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CCPC Minutes 05/06/2010 R May 6, 2010 TRANSCRIPT OF THE MEETING OF THE COLLIER COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION Naples, Florida May 6, 2010 LET IT BE REMEMBERED, that the Collier County Planning Commission, in and for the County of Collier, having conducted business herein, met on this date at 8:30 a.m. in REGULAR SESSION in Building "F" of the Government Complex, East Naples, Florida, with the following members present: CHAIRMAN: Mark Strain Donna Reed-Caron Karen Homiak Paul Midney Bob Murray (Excused) Brad Schiffer Robert Vigliotti (Excused) David J. Wolfley ALSO PRESENT: Jeffrey Klatzkow, County Attorney Nick Casalanguida, CDES Interim Administrator Ray Bellows, Zoning Manager Thomas Eastman, Real Property Director, CC School District Page 1 AGENDA COLLIER COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION WILL MEET AT 8:30 A.M., THURSDAY, MAY 6, 2010. IN THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS MEETING ROOM. ADMINISTRATION BUILDING, COUNTY GOVERNMENT CENTER. 3301 TAMIAMI TRAIL EAST, NAPLES, FLORIDA: NOTE: INDIVIDUAL SPEAKERS WILL BE LIMITED TO 5 MINUTES ON ANY ITEM. INDIVIDUALS SELECTED TO SPEAK ON BEHALF OF AN ORGANIZATION OR GROUP ARE ENCOURAGED AND MAYBE ALLOTTED 10 MINUTES TO SPEAK ON AN ITEM IF SO RECOGNIZED BY THE CHAIRMAN. PERSONS WISHING TO HA VE WRITTEN OR GRAPHIC MATERIALS INCLUDED IN THE CCPC AGENDA PACKETS MUST SUBMIT SAID MATERIAL A MINIMUM OF 10 DAYS PRIOR TO THE RESPECTIVE PUBLIC HEARING. IN ANY CASE, WRITTEN MATERIALS INTENDED TO BE CONSIDERED BY THE CCPC SHALL BE SUBMITTED TO THE APPROPRIATE COUNTY STAFF A MINIMUM OF SEVEN DAYS PRIOR TO THE PUBLIC HEARING. ALL MATERIAL USED IN PRESENTATIONS BEFORE THE CCPC WILL BECOME A PERMANENT PART OF THE RECORD AND WILL BE AVAILABLE FOR PRESENTATION TO THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS IF APPLICABLE. ANY PERSON WHO DECIDES TO APPEAL A DECISION OF THE CCPC WILL NEED A RECORD OF THE PROCEEDINGS PERTAINING THERETO, AND THEREFORE MAY NEED TO ENSURE THAT A VERBATIM RECORD OF THE PROCEEDINGS IS MADE, WHICH RECORD INCLUDES THE TESTIMONY AND EVIDENCE UPON WHICH THE APPEAL IS TO BE BASED. I. PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE 2. ROLL CALL BY SECRETARY 3. ADDENDA TO THE AGENDA 4. PLANNING COMMISSION ABSENCES 5. APPROVAL OF MINUTES - March 24,2010 (LDC), April 1, 2010 Regular meeting, April 1. 2010 (LDC) 6. BCC REPORT- RECAPS - April 27, 2010 7. CHAIRMAN'S REPORT 8. CONSENT AGENDA ITEMS A. Petition: BD-PL2009-918, Hickory Harbour Condominium Association, Inc., represented by David Turley, requests a Boat Dock Extension that includes expansion of the northern most dock by constructing two new finger piers with three new slips and constructing a new dock with eight finger piers, with 13 new slips and the retention of the two existing docks, totaling 40 slips. Subject propcrty is located at 226 Third Street, part of Lot 6, of Block D, Little Hickory Shores Unit 2, in Section 5, Township 48 South, Range 25 East. Collier County, Florida. [Coordinator: Ashley Caserta] B. LDC Amendment 2.03.07 G -Immokalee Deviation Process [Coordinator: Susan Istenes] C. LDC Amendment 3.06.06 F -- Regulated Well fields - Orange Tree [Coordinator: Susan Istenes] 1 9. ADVERTISED PUBLIC HEARINGS A. SV-PL2009-242I TAC Holdings, L.P., represented by Jeff Riggins, of Riggins Associates, is requesting a variance from Collier County Land Development Code (LDC) Section 5.06.04 F.1. which requires a minimum separation of 1,000 lineal feet between ground signs to allow a sign separation of 603 ct feet between two ground signs. The subject property, American Momentum Center, is located on 8625 Tamiami Trail North in Section 33, Township 48 South, Range 25 East. Collier County. Florida. [Coordinator: Nancy Gundlach] B. PUDA-PL2009-I499 Lennar Homes, LLC, represented by David R. Underhill, Jr. of Banks Engineering, and R. Bruce Anderson, of Roetzel & Andress, LPA, is requesting an amendment to the Heritage Bay Planned Unit Development (PUD (Ordinance No. 03-40) to add additional development standards for the AC/R3 designated area on the Master Plan to allow townhouse units, by amending Section 2.24, to add item F and by adding Table 2A, by allowing deviations from the land Development Code (LDC) Sections 6.06.0 1.B and 6.06.01.0 I (0) regarding standard road section and road width; by allowing a deviation from LDC Section 4.05.02.F to allow back out parking; and by allowing deviations from LDC Sections 4.05.02.1. and 4.05.03 regarding same-lot parking facilities to allow parking within easements dedicated to all residents; and by adding Exhibit A-I to show the layout; and by adding Exhibit A-2 to reflect the area wherein the amendment is effective; and by adding any other stipulations or regulations that may result from the amendment process pertaining to the 261-acre AC/R3 designated area within the 2,562 acre Heritage Bay PUD project. The AC/R3 subject property is located in Section 23, Township 48 South, Range 26 East, Collier County, Florida. The subject 2,562ct acres (the entire Heritage Bay PUD) is located on the north side of Immokalee Road (SR 846) east of Collier Boulevard (CR 951), in Sections 13, 14, 23, and 24, Township 48 South, Range 26 East, Collier County, Florida. [Coordinator: Kay Deselem] 10. OLD BUSINESS I I. NEW BUSINESS A. CIE/AUIR discussion[Coordinator: Mike Bosi] 12. PUBLIC COMMENT ITEM 13. DISCUSSION OF ADDENDA 14. ADJOURN 4/1 9/I 0 CCPC Agenda/Ray Bellows/jmp 2 May 6, 2010 CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Good morning. You two guys want to move closer? It's up to you. Anyway, good morning, welcome to the May 6th meeting of the Collier County Planning Commission. If everybody will please rise for pledge of allegiance. (Pledge of Allegiance was recited in unison.) Item #2 ROLL CALL BY SECRETARY CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, Donna, would you mind doing the roll call this morning. COMMISSIONER CARON: No problem. Mr. Eastman? MR. EASTMAN: Here. COMMISSIONER CARON: Mr. Schiffer? COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: I'm here. COMMISSIONER CARON: Mr. Midney? COMMISSIONER MIDNEY: Here. COMMISSIONER CARON: Ms. Caron is here. Mr. Strain? CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Here. COMMISSIONER CARON: Mr. Vigliotti is absent. Mr. Murray is absent. Mr. Wolfley? COMMISSIONER WOLFLEY: Here. COMMISSIONER CARON: And Ms. Homiak? COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Here. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Thank you. I believe both the Bobs are absent for reasons they called in for, so they'll be excused. Page 2 May 6, 2010 Item #3 ADDENDA TO THE AGENDA CHAIRMAN STRAIN: The next item on the agenda is addenda to the agenda. I understood there may be a change to 8.B, which is the Immokalee deviation process. Is that a fact, County Attorney's Office? MR. KLATZKOW: Yeah, we're asking that be continued. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Any objections from the board? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, we'll discontinue Item 8.B. Any other addenda to the agenda? (No response.) Item #4 PLANNING COMMISSION ABSENCES CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, Planning Commission absences. The next meeting we have is May 20th. Does anybody know if they're not going to be here on May 20th? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, we'll have a quorum that day. Item #5 APPROVAL OF MINUTES - MARCH 24,2010 (LDC), APRIL 1, 2010 REGULAR MEETING, APRIL 1, 2010 (LDC) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Approval of the minutes, March 24th, LDC minutes. Is there a motion? Page 3 May 6,2010 COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Motion-- COMMISSIONER CARON: Motion to approve. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Well, Karen first and Donna second. So all those in favor, signify by saying aye. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Aye. COMMISSIONER WOLFLEY: Aye. COMMISSIONER MIDNEY: Aye. COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Aye. COMMISSIONER CARON: Aye. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Aye. Anybody opposed? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Motion carries 6-0. The regular meeting of April 1 st and then an LDC meeting of April 1 st. Both are the same set of minutes, I believe. COMMISSIONER CARON: Motion to approve. COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Second. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Motion to approve by Donna, seconded by Karen. All in favor, signify by saying aye. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Aye. COMMISSIONER WOLFLEY: Aye. COMMISSIONER MIDNEY: Aye. COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Aye. COMMISSIONER CARON: Aye. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Aye. Anybody opposed? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Motion carries 6-0. Item #6 Page 4 May 6, 2010 BCC REPORT - RECAPS - APRIL 27, 2010 CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Ray, the recaps on April 27th? MR. BELLOWS: Yes, the Board heard the PUD rezone for the McMullen PUD. That was continued from an earlier meeting to allow the applicant to address some of the concerns from Commissioner Fiala. The petitioner revised some of the -- and made more clear what uses were prohibited in regards to some group housing issues, and they approved it on their agenda 5-0. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, thank you. Item #7 CHAIRMAN'S REPORT CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Chairman's report. Ray, could you put that item on the overhead? Let's hope the overhead works. MR. BELLOWS: It's not turned on. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Or plugged in. There we go. That's a new book, and it's by Daniel Mandelker. If you remember the gentleman here, he was a professor who came and helped us wade through the changes to the sign ordinance to make it constitutionally right. He wrote a new book titled, as you see it, Designing Planned Communities. And he did actually mention Collier County. He basically congratulated us for our -- or used our RI~SA standards as one example of good planning, and the architectural standards in the regular sections of the LDC. And in doing so he also acknowledged Susan Istenes and Catherine Fabacher for all the work that they did to help through the sign process and all that. And I certainly think we owe all them a thank you and a good job well done. And it's good to see Collier County being recognized as well. So thank you both. Page 5 May 6, 2010 Item #8A PETITION: BD-PL2009-918, HICKORY HARBOUR CONDOMINIUM ASSOCIATION, INC. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, with that, we will move right into our regular items. First item up is the 8.A. It's consent agenda item Petition BD-PL-2009-918, the Hickory Harbour Condominium Association. Any comments from the Planning Commission on the consent issue? Mr. Wolfley? COMMISSIONER WOLFLEY: We had an e-mail on this, I believe, and I didn't understand it. It said some numbers were changed. And I could not find, in looking at the attachment to the e-mail. Did you recall receiving that? CHAIRMAN STRAIN: I received it. And I think there was a quantity of boat docks was the issue. COMMISSIONER WOLFLEY: Yes. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Ashley, can you clarify it for us. (Speaker was duly sworn.) MS. CASERTA: For the record, Ashley Caserta. On I believe it was the second paragraph from the bottom on the first sheet, it said that there were 14 slips on the attachment. In the fifth paragraph from the bottom it now says 16 correctly. It matches the application submitted by the petitioner. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: David, does that clarify your-- COMMISSIONER WOLFLEY: Yes. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: -- issue? Okay, anybody else have any issues? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Ifnot, is there a motion to approve Page 6 May 6, 2010 Petition 8.A? COMMISSIONER WOLFLEY: So moved. COMMISSIONER CARON: Motion to approve. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Motion made by Commissioner Caron, seconded by Mr. Wolfley. Discussion? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: All in favor, signify by saying aye. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Aye. COMMISSIONER WOLFLEY: Aye. COMMISSIONER MIDNEY: Aye. COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Aye. COMMISSIONER CARON: Aye. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Aye. Anybody opposed? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Motion carries 6-0. Item #8C LDC AMENDMENT 3.06.06 F - REGULATED WELLFIELDS- ORANGE TREE CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Next item up is Petition 8.C, LDC amendment 3.06.06.F, the regulated wellfields, Orangetree. I'm not sure what the -- I can't remember offhand why we're hearing this. Susan, this is just one we missed probably doing final approval on during the process? MS. ISTENES: Susan Istenes for the record. I'm going by memory here, but I think my recollection was that there was an illustration that was presented to you on the overhead that was slightly different from the one in the packet. And the packet Page 7 May 6, 2010 was the one that had the error. So what we presented and talked about was correct. And so just in the abundance of caution we just wanted to bring this back on the consent agenda with the corrected illustration. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Great, thank you. Is there a motion to recommend approval? COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Move to approve. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Mr. Schiffer. Seconded by? COMMISSIONER CARON: Second. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Ms. Caron. Discussion? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: All in favor, signify by saying aye. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Aye. COMMISSIONER WOLFLEY: Aye. COMMISSIONER MIDNEY: Aye. COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Aye. COMMISSIONER CARON: Aye. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Aye. Anybody opposed? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Motion carries. Item #9 A PETITION: SV-PL2009-2421, TAC HOLDINGS, L.P. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: And that takes us into our regular advertised public hearings. First one up is SV-PL-2009-2421, TAC Holdings, LP. It's for a signage at the -- forgot the name of the -- there it is, the American Monurnentum (sic) Center. All those wishing to testify on behalf of this item, please rise to Page 8 May 6, 2010 be sworn in by the court reporter. (Speakers were duly sworn.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, are there disclosures on the part of the Planning Commission? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: In the packet I noticed that we did not have the reference to approval that the applicant had said he had from the foundation. So I had contacted the Pelican Bay Foundation and asked them for a copy of their approval. They did forward it to me. So other than that, that's the only communications I had. And it's the applicant's show at this point. MR. RIGGINS: Good morning. My name is Jeff Riggins with Riggins Associates, here to represent American Momentum Bank. As you know, our request is to install a non-illuminated monument sign to be located on Oakrnont Parkway. The property in question is located on U.S. 41 and Oakrnont Parkway. U.S. 41 is the primary traveled roadway there, but there is no entry into the center from U.S. 41. The only entrance to the center is on Oakrnont Parkway. The sign we're requesting is to help motorists identify the entry and guide them into the center. We feel it's essential to have the sign on Oakrnont, as the road is very heavily landscaped, and the transition from Oakrnont into the center will be made much easier by this identification sign. It's also located on a bend in the road on Oakrnont. The sign itself will be constructed to match the architecture of the existing monument sign on U.S. 41. The copy size is minimal, with the upper case lettering at seven inches and the lower case lettering at only three-and-a-half inches. The property will be an office center and will also be home to the American Momentum Bank. Of course banks rely on drive-up traffic, and their requested sign will assist in getting customers safely into the Page 9 May 6, 2010 bank with positive traffic flow by allowing ample time for them to turn into the center. As mentioned, the property is located on a curve in the roadway, adding to the difficulty in identifying the entrance to the bank. In a word, we call the sign practical. The intent of our request is not just to have another sign or over-sign the property but to rather serve as a practical manner in which to help patrons navigate into the center. It is presented in a tasteful manner, consistent with the balance of the signage in Pelican Bay. To be noted as well, the fact that the center address is a u.s. 41 address, but the entry to the property is on U.s. -- the entry -- there is no entry on U.s. 41, even though the address is U.S. 41. We therefore respectfully request your support for our approval on this project and will be glad to answer any questions you might have. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, are there any questions from the Planning Commission? Mr. Schiffer? COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Jeff, one thing is you go to the plan you have of the V-shaped sign. You have a note in there that the angle is to be determined. MR. RIGGINS: Yes, sir. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Would you mind -- I think 90 degrees is the greatest that angle could be. MR. RIGGINS: Yes. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: So would you mind putting in there less than or equal to 90 degrees? MR. RIGGINS: That is not a problem. It could definitely be less than. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: And then the other thing, let's go to that sign on the site plan. Page 10 May 6, 2010 MR. RIGGINS: Yes, sir. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: It seems odd the way you're orienting it. You're -- essentially the public's going to look into the V. I'm not sure why that's -- essentially you're providing signage for the parking lot, not the garage. MR. RIGGINS: No, I see what you're referring to. And that is -- I can't believe I didn't see that before. The orientation will obviously be for the Oakrnont direction. That is incorrect. Thank you for pointing that out to me. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: So essentially if you mirrored that over 180 so -- MR. RIGGINS: Yes, sir. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: -- that the flat part, the east-west stays the same but the north-south is actually to the -- MR. RIGGINS: Yes, sir, that is correct. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Thank you, I'm done. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Any other questions of the applicant? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: First of all, can you provide a new site plan with the reorientation for the record -- MR. RIGGINS: Yes, sir. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: -- by the time we get to consent? MR. RIGGINS: Yes, sir. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, second of all, the site plan that you provided, do you have it kind of in front of you? Do you have it handy? MR. RIGGINS: Yes, sir, I do. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Can you tell me what the revisions nine and 10 were? MR. RIGGINS: Revisions nine and 10. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: One was dated 11/3/09, the other one's Page 11 May 6, 2010 MR. RIGGINS: Yes, I had spoke to Nancy. We had -- actually on this site plan we had -- there were a couple of interior directional signs that once they get into the property to identifY them how to get to the banking center, to get to the drive-through, we actually had those removed from the plan. That was one of the revisions. The other revision was to add the dimensions as shown on there per our conversation, which is 135 feet, the 348 and the 120. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, by adding those dimensions, you didn't change them, you just were adding them for text to the document. MR. RIGGINS: Yes, this was a request from Nancy when I spoke to her. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: The reason I'm asking is because the plan you gave to the foundation, which they approved, was up to but not including those last two revisions. But if the revisions are insubstantial in any manner, which it seems they are, then it really doesn't matter. MR. RIGGINS: That were done strictly for this meeting, yes, sir. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, thank you. Any other questions of the applicant? Ms. Caron? COMMISSIONER CARON: One of the criteria for variances is that the variances be the minimum required variance. MR. RIGGINS: Yes, ma'am. COMMISSIONER CARON: What makes you determine that this sign is the minimum that you need? MR. RIGGINS: Well, given the copy size, which was what we based it on, we have a lower case lettering of three inches, which in traveling in a roadway to try to determine what your size were (sic), plus the sizes of the signs themselves were actually dictated by Pelican Bay, so we worked within their parameters. And the copy sizes, like I say, were worked all the way down to three inches for the lower case, May 6,2010 which is quite small for motorists traffic. COMMISSIONER CARON: Thank you. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, any other questions? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, thank you very much. MR. RIGGINS: Thank you. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Staff report. MS. GUNDLACH: Good morning, Commissioners. I'm Nancy Gundlach, Principal Planner with the Department of Zoning Services. And staff is recommending approval of this sign variance today, with one condition of approval, and I would like to change the language on that just slightly by adding one word. The condition of approval is that the sign is limited to the Oakmont Parkway, extra word, and extension entrance. And if you have any questions, it would be my pleasure to answer them today. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, any questions? Brad? COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Well, I mean, the only question is Nancy, don't you think it would be wise if our sign code allowed through lots to have two signs on it? I mean, essentially it's on two roads, two frontages. MS. GUNDLACH: It sounds wise, yes. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Put that on our things to do. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Well, at the same time, though, we could even let staff make those kind of judgment calls when it's an identical scenario and one that is -- I shouldn't say the word identical, but basically lives within the parameters that the signage on 41 would be existing with. So that's a laundry list of things that has been kind of hanging out there that staff could look at as maybe looking at some more administrative processes instead of public processes and simple things Page 13 May 6,2010 like that, so -- Ms. Caron? COMMISSIONER CARON: Yeah, this is another one of those instances where you cannot see -- you won't be able to see this new sign from any other place. You have to be on Oakmont traveling in front of it in order to see it. You won't be able to see it also from 41 or also from Pelican Bay -- I forget -- CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Boulevard. COMMISSIONER CARON: -- whether it's -- Boulevard. You won't be able to see it from there. You'll have to actually be almost in front of the place on Oakmont in order to see it. So just doesn't -- CHAIRMAN STRAIN: What was that last stipulation you had asked for? MS. GUNDLACH: Oh, just the correct name of the street. It's not Oakmont Parkway, it is Oakmont Parkway Extension. And we'll bring that back to you on the consent agenda. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, thank you. Any other questions of staff? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Ray, how many public speakers do we have registered for this? MR. BELLOWS: None for this one. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Well, that's good to hear. With that, we'll close the public hearing and entertain a motion. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: I'll make -- COMMISSIONER CARON: Motion to approve. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Second. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, motion's been made to approve and seconded. I'm assuming that the following two stipulations are to go with the motions. I'll need confirmation after they're read. First one is that the angle will be less than or equal to 90 percent -- or 90 degrees. Second one is that they'll reorientate the sign 180 degrees on Page 14 May 6,2010 Oakmont. Okay, does the-- COMMISSIONER CARON: Yes. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: -- motion maker and second accept those? COMMISSIONER CARON: Absolutely. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Yeah, except I think we don't want them to particularly -- well, that works, rotating it works. Same as mirroring it. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Well, I think it's going to come back on consent, so we can always make sure it gets to the point then. Okay, motion's been made, seconded and the stipulations have been added. All those in favor, signify by saying aye. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Aye. COMMISSIONER WOLFLEY: Aye. COMMISSIONER MIDNEY: Aye. COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Aye. COMMISSIONER CARON: Aye. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Aye. Anybody opposed? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Motion carries 6-0. Thank you. MR. RIGGINS: Thank you. Item #9B PETITION: PUDA-PL2009-l499, LENNAR HOMES, LLC CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Next item up is PUDA-PL-2009-1499, Lennar Homes, LLC. It's for a modification to some standards in the Page 15 May 6, 2010 Heritage Bay planned unit development Ordinance 03-40. All those wishing to testify on behalf of this item, please rise to be sworn in by the court reporter. (Speakers were duly sworn.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Disclosures from the Planning Commission? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: I had some communication with Bruce Anderson. I think Bruce was the only one that -- it was just he and I that spoke concerning the standards we're going to be hearing about today. With that, Bruce, it's all yours. MR. ANDERSON: Good morning, Commissioners. For the record, my name is Bruce Anderson with the Roetzel and Andress Law Firm. With me today are representatives from Lennar, Darin McMurray, regional vice president, Tony Burdett and Scott Edwards. Also with me is my project engineer, David Underhill, vice president of Banks Engineering. This is a minor PUD amendment. It's only applicable to the 26 acres that are depicted in the dark area. It is partially developed and it is in the mixed use activity center there. These 26 acres are the location for a work force housing neighborhood known as The Vistas at Heritage Bay. This amendment is to allow the existing housing to be replicated under a different form of ownership. It would be a change from a condominium ownership to ownership of a platted lot. You may ask why. This change in ownership is because of a more restrictive change in financing requirements for purchasers of condominium units. This is to facilitate the sale of these dwelling units. Because of the change in ownership form to a platted Page 16 May 6, 2010 single- family lot, Lennar needed to prepare new development standards and request three deviations from the Land Development Code for platted single-family lots that will allow the new buildings and the street layout to match the existing buildings and street layouts. As you know, the standards in the LDC are different for a multi-family condominium project than for a platted lot. The bottom line, these deviations are necessary to maintain the consistency of appearance in the Vistas' neighborhood. The only change will be in the form of ownership; otherwise, everything will look the same and you won't be able to tell the difference except on the deed to the property. I'd be glad to try to answer any questions you may have. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Questions of the applicant? Brad? COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: I'll go. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: I knew you'd have some. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Bruce, let's start on the ordinance itself. You have a statement you're going to add that the development standards are set forth in table two and/or utilizing the development standards in table 2-A. Is that so you can mix and match? Can you go into one and pick a number, go into another and pick a number? MR. ANDERSON: No, it's so that we don't make the existing units nonconforming that have already been built under the other standard. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Okay. So essentially F exists already, so maybe this should have been a strike-through. So are you adding this total paragraph or are you -- MR. ANDERSON: Yes. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: -- enhancing the existing paragraph? MR. ANDERSON: We are adding the entire new paragraph, because before this only applied was the development table. Page 17 May 6, 2010 COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Okay. MR. ANDERSON: So now we're putting this in here to make sure that we're not going to make the existing units nonconforming. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: But if I'm a designer of the new units, can I go into one table and grab a number and go to the other table and grab a number and -- or do I start at one table and finish in one table? MR. ANDERSON: You would go with either/or. And they would look the same, depending on whether you were doing it as a condominium or as a single-family townhouse on a platted wall. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Okay, then let's go to the table itself. The minimum area is 600 feet. I mean, isn't that -- that's a really tiny area. And your drawings show the exact same geometry as the other table provided. So I guess you're testifying that you're going to really essentially build the exact same geometry, there's no -- MR. ANDERSON: Yes, sir. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: -- sleeper thing in here. MR. ANDERSON: No. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Because the 600 is really, really small for a footprint of a building. MR. ANDERSON: These are townhouse units. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Okay. And the 13 feet wide is what you built in the other project? MR. ANDERSON: On the end -- middle units. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: The middle units or the -- yeah, looks like the middle. Not the end unit. MR. ANDERSON: Correct. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Okay, and that's a product that you've built and it works. Because it seems really small. I mean, you want to reduce it on a cul-de-sac. You don't show any cul-de-sacs, so I'm not sure why you need that. But that would be like a nine-foot Page 18 May 6, 2010 wide unit. Because essentially your footprint is the actual unit, it's not -- there's no yard or anything that's going to grow in dimension as it gets to the unit. MR. ANDERSON: No in width, no. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Okay, number one down there is to measure the front setback as you measured from -- and you list different places: The back of curb, edge of pavement, right-of-way line, whichever is least restricted. Which is an odd phrase for us, because normally we put conditions in and we go for the most restrictive. But what is really the intent of -- as right on that lot line you're going to be able to build a 35-foot high building; is that what you want to do? I mean-- MR. ANDERSON: Yes, this is going to be a common area. You see there where the cars are parked, all of that will be a common area. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Right. And essentially from the roadway edge you're going to go 18 feet for the car. I mean, you're -- the back of your parking space is the roadside of the valley gutter, right? MR. ANDERSON: Yes. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Okay. But it just seems really tight. But I guess your comeback is you built these units, this is nothing new, you're just completing what you already have, and you want to do it, so -- MR. ANDERSON: Yes, sir. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Okay. So this is what you built. So you really don't have the full height on that property line, which maybe the piece to the right is, or -- is that right? I mean, because what this is saying you could do is you could build, what, 82 feet face-to-face, these buildings, but -- I'll tell you what, let me fold on that. If you want to do it and you know what you're doing, that's fine. Page 19 May 6, 2010 I'm done, Mr. Chairman. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, anybody else have any questions of the applicant at this time? Ms. Caron? COMMISSIONER CARON: Yeah, the minimum average site depth, why does that change if the actual units aren't going to change? Why does the depth change from 40 feet for these townhouses to 20 feet? How did it suddenly get chopped in half? MR. UNDERHILL: Hi, Dave Underhill for the record with Banks Engineering. The reason that the depth is different is the configuration of the units. The end units have kind of a courtyard between the buildings, and the end units are not a typical townhouse that fronts on the street, if you will, they front on the common area between the buildings. And those units, the orientation of those units is different, so the depth is actually 20 feet. They're actually wider than they are deep, which is why the lot depth had to be revised and reduced. The picture shows the -- that configuration. There's actually two units on the end of the building: One in the front towards the street and one in the back of the building. And those are -- they're just a different shaped unit. And that's why the land uses had to be changed and mixed up, to allow the narrow unit for those and the other, the width to be less for the units that front -- that are more traditional that face the street, if you will. COMMISSIONER CARON: But you've been doing this before, correct? MR. UNDERHILL: Yes, this exact same building has been constructed. There's about maybe eight of these buildings have been constructed and sold. And the difference really comes that if you do it as a multi-family building and go through the condominium sale process, there is no right-of-way, there is no setback to the right-of-way. So all Page 20 May 6, 2010 these land use regulations are really predicated by the creation of the right-of-way to create the frontage for the lots, if you will, and that's what causes all the need for the different land use regulations. COMMISSIONER CARON: But in constructing what's already been constructed as a condominium, you wouldn't have needed the minimum average site depth to read in the current PUD as 20 feet as well, because you're doing the exact same exact thing? MR. UNDERHILL: No, ma'am. The whole 20-acre parcel becomes your lot -- COMMISSIONER CARON: Gotcha. MR. UNDERHILL: -- and so it meets all the requirements of the old table. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Is that it? COMMISSIONER CARON: Yeah. Thank you. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, just as clarification, the previous way you built these, you were defining the buildings' lot as the dimensional criteria for the table. Now what you're defining as the dimensional criteria for the table is the actual footprint on each unit. So we're not dealing with a lot, really, we're dealing with a footprint of the outside perimeter of the unit, if I'm not mistaken. So the numbers that we have here have to match the width and depth of each unit. So that you've got to go to the smallest unit to get your minimum width and depth and then work up from there. So that's probably an easy way of trying to figure out what it is you're doing. I have a few questions from your table. First of all, though, the parcel that you're asking to modifY, you're only showing -- you're not showing the only AC-R3 parcel. The parcel that you're modifying continues to the northwest, if I'm not mistaken. If you go to the original master plan -- or actually you go to Page 3 of the staff report. If you notice, the next down then goes up along the preserve into a Page 21 May 6, 2010 large area. And I know on the aerial that you've made that into a lake. According to the PUD amendment, the amendment area is the black area which stops where the neck of AC-3 goes to the northwest. So I'm just making sure that when we get done with this we're locking you in to the AC-3 area as shown, not to the overall AC-3 area. Because someone theoretically could come in and fill in that lake and build something there if they wanted to get away with it somehow. Is that a true statement, you're only trying to work with the area that's in black on the AC amendment -- I mean the PUD amendment? Bruce, you look confused for the first time. MR. UNDERHILL: That was our intention. I mean, certainly I guess I wasn't aware that the zoning line continued up to that lake. But certainly it's our intention to only limit it to the area that we've shown. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, and I'm not -- I mean, I practically don't think you're going to do anything like that, I'm just concerned about making sure we've got all the T's crossed and I's dotted in regards to what we're laying out. No one's addressed that little knob to the north. And I just think before this is over we just need to make sure that somehow it's clarified that that piece is going to be -- going to remain to what it is today and it's not going to be part of this change. So that was my first point. MR. ANDERSON: We'll be happy to insert a legal description. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, that would work -- well now, you can't do that. You can't change the zoning of that piece. You can insert a legal description to limit the amendment to the legal described area, but you can't take AC-3 and apply it only to the area you're trying to amend and remove it from the area to the northwest, because then you'd be changing the zoning, which I think would trigger probably a different review. Ray? MR. BELLOWS: I was thinking an option would be to label the Page 22 May 6, 2010 master plan as lake area on that tract. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: I don't want to -- see, if they change zOlllng -- MR. BELLOWS: No, it still would be that same district-- CHAIRMAN STRAIN: AC/3? MR. BELLOWS: Yeah, it's just a water retention -- CHAIRMAN STRAIN: That's fine. MR. BELLOWS: -- labeled as lake. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: That would work. Anything, as long as we know -- we get some clarification on it. On your table four, let's start with -- Brad touched on it, minimum lot width. You don't need that anymore with the footnote five. Because these are units you're not going to -- building setbacks on a cul-de-sac always have to start from the setback area, and the building has to have a minimum width and size, and it has to move further back in the cul-de-sac until you get to that. You can't take the building -- you're not going to chop a building and reduce it by, what is it, I forgot the percentage -- 29 percent if it's on a cul-de-sac, because you're building square buildings. So can we drop that footnote from minimum lot width? MR. UNDERHILL: Yes, those notes, the footnotes are carried over from the original table. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: I know they are, but that means you guys should have caught it before today's meeting, so now we'll go through each one and correct the ones that were caught. MR. UNDERHILL: Yes, number five can be dropped. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. If you go down to number three it says, building heights, see Section 1.6. Is that the right section reference? I think it's 1.8. MR. ANDERSON: It's what we have on ours. That's the new format. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Let me see what -- because I pulled the Page 23 May 6, 2010 PUD. Only problem is I didn't print the whole thing. County won't give me a printer. COMMISSIONER CARON: In the ordinance it says 1.8, see Section 1.8. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: I know. But I think it should be 1.6. COMMISSIONER CARON: Oh, I'm sorry, I thought I heard just the opposite. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Mark, in the version they gave us, it is 1.8 in the ordinance. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: I know. You guys are -- here, okay. MR. ANDERSON: It is 1.8. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: It is 1.8. Yeah, I've got the page now. Building height definition is 1.8 on Page 13. So you really want to change that reference in footprint three; do you not? COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Yes. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: The table four I'm looking at that I thought was provided by you guys shows see Section 1.6. What table four are you looking at? Because that may solve a lot of our -- MR. ANDERSON: We don't -- we're not doing anything with the table four. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. I have a table titled development standards for AC/R3 residential district. Is that the table we're working from? MR. ANDERSON: Yes, sir. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Well, wait a minute. What Mark's confused with, on County's stationery there is a table four, which made no sense. And I don't know why that was in there. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: I don't either, but it was in the packet and that's the packet we're reviewing today, so -- COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: If you loom at the resolution, the table attached to that I think would be the -- which is a 2-A. All Page 24 May 6, 2010 those references are to 2-A. MR. ANDERSON: Are they included? COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: And you are right, it says 1.6 on that table four. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Could someone put the table that -- there's multiple tables in my packet. So could someone put the table that you're trying to get approved on the screen today in front of us here. Okay. So your table says 1.8, mine says 1.6. Let me compare my notes to yours, then maybe I'll have less questions then. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Ray, put the one that's in the resolution, because you get the whole table on one sheet. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Hi, Steve. MR. WILLIAMS: Commissioner Strain, if I could introduce -- your table four that you saw, your source of confusion, was the original version. We renamed it to 2-A. It has been updated. I have a new ordinance for you, if you'd like me to distribute it. And then we'll all be on the same -- CHAIRMAN STRAIN: You're right. And you asked me before the meeting started if you could distribute that and I forgot. So why don't you distribute and we'll just work off of that. That would be great, thank you. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Is this different from the one in the packet? MR. WILLIAMS: Not in substance, only in format. But it does have clarification. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Thank you. Sorry I didn't -- I forgot our discussion. Okay, then Bruce, we'll just go back and I'll continue with still the new table that was just passed out. I shouldn't say new, but the corrected resolution still has some footnotes I want to question on it. It does have the correct building height reference in the code into Page 25 May 6, 2010 the PUD. It has a reference under accessory rear yard setback to item two. That's for a golf course. There is no golf course. Can we for clarity just drop item two as well? Is that a yes or no? MR. UNDERHILL: Yes, we can drop the reference to the golf course. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: So we drop footnote two. Guys, this is going to be painful if we walk through these and it takes a while. If you don't have a golf course, you don't need footnote two. So why don't we drop it. We don't have a -- MR. UNDERHILL: We still need the reference to the lake in that footnote, but we don't need the reference to the golf course. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. We'll drop the -- just the golf course reference. We move down to 10, accessory use under 10. Can you explain how that would work with this building? And number 11, while you're at it. MR. UNDERHILL: Ten certainly can be eliminated. There is a comment, pool building. We would like to main -- it's constructed. Again, we'd like to keep note 11, only to the extent that we don't make the existing building nonconforming. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Well, let me-- CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Go ahead. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: You wouldn't build the existing building to table 2.A. So this is only table 2.A. You would use table two. MR. UNDERHILL: Okay. I'll agree with that. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: So now we can drop 10, and what did you say about II? Is that -- MR. UNDERHILL: Eleven, I think we can probably drop that also. Page 26 May 6, 2010 CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Now, I'm not trying to mess up your plan. I'm not against it. I'm just -- when these tables are written with all these footnotes, it's not -- we shouldn't just carry over the old notes from another table, we should make sure the notes that we're carrying and using are specific to the new table that we've created. That's all I'm trying to correct here today. So that when staff goes in and they have to find a footnote that applies, nobody's sitting here doing what I'm trying to do, figure out how it applies to this project. It simply either does or does not, and we've got it ironed down to the ones that do. And the last one on this page is number 12, the common architectural features such as archways, arbors and courtyard entry features, aren't those addressed in our LDC as exceptions to the setback standards? I mean, if they are, then why are we being redundant here? And how does that redundancy clash possibly with the LDC? MR. UNDERHILL: Again, I think that we could just eliminate that footnote. I don't think it's going to cause us any harm. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: And Mark, that would be a good idea. Because essentially they could build into the right-of-way area that they're putting if we let that stay there. And again, if you needed it, you could go back to table two, since you can mix and match and get it. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Number six, how does that apply to this project? At least the table -- how does it apply to the new product you're trying to put there? I understand how part of it does, but I'm worried about the alley. You don't have an alley, so can we clean that up to be more -- or are you considering some of these alleys in some manner? MR. UNDERHILL: No, we don't have any alleys. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: When you come back for consent Page 27 May 6, 2010 agenda, could you clean up the language in number six to make sure it applies to the uses and the way you're laying out this project? If you don't have an alley, then drop that reference and leave it just so it's what's there. MR. UNDERHILL: Yes, sir. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. I think that's it. So you're going to clean up two and six, and you're going to drop five, 10, 11 and 12. You're going to fix the amended area as we discussed earlier. And I think that's it. Anybody else have any questions? COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: On the footnotes? CHAIRMAN STRAIN: On any of it. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Yeah, I do. You're referencing the table one. We've never seen a table 1. What is table I? In Section 3 of the development standards you're adding a paragraph A and it says tables 1, 2 and 2.A. What was table one? I mean -- MR. WILLIAMS: In may. Steve Williams. It is in the general PUD documents. It is the development standards for R -1 residential district. It's just referencing the general PUD. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: But it wasn't in our copy of the PUD standards, the full Section 1. So that's okay, as long as it doesn't hurt anything being there, in your opinion. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, any other questions of the applicant at this time? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, thank you. Staff report, please. MS. DESELEM: Good morning. For the record, Kay Deselem, Principal Planner with Zoning. In the newly named growth management division you have Page 28 May 6, 2010 before you a staff report that's dated last revision of April 19th, 2010. The staff report goes into detail providing the information such as location, project description, adjacent zoning, noting that it only includes the adjacent zoning to the site where the amendment is to be applicable. It has Growth Management Plan consistency analysis. Staff is recommending that it be found consistent -- it being the petition -- be found consistent with the Growth Management Plan. You also have the review comments from the various reviewing entities. And you also have the findings of fact for the PUD and rezoning sections of the Land Development Code to support our recommendation of approval. And if you have any questions, I'd be happy to address them. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, are there any questions of staff? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Thanks, Kay. COMMISSIONER CARON: Actually, I have a question. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: In the newly named department. Go ahead, Donna. COMMISSIONER CARON: The deviation from LDC Section 4.05.02.F, which states no motor vehicle shall have to back onto any street from an off-street parking facility. So when these were originally just multi-unit family dwellings, that doesn't apply? MS. DESELEM: Correct. Because they were designed under the auspices of one building and they had a parking lot. Because of the change that they're proposing now, in order to meet the standards, it kind of creates a lot frontage issue and a road access issue. So this is just to recognize what's already there and addresses that particular portion of the code. Because normally if you had a single-family house or a two-family house, you'd have road frontage. And the way these are designed, they spill onto a parking lot, per se. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Oh, I see what you're saying, it spills Page 29 May 6, 2010 onto the parking area. Okay, thanks. Anybody else have any questions of staff? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, thank you, Kay. Are there public speak -- go ahead, Brad. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Yeah, I just have one more question for the engineer from Banks. If you look at your sheet, the site plan sheet one of one, you have a note that says, shaded area indicates proposed right-of-way. And that doesn't make any sense to me. Is that floating or is that -- what is that telling us? Because the shaded area is actually representing your -- or at least the hatched area. MR. UNDERHILL: The hatched area is our proposed right-of-way, if you will. It includes the parking, utility easements, grassed areas. But the shape of it's necessary to create frontage on a street. It also is bounded by the limits of the existing condominiums, which is why it's not concentric or consistent where there's existing buildings. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Okay, so the right-of-ways is essentially going to include everything but the building. MR. UNDERHILL: That's correct. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: And around the perimeters some. Okay, I do think the note should be moved to where the arrow is, makes sense, don't you? It kind of floated, slid down, I think. MR. UNDERHILL: Yes. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Okay. So when we call it a right-of-way, it's not a road right-of-way then, because essentially it's going between buildings and everything else, right? MR. UNDERHILL: It's kind of that round peg, square hole thing with trying to meet the rules for -- to create lot frontage on a street and Page 30 May 6,2010 to map the existing development that -- and to continue the existing development pattern that's already there and approved. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Okay. So to get that -- on the end units that one in the rear to essentially front on a right-of-way. MR. UNDERHILL: Correct. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: All right, thank you. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: When people come in to buy these, in the past in the first phase of the project they would have come in and bought a condominium with certain common area rights. The condominium is a piece of the building, and in their condo dock that piece would have been described as a particular unit that they're buying, up to the common walls and all that. And now what you're doing, instead of buying into a condominium, they're buying a fee simple for the footprint area of the unit that they encompass, with rights to the general right-of-way surrounding it. Is that -- MR. UNDERHILL: That's very accurate. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. And how are you combining the operations of the former phased condominium to the fee simple selling process? How are these -- are they all going to be one HOA? MR. UNDERHILL: There will be several HOA's and -- at least two. I think there's a master and then there may be three. But it's to maintain the consistency and the rights that -- throughout the development. The intent is to try to get give the platted lots the same rights as the condominium lots have and not create any inconsistencies just due to the ownership. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: So you probably need cross easements and stuff like that back and forth. How do you -- I'm kind of curious, because this is kind of like a really unique animal. You -- the people that own the condominium have to pay condominium fees and dues based upon proposed condominium budget that the developer !,ruarantees for a certain period Page 31 May 6, 2010 of time. Now when you get into these fee simple, you're going to set up an HOA, I assume, and use an HOA budget that you're going to have to back for a certain period of time and then they contribute to the HOA budget and the HOA board of directors then decides how to spend the money once they take over. Is that how it's all going to come together? MR. UNDERHILL: I think that's appropriate. There is a master fee? Right, there is a master association that includes both the lots and the condos. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Who gets the benefit, the costs, the maintenance and the other issues involved in the rec area? MR. UNDERHILL: That's going to be one for the master. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Of the overall. The condo, and HOA are sub to the master. MR. UNDERHILL: Correct. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: It's pretty interesting. Great. Anybody else? COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Well, I mean, the real thrill is the sprinkling of the buildings without going through the party walls. MR. UNDERHILL: There's a number of issues like that with sidewalks and utilities and fire services. And yes, that will have to be well documented in the -- all the documents. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: And this is solely to create something you can market in this economy? MR. UNDERHILL: Yes, sir. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Does all these additional problems to make this work increase your cost? I mean, I know it does because you're here today. But let's say -- let's forget that. Say you've been set up from this way from the beginning. To build the fee simple on the footprint like it is or the condominium on the parcel like it is, do you have a difference in cost? Page 32 May 6,2010 MR. UNDERHILL: It's all the same hard costs. I mean, it's just the -- CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Legal costs. MR. UNDERHILL: -- soft costs, the legal and engineering to create the layers in the associations. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Well, it's going to set a precedent for sure. I don't think we've had one like this come through before. But now that I think we understand it better, we may see more. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: I think it's going to cost more. Because you have -- now you have townhouse fire walls between units. The other units didn't have that. The sprinkler system can't go through party wall. All the -- none of the utilities can. You'll enjoy it. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Interesting to see how you have to meter it from utilities, water and stuff like that. MR. UNDERHILL: It's all master metered right now. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: The whole project is? So how do you break down to individual meters in the fee simple product? MR. UNDERHILL: There's not going to be meters. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: So one guy's -- so everybody pays a percentage of the pro rata share of the budget. MR. UNDERHILL: Yes. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: So if someone uses 10 times more water than the guy that's up north 10 months of the year, the guy that's down here for two months of the year, he still pays for all that time the other guy uses. Wow, that will be interesting. We'll have to keep an eye on it. Thank you. Anybody else have any questions? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Are there any public speakers, Ray? MR. BELLOWS: No public speakers have registered. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Anybody from the public wish to speak? Page 33 May 6,2010 (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, with that, we'll close the public hearing and entertain a motion. Before we do, maybe for discussion, we had asked that they amend the PUD area to include all of the AC/R3 with the designation of lake for that part that is actually being used as lake in the north. They're going to have to relocate the right-of-way arrows so that they do actually go into the shaded areas on the map in front of us. They're going to drop footnotes five, 10, 11 and 12. They're going to modify the language in footnote two and six. I believe that's all we discussed. Is there any more for discussion? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, ifnot, is there a motion with those stipulations? COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: I'll make it. I move we forward PUDA-PL-2009-1499, Heritage Bay PUD, with a recommendation of approval. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Subject to the stipulations that were noted? COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Of course, yeah. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, is there a second? COMMISSIONER WOLFLEY: I'll second. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Mr. Wolfley seconded. Is there a discussion? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: All those in favor, signifY by saying aye. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Aye. COMMISSIONER WOLFLEY: Aye. COMMISSIONER MIDNEY: Aye. COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Aye. Page 34 May 6, 2010 COMMISSIONER CARON: Aye. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Aye. Anybody opposed? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Motion carries 6-0. Thank you all. It was a learning experience. For that we actually do enjoy it. Item #11 NEW BUSINESS - CIE/ AUIR DISCUSSION CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay, we have some new business, but the next on the agenda is old business. Is there any old business today? Okay, new business. Mr. Bosi. The CIE, the AUIR discussion. That was passed out to us at our last meeting. And of course Mike, you probably got a word from Nick. I'd like to know what's so high risk about us. But if he didn't warn you, he should have. Anyway, go ahead. MR. BOSI: Mike Bosi, with the Comprehensive Planning Section of the EECPZ Department. Engineering, Environmental, Comprehensive Planning, Zoning. Transportation in there as well. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Why don't you throw utilities and parks and rec in too, just for the heck of it. MR. BOSI: Bill put a limit on it in terms of his expertise. And what was distributed at the prior CCPC meeting was the proposal to combine the AUIR and the CIE. The direction that we had received was to look at the two processes. There was an apparent disconnect within the process based upon a number of the comments, the number of the issues that had arised (sic) over the past couple of years between the budget process, the AUIR process and the capital Page 35 May 6,2010 improvement process. And there's three different phases, three different snapshots in times. And those snapshots in times have -- were leading to -- I don't want to say disconnect, but differences within numbers in revenue streams and projections and costs associated with each one of the projects associated with the capital improvement programs that were contained in the AUIR, the capital improvement programs that were contained in the CIE. Originally when we tried to do the combination, we were thinking that we would have the AUIR and the CIE be heard in the spring because we wanted to -- we wanted a natural progression to the budget discussions that happen in June. The problem with that is we would be working upon one population numbers that were a year old, because the BEBR populations do not come out till the end of March, and we're obligated to use the most currents BEBR populations. To the revenue projections and the costs associated, the impact fee projections, all the revenue fiscal numbers were going to be almost a year old, because budget in 0 and B utilizes February, March, April and May to coalesce all the financial numbers that go into the tentative budget hearings that go before the Board of County Commissioners in June. Based upon that, we did not want to give up on the idea of combining the two, so we said why not have the CIE track the current schedule of the AUIR. And one of the additional benefits that are provided with that is in 2011 we have to by December 1st adopt a financially feasible CIE. And the way that we've been adopting our CIE has been in February and March of the year. Well, our CIE was lagging a year behind our actual budgetary process, and the capital improvement programs that have been associated with the programs within that CIE. Page 36 May 6, 2010 So with the combination of the CIE and the AUIR being tracked in the fall, we'll be able to attain that statutory compliance with the transmittal of the CIE in early November to the Department of Community Affairs. And one of the main advantages was cost savings. In terms of duplication of meetings, duplications of procedure, and there was an estimation that was done in-house that potentially with the combination of these two processes we may be able to save 23,700 tax dollars that could be reallocated to another specific activity. That's based upon staff hours for the various departments, for utilities, for transportation, for parks, for all the contributing members of the CIE, as well as the time associated and the cost associated with the public hearings, the advertising for the Planning Commission and the Board of County Commissioners. We've had the internal discussions amongst staff with the County Attorney's Office. We believe that we will still maintain the integrity of the codes as specified and be able to a attain the increase in efficiencies that -- based on this budgetary environment that we find ourselves in we're all striving to do in terms of look at our process and look at where we can maybe improve upon those processes in the terms of efficiency. With that, I would enjoy any questions that the Planning Commission may have about the process and some of the cautions that may be put forward. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Anybody have any questions? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Mike, why do you think we're high risk? MR. BOSI: High risk? I don't think the Planning Commission's high risk. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Who wrote this, the executive summary? Page 37 May 6, 2010 MR. BOSI: I did. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Who wrote the project management plan? MR. BOSI: It was myself. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Why do you think we're high risk? Page 7, 10.A. Nick didn't brief you on this, huh? He always says we're high risk, but I didn't know it was inherent in the whole department, so -- MR. BOSI: No, sir, I wasn't briefed upon the statement of high risk. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Risk management, 10.A. Project scope management talks about the Planning Commission and Productivity Committee. Risk is high. I'd just like to know why these two committees are so high risk. Just curious. Because maybe we should get insurance or something. I'm not sure. MR. BOSI: What that refers to is the documents contained within the AUIR within the CIE. And the amount of changes that can be contained or initiated from the CCPC review, based upon valid concerns, based upon valid analysis that there's traditionally a number of changes that will happen to that document from what staff puts together, based upon the required population, against the level of service standards, the timing of the projects, the location of some of the specifics of the projects, and the recommendations that have come from the Planning Commission and the Productivity Committee normally has a tremendous altering effect upon that document. So when we utilized the term high risk, I guess it's not in the traditional sense that there's danger associated with it, it's that the document will be modified substantially from its original base or form. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: And I kind of thought that's the direction you were going, but I kind of -- it was good to hear that you consider us a high risk because we do our job. So that's not a bad Page 38 May 6, 2010 thing. MR. BOSI: In terms of -- I think they're exhaustive in terms of the job that you -- and one thing that I wanted to mention to the Planning Commission is there's a high degree of probability that you will be reviewing the AUIR/CIE this year on a solo capacity, in terms of my interaction with Ms. Vasey from the Productivity Committee who usually takes the lead in the AUIR/CIE review, based upon the lack of projects that will be put forward in the AUIR, the CIE. And their specific task is fiscal review and fiscal analysis. Based upon the lack of fiscal outlays that they see, they're questioning the value of their time spent in that regard. So at their next meeting I believe they're going to debate whether they want to have one -- you know, their sub-committee reviewing and participating. And I will provide the Planning Commission an update as to whether you're going to have to shoulder that burden all yourself this year. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Well, no, I think that's fine. We try to focus more on the zoning issues to begin with anyway, so -- because that is what our -- we're supposed to be looking at. I think that would work fine. Well, you must be working a lot with Nick, because you've gained some of his abilities to say the right things at the right time at public meetings. MR. BOSI: I try to take my lead from the director, without a doubt. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Watch -- good way to explain the risk is high. I think that's great. Great job. MR. BOSI: I appreciate that. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Are there any other questions from the Planning Commission? Mr. Schiffer? Page 39 May 6,2010 COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Mike, what's a good reason that we had the two of them separated? I mean, I can't think of one. MR. BOSI: Well, one of the reasons that it was separated -- and I'm not sure what the motivation was behind it -- was within the code it says the AUIR should be approved before the CIE. And that does get into one point that we're going to have to do during these upcoming meetings. We will have to hear the AUIR, as we traditionally do. We'll have to hear the AUIR, convene that meeting, open up the CIE, and on a procedural manner, you know, approve the individual components of the CIE. But I'm not sure why -- well, here's my guess as to why it was separated. Because the Category A facilities are the only ones that are contained in the CIE, but this county has a strong desire to publicly vet the level of service standards that are associated with the Category B facilities, your libraries, your jails, your dependent fire districts, your government buildings, those aren't traditionally heard in the CIE. So they wanted a document where we're going to talk about all the levels of services, Category A and Category B facilities, which is our AUIR, which is unique to this county. And then we'll have the statutory required CIE, which only deals with the Category A facilities, which are the concurrency management component. So I think that's why we had the two separated. But I think you can still gain the intent with the culmination of the two without losing any of the effectiveness of each of those documents. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: So long as you keep the sequence in that order. MR. BOSI: Yes. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: I agree. And Mark, I think every document's at risk when it comes before this board, so -- CHAIRMAN STRAIN: And he could have said that too. Then it Page 40 May 6,2010 would have posed more questions. Okay, thank you. Anybody else have any questions on this issue? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: And Nick, are you looking for any kind of comments from us or just you're going to -- now that you've heard it you can say we listened to it and you're going to take it to the board, or what would you like? MR. CASALANGUIDA: Consensus, if I could, from the Planning Commission that you think it's a good idea. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: I move we accept it. COMMISSIONER CARON: Second. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Motion's been made and seconded by Commissioner Caron. Is all -- discussion? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: All in favor, signify by saying aye. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Aye. COMMISSIONER WOLFLEY: Aye. COMMISSIONER MIDNEY: Aye. COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Aye. COMMISSIONER CARON: Aye. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Aye. Any opposed? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Motion carries 6-0. Nick? MR. CASALANGUIDA: Sure, we'll continue to bring items like this forward. The challenge we face is that we're becoming the change machine. Every time we find something we're trying to fix it. We can only handle so many changes at one time, so we're trying to space these out and looking at the best and most productive way to do our business. Page 41 May 6, 2010 But you had mentioned today the sign variance, you've mentioned pool cages in the past. We're working with the County Attorney's Office. So I think, you know, once a month, once every two months we'll bring something forward that makes sense and have you look at it, analyze it with us, and if you agree we'll move forward to, you know, do things like that. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Sounds good. Anything else on today's agenda from anybody on the Planning Commission? (No response.) CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Public's gone. No public comment. Can't be anymore discussion. Motion to adjourn? COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: So moved. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Mr. Schiffer. Seconded by Ms. Caron. All in favor, signify by saying aye. COMMISSIONER SCHIFFER: Aye. COMMISSIONER WOLFLEY: Aye. COMMISSIONER MIDNEY: Aye. COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Aye. COMMISSIONER CARON: Aye. CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Aye. Motion carries 6-0. We're out of here. Thank you. ***** There being no further business for the good of the County, the meeting was adjourned by order of the Chair at 9:37 a.m. Page 42 May 6, 2010 COLLIER COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION MARK STRAIN, Chairman These minutes approved by the board on presented or as corrected as Transcript prepared on behalf of Gregory Reporting Service, Inc., by Cherie' R. Nottingham. Page 43 ~ CoIU~r County ...._ ~,..,,~;.J;!'It:~...~"'''.I<~ __",,~'''"'-'=-'. ''''~"..,~ -."....-' ''''b~,.~..--''' ~>m.:';; Community Development & Environmental Services Division Engineering, Environmental, Comprehensive Planning & Zoning Services May 27, 2010 Mr. David Turley PO BOX 111385 Naples, FL 34108 Reference: BD-PL2009-918, Hickory Harbour Condominium Dear Mr. Turley: On Tuesday, May 6, 20 I 0, the Collier County Planning Commission heard and approved Petition No. BD-PL2009-918. A copy ofCCPC Resolution No. 10-02 is enclosed approving this petition. Please be advised that Section 10.03.05 B.3 of the Land Development Code requires an applicant to remove their public hearing advertising sign(s) after final action is taken by the Board of County Commissioners. Based on the Board's final action on this item, please remove all public hearing advertising sign(s) inunediately. If you have any questions, please contact me at (239) 252-2942. Sincerely, J\~~C~~ Ashley Caserta Senior Planner Enclosure CC: Hickory Harbour Condo Inc, 226 3rd Street, Apt 108, Bonita Springs, FL 34134 Land Dept. Property Appraiser M. Ocheltree, Graphics MUll tll6<<R~(BI}i1>>SP*PW1 File ~ \1iI Engineering, Environmental, Comprehensive Planning & Zoning Services. 2800 N, Horseshoe Drive. Naples, FL 34104 .239-252-2400 CCPC RESOLUTION NO. 10- 2 A RESOLUTION OF THE COLLIER COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION RELATING TO PETITION NUMBER BD-PL2009- 918 FOR AN EXTENSION OF AN EXISTING BOAT DOCK TO INCLUDE TWO NEW FINGER PIERS WITH THREE NEW SLIPS AND THE CONSTRUCTION OF A PROPOSED BOAT DOCK WITH EIGHT FINGER PIERS TO INCLUDE THIRTEEN NEW SLIPS, BOTH OVER THE MAXIMUM TWENTY FEET LIMIT PROVIDED IN SECTION 5.03.06E.l OF THE COLLIER COUNTY LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE ON PROPERTY HEREINAFTER DESCRIBED IN COLLIER COlJNTY, FLORIDA. WHEREAS, the Legislature of the State of Florida in Chapter 125, Florida Statutes, has conferred on all counties in Florida the power to establish, coordinate and enforce zoning and such business regulations as are necessary for the protection of the public; and WHEREAS, the County pursuant thereto has adopted a Land Development Code (LDC) (Ordinance 04-41, as amended) which establishes regulations for the zoning of particular geographic divisions of the County, among which are provisions for granting extensions for boat docks; and WHEREAS, the Collier County Planning Commission (CCPC), being duly appointed, has held a properly noticed public hearing and has considered the advisability of a l47-foot and 131- foot extension over the maximum 20-foot limit provided in LDC Section 5.03.06.1 to allow for a 167-foot boat dock facility and a 151-foot boat dock facility, respectively, in a Residential Multifamily (RMF-12) zoning district for the property hereinafter described; and WHEREAS, approval of the extensions will result in an additional sixteen slips for a combined total offorty slips; and WHEREAS, the CCPC has found as a matter of fact that satisfactory prOVISIOn and arrangement have been made concerning all applicable matters required by LDC Section 5.03.06; and WHEREAS, all interested parties have been given the opportunity to be heard by this Commission in public meeting assembled, and the Commission having considered all matters presented. NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED BY THE COLLIER COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION OF COLLIER COUNTY, FLORIDA, that: Petition Number BD-PL2009-918, filed on behalf of Hickory Harbour Condominium Association, Inc. by David Turley, with respect to the property hereinafter described as: Hickory Harbour Cando Dock / BD-PL2009-918 REV 4/30/10 ] of2 Part of Lot 6 of Block 0, Little Hickory Shores Unit 2, as described in Plat Book 3, Page 79, of the Public Records of Collier County, Florida (part of the Hickory Harbour Condominium) be and the same is hereby approved for a 147- foot and 131- foot extension over the maximum 20- foot limit provided in LDC Section 5.03.06.1 to allow for a I 67-foot boat dock facility and a 151- foot boat dock facility, respectively, as shown on the attached Proposed Site Plan, Exhibit A, in a Residential Multifamily (RMF-12) zoning district wherein said property is located, subject to the following conditions: I. A Site Improvement Plan shall be submitted and approved prior to the issuance of a building permit. 2. The existing 119-foot dock shall be allowed to remain and will be included on the Site Improvement Plan. BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED that this Resolution be recorded in the minutes of this Commission and filed with the County Clerk's Office. This Resolution adopted after motion, second and majority vote. Done this lo~ day of rnf\Y ,2010. ATTEST: ~ // ~1 5'-/~ -/0 Nick Casalanguii( ~,/ <- Community Development and Environmental Services Administrator COLLIER COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION COLLIER COUNTY, FLORIDA ~~c[~~ Approved for form and legal sufficiency: \\ii3~~ JennifeR>!. White Assistant County Attorney Attachment: Exhibit A - Proposed Site Plan 09-CPS-00990136 Hickory Harbour Condo Dock 1 BD-PL2009-918 REV. 4130110 20f2 r., - .... f.,- ",0, - .... 0,' :-co ~Ll.i ..g t:jt:: 2c.'l 1'::< :59 vi co "'....lCj C)c:i.:ll) ". :I:"< < '" ". 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