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PVAC Minutes 02/09/2000 RFebruary 9, 2000 TRANSCRIPT OF THE MEETING OF THE PUBLIC VEHICLE ADVISORY COMMITTEE Naples, Florida February 9, 2000 LET IT BE REMEMBERED, that the Collier County Public Vehicle Advisory Committee, having conducted business herein, met on this date at 9:00 a.m. in REGULAR SESSION in Building "F" of the Government Complex, East Naples, Florida, with the following members present: CHAIRPERSON: Pat Baisley Cliff Flegal Bryan Pease William Csogi ALSO PRESENT: Thomas Palmer, Assistant County Attorney Bill Bolgar, Code Enforcement Director Maria Cruz, Code Enforcement Specialist Page 1 ANY pERSON W~40 DECIDES %'0 APF~ A D~-CI~TON OF THIS BOARD WILL ...... ~ ~ ~V~D~CE ~ON ~%CH THE A~L $~ iii. IV. V%I. VIII. ADDITI~ OK D~LETIQN$~ ~PFROVAL OF M/N/3TE/: 0c=ob~ 14, 1999 k. Robert Louis Scaiian ~/bfa :~=,~-~e,_ri~e~ Inc. - ~-~s ~/bla American ~agle Li~oum~ne, B. George.~S_2 ~J~.~i to operate a charte~ N/A April 4, 2000 February 9, 2000 CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: I would like to open the Collier County Public Vehicle Advisory meeting of February 9th. We do have a new board member today. He's a member of the public. His name is William -- MR. CSOGI: Csogi. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: -- Csogi. We need to take a roll call. MS. CRUZ: Good morning, for the record, Maria Cruz, code enforcement official. And we also have Mr. Bill Bolgar on behalf of code enforcement director Michelle Arnold present here. Patricia Baisley. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: Here. MS. CRUZ: Clifford Flegal. MR. FLEGAL: Here. MS. CRUZ: Tom Lugrin. Let the record show Mr. Lugrin is absent. Bryan Pease. MR. PEASE: Here. MS. CRUZ: And William Csogi. MR. CSOGI: Here. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: MS. CRUZ: Okay. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: deletions to our agenda for today's meeting? Do we have an approval of our agenda for today's meeting? MR. PEASE: I'll approve. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: Do I have a second? MR. FLEGAL: Second. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: All in favor say aye. (Aye.) CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: I'm looking for an approval of the minutes from our October 14th, 1999 meeting. MR. PEASE: I'll do that, too, since I was there. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: You're on a roll today. You were there. Well, I was there, too, so I will second that. MR. PEASE: We were the only two that were there. Mr. Lugrin has an excused absence. Do we have any additions or Page 2 February 9, 2000 CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: All in favor say aye. (Aye.) CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: Move on to new business. Robert Louis Scallan doing business as Hummeride, Inc. Is Mr. Scallan present, please? Could you come up to the podium. MR. SCALLAN: Yes. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: Could you come up to the podium and be sworn in, please? (Witness was sworn.) MR. FLEGAL: Are you ready for questions? CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: Yes. MR. FLEGAL: Tom, I guess I will ask my questions of you first. We have an application in the name of Hummeride, Inc. Such a company doesn't exist yet. MR. PALMER: Well, then the final validity of any permission that you would grant today would be -- would be subject to having the corporation exist as a formalized corporation recognized by the Department of State in Florida. MR. PEASE: There's a notation that he's looking for funding. And my question is, is there discussion needed on this item? Does he have questions of us? MR. FLEGAL: That was my first question and I have a lot of them. And that's one of them, I mean. He doesn't -- I realize he hasn't purchased the vehicle and that's fine, too, but he doesn't even have, the way his application reads, the funding to purchase a vehicle. He's trying to get somebody to put money into his business, I mean. Why do you want to approve any kind of application with forty-seven contingencies, that if you go out and do this, this, this? I mean, it's useless to have this paperwork if that's what we're going to do. MR. PEASE: Except from his perspective, which is I assume to-- MR. FLEGAL: To help him get the funding. I mean, there's so many -- he doesn't have any experience at all. I don't know yet if he has a commercial license. I haven't asked that question. His Page 3 February 9, 2000 existing company, which he says he's going to change the name of, I guess is where he's employed. I don't know. We don't have a background check yet. I'm not impressed by the application. MR. PALMER: I understand what you're saying. If, in fact, knowing that he's going to be granted permission by this board to operate in Collier County, may be some value prerequisite to getting finances and so forth. If there's nothing in there that is an uncorrectable impediment, something that in the future can't be absolved, the board can effectively say that if you do this, this and this, we see nothing that will bar you from getting a final certificate from the board for the purposes of financing. But in any event, I would recommend that even if you were going to grant permission based on subsequent conditions, that there be a specific time limit, that if these things are not accomplished say within ninety days, that the -- that the whole application lapses and you have to start over. Otherwise people go in and embank these things and we don't want to see that. But on the other hand, it would be maybe valuable to this applicant to know that yes, if he does this, this and this, he can be qualified, and we see nothing that can't be correctable such as, you know, a criminal record, it either exists or it doesn't exist and it's not correctable. But a lot of these other things would just be a matter of getting it done. But in any event, as I say, I would not grant anything out into the indefinite future, otherwise people would be putting these things in their back pocket. And you have already perceived the possible threat for abuse that exists there. MR. PEASE: Is ninety days a reasonable period? MR. PALMER: Well, we could ask the applicant. I just threw that out. It seems to me that ninety days ought to be about enough to put a taxicab company together. But that was just a number I threw out. MR. SCALLAN: That's extremely within reason. I'm working diligently to get this -- everything in line. In fact, I should hear from my lending institution today on that financing. And I kind of see your point. I didn't want to go out and buy an eighty thousand dollar vehicle and then come to the board to Page 4 February 9, 2000 have this approved and then it be rejected and I have this vehicle that I can't use. So that's kind of my angle, the reason why I'm doing it in these steps. MR. PEASE: That makes sense. We have approved them before. MR. FLEGAL: I understand that part of it, but, I mean, the part that bothers me is where he says he's going out to get funding. Most people are ready to give them the permit, they walk over to Ford or whoever, Cadillac or Lincoln and they're sitting there waiting to sign the papers. In this case it leads you to believe that he's not even that far. MR. PEASE: He's a victim of his own honesty. MR. CSOGI: You still get a letter of credit from the bank to present to the board, and he still has to obtain a letter of credit saying that he can purchase a vehicle. MR. FLEGAL: Do you have a commercial license, driver's license? MR. SCALLAN: No, I do not. This vehicle is under the six thousand pound limit that requires a chauffeur's license. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: You have a chauffeur's license? MR. SCALLAN: No, I do not. One is not necessary to operate this vehicle. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: You have to have a chauffeur's license to operate a for-hire vehicle. MR. SCALLAN: Okay. As far as securing that, that should be no problem. MR. PEASE: Will you be the driver? MR. FLEGAL: That's not what I remember. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: -- driver's license is not required -- MR. PEASE: CDL is not required, right. THE COURT REPORTER: I'm sorry, I didn't hear you. MR. PEASE: The CDL is not required. MR. FLEGAL: I guess I need Tom's guidance. Section one forty-two thirty-seven, driver standards. Each driver of a motor vehicle for hire must hold a current and valid commercial driver's license in said driver's name issued by the State of Florida or by any other state of the United States. Page 5 February 9, 2000 CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: What page is that on? MR. FLEGAL: Page eighteen. MR. PALMER: Well, I think the word -- I don't think the word commercial is the operative word. It means he's got to have the license that's required by the state law to engage in that particular activity. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: That's the way we have always understood it. MR. PALMER: Yeah, that's what it means. If he needs a chauffeur's license, then he needs a chauffeur's license. Besides that, we'd be controlling anyway. We wouldn't want to ratchet up a local regulation that requires a license that's beyond what the state requires. And I take it in this instance this vehicle requires a chauffeur's license, which means he has to get a chauffeur's license in order to operate the vehicle. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: This really should be reworded here so that it's not misleading to anybody. MR. PALMER: It really should. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: A workshop item. MR. PEASE: A workshop. MR. SCALLAN: So is that definite, chauffeur's license is absolutely required? It seems like I heard two different points. MR. PALMER: Well, the point was whether or not our ordinance required a standard that's higher than the state law. And in my opinion, we have never intended that. But if state law requires you to have a chauffeur's license, then you must go out and get a chauffeur's license before you operate this vehicle for hire. MR. SCALLAN: Right. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: You also understand that your vehicle would have to be registered for hire? MR. SCALLAN: Yes, I do. MR. PEASE: So what are we missing? MR. FLEGAL: If you're -- if you're getting ready to get this vehicle, you understand that if you're going -- is your corporation buying the vehicle? Is that what you're waiting to find out? Page 6 February 9, 2000 Who's buying the vehicle? Are you going to buy it and lease it to the corporation or what? MR. SCALLAN: It will be bought under the corporation's name. MR. FLEGAL: Okay. I guess my next question is, if that's the fact, since this corporation doesn't exist yet -- MR. PEASE: He's got a corporation. MR. FLEGAL: But that's not the one that he's made the application for. And we don't have a credit report on this corporation. We have a credit report on him personally. MR. PEASE: It's what we have to have when it's a new company, right? The credit report on a new company is supposed to be zero. MR. FLEGAL: Well-- MR. PALMER: Credit history-- accept it's existence -- MR. FLEGAL: He's changed his existing corporation. He's just changing the name of an existing corporation. MR. PALMER: Well, if that's the case, to whatever extent that corporation has a history, it will have some sort of an economic history. MR. FLEGAL: The corporation has been in business since '97. MR. PALMER: Okay. Then it ought to have some sort of history from that point in time. MR. FLEGAL: I would think. MR. SCALLAN: Would it be simpler if I were to purchase this vehicle under my own personal name? MR. FLEGAL: I guess that's up to the people that are going to loan you the money. I mean, are they -- if they're -- are they loaning -- they can't be loaning the Hummeride, Inc. because that company doesn't exist. MR. SCALLAN: Right. MR. FLEGAL: So they must be loaning the money to MEDCLEP or whatever it is. MR. SCALLAN: They are loaning the money to me personally, not under the MEDCLEP name. MEDCLEP is an extremely small home business that I started in '97. It was medical collections. It's basically not -- at this time not generating any money. It's Page 7 February 9, 2000 not being actively run. And through the state, as I understand it, I may be wrong, is that I could change, I could simply change that name as far as a corporation or I can simply just incorporate as an S corp. for a whole new business. To my understanding it was simple -- a very simple procedure just to change that business name to avoid some paperwork and fees. MR. FLEGAL: I don't disagree with that. What I'm looking for is, if you're going to get the vehicle personally, which is fine, you can do that, then lease it to your corporation, but I'm looking for the registration of the vehicle, which we haven't got yet, but you're going to have to get. MR. SCALLAN: Right. MR. FLEGAL: Isn't he going to have to -- if he leases it to the corporation, who's he going to register the vehicle with? MR. PALMER: Well, obviously, either the corporation is going to have to own title to the vehicle or he is. If he has known title to the vehicle, there would be no way he could lease it to anybody. You can't lease what you don't own. Whether or not you want to put this in the name of an existing corporation and just change it's name is up to you. Those are -- those are questions of liability, about what would happen if somebody should be injured as a result of your activities with this vehicle. And the county can't give you advice on that. The fact of the matter is that the vehicle, whomever owns it, must be the vehicle that will be licensed by this board for you to operate for these uses. We want to know who owns it, but it's a matter of indifference to whether he owns it to us, whether he owns it or whether the corporation owns it or leases it, so long as this vehicle is the vehicle that we know about that he will operate under the license that you grant to him. MR. FLEGAL: And when he gets his insurance, is the insurance -- if he owns the vehicle and leases it to the corporation -- MR. PALMER: Well, the insurance effectively is going to insure the public, and it will be a question of what the policy Page 8 February 9, 2000 says. The insurance company may have some idea of what it wants to happen. But in general, as long as the coverage is there protecting the class of people that are to be protected, the question of who owns the vehicle should be a matter of indifference to the county as long as the protection, the insurance protection exists. And what we're interested about is public liability. MR. FLEGAL: Right. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: On your occupational license you list your type of business conducted as livery and advertising. What kind of advertising are you referring to, advertising on the vehicle? MR. SCALLAN.' Right. Business owners will -- would approach me and their logo would be placed on the vehicle. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: You can't do that with a charter service vehicle. The only thing you can do is put your name on the rear bumper. Is that what you call that, the rear area of the vehicle? MR. FLEGAL.' If you're wanting to do kind of like the Naples Trolley and have a bunch of ads on this summer, then you can't do that. MR. PEASE: You need to -- you need to have more seats than what we oversee, which is what, fifteen? CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: I think so, yeah. MR. PEASE: A mini coach or larger to put advertising on it. MR. FLEGAL: The only thing you would be allowed on this vehicle is basically like a license plate or, you know, your name across the trunk, Hummeride, Inc., and that would be it. Nobody else's name, no Iogos, nothing. Just that, Hummeride, Inc., period. So if your intent is to do it through advertising to help make money to pay for your vehicle, this isn't it. MR. SCALLAN: I understand. MR. FLEGAL: So you need to tell us what your intent is, because if you get this permit, you definitely can't do that. MR. SCALLAN: Right. MR. FLEGAL: And that may change your business. Page 9 February 9, 2000 MR. SCALLAN: Right. Well, obviously, I mean, if I can't do it, I mean, I understand that that can't be done and it would strictly be for hire services, livery services. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY.' We don't regulate -- MR. FLEGAL: They can do what they want. MR. PEASE: They surely can. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: The only rates that are regulated are the taxi rates. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: I think we have a lot of pieces that are still missing to this application, and whether or not we approve it conditionally and let Maria fill in the pieces or have him come back in front of us -- MR. PEASE: I think I have come up with -- we need a registration class nine, which would also include the VIN number, which we don't have. Usually we get a VIN number. Credit history on the existing corporation, if that's -- if it's going to be put in the corporate name. Proof of insurance and a criminal background check. MR. FLEGAL: And a corporation name to start with, because that corporation doesn't exist. He's made an application as Hummeride, Inc. and there is no such corporation. MR. PALMER: I understand he intends to change the name of his existing corporation. MR. FLEGAL: I understand that. That's just one thing, I mean. We need to understand what all he has to do. And I think, personally, approving somebody, you know, conditionally upon going and purchasing the vehicle and getting the registration is one, or getting the background check criminally which comes from somewhere else is fine. But now it seems we're getting into approving things where all of a sudden the items you have to do, the list keeps getting longer and longer and longer and longer for the county to get before they issue a permit. And I just -- I don't know, personally, don't feel the board should do that. So I am not in favor of this until we see all of this stuff. I mean, anybody can sit up here and say we approve you conditionally, go out and get forty-seven things and give it to Page 10 February 9, 2000 them, next. MR. PALMER: Well, that's true. And you're well within your discretion to insist if you want to that you see a full application before it's presented to you. You can do that if you desire or you can delegate to Maria as you desire, as long as it isn't something that you must pass upon on the merits. For example, if Maria had -- if the background check came in and there were some questions about it, you might want to not let Maria make the final determination on the weight that would be given to that. You might want to have that be your collective decision of the board. A number of our quasi-administrative bodies will delegate to staff things that are crystal clear and there's really not a lot of judgment on. But if there's something of judgment comes up, it usually goes to the board and let the board decide the matters that may be -- you may give more weight than somebody else may give. But in general I think -- I agree with you that's it nice to have a complete package before the board so you know just what it is you're doing, instead of this little bit out of reach. And you don't really know what happens. In fact, you might not even necessarily have any formal follow-up on it. On the other hand, the board could meet. Rather than meet three months from now, if this thing gets wrapped together in another thirty days, the board might want to meet to address the merits of this application. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY.' I think we could give him a checklist of things that he needed to bring back to us to present at the next board meeting or next scheduled board meeting. And if he has all of those things in line, certainly he would get a permit. MR. PALMER: As a matter of fact, if you wanted to, you could make a policy to Maria not to present to you any applications that are not complete or they are complete except for a few incidentals, whatever you want to do. MR. PEASE: This is a little bit unique in the amount of the expenditure on one vehicle. Page 11 February 9, 2000 CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: Exactly. MR. PEASE: So I don't have a problem with it coming up to the board because that's a big investment. I understand his concern. I would suggest that, Robert, that you -- I know you signed off that you read the ordinance, but I would suggest you read that again and really understood what you're allowed to do or what you're not allowed to do in terms of your business plan, because we want you, if you're going to do this, to be viable and to be there long term for the benefit of the customers and the local residents. The board does not have the power to arbitrarily say you can't operate. What we can say is if you will do these things, you're going to have a good shot at being approved because you have completed the tasks that were before you. So I would concur with the other board members that we not put a vote on this at this point, but ask that he go back and get those items at least on a tentative basis. MR. SCALLAN: Will you supply me a list of those items? MR. PEASE: Maria can do that. MR. PALMER: Another thing that would be helpful, let's assume that in this process, Maria, everything is moving along smoothly and Maria sees no reason why this board would deny. That's fine. But if Maria should -- a red flag should come up and Maria says we have got a serious problem here, don't -- don't make any commitments on an eighty thousand dollar vehicle. I mean, Maria can do those kinds of things. And then he can be apprised as things go how things look. We have no reason to suspect sitting here today that this application won't be approved, but we don't know it for a fact. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: That's right. MR. PALMER: But we also see no -- no -- no poison pills in anything that you're reading. And in all probabilities you will be approved. It's a matter of getting the ducks lined up, getting it to Maria. Maria can probably make a judgment for you that, yes, everything looks fine and she sees no reason why she would suspect the board would deny when they decide your matter on Page 12 February 9, 2000 the merits. MR. PEASE: April would be a good time to have this brought before us. It gives him time to get some things in order and it gives him time also on his financing. I think he does have a projected CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: date in here of March 15th. THE COURT REPORTER: CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: have on here for your -- What date, I'm sorry? March 15th, isn't that what you MR. SCALLAN: Right. I would like to move on this as quickly as possible. This has kind of been in the works. I've been planning this and putting the project together for some time now. MR. PEASE: When's our meeting? MS. CRUZ: I'm sorry? MR. PEASE: When is our April meeting? MS. CRUZ: Four. MR. PEASE: April 4th. That's only twenty days. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: Could I have a motion on it? MR. PEASE: He started it. MR. FLEGAL: I guess my motion would be that we -- what's best, Tom, table it until the next meeting? MR. PALMER: Continue the matter to a date certain, to the next meeting, subject to a complete application being presented to you at that time. And what -- you will determine the matter on the merits. MR. FLEGAL: I would make a motion that we continue this to our next meeting, which is currently scheduled for April 4th, and -- in hopes that the applicant can fill in all of the blanks and bring us additional information so we can make a confirmed judgment. MR. PALMER: By that -- but you don't mean have title to the vehicle? MR. FLEGAL: No, title doesn't bother me -- MR. PALMER: Right. MR. FLEGAL: -- if he says, you know, if you will give me a permit, I'm ready to go buy the vehicle, that's fine. Right now it's kind of in limbo whether he really can buy the vehicle or not. MR. PALMER: Right. Page 13 February 9, 2000 MR. FLEGAL: And I'm a little bothered about giving permits when you can't buy the vehicle. MS. CRUZ: May I have for clarification purposes the list of items that he needs to provide, because all I have is the registration, credit history on the existing corporation? MR. PEASE: The corporate name, criminal background check. MS. CRUZ: The criminal background check was requested on January 26th, and that's beyond our control. We send that to FDLE and we can't determine when they're going to be sending that in to us. MR. PEASE: Credit history on the existing corporation, if that's where the title of the vehicle is going to be. MR. FLEGAL: If he's changing names from the existing corporation to the new corporation, then the existing corporation should have some kind of credit history because it's been in existence since '97. MR. PEASE: Get that, and then it's narrowed down to just the last two items which can be approved contingent on, which is the class nine registration and the proof of insurance. MR. FLEGAL: He needs a proper driver's license. MR. PEASE: The proper driver's license, that's right. MR. SCALLAN: Is that an item I must secure before -- once again before I own this vehicle? MR. PEASE: Everything except registration and -- MR. FLEGAL: Driver's license should be easy to get. MR. PALMER: Yeah, it strikes me that if you're serious about doing this, I'd get my driver's license ASAP. MR. FLEGAL: Yeah, I mean, you just have to go -- it's -- CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: It's not a difficult thing, it's just a written test to get a chauffeur's license. It's very easy. MR. FLEGAL: I mean, it's like changing the name of your corporation, it's no big deal. And whether you have it and don't ever drive is immaterial, you know. And it's just something you have that -- so I would go get that immediately. MR. PALMER: Or another possibility, if enamored with this name, fine, but if you could do something slightly different, do it d/b/a. Have this corporation doing business as something, a Page 14 February 9, 2000 name that you like, and you don't have to go through all of the rigmarole of a formal change of the corporation recognized by Tallahassee. It's a lot cheaper, it's very expeditious. That might work. Just a suggestion. MR. SCALLAN: The State of Florida can supply information on how to do that? MR. PALMER: Oh, yeah, it's a simple process. You just do business as some other thing, but you're formally the -- the corporate name doesn't change. And nothing in the corporation is affected. You'd just be doing business as some other name which is a catchy name that somebody else hasn't already -- that isn't already using. Very simple, inexpensive process. MR. SCALLAN: Thank you. MR. PEASE: I would second the motion to continue this item to the next board meeting. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: All in favor say aye. (Aye.) MR. SCALLAN: Question. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: Uh-huh. MR. SCALLAN: Where might I find more information on the county's policy regarding the advertising concerns? MR. PEASE: The ordinance, and Maria can give you a copy of that. You did sign off that you had read it. Do you not have the ordinance? MR. SCALLAN: Yes, I have that. That was for -- for livery. MR. PEASE: It also discusses advertising. In fact, it's the very first item on the table of contents. MR. SCALLAN: Okay. MR. PALMER: Maria -- Maria knows most of these things. If you talk to Maria, she can probably help you in almost every aspect of your application. MR. SCALLAN: Thank you. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: Move on to our next item of new business, George E. Rogers doing business as American Eagle Limousine, Inc., request for approval to operate a charter service. Is Mr. Rogers present? Page 15 February 9, 2000 MR. ROGERS: Yes. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: please? (Witness was sworn.) CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: Would you swear Mr. Rogers in, Any questions on this application? MR. FLEGAL: Maria, I assume the background check is in the same category? MS. CRUZ: That's correct. MR. PEASE: What's this section on -- CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: Is-- THE COURT REPORTER: I'm sorry, I'm not able to hear you. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: We're looking for the section under -- about bad debt on the credit report. MR. PEASE: It says page twenty-five, Maria, but I don't -- MR. FLEGAL: Page twenty-two. MR. PEASE: Twenty-two? MR. FLEGAL: The only thing this says is current credit report. Bad debts, twenty-five. The only thing this says on twenty-five is at the top, no certificate shall be issued to any applicant whose owner's credit report indicates facts and circumstances showing failure to properly pay vehicle-for-hire related bills. Since he's not been in business, this has no bearing. MR. PALMER: That's correct. MR. PEASE: And there's nothing in the ordinance related to any personal bankruptcy or anything of that nature in terms of an applicant? MR. PALMER: Absolutely. As a matter of fact, I think as a matter of law that couldn't be a valid consideration, otherwise it would be a double-edged sword, you're darned if you do and you're darned if you don't by declaring bankruptcy. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: We've had people in the past that have come in front of the board that have been bankrupt. MR. PEASE: Just wanted to double check. MR. PALMER: However, if somebody in a bankruptcy did that to absolve themselves of a lot of taxicab related debt, then it becomes a material consideration. MR. FLEGAL: Then you can consider it. That's what I Page 16 February 9, 2000 thought. Subject to the background check, I make a motion we approve the application. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: Do I have a second on that motion? MR. PEASE: What do you think, Bill, do you want to be in on this? MR. CSOGI: I will second it. I read it. No problem. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: Put the new guy right on the spot there, Bryan. MR. PEASE: Next -- next -- next quarter you get to actually make a motion. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: All in favor say aye. (Aye.) CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: You're approved. Congratulations, sir. MR. FLEGAL: Congratulations, sir. Good luck. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: Moving on to old business. MR. ROGERS: When do I get my permit? CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: You have to see Maria in her office. MR. ROGERS: Today? MS. CRUZ: Yes, sir, you can come in later on if you like. MR. ROGERS= Thanks. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: The only old business that I really have is we have discussed items here over several months that we wanted to change in the ordinance, and we never really follow through with them. I would like to see a meeting where we just discuss those items and get down to work and do it. MR. PEASE: My suggestion is we not put them in a workshop format, because the workshop format becomes conversation and no action gets taken. I suggest we put it on the agenda for the next meeting. MR. FLEGAL: I agree. MR. PEASE: We just spend some time. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: Either way, but it needs to get done. We just keep talking about it and no action's ever really been formally taken on it. MR. FLEGAL: Why don't we -- we all probably have different items that we can think of that haven't been accomplished. Why Page 17 February 9, 2000 don't we pass those on to our chairperson and have her direct the staff to put them on the agenda for the next meeting. MR. PEASE: Wonderful idea. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: That's fine. Just pass them over to me, MR. PEASE: I will walk mine. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: Okay. You can walk yours over. Do we have any other reports? No? Discussion? MR. FLEGAL: Maria, we have a vacancy, don't we? MS. CRUZ: I'm not sure if we do. MR. PEASE: Transportation. MR. FLEGAL: We're missing -- we're supposed to have five members and one alternate. We have four members and one alternate. MS. CRUZ: Right. I will check into that. MR. PEASE: Wasn't the staff going to send a letter out to the members? Not the members, but the certificate holders? CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: I think we had discussed that, yes. MS. CRUZ: It was discussed. MR. PEASE: But not accomplished. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: Those things happen. MS. CRUZ: There's only one of me. It will be done. MR. PEASE: Make it so. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: I would like to have a full board here. And I would like to see some participation from the public here, the public or other certificate holders. There's never anybody here. MR. PALMER: Well, that may be that everybody thinks everything is fine and there's no serious concern about this activity in Collier County. MR. PEASE: We're doing our job properly. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: I guess so. MR. PALMER: I would be concerned if we had a room full of people here. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: I don't want that either. But sometimes when we're discussing some items to change in the Page 18 February 9, 2000 ordinance, it would be nice if you had a little input from other people. MR. PALMER: Well, if people are concerned about it, there will be adequate notice before the County Board of Commissioners and they can speak at the time that the board considers the amendments. I don't recall ever having any public comment on anything to do with the PVAC ordinance. MS. CRUZ: I don't recall either. MR. PALMER: Even by the regulated industry. MR. PEASE: It's good to have this slot filled. MR. PALMER: Oh, yeah, it's always nice to have a full compliment, then we don't have quorum problems. MR. CSOGI: Well, I can say before today, I had never heard of the committee -- before my application and before I saw it in the paper, I didn't know it existed. As a public viewpoint. I don't know if we advertised this meeting's held today in the paper or anywhere. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: They're advertised. Where do they advertise them? MR. PALMER: They post them on bulletin boards. MR. CSOGI: In the building here? MR. PALMER: Yeah. MR. CSOGI: That's it? MR. PALMER: Yeah. There's no legal requirement that a regularly scheduled meeting of a board like this publish in the newspaper. Every board, depending on the matter that's being addressed, may have its own triggering requirement of advertisement. But in general, even when this board is considering quasi-judicial matters on the merits of an application, grant or denial, there's no requirement that that be anything other than posted on bulletin boards within a reasonable time prior to the meeting. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: Okay. Anybody else have anything else to discuss today? No? MR. FLEGAL: Next meeting is April 4th. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: That's correct. MR. PEASE: I make a motion we adjourn. Page 19 February 9, 2000 CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: motion? MR. FLEGAL: Second. CHAIRPERSON BAISLEY: May I have a second for that All in favor say aye. There being no further business for the good of the County, the meeting was adjourned by order of the Chair at 9:40 a.m. PUBLIC VEHICLE ADVISORY COMMITTEE PAT BAISLEY, CHAIRPERSON TRANSCRIPT PREPARED ON BEHALF OF GREGORY COURT REPORTING SERVICE, INC. BY DEBRA J. DeLAP, NOTARY PUBLIC. Page 20