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BCC Minutes 03/17/1998 R REGULAR MEETING OF THE BOARD OF COUNTY COHMISSIONERS Naples, Florida, March 17, 1998 LET IT BE REMEMBERED, that the Board of County Commissioners, in and for the County of Collier, and also acting as the Board of Zoning Appeals and as the governing board(s) of such special districts as have been created according to law and having conducted business herein, met on this date at 9:00 a.m. in REGULAR SESSION in Building "F" of the Government Complex, East Naples, Florida, with the following members present: CHAIRPERSON: Barbara B. Berry Pamela S. Hac'Kie John C. Norris Timothy J. Constantine Timothy L. Hancock ALSO PRESENT: Robert Fernandez, County Administrator David Weigel, County Attorney Item #3 AGENDA AND CONSENT AGENDA - APPROVED AND/OR ADOPTED WITH CHANGES CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Good morning. I'd like to call to order the March 17th meeting of the Collier County Board of Commissioners. And we welcome all of our Irish friends today on their special day and all those who wish they were Irish. It's a pleasure to have Pastor Olson from Shepherd of the Glades Lutheran Church here this morning for our invocation. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Here he is. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Please rise and remain standing for the in -- and for the pledge of allegiance. REVEREND OLSON: Let us pray. Gracious God, we thank you for this beautiful morning. We ask that you help us always to remember the beauty of your creation. And Lord, we ask that you be present with us today. Be present in our hearts and in our minds. Help us to give -- give strength to us, and give your wisdom to us. Be especially, Lord, with those whose decisions affect the lives of many. And we ask that you help us to remember those who are less fortunate than ourselves, those who need us the most. And help us to care for them and love them as you have cared and loved for us. We ask these things in your name, we pray. Amen. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Amen. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Amen. (The Pledge of Allegiance was recited in unison.) CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Thank you, Pastor Olson. Mr. Fernandez, do we have any changes to the agenda this morning, please? MR. FERNANDEZ: Yes, ma'am. Good morning. First change is to add item 7(B), Howard E. Rice, secretary of the Marco Island Lions Club, requesting a waiver of permit fee. Also, we'd like to add item 7(C), Women's Health Week race, waiver of permit fee. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Didn't we do this? MR. FERNANDEZ: We'd like to add item 8(B)(2), approve the acquisition of services necessary for the design and construction associated with the dredging of Clam Pass prior to May 1st, 1998. Staff request. I'd like to continue a couple of items. The first is item 12(B)(1) to be continued to the March 24th meeting. This is petition PUD 97-18, requesting a fezone from RHF 6, RHF 12(6), and RHF 12 ST(6) to PUD to be known as the Dunes planned unit development for property located on the northwest corner of lllth Avenue North, Bluebill Avenue and Vanderbilt Drive. Petitioner's request. Also, continue item 16-A(7) to the March 24th meeting. It's the approval for recording the final plat of Glenn Eden, phase one. Staff request. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Mr. Fernandez, the Women's Health Week rings a bell of something I thought we did last week. Did we not take care of that entirely? I thought we -- did we give direction or authorize a waiver of permit fees last week? COMMISSIONER HAC'KIE: We did it last week without discussion, I thought. The Women's Health Week marathon or mini-marathon, whatever it was. MR. FERNANDEZ: The reason we add that is because a representative is here this morning with a letter for me saying to be here today, and -- COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: We did that. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: I think we did, too. MR. FERNANDEZ: We did do that last week. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: We did that last week. MR. FERNANDEZ: I apologize. Sorry. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: The good news is you got the result you wanted; the bad news is we wasted part of your morning. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: We would have wasted it last week if it had the date right. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: There you go. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Good luck with the event. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: It's done. UNIDENTIFIED VOICE: Here, so I'm not wasting my time. MR. FERNANDEZ: I apologize for the confusion. Sorry. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: 7:30 in the morning. Whoa. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: And then you run five miles. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: My daughter should be up by then. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Running at 7:30 in the morning isn't my idea of a way to start a day. UNIDENTIFIED VOICE: I will need that in writing. MR. FERNANDEZ: We'll send copies to you. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Mr. Fernandez, I have a question in regard to -- it seems like we've got a lot of things that are stacking up for next Tuesday. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Oh, man. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: I think maybe we need to take a look at that agenda, because I know there's some big items that may require some lengthy discussion, and we may need to take a look. It's just curious, because I've noticed as we've gone along here, a lot of things have been placed on the March 24th agenda, and it seems like it's getting longer and longer and longer. So we may want to take a look at that. MR. FERNANDEZ: It is. We were concerned about that when we were asked to continue this item to the 24th meeting. The problem is the next public hearing meeting is equally as packed. Our alternative is to go with an off public hearing day to consider some of these. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Or to put in a long day next week. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Yeah, and -- CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Well, I know that one -- one problem is that a couple of us have got to catch a plane. So this is going to be really exciting, come down to a photo finish of making the dash to the airport, so -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Well, you go ahead, we'll make the decisions. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: No problem. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: I don't think so. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Madam Chair, in the past when we have a time sensitive issue such as a board member needs to be -- you know, catch a plane or getting out of town, whatever that may be, those items requiring four affirmative votes, we tend to juggle the schedule and move those forward. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Move them up. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Yeah. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Okay. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: To make sure we have -- CHAIRPERSON BERRY: If there's anything that does, we will need to make sure that gets taken care of, but hopefully we'll be done by that time. Mr. Weigel? MR. WEIGEL: Thank you. In regard to -- the note in regard to 12(B)(1) continued to Hatch 24th, just to note for the record, there's a companion item that has been readvertised that will also be heard, vacation within the plat. This is a PUD fezone, this item, which will be heard. And I wanted the record to reflect it has been readvertised and noticed also for March 24th. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Okay. MR. WEIGEL: Additionally, if I may -- beyond this agenda -- this approval of this agenda today, I'd like to address the board and ask for direction in regard to a future agenda item. So I would appreciate it if you could come back to me after you finish with this morning's agenda. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: We'll do that. MR. WEIGEL: Thank you. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Very good. Commissioner Mac'Kie, do you have any changes to the agenda? COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: No. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Commissioner Norris? COHMISSIONER NORRIS: No changes today. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Commissioner Constantine? COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: No changes. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Commissioner Hancock? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: One item to add under Board of County Commissioners regarding economic development. Very brief. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Is this under item 107 CHAIRPERSON BERRY: That will be item 10-B. Okay. Very good. Do I have a motion then? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Motion to approve the agenda and consent agenda as amended. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Okay, we have a motion -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Second. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: -- and a second. All in favor? Opposed? (No response.) CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Motion carries five-zero. Item #4A HINUTES OF RGULAR HEETING OF FEBRUARY 24, 1998 - APPROVED AS PRESENTED COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Madam Chairman, I move approval of the minutes of the February 24th regular meeting. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: I have a motion. Do I have a second? COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Second. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Motion and a second. All in favor of approval of the February 24th meeting minutes. Opposed? (No response.) CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Motion carries five-zero. Item #5B EMPLOYEE SERVICE AWARDS - PRESENTED This morning, I have a service award to present. Would Pedro Hontero come forward, please. Pelican Bay services, five years. (Applause.) CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Thank you very much. Here's your certificate and your pin. Okay? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Congratulations. Item #5C1 PRESENTATION OF A CHECK IN THE AMOUNT OF $7,000 FROM THE COOL CRUISERS TO BENEFIT THE GOLDEN GATE COHMUNITY CENTER CHAIRPERSON BERRY: And this morning we have a representative here from the Cool Cruisers, which is going to present something to the commission benefiting the Golden Gate Community Center. Mr. Constantine? COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: We have a pretty active community center, as you know. And even with the expansion we did a few years ago, every room and gymnasium and all seem to be full all the time. We've got a very good staff. And maybe Janice and Keith and crew want to come up now. But Cool Cruisers put on a special event out there as a fundraiser for the community, raised a great deal of money, and they want to make that presentation this morning, if they can. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Turn around and face the camera. MS. HEDLAN: First of all, thank you for allowing us this time to present -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Only because we have to get it on the record, let me get this thing close to you. MS. HEDLAN: Okay. Thank you for allowing us this time to present this. This is part of the proceeds from our seventh annual car show that we held -- was held on January 25th, 1998, and on behalf of the Cool Cruisers, we'd like to give this check to you, okay -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Very good. MS. HEDLAN: -- to use with your funds over there, and we look forward to helping you in the near future also. Okay? (Applause.) CHAIRPERSON BERRY: We might note that this check is in the amount of $7,000 that's being presented, so thank you. COHHISSIONER HAC'KIE: Look at that, admire the necklace -- COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: My God, I'm having Indian flashbacks. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Admire the necklace, get the necklace. I love that. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: If only it would work with diamonds. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Thank you. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Great looking sneakers you got on there. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Oh, you want the sneakers, is that it? The message is, Ty, if you admire something, it's presented to -- okay? COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: I saw a really good laptop out there. Item #7A ALFRED LUCKERBAUER REGARDING THE ISLES OF CAPRI ADVISORY COMMITTEE - COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR TO PROVIDE UPDATE AT 3/24/98 MEETING CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Okay. Moving on then this morning to public petitions, we have Mr. Alfred Luckerbauer, regarding the Isle of Capri advisory committee. Would you come forward? Mr. Luckerbauer, you have ten minutes to make your presentation. The board then will take this under advisement and make a determination. If you have something to pass out, you may give it to Mr. Weigel. MR. LUCKERBAUER: For the record, Alfred Luckerbauer, resident of Isle of Capri and concerned taxpayer of Collier County. Madam Chairman, dear County Commissioners: First, a happy Saint Patrick's Day. COMMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Thank you. COMMISSIONER NORRIS: Thank you. MR. LUCKERBAUER: I'm very happy to be a resident of Collier County, and I'm an admirer of your professional ways to run this county and to get -- and try to get the best use for our tax dollars. It is my understanding you also hire people to get the job done and you look for advice at different advisory committees. One of the advisory committees is outlined in ordinance section 122-609.A, and it refers to the advisory committee of the Isle of Capri Municipal Rescue and Fire Services Taxing District, which was created for the purpose of providing rescue and fire control services to the residents of the area. Please let me point out to you, it says first rescue, and second, fire control services. Section 122-609, point A, "For the purpose of carrying into effect this article, the board of county commissioners shall appoint a committee of three to five electors residing within the district to serve staggered terms of two years each, to hold meetings at such times and places as it shall determine for the purpose of advising the board regarding the affairs of the district." And B, "The advisory committee shall annually prepare a district budget and estimate the funds, their purpose and the ad valorem taxes necessary to carry out the provisions of this article for the following fiscal year, as prescribed in Florida statute, chapter 129." In addition to this ordinance, on June 27th, there was a memorandum sent to Jeff Page from the county attorney's office, and I'm just guessing, I don't know the details on it, but it probably had to do with the regrets from the advisory committee, what their responsibilities are, because it started out, "You explained that the Isles of Capri Municipal Rescue and Fire Service Taxing District Advisory Board is requesting clarification as to their authority and function. Specifically, they want to know if the members of the Isles of Capri Municipal Rescue and Fire Services Taxing District make hiring and firing decisions, procurement decisions and other management decisions." And the answer was no. It gives an explanation from the statutes, and the last three lines say, "The chief of the Isles of Capri Municipal Rescue and Fire Service Taxing District is an employee of the Board of County Commissioners who acts as the liaison and the facilitator between the advisory committee and the Board of County Commissioners." You probably already asked the question, why is he telling us all these paragraphs we already know? Here's the answer. The people you appointed in the past are not willing to follow this guideline and any other law which is connected with the appointment, like examples, the Florida Sunshine Law. The behavior of some members of the advisory committee is far from an acceptable level of common communication. I have only a few minutes to direct your attention to the constant destructive actions by the advisory committee against the people of Isle of Capri by negotiating secret agreements or prohibiting an increase of medical services to the residents which are in need of such services, and should get the same service with the same response time, like an EHS, like any other taxpayer in Collier County. My personal attention to this problem started on November 3rd, '97 at a public meeting. I could not find any meaning to the aggressions and discussions between firefighters of East Naples and Marco Island and residents and non-residents of Isle of Capri. Next day, I attended my first meeting in this room and heard about a request to look into a two-phase approach regarding a contract with East Naples and Isles of Capri. In the afternoon, I went to Phil Poparichi, a member of the advisory committee and resident of Isle of Capri, and asked for more information about this matter, and if there were any problems. He referred me to read the minutes from the meetings and to get the minutes from Chief Rodriguez. The results from my attempt to obtain minutes is documented in the memorandum of November 25th, '97, written to Diane Flagg from Emilio Rodriguez regarding advisory board minutes. In short, the result, I could not get any copies or information on previous meetings. This incident started also an investigation for violating the Florida Sunshine Law, and to my knowledge, it is still pending. Okay. So I started to attend the public advisory committee meetings to get more informations about the proposed contract with East Naples. Every single meeting I attended had absolutely nothing to do with the guidelines in section 122, or had any constructive nature. No, it was the opposite. A constant attack against the Fire Chief Emilio Rodriguez, Diane Flagg, Jeff Page, specifically by Mr. Ed Huegel. It even came to several complaints against Mr. Huegel, like a sexual harassment complaint by a paramedic. If you watch the news, maybe that's fashionable. The findings should be actually in the office. But just a short sentence from the findings from the report which says, "This investigator finds that the comments which have been reported and/or admitted in attachment A and B, can reasonably be found to have sexual connotations and to contribute to an offensive work environment." The volunteer force, which provides the service for free, which means no cost to the taxpayer, is under constant attack by former Chairman Skip Volpe and Ed Huegel. Please read the resignation letter of the firefighter volunteer and also the letter to the advisory committee from the vice president of volunteers. May I ask you a question? Is this the purpose of the advisory committee? But this is only the tip of the iceberg. The real target is our fire chief, Emilio Rodriguez. It would take me another hour to tell you how much time Mr. Rodriguez spent in the last year to write statements and answer allegations which are totally unfounded. He does not have a secretary. He has to do it on his free time. Or we the taxpayers have to pay for it. It involves meetings with other staff members, more members, letters. My question, who pays for it? Every taxpayer in Collier County. And this waste of tax dollars is created by people which should only advise you and not terrorize the people which provide a needed service to our community to protect lives and property. The county administrator has a lot of copies of letters, memos, and probably has to ask for a special budget to handle the paper trail which is willingly created by the special advisors to continue to harass the operation on the Isles of Capri. You have in your package all the copies of the workplace harassment complaint. It takes so far two months to be investigated by Jennifer Edwards. I understand it will take her a long time to listen to all the audio tapes or read all the minutes from the last year to see all the attacks by the advisory committee against the operation of Isle of Capri and Chief Rodriguez. Who pays for it? The taxpayers of Collier County. I was asked this morning to bring you a few cards that are addressed to Chairman Barbara Berry. Would you please maybe pass it on? I was asked by a resident of the island who spent, he told me, about three hours just to collect a few cards and signatures. I understand you have to answer every resident in writing. My question, who pays for it? The taxpayers of Collier County. In summary, it seems to me that the advisory committee you appointed to advise you and help you to use the taxpayers' money to the benefit of the community and to support a rescue and fire protection operation for the residents on Isle of Capri became a major liability to the taxpayers of Collier County and a real comedy club to the people of Isle of Capri. I have full confidence in your ability and willingness to replace the members of the present advisory committee with new members as soon as possible to ensure the safety and best service possible to the residents of Isle of Capri. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Thank you, Mr. Luckerbauer. MR. LUCKERBAUER: Do you have any questions or do you need any more documentation? COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: I'll tell you my -- you know, my impression is that we've gotten so much correspondence and so many complaints that we have to at least ask staff to look into this to see, you know, if this is a situation that might require something as radical as removing members from a board if they are interfering with the operations of county department work. You know, I don't know what the answer to that question is, but I think that we have to respond to such serious complaints -- COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Well -- COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Excuse me, Mr. Norris. -- that we have to respond to such serious complaints with some investigation at a minimum by staff to find out if the problem is as serious as it sounds. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Well -- CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Commissioner Norris? COHMISSIONER NORRIS: -- part of the answer to that question is that they are advisory in nature, and they don't control the operation. I mean, Mr. Luckerbauer is arguing both sides of the fence here. He's saying -- he's saying on the one hand that the advisory committee is strictly advisory, which is correct, and they cannot interfere with operations, then on the other hand he's saying remove them because they're interfering with operations. So, you know, you can't make both sides of the argument. You've got to pick one. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Hay I respond to that to tell you there are letters in here from the chief down there saying that -- from him, from the chief, saying that the advisory board members attempt to interfere with his operations. And that's the crux of the issue. Whether they're trying to -- I pray that they're not able to, but if they're trying to, that's a problem. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Commissioner Hancock? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Mr. Luckerbauer's complaints, whether valid or not, have a proper chain of command that they must follow. One is that if a chief of that fire district, employed by the county, has a problem with advisory board members interfering with his duty, he reports it to his supervisor, who in turn reports it to their chain of command, the county administrator, and it is handled administratively. Mr. Fernandez, have you received a complaint from the chief to your office or through Diane Flagg that indicates he is not being able to perform his duties due to the members of the advisory board? MR. FERNANDEZ: I have received a verbal report to that effect. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay, a verbal report from the chief? MR. FERNANDEZ: From the director of the department. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. Then I think the appropriate question is, Mr. Fernandez, what action is being taken to resolve that? Has it timely -- has it been allowed to resolve itself in a timely manner? In other words, I think this is an administrative issue which is what we hired Mr. Fernandez for, and we need to look to him to determine whether or not there is a problem. Not to discount Mr. Luckerbauer's statements in any way, but they must follow the chain of command before we interject ourselves and start giving direction. And I don't know that that has or has not occurred. So maybe the most appropriate thing is, since this is a public petition, is we ask Mr. Fernandez for an update next week on this particular matter, and if we find that action insufficient, we can give direction at that time. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: I'd be satisfied with that, just -- because it is exactly the kind of thing that Mr. Fernandez should be handling. And I trust his doing that, if he'll just bring some attention to it. MR. LUCKERBAUER: Hay I answer both questions? First, Mr. Norris, you're absolutely right. And I know exactly what you're saying, I am arguing both sides. But that's why I gave you the copies. There was a lot of correspondence which went sometimes, not even to Mr. Fernandez, because in the chain of command -- what Mr. Hancock points out, there's also Mr. Ochs. And I saw correspondence was stopped right there. And even he took over so Mrs. Edwards could not go on in the investigation. You have a copy of this letter. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: I do. MR. LUCKERBAUER: We have a very serious problem here -- COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Mr. Luckerbauer -- MR. LUCKERBAUER: -- because it's -- COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- Mr. Luckerbauer, I need to interrupt you, sir. You're given 10 minutes for public petition. You presented information to us. We have directed our county administrator to take action. And if in fact Mr. Ochs is stonewalling information, I am very confident that Mr. Fernandez can find that out. MR. LUCKERBAUER: I didn't say stonewalling. I'm saying he might have felt it's not important enough and that's why I'm here, because I learned the chain of commands, especially through Chairman Barbara Berry, which explained to me, you correspond only with the administrator, Mr. Fernandez, and if something comes up the chain of command and got stopped here, there's a gap. I'm not saying stonewalling. Now, it might not be -- because Mr. Ochs was one or two times down and was witnessing himself, and maybe he asks himself, when Mr. Huegel is addressing him, says, "Are you running the meeting, Leo, or what? What's going on?" COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Or, Mr. Luckerbauer, it might have been solved. So we will find that out next week, because Mr. Fernandez is going to answer those questions for us. MR. LUCKERBAUER: Okay. Thank you very much. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Thank you. MR. LUCKERBAUER: And have a good day. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Thank you. Item #9A REQUEST BY COUNTY ATTORNEY TO ADVERTISE ORDINANCE FOR INTERIM GOVERNMENTAL SERVICES - ORDINANCE TO BE HEARD ON 3/31/98 AT AT 1:00 P.M. SPECIAL MEETING CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Mr. Weigel? MR. WEIGEL: If I may, I have a time sensitive item in regard to a future agenda that I'd like to address with you now before you get into the meat of the agenda today. Thank you. Okay? Thank you. I want to report that yesterday, Mr. Yonkosky, assistant county attorney Heidi Ashton and I had our final meeting with outside counsel, Mr. Allen Watts, regarding the interim government services fee ordinance. The ordinance is ready for advertisement and for hearing. And looking ahead down the road of hearings -- hearing availability or board meeting dates, I note that March 31st, a fifth Tuesday of this month, is a workshop day, and I understand that the workshop is scheduled to be held at the North Water Treatment Plant, I believe, for the workshop purposes. COMMISSIONER NORRIS: That morning. MR. WEIGEL: It's off campus, in any event. MR. FERNANDEZ: It's at the Glades. COMMISSIONER NORRIS: At the Glades. MR. WEIGEL: At the Glades. But knowing the substance of the ordinance and its application date, which I can tell you now is looking to have an application time of April 1st and beyond, it would, I think, facilitate us if this could be heard as early as possible. If the March 31st date off campus does not work well as an agenda item for that, I would ask that you might consider perhaps even a separate agenda date, such as April 1st, or as close to April 1st as we may for that item. Otherwise, if need be, we can go to April 7th. But just even now to let the public and you know that it has a potential application date of April 1st and onward. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: And the reason we can't put it at the March 24th meeting is? MR. WEIGEL: Ten-day advertisement requirement. We had enough -- COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Can the board declare an emergency today and then you have seven days to advertise it? MR. WEIGEL: I would prefer that this ordinance of this import not be an emergency to go on that way. Although we could still advertise, even if it were declared to be an emergency. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: If we're going to call a special meeting, is there some reason why we couldn't do that the same day we do the workshop? MR. WEIGEL: Absolutely, you could. The question is just logistics, and that is if you wish to hear this as a meeting item at your off-campus location and then adjourn into your workshop -- CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Come up here and do it. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I think we'd better come here because -- CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Why don't we just come here at 9:00 in the morning and take care of that specific item and then go on to our workshop. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Well, what time is the workshop scheduled? MR. WEIGEL: It's scheduled for 9:00, I believe. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Can we -- could we do the workshop first and then come here? CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Why not? Well, I don't -- COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: As long as we're going to -- MR. WEIGEL: Either way is fine with me. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Is there any reason we can't do the workshop here? I know you want to get away from this format, but considering the item -- or if somewhere else closer by, anyway, just from a logistical standpoint? COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Well, there -- MR. FERNANDEZ: You can do the workshop anywhere you'd like. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Let's do it here. MR. FERNANDEZ: We thought it'd be nice to get away from the normal environment. But if you have this need, it may be that you'll have to do it here. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: I would like to not do it in this room myself, just personally. Is there a problem with meeting here at 8:00 and starting the workshop at 9:00? COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Not with me. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Because this isn't an item that for us is going to take a terrific amount of time, and there's only going to be probably a handful of speakers, at best. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Is that what you expect, Mr. Weigel? I would think that we're going to have the contractors turning out and that kind of stuff. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Yeah, I do, too. What's the objection to having the -- I mean, I understand it's nicer to do the workshop in a less formal atmosphere, but -- COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Let's do it here. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: -- is there any harm by doing it here? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: There's no harm. It's just that some situations are more conducive to the type of discussion we had the last time we did this, and this isn't one of them. But, you know, however we need to do it is fine with me. It would obviously be my preference to do it off-site, but-- MR. WEIGEL: Well, I would add that as far as the regular agenda item, that this would be -- it could be at any time during that day. It could be following the now regularly scheduled workshop off campus; if you wish to come back and we would just advertise accordingly for a time certain on that date, if that's any assistance to you. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Can the workshop -- I mean, have the workshop wherever we want it and then come back here at 1:007 CHAIRPERSON BERRY: We could do that. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: That would work fine. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: That's fine by me. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: That's fine. I can count three votes for doing that. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: That's fine. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Now four votes. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: All right. MR. WEIGEL: That's -- I appreciate very much your assistance and direction in that regard, and -- CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Okay. So then we'll go ahead and have the regularly scheduled workshop at 9:00 and then determine a time for this specific item to be heard here in these chambers. MR. WEIGEL: I will be going forward with the advertising immediately. We need to submit today. If one o'clock's too close to the lunch hour, or any nuances that you wish in that way? CHAIRPERSON BERRY: One thirty? COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: We have to advertise the times. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Let's say 1:00 and hit the drive-thru, folks. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Fast food junkie over here. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Those kids today have really done him in. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Yeah, I know. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Those kids. MR. WEIGEL: Thank you very much. I appreciate it. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Okay, thank you. Item #7B HOWARD E. RICE, SECRETARY OF THE MARCO ISLAND LIONS CLUB REQUESTING A WAIVER OF PERMIT FEE - APPROVED Next item is Mr. Howard Rice from the Marco Island Lions Club, requesting a waiver of a permit fee. Is he here? COMMISSIONER NORRIS: Mr. Rice couldn't make it this morning. This is something we've done on an annual basis for a number of years. But I'd like to ask the board to direct the staff to waive this fee. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Second. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Okay. We have a motion and a second. Any other discussion or questions? I call for the question. All in favor? Opposed? (No response.) CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Motion carries five-zero. Item #8A1 RESOLUTION 98-74 GRANTING EXTENSION TO OCTOBER 1, 1998 TO THE GOLDEN GATE HEALTH PARK PUD - ADOPTED CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Next item is 8A(1), recommendation -- recommendations relative to ordinance 92-82, the Golden Gate Health Park PUD. Mr. Nino. MR. NINO: Good morning. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Good morning. MR. NINO: Ron Nino, for the record. The Golden Gate Health Park PUD is now subject to a Sunsetting action. Staff is asking that you allow us an opportunity to revisit this PUD by requiring the petitioner to return within the -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Motion to approve staff recommendation. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Second. MR. NINO: Might I -- might I -- the petitioner has asked for an additional three months. We don't have a problem with that, changing the date of return to nine months instead of six months. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: When was this first passed? COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: '92, something like that. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: October of '92? CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Yes. MR. NINO: Yes. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Petitioner is here. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'm just curious, what -- I mean, everybody does their little six months. It's been six years. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I know it. MR. NINO: I believe the petitioner apprec -- believes they have a different development opportunity, and it's going to take them the additional time to respond to a new PUD with a different development strategy. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Maybe we want to hear from her. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: I don't have any problem with the additional three months, as long as there's going to be, you know, substantive changes to the PUD, you know, that I think at the outset this board's going to like. But I'd hate to see this thing come back materially the same with the delay, so -- COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'd like to hear if there's a unique reason, because, I mean, we've done a couple of dozen, at least, of these Sunset things, and I suspect they're going to do a couple dozen more in the coming year, and I don't want -- if there's a particular reason that's different from any other, we should hear that, but otherwise, I don't want to make some special grant for one of them, because then we'll hear that from everyone. MS. JENKINS: Good morning. Anita Jenkins with Wilson, Miller, Barton and Peek, representing the property owner. And there is a special reason that we would ask for an extension on the six months. And being handed out to you right now is the language that you sent to DCA regarding the interchange master plan that will be developed for activity center number nine. And this activity center will be created as a gateway to Collier County. And this master plan is to be initiated by property owners and their representatives within 60 days after the notice of compliance from DCA. And rather than setting a time certain when the PUD amendment would be submitted, we think that we would like to tie it to the adoption of this interchange master plan so our PUD amendment will comply with the intent of the interchange master plan. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Good enough reason for me. MS. JENKINS: So we would ask that you would consider 90 days after that adoption that we would submit the PUD amendment. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: What happens if the interchange master plan isn't completed by then? MS. JENKINS: Within 90 days, or -- COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: What happens if for some reason that drags on for 18 months? Does that me we don't hear back from you-all for 18 months? MS. JENKINS: It's our intent to initiate that process as soon as we have received notice of compliance from DCA. COMMISSIONER NORRIS: I don't think that answered your question. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: No, it didn't. MS. JENKINS: Well, if it would drag on, we could say we would do it within 90 days of the adoption of that interchange master plan and no longer than 12 months or something like that. If that would -- but I think that that's -- to have an opportunity to participate in that process to create that gateway is what the property owner would like to do. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: You know, I appreciate what you're trying to achieve, but I just hesitate to grant an extension that is essentially open-ended that way, or that you end up with 12 months beyond the six months. I mean, that's 18 months from now instead of six months from now, so -- COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Commissioner Constantine, if I could ask you, what is it particularly about this PUD that it's -- something -- what about it that is just sitting out there gives you cause for concern? COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: It's not this specific PUD. It's that we've had the great debate a couple years ago on the Sunset ordinance, and if we're going to comply with that and enforce that, we can't selectively say -- I mean, it's for everyone else at six months, and if it becomes 18 months for those folks -- these folks, then it's likely to come up with scenarios for any number of PUD's that come back to us. Every place is going to have their own unique characteristics. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: I think based on the fact that there's in -- a growth management plan amendment that is to be coming back to this board regarding the activity center number nine and, as was mentioned, the gateway concept, but predominantly just the configuration and master planning of activity center number nine, it makes sense to parallel the two, not just from their standpoint, but from the community's. So when we master plan that activity center, everyone knows exactly what they're getting. And the community can help give us input to help shape that with more specificity than doing a general PUD amendment and then coming back after the activity center is changed and doing another one. Is that the crux of your request and it's based on that growth management plan amendment? MS. JENKINS: That is. It's the intent of the interchange master plan to create that vision which will set forth guidelines for access, for landscaping, for design, and all of the fezones will be subject to that interchange master plan after its adoption. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Would it be fair to do an either/or earlier of, to put a specific time in there, Commissioner Constantine, that this thing does not linger on, should the growth management plan amendment be stayed? COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: That's fine. I just -- I don't know that I want a year over and above the six months to be that number. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Ms. Jenkins, we're looking for a little bit of help on that one. We need a date that you can reasonably get this done, consistent with what comes back on activity center number nine. We need a drop dead date that is a little aggressive, so we need something from you on that to give us a starting point. MS. JENKINS: In speaking with your growth management plan staff, we believe that we will have that notice from DCA -- or you will have that notice from DCA by the end of April is my understanding. And they believe that they will have the resolution for the adoption of this interchange master plan to you within six months after that. And so then we were saying three months after that. So it's March, so we're looking towards the end of the year. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: I have a little better idea. Since your property is going to be approximately 50 percent of the active -- well, 25 percent, but really, as far as that is looking to be rezoned, you're going to be a big part of shaping the master planning of that activity center? MS. JENKINS: Yes. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: I don't think it's too unreasonable to ask that that approval run as concurrent with the activity center master plan as possible. In other words, you come in at that same six-month time frame that the activity center master plan comes back, since your property's based on it. So rather than giving the additional three months, I think I'd like to see it run concurrent with the master plan at a period of six months. Again, I know that can be done. It's a little more cumbersome for a property owner, but I know it can be done. Commissioner Constantine, does that satisfy your concern, based on having a time out there that -- COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Which makes a worst case scenario of? COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: That's six months from April lst; is that correct? COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: That's fine. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: In that case, I'll make a motion to that effect. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I'll second it. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Okay, we have a motion and a second. All in favor? Opposed? (No response.) CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Motion carries, five-zero. Item #8A2 CARNIVAL PERMIT 98-4 RE C-98-4, GOLDEN GATE AREA CHAMBER OF COHMERCE REQUESTING AN AFTER-THE-FACT PERMIT TO CONDUCT THE GOLDEN GATE FRONTIER DAYS FESTIVAL ON FEBRUARY 27 THROUGH MARCH 1, 1998 - ADOTPED AND PERMIT FEES WAIVED Item 8A(2), petition C-98-4, Golden Gate Area Chamber of Commerce requesting an after-the-fact permit. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Didn't we actually do something ahead of time that it wasn't complete, or did I misunderstand that? MR. CAUTERO: Vince Cautero, for the record. No, Commissioner, you did not misunderstand. The lease agreement was approved prior to the event. I'll be brief. The reason I bring you this application is twofold, stated in the recommendation section. One is to have a permit of record for the activity. Staff did take some action when the carnival organizers did apply for the permit the day before the event, but it was too late to bring that forward to you. Your ordinance requires that you approve the permit, which is why it could not be handled administratively. And also, the representatives of the carnival are asking for the fee to be waived. As a sign of good faith, I did ask them to pay for the permit application -- pay the permit application fee. They did when they submitted the paperwork, and we have not cashed the check yet. If it's any consolation to the board, Tom Olliff and I have devised a plan which we believe will avoid this problem in the future when they come in at the last minute, or if an organization should, not just them, come in at the last minute. His staff and Parks and Recreation will not bring a lease agreement forward to you until a permit application is filed, and we will come together with those two items on the same day on the consent agenda. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: My understanding is that some new volunteers heading up the festival this year were under -- and those folks were under the impression that the lease agreement took care of their -- MR. CAUTERO: That's correct. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: -- requirement with the county. MR. CAUTERO: That's correct, Commissioner. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Motion to approve the item and waive the cost. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Okay, we have a motion. COMMISSIONER NORRIS: Second. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: And a second. All in favor? Opposed? (No response.) CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Motion carries five-zero. Item #8A3 APPROVAL OF THE FY 97/98 BICYCLE AND PEDESTRIAN PROGRAM PROJECT LIST FOR COUNTYWIDE SIDEWALK CONSTRUCTION - STAFF RECOHMENDATION APPROVED AS AMENDED Item 8A(3), approval of the fiscal year 97-98 bicycle and pedestrian program project list for county-wide sidewalk construction. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Are we actually going to have any money to build any of these this time around? MR. BATTIS: I'm going to answer all those. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Doesn't have a priority list, but we have money in the -- MR. BATTIS: Good morning, Ms. Chair, members of the board. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Good morning. MR. BATTIS: I've got a handout here with a correction for district three. One project was omitted. This was a last-minute addition that didn't make our -- COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Who are you, anyway? MR. BATTIS: Oh, I'm sorry. Jeremy Battis, HPO, bicycle pedestrian coordinator. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Thank you. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Thank you. MR. BATTIS: First time up here. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Thank you. MR. BATTIS: I came to Collier County in the im -- in September, and this process had been handed off to me by Amy Taylor, planner II. And she had begun the rankings and priorities -- prioritization process with our pathway advisory group. It's known as the PAC and Transportation Services. And we were a little bit behind on this because of staff limitations, and what you have before you is the 97-98 budget. So from September until February, we whittled away at this and came up with a short list of nine projects. OCPH gave us cost estimates that exceed the $250,000, but these are simply estimates. We want to make sure that we're able to spend the entire two hundred and fifty thousand dollar fund. So at your discretion, I'm seeking approval of this. I think it's $294,000, with the understanding that spending will not exceed 250,000, based on what the final cost bids are. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Mr. Battis, since it is your first time up here, I want to give you a recommendation: Never use the term make sure we spend. MR. BATTIS: Good advice. Thank you. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: But understood the estimates may come in a little lower. And this will be monitored as each project is completed, and the estimated cost total adjusted to ensure that we stay within that 250,000 that was budgeted; is that correct? MR. BATTIS: That's correct. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Motion to approve -- COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Second. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: -- staff recommendation, as amended. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: What I'm looking at here, where the green lines are, those are the two projects you're looking at? MR. BATTIS: That's correct. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Okay. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Cardinal Street in particular is school related, that's right near the -- MR. BATTIS: East Naples Middle School. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: -- East Naples Middle School. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: All right. We have a motion and a second. All in favor? Opposed? (No response.) CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Motion carries five-zero. Thank you very much. MR. BATTIS: Thank you. Item #8B1 AWARD WTIH R & L INDUSTRIES FOR THE RECYCLING OF AGRICULTURAL PLASTIC AT THE IHMOKALEE LANDFILL - RESCINDED; STAFF TO ISSUE NEW RFP FOR EXCAVATION TO BURY THE MATERIAL CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Next item, item 8B(1), rescind the award with Arnell Industries for the recycling of agricultural plastic at the Immokalee landfill. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Isn't this a shame? CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Mr. Russell. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I mean, it looks like you guys have worked as hard as you could, but what a shame. MR. RUSSELL: Yeah. For the record, David Russell. Yes, we're disappointed that this didn't work out, but I think we've gone the extra miles in this case. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Looks like you have. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: I have a question. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Yeah, so do I. Mr. Hancock? COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Mr. Russell, the failure to meet the county's RFP requirements for bonding and insurance, was that predominately for the transport of the material? MR. RUSSELL: The reason for the bond? COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Yeah. I'm curious, once they have it on their site, you know, I'm not really sure what -- I'm just curious, because I'm looking at the price of this and I'm thinking if transport is an issue, we could probably transport it to their facility cheaper than we're paying to bury it, and then at least it gets recycled and you don't have to bury it. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Right. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: I'm just looking for the bond and insurance information, how it's applied, what's required and why. MR. RUSSELL: The bond -- we felt the bond was necessary, particularly in the area of payment where there could be a significant amount of trucking and transportation costs involved here, and if they had a problem making those payments, then of course those truckers were going to be looking at the county for reimbursement, and that could be significant for this amount of material. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. MR. RUSSELL: Plus the equipment involved. We were told at one point that they had equipment with a cost in excess of a half a million dollars. So there's another -- there's quite a bit of exposure for the county I guess is the short answer on that. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: I'm having -- I'm having a little difficulty understanding this. What exactly is the exposure of the county? We're not paying -- at this point we were not going to pay them anything, right? MR. RUSSELL: That's correct. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: But a performance bond is if the -- if -- if the service providers don't get paid by the agency with whom we've contracted, then the performance bond would pay the subcontractors. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Well, that was -- okay, I've dealt with performance -- COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I bet you have. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: -- bonds too, but that wasn't -- that was not the intent. We -- because we were on the line financially. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: But if we're not on the line. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Yeah, but you understand -- but the performance bond, I don't understand it here, because we -- COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I agree. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: -- they were performing, and if they did perform, we were no better off -- we were no worse off than we were before, because we were not paying them. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I hear you -- I hear what you're saying. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Okay? COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Uh-huh. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: So I -- I just question this whole thing. There's something in here that just doesn't quite flow right with me, because as I read in here, too, and a little other additional information, that DEP has gotten into this. And I'm amazed that after 13 years, apparently this material has sat there, and all of a sudden within the last few months, DEP has gotten excited about this whole thing. It just -- there's something about this. We got a tipping fee, apparently, correct, when they brought this to the landfill? MR. RUSSELL: Yes, that's correct. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Now we're going to turn around, we're going to spend -- the taxpayers are going to spend $353,000 to bury this material, and FDEP is requiring that this be buried, and yet, it was my understanding, at FDEP, they're never really excited about burying this kind of material. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: That's true. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: This -- the whole thing just does not make a lot of sense to me. Sorry. MR. RUSSELL: Well, DEP did work with the county for a number of years, because they did like the idea of solving this waste stream problem and recycling the material. So they were willing to classify this material as a stockpile recyclable. But as we made attempts with various individuals and made no progress and those attempts failed, they got to the point where they felt to be in compliance with their rules, that this material had to be reclassified as a waste material and dealt with accordingly. So they felt they had to make that decision finally, because of the lack of success in recycling the material. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: And my question -- CHAIRPERSON BERRY: But if there was -- if you were -- if you could prove to them and continue to prove to them that whoever this group is, and I'm -- I guess I'm a little sensitive to this only because I kind of helped get the individuals together. Nothing more than that. I wouldn't even know who these people are if I ran into them on the sidewalk. But it just seems like if you're making an effort and continuing to work with them to try and get them into a position where they can go ahead and recycle this material, why would you not want to do that? I just don't understand the down side of it here. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: As a practical reality, David, what -- I think it was Commissioner Hancock who started on the question about would it cost us less than $354,000 to truck the material to their site? MR. RUSSELL: They don't have a site. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: They don't have a site. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Well, what were they going to do with it when they -- MR. RUSSELL: They were going to bale it, handle it, clean it, screen it to -- COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Where were they going to -- MR. RUSSELL: -- some degree, bale it, and then truck it to the end user. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: They were going to do that on our -- MR. RUSSELL: This was a marketing -- COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: -- the baling and all that on our site. MR. RUSSELL: Essentially a marketing company. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Okay. So what if we let them do the baling and cleaning and all that stuff on our site and then put it on our trucks and truck it to the end users. Surely that's less than $360,000. MR. RUSSELL: The county doesn't have equipment to do that. You're talking about cross-county commercial trucking to -- COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Can we '- MR. RUSSELL: -- effective -- COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: -- rent them for less than $360,000? COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: The problem is, as I see it now, is the end user is their market, right? MR. RUSSELL: That's correct. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Sure. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: So unless you have someone out there who's willing to buy it -- COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: But they do, right? They do have somebody out there willing to buy it. That's not the issue. The issue is -- COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I see them shaking their head no. COMMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Okay, I'm sorry. That's what they told us. MR. RUSSELL: They claim that they did have -- COMMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Right. MR. RUSSELL: -- buyers in their market for it. But they're market specialists, and the county is not. COMMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Now, I want them to still market it. Here's what I'm saying is -- and maybe this is unrealistic, because I know you've spent a lot more time and effort on this than I have. I just want to explore one last option and that is, if this contractor came to our site and did what they were going to do, clean it and bale it and all that stuff, and then the bond -- the payment performance bond issue relates to the transport, as I understood you to answer Commissioner Hancock's question. And if we did the transport and it costs us less than $360,000 to transport it, we would A, have recycled it, and B, spent less money. MR. RUSSELL: We don't have the ability to transport it. We're talking about this material going in various places. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: For $360,000 we can't get it somewhere? I don't understand that. MR. RUSSELL: A lot of the cost is in handling the material to get it into a baled form so that you -- COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: But that's what they're going to do. MR. RUSSELL: -- can't -- that's what they were going to do. That equipment itself cost a half a million dollars. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Well, let them do that. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: That's their equipment. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: That's their equipment. Let them do that. Do you understand what I'm saying? Let them do that part. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I don't think they have it. I think this is one of those where the vendor said hey, I've got a great idea, and apparently they're not able to fulfill what they thought they were going to do. MR. RUSSELL: It was represented that they had acquired the equipment, and then finally I asked for documentation on that to -- as a means to give DEP something. And that was really verbally that information, and in fact they provided a letter, copy to DEP, that they had acquired this equipment. When I asked for documentation as a means for DEP to give us a little more time, no documentation was provided. At that point it appeared that there wasn't much of substance there, and DEP, I think, felt the same way. And they provided me a courtesy call to say we're getting ready to invite you in to discuss the details of a consent order. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: The term primrose path is coming to mind here. Someone came up with an idea, said I can put A, B and C together. Turns out they don't have A, B or C, and they're not willing to go out and get a letter of credit or a bond to make sure that what they promised us will happen. I'm like you, and as eager to recycle this as anyone, but there's only one option out there available to us, and it isn't panning out very well. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: And we've RFP'd this twice, right? I mean, wewve -- MR. RUSSELL: That's correct. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: There's no equipment, there's no location, and we don't have an end user. Other than that, it's a great idea. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Other than that. MR. RUSSELL: The RFP went out to 100 plus firms that might remotely be interested in recycling. So it's not as if we didn't shake the bushes pretty hard. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Understood. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: $360,000 to bury some plastic. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Well, the good news is that the farmers are -- have already paid the money -- COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I know. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- so it's not affecting our residential rate payer. But it's unfortunate, I agree. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Anyway -- COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Make a motion to support staff recommendation. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Second. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Attorney comment. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Attorney comment. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Mr. Weigel? MR. WEIGEL: If the board's motion is to support the recommendation, which is the recision of the award and the award to Sunshine Excavation -- is that correct? Is that the motion? COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: That's what staff's recommendation was, right? MR. RUSSELL: To enter into negotiations with the previous individual that responded to the RFP. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Right. MR. RUSSELL: That particular RFP was closed out. So it's to waive that RFP process and to enter into negotiations. MR. WEIGEL: Well, I think it's clear to note what the -- what the board's direction may be here. I think it's also clear to note for the record for the board at this point in the process that Sunshine Excavation is currently in a lawsuit with Collier County. They have sued the county -- COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Whoops. MR. WEIGEL: -- in regard to work that they performed at Sugden Park. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Whoops. MR. WEIGEL: Not at the behest of the county. The county had its own contract with Sunshine Excavation with a purchase order to the amount of 127,000. It was ultimately closed out at the fulfillment of that work. Ostensibly, the complaint is that additional work was done, we believe it was done at the behest of Fantasy and Fire on the premises there, and they have sued the county for an approximate amount of $13,000 concerning work that they did and were not paid for but never directed to do by the county. So -- COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: So why wouldn't we just do an RFP for the excavation work and see if -- you know, give it to the lowest bidder instead of automatically -- I mean, you know, surely that will buy us some time with FDEP if we tell them we're bidding it where -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I withdraw my motion. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Okay, the motion has been withdrawn. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: I will make a motion to cancel the contract for the recycling, and to issue an RFP for excavation to bury the material. MR. RUSSELL: I would think DEP would be understanding, given the fact of this additional information. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: I mean, if they're not, you can come back and tell us. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Okay, second? COHMISSIONER NORRIS: Second. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: We have a motion and a second to rescind the contract for the recycling and initiate a new RFP for the burial of the material. All those in favor? Opposed? (No response.) CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Motion carries five-zero. Item #882 ACQUISITION OF SERVICES NECESSARY FOR THE DESIGN AND CONSTRUCTION ASSOCIATED WITH THE DREDGING OF CLAM PASS PRIOR TO HAY 1, 1998 - APPROVED Next item on the agenda is the Clam Pass dredging. Mr. Huber. MR. HUBER: Good morning, Commissioners. For the record, Harry Huber, representing the office of capital projects. Due to the untimely receipt of the long-term permit to authorize activities associated with the Clam Bay Restoration and Management Plan -- COHHISSIONER HANCOCK: Mr. Huber, as much as you'd like to go through this, as I understand it, just to inform everyone else, the permits for Pelican Bay that they have been funding with -- in joint cooperation with WBCI are just out there, just barely out of reach. We have near closure. And this should be the last time we do this on an emergency basis. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: I hope so. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: After this point, everything will be covered by the permit that is being issued as we speak, so I'd just like to -- obviously I'd move -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Second. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- table this. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Yeah. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Was that a motion, Mr. -- COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Yes. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: -- Hancock? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Yes. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Okay, we have a motion and a second. All in favor? Opposed? (No response.) CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Motion carries five-zero. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Thank you for working quickly on this, Harry. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Thank you. MR. HUBER: For your information, my objective is to have construction commence by the -- on or about April 6th, which is consistent with when we started last year, and we completed by April 25th last year, so -- COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Perfect. Item #10A RESOLUTION 98-75 APPOINTING GRIFFITH, KEGG, WARD, GUGGENHEIH, BARBER & DURHAN AS PRIMARIES; BOYD, PETTIT, STRAIN, CONRECODE & STAIGER TO SERVE AS ALTERNATES TO THE U.S. ARMY CORPS OF ENGINEERS ALTERNATIVE DEVELOPMENT GROUP (ADG) - ADOPTED CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Moving on then to item 10-A, appointments to the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers ADG group, which I just read a letter that's been placed in front of us this morning hereby noting -- and I hope that -- I wasn't aware of it and I certainly didn't -- the individuals that I spoke with, I didn't talk to them about the length of time that this process involved. I knew it would be lengthy, but if your -- if you haven't noticed, they're talking about ten meetings, each meeting two days long, from March to July, inclusive. And possible homework. I don't think they could have written it any better to try and discourage people from participation. I think that was an admirable effort on their part to be very discouraging in their effort. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: They described it that way from the beginning. And I think it's frankly trying to be very realistic about what -- CHAIRPERSON BERRY: You're being very charitable, Commissioner. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Well, I'm being very honest in what I think they need for time commitments. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: On the other side, we -- we have a time frame that we -- we're very firm with, and I think they're trying to meet that time frame. But Commissioner Berry, I don't discount your comments. It's very difficult for someone who is a, you know, professional who is -- CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Right. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- making a living -- COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Got a day job. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- themselves to -- CHAIRPERSON BERRY: That's right. That's my point. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- who is not paid to be at these things. But I did -- in the individuals I contacted, I did explain to them this would be a lengthy -- CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Right. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- and time-consuming process. And I think they expect it, if not that level of -- CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Yeah. Well, that was my point. At the same time, I had mentioned the same, as far as, you know, that it would be lengthy, and they were aware pretty much. But I'm not sure they realized March to July -- COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: It was -- CHAIRPERSON BERRY: -- in length. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: It was added to your agenda, and my apologies for not having it on time, but I did have a second recommendation, Ms. Pam Pettit, a property manager. She lives in North Naples. Very active. What I wanted to pass on is that I spoke with Mr. Hall yesterday, and what we agreed upon is that we would forward to them six recommendations and four alternates. Because the group is going to have a size of 30 or less, according to facilitators. And with our representation being one-third, one-third and one-third, as we requested it, I think we need to submit at least ten names, in case the group is smaller. What we have been -- we may be nominating someone that they've already chosen. And so I thought we should at least put ten names forward, six primary and four alternate, if that's acceptable to everyone. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Mr. Constantine? COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Maybe I can just kick off some discussion on some of these names. I thought -- starting from the bottom and working my way up, I guess, Rick Barber, one of Commissioner O'Berry's (sic) recommendations. Excellent. With the work he's doing right now, upper water management district -- CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Right. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: -- and all, it's just a natural that appears to be much of -- or certainly a big part of what the Corps is talking about doing anyway. And rather than have that effort duplicated, if we can have the very person who's doing it, I can't think of anybody better. And that's not to discount anybody I don't mention here; I'm just running through some highlights. Dr. Staiger from the city I think is fantastic. He worked with us on the landfill issue, and is absolutely the voice of reason. He has so much knowledge and understanding of environmental issues, and yet is very practical and very straightforward, and I just think it would be nice to have a representative, somebody specifically with the city government as well, so I -- COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Although, can I just point out on that, that he may well be recommended for appointment by the City of Naples, and so it might be that he's a superfluous one -- COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Right. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: -- and for that reason, I would wish that among my two, I'd like to support Mr. Guggenheim over Dr. Staiger, just for the reason that I think Dr. Staiger is going to be there anyway. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: The -- and I hope so, because he's very, very good and works very well on these formats. On my own, I had both Mr. Strain -- but Whit Ward, I thought it was certainly important that we have someone from the building industry. I have no doubt that we'll have either -- as Mr. Guggenheim or others active from the environmental community, and I think if we are truly going to try to achieve that balance, we need to have someone from the building industry, and with roughly one in four jobs in Collier County somehow related to that, and they should probably have a voice as well. And then I hadn't seen just until yesterday Ms. Pettit. And I don't know that much about her. I do know Mr. Durham a little bit. Maybe you can help me on that. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: The reason I forwarded Mr. Durham's name is that we've talked all along about this being intended to streamline the permitting process to be fairer to the property owner. It seemed to me that the most qualified person to assess whether that was the direction it was taking was someone who does environmental permitting for a living. And Mr. Durham has been doing it longer than just about anyone I know of in this county, and that's why I put his name forward as a nice check and balance and someone who already has a very good relationship with the Corps of Engineers as an environmental permitting specialist. So I thought that was important just to have that -- again, we're trying to achieve a balance here, and I thought that was a key balance. And the other thing is, whether it's Ms. Pettit or whether it's Mr. Kegg or whether it is Mr. Strain or any of the people that have offered their names, I think of our six primary individuals, we need to appoint at least one just average Joe or average Sue to sit on that committee as a representative of the general public, and not someone necessarily that brings technical expertise, per se. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Not to be confused by their own far above average Sue. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Right. Which we are not letting go for two days at a clip, so -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: The -- and just -- Commissioner Norris' names, both of those from very different perspectives, but Ed's very knowledgeable in his field, and I think would be excellent, again, similar to Hr. Durham, just having a good background and understanding of the process. But Earl Kegg, if we're looking for an average Joe, as you say, I think he's real good. I've worked with him on a number of things. I know he's been president of his homeowners association. Just a very knowledgeable guy, so -- and that's not to discount if I missed some people along the list, but -- COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Can I ask for a consensus on -- just from the discussion so far? There's six names that have been thrown out as primary, and let me ask if there is anyone that wishes to substitute or change this as a consensus, six individuals: Mr. Griffith, Mr. Kegg, Mr. Durham, Mr. Ward, Mr. Guggenheim, Mr. Barber. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Did somebody just tell me -- I don't know Mr. Kegg. Is he -- what's his experience as an attorney? COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: You would probably remember him actually from East Naples Civic. He's there with some regularity. How old is he, John? Maybe 65. COMMISSIONER NORRIS: I would suspect. He's a retired attorney. He's in the -- the president, right, of the Countryside Homeowners Association. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Yeah, the past -- COMMISSIONER NORRIS: For some time. And I think he's just off this year. But he's been president for some time. And he's been very active in East Naples Civic affairs, and really is the epitome of an average citizen that would like to be involved and do something. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Didn't have a particular predisposition -- COMMISSIONER NORRIS: No. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: -- pro environment, anti environment, any of that kind of stuff? COMMISSIONER NORRIS: Well, I think he would be just a very neutral objective person on the ADG, and that's probably what we're looking for. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Thank you. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Of the six you mentioned, the only one I didn't -- I think we had -- from the discussion and consensus on five of those, I didn't hear a consensus on Ed Griffith. I don't have any problem with him. But I just throw into the mix on that discussion Tom Conrecode. Knowing Tom's work, particularly with us for the county for all of those years and knowing the process, he may be somebody to consider as part of that, too. The other five I agree with wholeheartedly. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: The reason I would give Ed a slight nod over Tom is twofold: One is that -- one, they're both engineers, and Tom has worked for the county. But Ed working with WCI Communities, they have properties in the area, substantial holdings in the area. And I think the effect of environmental permitting on them, and again, how they have actually worked through -- COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I agree with that. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- permits in the area is important, because we're going to have for the Corps side, I think we're going to have a lot of appointees from state and federal agencies that have absolutely no local interest. And again, someone who's -- I guess is going to come home to roost to them more quickly than would Mr. Conrecode would be why I would give him a very slight edge. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Let me ask a question about that, if I may. I know that they have certainly developed a lot of property in that part of -- in the north part of the county already, but I think it could be not a conflict but at least a little disconcerting to have someone who is going to be -- whose pocketbook will be directly affected by the decisions made by the Corps. Are you saying that he's got future permitting to do up there, or has a lot of experience with permitting up there? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I would assume both. The pocketbook, actually, I would make just the opposite argument. Having no one on this committee whose pocketbook is directly affected by the Corps action I think would be a mistake. Mr. Ward is an excellent representative of the building industry, but I think having corporate roots in that area actually is a benefit. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: What I'm worried about, though, is -- is general pocketbook, the general county populous interest as opposed to one company as against another company. If, for example, there are two development companies with significant holdings in this part of the county, we wouldn't want one to have the opportunity to have his property favored over another's. I know Ed Griffith, and he wouldn't -- you know, he's not that kind of guy. But I wouldn't want there to be the perception that that might happen. I'm just asking, because I don't know what they have as far as land holdings up there yet to be permitted, but I wouldn't want them to be able to get favor for their property over -- COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Would you favor Mr. Conrecode then, is that the basis for that? COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Based on that -- only based on that perception is where I was going. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Mr. Fernandez? MR. FERNANDEZ: Madam Chair, I think -- not really relative to this conversation, but I wanted to throw into the mix at some point the board's attention drawn to the comment that we have in the executive summary about Lee County's appointments. We really don't know the status of those at this time, but I think you need to give some thought to some parallel, if in fact they do have some staff presence, attorney presence, you may want to consider the same kind of response on our side. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Just back to the Ed Griffith discussion. I've been persuaded by Commissioner Hancock, and I think as we try to achieve a balance on there, that -- I think it is good to have someone who has to absorb the real life impact of whatever is done. I think that -- COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: I agree with that. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: -- is a very fair -- COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: I agree with that. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: -- voice to have on there. I would worry if we had that be the primary voice that we're appointing out of all six or all ten -- COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Let me be real clear -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I think to have one person on there is a very good idea, and I'm persuaded by your argument. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: I agree with that. What I'm saying is, we don't want to give one company the opportunity to gain advantage over another company. If Collier's Reserve owns land up there and Barton Collier companies and WCI, we have to be very careful that WCI Properties don't get some particular benefit from having a staff person on there. That's what I -- and I just wanted to be clear -- sure I was clear. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: It's a good argument, but I don't think the Corps is going to end up through this process allowing any company, any particular company, a special benefit over any other particular company. I don't think that's what will happen out of this process at all. So I don't really share that particular concern of yours. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Okay. So you have the names of Edward Griffith, Earl Kegg, Timothy Durham, Whit Ward, Dr. John Staiger and Rick Barber. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Actually, no. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: No, Dr -- COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Mr. Guggenheim. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: You went with Mr. Guggenheim? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I think John Staiger should be an alternate -- COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Absolutely. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- in case he's not covered somewhere else COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Absolutely. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- because I would like to see him there. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Okay. So that would be Mr. Guggenheim, Barber, Ward, Durham, Kegg and Griffith? COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: That's how I have it. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: With the balance as the alternates. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: And the balance would be the alternates? COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Can I just make one suggestion? We -- and we had expressed some concern that there might be some duplication from other agencies. And with that in mind, would anyone have any objection if we add Kim Boyd in as an alternate as well, so we would actually have five alternates? And we can rank those -- perhaps she's the fifth alternate in case -- COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I think that's a great idea. COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Actually, that is a good idea, because if we -- if there is duplication, such as Mr. Staiger, and the Corps' going to appoint him, then we'd like to -- if they go to 30 people, that would still give us 10 names, so I like that idea. We'll change it a little bit and have six primaries and five alternates, and include Ms. Boyd with the other four individuals that's (sic) names were submitted by the Commission. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Let me just make sure -- and I'm sorry, I know you just went through them, but I -- CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Griffith, Kegg, Durham, Ward, Guggenheim -- COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: And Barber. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: -- and Barber. Those are the six -- COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: Primaries. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: -- primaries. The alternates will be Pettit, Strain, Staiger, Conrecode, and Boyd. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Madam Chairman, I'll make a motion we COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Second. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: -- approve that slate. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Okay, we have a motion and a second. Any further discussion? If not, all in favor? Opposed? (No response.) CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Motion carries five-zero. MR. FERNANDEZ: Madam Chairman? CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Yes, Mr. Fernandez. MR. FERNANDEZ: The motion came quicker than I was prepared. You have one speaker. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: We have one speaker? Do they still wish to speak on the topic? MR. FERNANDEZ: Mr. Agoston? COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Those are great looking sneakers, Ty. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Can't have 'em. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: He's not going to give them to you. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Frankly, they look like they're only about a size nine, though. I'm in trouble, aren't I? MR. AGOSTON: Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Good morning. MR. AGOSTON: My name is Ty Agoston. I live in that endangered Golden Gate Estates, and I'm speaking for myself. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: The character of the day. MR. AGOSTON: A Naples Daily News editorial pretty much condemned you -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: No. MR. AGOSTON: -- for sleeping with developers, or being in bed, whatever the term. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: I personally don't. My husband's not a developer, and that's who I sleep with. MR. AGOSTON: Well -- COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I was going to say, Ty, my wife's going to be really mad when she hears this. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Get those boots. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: They got us confused with the president, I think. MR. AGOSTON: The point in fact is the Naples Daily News has a liberal agenda, and it will do everything in its power to further that agenda. On the other hand, they performed a very viable service to me when they published a map of the current Collier County, and the conservation areas are in the various shades of green. I think -- well, I raised five children and I taught math and statistics, and I have found that it's very difficult to convey numbers. And 85 percent doesn't really sound like a whole lot until you look at it and you look at the bulk of the -- of Collier County is essentially under conservation owned by some agency. The liberals in town do not want to build any more and they want to get -- gain more green space. Apparently 85 percent is not enough. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Tim, you're liberal. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Flaming. MR. AGOSTON: Flip side of that, I attended a meeting -- CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Be nice. MR. AGOSTON: -- dealing with the 10,000 Islands, and there was a committee pretty much what you have just -- one you recommended, and it was interesting, the 18 members with the facilitator contained 12 environmentalists, and six people who actually were doing business in the 10,000 Islands, running boats and what have you. I believe that the ADG group that you have assembled this morning will wind up pretty much the same way. You -- Dr. Guggenheim is definitely an -- well, I mean, that's redundant. So is Dr. -- the gentleman who is from Naples as well. What I don't see is some people who take a somewhat hostile point of view against this entire measure, because the measures underlaying Ms. Mac'Kie's group, who is essentially promoting Socialism, and you want the -- COMMISSIONER HANCOCK: You mean the agreement -- MR. AGOSTON: Ms. Hac'Kie, I don't much appreciate being laughed at. I'm a little older than you are, and I have some direct experience on -- COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: I'm sorry. MR. AGOSTON: -- how things happen under Socialism. And I also recognize the method. So while you can sit there and you being elected then you can laugh at people, I don't appreciate it. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: I apologize. MR. AGOSTON: No, that's okay. The fact of the matter is, is that this is a directed movement that you have assigned a group for, and I'm not exactly sure whether I agree with it personally. I have seen some names, a whole string of names I would much rather prefer to be members than some of the ones that you have assigned. Thanks for the input. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Ty, you know you and I share many of the same opinions on part of this. I'm reasonably sure Commissioner Hac'Kie, while I often disagree, is not promoting Socialism. But I share some of your concerns with the Army Corps of Engineers study, as you know. However, I do believe if it's going to move forward, and it is, then we should certainly participate and be a voice in that. And in fairness, we need to try to present a balanced voice. And so I'm sure while some of the folks in the environmental groups you mentioned would prefer not to see Whit Ward or to see Ed Griffith or some others on there -- you may prefer not to see Dr. Guggenheim and Dr. Staiger. I will say, though, while I disagree from time to time on individual issues with Mr. Guggenheim and Dr. Staiger, they are both very fair and straightforward individuals, and I think we need look no further than the issue that was before us a week ago at Twin Eagles where the Conservancy stepped forward and tried to put forward a reasonable approach to that. There are certainly groups who have opted not to do that. But I think Mr. Guggenheim has demonstrated in that incident and others that he's willing to come to a fair and reasonable compromise in issues. So I'm very, very confident that the group we have appointed overall will represent the views, the diverse views that exist in Collier County. Item #10B DISCUSSION RE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT COUNCIL - STAFF TO PROVIDE INFORMATION AT A FUTURE BCC MEETING RE DEFERRAL OF IMPACT FEES FOR UP TO 6 YEARS FOR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT COMPANIES THAT QUALIFY CHAIRPERSON BERRY: All right. Moving on then, item 10B, economic development. Commissioner Hancock? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I think you all can give yourself a pat on the back after the article that appeared on the front page of the Daily News today regarding an aerospace firm coming to Collier County. The reason is that I've been working with the EDC and meeting with individuals of Shaw Aerospace for over six months now. It started back when I was chairman. Because they were doing this as quietly as possible, I was asked just simply to meet with them and keep those discussions as private as possible, you know, regarding our position. As a result of the EDC's work and our partnership with the EDC, I believe -- and I have to give Susan Paragons and the board of the EDC a huge thank you -- Shaw has decided to move ahead with the accommodation facility at the White Lake Industrial Park, and will require our assistance in a community development block grant proposal in the very near future. The reason for this item today is one, to just give a little light and shed a little light on the fruits of our economic development partnership with the Economic Development Council. We've seen Titon Hellerman in the recent past, we've seen others, and now exactly the kind of jobs we're talking about bringing to this county, everything from skilled laborer in a machinist sense, and right through engineering testing and research and development. It's an incredible facility, and I think you're going to be very pleased with it. What I'd like to ask the board to do today is, I've received a request from Shaw -- and until they made their decision public, and which I didn't know until yesterday, I couldn't really bring it to the board because of the confidence they asked me to keep as much as is possible. And that is that they are looking at -- first of all, they were talking about waiving impact fees. I informed them at the outset that that is not an option. That's not something we do in Collier County. We're not going to play money games in drawing business here. However, noting that we do have deferral of impact fees for up to six years for projects that are deemed worthy and necessary by this community, such as affordable housing, it seems to make some sense, if the board would assist me today in giving direction to our staff, that we may wish to develop impact fee deferrals for a period of up to six years for economic development companies that qualify through certain types of job creation. We still get the money; we get it in a time frame that we choose. And again, it could be up to six years, but it helps in the cost to construct and relocation for the companies to make that decision. I think economic development is important enough to consider impact fee deferrals when asked if the board would assist me in giving direction to staff to develop some scenarios, particularly Mr. Hihalic, and bring that back to us for future consideration. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: I don't know enough about it to say yea or nay, but if what you're asking is staff do a little homework on it and bring it back so we do have that information, I'm all for that. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: That's fine with me. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Agreed. COHMISSIONER NORRIS: The reason -- I believe the reason that we picked six years originally is that if we go longer than that, we'd end up having to do some sort of a bond -- bonding or financing of the impact fees that were deferred. But under six years, we don't have to do that. So I believe that's the reason for that particular six-year time frame. But that sounds like something that we could at least work on, take a look at. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. Mr. Fernandez, is there any difficulty in doing that? MR. FERNANDEZ: I know none at this time. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Okay. And I did speak to Mr. Hihalic this morning before bringing this item up. I didn't want to catch him off guard -- COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Surprise. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- and he seemed very supportive of the ideas and felt like he could do it. And so if that's sufficient direction, then I thank you very much, and thank you for your EDC support, because it's starting to bear some real fruit. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Commissioner, is that all impact fees that are postponed? COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Obviously, we can't do that with school board impact fees, unless they agree. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Right. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Now, with the school board's technology plan, I would assume that having a place for our students to work when they graduate would be as equally important to them as it is to us. So I would be glad to communicate with the school board on that as this comes forward. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: I think you might want to do that. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: I would love to. And we'll take care of that. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: We've got a place for them to go to college and places for them to go to work now. It's an amazing thing. COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: One stop shopping. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: All right. Moving on then, public comment. Do we have any registered speakers? MR. FERNANDEZ: None. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Nobody wants to speak with us today. All right. Having said that, Mr. Weigel, any comments? MR. WEIGEL: None, thank you. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Mr. Fernandez? MR. FERNANDEZ: I have none, thank you. Item #15A DISCUSSION REGARDING TOWER SPACE FOR EMERGENCY BOARDCAST SYSTEM CHAIRPERSON BERRY: And commissioners? Commissioner Hac'Kie? COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Just one opportunity to nag about the need for tower space for the Emergency Broadcast System that we have money for and that we approved in our consent agenda today to extend the contract time. I had just wanted to be sure that all of us are making as many contacts as we possibly can. This is such a practical idea, that -- you know, the net effect of this is that for 75 bucks you buy a radio. If you have this radio when there is an emergency war -- emergency warning like could have happened at Naples Land Yacht Harbor and in other parts of East Naples, you know, a week ago, they would have had an alarm go off on their radio. They would have known immediately, get out and go to someplace safe. Well, we got lucky there without having any fatalities or injuries, and I just hope that all of us are out beating the bushes for someplace cheap and/or free to put that tower up, or to access that facility. It's critical. There are so many people who need it. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: I had some discussion, however, along those same lines about if people were notified of a place to go. And not only that, it's the time frame. Once they get them out of their house, that presents a problem as well. COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: Well, at this particular place, for example, they have a clubhouse, a sort of town center thing where they could all -- it's a concrete block building, they could go there and at least be -- have life and limb protected. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Could they get there in time? COMHISSIONER MAC'KIE: Yeah, it's -- you know. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Well -- COMMISSIONER NORRIS: That's always the thing with tornadoes. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Well, that's the whole problem. It's different -- you know, I lived in a tornado area, very prevalent tornado area, and it's one thing to be able to walk down a flight of stairs and be in a basement. It's quite another thing, once you get outside of that building, you're very vulnerable as well. And if you -- time predictability is a very difficult thing to deal with, so -- COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: And that's why this transmitter is so critical, because right now all that they get is what's on the TV. And it will say, you know, danger -- CHAIRPERSON BERRY: I understand. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: -- go to a safe place. If we had this transmitter, the alarm would go off as soon as the information is available, which would be much earlier than they're able to get the information now. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Just looking at the age of sometimes the people involved -- and it's very difficult to get some of the elderly people to move as quickly as possible. And I think, too, you have to be very careful that you don't put them in a situation where you get them out of the structure. Even though that may be bad in itself, it may be better to be in there than it is to be out of it in an open area. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Madam Chairman? CHAIRPERSON BERRY: There's a lot of discussion about that particular situation. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Getting information fast has got to be the right thing to do. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: I understand. But tornadoes, you don't always have a lot of time. It's a lot different than a hurricane. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Madam Chairman, what I might suggest is we are not the first community to deal with this, and we might see how others are doing it effectively. My wife comes from Nebraska, where they have an inordinate number of tornadoes, and they have an alarm system like that. There are procedures and there are certain circumstances in which they do it and they don't, and it just might behoove us to have our staff talk to -- CHAIRPERSON BERRY: The Midwest is a whole lot different, however, than south Florida. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: No, my point is -- it certainly is, my point being Collier County is not the first place to deal with this, and if we have our staff communicate with some of those places, we can see what the upside is, what the downside is and how they have corrected some of those concerns you've expressed. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Through Mr. Pineau, I think we'll do the research and -- COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Yeah. COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: -- whatnot, but one thing we need to remember -- and I expressed this to Landmark Estates Homeowners Association last week -- is what happened in Orlando is a 100-year anomaly. Having a force IV tornado in Florida is unheard of. They couldn't remember the last time one occurred. Most of our tornadoes are force I and II. Your middle latitude cyclones in Nebraska and Oklahoma are force IV and V regularly, so that -- so we have to be careful that we don't make a knee-jerk reaction and give people a false sense of security. By the same token, even if they're in a premanufactured home or a mobile home, if they're awake they have a far better chance of being on the floor and in an interior room than if they're asleep. So I think let's do the fact finding and whatnot, but let's not send a message out there that all of a sudden tomorrow we're going to erect a tower -- I know that's not what you're doing. But let's not send the wrong message that we're going to make sure people are notified of every time a tornado is spotted, this does require them at least to purchase a radio and whatnot, so -- COHMISSIONER HAC'KIE: Right, this is a radio you have in your house. This isn't a loud blast, this is -- COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Right. COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: It's 10:30, are we going to take a break before we finish? CHAIRPERSON BERRY: I don't think so. Do you have any comments, Commissioner Norris? COHMISSIONER NORRIS: No. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Commissioner Constantine? COHMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: Happy Saint Patty's Day. Item #15B DISCUSSION REGARDING PROGRAMS FOR MIDDLE SCHOOL AND HIGH SCHOOL STUDENTS DURING SPRING BREAK AND SUHMER VACATION COHMISSIONER HANCOCK: Remember about two years ago when we appointed -- or formed a youth advisory committee? We have been having monthly meetings during the school year, attended by junior high and high school students, and from our no year government lunch last week, I had 12 high school students at the meeting last night. Just so you know, these will be coming out on fliers, they'll be coming out for the paper and radio. We have about a dozen events planned for spring break for junior high and high school; things from a wild video dance party, which is a 40-foot video screen, that's set up running, you know, popular videos while music is playing, to fishing tournaments at the pier. And I want to give Steve Peppers of County Parks, and Dave Likens of City Recreation a huge pat on the back, because never before have we seen a schedule like this for spring break, and as soon as this is over, next month we start on summer. So the youth advisory committee that I've been on for two years is alive and well, and we're we've got everything from parties at the sanctuary to all kinds of stuff. So when the schedules come out, I'll give them to you so you're informed, and we'll be distributing them through the school on fliers. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Great. I have nothing. MR. FERNANDEZ: Madam Chairman, I handed you the agenda for next week, in the interest of taking a look at the -- the list of items that you have there, if you want to make some adjustments. You mentioned at the beginning of the meeting that you're concerned that our agenda is getting a little full. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: I don't think it looks unworkable. I, you know, hate to drag people longer. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: It will be a full day, that's all. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: It will be busy. COMMISSIONER CONSTANTINE: We get spoiled by days like today. COMMISSIONER MAC'KIE: Right. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: Well, enjoy today. COMMISSIONER NORRIS: Just have a big meeting once in a while and take care a whole bunch of things at once; nothing wrong with that. CHAIRPERSON BERRY: The meeting is adjourned. ***** Commissioner Hancock moved, seconded by Commissioner Constantine and carried unanimously, that the following items under the Consent Agenda be approved and/or adopted: ***** Item #16A1 FINAL PLAT OF "MARKER LAKE VILLAS" WITH STIPULATIONS AS DETAILED IN EXECUTIVE SUMMARY Item #16A2 BUDGET A_MHENDHENT REDUCING THE BUDGET FOR THE CDBG GRANT FOR SHELLABARGER PARK (FUND 121, COST CENTER 138755, PROJECTS NUMBERED 33020 AND 33021) BY $583,000 Item #16A3 RESOLUTION 98-70 AUTHORIZING THE DEFERRAL OF IMPACT FEES TOTALING $592,660.48 DEFERRED UNTIL AUGUST 15, 2004 FOR LIBRARY SYSTEM, PARKS AND RECREATIONAL FACILITIES, ROAD, WATER, SEWER, EMERGENCY MEDICAL SERVICES, AND EDUCATIONAL FACILITIES FOR SAXON MANNOR ISLES APARTMENTS, AFFORDABLE RENTAL HOUSING PROJECT Item #16A4 REFUND OF ROAD IMPACT FEE OF $4,032.73 TO HARVY BROTHERS FARMS, INC. Item #16A5 EXCAVATION PERMIT NO. 59.634 FOR THE TIM JACOBSEN EXCAVATION LOCATED IN SECTION 32, TOWNSHIP 48 SOUTH, RANGE 28 EAST, BOUNDED ON THE NORTH BY 16TH AVENUE NE R/W, ON THE EAST BY GOLDEN GATE CANAL R/W, ON THE SOUTH BY VACANT LOT AND ON THE WET BY A VACANT LOT - WITH STIPULATIONS Item #16A6 COHMISSIONER PAMELA HAC'KIE APPOINTED AS THE OFFICIAL COUNTY REPRESENTATIVE TO THE SOUTHWEST ISSUES GROUP (SWIG) OF THE GOVERNOR'S COHMISSION FOR A SUSTAINABLE SOUTH FLORIDA AND VINCENT A. CAUTERO, AICP, TO SERVE AS ALTERNATE Item #16A7 - Continued to 3/24/98 APPROVAL FOR RECORDING THE FINAL PALT OF "GLEN EDEN, PHASE ONE" Item #16B1 - Deleted Item #1682 COOPERATIVE AGREEMENT WITH THE SOUTH FLORIDA WATER MANAGEMENT DISTRICT FOR THE MAINTENANCE AND OPERATION OF THREE REPLACEMENT BRIDGES AT BAY WEST NURSERY, ROSE LANE AND NURSERY LANE OVER THE COCOHATCHEE CANAL Item #1683 ADDITION OF FOUR 94) AUTO CRANE HOISTS TO THE AUCTION LIST SCHEDULED FOR MARCH 21, 1998 Item #1684 AGREEMENT WITH BIG CYPRESS BASIN/SOUTH FLORIDA WATER MANAGEMENT DISTRICT FOR COST-SHARING DESIGN OF PHASE I LELY AREA STORMWATER IMPROVEMENT PROJECT. Item #16C1 RESOLUTION 98-71 FUNDING THE EXPENDUTURE UP TO $2,000 FOR COLLIER COUNTY PARTICIPATION IN THE YOUTH MIDNIGHT BASKETBALL TOURNAMENT IN ORLANDO, FLORIDA Item #16C2 PURCHASE AND INSTALLATION OF PLAYGROUND EQUIPMENT FOR SUGDEN REGIONAL PARK - AWARDED TO DOHINICA RECREATION PRODUCTS, INC. FOR $78,461 Item #16D1 RESOLUTION 98-72 SATISFACTION OF LIENS FOR CERTAIN ACCOUNTS THAT HAVE PAID IN FULL THE 1994 SOLID WASTE COLLECTION AND DISPOSAL SERVICES SPECIAL ASSESSMENTS Item #16D2 HODIFICATION OF A GRANT AGREEHENT EXTENDING THE COHPLETION TIHE FOR THE INSTALLATION OF A NOAA WEATHER TRANSMITTER FROM MARCH 31, 1998 TO SEPTEMBER 30, 1998 Item #16D3 CONTRACT TO ROMAN WATERPROOFING & RESTORATION SYSTEMS, INC. RE BID #97-2751, FOR WATERPROOFING THE ADMINISTRATION BUILDING RESCINDED; CONTRACT AWARDED TO AERIAL RESTORATION CONTRACTORS IN THE AMOUNT OF $57,102.00 Item #16D4 RESOLUTION 98-73 SATISFACTION OF LIENS FOR CERTAIN ACCOUNTS THAT HAVE PAID IN FULL THE 1994 SOLD WASTE COLLECTION AND DISPOSAL SERVICES SPECIAL ASSESSMENTS Item #16El BUDGET AMENDMENT NO. 98-173 Item #16G1 SATISFACTIONS OF LIEN FOR SRVICES OF THE PUBLIC DEFENDER Item #1662 MISCELLANEOUS CORRESPONDENCE - FILED AND/OR DEFERRED The following miscellaneous correspondence as presented by the Board of County Commissioners has been directed to the various departments as indicated: Item #1611 STIPULATED FINAL JUDGHENT RELATIVE TO THE EASEHENT ACQUISITION ON PARCEL NOS. 702, 703, 902 AND 903, WAYSON UNDERGROUND UTILITIES, INC. IN THE LAWSUIT ENTITLED COLLIER COUNTY V. WILLIAM A. KINSLEY, ET AL, CASE NO. 96-1315-CA-01-DRH. (NORTH COUNTY REGIONAL WATER TREATMENT PLANT 8-HGD WELLFIELD EXPANSION PROJECT). There being no further business for the good of the County, the meeting was adjourned by order of the Chair at 10:32 a.m. BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS BARBARA B. BERRY, CHAIRPERSON ATTEST: DWIGHT E. BROCK, CLERK These minutes approved by the Board on as presented or as corrected TRANSCRIPT PREPARED ON BEHALF OF GREGORY COURT REPORTING BY: Cherie R. Leone, RPR