98
TO ALLOW CONTINUOUS OPERATION OF THE
COMMUNITY CARE FOR THE ELDERLY, ALZHEIMER’S
DISEASE INITIATIVE, AND HOME CARE FOR THE ELDERLY
GRANTS FOR THE COLLIER COUNTY SERVICES FOR
SENIORS PROGRAM FROM THE AREA AGENCY ON AGING
FOR SOUTHWEST FLORIDA, INC., PRIOR TO THE
EXECUTION OF THE FUNDING AWARD (ALL DISTRICTS)
Item #16D8
RESOLUTION 2019-89: THE ELECTRONIC SUBMISSION OF
THE SMALL MATCHING GRANT APPLICATION TO THE
FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF STATE, DIVISION OF
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Page 282
HISTORICAL RESOURCES, HISTORIC PRESERVATION
GRANTS PROGRAM TO SECURE $48,300 IN FUNDING FOR
THE BUDD TAVERN OBSERVATION CAR LOCATED AT THE
NAPLES DEPOT MUSEUM AND APPROVE $6,000 IN
MUSEUM FUNDS FOR PROJECT TRANSPORTATION COSTS
(DISTRICT 4) – TO PROVIDE ADA ACCESSIBILITY TO
VISITORS AT THE NAPLES DEPOT
Item #16E1
RATIFY PROPERTY, CASUALTY, WORKERS’
COMPENSATION AND SUBROGATION CLAIM FILES
SETTLED AND/OR CLOSED BY THE RISK MANAGEMENT
DIVISION DIRECTOR PURSUANT TO RESOLUTION # 2004-15
FOR THE SECOND QUARTER OF FY 19 (ALL DISTRICTS)
Item #16E2
AMENDMENT # 1 TO AGREEMENT NO. 15-6409, P25 DIGITAL
RADIO SYSTEM, WITH COMMUNICATIONS
INTERNATIONAL, INC., AND AUTHORIZE THE PAYMENT
OF OUTSTANDING FY19 MAINTENANCE INVOICES IN THE
AMOUNT OF $186,300 (ALL DISTRICTS) – FOR SERVICES
BETWEEN OCTOBER 8, 2018 THROUGH MARCH 25, 2019
Item #16E3
THE ADMINISTRATIVE REPORT PREPARED BY THE
PROCUREMENT SERVICES DIVISION FOR DISPOSAL OF
PROPERTY AND NOTIFICATION OF REVENUE
DISBURSEMENT (ALL DISTRICTS) – FOR ON-LINE SALES IN
May 28, 2019
Page 283
THE AMOUNT OF $997 FOR SURPLUS EQUIPMENT AND
$28,800 FOR TRADE-IN VALUE IN DISPOSED EQUIPMENT
Item #16E4
THE ADMINISTRATIVE REPORT PREPARED BY THE
PROCUREMENT SERVICES DIVISION FOR CHANGE ORDERS
AND OTHER CONTRACTUAL MODIFICATIONS REQUIRING
BOARD APPROVAL (ALL DISTRICTS) – FOR A TOTAL OF SIX
CHANGES THAT HAVE A NET TOTAL OF $88,156.25
Item #16E5
THE SALE AND DISPOSAL OF SURPLUS ASSETS PER
RESOLUTION 2013-095 VIA PUBLIC AUCTION ON JUNE 21 &
22, 2019; APPROVE THE ADDITION OF SURPLUS ITEMS
RECEIVED SUBSEQUENT TO THE APPROVAL OF THIS
AGENDA ITEM FOR SALE IN THE AUCTION; AND
AUTHORIZE THE PROCUREMENT DIRECTOR, AS DESIGNEE
FOR COUNTY MANAGER, TO SIGN FOR THE TRANSFER OF
VEHICLE TITLES (ALL DISTRICTS)
Item #16E6
THE REPORT FOR THE SALE OF ITEMS AND
DISBURSEMENT OF FUNDS ASSOCIATED WITH THE
COUNTY SURPLUS AUCTION HELD ON APRIL 26 & 27, 2019
(ALL DISTRICTS) – TOTALING $385,710.00
Item #16F1
May 28, 2019
Page 284
A REPORT COVERING BUDGET AMENDMENTS IMPACTING
RESERVES AND MOVING FUNDS IN AN AMOUNT UP TO
AND INCLUDING $25,000 AND $50,000, RESPECTIVELY (ALL
DISTRICTS) – FOR SERVICES FOR SENIORS EXPENSES
Item #16F2
RESOLUTION 2019-90: A RESOLUTION APPROVING
AMENDMENTS (APPROPRIATING GRANTS, DONATIONS,
CONTRIBUTIONS OR INSURANCE PROCEEDS) TO THE
FISCAL YEAR 2018-19 ADOPTED BUDGET (ALL DISTRICTS)
Item #16F3
AN AGREEMENT FOR INVITATION TO BID NO. 19-7513
“PELICAN BAY TREE PRUNING,” TO SAFE AND GREEN,
INC., D/B/A MONSTER TREE SERVICE OF SOUTHWEST
FLORIDA, AND AUTHORIZE THE CHAIRMAN TO EXECUTE
THE ATTACHED AGREEMENT (DISTRICT 2)
Item #16F4
AWARD INVITATION TO BID (ITB) NO. 19-7536 FOR THE
PELICAN BAY U.S. 41 BERM LANDSCAPE RESTORATION TO
STAHLMAN-ENGLAND IRRIGATION, INC. IN THE AMOUNT
OF $477,000 AND AUTHORIZE THE CHAIRMAN TO EXECUTE
THE ATTACHED AGREEMENT (DISTRICT 2) – TO RESTORE
LANDSCAPE DAMAGED BY HURRICANE IRMA ON
PELICAN BAY U.S. 41 BERM
Item #16G1
May 28, 2019
Page 285
ACCESS AGREEMENT TO GRANT TERRACON
CONSULTANTS, INC., ACCESS TO THE IMMOKALEE
REGIONAL AIRPORT TO PERFORM A PHASE I
ENVIRONMENTAL SITE ASSESSMENT UNDER THE US
ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION AGENCY (EPA)
BROWNFIELDS ASSESSMENT GRANT PROGRAM (DISTRICT
5)
Item #16I1
MISCELLANEOUS CORRESPONDENCE (All Districts) –
BAYSHORE GATEWAY TRIANGLE CRA REPORT
Item #16J1
SERVING AS THE LOCAL COORDINATING UNIT OF
GOVERNMENT FOR THE FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF LAW
ENFORCEMENT’S FEDERAL FISCAL YEAR 2018 EDWARD
BYRNE MEMORIAL, JUSTICE ASSISTANCE GRANT (JAG)
COUNTYWIDE PROGRAM AND (1) AUTHORIZE THE
CHAIRMAN TO EXECUTE THE CERTIFICATION OF
PARTICIPATION; (2) DESIGNATE THE SHERIFF AS THE
OFFICIAL APPLICANT AND THE SHERIFF’S OFFICE STAFF
AS GRANT FINANCIAL AND PROGRAM MANAGERS; (3)
AUTHORIZE THE ACCEPTANCE OF THE GRANT IF AND
WHEN AWARDED; AND (4) APPROVE ASSOCIATED
BUDGET AMENDMENTS AND APPROVE THE COLLIER
COUNTY SHERIFF’S OFFICE TO RECEIVE AND EXPEND THE
GRANT FUNDS (ALL DISTRICTS)
May 28, 2019
Page 286
Item #16J2
THE FY 2019 SCAAP LETTER DELEGATING AUTHORITY TO
SHERIFF KEVIN RAMBOSK TO BE THE OFFICIAL GRANT
APPLICANT AND CONTACT PERSON, OR HIS DESIGNEE,
AND TO RECEIVE, EXPENDS THE PAYMENT AND MAKE
ANY NECESSARY BUDGET AMENDMENTS OF THE FY 2019
OF THE STATE CRIMINAL ALIEN ASSISTANCE PROGRAM
(SCAAP) GRANT FUNDS (ALL DISTRICTS) – FOR SALARY
EXPENSES BETWEEN JULY 1, 2017 THROUGH JUNE 30, 2018
Item #16J3
THE DESIGNATION OF THE SHERIFF AS THE OFFICIAL
APPLICANT AND POINT OF CONTACT FOR THE U.S.
DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE, COPS SCHOOL VIOLENCE
PREVENTION PROGRAM GRANT (SVPP) FY2019.
AUTHORIZE THE ACCEPTANCE OF THE GRANT WHEN
AWARDED, APPROVE ASSOCIATED BUDGET
AMENDMENTS AND APPROVE THE COLLIER COUNTY
SHERIFF’S OFFICE TO RECEIVE AND EXPEND 2019 SVPP
GRANT FUNDS (ALL DISTRICTS) – THIS GRANT HAS A 25%
CASH MATCH
Item #16J4
TO RECORD IN THE MINUTES OF THE BOARD OF COUNTY
COMMISSIONERS, THE CHECK NUMBER (OR OTHER
PAYMENT METHOD), AMOUNT, PAYEE, AND PURPOSE FOR
WHICH THE REFERENCED DISBURSEMENTS WERE DRAWN
FOR THE PERIODS BETWEEN MAY 2, 2019 AND MAY 15,
May 28, 2019
Page 287
2019 PURSUANT TO FLORIDA STATUTE 136.06 (ALL
DISTRICTS)
Item #16J5
REQUEST THAT THE BOARD APPROVE AND DETERMINE
VALID PUBLIC PURPOSE FOR INVOICES PAYABLE AND
PURCHASING CARD TRANSACTIONS AS OF MAY 22, 2019
(ALL DISTRICTS)
Item #16K1
THE ATTACHED SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT AND RELEASE
BETWEEN THE COLLIER COUNTY BOARD OF COUNTY
COMMISSIONERS AND MANHATTAN ROAD & BRIDGE,
INC., PERTAINING TO THE WHITE BOULEVARD OVER
CYPRESS CANAL BRIDGE PROJECT (PROJECT NO. 66066.10)
(ALL DISTRICTS) – ALLOWING FOR THE FINAL CLOSE OUT
OF THE PROJECT
Item #16K2
AUTHORIZE THE CHAIR TO EXECUTE A SETTLEMENT
AGREEMENT IN THE CASE STYLED MARIE MICHELLE
JEROME V. COLLIER COUNTY (CASE NO. 18-CA-2065), NOW
PENDING IN THE CIRCUIT COURT OF THE TWENTIETH
JUDICIAL CIRCUIT IN AND FOR COLLIER COUNTY, FOR
THE SUM OF $8,230.15 (ALL DISTRICTS) – DUE TO AN
INCIDENT THAT OCCURRED ON DECEMBER 6, 2016 AT THE
CAT TRANSFER STATION AT 3555 TAMIAMI TRAIL EAST
May 28, 2019
Page 288
Item #16K3
A MEDIATED SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT AND
STIPULATED FINAL JUDGMENT TO SETTLE FINAL
COMPENSATION FOR THE TAKING OF PARCEL 434RDUE, IN
THE AMOUNT OF $20,832.50, INCLUDING STATUTORY
ATTORNEY FEES AND COSTS, AND EXPERT FEES AND
COSTS, IN THE LAWSUIT STYLED COLLIER COUNTY V.
KINH THI PHAM, ET AL, CASE NO. 17-CA-1473, REQUIRED
FOR THE GOLDEN GATE BOULEVARD EXPANSION
PROJECT NO. 60145 (FISCAL IMPACT: $16,932.50) (ALL
DISTRICTS) – FOR THE GOLDEN GATE BLVD. EXPANSION
Item #16K4
A MEDIATED SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT AND
STIPULATED FINAL JUDGMENT TO SETTLE FINAL
COMPENSATION FOR THE TAKING OF PARCEL 445RDUE, IN
THE AMOUNT OF $26,551, INCLUDING STATUTORY
ATTORNEY FEES AND COSTS, AND EXPERT FEES AND
COSTS, IN THE LAWSUIT STYLED COLLIER COUNTY V.
JOHN R. BRUNNER, ET AL, CASE NO. 17-CA-1452, REQUIRED
FOR THE GOLDEN GATE BOULEVARD EXPANSION
PROJECT NO. 60145 (FISCAL IMPACT: $22,851) (ALL
DISTRICTS) – FOR THE GOLDEN GATE BLVD. EXPANSION
Item #16K5
RESOLUTION 2019-91: APPOINTING FOUR MEMBERS TO
THE COASTAL ADVISORY COMMITTEE (ALL DISTRICTS) –
APPOINTING TERRY HUTCHINSON FOR THE REMAINDER
May 28, 2019
Page 289
OF TERM WITH TERM EXPIRING ON MAY 22, 2020, AND THE
REAPPOINTMENT OF THOMAS MCCANN WITH TERM
EXPIRING ON MAY 22, 2023, BOTH AS THE CITY OF NAPLES
REPRESENTATIVES AND ALSO REAPPOINTING DAVID
TRECKER AND JIM BURKE WITH TERMS EXPIRING ON
MAY 22, 2023
Item #16K6 (Commissioner Taylor voted “no” During Agenda
Changes)
RESOLUTION 2019-92: APPOINT A MEMBER TO THE PARKS
AND RECREATION ADVISORY BOARD (ALL DISTRICTS) –
APPOINTING DAPHNIE BERCHER WITH TERM EXPIRING ON
DECEMBER 31, 2021
Item #16K7
RESOLUTION 2019-93: REAPPOINT TWO MEMBERS TO THE
FOREST LAKES ROADWAY & DRAINAGE ADVISORY
COMMITTEE (DISTRICT 4) – REAPPOINTING BARBARA
BELL AND JOHN GOODY WITH TERMS EXPIRING ON
APRIL 21, 2023
Item #16K8
RESOLUTION 2019-94: REAPPOINT A MEMBER TO THE
BAYSHORE /GATEWAY LOCAL REDEVELOPMENT
ADVISORY BOARD (DISTRICT 4) – REAPPOINTING KAREN
BEATTY WITH TERM EXPIRING ON MAY 22, 2022
Item #16K9
May 28, 2019
Page 290
WAIVE THE RESIDENCY REQUIREMENT FOR A MEMBER
OF THE IMMOKALEE BEAUTIFICATION MSTU ADVISORY
COMMITTEE (DISTRICT 5) – FOR THE REMAINDER OF HER
TERM WHICH EXPIRES ON SEPTEMBER 23, 2021
Item #16K10
AUTHORIZE THE CHAIRMAN TO EXECUTE A RETENTION
AGREEMENT FOR SPECIALIZED LEGAL SERVICES ON AN
“AS NEEDED” BASIS WITH THE LAW FIRM OF BAKER,
DONELSON, BEARMAN, CALDWELL & BERKOWITZ, P.C.
(ALL DISTRICTS)
Item #16K11
BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS DIRECTS THE
COLLIER COUNTY HEALTH FACILITIES AUTHORITY TO
DISBURSE GRANT FUNDS TO CERTAIN NONPROFIT
HEALTH SERVICE AGENCIES (ALL DISTRICTS) – TO THE
FOLLOWING AGENCIES: CHS HEALTHCARE d/b/a
HEALTHCARE NETWORK OF SOUTHWEST FLORIDA;
PHYSICIAN LED ACCESS NETWORK OF COLLIER COUNTY;
SENIOR FRIENDSHIP CENTERS’ FRIENDSHIP HEALTH
CLINIC COLLIER; AND DAVID LAWRENCE MENTAL
HEALTH CENTER, INC.
Item #17A
RESOLUTION 2019-95: A RESOLUTION APPROVING
AMENDMENTS (APPROPRIATING CARRY FORWARD,
May 28, 2019
Page 291
TRANSFERS AND SUPPLEMENTAL REVENUE) TO THE
FISCAL YEAR 2018-19 ADOPTED BUDGET (ALL DISTRICTS)
Item #17B
ORDINANCE 2019-07: AN ORDINANCE AMENDING
ORDINANCE NO. 2009-21, AS AMENDED, THE ESPLANADE
GOLF & COUNTRY CLUB OF NAPLES RESIDENTIAL
PLANNED UNIT DEVELOPMENT, AND AMENDING
ORDINANCE NO. 2004-41, THE COLLIER COUNTY LAND
DEVELOPMENT CODE, BY AMENDING THE APPROPRIATE
ZONING ATLAS MAP OR MAPS BY CHANGING THE ZONING
CLASSIFICATION OF AN ADDITIONAL 10± ACRES OF LAND
ZONED RURAL AGRICULTURAL (A) TO THE ESPLANADE
GOLF & COUNTRY CLUB OF NAPLES RESIDENTIAL
PLANNED UNIT DEVELOPMENT (RPUD); BY REDUCING
THE MAXIMUM NUMBER OF RESIDENTIAL DWELLING
UNITS FROM 1233 TO 1184 FOR THE RPUD; TO MODIFY THE
MASTER PLAN; TO REVISE THE LEGAL DESCRIPTION; TO
MODIFY DEVELOPMENT COMMITMENTS; AND BY
PROVIDING AN EFFECTIVE DATE. THE PROPERTY TO BE
ADDED TO THE PUD IS LOCATED JUST WEST OF COLLIER
BOULEVARD, APPROXIMATELY TWO-THIRDS OF A MILE
NORTH OF IMMOKALEE ROAD, IN SECTION 22, TOWNSHIP
48 SOUTH, RANGE 26 EAST, COLLIER COUNTY, FLORIDA,
WITH THE ENTIRE PUD CONSISTING OF 1,668.3± ACRES
[PL20180002020] (DISTRICT 3)
May 28, 2019
There being no further business for the good of the County, the
meeting was adjourned by order of the Chair at 6:24 p.m.
BOARD OF COUNTY COMNIISSIONERS
BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS/EX
OFFICIO GOVERNING BOARD(S) OF
SPECIAL D ` '_ TS UNDER ITS CONTROL
6e)- 4.
WILLI i,'1 L. McDANIEL, JR., CHAIRMAN
ATTEST
CRYSTAL,K. KINZEL, CLERK
bk O4LQc•
signature only:
These minutes approved by the Board on JU kg , aoL9 ,
as presented or as corrected .
TRANSCRIPT PREPARED ON BEHALF OF U.S. LEGAL
SUPPORT, INC., BY TERRI LEWIS, COURT REPORTER AND
NOTARY PUBLIC.
Page 292