BCC Minutes 02/13/2024February 13, 2024
Page 1
TRANSCRIPT OF THE MEETING OF THE
BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
Naples, Florida, February 13, 2024
LET IT BE REMEMBERED that the Board of County
Commissioners, in and for the County of Collier, and also acting as
the Board of Zoning Appeals and as the governing board(s) of such
special districts as have been created according to law and having
conducted business herein, met on this date at 9:00 a.m., in
REGULAR SESSION in Building "F" of the Government Complex,
East Naples, Florida, with the following Board members present:
Chairman: Chris Hall
Rick LoCastro (via zoom)
Dan Kowal
William L. McDaniel, Jr.
Burt L. Saunders
ALSO PRESENT:
Amy Patterson, County Manager
Daniel Rodriguez, Deputy County Manager
Jeffrey A. Klatzkow, County Attorney
Crystal K. Kinzel, Clerk of the Circuit Court & Comptroller
Troy Miller, Communications & Customer Relations
February 13, 2024
Page 1
COLLIER COUNTY
Board of County Commissioners
Community Redevelopment Agency Board (CRAB)
Airport Authority
AGENDA
Board of County Commission Chambers
Collier County Government Center
3299 Tamiami Trail East, 3rd Floor
Naples, FL 34112
February 13, 2024
9:00 AM
Commissioner Chris Hall, District 2; – Chair
Commissioner Burt Saunders, District 3; – Vice Chair
Commissioner Rick LoCastro, District 1
Commissioner Dan Kowal, District 4; – CRAB Co-Chair
Commissioner William L. McDaniel, Jr., District 5; – CRAB Co-Chair
NOTICE: ALL PERSONS WISHING TO SPEAK ON AGENDA ITEMS MUST
REGISTER PRIOR TO PRESENTATION OF THE AGENDA ITEM TO BE
ADDRESSED. ALL REGISTERED SPEAKERS WILL RECEIVE UP TO THREE
MINUTES UNLESS THE TIME IS ADJUSTED BY THE CHAIRMAN.
ADDITIONAL MINUTES MAY BE CEDED TO AN IN-PERSON SPEAKER BY
OTHER REGISTERED SPEAKERS WHO MUST BE PRESENT AT THE TIME
THE SPEAKER IS HEARD. NO PUBLIC SPEAKERS WILL BE HEARD FOR
PROCLAMATIONS, PRESENTATIONS AND PUBLIC PETITIONS.
SPEAKERS ON PRESENTATIONS ARE LIMITED TO 10 MINUTES, UNLESS
EXTENDED BY THE CHAIRMAN. ALL PERSONS WISHING TO SPEAK ON A
CONSENT ITEM MUST REGISTER PRIOR TO THE BOARD’S APPROVAL
OF THE DAY’S CONSENT AGENDA, WHICH IS HEARD AT THE
February 13, 2024
Page 2
BEGINNING OF THE MEETING FOLLOWING THE PLEDGE OF
ALLEGIANCE.
ANYONE WISHING TO ADDRESS THE BOARD ON PUBLIC PETITION
MUST SUBMIT THE REQUEST IN WRITING TO THE COUNTY MANAGER
AT LEAST 13 DAYS PRIOR TO THE DATE OF THE MEETING. THE
REQUEST SHALL PROVIDE DETAILED INFORMATION AS TO THE
NATURE OF THE PETITION. THE PUBLIC PETITION MAY NOT INVOLVE
A MATTER ON A FUTURE BOARD AGENDA, AND MUST CONCERN A
MATTER IN WHICH THE BOARD CAN TAKE ACTION. PUBLIC
PETITIONS ARE LIMITED TO A SINGLE PRESENTER, WITH A MAXIMUM
TIME OF TEN MINUTES, UNLESS EXTENDED BY THE CHAIRMAN.
SHOULD THE PETITION BE GRANTED, THE ITEM WILL BE PLACED ON A
FUTURE AGENDA FOR A PUBLIC HEARING.
ANYONE WISHING TO ADDRESS THE BOARD ON GENERAL TOPICS NOT
ON THIS AGENDA OR A FUTURE AGENDA MUST REGISTER TO SPEAK
PRIOR TO THE PUBLIC COMMENT PORTION OF THE AGENDA BEING
CALLED BY THE CHAIRMAN. SPEAKERS WILL BE LIMITED TO THREE
MINUTES, AND NO ADDITIONAL MINUTES MAY BE CEDED TO THE
SPEAKER. AT THE CHAIRMAN’S DISCRETION, THE NUMBER OF PUBLIC
SPEAKERS MAY BE LIMITED TO 5 FOR THAT MEETING.
ANY PERSON WHO DECIDES TO APPEAL A DECISION OF THIS BOARD
WILL NEED A RECORD OF THE PROCEEDING PERTAINING THERETO,
AND THEREFORE MAY NEED TO ENSURE THAT A VERBATIM RECORD
OF THE PROCEEDINGS IS MADE, WHICH RECORD INCLUDES THE
TESTIMONY AND EVIDENCE UPON WHICH THE APPEAL IS TO BE BASED.
COLLIER COUNTY ORDINANCE NO. 2003-53 AS AMENDED BY
ORDINANCE 2004-05 AND 2007-24, REQUIRES THAT ALL LOBBYISTS
SHALL, BEFORE ENGAGING IN ANY LOBBYING ACTIVITIES (INCLUDING
BUT NOT LIMITED TO, ADDRESSING THE BOARD OF COUNTY
COMMISSIONERS), REGISTER WITH THE CLERK TO THE BOARD AT THE
BOARD MINUTES AND RECORDS DEPARTMENT.
IF YOU ARE A PERSON WITH A DISABILITY WHO NEEDS ANY
ACCOMMODATION IN ORDER TO PARTICIPATE IN THIS PROCEEDING,
YOU ARE ENTITLED, AT NO COST TO YOU, THE PROVISION OF CERTAIN
ASSISTANCE. PLEASE CONTACT THE COLLIER COUNTY FACILITIES
February 13, 2024
Page 3
MANAGEMENT DIVISION LOCATED AT 3335 EAST TAMIAMI TRAIL,
SUITE 1, NAPLES, FLORIDA, 34112-5356, (239) 252-8380; ASSISTED
LISTENING DEVICES FOR THE HEARING IMPAIRED ARE AVAILABLE IN
THE FACILITIES MANAGEMENT DIVISION.
Lunch Recess scheduled for 12:00 Noon to 1:00 P.M
1. INVOCATION AND PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE
A. Invocation by Pastor John Huffman, The Harvest Recovery Ministry.
2. AGENDA AND MINUTES
A. Approval of today's regular, consent and summary agenda as amended (Ex
Parte Disclosure provided by Commission members for consent agenda.)
B. January 9, 2024, BCC Minutes
C. January 23, 2024, BCC Minutes
3. AWARDS AND RECOGNITIONS
A. EMPLOYEE
B. ADVISORY BOARD MEMBERS
C. RETIREES
D. EMPLOYEE OF THE MONTH
4. PROCLAMATIONS
A. Proclamation designating February 18 - 24, 2024, as Engineers Week in
Collier County. To be accepted by Kevin Dowty and other distinguished
guests.
5. PRESENTATIONS
A. ARTIST OF THE MONTH
February 13, 2024
Page 4
B. Presentation of the Collier County Business of the Month for February 2024
to Marco Office Supply. The award will be accepted by Philip Penzo,
Founder & Owner, and other distinguished guests. Also present is Heather
Gage, Membership Event Coordinator, the Greater Naples Chamber of
Commerce.
C. This item to be heard at 9:30 AM Update by the Pelican Bay Foundation,
Inc., on Pickleball at Pelican Bay Community Park.
6. PUBLIC PETITIONS
7. PUBLIC COMMENTS ON GENERAL TOPICS NOT ON THE CURRENT
OR FUTURE AGENDA
8. BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS
9. ADVERTISED PUBLIC HEARINGS
10. BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
A. This item to be heard at 10 AM That the Board discuss whether to
continue using fluoride in the public potable water supply distributed by the
County’s Public Utilities Division’s Water Department. (All Districts)
B. Commissioner McDaniel’s request for reconsideration of a Motion by
Commissioner LoCastro to consider the McDowell Housing Partners - Ekos
on Collier application for Workforce Housing Land Acquisition Surtax
Funding, made during discussion of item 11B at the January 23, 2024, BCC
meeting. (All Districts)
C. Recommendation to receive an update on the development of the State of
Florida’s application to the United States Department of Veterans Affairs -
State Home Construction Grant Program to secure federal construction
matching funds for a State Veterans’ Nursing Home in Collier County. (All
Districts)
11. COUNTY MANAGER'S REPORT
A. Recommendation to approve the selection committee’s ranking related to
Invitation to Negotiate (“ITN”) # 24-8223, “Golf and Entertainment
February 13, 2024
Page 5
Complex at the Former Golden Gate Golf Course” and authorize staff to
begin contract negotiations with the top-ranked firm, The Gate Golf Club,
Inc., so that a proposed agreement can be brought back for the Board’s
consideration at a future meeting. (Ed Finn, Deputy County Manager)
(District 3)
B. Recommendation to direct the County Manager or designee to proceed with
securing the services of one or more consultants to assist in the development
of a transition and acquisition plan for a replacement or enhanced 800MHz
radio system. (Michael Choate, Executive Director of Public Safety) (All
Districts)
12. COUNTY ATTORNEY'S REPORT
13. OTHER CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICERS
14. AIRPORT AUTHORITY AND/OR COMMUNITY REDEVELOPMENT
AGENCY
A. AIRPORT
B. COMMUNITY REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY
15. STAFF AND COMMISSION GENERAL COMMUNICATIONS
A. PUBLIC COMMENTS ON GENERAL TOPICS NOT ON THE
CURRENT OR FUTURE AGENDA BY INDIVIDUALS NOT
ALREADY HEARD DURING PREVIOUS PUBLIC COMMENTS IN
THIS MEETING
B. STAFF PROJECT UPDATES
C. STAFF AND COMMISSION GENERAL COMMUNICATIONS
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
16. CONSENT AGENDA - All matters listed under this item are considered to be
routine and action will be taken by one motion without separate discussion of
each item. If discussion is desired by a member of the Board, that item(s) will
be removed from the Consent Agenda and considered separately.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
February 13, 2024
Page 6
A. GROWTH MANAGEMENT DEPARTMENT
1) Recommendation to direct staff to advertise and bring back an
Ordinance amending the Collier County Code of Laws and
Ordinances to update temporary emergency housing and floodplain
development regulations. (All Districts)
2) Recommendation that the Board of County Commissioners, as Ex-
Officio Governing Board of the Collier County Water-Sewer District,
approve final acceptance of the potable water and sewer utility
facilities and accept the conveyance of a portion of the potable water
facilities for Lots 6 & 7 of White Lake Corporate Square,
PL20230010494. (District 3)
3) This item requires that Commission members provide ex-parte
disclosure. Should a hearing be held on this item, all participants
are required to be sworn in. Recommendation to approve for
recording the final plat of Macedonia (Application Number
PL20220006832), approval of the standard form Construction and
Maintenance Agreement, and approval of the performance security in
the amount of $204,175.95. (District 2)
4) Recommendation to adopt a Resolution scheduling a public hearing to
consider vacating the 10-foot-wide public road right-of-way easement
over the westerly 10 feet of Tract A-1, as described in Official Record
Book 1476, Page 242, of the Public Records of Collier County,
Florida, located approximately 2,000 feet south of Immokalee Road
(CR-846) and 1,000 feet west of Richards Street in Section 25,
Township 48 South, Range 26 East, Collier County, Florida.
(PL20230007642) (District 3)
B. TRANSPORTATION MANAGEMENT DEPARTMENT
1) Recommendation to award Request for Proposal (“RFP”) No. 23-
8149, “Laboratory Services,” to Advanced Environmental
Laboratories, Inc., Pace Analytical Service, LLC, and Eurofins
Environment Testing Southeast, LLC, as set forth herein, and
authorize the Chairman to sign the attached Agreements. (All
Districts)
February 13, 2024
Page 7
2) Recommendation to award Request for Professional Services (“RPS”)
No. 23-8108, “Design Services for Collier Area Transit Operations
and Maintenance Facility,” to Jacobs Engineering Group, Inc., in the
amount of $1,735,063.00, and authorize the Chairman to sign the
attached Agreement. (District 1)
3) Recommendation to approve an Agreement and adopt a Resolution
that authorize the exchange of 1.51 acres of land on the south side of
Painted Leaf Lane for 1.69 acres of adjoining land to be assembled
with abutting County-owned land, for future right of way, drainage,
utility and/or other public uses. Estimated fiscal impact: $28,000
revenue. (District 3)
4) Recommendation to adopt a resolution approving and authorizing the
Chairman to execute the Public Transit Grant Agreement (PTGA)
439255-1-94-22 with the Florida Department of Transportation to
accept Federal Transit Administration Section 5339 Rural Area Bus
and Bus Facilities Program in the amount of $575,000 for the
purchase of a replacement bus and authorize the necessary Budget
Amendments. (District 5)
5) Recommendation to approve an after-the-fact payment to Preferred
Materials, Inc., in the amount of $12,354.60, for additional irrigation
materials used in the “Radio Road at Devonshire Boulevard and
Countryside Drive Intersection Improvements” project under
Agreement 21-7842 “Roadway Contractors” and deem the
expenditure has a valid public purpose. (Project No. 60016) (District
4)
6) Recommendation to 1) approve an after-the-fact payment for
materials and services in the amount of $30,655.04 under Work
Directives 1, 2, and 3 for “Country Club Of Naples (CCON) Wetland
Outfalls” project under Agreement No. 20-7800, “Underground
Contractor Services” with Douglas N. Higgins, Inc., utilizing a draw
from the owner’s allowance; 2) approve an after-the-fact donation of
leftover materials at an estimated cost of $130 to the Country Club of
Naples; 3) ratify payment for Pay Application 1 that extended 11 days
past final completion for cleanup requested by the Country Club of
Naples; and 4) deem that these expenditures/donation have a valid
public purpose. (All Districts)
February 13, 2024
Page 8
7) Recommendation to award Request for Professional Services (“RPS”)
No. 22-8015, “Professional Services for Nearshore Biological
Monitoring,” to CSA Ocean Sciences Inc., and authorize the
Chairman to sign the attached agreement. (All Districts)
C. PUBLIC UTILITIES DEPARTMENT
1) Recommendation that the Board of County Commissioners, ex-officio
the Governing Board of the Collier County Water-Sewer District,
award Invitation to Bid (“ITB”) No. 23-8198, “Golden Gate Force
Main,” to Metro Equipment Service, Inc., in the amount of
$2,665,000, approve Owner’s Allowance of $250,000, and authorize
the Chairman to sign the attached Agreement. (Project 70243)
(District 3)
2) Recommendation to authorize Budget Amendments in the amount of
$116,691.40 from the Water User Fee Capital fund 4012, Project No.
71010, and the amount of $225,296.60 from the Wastewater User Fee
Capital fund 4014, Project No. 70278 to fund the design of FDOT’s I-
75 / Pine Ridge Road IQ and Water Main Relocation project (Project
No. 70289). (District 2, District 3, District 4)
3) Recommendation to award Invitation to Bid (“ITB”) No. 23-8178,
“North County Water Reclamation Facility Electrical Service #1
Upgrade Project” to Eau Gallie Electric, Inc., in the amount of
$3,852,000, approve Owner’s Allowance of $350,000, and authorize
the Chairman to sign the attached agreement. (Project Number 70278)
(District 2)
D. PUBLIC SERVICES DEPARTMENT
1) Recommendation to approve Services for Seniors, after-the-fact
Standard Contract with the Area Agency on Aging for Southwest
Florida, Inc., in the amount of $1,429,000, and authorize the
associated Budget Amendments, for FY24 Older American Act Title
III in the amount of ($12,222.23). (Human Service Grant Fund 1837)
(All Districts)
2) Recommendation to accept and ratify fee waivers granted by the
Division Director of Domestic Animal Services for the period of
February 13, 2024
Page 9
October 1, 2023, through December 31, 2023, in the amount of
$756.00, in accordance with the procedures set forth in Resolution
No. 2018-106. (All Districts)
3) Recommendation to approve the administrative report of “after-the-
fact” purchases for the Domestic Animal Services Division for the
payment of $90,542.74 for associated invoices that have not been
paid. (All Districts)
4) Recommendation to approve a First Amendment to the Pelican Bay
Community Park Management Agreement with Pelican Bay
Foundation, Inc., to clarify the percentage of public access to the
courts and extend time for County staff approval of capital
improvement plans. (District 2)
5) Recommendation to approve and authorize the Chairman to execute
the Designation Agreement (OGT-DA0109) with the State of Florida
Department of Environmental Protection, Division of Recreational
Parks, Office of Greenways and Trails to establish the Paradise Coast
Blueway Paddling Trail. (District 1, District 2)
E. CORPORATE BUSINESS OPERATIONS
1) Recommendation to approve modifications to the 2024 Fiscal Year
Pay & Classification Plan which consist of one new classification
added from October 1, 2023, through December 31, 2023. (All
Districts)
2) Recommendation to ratify Property, Casualty, Workers’
Compensation and Subrogation claim files settled and/or closed by the
Risk Management Division Director pursuant to Resolution No. 04-15
for the first quarter of FY 24. (All Districts)
3) Recommendation to approve an Assumption Agreement assigning all
rights, duties, benefits, and obligations to Bowman Gulf Coast LLC,
d/b/a Hole Montes, a Bowman Company, concerning Agreement Nos.
14-6345, 18-7432-CE, 18-7432-SM, 18-7432-UP, 20-7802, 20-7806,
and 21-7900. (All Districts)
4) Recommendation to approve the administrative report for various
February 13, 2024
Page 10
County Divisions after-the-fact purchases requiring Board approval in
accordance with Procurement Ordinance 2017-08, and the
Procurement Manual, and to approve the payment of $2,358.60 in
expenditures that have been incurred that were out of compliance with
the contracts or procurement requirements for associated invoices that
have not been paid. (All Districts)
F. COUNTY MANAGER OPERATIONS
1) Recommendation to adopt a Resolution approving amendments
(appropriating grants, donations, contributions, or insurance proceeds)
to the Fiscal Year 2023-24 Adopted Budget. (The Budget
Amendments in the attached Resolution have been reviewed and
approved by the Board of County Commissioners via separate
Executive Summaries.) (All Districts)
2) Recommendation to approve the Collective Bargaining Agreement
between Collier County and the Collier EMS/Fire District 27
Bargaining unit, Southwest Florida Professional Firefighters and
Paramedics, Local 1826, International Association of Firefighters,
Incorporated. (All Districts)
3) Recommendation to approve Agreement No. 24-010-NS “Fleet
Management Software Upgrade, Annual Support & Maintenance” and
authorize expenditures under a sole-source waiver for a period of five
years, in an amount not to exceed $235,000 for FY24 and not to
exceed $60,000 for annual maintenance fees and support per Fiscal
Year from FY25 through FY28, to obtain Fleet management system
services from TT Faster LLC, necessary to maintain County-owned
equipment. (All Districts)
4) Recommendation to award Invitation to Negotiate (“ITN”) 23-8177 -
“Gasoline and Diesel Fuel Multi-Agency Cooperative Purchase” to
Palmdale Oil Company, LLC, and authorize the Chairman to sign the
attached Agreement. (All Districts)
5) Recommendation to award Fixed Fee Professional Service Agreement
to Digitech Computer, LLC, under Request for Proposal (RFP) 23-
8098 EMS Billing Services and authorize the Chairman to sign the
attached agreement. (All Districts)
February 13, 2024
Page 11
6) Recommendation to approve Change Order No. 2, adding 425 days to
the Professional Services Agreement 21-7884 with Matern
Professional Engineering, Inc., for the New Chiller Plant Building K.
(Project No. 50214) (District 4)
7) Recommendation to approve a Subordination, Non-Disturbance, and
Attornment Agreement in reference to the property located at 1429
Don Street, Unit D, Naples, Florida currently leased by Collier
County from 23-81 LNT, LLC for warehouse storage space used by
Facilities Management. (District 4)
8) Recommendation to approve an after-the-fact payment in the total
amount of $8,295.31 to Metro Aviation, Inc., for the purchases of
helicopter medical interior equipment and parts for the backup County
air ambulance helicopter, which were not properly authorized, as
required by the Procurement Ordinance and deem that the purchases
had a valid public purpose. (All Districts)
9) Recommendation to 1) waive the single quote procurement threshold
of $3,000 per vendor per fiscal year for this transaction, 2) approve an
after-the-fact payment in the total amount of $3,871.95 to Eptura, Inc.,
for purchases that were not properly authorized as required by the
Procurement Ordinance of the annual EventBoard software
subscription for 13 licenses, which help facilitate conference room
scheduling throughout County locations, and 3) deem that the
purchases had a valid public purpose. (All Districts)
G. AIRPORT AUTHORITY
H. BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
I. MISCELLANEOUS CORRESPONDENCE
1) Miscellaneous Correspondence February 13, 2024 (All Districts)
J. OTHER CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICERS
1) Recommendation to approve the use of $2,000 from the Confiscated
Trust Funds to support the Florida FBI National Academy Associates,
Inc. (All Districts)
February 13, 2024
Page 12
2) Report to the Board regarding the investment of County funds as of
the quarter ended December 31, 2023. (All Districts)
3) To record in the minutes of the Board of County Commissioners, the
check number (or other payment method), amount, payee, and
purpose for which the referenced disbursements in the amount of
$73,629,560.92 were drawn for the periods between January 11, 2024
and January 31, 2024 pursuant to Florida Statute 136.06. (All
Districts)
4) Request that the Board approve and determine valid public purpose
for invoices payable and purchasing card transactions as of February
7, 2024. (All Districts)
K. COUNTY ATTORNEY
1) Recommendation to appoint a member to the Building Board of
Adjustments & Appeals. (All Districts)
2) Recommendation to appoint a member to the Collier County Citizen
Corps. (All Districts)
3) Recommendation to appoint one member to the Forest Lakes
Roadway & Drainage Advisory Committee. (District 4)
4) Recommendation to appoint a member to the Pelican Bay Services
Division Board. (District 2)
5) Recommendation to appoint three members to the Infrastructure
Surtax Citizen Oversight Committee. (All Districts)
6) Request by the Collier County Industrial Development Authority for
approval of a resolution authorizing the Authority to issue revenue
bonds to be used to finance the construction of the proposed NCH
Heart, Stroke, and Vascular Institute, the proposed NCH/HSS
Orthopedic Center, and other capital projects. (All Districts)
7) Recommendation to approve a Stipulated Final Judgment in the
amount of $140,800 plus $32,066 in statutory attorney fees,
apportionment fees, expert fees and costs for the taking of Parcels
February 13, 2024
Page 13
1125FEE and 1127FEE required for the Vanderbilt Beach Road
Extension Project No. 60168. (All Districts)
L. COMMUNITY REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
17. SUMMARY AGENDA - This section is for advertised public hearings and
must meet the following criteria: 1) A recommendation for approval from
staff; 2) Unanimous recommendation for approval by the Collier County
Planning Commission or other authorizing agencies of all members present
and voting; 3) No written or oral objections to the item received by staff, the
Collier County Planning Commission, other authorizing agencies or the
Board, prior to the commencement of the BCC meeting on which the items
are scheduled to be heard; and 4) No individuals are registered to speak in
opposition to the item. For those items which are quasi-judicial in nature, all
participants must be sworn in.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
A. Recommendation to adopt an Ordinance amending Ordinance No. 2021-11,
as ratified and confirmed by Ordinance No. 2021-44, which established the
Hyde Park Community Development District 1, in order to expand and
contract the external boundaries of the District resulting in a net expansion
of 63.02± acres from 368.9± acres to 431.96± acres. (District 5)
B. This item requires that Commission members provide ex-parte
disclosure. Should a hearing be held on this item, all participants are
required to be sworn in. Recommendation to approve Petition VAC-
PL20230013038 to disclaim, renounce, and vacate the County and the
Public Interest in the 12-foot Fire Wagon and Drainage Easement located
along the southerly border of Lot 20, Lake Kelly Unit 2, as recorded in Plat
Book 3, Page 93, of the Public Records of Collier County, Florida, in
Section 14, Township 50 South, Range 25 East, Collier County, Florida and
to accept Petitioner’s grant of a 12-foot drainage and access easement to
replace the vacated drainage easement. (District 4)
18. ADJOURN
INQUIRIES CONCERNING CHANGES TO THE BOARD’S AGENDA SHOULD
BE MADE TO THE COUNTY MANAGER’S OFFICE AT 252-8383.
February 13, 2024
Page 2
MS. PATTERSON: Chair, you have a live mic.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Good morning, everybody. Welcome to
the commissioner meeting.
If you haven't done so, I'm going to ask you to please silence
that cell phone. I was in a real tight meeting one time when
the -- when the tunes first came out on your phone, and all of a
sudden "She's a brick house." So I don't want you to feel like I did,
so please silence that phone.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Was that your wife calling
you?
CHAIRMAN HALL: She was calling.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: There you go.
Item #1A
INVOCATION BY PASTOR JOHN HUFFMAN, THE HARVEST
RECOVERY MINISTRY – INVOCATION GIVEN
CHAIRMAN HALL: And with that, Pastor Huffman, start us
out in prayer, please, sir.
PASTOR HUFFMAN: Yes, absolutely.
Father God Lord, we just thank you, Father. We thank you for
this great county, Lord, Collier County, Freedom Town USA, Lord.
We just pray for all the residents here, Lord. We thank you for
the wonderful residents here. We pray for wisdom. Father, any
grievances that they have, Lord, we pray that you impart wisdom and
understanding on these leaders. Lord, we pray that you continue to
impact our leaders here in Collier County. Lord, continue to protect
Collier County and keep us safe the way that you've been doing,
Lord.
Thank you, Father, for the leaders that you've given us, Lord,
February 13, 2024
Page 3
and we pray that you continue to raise these leaders up, Lord, and
give them the impartment, Lord, to pour into the future leaders, Lord,
so that we can continue to enjoy this great county.
So, Father, as grievances are raised here today, we pray, Lord,
that they are brought in, Lord, with concern, Lord, that you give the
leaders here a supernatural wisdom to impart grace on everybody
here. So, Father, again, we're just so grateful, Lord, for this great
county.
In Jesus' name, amen.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Mr. Puchalla, please lead us in the
Pledge.
(The Pledge of Allegiance was recited in unison.)
Added
A REQUEST FROM COMMISSIONER LOCASTRO ALLOWING
HIM TO PARTICIPATE VIA ZOOM – MOTION MOVED BY
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS; SECONDED BY
COMMISSIONER MCDANIEL – APPROVED
MS. PATTERSON: Commissioners, first we have a request
from Commissioner LoCastro to participate by phone, and we do
have him on the line.
Troy.
MR. MILLER: Yes, yeah. Yes, and he is unmuted.
MS. PATTERSON: All right. We have -- we need a motion
for him to participate.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: So moved.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Second.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Second.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Third.
February 13, 2024
Page 4
MS. PATTERSON: All right. Thank you. So that brings us
to agenda changes for February 13th, 2024. First is our add-on Item
16F10.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Do we need to vote, Amy?
MS. PATTERSON: Oh, I'm sorry. Yes, that would probably
be good.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: We all said --
CHAIRMAN HALL: All in favor of Commissioner LoCastro
joining us on the phone, say aye.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Aye.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: (No verbal response.)
MS. PATTERSON: I was confused by everybody saying yes.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Mr. Chair, may I say
something briefly?
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Turn him up.
MR. MILLER: I'm working on that, sir.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Can you hear me? I'm
actually on Zoom. I'm on video, so I can see you. Can they hear
me, Troy?
MR. MILLER: Yes, they can, sir.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Mr. Chair and just my fellow
commissioners, I thank you so much for your, you know, kind and
supportive words of issues I'm dealing with mostly with my mother,
and Commissioner McDaniel has been most kind because we're sort
of juggling very similar things. So I appreciate the indulgence.
We're going to be talking about some important things today,
and I'm well caught up. One of them won't be filing false police
reports, but that's going to come at another time. I'll just say that as
February 13, 2024
Page 5
an unsolicited announcement.
But thank you so much, and even to your spouses who sent me
such kind notes. It was much appreciated.
So I am -- I am fully up and running, and I look forward to some
healthy and robust discussion. And as the pastor said, supernatural
wisdom. Commissioner Hall, you must love that. You must love
that.
CHAIRMAN HALL: You have no idea.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Supernatural wisdom.
Item #2A
APPROVAL OF TODAY'S REGULAR, CONSENT AND
SUMMARY AGENDA AS AMENDED (EX PARTE DISCLOSURE
PROVIDED BY COMMISSION MEMBERS FOR CONSENT
AGENDA.) - MOTION TO APPROVE BY COMMISSIONER
MCDANIEL; SECONDED BY COMMISSIONER LOCASTRO -
APPROVED AND/OR ADOPTED W/CHANGES
MS. PATTERSON: All right. Agenda changes for
February 13th, 2024.
First is our add-on Item 16F10. This is a recommendation to
renew the annual Collier County Certificate of Public Convenience
and Necessity for Collier County Emergency Medical Services to
provide Class 1 Advanced Life Support Transport for one year and
authorize the Chairman to execute the permit and certificate with a
retroactive effective date of January 1st, 2024. This comes to the
agenda at staff's request.
And before we submit this officially for the record, we do have
three dates in the backup material that need to be corrected to have
the text of the number and the number match each other. So I just
February 13, 2024
Page 6
wanted to put that onto the record. We will make that correction
before it is entered in. And thank you to the Clerk for that
late-minute -- last-minute catch.
Next is move Item 16A4 to 11C. It is a recommendation to
adopt a resolution scheduling a public hearing to consider vacating
the 10-foot-wide public road right-of-way easement over the westerly
10 feet of Tract A-1 as described in Official Record Book 1476,
Page 242, of the public records of Collier County, Florida, located
approximately 2,000 feet south of Immokalee Road and 1,000 feet
west of Richards Street in Section 25, Township 48 South, Range 26
East, Collier County, Florida. This moves to the regular agenda at
Commissioner Saunders' and Commissioner McDaniel's separate
requests.
Continue Item 16F4 to the February 27th, 2024, BCC meeting.
This is a recommendation to award Invitation to Negotiate 23-8177,
Gasoline and Diesel Fuel Multi-agency Cooperative Purchase, to
Palmdale Oil Company, LLC, and authorize the Chairman to sign the
attached agreement. This is being moved at Commissioner
McDaniel's request.
Continue Item 16F5 to the February 27th, 2024, BCC meeting.
This is a recommendation to award Fixed Fee Professional Service
Agreement to Digitech Computer, LLC, under Request for Proposal
23-8098 EMS Billing Services, and authorize the Chairman to sign
the attached agreement. This is being moved at Commissioner
McDaniel's request.
Finally, continue Item 16B7 to the February 27th, 2024, BCC
meeting. This is a recommendation to award Request for
Professional Services No. 22-8015, Professional Services for
Nearshore Biological Monitoring, to CSA Ocean Sciences, Inc., and
authorize the Chairman to sign the attached agreement. This is
being moved at staff's request. This is a late move due to some
February 13, 2024
Page 7
unfinished questions. We spoke to each of you individually about
this item yesterday and decided to move it so we can make sure that
we have absolutely all of the answers to those questions.
Just time-certain items now. Item 5C is to be heard at 9:30 a.m.
This is an update by the Pelican Bay Foundation on pickleball at
Pelican Bay Community Park, and Item 10A to be heard at 10 a.m.
This is a discussion regarding the use of fluoride in the public potable
water supply distributed by the County's Public Utilities Water
Department.
We do have court reporter breaks set for 10:30 and again at
2:50.
With that, County Attorney.
MR. KLATZKOW: No changes. Thank you.
MS. PATTERSON: Chair, ex parte and any further changes.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Ex parte and changes, Commissioner
Kowal.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: I have no changes to the agenda
and I have no ex partes.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: And, Mr. Chairman, I have
no changes to the agenda and no ex parte as well.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner LoCastro.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Same for me; no, changes, no
ex parte.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner McDaniel.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Yes, I have enough changes I
was already inserting into this morning's repertoire.
I do want to make one public comment with regard to D5. I'm
really happy to see that. Duke, I'm really happy to see that. That's
the kyankers (phonetic) and the paddle path that we're establishing to
interconnect with our SUN Trail, and I'm really, really happy that
that's moving forward, and I hope that it meets with your approval,
February 13, 2024
Page 8
sir. And I got that.
And then the other is just a comment that I have, and it has to do
with K5, and that is I received a phone call from my friend last week
thinking that he was just checking on me to see how he was going.
So I'd like to withhold my approval for the reappointment of Scott
Lepore. And I'm joking, by the way. The TV camera's rolling.
Scott's my friend. We spent an hour on the phone, and I thought he
was calling to check on me. Then I realized he was up for
re-appointment, and he was just checking to make sure I was okay
with that. So other than that, Mr. Chair, no other changes and no ex
parte.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Thank you, sir.
And I have no changes and no ex parte.
MS. PATTERSON: All right. Could we get a motion to
approve the agenda as amended.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: So moved.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Second.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Moved by McDaniel and second by
Kowal. All in favor, say aye.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Aye.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Aye.
SEE REVERSE SIDE
Proposed Agenda Changes
Board of County Commissioners Meeting
February 13, 2024
Add-on Item 16F10: Recommendation to renew the annual Collier County’s Certificate of Public Convenience
and Necessity (COPCN) for Collier County Emergency Medical Services to provide Class 1 Advanced Life Support
Transport (ALS) for one year and authorize the Chairman to execute the Permit and Certificate, with a retroactive
effective date of January 1, 2024. (Staff’s Request)
Move Item 16A4 to 11C: Recommendation to adopt a Resolution scheduling a public hearing to consider vacating
the 10‐foot‐wide public road right‐of‐way easement over the westerly 10 feet of Tract A‐1, as described in Official
Record Book 1476, Page 242, of the Public Records of Collier County, Florida, located approximately 2,000 feet
south of Immokalee Road (CR‐846) and 1,000 feet west of Richards Street in Section 25, Township 48 South,
Range 26 East, Collier County, Florida. (PL20230007642) (Commissioners Saunders’ and McDaniel’s Separate
Requests)
Continue Item 16F4 to the February 27, 2024, BCC Meeting: Recommendation to award Invitation to Negotiate
(“ITN”) 23‐8177 ‐ “Gasoline and Diesel Fuel Multi‐Agency Cooperative Purchase” to Palmdale Oil Company, LLC,
and authorize the Chairman to sign the attached Agreement. (Commissioner McDaniel’s Request)
Continue Item 16F5 to the February 27, 2024, BCC Meeting: Recommendation to award Fixed Fee Professional
Service Agreement to Digitech Computer, LLC, under Request for Proposal (RFP) 23‐8098 EMS Billing Services and
authorize the Chairman to sign the attached agreement. (Commissioner McDaniel’s Request)
Continue Item 16B7 to the February 27, 2024, BCC Meeting: Recommendation to award Request for Professional
Services (“RPS”) No. 22‐8015, “Professional Services for Nearshore Biological Monitoring,” to CSA Ocean Sciences
Inc., and authorize the Chairman to sign the attached agreement. (Staff’s Request)
Notes:
TIME CERTAIN ITEMS:
Item 5C to be heard 9:30AM: Update by the Pelican Bay Foundation, Inc., on Pickleball at Pelican Bay
Community Park.
Item 10A to be heard at 10AM: Discussion regarding the use of fluoride in the public potable water supply
distributed by the County’s Public Utilities Division’s Water Department.
2/27/2024 1:45 PM
February 13, 2024
Page 9
Item #2B
JANUARY 9, 2024, BCC MINUTES - MOTION TO APPROVE BY
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS; SECONDED BY
COMMISSIONER HALL – APPROVED
Item #2C
JANUARY 23, 2024, BCC MINUTES - MOTION TO APPROVE
BY COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS; SECONDED BY
COMMISSIONER HALL – APPROVED
MS. PATTERSON: At your pleasure, Items 2B and 2C are
minutes from the January 9th, 2024, and the January 23rd, 2024,
BCC minutes. If you'd like to take them together or individually, at
your pleasure.
CHAIRMAN HALL: We'll take them together.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Mr. Chairman, I'll make a
motion to approve 2B and 2C, the minutes from those two meetings.
CHAIRMAN HALL: And I'll second it.
All in favor of approving both of them, say aye.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Aye.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Aye.
CHAIRMAN HALL: So moved.
Item #4A
PROCLAMATION DESIGNATING FEBRUARY 18 - 24, 2024, AS
February 13, 2024
Page 10
ENGINEERS WEEK IN COLLIER COUNTY. TO BE ACCEPTED
BY KEVIN DOWTY AND OTHER DISTINGUISHED GUESTS -
MOTION TO APPROVE BY COMMISSIONER MCDANIEL;
SECONDED BY COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS - ADOPTED
MS. PATTERSON: That brings us to Item 4A. Now, this is a
proclamation designating February 18 -- 18th through 24th, 2024, as
Engineers Week in Collier County. To be accepted by Kevin Dowty
and other distinguished guests. Congratulations.
(Applause.)
MR. TREBILCOCK: Good morning. My name is Norman
Trebilcock, and I'm here also with Alison Bickett and Kevin Dowty,
and we're all past presidents of the Florida Engineering Society,
Calusa chapter, which includes Collier County and four other
counties.
My local engineering and planning firm is Trebilcock
Consulting Solutions, and my technical expertise is in transportation
and illuminating and lighting engineering. I'm degreed in civil and
public works from the University of Miami, University of Florida.
We'd like to thank you, the Board of County Commissioners,
staff, and the County Manager for this proclamation.
Engineering is often called an invisible or stealth profession.
The stereotypical engineer is quiet and reserved; however, in our
civilized society, everything is really linked to engineering. This
very building we are in is, and it's even named after a past president
of the Florida Engineering Society, Calusa chapter, W. Harmon
Turner.
The unincorporated area of Copeland is named after Barron
Collier's chief engineer, David Graham Copeland, who helped plan
the original Tamiami Trail which opened nearly 100 years ago.
Today our society is such more complicated, and we have many
February 13, 2024
Page 11
disciplines of engineering.
There is one thing that's common to all engineers, and we use
math and science to solve real-world problems. The core value of all
engineers is we shall hold paramount the health, safety, and welfare
of the public. No matter who we're working for, the public is our
ultimate client, and that keeps us on the right side of things.
Thanks again, and we're honored to receive this proclamation
today. Appreciate it.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Thank you, sir.
MS. PATTERSON: Commissioners, if we could get a motion
to accept the proclamation.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: So moved.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Second.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Second.
CHAIRMAN HALL: All in favor to accept the proclamation,
say aye.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Aye.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Aye.
MS. PATTERSON: All right. Thank you.
Item #5A
ARTIST OF THE MONTH – COLLIER COUNTY MUSEUM
DIVISION
That brings us to 5A, if I can direct your attention to the back of
the room. This is the Artist of the Month. This month's display in
the chambers was created by the Collier County Museum division to
February 13, 2024
Page 12
celebrate Black History Month 2024. This overview of the lives of
African-Americans in Collier County is a sneak peek at things to
come because the museum division and the Friends of the Collier
County Museums are working to create a permanent home for these
stories in the Black History Baggage Car at the Naples Depot
Museum.
The museum division thanks the many members of the black
community who are sharing their lives and photographs to help create
a more complete picture of our shared history.
Item #5B
PRESENTATION OF THE COLLIER COUNTY BUSINESS OF
THE MONTH FOR FEBRUARY 2024 TO MARCO OFFICE
SUPPLY. THE AWARD WILL BE ACCEPTED BY PHILIP PENZO,
FOUNDER & OWNER, AND OTHER DISTINGUISHED
GUESTS. ALSO PRESENT IS HEATHER GAGE, MEMBERSHIP
EVENT COORDINATOR, THE GREATER NAPLES CHAMBER
OF COMMERCE – PRESENTED
That brings us to Item 5B. This is a presentation of the Collier
County Business of the Month for February 2024 to Marco Office
Supply. The award will be accepted by Philip Penzo, founder and
owner, and other distinguished guests. Also present is Donna
Jannine, director of government relations at the Greater Naples
Chamber of Commerce. Congratulations.
(Applause.)
MS. SISBARRO: Good morning. I'm Gina Sisbarro, and I'm
a partner with Philip Penzo for Marco Office Supply. So I'd like to
take this opportunity to thank the Naples Chamber of
Commerce -- thank you so much -- and also Collier County Board of
February 13, 2024
Page 13
Commissioners.
It was a -- it's such an honor and a complete surprise to us
because we do what we do because we love where we live. And we
thank you for your service, honestly, and we're just so happy to be
part of the community, which actually will extend all the way up to
Sarasota for all our clients.
Just real quick, my passion is with youth and teens. Phil is a
lifelong Rotarian with numerous projects under his belt, and our
newest employee, John Ryan, works with the Naples Zoo.
So we all have our passions, and it's family first in our
community, and we're happy to do what we do and keep helping
when these problems arise. From COVID to hurricanes to floods,
we're there for you. So thank you so much. Appreciate it.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Thank you.
(Applause.)
Item #11B
DIRECT THE COUNTY MANAGER OR DESIGNEE TO
PROCEED WITH SECURING THE SERVICES OF ONE OR
MORE CONSULTANTS TO ASSIST IN THE DEVELOPMENT OF
A TRANSITION AND ACQUISITION PLAN FOR A
REPLACEMENT OR ENHANCED 800MHZ RADIO SYSTEM.
(MICHAEL CHOATE, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF PUBLIC
SAFETY) (ALL DISTRICTS) - MOTION TO APPROVE BY
COMMISSIONER MCDANIEL; SECONDED BY
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS - APPROVED
MS. PATTERSON: Chair, with your indulgence, we'd like to
pull Item 11B up and hear it now due to the fact that we've several of
our first responders here in the audience. If we can deal with this
February 13, 2024
Page 14
item and then let them go. This is -- as directed by the Board at our
workshop, is a recommendation to direct the County Manager or
designee to proceed with securing the services of one or more
consultants to assist with the development of a transition and
acquisition plan for replacement or enhanced 800 megahertz radio
system. And Mr. Ed Finn is here to open up the discussion.
MR. FINN: Thank you, Ms. Patterson.
Mr. Chairman, one moment. Very good.
Again, thank you, Ms. Patterson, Mr. Chairman. My name is
Edward Finn, Deputy County Manager.
This item is a follow-up to a Board discussion that occurred
during our February 6th, 2024, Board workshop. As discussed in the
workshop, staff and key stakeholders have conducted a
self-assessment of the 800 megahertz P25 radio system and
concluded that a need exists to proceed with a formal evaluation of
the system to determine if the system should be replaced or otherwise
significantly enhanced.
To that end, we're seeking Board direction to proceed with
securing a third-party independent expert or experts to provide a
comprehensive system evaluation of the system. The proposed
scope will include but not be limited to a comprehensive system
evaluation, stakeholder alignment, current and future needs analysis,
financial considerations, scope development, and services during
procurement.
Staff's recommendation is to direct the County Manager or
designee to proceed with securing those services I just discussed to
conduct that comprehensive review.
With that, staff -- Mr. Hinkle is here, if need be, to answer any
specific questions. I'll also note for the Chair that there's a number
of public safety agency professionals here that may have some input
into this that the Board may wish to consider.
February 13, 2024
Page 15
CHAIRMAN HALL: Nobody's lit up, so I have a question for
you. You know, we're looking at spending money for somebody to
do some more thinking. And I guess my question to you,
Mr. Hinkle, is do you think that you and your staff would have the
capability to come up with what you want to come up with, or would
you look forward to hearing a third party?
MR. HINKLE: I'd look forward to hearing a third-party
recommendation, yes. I'm sorry. I'd look forward to hearing from a
third party. I believe that we are fully capable of coming up with
that recommendation, but in order to verify where we stand, I think it
is a prudent method and a methodology that's time proven to consult
a third party.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Sure, thanks.
MR. HINKLE: I don't want to delay anything, but on the other
hand, let's get that third-party consultant.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner McDaniel.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Yes. And this is for you,
Mr. Hinkle. I received an e-mail yesterday from the manufacturer of
the towers and the actual physical system, a company called L3
Harris.
MR. HINKLE: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Have you had
communication with them yet?
MR. HINKLE: No, sir, I have not.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Okay. I have a copy of an
e-mail, and I'd be happy to share it with everybody, including the
Clerk, if you wish. But they have reached out to express an interest
in participating with this. If we do, in fact, engage a consultant, I
want to be sure that we are consulting with everyone involved.
They're a huge company. We're moving down a path here that's
recommendation for replacement and an extremely extensive -- not
February 13, 2024
Page 16
that it isn't warranted, but it's an extremely expensive system.
And so I want to make sure that we're involving everyone that's
involved, especially the company that already has created and
manufactured the actual hardware that we, in fact, have. So the
company is called L3 Harris, and I just want to make sure, even if we
engage a third party, that we're communicating.
MR. HINKLE: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: With that, I'll make a motion.
Do you need a motion on this?
MS. PATTERSON: Yes, sir.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner Saunders, do you have a
comment?
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Oh, I'm sorry.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Yes, Mr. Chairman.
I was at a meeting last night and understood that this is a system
that may cost as much as $50 million, not counting the individual
radios. And so it's a huge -- obviously a huge acquisition. And
when this came up the first time, I felt very strongly that we needed
to bring in a third party to assist our staff. And it was not in
derogation of our staff's abilities or anything, but simply this is a
changing world and a lot of different suppliers, and having a third set
of eyes looking at this, I thought, was prudent.
MR. HINKLE: Absolutely.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: So I'm delighted to hear
what you said this morning in terms of, yes, you would like to have --
MR. HINKLE: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: -- an outside consultant. I
believe this will be money very well spent, because we don't want to
make a mistake on this one.
MR. HINKLE: No.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: And I don't know if anybody
February 13, 2024
Page 17
else wanted to speak on that. It doesn't look like anybody's jumping
up back there, so...
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Move for approval.
MR. MILLER: I do have two registered speakers for 11B.
This is 11B, correct?
MS. PATTERSON: Yes, sir.
MR. MILLER: I have Jose Vasquez, followed by Fred Gallart.
MR. GALLART: Yes. Good morning. My name is Fred
Gallart. I am the director for the Southeast for L3 Harris, the
company that manufactures the system that you presently have
deployed here in Collier County. We've had a tremendous history
here originally with the original equipment that was installed and
then upgraded in 2016.
The system is only 12 years old. Most of these systems last 20
to 22 to 23 years. I was significantly surprised by what happened in
the workshop, and you have all the right, you know, to do what you
want to do if you want to move and implement a brand-new system.
My issue here or my recommendation to you is to take a real
hard look at the amount of money that you have invested in this
technology, which is P25 technology, a technology that is open not
only to this manufacturer but to other manufacturers to participate
selling or putting terminals on.
To implement a brand-new system is approximately 50 to
$55 million, especially this size. Not only that, not only the public
safety side of the house, but also the school board which presently
also piggybacks off of this network and the core.
Apparently, we are right now not the contractor with Collier
County, but we are the manufacturer that supports the contractor,
which is CI. We're more than willing to help on anything that you
need. But if you look around -- for example, the State of Florida
tried to do a change approximately about three years ago, and the
February 13, 2024
Page 18
amount of money that they were going to spend, which was close to a
billion dollars, we came in around 700,000 to do an upgrade of that
system.
Your county next door, Miami-Dade County, which presently
has the same technology that you have, the county and multiple
cities, such as Hialeah, Miami, Miami-Dade, Miami Beach, all of
them are interconnected. I guess my question is, I can't understand
why it's not working here and it works all over Florida and all over
the United States.
So I am open for anything to help the county, but seriously
consider what it is that you're about to do.
I want to thank you for the opportunity to be here, and I'm open
for any questions that you may have.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I don't have any questions.
I'm just -- thank you for coming today. And I brought it up before
you spoke, and I'm sure you'll be engaged as we move through this
process.
MR. GALLART: Okay. Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Mr. Chair, that was Fred Gallart. I also have a
slip for Jose Vasquez. Is he --
MR. GALLART: Yeah. He reports to me. We didn't know if
we were going to need six minutes or three minutes. So thank you
very much. So we don't need Jose. Thank you very much.
CHAIRMAN HALL: You did good. Thank you.
MR. GALLART: Thank you.
MR. MILLER: That's all the speakers we had, sir.
CHAIRMAN HALL: So if I remember in the workshop --
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: And you did second.
CHAIRMAN HALL: -- the whole reason why this was coming
up was because we were having significant issues with
communications with our first responders. And so as we engage L3
February 13, 2024
Page 19
Harris in these conversations, I'm sure that he's -- I'm sure that they're
still aware of those same issues. I just want to make sure that
everybody gets a fair shake.
And so anybody else have any questions? Commissioner
McDaniel?
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I just wanted to -- on that
point, just to clarify, there is a vendor who we do do business with,
and then there is the manufacturer, which is L3 Harris technologies
and who have their own technologies and their own capacities as
well. So that was the rationale for me to make sure that it was
pointed that they're engaged in this process. We don't want to run
down a hole that says we have to replace the system if there are
upgrades and things. We already started that process. So that's the
whole goal here in bringing in a third-party consultant to ensure that
we're doing the best we can for our community.
MR. FINN: Yes, sir.
Mr. Chair, if I may just add a little bit to the dialogue. Our
intent here is to do, as we said, a comprehensive third-party
evaluation. That third-party evaluation is going to get us where we
need to go without the kind of inside -- inside concerns that may exist
by the self-evaluation that took place.
So I think this is a prudent step whether we move -- we move in
a significant direction or, at a minimum, identify any substantial
issues that perhaps haven't been addressed appropriately. Either
way, I think the outcome is going to be beneficial to the community.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner LoCastro, just checking
on you. Do you have any comments?
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: I don't, Mr. Chairman, but
thank you for checking.
CHAIRMAN HALL: All right. Thanks.
So with that, do we have a motion?
February 13, 2024
Page 20
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: And a second.
CHAIRMAN HALL: And a second. We have a motion and a
second to approve the study. All in favor, say aye.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Aye.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Aye.
CHAIRMAN HALL: All opposed?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN HALL: So moved.
MS. PATTERSON: Go ahead, Troy.
MR. MILLER: Yeah, Mr. Chair, the organizers of the public
speakers for 10A, I know, worked really hard to put these together in
some sort of order, but I found quite a few discrepancies here, people
ceding time to two different people or an option. So I'm going to
ask, I think it was Ms. Sherman, and I don't know who else I was
getting these with, to meet in the hallway with county staff so we can
get this sorted out before we get to that item.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Okay. Great.
Item #5C
UPDATE BY THE PELICAN BAY FOUNDATION, INC., ON
PICKLEBALL AT PELICAN BAY COMMUNITY PARK –
PRESENTED
MS. PATTERSON: Commissioners, at your pleasure, we're
about two minutes early, but I think we can go ahead and get the
Pelican Bay folks up for the update, Item 5C. Get them up and
situated. This is an update by the Pelican Bay Foundation, Inc., on
February 13, 2024
Page 21
pickleball at Pelican Bay Community Park. Thank you.
MR. D'ERRICO: Good morning, everybody. Mr. Chairman,
Commissioners.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Good morning. Hi, Tony.
MR. D'ERRICO: Thank you so much for the opportunity to be
here today to address you, and thank you so much for your leadership
and for your service to our community. I'm joined this morning by
Mike Ruffolo, the chairman of our board of directors; Melanie Miller,
our vice president; and Maury Bozman, our director of Community
Center and Racquets. My name Tony D'Errico. I am the president
of Pelican Bay Foundation.
We wanted to take just a minute and update you on our progress
of the project so far. And I have a few comments relative to our
partnership going forward. And I'd like to step you through the
materials we've provided for you in advance. And, of course, we'd
be honored to take your questions at the end.
First, since executing our agreement in August, we have
engaged the services of a professional team, namely the architect and
civil engineer, to guide and assist us with the design, development,
and budget development for the facility. And throughout this
process, we have kept the County Manager's Office and Parks and
Rec leadership abreast of all of our progress.
And, recently, we collaborated with them to draft language for
an amendment which is also included in your materials, an
amendment to our agreement, which will add clarity to public access
to the facility.
Just to update you on Foundation activities since we were last
here, at our December board meeting, the Foundation board
authorized funding to proceed with the development of bid
documents. That process began in January, will take roughly 12 to
14 weeks. We hope to have the bid set completed by April of this
February 13, 2024
Page 22
year and the project out for bid shortly thereafter.
All the while, we plan to continue our efforts to engage the
community by conducting focus groups and engaging our own
residents for various activities at the pickleball facility and Veterans
Park to give everybody a little taste and flavor in terms of what is
coming from a facility and programming point of view at the
community park facility.
With respect to our partnership with the county, which we
appreciate very much, we've got two key items for you today. The
first is simply to update you on the facility design and the site plan,
which we will continue coordination with county staff on the actual
approval of plans and specifications, and the second has to do with
the first amendment to the management agreement which includes
two articles. One is our request for a 60-day extension to the
original management agreement, which was 180 days. We needed
the extra time to seek the approval of county staff on actual plans and
specifications for the facility, and two is the amendment I just
mentioned which provided or provides more clarity with respect to
public access to the facility, and this was in response to a request that
was made by a resident and concern around public access.
The diagram on the screen, which I'm sure you have, is just the
current rendering of the community park. We made a few very
modest adjustments to the original site plan. The courts are located
in their original location, 20 courts. The proposed improvements to
the all-purpose athletic fields to the southeast -- on the southeast
corner of the property, and then the configuration of the gathering
area, building, shaded community area and, of course, the expansion
and resurfacing of the parking lot.
And by the way, just as an aside, we hope to seek consideration
for TDC funding in the future for the parking lot expansion. The
Foundation needed to make several value-engineering concessions to
February 13, 2024
Page 23
the project to get the projected costs back to our prescribed budget
cap of $6 million. If we're successful in doing that, we'd be more
than happy to reinvestigate any savings we had in reversing some of
those value-engineering changes to enhance the facility even more.
This image here is just a blown-up version. We wanted to
highlight the sound attenuation wall. This is an area of deep concern
to the Foundation to make sure we're respecting our neighbors and
doing everything possible to mitigate the sound activity from the
pickleball facility. We are in the process, actively engaged with
sound engineers to conduct a variety of studies to determine baseline
decibel levels and then to conduct a series of modeling exercises that
will help us to finalize the actual design and specification for the
material and -- the materials and the design for the sound attenuation
wall. We just wanted you to have a blown-up image of what we
anticipate the wall representing in order to protect the sound that's
going to come from the pickleball facility.
I hope it goes without saying the Foundation is grateful for our
partnership with Collier County, and we look forward to and are
committed to delivering a county park and recreational facility that
meets the needs of our residents, and we will continue to provide
routine and transparent conversations and communication with the
County Manager's Office and the Parks and Recreation leadership
concerning programming fees, project timelines, key milestones, et
cetera.
The next slide just gives you an idea of what our projected
timeline is, a quick recap. We're in the design development process
now. We hope to conclude that in April. We will begin a process
of transitioning the concessionaire in May, and sound studies for us
will be ongoing as we complete those and finalize the design for our
attenuation plan, and then we hope to build -- begin construction
sometime this summer, and we're being told by the contractors we're
February 13, 2024
Page 24
having initial discussions with that we're anticipating roughly a
six- to nine-month completion time.
That is all we had for our update for you this morning, and we're
happy to answer any questions that the commissioners have in mind.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner McDaniel.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: That's me. And just one
quick question.
MR. D'ERRICO: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: When you were talking about
the estimation of the initial cost and potential savings -- and this is as
much to you as it is to our staff, we're not authorizing an expenditure
of those funds for reinvestment in. This is a bequeath of money
there, both coming from you and from the county, with regard to
these improvements. Any changes in the construction cost, higher or
lower, has to come back to this board, if I'm not mistake; is that
correct?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: No. Actually, the way -- and the County
Attorney can correct me.
Dan Rodriguez, your Deputy County Manager.
The way the agreement works is they were going to contribute
up to $6 million for this investment of the park through their funds.
None of the funds would come to the county.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Okay. So your clarification
at the beginning was that in the event that the costs came in less than
that, then those funds are committed to --
MR. D'ERRICO: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: -- enhance the community
park and so -- thank you for that clarification.
MR. D'ERRICO: Yes, sir. My pleasure.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner LoCastro.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: I think I'm unmuted. Thank
February 13, 2024
Page 25
you, Mr. Chairman.
Troy, first off, I really appreciate that you brought this update to
our attention. Although I know you've worked so closely with Parks
and Rec and Commissioner Hall, this is his district, but we all know
so many people who live in Pelican Bay, and I've spoken there
several times as a Rotarian. So I still get, you know, questions here
and there.
So I just wanted to ask you a couple things that I think might be
a little redundant, because you did cover it, but I just want to know
for sure so I don't misspeak either in an e-mail or if I'm invited to
another Rotary breakfast or something like this.
There were quite a few constituents that had concerns over
noise. There was, I thought, a significant amount of people who
were confused on the cost, and you obviously would know that. I
got these, you know, long e-mails, and, you know, the answer was
very short. No, that's not how things are being paid for. You're
confused.
And then, you know, lastly, do you feel -- I guess my overall
generic statement would be that although I never felt it was a
significant amount of citizens, but I really respected the care that
you-all took to hear from everybody, but would you say it's a fair
statement to say although you can't please everybody, that the amount
of citizens that seem to have concerns, weren't happy, weren't
supportive has decreased significantly? Maybe that's the overall
question that encompasses the two or three things that I stated, you
know, beforehand.
MR. D'ERRICO: Thank you for your question, Commissioner.
I'll address the last one first. Yes, it is my belief and our belief that
that number has reduced due in a large part to our commitment to
engaging the community transparently on the subjects that were the
original irritants, i.e., the possibility of a noise problem in that section
February 13, 2024
Page 26
of the community and then what I'll politely suggest were rumors
around the cost escalation and funding source.
I'm sure you're aware, these things are quite common in
communities when information is passed through unofficial channels,
and many of those reached me, and I was able to deal with them, I
think, quite directly, that we are committed to our $6 million budget.
We have a viable plan that is our path forward that gets us there, and
we are not assessing the community any additional dollars to fund
our investment in the pickleball facility. That was the -- in our view,
the basis of the rumors or commentary that was going around and a
source of discontent for some. But I believe we were successful just
by providing facts in snubbing some of those out.
And to the first comment about the potential for the noise, I
believe -- again, I don't think we're going to make everybody
100 percent completely happy on this, but I believe we have been
successful in transparently engaging the community relative to our
plans for mitigation and our commitment to invest what we need to to
make sure that the sound is not a problem.
Thank you for the question.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Thank you very much. You
know, it was easy for me to actually just answer the questions of a
few friends because your team had so expertly briefed us that -- the
word I would use is, you know, like you said, confusion, gossip.
Really it was miscommunication. And so by you clearly stating just
what you said right now on the record, if somebody wants to go back
and read this or we want to pull the transcript or, you know,
somebody wants to get the straight skinny, I think you packaged it
perfectly.
So thank you so much for the update. Glad to hear, you know,
things are moving forward. And as you said, you can't please
everybody, but a much smaller group that maybe feels a lot better
February 13, 2024
Page 27
about it. And I do believe I have a Rotary Club separate sort of
breakfast that I'm attending, and I just want to make sure I'm fully up
to speed, and I certainly feel that I am. I won't stir the pot anymore
or at all.
But I appreciate the update. Thank you, sir.
MR. D'ERRICO: Thanks for the question and the opportunity
to clarify.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Yes, sir.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Thank you, Tony. Do we need a motion
to approve it or --
MS. PATTERSON: No, sir. This was just an update.
CHAIRMAN HALL: All right. Great, thanks.
MR. D'ERRICO: Thank you.
MS. PATTERSON: Commissioners, that brings us to Item 7,
public comments on general topics not on the current or future
agenda.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Mr. Chairman?
CHAIRMAN HALL: Yes.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I wanted to just interrupt for
a second. I understand that Mr. Bumpous from Arthrex just came in
on the issue dealing with the Golden Gate Golf Course, so if we
could take that up prior to the issue --
CHAIRMAN HALL: 10 o'clock time-certain?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: -- on fluoride.
CHAIRMAN HALL: I saw him leave. There, he comes back.
So we'll take -- we'll take the golf course issue before the 10 o'clock,
because it's going to be fairly short, I think.
MS. PATTERSON: Troy, how many public comment people
do we have?
MR. MILLER: That's Item 10B?
MS. PATTERSON: No, for Item 7.
February 13, 2024
Page 28
MR. MILLER: Oh, for Item 7; three.
MS. PATTERSON: At your pleasure, if you'd like to take
Arthrex first and then the public comment or vice versa, Chair.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Let's do Arthrex first. That way we can
get him on his way.
Item #11A
APPROVED THE SELECTION COMMITTEE’S RANKING
RELATED TO INVITATION TO NEGOTIATE (“ITN”) # 24-8223,
“GOLF AND ENTERTAINMENT COMPLEX AT THE FORMER
GOLDEN GATE GOLF COURSE” AND AUTHORIZE STAFF TO
BEGIN CONTRACT NEGOTIATIONS WITH THE TOP-RANKED
FIRM, THE GATE GOLF CLUB, INC., SO THAT A PROPOSED
AGREEMENT CAN BE BROUGHT BACK FOR THE BOARD’S
CONSIDERATION AT A FUTURE MEETING. (ED FINN,
DEPUTY COUNTY MANAGER) (DISTRICT 3) - MOTION TO
APPROVE BY COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS; SECONDED BY
COMMISSIONER KOWAL - APPROVED
MS. PATTERSON: Okay. That brings us to Item 11A. This
is a recommendation to approve the selection committee's ranking
related to Invitation to Negotiate 24-8223, golf and entertainment
complex at the former Golden Gate Golf Course, and authorize staff
to begin contract negotiations with the top-ranked firm, the Gate Golf
Club, Inc., so that a proposed agreement can be brought back for the
Board's consideration at a future meeting.
Mr. Ed Finn, your Deputy County Manager, will begin the
presentation.
MR. FINN: Thank you, Ms. Patterson. Thank you,
Mr. Chairman. I'm Ed Finn, Deputy County Manager.
February 13, 2024
Page 29
This item seeks approval of the selection committee's ranking
relative to ITN No. 24-8223 and authorization for staff to negotiate
an agreement for the golf and entertainment complex at the former
Golden Gate Golf Course.
In June -- rather, in July of 2019, the county took possession of
the golf course. We chose to not continue golf operations but have
maintained the property for passive recreation in the interim.
On December 12th, '23, the Board directed staff to develop and
solicit an invitation to negotiate for design, construction, and
operation of the Golden Gate Golf Course. The solicitation included
but was not limited to a nine-hole public golf course, driving range,
short-game area, and clubhouse with a restaurant open to the public,
along with The First Tee Learning Center, with Collier County
residents being provided a discounted fee structure and a fee to be
paid for -- to the county.
On December 18th, the Procurement Services Division released
the ITN. The county received two submittals by the January 8th,
'24, deadline. Both bidders were found to be responsive and
responsible. A selection committee met on January 27th after
reviewing the proposals and deliberating. The committee scored the
proposals and short-listed the two firms to move to an oral
presentation.
On January 29th, '24, the selection committee reconvened for
presentations, and the final rankings of the firms were the Gate Golf
Club, Inc., was ranked No. 1, Brook Holding was ranked No. 2. The
Gate Gulf Club is a newly formed public charity created by the
Schmieding family.
With that, staff is recommending that the Board approve the
selection committee's ranking and authorize staff to begin contract
negotiations with the top-ranked firm, the Gate Golf Club, Inc.
With that, we'll be happy to respond to any questions or --
February 13, 2024
Page 30
CHAIRMAN HALL: Thank you, Mr. Finn.
Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I don't have any questions.
I would -- I do want to thank staff for moving this along. This has
been a long-time project, and I know folks out in the Golden Gate
City area are really anxious to see what happens with that golf
course. So this is a good-news item. I know Mr. Bumpous is here,
I think, just probably if there are any questions. And if there are no
registered speakers --
MR. MILLER: I had someone registered on Zoom that was on
Zoom, and they dropped off right as we started this item. So I'm
watching for them.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: So there are no registered
speakers. I don't know that we need any further dialogue. I think
the Board is really fully up to speed on all of this, so I'll make a
motion to approve the staff recommendation to begin negotiations
with the first-ranked firm, the Gate Golf Club, Inc.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Second.
CHAIRMAN HALL: We have a motion and a second. I do
have a comment. As we go forward, this property has encumbered
public debt on it as of $29 million total for everything, for the
veterans administration home, the rural housing project, as well as the
golf course.
There was mention of $6 million that was previously done to the
First Tee or -- no -- excuse me, to BigShots as a gift to get started
from the county.
And just -- to my colleagues, just to put something in your ear.
I would really like to see that $6 million go towards the debt on that
property. Seeing that it's going to be a non-for-profit, it's going to
be -- you know, it's going to be operating, and we don't have any tax
base coming from that. Just a thought.
February 13, 2024
Page 31
MR. FINN: And I think that's a good thought, sir. We're
always trying to minimize our debt and place it properly.
In concept, this golf course will remain a passive recreation and
remain part of our inventoried acreage for Parks and Recreation.
Accordingly, we have been and we hope to continue to fund the
particular debt service with impact fees provided for Parks and
Recreation activities.
So while I'll acknowledge your desire, I think the fact that this
portion of the debt service is supported by the appropriate impact fee
makes the concept of this being a public recreation facility consistent
with the way we're funding it.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Okay. Commissioner LoCastro.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: I wanted to make sure I was
unmuted.
My question is for Commissioner Saunders, you know, sir, and
it's just one of inquiry. The last groups that were involved seemed to
give us the impression they were blindsided a bit by the conditions of
the land, the arsenic. You know, we know the list of challenges,
hurdles. This sounds great. We're moving forward with, you know,
a group that sounds extremely solid.
But I just was curious if they have a better comfort level that
there are some investment hurdles to get over, and it's not turnkey as,
you know, we found out with sort of the other group. Is that a fair
question? I just had written that down as I was hearing, you know,
the positive news that, you know, we've got another interested party.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Well, Mr. Chairman, if I
might respond.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Go ahead.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: All questions are reasonable,
so that's a reasonable question. But just a little bit of the history,
BigShots, when they came in with their proposal to do a 12-hole golf
February 13, 2024
Page 32
course and the BigShots facility along with First Tee, the county had
set aside $7 million for the development of the golf course.
BigShots was going to design the golf course. The county was going
to pay for the construction of the golf course and own the golf course.
So that really wasn't a gift to BigShots. It was really
recognition by the county that this was a county park. This was a
county golf course, and the county was willing to put in the cost to
develop it.
BigShots didn't fall off the radar here because of arsenic or any
other difficulties with the site. BigShots fell off because BigShots,
which was owned by ClubCorp, was ultimately sold to Topgolf, the
competitor. Topgolf made the decisions that they didn't want to be
in Collier County primarily for two reasons. One, they have a
facility in Lee County that everyone, I think, is familiar with and,
number two, their -- the way they operate, they own the land that
their facilities reside on. And with BigShots, the original proposal
was that Collier County would continue to own the land into the
future.
So BigShots fell off not because of any problems with
development, not because of any financial issues. They really fell
off because they were sold to Topgolf, and Topgolf didn't want to
proceed in Collier County.
All of the development issues are being resolved, and so there
are no real hurdles to the Arthrex group, the Gate Golf Club,
proceeding with this.
And, Mr. Chairman, the $6 million for the golf course has
always been part of this project going way back to the very beginning
when this was originally bid and that BigShots secured that bid
originally. And when this came back a few months ago, back in
December, that was also part of the plan was for the county to
continue to put that money into the development of the golf course
February 13, 2024
Page 33
because the county continues to own that property.
And so, Mr. Chairman, I think the proposal that we have in front
of us recognizes that this really is an inexpensive way for the county
to develop a really first-class public facility, a public park. And so
that's why I suggested originally that we proceed with this, and that's
why I made the motion this morning.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Okay. Commissioner McDaniel.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Thank you, Commissioner
Saunders. I think that clarity is perfect, and extremely important,
because much like the Pelican Bay pickleball, there's still a few folks
out there that I think have some sort of dated information, and you
encapsulated it perfectly, separating rumor from fact as to why we
moved on. So I couldn't be more supportive of the project. Thank
you.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner McDaniel.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: And just -- I concur as well.
Thank you for that explanation, Commissioner Saunders. And I also
don't disagree with Commissioner Hall. The call is for the
philanthropic community here to see the value of this -- of this
development for our community at large. And in the event that we
have people that can, in fact, contribute and we're not obligated for
that investment, then I would support the reduction of the debt as
well. Be that as it may, we're in for the investment as it is for right
now.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner Kowal.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Thank you, Chairman.
I know I sat through the original presentation from Gate Golf
Club, Inc., when it was originally brought to our attention, and then it
went out for bid, and I believe it went through the process with the
board and -- not us, but the board that oversaw that bid process.
February 13, 2024
Page 34
And I know that day that I had -- the presentation was given to
us and knowing that this was going to be a non-profit type
organization, even that day I was not real clear on the amount of
monies after fees are collected for our citizens to use the golf course,
what percentage came back to the county.
I guess my question is, after the process of this weeding out
who's going to be the person awarded this, did we get any more
clarity? Or maybe I just missed it initially in the initial report. But
have we got any clear -- clarity on what percentage and how much
comes back to the county to the people from the fees collected?
MR. FINN: The answer to that, sir, is those are -- those
specifics will work through in the negotiation process. We're well
aware that the Board intends to get some -- some recovery or some
fee for the use of its -- of its asset over time. I have no reason to
believe that we can't reach a reasonable agreement with the
Arthrex-led group.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: So once you get to that point,
then we'll know better what percentage will come back to us? And
would that monies be allowed to be used to reduce the debt, or would
that be earmarked back to Parks and Recs for --
MR. FINN: Well, insofar the debt could be covered by Park's
impact fees, it probably would be best to leave it that way. So
money coming back would go to offset the General Fund, and it
could well be Parks and Rec is where it would feed through.
And if I may, the contract with the terms that we ultimately
come to does come back to the Board for approval prior to it being
implemented, so at that time the Board at that point in time will have
a full presentation of the specifics of the contract and be able to give
us kind of an up or down vote on what we've been able to achieve.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
February 13, 2024
Page 35
To refresh everybody's recollection, when we decided to do the
ITN back in December, I had presented to the Board that there were
some preliminary discussions that the county would receive 2 percent
of the gross revenue of all of the operations associated with this; the
restaurant, the golf course, any other operations out there for the
driving range.
When we did the BigShots deal, I think the BigShots was -- I
think their commitment was 3 percent of the gross. One of the -- and
their gross revenue would be substantially higher.
One of the reasons that I had suggested using a percentage of the
gross revenue is that eliminates all of the difficulty in auditing any
type of revenue stream to the facility. The gross revenue will be
basically determined by the sales tax that's filed with the state.
So no real issues in how much profit there was, how much
money people are getting paid. That's all eliminated by having a
percentage of the gross. And the issue of the reduction in fees for
county residents, in the original BigShots facility deal, county
residents would receive a 40 percent discount on all fees charged for
the driving range and for the golf course.
Now, one question that arose is, well, what's the original fee that
you're taking the 40 percent off? Well, it's very difficult to say what
that fee would be because it changes from the time of year, from time
of day. And so there is a -- kind of a going rate, if you will, which
the golf course can charge the general public for playing nine holes or
18 holes on this golf course. Whatever that general fee would be,
the county residents would get a 40 percent discount from that.
And so I think all of that was pretty well laid out when we did
the ITN request back in December. All of that is obviously subject
to negotiation but -- in terms of some of the details. But those were
sort of the general parameters that we laid out in the ITN going back
to December.
February 13, 2024
Page 36
MR. FINN: I recollect that in much the same way.
CHAIRMAN HALL: You know, in reference to the
$6 million, BigShots was BigShots. We have a chance to do it right
and to do it correct going forward, and we -- this deal has nothing to
do with that deal.
So with that said, I would like to see -- you know, the general
fee in Collier County to play golf -- I'm a golfer -- I won't pay it. So
I would like to see something that's super realistic for our citizens
where they can come enjoy our -- you know, a golf course and do it
over and over and not be financially strapped to do it once a month,
but that they can really enjoy it.
So with that, we have a motion and a second. So all in favor of
continuing this for the -- for them to -- intent to negotiate?
MS. KINZEL: Commissioner Hall?
CHAIRMAN HALL: Yes. Go ahead, Clerk.
MS. KINZEL: Hi. Sorry. Crystal Kinzel, for the record,
Clerk.
We have had several discussions, and I did just want to put it on
the record with county management, some of the information
regarding use of the impact fee, especially when you're using it for
housing and also veterans.
So as a proportion of the debt that's owed is obviously a concern
to your comptroller.
Also, some of the issues with the ITN, there are concerns. We
received it last week with the responses, and we're continuing to look
at that, so I did just want to put that on the record for your
information.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Thank you.
MS. KINZEL: Thank you.
MR. FINN: Yes, sir. Mr. Chair, if I may just clarify
something. When I speak to Parks' impact fees, that's in reference to
February 13, 2024
Page 37
the acreage associated with the golf course. It's not relative to any
other use that may exist currently or in the future on the golf course.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Great. We don't want to get into the
weeds of the deal, but just so you heard the general comments and the
general -- you know, the thoughts moving forward, I'd appreciate
that.
So we have a motion and a second. So all in favor to continue
the ITN, say aye.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Aye.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Aye.
CHAIRMAN HALL: All opposed?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN HALL: Motion passes.
Item #7
PUBLIC COMMENTS ON GENERAL TOPICS NOT ON THE
CURRENT OR FUTURE AGENDA
MS. PATTERSON: Commissioners, we are at public
comments on general topics not on the current or future agenda.
Troy, do we still have three?
MR. MILLER: Yes, we do.
MS. PATTERSON: I would suggest at your indulgence that we
take those three public speakers, and then we can get started with our
10 o'clock time-certain.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Let's do it.
MR. MILLER: Your first speaker is Robert Thurston, and he'll
February 13, 2024
Page 38
be followed by Daniel Cook.
MR. THURSTON: Good morning, Commissioners.
Hello. My name is Robert Thurston. Today marks my ninth
appearance before the Collier County Board of Commissioners. As
always, these presentations are meant to be respectful and
informative.
I'm back again today to talk about the deep state and the
Targeted Individual Program. Recently I've contacted Florida
Senator Shevrin Jones, Jonathan Martin, Debbie Mayfield, Rosalind
Osgood, and Jason Pizzo to ask for assistance introducing new laws
that explicitly spell out the legal penalties for participation in the
Targeted Individual Program.
If you will please see the online link that talks about the local
people here in Naples involved in my illegal targeting at
targetedindividual4.wordpress.com. Again, that address is
targetedindividual4.wordpress.com.
At the last Board meeting on January 23, 2024, I began to
explain the role of San Diego-based Navy Seal John Smith and my
14-year ordeal of illegal targeting. It was Smith that nominated me
for placement on phony terrorist watch lists. That placement was the
basis for literally thousands of harassing incidents directed at me
between 2009 and 2024.
Smith's hope was that I would, in response to the targeting, die,
commit suicide, commit a crime, become homeless, become
institutionalized, impoverished, incarcerated. Today in 2024 I
reserve the right to speak out where my safety is involved. I'm
continuing to give examples of the crimes that people named in the
online documents committed against me in hopes legislators draft
new laws in response.
Navy Seal John Smith was able to use back doors into Google to
slander my name online.
February 13, 2024
Page 39
This week I wrote to over 350 politicians, reporters, law
enforcement people, other targeted individuals, lawyers, and activists.
I sent them videos from different dates in 2014 and 2023 that showed
under a Google search of my full name what I call a slander graphic,
for lack of a better word, that Smith put up and took down for years,
between 2010 and 2023. The slander graphic was the first entry at
the top of the search page and contained phrases like offender,
inmate, jail search, sexual predator, and other untrue derogatory
descriptions.
I searched many other names online with people of lengthy
records, and Smith's slander graphic never appeared under any of
these other people's names. I keep having to explain I have one and
only one misdemeanor conviction in the last 23 years. That is the
totality of my conviction record over the last 23 years.
One of the main tactics of the deep state is slander or name
smearing. Smith has around-the-clock real-time access to my phone
and home computers. Between 2010 and 2023, there are points
where I was looking for employment online. I would respond to an
English teaching ad opportunity and then sometimes get interview
offers. At this point, Smith would put the slander graphic up. That
would result in radio silence, no calls back, or questions about arrests.
You can imagine how frustrating that might be over 13 years.
If the people cannot trust -- if the people cannot trust their
government to do the job for which it exists, to protect them and to
promote the common welfare, then all is lost.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Thank you, Mr. Thurston.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Daniel Cook. He'll be
followed by Alan Carpenter.
MR. COOK: Thank you, Mr. Chair. Daniel Cook, vice
chairman of the Collier County Republican Party, for the record.
I'd like to take my three minutes to speak generally about some
February 13, 2024
Page 40
of our founding documents, actually.
I often ask myself the question, what is the purpose of
government? So I like to look at one of our founding documents, the
Declaration of Independence, to answer that question. It says there
that we hold these truths to be self-evident. Today we would call
that obvious. That all men are created equal; that they are endowed
by their creator with certain unalienable right, and that among these
rights are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness; that to secure
these rights, governments are instituted among men deriving their just
powers from the consent of the governed.
So I think that answers the question, what the purpose of
government is. It's to secure our rights. That's why laws are made.
That's why we have the court system. That's why we have due
process.
I then think about the Constitution for the United States of
America. What is the purpose of that document? In my opinion,
the purpose of the Constitution is not to give any rights to the people.
It's not to provide goods or services to the people, but the purpose of
the Constitution is to restrain the government.
And I look at the Supremacy Clause in Article VI which says
this constitution and the laws of the United States which shall be
made in pursuance thereof and all treaties made -- or which issued be
made under the authority of the United States shall be the supreme
law of the land. Now, a lot of people refer to that section as the
Supremacy Clause, but I'd like to introduce a new clause. I call it
the pursuance clause. I find these three words to be the most
powerful of all of the words in the Constitution, "in pursuance
thereof."
So what is the law of the land? It's not necessarily any law that
goes through Washington, D.C., or any law that goes through
Tallahassee or at the county level. It's only the laws that are made in
February 13, 2024
Page 41
pursuance of the Constitution and our documents.
I'd also like to bring attention to the Bill of Rights and our state
constitutions, particularly the ninth amendment of the Bill of Rights,
and I bring that up because it is very similar to the very first line in
the Florida Constitution. So let me read both of these for
comparison's sake.
So the ninth amendment says, the enumeration in the
constitution of certain rights shall not be construed to deny or
disparage others retained by the people. Article I, Section 1 of the
Florida Constitution says, all political power is inherent in the people.
The enunciation herein of certain rights shall not be construed to
deny or impair others retained by the people.
So the right to clean water might not be specifically written into
the Constitution or written into our Florida Constitution, but in my
opinion, the ninth amendment, as well as Article I, Section 1 of the
Florida Constitution does protect that right.
Thank you.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Thank you, Mr. Cook.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Alan Carpenter.
MR. CARPENTER: Chairman Hall -- am I on?
MR. MILLER: Yeah. I need to adjust it. Go ahead, sir.
MR. CARPENTER: Thank you. Chairman Hall, other
commissioners, I'm Alan Carpenter, 205 Estella Court of Riviera
Golf Estates and secretary of our HOA Board.
This past week I, along with other board members and owners in
Riviera, attended the Development Services Advisory Committee
where the Planning and Zoning director discussed the directive from
the County Attorney's Office to draft proposed changes to golf course
conversion code to make it Bert Harris proof to avoid future Bert
Harris claims.
Much to our dismay, the proposed changes to the code in the
February 13, 2024
Page 42
draft go well beyond the original direction from the BCC to provide
the Board flexibility in modifying greenway dimensional standards
on a case-by-case basis and improve the ITC process for the
stakeholder/landowner engagement process, which was seen to be
ineffective.
A couple examples of draft proposed changes to the law
regulating rezoning of golf course districts, which we see as
ineffective in addressing the current worry about Bert Harris Claims:
One, allowing greenways to be separate parcels which are not
contiguous to existing residences. This could result in as little as
15-foot buffers between new and existing properties creating a cause
of action on the part of abutters for lost property values in the order
of tens of millions of dollars, specifically; number two, encouraging
redevelopment of golf courses for cluster housing and affordable
housing plans. Surely there are better locations for affordable
housing than within existing golf course communities and
particularly in East Naples where there's already an abundance of
affordable housing where 78 percent of Lely school students come
from families which qualify for lunch food assistance.
These kind of code amendments being considered only benefit
golf course developers and do not mitigate the risk of Bert Harris
claims. They only reward and encourage more Bert Harris claims
against the county.
The Bert Harris claim against the county on the 2017 ITC code
amendments impact on the rezoning of the Riviera Golf Course
specifically is time barred, is not ripe, and is not a vested right. In
fact, Attorney Klatzkow has opined previously that he is not worried
about this action, not one little bit.
So this action and this potential ceding of control by redrafting
the code to give benefits to golf course owners appears to be a cover
for reducing standards for development. This is not an issue which
February 13, 2024
Page 43
is specific to golf course zones. It's conceding controls and could
affect development standards across all property zones and
development applications.
Recall that, as you know, under the constraints of Senate Bill
250, which is effective for two more -- two-plus years, you
commissioners are locked into applying the least restrictive
development standards of the LDC. Consequently, now is not the
time for loosening development standards unless there's an
immediate requirement to do so.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Wrap it up.
MR. CARPENTER: We ask staff and you commissioners to
please consider where conceding invalid Bert Harris claims will lead
us.
Thank you for your attention.
CHAIRMAN HALL: thank you.
MR. MILLER: That was your final registered speaker for
public comment.
Item #10A
DISCUSS WHETHER TO CONTINUE USING FLUORIDE IN
THE PUBLIC POTABLE WATER SUPPLY DISTRIBUTED BY
THE COUNTY’S PUBLIC UTILITIES DIVISION’S WATER
DEPARTMENT. (ALL DISTRICTS) - MOTION TO REMOVE THE
FLUORIDE AND DIRECT STAFF TO WORK WITH LOCAL
DENTAL AND HEALTH PROVIDERS FOR A PROPOSED
FORUM FOR THE COMMUNITY FOR EDUCATIONAL
PURPOSES BY COMMISSIONER KOWAL; SECONDED BY
COMMISSIONER LOCASTRO – APPROVED
MS. PATTERSON: Commissioners, that brings us to
February 13, 2024
Page 44
item 10A, our 10 o'clock time-certain.
This is that the board discuss whether to continue using fluoride
in the public potable water supply distributed by the Collier County
Public Utilities division's water department. This item is brought to
the agenda by Commissioner Kowal.
CHAIRMAN HALL: So this is going to be a big issue this
morning, so I want to remind everybody when you come to speak
you have three minutes. At the two-minute-and-30-second mark,
you'll see a yellow light, and at the three-minute mark a red light, and
I expect you to be wrapped up by then. We have a lot of speakers,
and we have a lot of content to cover.
Secondly, this is going to be a passionate conversation. This is
not a contest in here. I don't want to hear the handclaps. I don't
want to hear it if you're for it. I don't want to hear them if you're
against it. I need you to refrain from that. We want to focus -- this
is not emotional for us. We want to hear everything that's being said
so that we can weigh in on it professionally.
So with that, I ask you to be considerate and to be respectful of
every speaker whether you're for or whether you're against. And if
there's any outbursts, I'm going to say I'll give you maybe a half a
warning because I'm giving you the other half right now.
So with that, Commissioner Kowal.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Thank you, Chairman.
Well, I'd like to take this time and just kind of lay out a blueprint
on how we got here today.
So initially I -- you know, this board unanimously, you know,
was moving forward into this new year talking about reducing
budgets and minimizing our financial burden on the citizens, and we
were approached with our utilities, and we had a presentation of how
all our chemicals and treatment of water, how
chemicals -- everything we use to make potable water safe for
February 13, 2024
Page 45
drinking has increased or almost doubled in price over the past two
years. So that burden was going to fall back on our citizens, you
know, and through fees and raising of fees.
So I started a little dive into, you know, some areas where
maybe we can cut some costs not even imagining -- you know, I
knew fluoride was in the water for many, many years. I grew up
probably in an area that had fluoride in the water and just assuming
that, you know, that was something that was mandated. And then
when I started to dive into our particular water system here in the
state of Florida and what we do, I found out quickly that it is not a
mandate, it is not a state statute, and it's not even a federal mandate.
It's purely just a recommendation from other organizations, private
organizations, worldwide organizations, to place fluoride in our
drinking water.
That being said, I looked at the numbers, and it looks to be
about -- the cost of the fluoride itself, we pay about $130,000 a year
just for the product and probably man-hours, equipment,
maintenance, it probably runs about $200,000 a year just to
implement it on a regular basis periodically.
So that being said, I started looking at, you know, is it a little bit
of saving? Yes, we can look at it that way. And while in the
process of this, I had some concerned citizens actually reach out to
me and they were, like, very passionate about what's going on in new
studies around the world, things that are going on, and they're taking
a deeper dive in the fluoridation of water and administering it to their
citizens and maybe some effects that maybe weren't looked at when
you digest it or take it, you know, and drink the actual fluoride, not so
much as a topical treatment.
So that made me look in another aspect, so I started doing a little
bit of my own research and found that, basically, worldwide -- I
mean, we got to a point where 98 percent of the western European
February 13, 2024
Page 46
countries actually reject the fluoride now. And this list is pretty
impressive. It's Australia, Belgium, Denmark, Finland, France,
Germany, Italy, Luxembourg, New -- Netherlands, Norway, Sweden,
and Switzerland. About 95 percent of that country does not fluoride
their water because -- and then I took a deeper dive, and I was
wondering what the reasoning for that was, and the majority of the
answers was that they feel they're not tasked to deliver medical
treatment to their people through drinking water. If the people need
this type of additional fluoride, they can decide by their own to use
the most appropriate way to administer that fluoride.
And that started making me think that citizens -- everything I've
been reading so far, this is basically a health treatment. It's a
treatment for people's health, dental health, through medicating the
water and distributing it amongst the citizens.
And then that set a little lightbulb off in my head, and I just
realized that, you know, back in April 11th -- or back in last year, we
had a lot of heated discussion, and we got to a conclusion that we
adopted a resolution and an ordinance for the Collier County Health
Freedom Bill of Rights ordinance.
And then with that in mind, I started to realize that us as a
county, as we sit here today before you, in reading the resolution
itself and then reading the ordinance, on Line 3 of the resolution, it
basically states that we're administering medication to our citizens
without consent, and on Line 10 of the ordinance, we're basically
administering a medication -- a medical treatment to our citizens
purely based -- not based by federal law or state statute, but purely
just based on a recommendation by other health organizations. So in
reality, as we sit here today, we as a Board and as Collier County, we
are in violation of our very own law.
So I'm not going to sit here today in judgment. I'm not asking
my fellow commissioners to sit here in judgment, because I don't
February 13, 2024
Page 47
think I'm positioned to make a medical or a scientifical opinion of the
pros and cons. Because we're going to hear a lot of people today,
and a lot of people are going to have some very interesting points pro
and con to fluoride being in the water.
I simply have to make a judgment here today is that are we
medically treating our citizens of Collier County by placing the
fluoride in the water, which I've seen -- in every study I've seen it
refers to it as a medication for dental health -- are we in violation?
And I feel -- my opinion, not based on the actual health or the
science that we're going to hear today, but just in a legal aspect and
by being a member of this board, I feel this commission is in
violation, and then I ask -- I'm going to make a motion today that we
stop this program. So that's where I am today.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Thanks, Commissioner.
Troy?
MR. MILLER: All right. It's been a little tough counting
these up, but I believe we're about 48 registered speakers. I want to
remind the speakers to use both podiums.
We're going begin with Danielle Meo, and she'll be followed by
BT Esquibel. Danielle's been ceded additional time from Thomas
Meo. Please raise your hand when you're ceding time when I call
your name.
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: Thomas Meo. Thank you.
Kathy Meo?
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: Thank you.
And Vicki Wojciechowski. I hope I got that right.
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: She'll have a total of 12 minutes.
MS. PATTERSON: Chair, before we get started, also is just a
February 13, 2024
Page 48
reminder we do have a court reporter break scheduled for 10:30
plus/minus.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Okay.
MS. MEO: Thank you, Commissioner Kowal.
Good morning. My name is Danielle Meo. I have lived in
Collier County since July of 2023. I reside in Precinct 310 and am a
member of the CCREC. I have a Bachelor's Degree in health
science and have worked in the medical industry as a medical
assistant and pharmacy technician since 2017.
I have seen firsthand how the medical industry has become so
overwhelmed by sick patients yearning for answering. I have also
seen how every sect of the medical industry has been overrun by
pharmaceuticals.
I have done my due diligence of researching fluoride extensively
for weeks at a time. I have come to Commissioner Kowal to express
my concerns on the adding of fluoride in Collier County's water
supply system.
Our health is foundational, and my topic is about saving the
integrity of the human body, mind, and spirit. That is sacred and has
been created in God's image.
As I'm sure you're aware, that is now being manipulating,
degraded, and defiled through the many ways in our current world
now. One of those ways is through water fluoridation. Fluoridation
in public water systems has been an experimental procedure for over
60 years. Fluoride is just a clever way for industries to eliminate
their toxic industrial waste without having to pay for it as such.
Fluorosilicic acid is a byproduct of the action of sulfuric acid on
phosphate rock containing fluorides and silica or silicates.
Hydrofluorosilicic acid is a chemical often known by other names
like fluorosilicic acid. Hydrofluorosilicic acids prepared from
hydrofluoric acid include sodium fluoride, which is in your common
February 13, 2024
Page 49
toothpaste boxes.
Just a sidenote and fun fact, hydrofluoric acid does not occur in
nature. It is a manmade molecule, and it eats through concrete,
glass, stainless steel, Fiberglass, and plastic. So why are we putting
that in the water?
So what is fluoride? Fluoride is a naturally occurring mineral
found in air, soil, and water. What is labeled as fluoride, particularly
in the water system, is fluorosilicic acid, and it is not naturally
occurring fluoride but is actually a collection of hundreds of different
chemicals. These chemicals include neurologically damaging
elements, heavy metals, and cancer-causing radioactive chemicals.
It has a high biological activity which is very general in nature. It
inhibits many enzymes and interacts with calcium ions. And in the
presence of trace -- in the presence of trace amounts of aluminum, it
interferes with hormonal messaging systems. Since enzymes and
hormones are essential to all physiological processes, such activities
are likely to produce a wide variety of effects.
The first opponents of fluoridation in this country were
biochemists in the 1930s. These biochemists used fluoride in their
experiments to poison enzymes. Dr. James Sumner, a Nobel Prize
winner for enzyme chemistry, said in 1965, quote, everyone knows
fluorine and fluorides are very poisonous substances, and we use
them in enzyme chemistry to poison enzymes, those vital agents in
the body, end quote.
Fluoride inactivates 62 enzymes, increases the aging process,
increasing the incidents of cancer and tumor growth, disrupts the
immune systems, causes genetic damage, interrupts DNA repair
enzyme activity, and increases arthritis in the form of skeletal
fluorosis. It also harms -- has a harmful effect on the brain and IQ,
endocrine system, kidneys, thyroid, pineal gland, bones, and other
tissues including teeth, along with increasing uptake of lead in
February 13, 2024
Page 50
children.
Mark Twain had said, quote, it's easier to -- it's easier to fool
people than to convince them that they have been fooled, unquote.
In America today we have all of the symptoms of
hypothyroidism, obesity, heart disease, and neurological impairment.
And like most of our reality, fluoride is but one topic with a
grotesque and distorted history. The distortion of data that occurred
in the early '40s and '50s created a corrupt foundation that shaped the
attitudes in the public and scientific community about fluoride being
generally benign and safe. This has created a long shadow over the
past 70 to 80 years.
In the 1980s, dental researchers changed their position on
fluoride's mechanism action that was introduced in the '40s and
believed that the early absorption of fluoride made the enamel of
teeth more resistant to acid.
In 1999, the CDC conceded fluoride's predominant mechanism
action was topical, not systemic.
When fluoridation trials began 1945, no health studies were
undertaken. And since the endorsement of fluoridation in 1950 from
the U.S. Public Health Service, no trials have been completed, no
comprehensive health studies published, and there have been no
rigorous scientific studies on established safety or effectiveness.
Since 1950, the program has not been monitored nor have basic
health studies been performed. Fluoridating countries made no
effort in replicating studies to show associations of fluoride exposure
and increased bone fractures, arthritis-like symptoms, lowered IQ in
children, lowered thyroid function, accumulation of fluoride in the
human pineal gland, and early onset of puberty in animals.
Fluoridating countries have made no attempt to use dental
fluorosis as a biomarker to investigate health concerns in children
exposed to fluoride. The scarcity of literature on the effects of
February 13, 2024
Page 51
fluoride reflects a lack of interest by governments that promote
fluoridation.
Over the past 60 years, efficacy of ingested fluoride and
preventing dental caries has never been tested in randomized
controlled trials. Had the FDA been involved at any stage of the
tracking reports of fluoride possible side effects, it would have been
able to tabulate the many accounts of individuals complaining of
fairly common symptoms including, but not limited to, tiredness not
relieved by sleep, headaches, rashes, and gastrointestinal problems
that were easily reversed when the source of fluoride was removed.
No health agency in the U.S. or any fluoridated country pursue this.
A multitude of studies are shown to back that fluoride does not
prevent or decrease dental caries. In fact, the rates of tooth decay of
12-year-olds have been coming down as fast in non-fluoridated
countries as in fluoridated ones according to the World Health
Organization data available online.
There are 12 studies in my original document that point to the
conclusion that there's no statistically significant difference in
DMFTs, which stands for decayed, missing, or filled-in permanent
teeth, in children in fluoridated countries compared to
non-fluoridated countries.
Even if fluoride in the form of fluorosilicic acid was shown to
decrease dental caries systemically, which no study has ever proved,
does in really outweigh all of the damaging effects fluoride has on the
many systems of the human body?
They found an association between fluorosilicic acid and an
increased uptake of lead in children's blood. This lead present in the
stomach will be directly led to the child's blood stream, affecting the
brain, and lead is known to have a negative effect on children's brain
development.
The CDC agrees with the NRC, the National Research Council,
February 13, 2024
Page 52
that it is apparent that fluoride has the ability to interfere with the
functions of the brain and the body by direct and indirect means, and
they have stated this on camera.
There is only one division that the CDC is involved with
fluoridation, and that is the oral health division, or the OHD. This
division is largely staffed by personnel with dental rather than
medical qualifications. There is little evidence to suggest that the
OHD personnel have the appropriate educational background to
properly evaluate toxicological studies or to conduct health risk
assessments. The OHD supports mandatory fluoridation on a
statewide basis.
There's also no evidence that the CDC is involved in any
research program to investigate the toxicology of fluoridating
chemicals used.
Doctor H. Trendley Dean, who was the father of fluoridation
himself, went to areas in Texas where there were naturally occurring
fluoride in the water. In 1943, scientists of Public Health Service
went down to Bartolo, Texas, to look at people suffering the effects
from fluoride. They found bone disease including calcification of
the ligaments, effects of the joints causing arthritis symptoms, and in
addition they were seeing effects of the eyes in the form of cataracts.
They found elevated rates of cataracts in high-fluoridated
communities in Texas, so they did other studies in South Dakota and
Iowa, which also had high levels of fluoride in their water. They
found bone changes, bone diseases, and they found cataracts as well.
Did they publish the study? Did they tell the public or scientific
community? No. The Public Health Service never published the
study and never reported their findings to anyone in the public or the
broader scientific community.
At the Newburgh trial, Dean disclosed these findings, and in
1944 no one knew that the father of fluoridation himself was
February 13, 2024
Page 53
privately expressing concern that the policy of adding fluoride to
Newburgh, New York, could be toxic and cause harm.
When you censor health information, you are putting people's
lives at risk. It's really that simple.
So why don't these -- why don't these letter agencies and the
medical community recommend magnesium to reduce heart attacks
or zinc to better the immune system? They only believe in one
element, and that's fluoride. So why is that? We have to ask
ourselves that question.
Will we give up our right to health sovereignty or fight for it?
Will we accept the status quo or challenge it? Will we continue to
allow the water we drink and bathe ourselves in and our children be a
risk to our health?
Additionally, for the opponents that come up after me for water
fluoridation, keep in mind this question: Do they genuinely believe
fluoride decreased dental caries, or are they being coerced into saying
so?
My ask is that you, the commissioners, vote on removing
fluoride of any source out of Collier County water system.
Thank you for your time.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is BT --
CHAIRMAN HALL: Mr. Miller?
MR. MILLER: Yes, sir.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Just a quick question. Very
well done, by the way.
My question is you mentioned the studies in Texas where there's
naturally occurring fluoride in the water, and you mentioned high
levels. Was there any indication in those studies as to how much
fluoride was in the water in those communities?
MS. MEO: I don't have that --
February 13, 2024
Page 54
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: What is the high level, I
guess, is --
DR. YIACHOS: Eight parts per mill.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I'm sorry. I couldn't --
DR. YIACHOS: That study was eight parts per million.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Eight parts per million. Okay. Thank
you.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is BT Esquibel. He will be
followed by -- and I hope I'm saying that right -- Josephine Perez.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Mr. Miller, we'll hear BT, and then we'll
take a break.
MR. MILLER: Yes, sir.
MR. ESQUIBEL: I'm here today to support the removal of
fluoride from our water system but also here to expose current system
of home rule and how it is used here in our community. Please
prove me wrong.
The changes that have occurred from 1901 till now have altered
the natural path of the constitutional system which you-all took an
oath to. And unincorporated means nonpolitical attached to the
state. Home rule provides the local community to self-govern. So
if the county is unincorporated, your right to a guaranteed republic
form of government should be protected under the entire
Constitution, not to be picked apart by foreign agents of the county,
which all of you are when you operate under commercial use such as
attorneys; the commissioners; the county clerk, who doesn't support
our Article III court; an unlawful tax collector; the unconstitutional
sheriff when operating under the United States District of Columbia
Act of 1871, which is commercial.
When you choose to continue to operate fully commercial as a
county and pick when you want to be a constitutional county, you're
destroying the trust of the men and women of this community which
February 13, 2024
Page 55
simply means we the men and women must have unalienable rights
given to us by God and protected and guaranteed by the Constitution.
Since all of our county commissioners have sold us out to
Agenda 21 and Agenda 30 since 1992, whenever there is exclusive
power under home rule, all private rights are displaced. Let me say
this again: All private rights are displaced.
When we have seen the dominance and corruption of the
administrative state here locally in Collier County within its
corporation structure, the commercial agencies are based upon two
things: Constitutional parameters and territorial provisions in the
Constitution.
At some point, the corporation is going to come into conflict
with the men and women's constitutional rights and will be dragged
into a commercial administrative proceeding where they have no
private rights to protect or to assert. That's how administrative law
works. It's like playing Whose Line is it Anyway? Where is the
legal system's application when it's made up and the Constitution
doesn't matter?
The local conservative mindset on government policy appears to
adhere to a confederate ideology of protecting state's rights more than
the federalist's principles of submission to the central government's
authority or the District of Columbia.
As of June 30th, 1864, Congress slipped [sic] away the state and
refers it back to a commercial area. Everything in the state means
the District of Columbia or the territories of the Columbia.
What we have here is corruption within our local community. I
give you gratitude for what you said earlier, Dan Kowal, in reference
to being in opposite of what our Bill of Rights and also the health
situation is here within the ordinance.
Thank you for your time.
CHAIRMAN HALL: All right. It's 10:30. We will take a
February 13, 2024
Page 56
court reporter break, and let's return at 10:45.
(A brief recess was had from 10:30 a.m. to 10:45 a.m.)
MS. PATTERSON: Chair, you have a live mic.
MR. MILLER: Are you ready to resume with public speakers,
Mr. Chair?
CHAIRMAN HALL: I just want to remind everybody that we
definitely are interested in everything that you have to say, but at the
same time, if someone has said it, you know, the third or fourth time
that we hear it's not going to be very helpful because we're all
just -- when we all got up this morning, we all put our pants on just
like you did. So the third or fourth time we hear it is not so helpful,
so you can pass your time, or you have the right to speak. Just -- I'm
just asking that you use some common sense in that. So with that,
let's begin.
MR. MILLER: Your next public speaker is Josephine Perez.
She'll be followed by Richard Schroeder.
DR. PEREZ: Good morning. My name is Dr. Josephine
Perez, and I would like to share my story with you.
I graduated from one of the top dental schools in the nation over
30 years ago. I'm an excellent dentist and one that is particularly
focused on health.
My mission is to put an end to dental disease, including cavities.
I love the idea of fluoride in our water. It makes simple -- it makes it
simple to strengthen teeth and prevent cavities. I have studied this
for years through research and up close and personal with the patients
I care for. The idea is great, but I have been devastated to find it
doesn't work.
Studies show the rate of cavities are increasing despite the
increasing education about cavity prevention and the increase in
fluoride in our water supplies, packaged foods, dental products,
antibiotics, and other pharmaceuticals.
February 13, 2024
Page 57
I have been even more shocked to learn about the unexpected
and worrisome side effects that fluoride is creating. I have over 100
research studies here, and I made copies for one of -- each of the
Board members, and these are only just the recent ones. I didn't go
back.
A hundred research studies here, there are hundreds more,
showing undisputed evidence that this increase in fluoride has led to
increase in hip fractures, increase in thyroid deficiencies, and a
decrease in IQ levels in children.
These aren't just stories that patients have shared. These are
reputed medical journals and PubMed research. Anyone can access
them.
We're all on the same side. We all want there to be less cavities
and improved dental health. Unfortunately, research and experience
is showing fluoride isn't the answer we all hoped for. Thankfully
there is emerging evidence and research supporting new products like
hydroxyapatite, the mineral that the teeth are actually made of, that
are as or more effective than fluoride at preventing tooth decay
without sacrificing health.
Like I said, we are all on the same side. I am just here showing
you the latest information and that there are products that will
keep -- help us achieve this goal without causing other problems.
Thank you for your help.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Richard Schroeder. He'll
be followed by Ashley Jenkins. I'm sorry. Mr. Schroeder's been
ceded three additional minutes from Christos -- I can't pronounce
your last name, Christos. Are you here?
MR. CHRISTODOULOU: Yes, Christodoulou.
MR. MILLER: Thank you, sir.
He'll have a total of six minutes.
DR. SCHROEDER: Thank you. Rich Schroeder, retired
February 13, 2024
Page 58
medical doctor.
I'm going to abridge my comments a little bit because of
material already presented. The material I'm presenting today comes
mostly from depositions and investigations leading up to the trial
currently underway against the United States Environmental
Protection Agency in the U.S. District Court for the Northern District
of California in San Francisco, which was detailed in an interview
documentary between the plaintiffs' attorney and the chief attorney
for Children's Health Defense called Fluoride on Trial.
Food and Water Watch, Fluoride Action Network, Moms
Against Fluoridation, and other advocacy groups and individuals are
suing the EPA under the Toxic Substances Control Act in an effort to
force the agency to prohibit water fluoridation in the United States
due to fluoride's toxic effects on children's developing brains.
According to Michael Connett, lead attorney for the plaintiffs,
fluoride should be banned from drinking water, and the U.S.
government must warn people, especially pregnant mothers, about
the serious health risks of drinking fluoridated water. Fluoridation
violates informed consent, he alleges.
The fact that this lawsuit is being brought under the Toxic
Substances Control Act which regulates the legal levels of human
exposure to toxic substances like lead begs the question for me,
where does this potentially toxic substance come from?
And although recently more of it has been imported from China,
most of the fluoride, as you've already heard, historically came from
air pollution control scrubbers used in Central Florida's phosphate
fertilizer industry. They had a really massive fluoride pollution
problem in about the '50s with crippled cattle, scorched vegetation,
lots of liability concerns.
And so they put the air pollution control scrubbers on the
smokestacks which trapped the fluoride and created the fluoride
February 13, 2024
Page 59
acidic liquid you've already heard about called hydrofluorosilicic
acid, and that's what's barreled up and shipped around the country
and meted into our water supply.
So how in the world did we get into this mess? And a little
history of fluoridation of the water might help with that.
It apparently began with an observational study of some sort in
the 1930s, which is said to have shown reduced cavities in a
community with naturally occurring fluoride. This led to a proposal
to add it to water.
And then you've already heard about the studies by the Public
Health Service leading up to the decision whether to fluoridate water
or not, which showed that the water in Bartlett, Texas, which had
eight times the proposed levels, showed all sorts of severe fluorosis
leading to weak bones, joint problems, and even cataracts, and then
they did it, as you've heard, in South Dakota and Iowa. Same
findings: Problems with these elevated levels of fluoride.
But, unfortunately, corporate interference leading to data
suppression on water fluoridation began very early. The Public
Health Service never reported these abnormal findings to the public
but instead started adding fluoride experimentally to the water in
Newburgh, New York.
The Manhattan project, or the atomic bomb program, which
used huge quantities of fluoride, as well as uranium, needing, of
course, waste product disposal outlets, greatly accelerated the
nefarious activities around fluoride. Big paid names pushed water
fluoridation. Experiments were performed on human populations
without their consent. You know, think prisoners and other folks
like that. Experiments were performed presumably to see how they
would hurt the enemy because they were developing a bomb.
It was found that people with kidney disease couldn't excrete
fluoride. Despite that, in an article for the Journal of the Dental
February 13, 2024
Page 60
Association, Harold Hodge, who had been in charge of these human
experiments for the Atomic Energy Commission, lied about his own
studies and said there was no change in the rate of excretion. The
insurance branch of the AEC suppressed clearance of all the studies
that could potentially be released in an attempt to limit the lawsuits.
More recently, the National Toxicology Program -- and the NTP
is a branch of the Health and Human Services -- and the NIH
concluded a 1,573-page systematic review showing a link between
fluoride and lowered IQ.
Dental officials at the Centers for Disease Control and the NIH's
National Institute of Dental and Cranial Fascial Research put pressure
on the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services' assistant
secretary of health, Dr. Rachel Levine, to prevent the review from
being published.
Levine told the National Toxicology Program not to publish the
report but to put it on hold. It turns out that 18 of the 19 high-quality
studies in the NTP report found an association between higher
fluoride levels and lowered IQ in children exposed to fluoride.
The level of IQ loss rivaled those of previously -- previous
similar studies done for lead exposure. Susceptible members of the
population like pregnant woman and bottle-fed babies will be
particularly vulnerable to fluoride's neurotoxic outlets.
And also think of this: The study also said that since children
are exposed to fluoride from multiple sources, there is no obvious
threshold at which fluoridating water would be safe because the water
is only one source which these kids get their fluoride.
And we've already heard from Commissioner Kowal about how
Europe looked into the idea of adding fluoride. And I'm not going to
repeat -- not going to repeat that except that I absolutely agree.
Fluoride is a chemical that's added for medical purposes, and it's a
total violation of the principle of informed consent, and we have a
February 13, 2024
Page 61
Health Freedom Bill of Rights which in Section 11 enshrines in its
entirety the Florida Patient's Bill of Rights and Responsibilities.
Let's just use it to get fluoride out of our water.
Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Ashley Jenkins. She will
be followed by Beth Sherman.
MS. JENKINS: Good morning, gentlemen. For the record,
my name is Ashley Jenkins, a living woman that resides in Naples
34102.
I'm verbally noticing William McDaniel, Rick LoCastro, Chris
Hall, Bert Saunders, and Dan Kowal with the city [sic] manager,
Amy Patterson, and the County Attorney, Jeff A. Klatzkow.
Each of you that are physical present today received a copy of
the case and affidavit which was received by registered mail to your
offices on Friday at 10:28 a.m. You additionally received a copy of
my affidavit in the Florida Weekly which ran on February the 8th.
My request of the commissioners is simple: Remove all added
fluoride from the water supply in this county. Fluoride is causing
harm to my personal health. This affects my iodine, chloride, and
collagen levels necessary for optimal health.
There are high levels of kidney and liver concerns in this county
by numerous people I personally know. Forced medicating an
element in public water that is toxic to human consumption needs to
end. This element is unnecessary in any human biochemical
function.
I have personally taken four years of college academic
biochemistry and can confirm that this is a disadvantage to human
health. It is a halogen which leaches other essential halogens such as
chloride and iodine from the human body by occupying those
biochemical receptors. Dentists are in favor of this being added to
the water and noxious toothpaste. It is simply good for business for
February 13, 2024
Page 62
them. Use a substance which creates a problem; a customer for life
is created.
The CDC had positive stances on fluoride as a federal agency
which imposes its bought-and-paid-for opinion to influence human
health for gain and profit for "Big Harma." Research studies I
tagged in your affidavit are displaying damage to IQ, kidneys, livers
from exposure to fluoride in public water. The fluoride utilized in
public water is a byproduct, a fertilizer from mosaic as well as
aluminum waste from Alcoa.
In the 1940s, companies were getting in trouble for disposing of
waste. This waste led to the death of livestock from being in
landfills and rivers. The substance requires hazmat gear to add to
public water. Companies like these funded the Mellon Institute of
Industrial Research which had tasks such as providing asbestos was
safe and did not lead to cancer.
In 1939, this organization was tasked in producing studies that
showed exposure of fluoride waste was safe for human consumption.
All labels on medicated fluoride state, specifically, "Warning, keep
out of the reach of children under six years of age. If you accidently
swallow more than for brushing, seek professional help or contact a
poison control center immediately."
So I've requested that anyone responsible for voting to retain
fluoride in the public water provide the charter of Collier County,
your oath of office, as well as your personal or blanket hazard bond.
The County Attorney and County Manager have been requested to
provide this as well if the Board decides to retain fluoride in public
water as an additive.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Beth Sherman. She'll be
followed by Dr. Lauren Governale. I hope I'm saying that correct.
Ms. Sherman's been ceded additional time from Marge Heinzel?
(Raises hand.)
February 13, 2024
Page 63
MR. MILLER: There she is.
And Brandon Youst?
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: She will have a total of nine minutes.
MS. SHERMAN: Good morning, Commissioners. Thank you
for hearing us today on the issue of removing fluoride from the water.
This effort is being presented, as you know, through the Collier
County Republican Executive Committee. I'm the co-chair of the ad
hoc subcommittee for Agenda 2030.
Today I would like to present a resolution that was passed
through the CCREC called the Right to Clean Water. This passed
through with 187 "yes" votes to one "no" vote. I e-mailed this to all
of you previously, so you should have a copy. I'll leave a printout
with the court reporter for the record, and I will include our research
summary that we sent you.
Let me read the resolution for the Right to Clean Water.
Whereas, Collier County Ordinance No. 2023-18 and Resolution
2023-69 protect the God-given rights of Collier County citizens; and,
Whereas, the World Health Organization recommends adding
fluoride to water, contradicting Collier County Ordinance 2023-18,
Section 10, and Collier County Resolution 2023-69, Section 3; and,
Whereas, Collier County routinely adds sodium silica fluoride to
its municipal water supply; and,
Whereas, numerous medical studies indicate fluoridation of
water supplies can reduce children's intelligence; and,
Whereas, fluoridation of water is banned in many countries,
including, China, Austria, Belgium, Finland, Germany, Denmark,
Norway, Sweden, the Netherlands, Hungary, and Japan; and,
Whereas, fluoridation of water infringes upon a citizen's right to
choose to opt out of potentially hazardous consumption; and,
Whereas, fluoride is readily available via over-the-counter and
February 13, 2024
Page 64
prescription form to any citizen wishing to use it; and,
Whereas, fluoride is the only additive put in the water that is not
for sanitation or sterilization; and,
Whereas, sodium -- having sodium silica fluoride stored in water
treatment plants could potentially be misused by terrorists to
contaminate water supplies to toxic levels.
Now, therefore, be it resolved that the members of the CCREC
recognize our right to clean water and request that the Collier County
Commissioners direct our Water Management department to
discontinue adding sodium silica fluoride or any other chemical
synonymous with it that is intended to add fluoride to our municipal
water supply.
That's the end of the resolution.
I would like to comment on the violations to the Health Freedom
Bill of Rights resolution ordinance mentioned above. The
Ordinance is 2023-18, and it states that you will not take directives
from the World Health Organization or other international bodies
unless compelled by federal or state law. I'd like to point out that the
W.H.O. is recommending that we use the fluoride, but it is not a state
or federal law, as Commissioner Kowal mentioned; therefore, we ask
you kindly remove the use of fluoride in our county water.
Resolution No. 2023-69 involves the use of informed consent
without interference. We believe that the use of fluoride is a clear
violation of the resolution. Anything added to our water for
anything other than sanitary purposes should not be allowed.
Adding a supplement for health reasons to our water forces citizens
to accept it without any way to opt out. It is not the job of public
works or this county to add medical supplements but to only provide
clean drinking water.
We also believe it violates informed consent due to the findings
coming out of the federal TSCA fluoride lawsuit against the United
February 13, 2024
Page 65
States EPA over the neurotoxicity of fluoride chemicals added to
public drinking water supply showing that it lowers IQ in children.
In the trial, deposition of USEPA rep Dr. Edward Ohanian and
CDC rep Casey Hannan, admitted that the only benefit that they can
prove to be safe is a topical use of fluoride. So why are we adding it
to the water?
Deposition of EPA neurotoxicologist, Dr. Stanley Barone, Jr.,
concluded that fluoride has the ability to interfere with the functions
of the brain.
Deposition of EPA Office of Water, Dr. Joyce Donahue,
concluded that there is a correlation between low-level fluoride in the
urine of pregnant women and ADHD symptoms in children. She
also agreed that we need to readdress current safety standards in the
United States pertaining to fluoride.
The primary concerns in this trial, which concludes this week,
are the effects on the development of the brain, the thyroid gland, and
its effects on the bones, including the ability to weaken bone, bone
fractures, and the ability to cause arthritis. The argument here is not
can fluoride affect any of those things. The argument is that if the
CDC and EPA agree that the only benefit of fluoride is from topical
application, then why would we ever consider drinking it, especially
since it has zero use in keeping our water clean and safe?
I sent all the commissioners and Dr. Yilmaz a children's health
defense documentary called "Fluoride on Trial." I trust that you-all
watch it, as it breaks down and exposes that the U.S. government and
its nonelected agencies, such as the EPA and CDC, whom have been
suppressing information proving that fluoride is unsafe. This is not
my opinion. This is based on FOIA documentation and depositions
from the current lawsuit with experimental trials that have been
hidden and suppressed since 1942.
Data suppression has been -- has a real effect on public
February 13, 2024
Page 66
understanding. It has a real effect on scientific understanding. This
court case and its findings have been suppressed by our own U.S.
Department of Defense through Admiral Rachel Levine. When you
censor health information, you are putting people's lives at risk. The
DOD feels it's acceptable to not give informed consent to the
American people. This county declared that it would.
I ask today that you stand on the Health Freedom Bill of Rights
ordinance and resolution that you signed into law in Collier County
on April 11th, 2023. Take a stand for our health freedoms and stop
the fluoridation in the municipal water supply today.
Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Dr. Lauren Governale.
She'll be followed by Jill Kelly. The doctor has been ceded
additional time from Nancy Hannigan.
Nancy, can you raise your hand if you're here.
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: Oh, I see. Thank you.
And Dr. Irina Toma.
(Raises hand.)
DR. GOVERNALE: Thank you for the opportunity to be here
today to speak on behalf of fluoride.
My name is Dr. Lauren Governale, and I'm a board certified
licensed pediatric dentist with a master's degree in public health as
well as a dental public health certificate.
I have been the clinical director for the University of Florida
College of Dentistry’s and CEF Pediatric Dental Center which is
located in Naples, Florida, since 2008, since they opened.
The Naples Children and Education Foundation, founders of the
Naples Winter Wine Festival, recognized the great need for dental
care for children in Collier County almost 20 years ago. They
conducted a needs assessment survey and determined that
February 13, 2024
Page 67
the -- dental was the greatest need for at-risk children at that time.
Since then, they have donated millions of dollars to help prevent
and treat the ravages of dental decay in the county by establishing the
NCEF Pediatric Dental Center and to continue -- they continue to
support our center since then. There's no doubt that this initiative
helps relieve the pain and suffering due to dental decay, which causes
abscessed teeth and is often rampantly found in Collier County for
underserved children.
We continue to see very high rates of decay in this population,
and we go to great lengths to treat these children. Many of our
anxious patients must receive dental treatment while under sedation
to restore their oral health due to extensive decay. When that's
needed, medically trained pediatric anesthesiologists come to our
clinic to render these patients unconscious so they can comfortably
receive their treatment, which often includes dental root canals and
multiple extractions.
I am the only pediatric dentist in Collier County who treats
patients weekly in a hospital-based operating room setting in Collier
County. There are today hundreds of children on a waiting list for
these services. Some will wait as long as six to 18 months to receive
their oral healthcare care. And in the interim, they are often in pain,
which affects their ability to attend school and learn, and to simply
eat meals and smile.
The center has performed many thousands of these sedations
over the past 15 years and, unfortunately, the fear is that if
community water fluoridation is discontinued, the numbers of these
patients requiring these sedations will only grow significantly longer.
In terms of the safety, community water fluoridation is one of
the 10 greatest public health achievements in the 20th century. It has
dramatically improved the public's oral health.
Fluoride is proven to protect teeth from the acids that cause
February 13, 2024
Page 68
decay. It works by inhibiting bacteria from producing the acids
necessary to cause tooth decay, and it transforms the enamel crystal
in teeth into a stronger crystal.
Fluoride works in two ways, by becoming incorporated into the
tooth during its formation, and it also works topically on the tooth
surface after formation to prevent tooth decay.
Since 1950, community water fluoridation has been endorsed by
the American Dental Association, and there is an overwhelming
weight of peer-reviewed scientific evidence. There are many
systematic reviews and meta-analysis that have been done on over 70
years of research that exists for fluoridation.
Naples has been fluoridating the public water system since 1985.
Chlorine is added to the water supply to benefit the public and to
prevent disease, just like fluoride prevents dental disease. Consent is
provided for both of these preventative initiatives by the Collier
County Commissioners. Fluoride is added to help a large population
in this county who cannot provide for fluoride themselves to improve
their oral health.
There are no federal agencies backing anti-fluoridation claims
that it causes any diseases. If there was a disease that fluoridated
water caused, we would have found it out by now. Community
water fluoridation has also been tested in the United States court
system.
In terms of its cost effectiveness, something other than an
expensive surgical approach alone is needed. In larger communities,
the cost for fluoridating a water system is less than $2 per person per
year. Every dollar invested in community water fluoridation saves
far more than that in treatment cost. The cost is about $32 per
person in treatment costs that can be saved with community water
fluoridation. It is the most economically preventative intervention in
the nation.
February 13, 2024
Page 69
In terms of equity, community water fluoridation is effective for
everyone, including the elderly, in preventing dental decay.
Improvements in the quality of life are seen with this evidence-based
prevention program like community water fluoridation. Every
family needs the benefits of community water fluoridation.
A major benefit of community water fluoridation is that no one
has to change their habits to receive it. The American Academy of
Pediatric Dentistry recommends that children receiving
non-fluoridated water receive fluoride supplements.
Families then must access a dental or medical professional to
obtain a prescription for the fluoride supplement.
Unfortunately -- unfortunately for low-income families, compliance
with this method is not possible at times due to many barriers such as
lack of access to care.
Community water fluoridation is responsible for dramatically
improving oral health and has an unrivaled and proven track record,
so why change it? There is no reason to discontinue this important
public health resource for the citizens of Collier County.
Coincidentally, February is National Children's Dental Health
Month, so this is a perfect time for us to be here talking about this
crucial role that fluoridation plays in the health of children and for the
people in our community of all ages. Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Jill Kiley. She'll be
followed by James Rosenberger.
MS. KILEY: Commissioner Hall, you'll be proud that I've cut
this down a little bit for you.
Good morning. My name is Jill Kiley, Marco Island. I'm an
associate director of local advocacy for Stand for Health Freedom.
One of the primary pillars of Stand for Health Freedom is that of
informed consent. Stand for Health Freedom has over 1300 Collier
County resident supporters.
February 13, 2024
Page 70
I'm here to voice my support to remove fluoride from our water,
and this decision is simple: Informed consent is codified in our
recent Collier County Health Freedom Bill of Rights Ordinance,
2023-18. Fluoride is a medical treatment, and the citizens of Collier
County are receiving this treatment without full disclosure of
risk-benefit information and without the ability to give their consent.
There is no way to opt out. It is against our God-given rights, the
Nuremberg code, and our own county ordinance.
For decades we've been told that fluoridation of water helps
prevent cavities, but science does not support that claim, and yet the
myth goes on. As a matter of fact, fluoride is a waste product of the
fertilizer in heavy-metal industry that is so toxic it is not allowed to
be dumped in our landfills and yet somehow it's routinely added to
our water.
Before 1970, these gases were released into the air, making
Central Florida have some of the most toxic air pollution in the
country. During the 1960s, the manufacturers used pollution
abatement scrubbers to convert these toxic vapors into fluorosilicic
acid, FSA, a dangerous but more containable waste.
OSHA cautions that FSA has highly dire health consequences
for any worker that comes into contact with it. Breathing the fumes
may cause severe lung damage or death, and if it comes in contact
with bare skin, it will lead to burning and excruciating pain.
I will not repeat any of the many negative effects on the human
body that have been caused by fluoridation of water that have already
been mentioned this morning, but make no mistake, this is not a quest
for healthy teeth. This is the penalty-free dumping of toxic waste.
I appreciate the opportunity to speak today, and I'm requesting a
full stop to the practice of contamination of our water supply with
fluoride. I do not consent to this medical treatment. If there are
citizens that would like to continue to ingest this toxic substance, be
February 13, 2024
Page 71
my guest. They are free to purchase fluoride supplementation at
their local grocer. Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is James Rosenberger.
He'll be followed by Carol DiPaolo.
MR. ROSENBERGER: Good morning, Commissioners. I'd
like to take this opportunity to recognize Commissioner Kowal for
bringing this critical event forward.
So I did shorten what I intended to say also, Commissioner Hall.
Defluoridification. Has anyone ever heard this term before?
Of course not, because I just made it up this morning.
I would hope that one day it would be in Webster's dictionary
and would read as follows: A process whereby fluoride was
removed from drinking water, thereby ensuring the health of
American citizens. The process was first started in Collier County
where the County Commissioners have continued to lead the country
instituting policies protecting their constituents. Their wisdom has
led other counties to follow suit with the hope of spreading
cutting-edge critical thinking to those who have been in the dark for
so long.
Thank you for your help, Commissioners. Defluorification;
let's make it happen.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Carol DiPaolo. She'll be
followed by Andrea Werder.
MS. DiPAOLO: First of all, I want to say it's always an honor
to bring my concerns before all of you commissioners, and I want to
thank you for the way that you do vote, because you have made
Collier County probably one of the best counties to live in.
If I happen to lose my track of thought, it's probably from me
drinking fluoride for the past 60 years, so please bear with me.
You know, my stepdaughter is a dentist, and for the last eight
years, you know, I would meet her at Temple University. And for
February 13, 2024
Page 72
the past eight years, we'd -- you know, I love her, she loves me, but
we would always lock horns on root canals and fluoridation. And so
today I still stand and I still take my same opinion of -- that fluoride
should not be in the water.
There are over 78 contaminates in our water. As a matter of
fact, I was going to bring my Brita and my reverse osmosis and my
water -- you know, my water that I have stacked in my garage, but we
do that why? Because we want clean water.
Now, we can't take the chlorine, the lead, and the microplastics
out of our water, and the pharmaceuticals, where people dump their,
you know, antibiotics into our water system, we can't help that;
however, there are things that we can do, and one of them is
removing fluoride.
So I'm not going to go into everything else that everyone has,
you know, explained here. I think you get the message on that.
So we do have control over that. Now, you know, I started to
research, and I was like, what good is fluoride? Does it do anything
good? Does it sterilize? Does it purify? Does it do something to
the pipes, you know, that bring our water, you know, to our taps that
we drink? I found absolutely zero as far as what benefits fluoride
has other than oral health, you know, and tooth decay.
And in my research, as I would fight with my stepdaughter, you
know, the countries that do not use fluoridation, their teeth sometimes
are even more healthy than our American children's teeth that have
access to fluoridation. And I think we're missing one point, and
probably it's diet. Could it be, perhaps, the processed food that our
kids are eating that perhaps causes teeth -- you know, teeth decay?
So, you know, these are some of the things that we have to, you
know, think about.
So I just want to thank you for everything that you do and how
you do vote, and I know that you will make a wise choice on this,
February 13, 2024
Page 73
too.
Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Andrew Werder. She'll
be followed by Sofia Christodoulou.
MS. WERDER: Hey, everybody. Mark Twain wisely opined,
it's easier to fool people -- or it's easier to fool people than to
convince them they've been fooled. So let's just think about that a
little bit.
Okay. No longer will the people of Naples be fooled into
believing that fluoride in our water supply is a good idea. Sodium
fluoride must be removed for three reasons, and as a ex -- or
soon-to-be ex-high school teacher, I want to break it down to you
really easily. Sodium fluoride is different than calcium fluoride.
And I keep hearing the word "fluoride" being flippantly referred to
over and over again. Calcium fluoride occurs naturally, and it's
often around caves, and you'll see water -- water -- you'll see
crystallization and know that it's present; however, sodium fluoride,
it's another deal. It's toxic. It's a toxic waste byproduct, okay. So
calcium fluoride you can say is good -- well, reasonably, okay -- and
then you have sodium fluoride which is bad.
Okay. So where do we get our sodium fluoride? Well,
according to the EPA, sodium fluoride has been named as a
hazardous substance. It is an unwanted factory byproduct of
aluminum fertilizers and iron manufacturers. It is hazard waste. It
is labeled with a skull and bones and cross and a warning that it
targets the heart, kidneys, bones, teeth, and gastrointestinal tract
along with the nervous system. So what in the world is this doing in
our water supply?
Okay. It's unethical. How is it unethical? Well, Stalin used it
in his Gulags. Hitler used it in his concentration camps. Why did
he do that? So that he could control the inmates a little bit better.
February 13, 2024
Page 74
Apparently, when you use sodium fluoride, okay, and when it's
dumped into the water supply, you're not -- you're not as easily
agitated, and you're not going to be able to think as quickly.
So moving onto my third point: It's illegal. It's illegal from
the Nuremberg code, the Constitution, and state and city laws.
Sodium fluoride must be removed from Naples because it's toxic,
unethical, and illegal.
Become an informed water warrior with us today. Liberate our
water, liberate our bodies, and liberate our minds. Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Sofia -- excuse
me -- Christodoulou, and she'll be followed by John Meo.
MS. CHRISTODOULOU: All right. Hello, Commissioners.
My name is Sofia Christodoulou. I'm 15 years old, as you can
clearly tell. I'm also the South Florida debate champion as of
currently.
I just wanted to bring this attention to you. I believe we've
heard a lot today considering the horrible issues and side effects of
fluoride in our bodies, but I really wanted to dive right into exactly
what and the more nitty -- nit-picky details into this. Specifically,
the amount of IQ that is dropped, and I specifically want to go into a
little bit on the lethal doses.
So starting off with my -- with the IQ. The -- it started off in
1945 when it was first introduced into our water systems. And in
1950, the IQ -- the average IQ of the United States at that point was
91.64. That was the average IQ then. Today, in 2024, it's estimated
to be 87.87. It's dropped a full four points since that time, and it's
mainly because of fluoride, because it is significantly dangerous to
us.
Now, I want to really go into specifically why and how it
is -- where it sits. You don't -- when fluoride comes into our body,
you don't flush it out. It sits into your body, and it absorbs into your
February 13, 2024
Page 75
bloodstreams. It absorbs into your -- specific, the pineal gland,
which is a gland that sits in the midline center of your brain.
Now, specifically, what it does is actually affects right here -- it
says here -- I apologize. Here. Quote, fluoride accumulates in the
pineal gland, which produces melatonin, a hormone that is
responsible for establishing sleep patterns. Some experts suggest
that fluoride's effect on the pineal gland reduces the amount of
melatonin produced, affecting a person's sleep; that by accumulating
in the pineal gland located in the midline of the brain, outside the
blood brain barrier, attached to the roof of the third ventricle by a
short stock, fluoride stops the production of melatonin completely,
end quote. So not only does this affect your IQ, but it affects your
sleep, and it affects the way that melatonin is produced within the
person's body. So why are we implementing this into our water?
Why is it in our water and it shouldn't be? Not only is it a
neurotoxin, but it increases, and it gives people issues, as we've seen
multiple times, that I will be not be repeating, as was mentioned by
Mr. Patol [sic].
Not only does it hurt everybody, it also inhibits several enzymes
in the body including enzymes involved in energy production and
neurotransmitter synthesis and antioxidant defense mechanisms.
This leads to cellular dysfunction, end quote. It leads to not only
cellular dysfunction but a lack of melatonin.
Why should this be forced on us when we can simply just take a
supplement if it's so needed? It shouldn't.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is John Meo. He'll be
followed by Scott Sherman.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Hang on one second, John.
Good job. And I remember -- and congratulations on your
debate championship. And I do remember three debates ago I had
the privilege of judging, and you've come a long way. Good job
February 13, 2024
Page 76
today.
(Applause.)
MR. MEO: Good morning, Commissioners. I'm John Meo.
I'm the chairman of the Republican county executive committee, and
I'd like to thank you all for hearing this issue, but in particular -- and
it was mentioned before -- I'd like to thank Commissioner Kowal for
bringing this to the forefront.
And I'm going to comply with Commissioner Hall's request that
I don't repeat what we've heard a thousand times over, so I'm going to
come to this at a different angle.
I really don't think it needs any discussion. Since we've passed
the health freedom ordinance in this county, I think you as
commissioners have no choice but to comply with the request of
these individuals that have requested fluoride to be removed from the
water. I think it's really incumbent upon you to simply apply what is
law right now in this county and vote in favor of that.
It's going to be short. I don't need to say what was said before
about consent. We all know that. The world is a changing world.
It appears that three-letter agencies want to override the Constitution
of the United States, and we're not going to let it happen here in
Collier County.
So I thank you for your time, and I'm looking forward to your
vote. Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Scott Sherman. He'll be
followed by Darwin Brandt.
MR. SHERMAN: Thank you. Good morning,
Commissioners. It's always a pleasure to speak to you guys.
I did also just adjust what I'm going to say to just a very short
one, and that is the pediatric dentist that is the only opposing view to
this, we need to ask the question: If fluoride in water worked to help
children not get cavities, why is she in business?
February 13, 2024
Page 77
Thank you very much.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Darwin Brandt. He'll be
followed by Dr. Alexis -- oh, boy -- Diaczynsky. Did I get close?
DR. DIACZYNSKY: Close enough.
MR. MILLER: My apologies.
MR. BRANDT: Hello. I'm Darwin Brandt. I drill water
wells here in Central America and in Texas.
When I was in Central America, the water quality depended on
if the horse was floating with its feet up or floating with its feet down
around the -- around the pump. I mean, I saw all the nasty stuff you
could imagine.
In Puerto Cortés, you put their city water in a bucket, and it gets
to be slimy within about two, three hours. Now, they use no
chlorine. They use no fluoride. The kids' teeth down there
probably are more healthy than anyplace else because of what they
eat, probably, but it's no chlorine -- or no chlorine and no fluoride.
I've lived in some places where they only got water once a month
from the city.
Now let me get to what minute amounts are in water. I had a
heart attack two-and-a-half years ago, and they stinted me, and my
stint crumbled up, and when it crumbled up, it took them three times
back into the hospital before they figured out that it was crumpled up,
and it was wadding up with more plaque. They went back up my
leg, and they could not open it up. So the next time I saw my heart
doctor, I was sitting in his office in a wheelchair with oxygen on
24/7. I was dying.
I asked him if he could jump a vein over this mess and get me
going. He said, no, you can't -- we can't go in unless there's three
blockages.
And I said, well, I guess I have to fix it myself. And he looks at
me like I was crazy.
February 13, 2024
Page 78
And I -- and he said, how you going to do that?
I said, I got a tea that dissolves kidney stones, gal stones, the
plaque off of your teeth, and the plaque out of your blood.
I drank this tea, one cup, one of your big coffee cups there a day,
half in the morning and half at night. And in five weeks, I threw the
oxygen during the day, and at six weeks I threw it at night and started
walking.
I just turned 70, and I feel great. I feel absolutely wonderful. I
got -- my oxygen level's 99 and 100 all the time.
But that was a minute amount. So whatever they're putting in
our water, especially fluoride -- and I don't drink -- I don't drink city
water, and I don't drink county water. I have a well in my front yard
that I treat. And I haven't had city water or county water in my
house for probably about 30, 35 years because I had to treat it
anyway.
But the only way we're going to get -- the only way that people
can get fluoride out of the water is with an RO system, a big RO
system, because you don't want to suck it into your body. When
you're showering, you're showering -- your pores open up, and you
suck in chlorine and you suck in fluoride. That's just minute
amounts.
And like I said, I drank one cup of that tea, and it dissolved
everything around my -- it dissolved the stuff around the -- the plaque
around my stint, so I'm back to normal. Pretty crazy.
Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Dr. Alexis -- say it for me,
please.
DR. DIACZYNSKY: Diaczynsky. Also known as Dr. D.
MR. MILLER: She will be followed by Mary Alger. The
doctor's been ceded additional time from Jay Kohlhagen.
MR. KOHLHAGEN: Here.
February 13, 2024
Page 79
MR. MILLER: And Chelsea Benza.
(Raises hand.)
DR. DIACZYNSKY: All right. Good morning. As you
heard, my name is Dr. Alexis Diaczynsky, also known as Dr. D. I
am the current president of the Collier County Dental Association. I
am here on behalf of the 120 members of our association in support
of community water fluoridation here in Collier County.
Community water fluoridation has been happening in our country
since 1945 and here in Collier County since 1985. It is effective,
and it is safe.
Community water fluoridation is effective. Water fluoridation
reduces cavities by 25 percent over a person's lifetime. Fluoride is a
mineral that reduces -- that strengthen tooth enamel and prevents
cavities. Here in Collier County, we have a high proportion of
low-income underserved children who greatly benefit from
community water fluoridation.
Many of these children and their families have limited access to
dental care. We are fortunate to have the Naples Children and
Education Foundation Pediatric Dental Center and the Healthcare
Network of Southwest Florida and dental care centers that treat as
many of these patients as they can with the resources that they have
available.
If community water fluoridation is discontinued, cavity rates
will rise, pain will increase, emergency room visits will rise, and the
waiting list to be seen and treated will continue to grow.
Community water fluoridation is safe. There are nearly 7,000
scientific systematic reviews that prove fluoride is safe. The studies
that state fluoride is toxic and unsafe come from foreign countries
where fluoride levels are at least three to six times the level they are
recommended at in the United States for optimally -- optimal cavity
reduction and approved oral health.
February 13, 2024
Page 80
The optimal level of fluoride is between 0.7 and 1.2 parts per
million. That's a lot lower than some of the studies we've heard
about earlier. Anything in excessive quantities can be deemed toxic,
even water.
You've already heard all of the toxic side effects of fluoride. I'll
save you from the redundancy. The worst thing that fluoride can do
in an excess amount is cause something called fluorosis. Fluorosis is
staining or white spots that occur in the teeth. Most of them are
barely visible to the naked eye. Much more appealing than walking
around with black holes in one's teeth.
Big topic here: Fluoridation does not lower IQ. We have yet
to hear about the Harvard study. This is a reference to a 2011 review
of 27 Chinese studies that were brought to light from obscure,
difficult-to-translate Chinese journals by two faculty members of the
Harvard School of Public Health. They did not conduct the research
or publish the studies. The levels of fluoride in these studies were as
high as 11.5 parts per million. I remind you, the optimal amount of
fluoride is 0.7 parts per million.
The Harvard faculty later admitted these studies had key
information missing, had inadequate control for confounded
variables, and questionable methodologies.
Lastly, fluoride is not a medicine or a drug. Fluoride is a
mineral. The argument that fluoride is a drug has never been
approved or won in a court of law. I understand there is some
distrust of the government after what we have experienced with the
recent pandemic, but the truth is that fluoride is effective. Fluoride
is safe. Fluoride has been around for a long time and is tested and is
studied and is scientifically proven to be both effective and safe.
Fluoride is not toxic, and fluoride does not lower our IQs.
Fluoride is a naturally occurring element. Community water
fluoridation is adjusting the level of fluoride that is already in the
February 13, 2024
Page 81
water to a source -- to a level that is optimal for dental health. And
you can find whatever you would like to believe on Google.
Community water fluoridation is instrumental to maintaining
optimal oral health and overall well-being for the citizens of Collier
County. As you noticed, I brought my water bottle with me because
I'm quite parched. It's from my refrigerator. It's filtered. It filters
sediment and odor, like many other water filtration systems that we
use, aside from the previously mentioned reverse osmosis system.
Also, I just had a checkup. I have no sign of kidney disease or
sleep disruption, aside from staying up late and sleeping about this.
And I am born and raised in Naples, Florida. I have been drinking
our water for a very long time.
I thank you for -- question?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Yeah. I want to ask you a
quick question. I would ask the Chairman for permission to ask you
a question.
DR. DIACZYNSKY: But he disappeared.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: But I am serving as
chairman at the moment, so --
DR. DIACZYNSKY: Vice Chair.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: -- I have the liberty.
How does fluoride in the water actually work on your
teeth -- because, obviously, you drink the water -- that short contact,
or is it something that gets into your bloodstream? How does it
work?
DR. DIACZYNSKY: Can I have one of my supporters speak
on behalf of that? Because he's going to have a demonstration to
explain.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: The young lady that spoke
that was the pediatric -- maybe you could come up and answer that
question. I'm just curious as to how -- yes. You've got to come to
February 13, 2024
Page 82
the podium. You got to do it quickly before the Chairman comes
back.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: He's back.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: That's all right. I'm still
chairman until he sits down. Mr. Chairman, I've asked a question.
DR. GOVERNALE: It works in two ways.
CHAIRMAN HALL: I heard you.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I'm sorry. Would you start
over.
DR. GOVERNALE: Yes. Fluoride works in two ways. It
basically doesn't allow the bacteria to create the acids that break the
teeth down, and it also has a topical effect; so it can get into the tooth
surface that way as well, which is helpful for the elderly in
preventing all kinds of decay they have on their teeth, root caries, et
cetera, cavities along the roots of their teeth, and it's really
wonderfully beneficial for everybody. Basically, fluoride changes
the enamel crystal that's in your tooth to a more efficient crystal. So
it definitely protects the tooth from tooth decay.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: The quick content -- or quick
contact as you drink it, that's all it's --
DR. GOVERNALE: Right. The -- we get the topical effect
when we're older, and we get the -- yeah. When you're younger, it
gets incorporated into the enamel.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
DR. DIACZYNSKY: Can I follow up for a minute? Every
time we eat something or drink something, especially a
carbohydrate -- it doesn't have to be sugar, it doesn't have to be
candy -- our teeth are being attacked.
Commissioner Kowal and I and Dr. Benza had this conversation
yesterday. And what Dr. Governale was saying is your teeth are
February 13, 2024
Page 83
attacked, they're opened up; they are prone to decay that way. So we
recommend sipping on water frequently throughout the day.
When the acid breaks down the teeth, the fluoride in the water
helps strengthen and rebuild that enamel to be stronger and prevent
against future decay. Just like topical fluoride varnish that you
receive at the dental office, that does so, but in a stronger amount
than what we receive in the water. Hope that clarifies.
Any other questions?
(No response.)
DR. DIACZYNSKY: All right. Thank you for your time.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Mary Alger. She'll be
followed by Erikka Thalheimer.
MS. ALGER: Good morning. Mary Alger, Marco Island,
Florida.
I come before you this morning to bring to you my findings
regarding Collier County's use of sodium fluoride in its drinking
water. I'm also here to compel you to remove its use citing Collier
County's Health Freedom Bill of Rights ordinance which ensures
informed consent.
I have come to learn that the safe and effective and the "experts
say" mantras have been a slow removal of our ability to think
critically or go against the parroted lines of what the experts tell us.
Who, may we finally ask, are these nameless, faceless experts often
trotted out in lab coats that we are to put our trust in?
Why did we decide to cede our decision to those whom we have
no knowledge of? I believe there were many answers, some of
them, in no particular order: Laziness, of which I am certainly guilty
of; not wanting to be outside the common narrative casting us as the
dreaded conspiracy theorists, a name by which the way -- by the way,
which was invented to stifle any dissent of those revealing actual
conspiracy; fools if we're not of the credentialed set; and being
February 13, 2024
Page 84
drowned out by special interest money which now foments mob
action against the noncompliant.
Upon jettisoning my lazy excuse for not knowing, here's what I
found out about sodium fluoride which is used in public water
supplies. It's 80 times more toxic than naturally occurring calcium
fluoride, the mineral found in soil. It is a proven neurotoxin. It is a
chemical byproduct of aluminum, steel, cement, phosphate in nuclear
weapons manufacturing. It's used in electroplating, chemical
cleaning, and insecticides.
These industries, prior to convincing the population that it was
good for them to add it to the public water supplies, had a problem of
disposing of their highly toxic waste. Sodium fluoride has its own
hazardous substance fact sheet for handling and warnings of health
risks, including risk to developing babies in utero.
Fluoride cannot be removed by freezing. Boiling it causes
increased toxicity. So much for our drinking water to be used
to -- to be used to prepare our food or having the morning cups of
coffee and tea. Only distillation can remove fluoridation from water.
If I add a packet of sweetener to my tea, I can clearly read what
is in it and decide to use it or not use it based on that information and
upon further investigation. I found out that lipstick is made with fish
scales any some other unmentionables. In my vanity, I still choose
to wear it knowing the risks and the folly.
The point is, I can make a decision to use it or not. When
sodium fluoride is added to the public water supply, a citizen loses
that right to make an informed choice. If a citizen knew the truth of
using sodium fluoride and the false information to accept it as safe
and effective, most would surely choose for it to be removed.
On a personal note, adding sodium fluoride to the water has
certainly not kept me from getting cavities.
Revealed truth compels error to be corrected. Adding sodium
February 13, 2024
Page 85
fluoride to our water supply is an error that needs to be corrected. I
ask that you correct this error by using the Health Freedom Bill of
Rights to do so, and I thank you very much.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Erikka Thalheimer.
She'll be followed by Dr. Johnny Johnson.
MS. THALHEIMER: Thank you.
Have you ever thought of historical mistakes that people made
because they were listening to others that told them what was good
for me? Good for you? Well, I have. I've spent a lot of time
thinking about that in my life.
My name is Erica Thalheimer, and I've been a resident in Collier
County for over 40 years. And I'm a mom, which is the biggest
reason why I'm here right now, because I feel terrible about what I've
offered to my children over their lifetimes.
Good morning, Mr. Chairman, I appreciate you letting me
speak, and Commissioners. I am here to ask you to please vote to
stop the adding of fluoride to our water supply.
Now, here are a few things that people were told were good for
us, but they weren't: The atomic bomb; cigarettes; lead paint;
asbestos; baby oil and aluminum foil for tanning. I know
somebody's done that; tanning beds. Heroin cough syrup that was
developed by Bayer Laboratories; transorbital lobotomy, also referred
to as icepick lobotomy. I can't make this stuff up. LSD to cure
alcohol addiction -- maybe that one worked -- coronal behavior and
schizophrenia; cocaine, the cure-all wonder drug; mercury, which I
actually remember playing with as a child; tapeworm infestation for
weight loss. That's real. Radioactive water, drinking it. Yep, there
was a poor man who boasted about drinking radium water several
times every day for a year. The Wall Street Journal commemorated
his death in a headline and it was, quote, "The radium water worked
fine until his jaw fell off." This is all true.
February 13, 2024
Page 86
As a society -- and I'm skipping a whole bunch because we've
already heard it. As a society, we seem to have forgotten that for the
most part tooth decay is about dental hygiene and what foods and
drinks that we consume. Back in the '70s, convenience was king. I
was sat in the living room with a microwaved TV dinner or a TV tray
in front of a TV. I can still remember the smell of those TV dinners.
Same smell no matter what was under the microwaved plastic. That
is definitely on my list of bad ideas. Apparently, it was easier to let
the government put toxicity in the water than for parents, including
my own, to limit the bad-idea foods and drinks that promote tooth
decay. I do not want government or any NGO to add toxins to my
water for my own good.
In conclusion, I do not give my informed consent for this or any
other government to put a compound in my water that is toxic. I
understand that there are some people that believe that children will
have less cavities if they have extra fluoride. Fluoride is available in
other forms for people to use, and we know that already. We've
already. Please stop the madness and on the right -- and be on the
right side of history. Vote to stop the adding of fluoride to my
family's water supply.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Dr. Johnny Johnson.
He'll be followed by Tom Henning. Mr. Johnson -- or Dr. Johnson,
rather, has been ceded additional time from Miguel Gesino.
UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: He had to go to work.
MR. MILLER: Okay. Sarah Benza?
UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: She's at work also.
MR. MILLER: Okay. So that was -- Sandra Benza?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE VOICE: She's at work also.
MR. MILLER: All right. And Mary Dov -- well, I'm not
going to be able to pronounce that. Is she here?
(Raises hand.)
February 13, 2024
Page 87
MR. SHERMAN: Mary, retract your time. She retracts her
time from him. He misled who he was when we gave him time.
MR. MILLER: All right, sir.
All right, then. Dr. Johnson, that leaves you with just the three
minutes that you have signed up for, sir. I understand you had some
slides; is that correct?
DR. JOHNSON: I do.
CHAIRMAN HALL: All right. Sir.
DR. JOHNSON: I'm Johnny Johnson. I'm a pediatric dentist
who did research with fluoridation -- fluoride in infant formula back
in 1983 to '85.
How do I push these forward?
MR. MILLER: I'll get it for you, sir.
DR. JOHNSON: Okay. The safety and effectiveness I won't
go through, but I will tell you every single health effect that has been
given to you is listed on the form that I have here, the contents that I
gave you from the American Dental Association fluoridation facts.
They're all there. You can look them up.
Next.
There has never been an association between the levels of
fluoride in water fluoridation and any health effects ever. The only
thing that you see is dental fluorosis, and I'll go through that next.
Go ahead again.
Dental fluorosis -- go to the next one -- is just simply a color
change in the tooth on the surface, and it does not affect the tooth's
function or pain to the tooth, and, also, you barely ever see it. We
see it in the dental office. Nobody sees it walking down the street.
Next.
And research shows that that color does change by fading away.
Next, please. Next. Next. One more.
This is what fluoridation looks like. What you see in the
February 13, 2024
Page 88
middle, the yellow highlights around it are little, tiny white specks on
the teeth, and on the bottom is the very mild and mild. That's what
you see on kids' permanent teeth when they come in from a little
concentration of fluoride, and it only happens during the time the
teeth are developing under the gums by the time that they're eight
years old. It doesn't happen afterwards. You don't get that brown
pitted staining on teeth from water fluoridation.
Next.
What do you want? This is simply the difference between a
fluoridated community and not. Diet, yes. Diet's the same. The
ones on the right have mild fluorosis, and they definitely will get
some cavities, but they have much less and much less severe cavities.
The ones on the left look like where I live because there's no water
fluoridation in Levy County.
Next, please.
Claims about fluoride and IQ.
Next, please.
Grandjean who did the Harvard meta-analysis said that he is not
taking any sides on water fluoridation, and he still doesn't.
Next, please.
You hear about the National Academy of Sciences. This study
that was looking at every, every study from around the world looked
at fluoridation -- or fluoride in the water at several levels and did it
affect the IQ. The answer was no. They said -- and they said this
last year. Fluoride at the levels of water fluoridation and below 1.5
parts per million, there are no IQ changes whatsoever. None.
Next, please. Go ahead, go ahead, go ahead, and go ahead.
You can remove it with an RO very easily, $229.
Next. Next.
And here we have the U.S. courts. This is how we test things.
Next.
February 13, 2024
Page 89
Fluoride has never been shown to be unethical in the U.S.
courts. Informed consent, medication, unlicensed practice of
medicine and compulsory medication and for FDA approval. Never.
One more time, keep going. Keep going. You do need both
fluoridated water --
CHAIRMAN HALL: Bring it home, sir, please.
DR. JOHNSON: Sir?
CHAIRMAN HALL: Bring it home, please.
DR. JOHNSON: Okay, last -- go ahead one more. One more.
One more. Keep going. That's what the young lady talked about.
Next. Go ahead.
CHAIRMAN HALL: All right. Thank you, sir.
DR. JOHNSON: I've only got one last --
CHAIRMAN HALL: Your time's up. Thank you.
DR. JOHNSON: Well, I wanted to say that --
CHAIRMAN HALL: Your time's up. Thank you. You've
had three minutes just like everyone else.
MR. HENNING: Mr. Chairman, Tom Henning. I'm in favor
of removing the fluoride, and I thank the commissioners for putting it
on the agenda.
When I was sitting at your seat, it was -- we almost had it
passed. At the time, Frank Oakes, owns Food for Thought,
was -- petitioned the Board to remove the fluoride. I know he's here
in spirit, and I feel confident that the Board's going to do the right
thing by removing fluoride.
Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Joel Bohemier. I hope
I'm saying that right, sir. And followed by Dr. George Yiachos.
How do you say your name?
DR. BOHEMIER: Bohemier.
MR. MILLER: Bohemier. And he's been ceded three
February 13, 2024
Page 90
additional minutes from Scott Kiley. Scott?
(Raises hand.)
DR. BOHEMIER: I have a PowerPoint.
MR. MILLER: Oh, okay. Just a second, sir. Well, that's not
it; I'm sorry. Is this it here?
DR. BOHEMIER: Yes, that's the one.
MR. MILLER: Give me just a second to get that ready. All
right, sir.
DR. BOHEMIER: Good morning. Dr. Joel Bohemier,
resident of Collier County. Thank you for hearing us this morning.
I appreciate it.
I was also here in 2016, eight years, when the Board decided to
continue with fluoridation of the water in Collier County. And,
ultimately, the decision of the Board, as said at that time, was
basically because the dentists came out, just like they're doing today,
they showed degenerated teeth, and they said it was safe and
effective, like they're doing this morning, and they also said that the
EPA and the CDC says it's safe and effective as well.
So I'd like to address those two issues because since 2016 a lot
has changed, and we can't continue to follow the same dogma that
we've had -- have followed for the last seven years.
Okay. So I -- as of 2017, I became co-owner of a website
called greenmedinfo.com where we index and collate over 100,000
articles from the National Library of Medicine. These are research
studies only that we have on our website. And so a quick search
found -- if you can go to the next slide -- that there are 248 unique
studies on our site from the National Library of Medicine talking
about the adverse effects of fluoride on the human body. Okay.
Out of those -- if you go to the next slide -- you'll find there are
26 different pharmacological actions that fluoride have in the human
body such as neurotoxicity, antifertility, cardiotoxic, oxidant,
February 13, 2024
Page 91
inflammatory, teratogenic, and abortive, and many others that I'll
save the time, but I can share this information with you if you wish.
As well, fluoride contributes to -- the next slide -- contributing
to 91 different diseases in the human body. And so when we hear
that it is safe and effective and we've used if forever, I believe it is
intellectual maybe lethargy or, at best, to be nice about it is just we
didn't look at the actual studies that are on the National Library of
Medicine warning us of the devastating effects of fluoride on the
human body.
And so we need to move on and understand that there are ill
effects and that it is well studied. This isn't -- these -- there are
dozens of studies on human beings and hundreds of laboratory
studies proving the toxicity of fluoride. So if somebody comes up
here and says it's safe and effective again, it is not, according to the
National Library of Medicine.
Point No. 2, according to the EPA and the CDC -- if you can go
to the next slide, please -- here is Dr. Ohanian from the EPA
representative under oath who says a baby that is formula-fed
receives over 100 times the amount of fluoride as a baby who's
breast-fed. He's asked, and he says yes.
Next slide.
Dr. Joyce Tsuji -- and, again, this is -- that was 2018. This is a
deposition in 2019 of another EPA expert who says, do you think the
recommendation to avoid the use of fluoridated water in infant baby
formula is a reasonable and sound recommendation?
What does she say? She says, it certainly appears to be
reasonable given that the dose to infants is potentially greater than the
referenced dose for dental fluorosis and provides no benefit at that
stage.
Next slide.
Another expert from the CDC, Casey Hannan, says, the CDC
February 13, 2024
Page 92
agrees with NRC that it is apparent that fluoride has the ability to
interfere with the function of the brain and the body by direct and
indirect means. He's asked that question.
What is his answer? Yes.
Next slide.
Another neurotoxicologist from the EPA is Dr. Stanley Barone,
Jr. Fluoride has the ability to interfere with the functions of the
brain. The answer is yes, I believe their findings are correct, and
"their findings," he means of the study.
Next slide.
And lastly, Dr. Joyce Donahue, EPA Office of Water. There is
a significant relationship between low levels of fluoride in the urine
of pregnant women and ADHD symptoms in children. She's asked.
Her answer, yes.
And the question, and this further supports the need for
reassessment of current safety standards of fluoride in the United
States?
And what is her answer? The Office of Water expert from the
EPA, she says, yes.
And so for experts -- dental experts to stand up here and say that
there are no other effects in the body is asinine, in my opinion,
because even the organizations that they use as proof that it's safe and
effective, when it's under oath, they also admit that there are main
problems.
Lastly, the last thing I want to add -- next slide. I am the
cofounder of Stand for Health Freedom. We are an international
organization that stands up for freedom of human beings. We have
1,300 members, like Jill said, in Collier County itself, okay.
We sent out, about less than a year ago, an e-mail to millions of
Americans talking about the Collier County Board of
Commissioners, praising your efforts for the healthcare -- Health
February 13, 2024
Page 93
Freedom Bill of Rights, okay? I believe that forcing me and other
Collier County residents to drink fluoridated water directly
counteracts and is in conflict with the Healthcare Bill of Rights that
you guys have enacted and passed. And so I believe you do not have
my informed consent and many of others of my patients and my
family members here in Collier County. So I would beg you and
plead to you to please remove fluoride from the water in Collier
County.
Thank you for your time. I really appreciate you guys.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Dr. George Yiachos, and
he will be followed by Susan Gorman. The doctor has been ceded
three -- pardon me -- has been ceded three additional minutes from
Elizabeth Yiachos.
(Raises hand.)
DR. YIACHOS: Hi. My name's Dr. George Yiachos. I've
been a cardiologist for over 30 years, and I'm not representing any
hospital system or corporation. I am here to discuss the importance
of informed consent.
Informed consent is what distinguishes responsible public
healthcare from dangerous, immoral, and unethical behavior and at
its worst could equate to medical torture and criminal activity.
Misplaced trust in the healthcare and the pharmaceutical
industry leads to shortcuts with terrible consequences. A proactive,
informed health consumer is the only protection against intended and
unintended consequences of medications and treatments.
Cardiovascular disease is the No. 1 killer in the world. Does
that mean we should put statins, blood thinners, and blood pressure
medications in the water? That's nonsense. And if you believe that
you should and you don't think this is ridiculous, you lack informed
consent.
Medications being placed in the water supply without the
February 13, 2024
Page 94
foreknowledge of a consumer's overall health problem, nutritional
status, their genetics, no matter how well-meaning is irresponsible,
criminal, and Dr. Mangele-level science.
You might ask what this has to do with fluoridation of the water
supply. We spoke about the history, how Nazi camps and Russian
camps used this to make their dissonance [sic] and their prisoners
docile so that they wouldn't rebel against them and they could control
them better.
In the '40s, many people were around purporting the benefits of
oral intake of fluoride. There was a Dr. Hodge that was mentioned
earlier. He was the lead toxicologist of the Manhattan project. This
guy who used to do infomercials on the TV telling people fluoride is
safe and effective sounds familiar, right? Safe and effective. And
he basically would take prisoners and unwitting people and inject
uranium, plutonium, and fluoride, a byproduct of what they were
doing there, just to see what the impact was and, yet, this gentleman
who found that there were terrible impacts on somebody's health was
later purporting the benefits of oral intake of fluoride.
The father of water fluoridation, Dr. Dean, was mentioned a
little bit earlier, who found communities with naturally occurring
fluoride in their water, and there were benefits for the cavities, and
then went on to do further -- a real scientist. He actually looked
further to see if there was anything else wrong with fluoridation.
So he decided to go to a community where there was more than
the average amount of fluoride in water naturally, and he found
people having huge prevalence of cataracts, huge prevalence of bony
problems, vertebral problems, spine problems. And these were
things that they were able to observe back then.
So I want you -- I want to ask people, how many people have
somebody that they know that have had cataract surgery? So do you
think the purported topical water that you drink that supposedly has
February 13, 2024
Page 95
topical benefit -- because that's what we were told, that it's topical
benefit from the water, not ingestion, the fluoride that destroys the
micro -- the micro -- the biome of your intestines, the fluoride that
gets absorbed into your bloodstream, that it's only the topical thing
that has any impact here?
So a lot of ophthalmologists could potentially be put out of
business if we could just take fluoride out of the water. Maybe.
Maybe. But there are other health effects besides worrying about
cavities.
So Dr. Dean was so excited about this information, he sought it
out, and then when he became the proponent for the opposite side, his
information got squashed. He would go to these other counties and
talk about the dangers of water fluoridation but got squashed. But
he's still considered the father of fluoridation. That part survived.
So, nonetheless, it's thought that the ingestion and the
swallowing of water is helping you avoid tooth decay and that the
assumption that topical exposure to fluoride -- and that drinking the
water is necessary, but topical is not good enough.
So as was just shown on the slides, the information that the
dentist population was just presenting us with as no IQ reduction is
complete nonsense. In fact, we, as the United States, have sought to
find out if these Canadian and Mexican studies that showed
significant reductions in the IQs of children are true. And the
information's been available for over a year, getting squashed, getting
suppressed by Dr. Rachel Levine, and we have to do Freedom of
Information Act releases just to find out that 72 studies have
confirmed that there is IQ reductions in children. And now we have
to wait till next week before that information gets released from a few
years ago. So this constant repeating "It doesn't reduce IQ," I think
is a lie, honestly.
So that being said, they do not know the upper limit of safe
February 13, 2024
Page 96
fluoride ingestion. Whether it's 1.7 or eight parts per million, no one
knows. It was admitted during these depositions.
The prominent benefit of fluoride is from topical application.
That was admitted during these depositions. There was never any
proof that ingestion of fluoride made a difference in caries, as our
European counterparts have told us.
Ingestion of fluoride has adverse effects on the brain, the
thyroid, the pineal gland. The pineal gland has one other function
we didn't mention here; it's our God antenna. You know, you calcify
that, you actually impact people's religious fervor. That's pretty
interesting.
The Natural Toxicology Program confirmed the whole issue
with IQ degradation. And dental fluorosis, which is being shown
here, is present in 80 percent of the public and represents toxic
exposure to fluoride, no topically, because you absorbed it, and it
went everywhere.
How about some other candies that we gave in medicine that are
really good? Prozac, Luvox all have fluoride in them. You know,
that mineral that supposedly is beneficial is actually a chemical
compound that dampens your brain's function. Fen/phen destroyed
the heart. Roofies, the date rape drug, fluoride had that impact on
your memory.
So make no mistake, fluoridating water is forced medication of
the public without consent.
Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Susan Gorman. She'll be
followed by Stephanie Nordin. Ms. Gorman's been ceded three
additional minutes from Mark Singer.
MR. SINGER: Hello.
MR. MILLER: Thank you, Mark.
MS. GORMAN: Thank you for allowing me to speak today.
February 13, 2024
Page 97
My name is Susan Gorman, and I am the clinical program
coordinator, registered dental hygienist for the University of Florida
dental outreach program that serves the children of Collier County. I
am here to urge you to retain fluoride in Collier County water system.
For the past 10 years, the UF Dental Outreach Program has
provided preventative care for over 57,000 children in Collier
County. Our annual countywide dental screenings are our compass.
These screenings allow us to assess the prevalence of tooth decay
among our third-grade students.
Last year alone, we screened 2,093 third-graders. The results
were sobering. Seven hundred and forty-four of these children had
untreated tooth decay, a staggering 35 percent, but that's not all. A
hundred and thirty of these students faced urgent dental needs
requiring immediate attention due to signs of infection and pain.
Every day while working in this program, I see children within
our county who have been negatively impacted by untreated tooth
decay. Just this past week we saw a child four years of age that was
enrolled in one of our early learning programs who has teeth abscess
causing pain because of severe cavities. Tooth decay can cause
many devastating and serious effects on the body as a whole, not just
within the mouth specifically.
Tooth decay can interrupt sleep patterns, cause nutritional
deficiencies, initiate mental health concerns, and affect the ability for
the child to learn.
I hesitate to think what would occur if our county would
discontinue community water fluoridation given some of the
staggering facts from the statewide third-grade dental surveillance
that was conducted a few years ago. This status showed that in the
northwest region where Jackson County is located and has no
fluoridation in their water system, over 53 percent of the third-grade
students were found to have untreated decay. This alarming statistic
February 13, 2024
Page 98
serves as a potential indicator of the future oral health of our children
if our county were to discontinue community water fluoridation.
Such a decision could have devastating medical and dental
consequences for our community. It underscores the importance of
maintaining water fluoridation programs to prevent better [sic] oral
health outcomes for our residents.
If you are wondering if water fluoridation is just for kids, it is
not. With community water fluoridation, everyone benefits.
Irrespective of race, age, income, or education, community water
fluoridation offers lifetime protection even beyond childhood. The
direct contact with fluoridated water continues to shield teeth
throughout a person's lifetime.
Community water fluoridation is cost effective by reducing
cavities by approximately 25 percent in both children and adults;
therefore, community water fluoridation saves money for families
and our entire healthcare system.
For example, for every dollar invested in community water
fluoridation, you save $38 in treatments that would have been needed
to treat cavities. It also provides indirect cost savings by preventing
lost work time, lost schooltime, or emergency department visits
because of tooth decay.
Today I stand before you to emphasize the critical role of
community water fluoridation in safeguarding our community's
population. Our endorsement is not singular. It echos across
esteemed organizations, as the American Dental Association, the
American Hygiene Association, the American Academy of
Pediatrics, the American Academy of Pediatric Dentistry, and also
the American Academy of Family Physicians all rally behind this
preventative measure. Their collective choice resounds water
fluoridation is a cornerstone of public health.
Closer to home, the Florida Department of Health penned a
February 13, 2024
Page 99
letter that resonates with unwavering conviction for water
fluoridation. They assert that no other public health intervention has
undergone more vigorous scrutiny than water fluoridation. Decades
of research, epidemiological studies, and public disclosure have
fortified this stance.
I would like to speak a little bit off the record of what I have
written just to kind of dispute professionally in my own personable
[sic] opinions of what has been stated before. Chlorine is also added
to our water, and we do not give our consent for that to be added to
our public water system. Fluoride, whether it is naturally occurring
in well water -- fluoride ion is a fluoride ion, whether it is in well
water or whether it is in your public water system.
I urge you to please take consideration and read for yourself the
many facts that have been gained through regulated studies by
reputable organizations. We all have an opinion on something, but
take what is science based and what is also behind you because of the
organizations that are prominent that guard our health for our
citizens, not only our children, but also our adults.
Fluoride supplements cannot be purchased at a grocery store. I
also wanted to let you know that. They have to be dispensed
through a physician or a dentist. However, on the other hand, you
can purchase bottled water, which has negligible amount of fluoride
in it, if a person does not want fluoride in their water.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Stephanie Nordin. She'll
be followed by Alfie Oakes.
MS. NORDIN: Good afternoon, Commissioners. My name is
Stephanie Nordin, and I am a native to Collier County, born in 1985,
along with fluoride in the county. I am a mom of four boys, and the
president and founder of Autism Collier.
I'm here today as a concerned member of the community
committed to the health and well-being of our residents, especially
February 13, 2024
Page 100
our children.
So today I'm bringing up a matter of critical importance, the
presence of fluoride in our water system and the potential impact to
our community's health.
Emerging scientific evidence suggests that there is a possible
link between fluoride exposure and the rising prevalence of autism
spectrum disorder. Research indicates that fluoride can harm brain
development and lead to issues like oxidative stress and inflammation
while also affecting hormone regulation, like you heard before,
including melatonin. These are all common symptoms my children
experience.
And, moreover, studies show that higher levels of fluoride
can -- higher levels of fluoride exposure during pregnancy can lead to
lower IQ scores in children, which is particularly concerning to me
given the prevalence of intellectual disability rising in individuals
with autism.
In 2023, the CDC released statistics that one in 16 children are
diagnosed with autism, and 28 percent of those children are severely
impacted by their disability. My children are in that -- in that
category, and when they were diagnosed 13 years ago, it was one in
60. So those numbers have risen exponentially for a reason.
And one such study, "Chronic fluoride exposure and the risk of
autism spectrum disorder," published by the National Institution of
Health, National Library of Medicine, highlights the potential
association between fluoride and the exposure of autism. The
research underscores the urgency of addressing fluoride's exposure in
our community water supply. I e-mailed that all to you for your
review.
So as we navigate public health policy, it's imperative that we
address this evidence and consider the profound implications for our
community's future.
February 13, 2024
Page 101
Now, I have 42 seconds so, off on the record, my children go to
NCEF. It is the only pediatric dentist here in our area. They do
wait six months to 18 months under sedation to see these dentists,
and they are incredible pediatric dentists for our children. If we
could take that $200,000 into -- from the fluoride budget and put it
into better health, these children can go get the treatment that
they -- we need preventatively.
So thank you very much.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Alfie Oakes, and he'll be
followed by Donald Braswell.
Mr. Oakes has been ceded three additional minutes from Daniel
Cook, who is right there.
MR. OAKES: So thank you for hearing me today. As you
know, this is somewhat personal to me. My father that passed away
back in 2023, a couple years before his passing, was up here fighting
with the Commission to get the fluoride out of the water. It was
something that he was very passionate about.
I had the privilege of -- my father, while he never made a lot of
money -- he drove around in a $300 car -- at the age -- when I was at
the age of 11, he spent $900 for a reverse osmosis system for our
house because that was more important to him than the car that he
drove, that he didn't want to damage, mostly us kids, but the whole
family with the fluoride when he found out that the only way to get
fluoride out of the water would be with reverse osmosis. So he was
way ahead of the curve on a lot of things.
And I have -- except for one time when I was in the -- like third
or fourth grade, there was a fluoride supplement that came out, and
they made us take it, and my father found out about it and lost his
mind. That's the only time that these teeth have ever seen fluoride.
They don't look like they've got too many cavities, do they? Forty
years, I haven't had a cavity. So my dad was smart enough to get us
February 13, 2024
Page 102
ahead of the curve.
So I'd also like to talk about -- we find out a lot about who's on
the right side of things by who our -- who our -- what I call our
enemies are. And when I see something that's reported or that's
encouraged by the World Health Organization or by Rachel
Levine -- and even the World Economic Forum all promotes this
fluoride, and you have to ask yourself why.
I was lucky enough to attend an event over in Mexico this past
summer, and it was the first time that I had ever heard -- I heard this
gentleman say it today. It was the first time I ever heard that
fluoride actually calcifies the pineal gland. It's the only element that
calcifies your pineal gland.
So I've been lucky that my pineal gland hasn't been calcified.
Maybe it's why I have eternal energy. I get up 4:00 in the morning
and go till 10 o'clock at night.
I have -- the pineal gland is represented in ancient history as the
third eye, our connection to our spirituality. It's also what I consider
a driving force. When I hear that the IQ has been lowered of all
these reports of kids that are taking -- taking tests that our IQ's
directly proportional to how much fluoride is used in the water, it's
stunning.
But when I think about that in a logical sense, it makes sense,
because I don't believe that -- like some of these doctors here who
their vessel is filled with knowledge from the universities, I think that
real learning comes from the lighting of a fire, and the lighting of the
fire is that pineal gland. That's our fire that connects us to
spirituality. It gives us drive. I've got a high school education.
I've done pretty well because I got the fire burning.
And this is intentional. If you don't think this is intentional to
dumb us down to keep control of the people in this country, then I
don't think that you're paying attention.
February 13, 2024
Page 103
The fluoride, unfortunately -- and I'm going to take a few
minutes because there's 100 different things said that I was going to
bring up today. But the fluoride's not the only problem. So as we
know, that that -- the fluoride that they're putting in the water is not
natural-occurring fluoride. It's a manmade substance. It's toxic to
us.
When they found out how well that worked to poison us and
dumb us down back in the '40s and '50s, in 1977, they decided that
we were going to put folic acid in the bread. Folic acid's in almost
all the bread. 99.9 percent of the bread in this country has folic acid
in it. It's, again, another manmade substance. It's poisoning us.
And, you know, I don't think -- we're not putting -- thank God
we're not putting the folic acid in the water, or we'd be getting that
out. But we might even -- I might be back here asking everyone to
be putting poison labels on all bread in Collier County that has folic
acid in it because it's just another sham from the same people that are
trying to bring us down.
And, you know, the difference between right now and when my
dad was here 13, 14 years ago, whenever it was, fighting against the
fluoride, the difference is is we don't trust the whitecoats anymore.
We used -- they got up here and put on the same show. I just
listened to them. They were -- you're saying not to say the same
things over again. Almost every one of their talking points from the
universities is exactly the same talking point. And they've been
using it over and over again. It's the same things when I sat here
with my father 14 years ago that they used.
As a matter of fact, the gentleman, Johnny Johnson who came
up, he goes around the whole state doing this. I don't know if he's
paid or not. It doesn't matter to me. But you have to wonder
what -- you know, what is driving that. What's the driving force?
Why are they trying to do this? Why are they trying to put a
February 13, 2024
Page 104
neurotoxin in our water that's poisoning us?
You know, I never had to take a shower where my skin was
absorbing -- a hot shower, you open up your pores and having, you
know, a neurotoxin pour into your skin. Thank God I wasn't. But
everybody else in this county has been subjected to it, and it's
certainly time that we -- that we -- like Mark Twain said, it's hard
sometimes to realize when you've been duped, it's hard to admit it,
but I think we need to -- we need to -- you know, time for us to be
responsible. We have a -- we have a great group of commissioners
up here that I think is going to make the right decision, and I've never
felt more blessed to live in this great county of Collier County.
Thank you, Commissioners.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Donald Braswell, and he'll
be followed by Dr. Pam Cunningham.
MR. BRASWELL: Just a handout for Dan. You can look at it
and then pass them along.
I actually don't need a microphone, but I'll do it for the sake of
recording this. I'm here briefly to tell you that I want it removed.
We have, as consumers, all kinds of choices except that we can't
choose not to have fluoride in our water.
What I handed to you is two pictures from your local Walmart.
There's 12 feet of toothpaste products; all have fluoride. Then the
second one shows I want the choice to not have fluoride in my
toothpaste. There's three.
So for those who are hesitant, you're well covered. You have
an option by brushing your teeth, you know. And there's a good
advantage to using a tooth product. It gets rid of your moose breath
in the morning, whitens your teeth, and some of them even say that it
makes you sexy.
But the point is I want to have the choice of whether I accept
fluoride or not. So removing it from our water system is the choice I
February 13, 2024
Page 105
would prefer you to do.
Thank you, gentlemen.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Dr. Pam Cunningham.
She'll be followed by Peter Osinski. Dr. Cunningham's been ceded
three additional minutes from Joe Alger. Joe, can you raise your --
(Raises hand.)
MR. MILLER: Oh, thank you.
MR. ALGER: I'm not at work.
MR. MILLER: Okay. So she'll have six minutes.
DR. CUNNINGHAM: Good afternoon, Commissioners. My
name is Dr. Pam Cunningham. It's a pleasure to be here today to
have the opportunity to address you regarding this important issue.
As you may remember, I e-mailed each of you several days ago
but wanted to have the opportunity to speak to you to reiterate what
my thoughts on fluoride in the drinking water supply are.
I'm a Christian and an American and as such I'm a free
individual. Our country was founded on the Biblical principles of
liberty and free will. These principles are outlined in our nation's
founding documents, the highest laws in our land.
We as individuals, by definition, must have the freedom to do
with our persons as we wish so long as we do not harm others in the
process. Part of this freedom is medical freedom, the right to not
have substances placed in our bodies or surgical procedures
performed on our bodies without informed consent. I and,
obviously, many others in Collier County do not consent to having
fluoride placed in our drinking water supply.
Along with viewing the fluoride situation as a Christian and
American, I also view it as a medical doctor. As a physician, I was
trained to first do no harm. In fact, that has historically been and
should always remain the cornerstone of medical practice, and it must
also be the cornerstone of public health practice. We have recently
February 13, 2024
Page 106
seen many examples of what happens when that principle falls away
from our center of focus.
My argument before you today is that fluoridating the water
likely does more harm than good and, therefore, it is a practice that
should be abolished in Collier County. A lot of research has been
done on this issue. And I sent you guys in my e-mail several
scientific references. In fact, one of them was to -- alluded to by one
of our previous speakers from the Harvard School of Public Health.
There's a very famous study that showed these two -- these two
researchers from Harvard Public School said very clearly that
fluoride is toxic to the brain, and as toxic as lead and mercury in the
drinking water. Under tremendous political pressure, the gentleman
who authored the article pulled away from that statement and later
said that he was neutral on the subject of adding fluoride to the water.
That was not his initial stance.
If you can look up on the screens, you'll see one graph followed
by a second one. These graphs are taken from the OEC health
statistics database. If you look at the first graph with me, you'll see
it looks at the average number of missing, decayed, or filled teeth in
12-year-old children in countries that fluoridate their water from
1976 to 2014, and what you'll see along the X axis is that these dental
conditions went down over time in countries that fluoridated their
water.
If you can please switch to the second graph. Okay. This
graph looks tremendously similar to the first graph. This is a graph
of children with missing, decayed, or filled teeth at 12 years of age in
countries that do not fluoridate their water. In other words, what the
data shows is that whether the countries are fluoridating or whether
they are not fluoridating, the dental health of the 12-year-old children
is the same, and what that demonstrates is that we have had improved
dental hygiene in the way of children brushing their teeth properly
February 13, 2024
Page 107
and also in terms of nutrition.
A couple people have shown a toothpaste container today. I
have one in my bag, but I left it over on the other side of the room,
but it's a fluoridated toothpaste, and there's a warning on it, and it's
already been read today, but I'll just reiterate that it says, keep out of
the reach of children under six years of age. If more than used [sic]
brushing is accidently swallowed, get medical help or contact poison
control right away.
A lot of these toothpastes, they have, like -- if you guys have
children, they have, like, shiny, pink sparkles in them. They're
flavored to strawberry or orange. They're really -- they're very
appealing to children. Some children will eat that, and they
become -- they become very ill because they've ingested too much
fluoride from that toothpaste.
When ingested in excessive amounts, the fluoride can cause
abdominal pain, diarrhea, drooling, irregular heartbeat, et cetera.
Let's think about the effects of a tiny bit of fluoride added every day
to children's drinking water and what that does to the development of
their brains. Small amounts of poison every day for these children.
Again, the researchers from the Harvard School of Public Health
called this as dangerous as taking daily mercury or lead on the
developing brain.
The final issue that I want to touch on is the issue of water
filtration. A lot of people say, well, it's fine, just go out and get
yourself a good water filter, and a lot of families do this. But the
truth is that most water filters on the market do not remove this
harmful substance from the drinking water. Once fluoride is added
to the water, it's extremely difficult to get out unless you use reverse
osmosis or a very high -- high filter water -- I'm sorry -- high-end
water filtration system.
I would like to echo what I believe Mr. Sherman said in that if
February 13, 2024
Page 108
this fluoride in the water is so effective, why are these pediatric
dentists -- and God bless you. I love my pediatric dentist for my
children, but why are you guys seeing such high levels of dental
illness among these children? They are drinking the water.
Commissioners, I ask you to please take one giant step forward
in public health today. Please join the hundreds of other U.S.
counties and the large majority of Western Europe and vote to stop
adding this chemical to our drinking water.
Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Peter Osinski.
(No response.)
MR. MILLER: No? Katie Tardif. I know Katie's here. And
then Katie will be followed by our final speaker who will be on
Zoom, April Donahue. So, April, stand by.
MS. TARDIF: Where do I go?
MR. MILLER: Either one. Either one.
MS. TARDIF: Okay. Thanks. Good to see you guys again.
And I have to start by saying, I never thought I'd find points of
agreement with Alfie Oakes. Is he still here? But I'm with him.
And when it comes to healthy food, limited additives, I get chills
thinking I have something in common with Alfie now.
Later when I speak to Collier County's water treatment plants
challenges, I hope to discover another point of agreement.
There's been a lot of hair on fire commenting today, and I'm sure
you-all know how to discern hair on fire from fact. I don't know the
facts in this case, frankly, but I am much persuaded by common
sense, whatever that is anymore. Sorry, I didn't mean to look away.
I think the fluoride matter might be ably addressed where Collier
County's children are concerned as a compromise, many of whose
dental health for life depends on "early in life" dental fluoride
treatments. I don't know that they have to come through our water
February 13, 2024
Page 109
system.
So I'm only proposing that rather than voting today on the matter
in full, today consider a hybrid or compromise approach that takes
care of children's dental health in their earliest or up to through high
school years while not requiring fluoridating the entire community.
And, again, I'm not pro or con fluoridation. I am pro children's
early dental health and what a critical difference it makes in their
entire life.
I hope that you will please investigate an alternative approach to
a serious public health issue in this manner.
Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Mr. Chair, our final registered speaker is on
Zoom, April Donahue.
April, you're being prompted to unmute yourself, if you'll do so
at this time. And there you are. April, you have three minutes.
MS. DONAHUE: Thank you. And good afternoon, Chair and
Commissioners.
I'm April Donahue, executive director of Collier County
Medical Society, and I speak on behalf of the CCMS board of
directors. We would echo the previous comments offered by our
dental association colleagues and ask you to vote no on removal of
fluoridation from our county water.
Fluoridation to the recommended level is not just an important
method for good dental health, but for good overall health. The
Florida Medical Association, American Medical Association,
American Academy of Pediatrics, America Academy of Family
Physicians, and American Nurses Association together representing
millions of healthcare providers all support water fluoridation. In
addition, so does the Department of Defense for all of their military
bases.
Tooth decay is the most common chronic disease for adults and
February 13, 2024
Page 110
children in the U.S. Fluoride, which is not a medication but a
mineral existing naturally in all water supplies, is one of the best
tools for reducing that risk.
While all water supply has natural fluoride, it is an amount
below the recommended level of .7 milligrams per liter. Decades of
research show the safety efficacy and overall cost savings of
fluoridated water in keeping communities healthy and reducing the
need to treat dental disease.
Community water fluoridation provides a critical benefit,
especially to those without access to regular dental care, by simply
drinking community water. Unlike many other first-world counties
like Europe who cover the cost of dental care -- like in Europe, who
cover the cost of dental care, the U.S. does not. Multiple options are
available for those who prefer not to drink the community water.
Keeping fluoridation helps us take care of those who are most at risk,
from young to old, and everyone in our community.
I thank you for your time.
MR. MILLER: Mr. Chair, that was our final public speaker for
Item 10A.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Can I ask a question of the
individual on Zoom?
MR. MILLER: Yeah. She still is unmuted.
April, hold on a minute. Commissioner Kowal has a question
for you.
MS. DONAHUE: Sure thing.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: You're probably like -- thank
you for coming on today. I think you're, like, the second or third
person I heard say the recommended level. Now, just in my little bit
of research, I never really saw a particular recommended level.
Now, I know if you participate in a fluoride -- introducing fluoride
into your public water, the only time levels come into play is that you
February 13, 2024
Page 111
don't poison your citizens by going too over a level.
And the federal government has a certain number, and the state
has a certain number that you must be below, but I never really saw
anything that said a recommended level. Is that -- are you stating
the -- you know, to stay below a level, or is it truly a recommended
level?
MR. MILLER: I'm sorry, Commissioner Kowal. You're going
to have to bear with us. The Zoom protocol is to automatically mute
people after they speak. I'm trying to get her unmuted again.
There it is, April. You can now respond.
MS. DONAHUE: Yes. Hello. I should say that it is a
recommended range, and that range starts at .07 [sic]. That can be a
little bit more than that. But, basically, what you're going to see is
communities that have more than that recommended range would
perhaps reduce the amount of fluoride in their water, and
communities who have less than that recommended range would try
to increase that level to make it optimal for dental health and overall
health.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Thank you for clarifying that.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
I'd like to ask Dr. Yilmaz a couple questions. I hate to put him
on the spot. Probably I should have said something to him during a
break that I would ask him a few questions.
And as he's coming up, everything that I read had a
recommended level of .07 [sic] milligrams per liter. I think that
come out to seven -- .7 parts per million or something of that nature.
But that seemed to be the recommended dose.
But I want to ask Dr. Yilmaz a couple questions. First of all,
what is the amount that you have in the Collier County water system?
DR. YILMAZ: We do not exist -- we do not exceed .7
February 13, 2024
Page 112
recommended level.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Now, that's .7 parts per
million? Am I -- I heard a couple different numbers, and I've heard
.07 milligrams per liter.
DR. YILMAZ: That will be 0.7 milligrams per liter.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: And where do you acquire
your sodium fluoride? Is that a -- I've heard different concerns about
it being a byproduct of several different industrial processes, but I've
also heard that it's acquired from China. And I'm curious as to do
you know where our sodium fluoride comes from?
DR. YILMAZ: It comes from EPA-approved suppliers in the
United States.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: What does it take to be an
EPA-approved supplier? And the reason I'm asking this is I -- you
know, we do get stuff from China that is perhaps not the safest. Dog
food, I think, things of that nature, children's toys. And so the issue
of whether it comes from China or not, I think, is important to me.
And so when you say EPA-approved suppliers, do you have any idea
who those EPA-approved suppliers are and where they get their
material and why are they EPA approved?
DR. YILMAZ: Thank you, Commissioner. It's a good
question. In this global market we have, chain of custody sometimes
changes from LLCs to LLCs to LLCs. So at the end, the product
we -- product we do buy has to meet EPA and CDC requirements.
As far as origin goes, we don't go and chase down the chain of
custody.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: All right. I don't have any
other questions at the moment, Mr. Chairman.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Great.
Commissioner LoCastro, are you good?
DR. YILMAZ: Commissioner Saunders, I have one comment
February 13, 2024
Page 113
to make in terms of dosage. Among all chemicals we use for water
treatment, disinfection, they are all required chemicals/substances for
us to produce safe water 365/24/7. As we talked before, we produce
over 6 billion gallons of drinking water. That's potable water ready
for baby formula.
There's only one substance that is not required and added into
our water supply is sodium fluoride silicate, which is fluoridation.
I just want to make sure that it's clear to our customers that that
is simply a public health policy decision by the governing board. It
is not our water department or our public utilities' decision.
So the public health decision has to be made by the governing
board as a policy based on all the hearing and advisors you do have
from medical and scientific community you did hear today.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Mr. Yilmaz, there are several
utilities in Collier County that do not add fluoride to the water, and a
couple fairly large ones. One is the City of Marco Island with
20 -- almost 28,000 customers, and the other is -- let me see. There
was another fairly large one. But do you have any idea why -- oh,
City of Everglades, fairly small, 2500 customers. Do you have any
idea why two of the cities in our county have chosen not to add
fluoride? Do you have any -- was there ever any discussion, any
dialogue between you and the other utilities concerning this type of
additive?
DR. YILMAZ: Very good, Commissioner. As far as other
utilities go, their governing board or their city council or county
commission, whoever governs the water supply system. In this case,
Collier County Water/Sewer District was created by special act, and
you're the governing board, and you have an ordinance that also
governs other regulatory functions.
In this case, our only function as the Collier County
Water/Sewer District is produce potable water. Anything above and
February 13, 2024
Page 114
beyond is a public health policy decision.
So, yes, we did have conversations, but most utilities will pretty
much land with my statements here that subject to governing board
decision based on the public health policy. From a potable water
production standpoint, our charter is very simple: Produce water for
baby formula.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Okay. Thank you,
Mr. Chairman.
CHAIRMAN HALL: All right. Commissioner LoCastro,
we'll take your comment or question, and then we will break for
lunch, and --
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: You've just -- you've just
answered it. I didn't know. It's hard for me to gauge the mood of
the room. Sometimes when you have that many citizens there, if
you feel the mood of the commissioners is a certain way -- as
Commissioner Saunders sometimes says, I can count noses -- it's
good for the citizens to sort of see the vote than make them wait out
in the hall for another hour plus and then come back. That was
really going to be my question. I do have some comments. And I
won't lead the motion, but I do have some comments. But if you're
going to hold those till after lunch, that was my question.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Do you-all want to go ahead and vote?
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Let's vote.
CHAIRMAN HALL: All right. Commissioner Kowal.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Thank you, Chairman.
Like I made in my opening statements, I'm not -- in no position
here to say I'm a doctor or a scientist. And I've heard from a lot of
very intelligent people that probably know a lot more than I do from
both sides, the pro and con.
And, basically, what comes down to me and what I'm making a
decision on today and why I'm making this motion is -- and I think
February 13, 2024
Page 115
it's pretty unanimous from both sides that we agree this is a medical
treatment. This is a medication that we're providing the citizens
through the drinking water.
I had a few people from the dental community that actually
corrected some things saying that you can't buy fluoride from the
grocery store. You can't buy it from, you know, a Walmart. You
can buy products that might be fortified with some fluoride, but to get
fluoride administered to you that you're going to take it, you have to
have a prescription from a dentist or a doctor. To me, that's a
medication. If it's required to have a prescription to obtain it, that's a
medication.
And that being said, with our own resolution and our own
ordinance that we passed back in April 11th, 2023, I believe I can't
tell my commissioners -- fellow commissioners here or tell them how
they're going to decide on this or if they're going to look at accepting
one side over the other, but I urge them to look at the legal aspect of
it. And by our very own hand that we passed 5-0 back in April of
2023, the resolution and the ordinance -- and it's clearly stated in
both -- that we are acting in violation of our very own law. And by
this motion today, I would motion to bring us into compliance with a
vote to stop adding the chlorine to our water.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Fluoride.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Fluoride to our water. A lot
talk about chlorine, but that's mandated, so there's nothing we can do
about that. But the fluoride is not mandated, and it's clearly stated in
Section 10 of our ordinance that if it's not mandated by state statute
or federal law, we are not required, or we are basically prohibited
and -- through the resolution on Line 3 through the implied consent
of medical treatment. So my motion stands, that I want to bring us
into compliance, and that I want to vote right now on removing the
fluoride from our water.
February 13, 2024
Page 116
CHAIRMAN HALL: So we have a motion.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Mr. Chairman, it's
Commissioner LoCastro, and I can't see the lights. But one thing
that was mentioned that I think does have merit is I have the
municipality of Marco Island that has not fluoridated the water, and
I've gotten a lot of feedback from people that they are happy with
that. And, you know, I won't go into a big long speech. So I don't
want to go out of order if somebody else has the light or wants to
second the motion. I'm a big supporter of voting now, and not
because we're doing a knee jerk, but because I think we all have done
our due diligence, and I couldn't agree more with Commissioner
Kowal that we have to be consistent. We can't be voting for
sanctuary counties and rights and things like this and then find
something else and put it in a different box.
And I just made a couple of notes here. And I apologize if I'm
out of order, but I can't see the lights and whose got their hands
raised, but I heard a lot of informed consent, but I actually wrote
down the word "choice." I'm for choice. And so if
somebody -- you know, I don't want to bring back, you know,
COVID, but if somebody thinks the COVID vaccine is the greatest
thing in the world, go get it. None of us are handcuffing you. If
somebody wants to flavor their water, go flavor it.
There are ways to get fluoride of different levels. There are
rinses, and toothpaste has fluoride. Yes, not of the levels. And I do
know a little bit of the science, but I couldn't agree more with
Commissioner Kowal. And if I'm out of order to second the motion,
then I'll silence. But I'm -- I always think it's a very strong statement
regardless of how many noses we have for the commissioners, that
when you have a full room of people and we've heard from
everybody, that they go to lunch knowing what the vote is.
And I would second that motion if that's not out of line. If it is,
February 13, 2024
Page 117
then you already know what my vote's going to be.
CHAIRMAN HALL: So we have a motion and a second.
Commissioner McDaniel.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Yeah, and you are out of
order, just so you know.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Just to -- and I'm -- I was
going to second the motion as well.
And, you know, Ms. Katie, you spoke earlier -- I think her name
is Katie. That's correct. You spoke earlier about being scared about
being in agreement with my friend Alfie. I am equally as concerned
about being in agreement with you.
I think, in all sincerity, that if there is a health issue with regard
to our children, that it is incumbent upon us to make sure that that is
tended in a manner and form that it can be tended and needs to be
addressed. It is critical that our children receive the highest level of
care, especially with regard to dental care that is, in fact, possible.
But I am also in agreement that fluoridation should be removed from
our water system, and I would like for us, as a Board, moving -- this
is a secondary comment to the support of the motion and
second -- out-of-order second.
But to move forward with exploration and a direct support for
the dental health, especially for our challenged communities and our
children.
And I was joking about not agreeing with you, Katie.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Is there any other comments --
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Were you joking about my
being out of order? I just would like clarification.
CHAIRMAN HALL: No, he was not.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: By no means, sir. You were
out of order.
February 13, 2024
Page 118
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Unbelievable.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner Saunders?
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Wait a second. Mr. Troy
just told me he has the mute on you, so be careful. I'm right by him.
Go ahead, sir.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
You know, it's impossible for me to really know what is the
right answer or the wrong answer to this. I spoke to folks yesterday,
and I was pretty convinced that keeping fluoride in the water made
sense based on the very little opportunity I had to do some research
on it. You go to the European countries, and most of the countries
that were identified have fairly high levels of fluoride in their
background water.
So they're taking fluoride out of the water because there's too
much fluoride in the water to begin with. And so I'm not persuaded
by what has occurred in Europe, particularly. I'm certainly not
persuaded as to what has is occurred in China. They don't have
fluoride in the water, but that's irrelevant as far as I'm concerned.
What is relevant is whether or not there are any negative side
effects from having fluoride in the water, and there's apparently
evidence both ways. And so, you know, who knows what the right
answer is. I tend to try to err on the side of caution. If I'm confused
as to what the right answer is, I always try to perhaps go to what is
the cautious approach. And I'm -- I'm semi convinced at this point,
based on what I've been told, that fluoride in the water can cause
some problems. Now, I didn't feel that way yesterday, and I know
even saying that is disappointing to some folks that I spoke to
yesterday.
So I have to say right now I don't know what the right answer is.
I know this motion's going to pass, but I'm going to want to take just
February 13, 2024
Page 119
a slightly different approach and ask the Board for some
consideration on this. We've heard all the public comment. We
don't have to hear any more public comment on this. I'd like to have
two weeks to do a lot of research myself.
Now, I have -- I didn't have a great opportunity to do research as
this was added to -- when this was put on the agenda. I didn't realize
it was coming until a few days ago or about a week ago now. That
may not be a very popular thing, but I think it would be very
important for all five of us to do what Commissioner LoCastro says
frequently, do a deep dive into some of the data and make a decision
based on what we believe to be based on facts.
So I'm going to ask that to see if we can -- not have any more
public comment but have two weeks on the vote. Vote -- just bring
it up at a time-certain and vote on it, but give me an opportunity to do
a little bit of -- a little bit more research on this, because I've not had
that full opportunity.
CHAIRMAN HALL: I can certainly understand the ask;
however, I have had the opportunity. I've had a lot of opportunity,
and I've dug into it extensively. And there's really no right and no
wrong here other than, you know, you've got kids who have been
fluoridated all our lives, and you say it protects their teeth, but they're
lined up to get teeth fixed.
And then you have the chance to where fluoride could cause this
and could cause that, and there's documentation for that.
I'm all for removing it and giving people the choice to add the
fluoride that they want to, and the ones that don't, don't have it
pushed upon them. So it's all about health freedom and limited
government, and I'm all about it. So we have a motion, and we have
a second.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Mr. Chairman, just one
quick comment. Then this afternoon I'm going to err on the side of
February 13, 2024
Page 120
caution. I'm going to support the motion. But I can't say I feel
particularly good about it because I just don't know what the data
really, really shows. But being cautious, I'll err on the side of
caution.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Chairman?
CHAIRMAN HALL: Yes.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Could I -- I'd just like to -- my
original motion, the way I explained it, still stands. And, like I said,
I didn't want to put my fellow commissioners up here in a position
today they had to make some sort of scientifical or medical decision
about the research, who's right or wrong. I wanted them to look at
the face value of what this is and if it is, you know, medically treating
our citizens and violating our own rules.
So that basis still stands, and that's where my motion is, but I
would like -- Commissioner McDaniel make a good point there. I
would also add onto the motion that we invite our health community,
our dental community, and even maybe members from the school
board and have some sort of breakout session with them on how we
can get more information out to these communities that may be less
served through the schools, through other means or, you know,
somehow let's brainstorm together and work -- work together for the
common-sense solution but short of medicating our citizens without
their permission and violating our very own law.
So I'd like to add that to the motion, if possible, if that's
something we can do in some sort of breakout, invite people from the
health community and the dental community and have some
representative from the Collier County Schools and even if any of the
charter schools or any of these other private schools want to send a
representative in, and we can brainstorm how we can get this
information out to -- you know, to better serve the children. So I
February 13, 2024
Page 121
want to add that, kind of, to my motion, if that's possible.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Does the out-of-order second
say okay? Commissioner --
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: I think that's a great idea.
And I actually don't think we need to add it to the motion. We can
do that anytime, I think. Maybe it is more appropriate if it's
something we vote on. But, yes, the out-of-order second would
agree with that wholeheartedly.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Absolutely. And if -- if
we're -- I see our County Manager, you know, hurriedly making
notes. Healthcare Network is an organization we want to involve
there. They're one of the -- they're primarily the healthcare provider
for our more challenged communities, so add them to that list.
And, Commissioner Saunders, I'm going to say this to you,
because I wasn't in support of moving this off for a couple of weeks
to allow us. You and I were faced with this decision early when we
came into office, I think 2016/2017, right when we first came into
office, and I supported the fluoridation then. Based upon what I've
learned, based upon what I've been able to study, based upon the
thought processes that we -- that we have in front of us with regard to
the choice, I don't support it any longer. I believe there are
methodologies for fluoridation to come about that can be garnered.
I've also supported for personal choice between the individual and
their healthcare provider all along, and I'm going to continue to do
that. So with that...
CHAIRMAN HALL: All right. We have a motion, and we
have a second. All in favor of removing the fluoride in the water,
say aye.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Aye.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
February 13, 2024
Page 122
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Aye.
CHAIRMAN HALL: All opposed?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN HALL: Motion carries. With that --
(Applause.)
CHAIRMAN HALL: I do -- I do want to commend every
public speaker for doing an amazing job. Thank you for making it
easy on us.
We'll adjourn for lunch, and let's come back at 2 o'clock.
(A luncheon recess was had from 12:52 p.m. to 2:00 p.m.)
MS. PATTERSON: Chair, you have a live mic.
CHAIRMAN HALL: All right, County Manager.
Item #10B
COMMISSIONER MCDANIEL’S REQUEST FOR RECONSIDERATION
OF A MOTION BY COMMISSIONER LOCASTRO TO CONSIDER THE
MCDOWELL HOUSING PARTNERS - EKOS ON COLLIER
APPLICATION FOR WORKFORCE HOUSING LAND ACQUISITION
SURTAX FUNDING, MADE DURING DISCUSSION OF ITEM 11B AT
THE JANUARY 23, 2024, BCC MEETING. (ALL DISTRICTS) - MOTION
TO APPROVE BY COMMISSIONER MCDANIEL; SECONDED BY
COMMISSIONER HALL – APPROVED (COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS
OPPOSED)
MS. PATTERSON: Commissioners, that brings us to
Item 10B. This is Commissioner McDaniel's request for
reconsideration of a motion by Commissioner LoCastro to consider
the McDowell Housing Partners - Ekos on Collier application for
workforce housing land acquisition surtax funding made during
discussion of Item 11B at the January 23rd, 2024, BCC meeting.
February 13, 2024
Page 123
Just a reminder, this is just the item to consider the
reconsideration. Should there be support for that, it would come
back for full discussion at a future agenda.
With that, Chair, Commissioner McDaniel.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Yes. And I'll be very brief.
This has -- this has nothing to do with the necessity for housing
affordability by any stretch of the imagination.
I have received new information that I didn't feel was brought
out as prevalent as it could have been or should have been during the
actual hearing. There are questions about zoning on the actual site.
There are questions with regard to the surface water discharge and
the proximity of the site to the Henderson Creek water body, and then
there are -- I want to have further discussions about the overall
structure of the transaction between McDowell and Collier County,
and that's my rationale for asking for this.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Any questions?
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: So with that, I'll make a
motion for -- am I allowed to make a motion for my own request?
MR. KLATZKOW: Sure.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: I'm going to talk out of order
again. Commissioner LoCastro here.
I just want to say I fully support what Commissioner McDaniel's
bringing forward. You know, nobody wants to knee jerk or ramrod
any projects. You know, we often get accused of rubber stamping
things. That's not the case.
You know, I believe we do our due diligence, and if there's
something that was missed, something that ever comes to any
commissioner, it doesn't matter whose district it's in. How many
times have we all said, we all vote on everything in every district.
So I don't know what specifics have come to Commissioner
McDaniel's attention, but I welcome hearing it. I'm sure we all do.
February 13, 2024
Page 124
So I'm not here to make a long speech to have him laundry list
what the issues are. If his motion is to take more time, relook at
something or, you know, however he's going to phrase it, I welcome
it so that we can make sure we get the best project on that site or
not -- or not. Maybe that's not the best site. I know it's been kicked
around for a while. So I have no objection about any of that. I
welcome it.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Is there anybody here from
Ekos or --
MR. MILLER: Well, I have two registered public commenters.
I don't know if they're affiliated with that or not.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Well, Mr. Chairman, I'd like
to hear from the folks with Ekos to see what kind of an impact this
type of delay will have. Because we're not talking about a two-week
delay. We're talking probably about a month, I would assume. This
would not come up at the next meeting. I think it has to come up
within the next couple of meetings. And so I want to make sure that
they have an opportunity to express what their concerns would be.
MR. SHEAR: Good afternoon, Chris Shear with McDowell
Housing Partners, the sponsor developer of Ekos on Collier. Good
afternoon, Chair, Commissioners.
The question as to whether or not this would impact funding, we
do have a preliminary funding award from Florida Housing in front
of us for a significant amount of the remaining gap financing. The
county's funding was the last piece of gap financing that really
allowed this project to move forward from the economic viability
perspective.
It would be difficult for us to accept that invitation if the project
is still unapproved by the county, because what we do is put
ourselves in a dangerous business position, because if we don't close
February 13, 2024
Page 125
on the development with the state, which wouldn't be viable without
the county's funding, we would end up having to have punitive
measures tallied against us where our business model, effectively,
would be disrupted. We wouldn't have the ability to apply for
Florida Housing funds for another year.
So there is a concern on that end. And I think the
commissioner's concerns are all valid. They're all things that we
deal with on a regular basis throughout the development process, and
we could certainly address those in detail.
It's not unusual to address questions that come up from
commissioners or from their staff or from county staff on a routine
basis as things come up in due diligence.
We do have a development agreement ahead of us. We do have
a land lease ahead of us. The county is not making the investment in
the property to actually acquire the property until it's satisfied, and so
our assumption was this was an approval to move forward on the
development agreement and that the development agreement would
have some measure of feasibility within it to ensure that the county's
not investing and actually expending dollars until all of these
concerns are fully satisfied. Thank you.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: So are you suggesting
then -- because I think what you're saying is that if we stay the
course, we don't do the reconsideration, that there are opportunities
for all of these issues to be addressed to the satisfaction of this board
during the process of developing the various agreements.
MR. SHEAR: Yes, sir, exactly.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Commissioner McDaniel,
would that satisfy your concerns?
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: No, sir.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Could I ask Mr. Bosi or
somebody from our community development? I'm not sure if that
February 13, 2024
Page 126
would be Jamie French or Mr. Bosi or -- I guess I'm trying to,
perhaps, understand what the concerns would be that we couldn't
address going forward, assuming we don't do the reconsideration.
Are you familiar with what the concerns would be or --
MR. BOSI: In terms of the specifics that Commissioner
McDaniel just highlighted, one was the zoning. The majority of the
property is zoned C-3. It's clearly eligible for exercising of Live
Local. There's like a point, I think, 6-acre mobile home which
would not be eligible for Live Local. They have submitted a zoning
verification letter of how they could utilize that property in
relationship to the C-3 property. I think we've satisfied those
requirements and those issues.
As for the discharge into Hendry Creek, the stormwater issues, I
would turn maybe to Mr. French to be able to kind of address that.
MR. FRENCH: Thank you, Commissioner. For the record,
Jamie French, your department head for Growth Management.
We have had numerous conversations with the property owner,
now McDowell Partners, the applicant that came forward. There are
numerous concerns with regards to the mangroves, the restoration,
water quality, and the discharge to that -- to that -- it is a critical
water body that eventually flows down into Rookery Bay, and, you
know, just, even today, in speaking with Chris and speaking with
Jaime Cook, kind of going over their preliminary plans.
We have not seen anything to date on how they're going to
address that. As Mike said, that there are some zoning restrictions
with regards to that property along the water body outside of the C-3.
But the C-3, in and of itself, would qualify for Live Local. We just
have not gotten there yet.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Okay. So if we don't
reconsider this, will there be opportunities, from your perspective, to
address those concerns about flows of water into the Henderson
February 13, 2024
Page 127
Creek?
MR. FRENCH: Sir, Live Local -- to answer your question, yes.
We are going to have to address these no matter what. No matter
what action is taken by this board, they're still going to have to meet
the conditions of both the state and of your Land Development Code.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: So I guess this is a comment
for Commissioner McDaniel. If we vote to reconsider this, the item
comes back on the original decision to go forward with the purchase.
Our only options at that point are to negate what we did or just
continue forward. And I don't know that I'd be prepared to negate
what we did based on the fact that we have opportunities to address
all of these concerns going forward anyway. So I won't be able to
support the reconsideration.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: You're entitled to not
support.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I don't know that it gets us
where we need to be, because at that point all we can do is either say
yay or nay to the acquisition.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I understand.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner LoCastro.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: The question I just had is I
think we all agree there's unanswered questions. I guess I want to
just go back to the question of timing. If all the questions can be
answered to Commissioner McDaniel's satisfaction and we don't have
to do a reconsideration, that's great but, you know, nobody wants to
have a rush to judgment and skip some steps.
So I guess my question is -- it's probably for Chris from, you
know, the company, or Mr. Bosi or Jamie French -- the things that are
unknown, can we do them on a timeline and be within the proper
time to not have the company penalized if there's some sort of wiggle
in a different direction? I mean, there's always a chance for some
February 13, 2024
Page 128
sort of discovery that brings a project to a halt. There's always risk.
But as you said, there's known things we haven't worked out yet.
Is the question of timing feasible, or if we agree with
Commissioner McDaniel, we've just put a whole bunch of risk now
on the company, which I'm not saying is good or bad. It's just I want
to know if it's known that timing is -- would be a monumental
difference if we -- if we agreed with, you know, Commissioner
McDaniel's concerns and to, you know, slow the process, more
questions. Can anybody talk eloquently on that? That would be my
main concern.
MR. SHEAR: May I address it?
CHAIRMAN HALL: Yes.
MR. SHEAR: Hi. For the record, Chris Shear.
The site development permit, the site development review
process covers all of those measures in regards to the various
agencies who oversee the stormwater management systems, who
oversee the environmental regulation, who oversee the Land
Development Code. So all of that is done through the site
development process and site development permit. That process
does take time. There's multiple iterations of site plans. There's a
lot of engineering and professional architecture engineering that goes
into getting that site plan to a point where we ultimately get it
approved, and that's a lot of staff involvement and a lot of due
diligence that goes into it. That is a long process.
My presumption was that the county would not close on the land
until that point of having that site plan approved regardless. So the
risk, again, would be mitigated in ultimately investing in this property
if we fail to be able to demonstrate site plan approval through all of
the local county development code as well as all the agencies that
govern the site, including DEP, FDOT, et cetera.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner McDaniel.
February 13, 2024
Page 129
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I'm not asking to delay this
development for an extended period of time. I don't see any reason
why we can't come back and address these concerns at our next
meeting, which is two weeks. If for nothing else, I want you on
record to be saying what you are and are not going to be able to do.
I want to talk about -- specifically about the structure of the
transaction. I've already stated why I want to have this
reconsideration. So I'm only talking about bringing this back for a
discussion so that I can become comfortable with the decision to
make the acquisition at all.
MR. SHEAR: And, Commissioner, the fear is that two weeks
is just not enough time for us to go through and finalize a final plan
or have it approved by the various agencies and departments that
approve that. If that's the -- kind of the bright line for us to move
this deal forward for acquisition, we won't have time to sufficiently
address that in the two-week period. We certainly have time to
address that prior to the county making an investment in the property.
CHAIRMAN HALL: I think -- I think what Commissioner
McDaniel's just saying is he wants to bring back and get some
questions answered. He's not expecting you to have answers but
expecting you to have a plan towards those answers. And I'm sitting
here torn. You know, I think if two weeks' time was going to kill
this deal and kill your financing options, then, you know, it would be
a lot more difficult of a decision.
But in treating others, especially these colleagues, like I would
want to be treated if I -- if I came back and I had some legitimate
concerns and I wanted to talk about it after changing my mind, I
would want that freedom, and I would want that privilege. And he
obviously feels strongly enough about it.
I don't think in any way that we're going to change our mind
about McDowell having surtax funds. I think it's just a matter of us
February 13, 2024
Page 130
getting more comfortable, Commissioner McDaniel getting more
comfortable with those decisions with staff and some more
infirmities [sic] that may -- you know, maybe not -- the finalities or
not, but just -- just something more structured. I'm trying to
communicate for him. Just so that he's more comfortable with the
decision that he's making.
Jamie, I can see you blowing up.
MR. FRENCH: Thank you, Commissioner.
The only clarification that I'd like to offer is just so the Board is
clear, we're -- on a Site Development Plan like this with the
environmental concerns that this has, we're going to have to -- it's
going to be required to go through the ERP process. We're six
months to a year before we have an approved Site Development Plan.
I understand -- I think, Commissioner, what you're saying is that
this is more so about the financing of the acquisition of the property,
not so much as coming back and looking at what this might look like
as an approved Site Development Plan, unless I'm incorrect.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: It's all of that. It has to -- I
don't -- there again, my intent here is to not squirrel McDowell's
capacity to be able to fund the project.
MR. FRENCH: Sure.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: It's my support with regard to
the county acquiring the land. And I understand that the county will
only acquire the land if and when all of the regulatory approvals are
in place. It's just we didn't spend an enormous amount of time on
those things. And, again, I wasn't -- I've shared with you there are
issues with the zoning that I want specifically addressed on the
record. There are issues with the ecology of the entire area and the
runoff and then the entire structure of the transaction that I want to be
specified before I continue to support this. That's the reason for the
reconsideration.
February 13, 2024
Page 131
And I think -- I think we can get there. Now, I don't have to
have specific what's the height of the risers and the runoff boards
before -- before outfall, in fact, transpires. I don't have to have that
in order to be comfortable. I just -- I would like to have those things
addressed publicly in advance so that the community can be assured
that negative impacts are not as prevalent as what's being portrayed.
MR. SHEAR: Understood.
CHAIRMAN HALL: I'll second the motion. Have we got any
other -- we do have public comment.
MR. MILLER: Yeah. I have two registered names. I don't
know if either one of the gentlemen are here. Johnny Johnson and
John Nay?
(No response.)
MR. MILLER: No, I don't see either one of them here, sir.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Johnny Johnson was one of
the previous speakers.
MR. MILLER: I know, and I had a slip for that, but I have a
slip for this item as well.
(Simultaneous crosstalk.)
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: There's a different one --
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Oh, it's a different Johnny
Johnson? Okay.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: May I ask a question?
CHAIRMAN HALL: Sure.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: If we do vote to move this down
the road, are we going to have a specific date?
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I wouldn't mind -- again, I
wouldn't mind hearing it in two weeks or, at most, a month, at our
first meeting in March. My thought processes are not that
complicated that -- again, I don't have to have specifics. I just want
on-record statements made validating the concerns that have been
February 13, 2024
Page 132
raised to me.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: So if we do agree to, say, two
weeks from now, Chris, is that -- I mean, where does that put you?
MR. SHEAR: We would move quickly to get with staff on
more of the specific questions so we can address that most directly
with our engineers as well because they certainly have more technical
knowledge than I do on some of these questions, and we'd want to
come back as quickly as possible simply because we have another
funding commitment that we're going to have to make a business
decision on, and this funding is critically important to ultimately
making that larger decision. So we would respectfully ask, if this is
voted to reconsider, that we come back as quickly as possible.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: And can I ask the County
Manager about that time? I mean, she's the one that's pushing the
buttons with our clock. Do we -- can we do that?
MS. PATTERSON: So, Commissioners, if we're looking to
bring this item back in order to have this conversation to then inform
future decision-making -- which is my takeaway, is some of the
questions that you have are not going to be able to necessarily be
answered but they need to be put out there so that they are taken into
consideration as this project potentially moves forward?
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Correct.
MS. PATTERSON: So for specifically things about
stormwater, you know, I would view as that needs to be a dialogue so
that it will inform some of the decision-making that ultimately is
made relative to the site.
We'll bring it back in two weeks understanding that we won't
have engineering answers and things like that, but we will be able to
have an informed conversation about information that's come to light,
and that will also help the applicant.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: That's -- I'm fine with that.
February 13, 2024
Page 133
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner LoCastro?
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Yes. Mr. Chairman, thank
you.
I was just really going to echo the same thing. Chris, you guys
are professionals. You know, we've just cut a ribbon on an amazing
complex on Santa Barbara. Have a sense of urgency, which you
already do. The staff is at your disposal.
Two weeks, you know, should be ample time, and if it's not,
then it means, you know, Commissioner McDaniel and maybe even
more of us aren't getting the answers that we require. But, you
know -- and you've already echoed saying you do want to come back
as soon as possible. You don't want to wait a month. So then let's,
you know, make sure that we give you every access to the staff, and
you have a sense of urgency. This is a big project. We want it to be
right. We want all the commissioners to be comfortable with it, and
if there's, you know, some unknown things or unanswered questions,
you echoed it and said two weeks means we've got to kick it in gear,
but it is ample, and it doesn't throw us into some sort of tailspin
where we're, you know, losing money or being penalized in some
way.
So I think we're all answering our own question. See you in
two weeks would be -- would be, you know -- you know, my
statement. And it's my district, but all of us here are so focused on
affordable housing and projects that it's all of us. So I'm not falling
on my sword, you know, saying, you know, this is a bad idea. I
think this is smart. Let's just make sure we have a sense of urgency,
and it sounds like everybody's paddling in the same direction.
So I appreciate Commissioner McDaniel actually highlighting
this. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN HALL: So, Chris, is two weeks good, or would
even the first week of March -- or the first meeting in March?
February 13, 2024
Page 134
MR. SHEAR: We prefer to come back as quickly as possible.
We'll get our engineers engaged to answer questions technically,
proficiently as possible. It may not -- it certainly doesn't come with
an approval. And we'll work with staff as we typically do. And
we've got a good rapport there.
And hopefully what we bring back provides the comfort level
that allows us to move forward to the next step, again, getting into the
development agreement; that won't actually fund into this deal until
we have that final stamp-approved site plan.
So we'll do our best to get you answers as cleanly and as
proficiently as possible within two weeks.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Thank you.
I'm going to vote against the motion to reconsider because all of
the issues that can be raised on reconsideration are going to have to
be addressed by the developer through staff and brought back to us.
If we're not satisfied with those answers, then we just don't go
forward with the project.
What we're going to do today is create a fire drill for these folks
to get together and put together something, which isn't going to really
answer the questions thoroughly to begin with. They've already
acknowledged that's impossible, and we're going to get to review it
anyway. So I think it's a fire drill that's a waste of time. So I'm not
going to support the motion.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner Kowal.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Thank you, Chair.
I think what Commissioner McDaniel is trying to do -- I'm just
thinking for myself what I think you're trying to do is basically get
these concerns on record, because I think we initially -- we voted on
this two weeks ago, which I don't know if two weeks ago was the
drop-dead time. You got it approved two weeks ago. You know,
February 13, 2024
Page 135
now we're two weeks later. You know, I don't know if that was,
like, you were looking at some very fine time window at that point
that it had to be done, but I don't think you were because you -- just,
basically, luck of the draw is where you fell on the agenda, and we
got it done.
But I think he wants to get these particular questions on record
so we can make a more clear vote moving forward on the same exact
thing that we may have had, not so much solutions but -- because
certain things come up after the fact and he felt it was important
enough to bring it back up. It may be important that the citizens
know those questions [sic] before we definitively make a final
agreement.
So I think that's why. I think the two weeks, I think that falls
within the timelines of let's get these answers -- these questions out in
the open so that people are aware of them, so that they didn't come
behind, you know, closed doors, and it's out in front. Then we can
go ahead and vote again and keep the project going forward. So I
support it.
CHAIRMAN HALL: I seconded it because I want to honor his
request for more information, just like in the future if I wanted to, I'd
want the same. I certainly don't want you to leave here on eggshells
thinking the deal's -- I'm not looking to change my mind. I'm
rooting for you.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: And it was poorly described
as a fire drill. It isn't a fire drill. I have real live concerns, real live
discussion points, and I want to -- that's the reason for me asking this.
That's all.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: You know, the fire drill I'm
talking about is these folks are going to have to huddle with their
engineers and everybody, and everybody's busy, so that's why I'm
saying it's a two-week time period is pretty slim to get all the
February 13, 2024
Page 136
professionals together and get a -- even get the questions addressed
the way you want them, so that's why I'm not going to support it.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner LoCastro.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Mr. Chairman, I'm obviously
going to support it. No disrespect to Commissioner Saunders -- and
I know how he meant it, but I don't characterize it as a fire drill. I
look at it as business, and these are businessmen. And when you
have a big project, you have a sense of urgency, you've got to circle
the wagons at times.
And if they come back to us in two weeks and they weren't able
to accomplish what they needed to accomplish, then that wasn't a
good sign. So I think we put it on the agenda in two weeks. I think
we've got all professionals standing there at the podium. Yep,
they're going to -- they're going to have to, you know, circle their
professionals quickly, and that's what we're asking them to do, and
that's called business when you're, you know, building a big project.
Then we'll find out in two weeks if their circling of the wagons
brought us sufficient answers. So I have no reservations, and I
would -- you know, I would agree to the first and the second of the
motion. So I just wanted to go on record and say that.
CHAIRMAN HALL: All right. We have a motion and a
second. All in favor of kicking this forward for two weeks, say aye.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Aye.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Aye.
CHAIRMAN HALL: All opposed?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN HALL: All right. Motion carries.
Item #10C
February 13, 2024
Page 137
AN UPDATE ON THE DEVELOPMENT OF THE STATE OF
FLORIDA’S APPLICATION TO THE UNITED STATES
DEPARTMENT OF VETERANS AFFAIRS - STATE HOME
CONSTRUCTION GRANT PROGRAM TO SECURE FEDERAL
CONSTRUCTION MATCHING FUNDS FOR A STATE
VETERANS’ NURSING HOME IN COLLIER COUNTY. (ALL
DISTRICTS) – DISCUSSED
MS. PATTERSON: Commissioners, that brings us to
Item 10C. This is a recommendation to receive an update on the
development of the State of Florida's application to the United States
Department of Veterans' Affairs State Home Construction Grant
Program to secure federal construction matching funds for a State
Veterans Nursing Home in Collier County.
This item is brought to the agenda by Commissioner Saunders,
and Mr. Mullins is also here to assist with the update.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Thank you, Mr. Chairman,
members. I spent the day in Tallahassee on February 1st. We
actually had an all-day meeting with the architects and the Florida
Department of Veterans' Affairs as well as a couple of the other state
agencies that are involved in any types of projects that the state's
involved in.
And I think Mr. Mullins has a couple items that he's going to put
on the visualizer or on the screen there. But just as a way of
introduction, we're looking at 120,000-square-foot nursing home. I
think we all liked the Las Vegas plan that was submitted to us back
several months ago. And the good news is Florida Department of
Veterans' Affairs likes that type of plan. It's more compact. And
the architects are working on that type of a plan and are putting
together some pretty phenomenal stuff for that.
February 13, 2024
Page 138
The facility will have 120 beds. Everybody's agreed to that.
There was discussion about going as low as 108 beds, but we want to
have a facility that meets the needs and is financially viable, and so a
120-bed facility is where everybody landed on. Ten percent of the
rooms are going to be used for bariatric patients, so those rooms will
be a little bit bigger, and then there will be 40 to 60 beds for memory
care.
The adult daycare component will be about an
11,000-square-foot facility. That has to have a separate entrance,
separate parking area to keep these visitors separate from the folks
that are resident in the nursing home, and so they've laid out how that
would be situated with the nursing home.
They'll be able to serve somewhere between 45 to 55 or 60
patients in the adult day healthcare at a time, and that facility will be,
I think, something that will be really not only unique in a nursing
home, we'll have the only one that has that, but will be something of
great value to our veterans.
The outpatient component, the way that's going to be structured
is it will be a dual-use facility. They'll have to have separate hours
for the folks that are using the rehabilitation services that are
outpatient, so they'll have to come in at different times of the day
than the patients that are resident in the facility, but that's all been
worked out with how they would have a separate entrance for the
outpatients.
And so the design of this is really phenomenal.
Mr. Mullins, if you could put the -- well, right now this is the
Port St. Lucie design. This is the one that was way spread out, very
inefficient, the one that all of us really didn't like. And if you could
put the Vegas one up. And that's much more similar to what we'll
have here in Collier County. Much more compact, much more user
friendly, much more efficient for the folks working there.
February 13, 2024
Page 139
The architects and folks are on a very tight timeline. The goal
is that we have to have an application in by April 15th. That's
the -- certainly the desire to -- by everybody, especially our Florida
Department of Veterans' Affairs. They know that this is a very
impressive and a very important project.
While we were there, we realized that we had to change the
language that was proposed in the state budget to make it clear that
we have the outpatient facility as well as the $10 million to match our
$10 million for the outpatient facility. So we made arrangements to
get that language changed in the proposed budget that the legislature
is looking at now.
There were going to be several more virtual meetings between
now and April 15th to get this done, but everybody's 100 percent
confident that the budget works based on the amount of money that
the county's putting in and the 65 percent share from the federal
government. Everybody's confident that they've got a good financial
plan, a good layout, and they're very confident that when this gets to
Washington, that there will be -- it will be very positively received.
I will tell you that Texas is another state that is a high-need state,
just like Florida, and so we're in competition with other states, and
hopefully our plan will be one that stands out and one that ultimately
gets funded. But there's always that potential with other competition
that there may be some delay in that regard.
I will also say one other thing before -- I'm not sure if John has
some comments. But I had suggested two things to the group, and
the Florida Department of Veterans' Affairs agreed to these. One
was that once we get the general application in and it's approved by
the federal Department of Veterans' Affairs, there's no money
available for architectural work, design work until the federal money
actually is approved by Congress.
I suggested to the Florida Department of Veterans' Affairs that
February 13, 2024
Page 140
they go through the procurement process to select architects and
select engineers with the understanding that there isn't federal
funding, so that will save four or five months during the procurement
process while they're waiting for federal funding. So that shaves off
some time.
There's also some potential, and this is something that the
Commission will have to consider but one that I had suggested as a
possibility, and that is having the funds that we have on -- in escrow
in Tallahassee, the $30 million that we have there, being able to use
some of those funds in advance of the federal funding. Once our
project is approved by the federal Department of Veterans' Affairs,
use some of our funds to actually fund the initial design work.
Again, that would save a substantial amount of time. Those are
policy issues that we have to discuss.
But the project is moving along. Everybody's really confident
about this. I was really impressed with the team that's been put
together. John Mullins was on the call the entire day. Brian
DeLony was on the call the entire day. There were questions
concerning the entrance road and things of that nature. Everything
got worked out. And so I just wanted to update the Board that this is
moving along in a very positive way.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Thanks, Commissioner.
Commissioner McDaniel.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Mr. Mullins, do you have
anything to say before I ask a couple questions?
MR. MULLINS: John Mullins, your director of
Communications, Government and Public Affairs. And I think
Commissioner Saunders covered everything, but I'm happy to answer
any questions.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Well, my questions, as much
as anything, are to Commissioner Saunders as anything. When we
February 13, 2024
Page 141
were in Tallahassee in December, there was a discussion about a
potential budget appropriation this session. Is that moving forward
well?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Yes. That's the -- we had to
change the language to make it clear that there was going to be an
adult day healthcare facility and $10 million state appropriation to
match ours. That language is now in the budget.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Outstanding. I heard
you -- I didn't want to say glaze over that, but I just wanted -- I heard
that, okay.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Yeah. I try not to glaze
over $10 million.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Thank you, sir.
In our early discussions with the Veterans' Administration, there
was some discussion about the necessity for coverage of the O&M
from the Veterans' Administration based upon the depository for the
Veterans' Administration and the amount of patients that they have in
other facilities. And was that addressed with regard because -- with
regard to this project? Was there capacity to be able to fund up the
O&M, the operations and maintenance, out of the trust fund?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Yeah. We did not get into a
discussion of operations and maintenance once the project's
completed. There was a lot of good news, though, from the
Department of Veterans' Affairs. All of their facilities in Florida are
now 95 percent or more occupied.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Yes.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: They've had no real
problems going forward with staffing, and they certainly haven't had
any problems with finding patients. So they're confident that with
our facility, it will fill up very quickly, but we did not get into a
discussion of --
February 13, 2024
Page 142
MR. MULLINS: And actually, Commissioner, I can shed a
little bit more light on that. That actual VA checklist which you
have to satisfy as part of the application process and due April 15th
are two items, the financial plan for the state facility's first three years
of operation and the state official certification of the number of
state-operated nursing home and domiciliary beds and occupancy
rate. So FDVA will have to put together all of those items to submit
with the application by April 15th, and they said they would have
absolutely no issue in doing so.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: All right. And -- perfect.
That's a great answer.
I mean, four years ago, Commissioner Saunders, five years ago,
that was a topic of discussion of this even coming to fruition, and we
had had some discussions and I wanted to bring it up now to have a
look at -- I know we're squeezing our coffers every time we come
around the corner, but there was -- back in those days, there was
discussion about the county actually even putting up some of that
money to offset the potential exposure on the treasury for the
Veterans' Administration. And if that was requisite, I wanted to
have that discussion now and share that I'm in complete support of
that if it's necessary because of just how important this is to our
community, so...
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Well, hopefully that won't be
necessary.
I will say that I was advised by the Department that they do have
a fairly substantial trust fund, and they want this project to go.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Okay. Good.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: So I would not hesitate to
encourage them to use some of that trust fund, and I think they will.
So I don't think we're going to have a problem with that.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Okay. Great. That's all I
February 13, 2024
Page 143
had. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Thanks, Mr. Mullins.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Thank you, Commissioner
Saunders, for all your hard work on this.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: (Nods head.)
Item #11C
RESOLUTION 2024-28: RESOLUTION SCHEDULING A
PUBLIC HEARING TO CONSIDER VACATING THE 10-FOOT-
WIDE PUBLIC ROAD RIGHT-OF-WAY EASEMENT OVER THE
WESTERLY 10 FEET OF TRACT A-1, AS DESCRIBED IN
OFFICIAL RECORD BOOK 1476, PAGE 242, OF THE PUBLIC
RECORDS OF COLLIER COUNTY, FLORIDA, LOCATED
APPROXIMATELY 2,000 FEET SOUTH OF IMMOKALEE ROAD
(CR-846) AND 1,000 FEET WEST OF RICHARDS STREET IN
SECTION 25, TOWNSHIP 48 SOUTH, RANGE 26 EAST,
COLLIER COUNTY, FLORIDA. (PL20230007642)
(COMMISSIONERS SAUNDERS’ AND MCDANIEL’S
SEPARATE REQUESTS) - MOTION TO APPROVE BY
COMMISSIONER MCDANIEL; SECONDED BY
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS - ADOPTED
MS. PATTERSON: Commissioners, that brings us to
Item 15 -- oh, no, I'm sorry. That's Item 11C, formerly 16A4. I
tried to rush us through the end of this.
This item is brought to the agenda by Commissioner Saunders'
and Commissioner McDaniel's separate requests. This is a
recommendation to adopt a resolution scheduling a public hearing to
consider vacating the 10-foot-wide public road right-of-way
easement over the westerly 10 feet of Tract A-1 as described in
February 13, 2024
Page 144
Official Record Book 1476, Page 242, of the public records of Collier
County, Florida, located approximately 2,000 feet south of
Immokalee Road and 1,000 feet west of Richards Street in Section
25, Township 48 South, Range 26 East, Collier County, Florida.
Ms. Jaime Cook, your director of Development Review, is here
to answer questions or present.
MS. COOK: Good afternoon, Commissioners. Jaime Cook,
your director of Development Review.
So the item before you today that was on the consent agenda is
simply the request to advertise for the vacation. The actual vacation
would be brought forward with the companion proposed GMP
amendments as well as PUD rezone.
The area that you can see on the aerial to the right circled in red
is the 10-foot easement, and shown on the proposed master plan, that
same area is highlighted in yellow. This access easement was never
accepted by the county. It's never been maintained by the county,
and it simply is to provide access to those two landlocked parcels in
the middle of the proposed development.
So with that, Mike and I are both available to answer any
questions you may have.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner McDaniel.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Well -- and I'm satisfied now
that I've learned -- I asked this to be pulled, but I'm satisfied to allow
this to go forward for advertisement. Because one of my concerns
and rationale for pulling it was I didn't see the whole picture. I didn't
see access and ingress and egress and all that -- all those sort of
things, and I understand now that that will come back to us with the
entire PUD before we grant the vacation. So I'm okay with
that -- I'm okay with this agenda item moving forward.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Thank you. And I had the
February 13, 2024
Page 145
same concern. I just wanted to make sure, and you've addressed
this, that when this vacation comes back, it's an item that's heard right
after the rezone; because if there's no rezone, there's no need to
vacate the easement. But I just want to make sure it's held at the
same time.
MS. COOK: Correct, yes. And we've actually scheduled it so
that it would be part of the public hearing for the GMP and PUD.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Thank you.
MS. COOK: You're welcome.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Do you want to move for
approval, or do you want me to? I'll move for approval. Let's get
this on.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I'll second it then.
CHAIRMAN HALL: All right.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: See, we're working together
as a team now.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Oh, yes, that's it.
CHAIRMAN HALL: I like it. And you're both in line.
All in favor, say aye.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: (No verbal response.)
CHAIRMAN HALL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Aye.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Motion carries.
MS. COOK: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: You might not have heard
me. I said "aye."
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: LoCastro was on delay.
MS. PATTERSON: Commissioners, that brings us to Item 15,
staff and commission general communications.
February 13, 2024
Page 146
Item #15A
PUBLIC COMMENTS ON GENERAL TOPICS NOT ON THE
CURRENT OR FUTURE AGENDA BY INDIVIDUALS NOT
ALREADY HEARD DURING PREVIOUS PUBLIC COMMENTS
IN THIS MEETING
Item 15A is public comments on general topics not on the
current or future agenda by individuals not already heard during
previous public comments in this meeting.
MR. MILLER: We have no one registered at this time.
Item #15B
STAFF PROJECT UPDATES
MS. PATTERSON: Item 15B is staff project updates. At the
Board's pleasure, we do have Mr. Summers here just to give a brief
update on communication plans. This is a follow-up to the
discussion that we had after the issues that we had with the utilities
and the water outage.
MR. SUMMERS: Commissioners, good afternoon. For the
record, Dan Summers, director of Emergency Management for
Collier County.
And I just wanted to let you know we've had a -- continue to
enjoy a great dialogue with Dr. Yilmaz and his team associated with
the outage.
And as an opportunity to kind of hot wash and review that
situation, certainly his team had some very unique challenges not
only with restoration but the subsequent outages that were down
range of that event.
February 13, 2024
Page 147
And what I wanted to bring to you today is to let you know that
Dr. Yilmaz and his team and our alert notification team, what we
want to do, we're going down the road of planning for some
thresholds that might be appropriate to activate the Alert Collier
notification for.
When some of these things may, in fact, be short duration or we
may -- may or may not have a geographical boundary, those are some
things that we certainly have to consider. In retrospect, I'll tell you
I'm kind of glad that we did not activate Alert Collier, because when
we had the down-range subsequent breaks, we would have generated
an enormous amount of confusion, not that it wasn't confusing at that
particular moment.
So when you have a cascading event like that, that messaging
has to be done right and I think would have certainly been
challenging in the Alert Collier world because there is some
bleedover.
So let me just show you what goes into our process a little bit
and, again, we'll come back with Dr. Yilmaz's teams and kind of
revise or make sure we have some thresholds identified.
So the first part of this, just to let you know what our business
process is, we have to build a sample template for each notification.
Now, we've done templates already for things like wildfire and severe
weather and those type of things, and we have a general format for
the water outage. But in this case, we're going to use the North
Collier event as kind of a new planning template for our plan and
process.
We have to refine that geographical boundary. That's real
important. And if you'll recall, when I mentioned the alert
notification last time, this is to a cell phone device. It is only as
accurate as the software and the algorithm that the cell provider
provides to us. So there is bleed. So, you know, folks might say,
February 13, 2024
Page 148
well, I'm on the east side of the road and the outage is for the west
side of the road; those things are going to occur.
We have to also decide on our delivery method. We can send
short text. We can also get into the federal system, so to speak, and
do a large notification, as well as voice.
What is really important here is to continue to remind our
residents to subscribe to Alert Collier, okay. Right now the state has
funded what we call the Whitepages, resident connect, so they have
millions of phone numbers that they have already paid for. That is
on a year-to-year subscription basis that the state covers.
Right now I have everyone's white pages, if you will, until the
end of this calendar year, and the Division of Emergency
Management continues to plan on funding that in the future, and they
usually charge that off as a hurricane expense. Heaven forbid, if we
have another hurricane this year, it's part of their doing business.
And, statutorily, they're required to have a mass notification system.
From that process, we also look at any demographics associated.
For example, we've done lost child -- lost children in Immokalee.
We've also used Google Translate to try to get that language barrier
addressed. Then we go through a two-step validation process. This
is all done within just a couple of minutes. We launch that message.
This Alert Collier is so powerful that we actually have to throttle it.
We could overwhelm the local phone system, even a local PBX.
So there is time spread out to throttle these messages. We don't
want to impact the rest of the phone system in the community.
We do get real-time dashboard reports as to who acknowledged
that particular call, and we do cut off the number of calls. So, you
know, we may try three times in a 15-minute period, but that's it.
And we typically don't continue to hammer that phone number.
We also want to make sure that we don't cross municipal
boundaries. While all three municipalities are on board with us, they
February 13, 2024
Page 149
do ask that we make sure we check with them first because they
do -- some of these folks do -- municipalities still maintain their code
red, but we don't want -- which is another mass notification system
that is -- that have to subscribe to and pay for, but we make sure we
coordinate with the municipalities if there are any borderline
situations.
And then, finally, when you activate Alert Collier, phones are
going to ring. Folks, even though there's a seven-digit number and
there's a place to go for more information, there's that first instinct to
either dial 911 or 311. So when we do something like that, we want
to make sure that we've got the services ready behind it to answer any
questions that come back.
So, again, it is a -- it is a process that we have learned over the
years. It's one thing to launch it; it's another thing to receive it; and
another process to make sure that our residents get the information
that they want.
And then, finally, we've also learned a little bit from the wildfire
events, that we also want to transmit an all clear. And so, again,
these are part of the processes that we'll go through.
But we'll continue evaluation with Dr. Yilmaz and his team for
thresholds. We have done this before on behalf of Marco Island for
a scheduled utility outage. So we know how to do it, and this
particular event I think we need to set some thresholds for the length
of the outage and the impact of the outage. Work in progress.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Thanks, Dan.
Commissioner McDaniel.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Yes. And this is -- thank
you for this information, but my question is, is -- there a -- is there a
need to use Alert Collier, or can our utility department manage this
on a more localized basis?
MR. SUMMERS: I believe Dr. Yilmaz is looking at some
February 13, 2024
Page 150
additional options within his call center resources. Probably his
would not be as fast or maybe as -- could hit as many subscribers as
we can. That may be an option for him to look at and, of course, we
still have our social media resources as well as his effort to go door to
door in certain locations.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: And I'm asking the question
because it would seem to me -- if Dr. Yilmaz can come up, maybe he
can better answer this. It would seem to me that the Alert Collier's
more of a mass notification process where you would -- you may
have overlap; people on one side of the street wouldn't be impacted
by the circumstance than the other, but they get a notice anyway and,
whereas, our utility department -- let me ask him. He's standing
behind you now.
MR. SUMMERS: Pardon me. Go ahead.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: My thought -- and I haven't
talked to Dr. George. But my thought process would be, you know
where the breach is, you know where the circumstances are, and you
know the customer base that is being impacted by this. Is there a
measure that we could assist you in to better notice of your -- the
customer base that's serviced by the utility?
DR. YILMAZ: The short answer, Commissioner, is absolutely
yes. And I'm sure everyone in this room -- there might be few
exceptions -- we all received FPL outages on our cell phones. If
anyone has experience with FPL and how they manage their
customers one on one, it doesn't matter what the size is. And we're
looking at being as good as FP&L, if not better than FP&L. We
initiated already some of the scope work.
And you're correct, Commissioner, that we want to get to the
point where hurricane or extreme emergencies then we're tapping into
our EOC.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Right. And that was my
February 13, 2024
Page 151
thought process. Natural disasters, hurricane, fire, so on and so
forth, that's Alert Collier. And it almost -- it almost seems better for
us to be managing utility outage and notification processes on a
localized basis.
MR. SUMMERS: Absolutely, I agree. And, again, I think we
have -- the Alert Collier really is designed for that fast-breaking
community emergency situation. Not that this wasn't fast-breaking,
necessarily, when that pressure changed. But, again, it is slightly
different for the utility.
So I just wanted to let you know the good news here is that we
have options. Dr. Yilmaz might build some threshold capability
with other systems and then, of course, some type of escalation or an
escalated situation, we're here to pull the trigger upon the request of
the incident commander.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Thank you.
MR. SUMMERS: Very good. Anything else,
Commissioners?
CHAIRMAN HALL: Yes. I just want to -- you said you were
glad that we didn't use the Alert Collier this time. So I'm just
wondering -- just take District 2. If we had the defined boundary for
District 2 and we shot a message across the board, "boil-water
notice." Then 16 hours later we had this break at Arthrex. Can you
redefine the smaller area of Arthrex and say, your boil-water notice is
going to continue because of this break, and then we have another
one at Pewter Mug area. So can you -- can you effect the new
breaks with communication without affecting the whole?
MR. SUMMERS: Yes, sir, you can. You can do that. We
are graphically defined. We do have -- again, as I mentioned, there's
bleed in that geography.
I think what we didn't know at the time was probably the time to
restoration on those subsequent breaks or when those particularly
February 13, 2024
Page 152
came up.
So, again, the issue or -- not the issue. The lesson learned here
is that even had we done secondary or tertiary notifications, you've
got to be ready for these customer inquiries to come back, and then
we were into, what, Saturday night or Sunday morning. I can't
remember which day it was. But, again, now we know that if we
wanted to do that, we've got to make sure that we're staffed up to
make sure that we can address those inquiries.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Good. I think that was the main issue
was the lack of communication from us to them. And as long as we
have the capability to get the information out --
MR. SUMMERS: We do.
CHAIRMAN HALL: -- more is better. Even -- I called it a
nonsolution message. You know, even if after several, you know,
hours or the next day, you know, hang with us, we're still -- we're
getting close, the people still know.
MR. SUMMERS: Right. And, again, it is a balancing act.
I'll just tell you from professional experience, it's a balancing act
whether you use the big shotgun or you come back and do -- you
know, kind of make that a little bit more smaller venue as to how you
notify and alert the public, and I think we learned something from
this, and we'll fine-tune it.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Okay. Commissioner Kowal.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Thank you, Commissioner.
Hey, Dan, thanks.
MR. SUMMERS: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: I just -- quick question. The
Alert Collier, is that -- what system does that use? Because I'm
familiar with the geo fencing systems because I've kind of looked
into it in the past for other things. And according to them, the
people that run those and design them, you can literally bring it down
February 13, 2024
Page 153
to an address. Like, I can say, pick a Publix in Collier County and
put that address in there, and anybody that pulls into that parking lot
will get an alert on their cell phone as long as it's on or activated. I
mean, is that similar to the capability we have with the Alert Collier?
MR. SUMMERS: Yes, sir, it is. And so what we are, we are
at the mercy of -- and, again, Alert Collier, every county in the state
of Florida brands "Alert Charlotte," "Alert Lee County" as a result of
the state subscribing to this agreement and giving subagreements to
each county.
We say that bleed is there because it really depends, number
one, on the carrier, although, as you said, 5G phones are getting more
and more precise with their geo points and algorithms. But we
always want you to know that as these systems -- as people migrate,
there may be some bleed, and that's about it.
As we've seen cell phone text messaging to 911, those -- those
coordinates are getting more and more refined. But we plan -- we
conservatively plan for a thousand feet of bleedover. It's a planning
tool.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Thank you. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Thanks, Mr. Summers.
MR. SUMMERS: Very good. Thank you.
MS. PATTERSON: Dan, any other updates from you?
MR. RODRIGUEZ: I'm good.
MS. PATTERSON: All right. County Attorney?
MR. KLATZKOW: Nothing, thank you.
MS. PATTERSON: Commissioners.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner LoCastro, any comments?
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: It just takes me a second to
unmute.
You know, I don't -- I'm sure somebody else was going to say
something, but, you know, as an Air Force member, seeing airplanes
February 13, 2024
Page 154
go down, and if turns out that at least what we were hearing was it
could be a multi-engine failure, that's actually pretty rare, you know.
Those of us that fly know that. You know, you don't make any kind
of, you know, preliminary decisions, but -- or assessments, but, you
know, obviously, we had a catastrophic accident.
You know, I just wanted to say, from near and from afar
monitoring what happened at the county, obviously, tragic but, you
know, we had our best and our brightest that were out there on I-75
from the state, from the county, and from lots of other agencies, and
I'm sure everybody would echo that. I don't want to steal anybody's
thunder by saying that. You called on me first, and that's just the
first thing that comes to mind that these kind of things don't happen a
lot. We had fatalities but, you know, we also had, you know, brave
men and women in uniform that were out there doing, you know,
incredible work and saving other lives, directing traffic, and you
know, I think the county certainly had a tragedy, but there was a lot
of heroic efforts in the middle of a lot of mass confusion. So I just
want to say, you know, hats off to our team and those from other
outside agencies who were involved.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner McDaniel.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Yes, I have a laundry list
here, so hang on.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Go for it.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: First off I want to --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I make a motion that we
adjourn.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I'll be brief.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: I'll second that motion. Am
I out of order?
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Yes, out of order again, sir.
On our MPO, I serve as the liaison for the MPO AC. And if it
February 13, 2024
Page 155
hasn't made it through to you yet, there is legislation moving through
Tallahassee. It had a lot of not happy language in there with regard
to imposition or placement of bureaucrats in front of the elected
officials for an MPO in the event that the MPO was failing, and that
language I'll change, but there is still -- that legislation's moving
forward, and there is a discussion about the discontinuance of the
existence of the MPO AC, et al. And so that's just a heads-up as
to -- now, I have personally, not on behalf of our MPO -- or I think I
mentioned it last week at our MPO a meeting, I have made
suggestion that rather than whack the MPO AC, that we offer up a
restructure of the organization to provide for greater efficiencies.
And so I've let our legislators know that when it comes across, that
that's something that might be accomplished there as opposed to just
a complete elimination of the MPO AC.
Number two, Commissioner LoCastro, out of order, we're all
really happy to be hearing from you, and I -- I just want to offer
myself and my office to assist in any way, form, or fashion that is
requisite for you.
If there's anything my office can do -- and I'm sure all of us feel
the same way. If there's anything we can do to speaking
engagements or constituent concerns or anything along those lines,
don't hesitate to reach out. I just want you to know that.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Oh, you're more than
welcome, sir.
Number three, we have an issue at our -- with Parks and Rec
with our insurance policies that our commercial vendors are requisite
in getting insurance thresholds, and it's hit a couple of our
commercial users at our boat ramps. And so if it meets with your
approval, I'd like to bring an item forward, if you would like to hear
about it, just to -- I've got a couple ideas that may be able to help
February 13, 2024
Page 156
mitigate that.
There was a policy that had -- just a brief explanation. There
was a policy that has always been in place, and then with our change
in staff and authority, someone said, hey, we haven't been paying
attention to this and hadn't been enforcing these things, and then we
did, and so it's caused an imposition on some of our commercial
operators. And I have a couple ideas I'd like to throw out. So if it
meets with you-all's approval, I'll whip up an agenda item. Do you
want to say something, Tanya, or are you just there for questioning?
MS. WILLIAMS: Just coming up in case.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: So I don't want to belabor the
point today, but there are people that may want to speak in that
regard, and I've got a couple of ideas that may be able to help with
that.
Number three, and it's -- am I on number four? Thanks for
counting, dear.
Our leases with our airport facilities are in dire need of
addressing. And it would be my request that we withhold any
negotiations or bringing forward of any leases for our leasehold
properties on our airports until we review the ranking system that's
been established through procurement for the selection of vendors
and contractors and an actual review of the lease parameters.
Commissioner Hall, you're a -- I'm going to pick on you because
you're the Chair.
CHAIRMAN HALL: I'm listening.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I'm going to lease you -- go
to contract with you, lease you a piece of land that I own, and you
don't have to pay me for at least two and a half years. How do you
feel about that?
CHAIRMAN HALL: That's a good deal for me; bad deal for
you.
February 13, 2024
Page 157
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: So that's what we have going
on with our leasing of vacant lands, at the Immokalee airport at least.
And so I'd like to -- I'd like to tighten up those parameters. I'd like to
tighten up the rules with regard to how we're doing that. I would
also like to have a review of the ranking criterium that's being
utilized for selection of contractors. When I first came into office in
'16, you know, the success of an airport has to do with what?
CHAIRMAN HALL: Fuel. Fuel.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Fuel sales and air traffic.
The more air traffic you have, the more fuel sales you have and so
ons and so forth.
And we had a piece of property out at the Immokalee airport that
was tied up by a contractor for over a year before I came into office.
It was another year and a half, and then they asked for an extension,
and they hadn't -- because the way the current lease reads is you don't
have to pay me until you get your CO.
So -- and all I'm doing is renting the land. So you can tie up a
piece of property, hold it under contract for two and a half years, not
even apply for a building permit, and then ask for an extension and
continue to tie up that land. And so it's not very fortuitous for our
taxpayers and the utilization of our county assets, and on so -- was
that too long of a description? No. So that's the rationale for doing
that.
CHAIRMAN HALL: How do you suppose that we do that?
In a workshop or here or --
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I'm going to make some
recommendations. I've been having discussion with Trinity Scott
about this. I'm going to make some recommendations and then bring
that format back to you in short order.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Okay.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Is that a positive head nod
February 13, 2024
Page 158
out of her? Yes, so that's a positive head nod out of her.
I've been working on this quite a bit. And then, obviously,
when we bring it forward, you-all will have your opportunity for
input.
Hang on one second. The little timeout on your phone doesn't
work all that well. And it also has to do with -- on the same note,
with regard to procurement, I would like for us to have a discussion
about the thresholds that we currently have for acquisitions that are
established -- were established quite some time ago that may
need -- that need to be reviewed.
And so I'm going to use specifically Andrew, the young
gentleman that used to be our airport director that went and took
another job. He wasn't -- he wasn't able to buy a piece of equipment
that was essential for the Marco airport because of the threshold
limitation that was -- now, there may have been other circumstances,
but it's come to me --
CHAIRMAN HALL: Monetary threshold?
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Yes. And so I'd like to -- I'd
like to have a discussion about that in the near future as well.
Last, but not least -- and I brought this up a while ago, not too
awfully long ago, but I would like to direct staff to give us some
discussion about privatization of our aquatic centers. So I've got -- I
have some ideas, and I just want to hear -- I hear a lot about the
ongoing expense, the enormous capital expense that we put out, the
enormous maintenance expense that we put out with regard to our
aquatic centers. And when I talk about privatization, it's not -- it's
not selling those aquatic centers. It's giving the operations over to a
private entity that can help offset this enormous expense and maybe
generate revenue for us. So if that meets with your approval, I'll
work with staff, and we'll bring something forward there as well.
CHAIRMAN HALL: However we can do it smarter and better,
February 13, 2024
Page 159
I'm in.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Okay. And then now you
can go ahead and move to close the meeting if you want.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Oh, now he wants to talk.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Actually, all I want to say is
I echo what Commissioner LoCastro said in terms of the response
from our county, Collier Sheriff's Department, EMS, all those folks
that were on site on I-75. Everything I heard from different folks
was that the county's response was really spectacular. Obviously, a
tragedy, but kept things from getting worse.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Commissioner Kowal.
COMMISSIONER KOWAL: Thank you, Chair. I'd also like
to echo that, also, the response and the feeding us the information as
it was coming in, from Mr. Summers, through John, and everybody
keeping us abreast of the situation. You know, it was very
important, because, sad but true -- it was true. Social media gets
ahold of things. And I witnessed it myself, that there was some
just -- some outrageous comments. And if they're said over and over
enough, they become truth in some people's eyes. We see that a lot.
So it was important. I know -- Commissioner Hall, I think you
put out something on social media, and then I put something out, and
then people were very thankful that they got some real details, real
truths about what was going on, so it was really -- it had a good
response.
Just -- I'd like to visit what we went through today. I'm sorry I
had to put you guys through an extremely long agenda item. This
would have been a very short meeting if I didn't do that, so it was
probably a good one to do it for -- on.
I just wanted to say, you know, we don't -- you know, as
government and government officials and as, you know -- you know,
February 13, 2024
Page 160
our duty is to provide certain things and stay out of the way of certain
things, and I truly believe that. And regardless of where you think
the medical theories are or which way the science goes on a plethora
of things -- we talk about masks. Do they work? They don't work?
Shots, do they work? They don't work? You know, fluoride, does
it work or it don't work? Or does it outweigh one out of the other,
the good or the bad?
But I think with what it comes down to is as a government,
we're responsible to provide safe water, safe water for our community
to drink, and that means safe water when they drink it, they're not
going to get sick, and that's where it comes into. You know, where
our health part of it comes into play, not so much premedicating it
with something that may or may not be good for them.
So I just wanted to make sure, you know, that it's clear on why I
was doing what I was doing, because I don't think it's our duty
to -- and I think the document that we all agreed on back in April of
last year demonstrates that, that it is not our duty. Our duty is to
provide certain things but draw a line at certain things.
And I just want to say I thank everybody, because I think
we -- we did vote in the line of liberty today, so thank you.
CHAIRMAN HALL: Okay. I'll just real quickly echo how
thankful I am for our emergency management on the airplane crash
out there. Physically going through the same thing, I could
appreciate that. I think we were -- I think the airport people were out
there in six minutes, and that crash could have been a lot worse, and
those pilots are to be commended. And, you know, they died heroes,
even though it's in a bad way.
So you did a great job. Appreciate that. Good work today,
guys. It's always a pleasure to do this with you. And with that,
we're adjourned.
February 13, 2024
Page 161
*******
****Commissioner McDaniel moved, seconded by Commissioner
Kowal and carried that the following items under the consent and
summary agendas be approved and/or adopted****
Item #16A1
ADVERTISE AND BRING BACK AN ORDINANCE AMENDING
THE COLLIER COUNTY CODE OF LAWS AND ORDINANCES
TO UPDATE TEMPORARY EMERGENCY HOUSING AND
FLOODPLAIN DEVELOPMENT REGULATIONS
Item #16A2
THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS, AS EX-OFFICIO
GOVERNING BOARD OF THE COLLIER COUNTY WATER-
SEWER DISTRICT, APPROVE FINAL ACCEPTANCE OF THE
POTABLE WATER AND SEWER UTILITY FACILITIES AND
ACCEPT THE CONVEYANCE OF A PORTION OF THE
POTABLE WATER FACILITIES FOR LOTS 6 & 7 OF WHITE
LAKE CORPORATE SQUARE, PL20230010494 - FINAL
INSPECTION BY STAFF FOUND THESE FACILITIES
SATISFACTORY AND ACCEPTABLE ON AUGUST 1, 2023
Item #16A3
APPROVE FOR RECORDING THE FINAL PLAT OF
MACEDONIA (APPLICATION NUMBER PL20220006832),
APPROVAL OF THE STANDARD FORM CONSTRUCTION
AND MAINTENANCE AGREEMENT, AND APPROVAL OF
February 13, 2024
Page 162
THE PERFORMANCE SECURITY IN THE AMOUNT OF
$204,175.95 – LOCATED IN SECTION 24, TOWNSHIP 48
SOUTH, RANGE 25 EAST, COLLIER COUNTY, FLORIDA
Item #16A4 – Moved to Item #11C (Per Agenda Change Sheet)
Item #16B1
AWARD REQUEST FOR PROPOSAL (“RFP”) NO. 23-8149,
“LABORATORY SERVICES,” TO ADVANCED
ENVIRONMENTAL LABORATORIES, INC., PACE
ANALYTICAL SERVICE, LLC, AND EUROFINS
ENVIRONMENT TESTING SOUTHEAST, LLC, AS SET FORTH
HEREIN, AND AUTHORIZE THE CHAIRMAN TO SIGN THE
ATTACHED AGREEMENTS
Item #16B2
AWARD REQUEST FOR PROFESSIONAL SERVICES (“RPS”)
NO. 23-8108, “DESIGN SERVICES FOR COLLIER AREA
TRANSIT OPERATIONS AND MAINTENANCE FACILITY,” TO
JACOBS ENGINEERING GROUP, INC., IN THE AMOUNT OF
$1,735,063.00, AND AUTHORIZE THE CHAIRMAN TO SIGN
THE ATTACHED AGREEMENT
Item #16B3
RESOLUTION 2024-018: APPROVE AN AGREEMENT AND
ADOPT A RESOLUTION THAT AUTHORIZE THE EXCHANGE
OF 1.51 ACRES OF LAND ON THE SOUTH SIDE OF PAINTED
LEAF LANE FOR 1.69 ACRES OF ADJOINING LAND TO BE
February 13, 2024
Page 163
ASSEMBLED WITH ABUTTING COUNTY-OWNED LAND,
FOR FUTURE RIGHT OF WAY, DRAINAGE, UTILITY AND/OR
OTHER PUBLIC USES. ESTIMATED FISCAL IMPACT:
$28,000 REVENUE
Item #16B4
RESOLUTION 2024-019: ADOPT A RESOLUTION APPROVING
AND AUTHORIZING THE CHAIRMAN TO EXECUTE THE
PUBLIC TRANSIT GRANT AGREEMENT (PTGA) 439255-1-94-
22 WITH THE FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF
TRANSPORTATION TO ACCEPT FEDERAL TRANSIT
ADMINISTRATION SECTION 5339 RURAL AREA BUS AND
BUS FACILITIES PROGRAM IN THE AMOUNT OF $575,000
FOR THE PURCHASE OF A REPLACEMENT BUS AND
AUTHORIZE THE NECESSARY BUDGET AMENDMENTS
Item #16B5
APPROVE AN AFTER-THE-FACT PAYMENT TO PREFERRED
MATERIALS, INC., IN THE AMOUNT OF $12,354.60, FOR
ADDITIONAL IRRIGATION MATERIALS USED IN THE
“RADIO ROAD AT DEVONSHIRE BOULEVARD AND
COUNTRYSIDE DRIVE INTERSECTION IMPROVEMENTS”
PROJECT UNDER AGREEMENT 21-7842 “ROADWAY
CONTRACTORS” AND DEEM THE EXPENDITURE HAS A
VALID PUBLIC PURPOSE. (PROJECT NO. 60016)
Item #16B6
1) APPROVE AN AFTER-THE-FACT PAYMENT FOR
February 13, 2024
Page 164
MATERIALS AND SERVICES IN THE AMOUNT OF $30,655.04
UNDER WORK DIRECTIVES 1, 2, AND 3 FOR “COUNTRY
CLUB OF NAPLES (CCON) WETLAND OUTFALLS” PROJECT
UNDER AGREEMENT NO. 20-7800, “UNDERGROUND
CONTRACTOR SERVICES” WITH DOUGLAS N. HIGGINS,
INC., UTILIZING A DRAW FROM THE OWNER’S
ALLOWANCE; 2) APPROVE AN AFTER-THE-FACT
DONATION OF LEFTOVER MATERIALS AT AN ESTIMATED
COST OF $130 TO THE COUNTRY CLUB OF NAPLES; 3)
RATIFY PAYMENT FOR PAY APPLICATION 1 THAT
EXTENDED 11 DAYS PAST FINAL COMPLETION FOR
CLEANUP REQUESTED BY THE COUNTRY CLUB OF
NAPLES; AND 4) DEEM THAT THESE
EXPENDITURES/DONATION HAVE A VALID PUBLIC
PURPOSE
Item #16B7
AWARD REQUEST FOR PROFESSIONAL SERVICES (“RPS”)
NO. 22-8015, “PROFESSIONAL SERVICES FOR NEARSHORE
BIOLOGICAL MONITORING,” TO CSA OCEAN SCIENCES
INC., AND AUTHORIZE THE CHAIRMAN TO SIGN THE
ATTACHED AGREEMENT
Item #16C1
THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS, EX-OFFICIO
THE GOVERNING BOARD OF THE COLLIER COUNTY
WATER-SEWER DISTRICT, AWARD INVITATION TO BID
(“ITB”) NO. 23-8198, “GOLDEN GATE FORCE MAIN,” TO
METRO EQUIPMENT SERVICE, INC., IN THE AMOUNT OF
February 13, 2024
Page 165
$2,665,000, APPROVE OWNER’S ALLOWANCE OF $250,000,
AND AUTHORIZE THE CHAIRMAN TO SIGN THE
ATTACHED AGREEMENT. (PROJECT NO. 70243)
Item #16C2
AUTHORIZE BUDGET AMENDMENTS IN THE AMOUNT OF
$116,691.40 FROM THE WATER USER FEE CAPITAL FUND
4012, PROJECT NO. 71010, AND THE AMOUNT OF $225,296.60
FROM THE WASTEWATER USER FEE CAPITAL FUND 4014,
PROJECT NO. 70278 TO FUND THE DESIGN OF FDOT’S I-75 /
PINE RIDGE ROAD IQ AND WATER MAIN RELOCATION
PROJECT (PROJECT NO. 70289)
Item #16C3
AWARD INVITATION TO BID (“ITB”) NO. 23-8178, “NORTH
COUNTY WATER RECLAMATION FACILITY ELECTRICAL
SERVICE #1 UPGRADE PROJECT” TO EAU GALLIE
ELECTRIC, INC., IN THE AMOUNT OF $3,852,000, APPROVE
OWNER’S ALLOWANCE OF $350,000 AND AUTHORIZE THE
CHAIRMAN TO SIGN THE ATTACHED AGREEMENT.
(PROJECT NO. 70278)
Item #16D1
APPROVE SERVICES FOR SENIORS, AFTER-THE-FACT
STANDARD CONTRACT WITH THE AREA AGENCY ON
AGING FOR SOUTHWEST FLORIDA, INC., IN THE AMOUNT
OF $1,429,000, AND AUTHORIZE THE ASSOCIATED BUDGET
AMENDMENTS, FOR FY24 OLDER AMERICAN ACT TITLE III
February 13, 2024
Page 166
IN THE AMOUNT OF ($12,222.23). (HUMAN SERVICE GRANT
FUND 1837)
Item #16D2
ACCEPT AND RATIFY FEE WAIVERS GRANTED BY THE
DIVISION DIRECTOR OF DOMESTIC ANIMAL SERVICES
FOR THE PERIOD OF OCTOBER 1, 2023, THROUGH
DECEMBER 31, 2023, IN THE AMOUNT OF $756.00, IN
ACCORDANCE WITH THE PROCEDURES SET FORTH IN
RESOLUTION NO. 2018-106
Item #16D3
APPROVE THE ADMINISTRATIVE REPORT OF “AFTER-THE-
FACT” PURCHASES FOR THE DOMESTIC ANIMAL
SERVICES DIVISION FOR THE PAYMENT OF $90,542.74 FOR
ASSOCIATED INVOICES THAT HAVE NOT BEEN PAID
Item #16D4
APPROVE A FIRST AMENDMENT TO THE PELICAN BAY
COMMUNITY PARK MANAGEMENT AGREEMENT WITH
PELICAN BAY FOUNDATION, INC., TO CLARIFY THE
PERCENTAGE OF PUBLIC ACCESS TO THE COURTS AND
EXTEND TIME FOR COUNTY STAFF APPROVAL OF
CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PLANS
Item #16D5
APPROVE AND AUTHORIZE THE CHAIRMAN TO EXECUTE
February 13, 2024
Page 167
THE DESIGNATION AGREEMENT (OGT-DA0109) WITH THE
STATE OF FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF ENVIRONMENTAL
PROTECTION, DIVISION OF RECREATIONAL PARKS,
OFFICE OF GREENWAYS AND TRAILS TO ESTABLISH THE
PARADISE COAST BLUEWAY PADDLING TRAIL
Item #16E1
APPROVE MODIFICATIONS TO THE 2024 FISCAL YEAR PAY
& CLASSIFICATION PLAN WHICH CONSIST OF ONE NEW
CLASSIFICATION ADDED FROM OCTOBER 1, 2023,
THROUGH DECEMBER 31, 2023
Item #16E2
RATIFY PROPERTY, CASUALTY, WORKERS’
COMPENSATION AND SUBROGATION CLAIM FILES
SETTLED AND/OR CLOSED BY THE RISK MANAGEMENT
DIVISION DIRECTOR PURSUANT TO RESOLUTION NO. 04-15
FOR THE FIRST QUARTER OF FY 24
Item #16E3
APPROVE AN ASSUMPTION AGREEMENT ASSIGNING ALL
RIGHTS, DUTIES, BENEFITS, AND OBLIGATIONS TO
BOWMAN GULF COAST LLC, D/B/A HOLE MONTES, A
BOWMAN COMPANY, CONCERNING AGREEMENT NOS. 14-
6345, 18-7432-CE, 18-7432-SM, 18-7432-UP, 20-7802, 20-7806,
AND 21-7900
Item #16E4
February 13, 2024
Page 168
APPROVE THE ADMINISTRATIVE REPORT FOR VARIOUS
COUNTY DIVISIONS AFTER-THE-FACT PURCHASES
REQUIRING BOARD APPROVAL IN ACCORDANCE WITH
PROCUREMENT ORDINANCE 2017-08, AND THE
PROCUREMENT MANUAL, AND TO APPROVE THE
PAYMENT OF $2,358.60 IN EXPENDITURES THAT HAVE
BEEN INCURRED THAT WERE OUT OF COMPLIANCE WITH
THE CONTRACTS OR PROCUREMENT REQUIREMENTS FOR
ASSOCIATED INVOICES THAT HAVE NOT BEEN PAID
Item #16F1
RESOLUTION 2024-020: ADOPT A RESOLUTION APPROVING
AMENDMENTS (APPROPRIATING GRANTS, DONATIONS,
CONTRIBUTIONS, OR INSURANCE PROCEEDS) TO THE
FISCAL YEAR 2023-24 ADOPTED BUDGET. (THE BUDGET
AMENDMENTS IN THE ATTACHED RESOLUTION HAVE
BEEN REVIEWED AND APPROVED BY THE BOARD OF
COUNTY COMMISSIONERS VIA SEPARATE EXECUTIVE
SUMMARIES.)
Item #16F2
APPROVE THE COLLECTIVE BARGAINING AGREEMENT
BETWEEN COLLIER COUNTY AND THE COLLIER EMS/FIRE
DISTRICT 27 BARGAINING UNIT, SOUTHWEST FLORIDA
PROFESSIONAL FIREFIGHTERS AND PARAMEDICS, LOCAL
1826, INTERNATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF FIREFIGHTERS,
INCORPORATED
Item #16F3
February 13, 2024
Page 169
APPROVE AGREEMENT NO. 24-010-NS “FLEET
MANAGEMENT SOFTWARE UPGRADE, ANNUAL SUPPORT
& MAINTENANCE” AND AUTHORIZE EXPENDITURES
UNDER A SOLE-SOURCE WAIVER FOR A PERIOD OF FIVE
YEARS, IN AN AMOUNT NOT TO EXCEED $235,000 FOR FY24
AND NOT TO EXCEED $60,000 FOR ANNUAL MAINTENANCE
FEES AND SUPPORT PER FISCAL YEAR FROM FY25
THROUGH FY28, TO OBTAIN FLEET MANAGEMENT
SYSTEM SERVICES FROM TT FASTER LLC, NECESSARY TO
MAINTAIN COUNTY-OWNED EQUIPMENT
Item #16F4 – Motion to Continue to a future BCC Meeting by
Commissioner McDaniel; Seconded by Commissioner Kowal –
Approved (Per Agenda Change Sheet)
AWARD INVITATION TO NEGOTIATE (“ITN”) 23-8177 –
“GASOLINE AND DIESEL FUEL MULTI-AGENCY
COOPERATIVE PURCHASE” TO PALMDALE OIL COMPANY,
LLC, AND AUTHORIZE THE CHAIRMAN TO SIGN THE
ATTACHED AGREEMENT
Item #16F5 - Motion to Continue to a future BCC Meeting by
Commissioner McDaniel; Seconded by Commissioner Kowal –
Approved (Per Agenda Change Sheet)
AWARD FIXED FEE PROFESSIONAL SERVICE AGREEMENT
TO DIGITECH COMPUTER, LLC, UNDER REQUEST FOR
PROPOSAL (RFP) 23-8098 EMS BILLING SERVICES AND
AUTHORIZE THE CHAIRMAN TO SIGN THE ATTACHED
AGREEMENT
February 13, 2024
Page 170
Item #16F6
APPROVE CHANGE ORDER NO. 2, ADDING 425 DAYS TO
THE PROFESSIONAL SERVICES AGREEMENT 21-7884 WITH
MATERN PROFESSIONAL ENGINEERING, INC., FOR THE
NEW CHILLER PLANT BUILDING K. (PROJECT NO. 50214)
Item #16F7 - Motion to Continue to a future BCC Meeting by
Commissioner McDaniel; Seconded by Commissioner Kowal –
Approved (Per Agenda Change Sheet)
APPROVE A SUBORDINATION, NON-DISTURBANCE, AND
ATTORNMENT AGREEMENT IN REFERENCE TO THE
PROPERTY LOCATED AT 1429 DON STREET, UNIT D,
NAPLES, FLORIDA CURRENTLY LEASED BY COLLIER
COUNTY FROM 23-81 LNT, LLC FOR WAREHOUSE
STORAGE SPACE USED BY FACILITIES MANAGEMENT
Item #16F8
APPROVE AN AFTER-THE-FACT PAYMENT IN THE TOTAL
AMOUNT OF $8,295.31 TO METRO AVIATION, INC., FOR THE
PURCHASES OF HELICOPTER MEDICAL INTERIOR
EQUIPMENT AND PARTS FOR THE BACKUP COUNTY AIR
AMBULANCE HELICOPTER, WHICH WERE NOT PROPERLY
AUTHORIZED, AS REQUIRED BY THE PROCUREMENT
ORDINANCE AND DEEM THAT THE PURCHASES HAD A
VALID PUBLIC PURPOSE
Item #16F9
February 13, 2024
Page 171
1) WAIVE THE SINGLE QUOTE PROCUREMENT THRESHOLD
OF $3,000 PER VENDOR PER FISCAL YEAR FOR THIS
TRANSACTION, 2) APPROVE AN AFTER-THE-FACT
PAYMENT IN THE TOTAL AMOUNT OF $3,871.95 TO
EPTURA, INC., FOR PURCHASES THAT WERE NOT
PROPERLY AUTHORIZED AS REQUIRED BY THE
PROCUREMENT ORDINANCE OF THE ANNUAL
EVENTBOARD SOFTWARE SUBSCRIPTION FOR 13
LICENSES, WHICH HELP FACILITATE CONFERENCE ROOM
SCHEDULING THROUGHOUT COUNTY LOCATIONS, AND 3)
DEEM THAT THE PURCHASES HAD A VALID PUBLIC
PURPOSE
Item #16F10 – Add-On Item (Per Agenda Change Sheet)
RECOMMENDATION TO RENEW THE ANNUAL COLLIER
COUNTY’S CERTIFICATE OF PUBLIC CONVENIENCE AND
NECESSITY (COPCN) FOR COLLIER COUNTY EMERGENCY
MEDICAL SERVICES TO PROVIDE CLASS 1 ADVANCED
LIFE SUPPORT TRANSPORT (ALS) FOR ONE YEAR AND
AUTHORIZE THE CHAIRMAN TO EXECUTE THE PERMIT
AND CERTIFICATE, WITH A RETROACTIVE EFFECTIVE
DATE OF JANUARY 1, 2024.
Item #16I1
MISCELLANEOUS CORRESPONDENCE FEBRUARY 13, 2024
BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
MISCELLANEOUS CORRESPONDENCE
February 13, 2024
1. MISCELLANEOUS ITEMS TO FILE FOR RECORD WITH ACTION AS
DIRECTED:
A. DISTRICTS:
1) Naples Heritage Community Development District:
11/07/2023 Signed Minutes, Agency Mailing & Agency Memo
2) Collier County Industrial Development Authority:
12/12/2023 Oath of Office – J. Oscar Perez
February 13, 2024
Page 172
Item #16J1
APPROVE THE USE OF $2,000 FROM THE CONFISCATED
TRUST FUNDS TO SUPPORT THE FLORIDA FBI NATIONAL
ACADEMY ASSOCIATES, INC
Item #16J2
REPORT TO THE BOARD REGARDING THE INVESTMENT OF
COUNTY FUNDS AS OF THE QUARTER ENDED DECEMBER
31, 2023
Item #16J3
TO RECORD IN THE MINUTES OF THE BOARD OF COUNTY
COMMISSIONERS, THE CHECK NUMBER (OR OTHER
PAYMENT METHOD), AMOUNT, PAYEE, AND PURPOSE FOR
WHICH THE REFERENCED DISBURSEMENTS IN THE
AMOUNT OF $73,629,560.92 WERE DRAWN FOR THE
PERIODS BETWEEN JANUARY 11, 2024, AND JANUARY 31,
2024, PURSUANT TO FLORIDA STATUTE 136.06
Item #16J4
REQUEST THAT THE BOARD APPROVE AND DETERMINE
VALID PUBLIC PURPOSE FOR INVOICES PAYABLE AND
PURCHASING CARD TRANSACTIONS AS OF FEBRUARY 7,
2024
Item #16K1
February 13, 2024
Page 173
RESOLUTION 2024-021: APPOINT A MEMBER TO THE
BUILDING BOARD OF ADJUSTMENTS & APPEALS –
APPOINTING MICHAEL A. MICK TO A FOUR-YEAR TERM
EXPIRING ON AUGUST 9, 2027
Item #16K2
RESOLUTION 2024-022: APPOINT A MEMBER TO THE
COLLIER COUNTY CITIZEN CORPS – APPOINTING
MEREDITH GAVIN WITH TERM EXPIRING ON NOVEMBER 5,
2025
Item #16K3
RESOLUTION 2024-023: APPOINT ONE MEMBER TO THE
FOREST LAKES ROADWAY & DRAINAGE ADVISORY
COMMITTEE – APPOINTING GERALD T. NORSIC TO A
FOUR-YEAR TERM EXPIRING ON APRIL 21, 2028
Item #16K4
RESOLUTION 2024-024: APPOINT A MEMBER TO THE
PELICAN BAY SERVICES DIVISION BOARD – APPOINTING
MICHEAL WEIR WITH TERM EXPIRING ON MARCH 31, 2027
Item #16K5
RESOLUTION 2024-025: APPOINT THREE MEMBERS TO THE
INFRASTRUCTURE SURTAX CITIZEN OVERSIGHT
COMMITTEE – APPOINTING TWO AT-LARGE SEATS TO
SCOTT LEPORE AND JAMES DELONY EACH TO A TWO-
February 13, 2024
Page 174
YEAR TERM EXPIRING ON JANUARY 12, 2026, AND SCOTT
SPITZER IS APPOINTED TO FILL THE REMAINDER OF THE
VACANT ALTERNATE TERM WHICH WILL EXPIRE ON
JANUARY 11, 2025
Item #16K6
RESOLUTION 2024-026: REQUEST BY THE COLLIER
COUNTY INDUSTRIAL DEVELOPMENT AUTHORITY FOR
APPROVAL OF A RESOLUTION AUTHORIZING THE
AUTHORITY TO ISSUE REVENUE BONDS TO BE USED TO
FINANCE THE CONSTRUCTION OF THE PROPOSED NCH
HEART, STROKE, AND VASCULAR INSTITUTE, THE
PROPOSED NCH/HSS ORTHOPEDIC CENTER, AND OTHER
CAPITAL PROJECTS
Item #16K7
APPROVE A STIPULATED FINAL JUDGMENT IN THE
AMOUNT OF $140,800 PLUS $32,066 IN STATUTORY
ATTORNEY FEES, APPORTIONMENT FEES, EXPERT FEES
AND COSTS FOR THE TAKING OF PARCELS 1125FEE AND
1127FEE REQUIRED FOR THE VANDERBILT BEACH ROAD
EXTENSION PROJECT NO. 60168
Item #17A
ORDINANCE 2024-04: ADOPT AN ORDINANCE AMENDING
ORDINANCE NO. 2021-11, AS RATIFIED AND CONFIRMED
BY ORDINANCE NO. 2021-44, WHICH ESTABLISHED THE
HYDE PARK COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT DISTRICT 1, IN
February 13, 2024
Page 175
ORDER TO EXPAND AND CONTRACT THE EXTERNAL
BOUNDARIES OF THE DISTRICT RESULTING IN A NET
EXPANSION OF 63.02± ACRES FROM 368.9± ACRES TO
431.96± ACRES
Item #17B
RESOLUTION 2024-027: APPROVE PETITION VAC-
PL20230013038 TO DISCLAIM, RENOUNCE, AND VACATE
THE COUNTY AND THE PUBLIC INTEREST IN THE 12-FOOT
FIRE WAGON AND DRAINAGE EASEMENT LOCATED
ALONG THE SOUTHERLY BORDER OF LOT 20, LAKE KELLY
UNIT 2, AS RECORDED IN PLAT BOOK 3, PAGE 93, OF THE
PUBLIC RECORDS OF COLLIER COUNTY, FLORIDA, IN
SECTION 14, TOWNSHIP 50 SOUTH, RANGE 25 EAST,
COLLIER COUNTY, FLORIDA AND TO ACCEPT
PETITIONER’S GRANT OF A 12-FOOT DRAINAGE AND
ACCESS EASEMENT TO REPLACE THE VACATED
DRAINAGE EASEMENT
February 13, 2024
There being no further business for the good of the County, the
meeting was adjourned by order of the Chair at 3:09 p.m.
BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS/EX
OFFICIO GOVERNING BOARD(S) OF
SPECIAL DISTRICTS UNDER ITS CONTROL
CHRIS I All, CHAIR. AN
ATTEST
CRYSTAL K. KINZEL, CLERK
.A,ttett a;to Chainnan's
'nn,ture on!y.
These minutes approved by the Board on3/.2424_ as
presented ✓ or as corrected
TRANSCRIPT PREPARED ON BEHALF OF FORT MYERS
COURT REPORTING BY TERRI L. LEWIS, REGISTERED
PROFESSIONAL COURT REPORTER, FPR-C, AND NOTARY
PUBLIC.
Page 176