BCC Minutes 10/16/2007 S (LDC Amendments)
October 16, 2007
TRANSCRIPT OF THE LDC MEETING OF THE
BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
Naples, Florida
October 16, 2007
LET IT BE REMEMBERED, that the Collier County Planning
Commission, in and for the County of Collier, having conducted
business herein, met on this date at 5:05 p.m. in SPECIAL SESSION
in Building "F" of the Government Complex, East Naples, Florida,
with the following members present:
CHAIRMAN:
Jim Coletta
Tom Henning
Frank Halas
Fred W. Coyle (Absent)
Donna Fiala
ALSO PRESENT:
Jeffrey Klatzkow, Chief Asst. County Attorney
Joseph Schmitt, CDES Administrator
Ray Bellows, Zoning & Land Development Review
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COLLIER COUNTY
BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
~
LDC AGENDA
October 16, 2007
5:05 p.m.
SPECIAL MEETING
NOTICE: ALL PERSONS WISHING TO SPEAK ON ANY AGENDA ITEM
MUST REGISTER PRIOR TO SPEAKING. SPEAKERS MUST REGISTER
WITH THE COUNTY MANAGER PRIOR TO THE PRESENT A TION OF THE
AGENDA ITEM TO BE ADDRESSED.
COLLIER COUNTY ORDINANCE NO. 2003-53, AS AMENDED BY
ORDINANCE 2004-05 AND 2007-24, REQUIRES THAT ALL LOBBYISTS
SHALL, BEFORE ENGAGING IN ANY LOBBYING ACTIVITIES
(INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, ADDRESSING THE BOARD OF
COUNTY COMMISSIONERS), REGISTER WITH THE CLERK TO THE
BOARD AT THE BOARD MINUTES AND RECORDS DEPARTMENT.
REQUESTS TO ADDRESS THE BOARD ON SUBJECTS WHICH ARE NOT ON
THIS AGENDA MUST BE SUBMITTED IN WRITING WITH EXPLANATION
TO THE COUNTY MANAGER AT LEAST 13 DAYS PRIOR TO THE DATE OF
THE MEETING AND WILL BE HEARD UNDER "PUBLIC PETITIONS".
ANY PERSON WHO DECIDES TO APPEAL A DECISION OF THIS BOARD
WILL NEED A RECORD OF THE PROCEEDINGS PERTAINING THERETO,
AND THEREFORE MAY NEED TO ENSURE THAT A VERBATIM RECORD
OF THE PROCEEDINGS IS MADE, WHICH RECORD INCLUDES THE
TESTIMONY AND EVIDENCE UPON WHICH THE APPEAL IS TO BE BASED.
ALL REGISTERED PUBLIC SPEAKERS WILL BE LIMITED TO FIVE (5)
MINUTES UNLESS THE TIME IS ADJUSTED BY THE CHAIRMAN.
IF YOU ARE A PERSON WITH A DISABILITY WHO NEEDS ANY
ACCOMMODATION IN ORDER TO PARTICIPATE IN THIS PROCEEDING,
YOU ARE ENTITLED, AT NO COST TO YOU, TO THE PROVISION OF
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October 16, 2007
CERTAIN ASSISTANCE. PLEASE CONTACT THE COLLIER COUNTY
FACILITIES MANAGEMENT DEPARTMENT LOCATED AT 3301 EAST
T AMIAMI TRAIL, NAPLES, FLORIDA, 34112, (239) 774-8380; ASSISTED
LISTENING DEVICES FOR THE HEARING IMP AIRED ARE AVAILABLE IN
THE COUNTY COMMISSIONERS' OFFICE.
1. INVOCATION AND PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE
2. THE BOARD TO CONSIDER AN ORDINANCE AMENDING
ORDINANCE NUMBER 04-41, AS AMENDED, THE COLLIER COUNTY
LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, WHICH INCLUDES THE
COMPREHENSIVE REGULATIONS FOR THE UNINCORPORATED
AREA OF COLLIER COUNTY, FLORIDA.
3. ADJOURN
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October 16, 2007
October 16, 2007
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: Thank you, ladies and gentlemen. I'd
like to welcome you to the Land Development Code amendment
2007. Cycle I?
MS. FABACHER: Yes.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: Yeah, Cycle 1. And we'll start this
meeting like we start all meetings, with the pledge of allegiance.
Commissioner Halas, would you be kind enough to lead us?
(Pledge of Allegiance was recited in unison.)
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: I want to stand corrected. I might have
said good morning. If I did, I want to make sure that everybody knows
that the time now is 5:05 in the evening.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: If you did, I didn't notice it.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: I had to make that correction. I didn't
want to let it go by. I didn't want to confuse people any more than
they've already been confused.
MS. F ABACHER: Thank you, Mr. Chair. I want to -- for the
record, Catherine Fabacher with the zoning and land development
review. I want to say that we are here for the second meeting of the
first hearing of the LDC amendments for 2007, Cycle 1.
And we have heard a lot of amendments the other day, and now
what we're going to start with tonight is on summary sheet B, and
we're going to start with Section 5.05.13, heliports. Provide siting and
design and operation criteria for private use heliports.
And our speakers -- this is a private petition, and our speaker
tonight will be Clay Brooker. Thank you.
Thank you, Clay.
MR. SCHMITT: Commissioners, that is in your blue book.
MS. FABACHER: I'm sorry, Joe.
COMMISSIONER MURRAY: Page 5.
MR. SCHMITT: And it's Page 5 in your blue book. It's behind
the tab that says hot topics.
I don't know why, Clay, it says hot topics. I can't figure that out,
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October 16, 2007
but it does.
MR. BROOKER: It's good hot topics.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. My name is Clay Brooker. I'm with the
law firm ofCheffy, Passidomo, Wilson and Johnson. I'm here on
behalf of the petitioner, the applicant on this private LDC amendment
request. And that applicant is E.B. Simmons Electrical, Incorporated.
It's an electrical contractor here in Collier County.
With me is Stephen Rhuby of Architects, Ltd. He deserves a lot
of the kudos for the behind-the-scenes work on researching heliports
and helistops and so forth and so on.
What I hope -- in your packages, if you look down the title page
of your LDC amendment request, there's about three-fourths of the
way down is an other notes/version date. The one we are working on,
at least that I am working from is August 28th. And I hope that's in
your packets, because that's the latest and greatest.
This version that you see before you has enjoyed a unanimous
recommendation of approval from all three boards that have already
seen it. That being: Development Services Advisory Committee,
Environmental Advisory Council, and the CCPC. Each of those
groups made comments, recommendations, and all of their revisions
and suggestions have been incorporated into the version you see here
today.
Just a little bit of background. Mr. and Mrs. Simmons purchased
property off of Enterprise Avenue, just east of the Naples Airport,
back in 2001. That is in the industrial zoning district. They intended to
move their electrical company to that site and incorporate a helipad on
top of one of the buildings on the business site. At that time in 2001
and today, as we stand here, a permitted use in the industrial zoning
district is called transportation by air. And transportation by air
includes airports, flying fields, scheduled and non-scheduled air
transportation, air courier services, air cargo carriers, air passenger
carriers, air ambulance services, air taxi services and so on and so on.
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October 16, 2007
What the Simmons' did was they submitted an SDP; they showed
the helipad on the SDP. Initially it was approved by staff, the SDP
was, but then later it was retracted. That approval was retracted
because staff got a little bit concerned about approving a helipad,
which may be the first private helipad approval in Collier County, or
at least in recent history.
So because of their concerns about that, they asked us to propose
this amendment to give a little bit more beef into the code, give staff a
comfort level that we're not just going to allow helicopters to fly all
around the county. And that's what this does, this proposal does before
you today.
In a nutshell, what it does is it creates three categories of
heliports or helistops. The first is a public heliport. That's exactly the
way it sounds, where air passengers from the public can take a
helicopter to and from the location.
Then there are private and public -- then there's a private use
heliport. That's again a facility that's a little bit more grandiose in
scope, but it is for a private use only.
And then finally, from Mr. Simmons' perspective, and most
important was what we called a private use helistop. And the
difference between a heliport and a helistop as discussed at length
before the planning commission is the helistop does not allow any
fueling or maintenance, heavy maintenance or repairs. So essentially
it's just a helipad. It's a place to keep the helicopter, fly in and fly out,
but if you need fueling, if you need major repairs, you have to go to a
more established grandiose facility.
In essence, the private use helistop is permitted as an accessory
use in the industrial zoning district. And all the other types of the
heliports, which are larger facilities, they must come before you for
conditional use approval.
So the idea was, given that transportation by air is already
permitted by permitted use, we're going to allow small private use
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helistops permitted as an accessory use in the industrial zone only, and
anything bigger than that that deals with fueling that might get into
bigger and greater concerns, that must be brought before you as a
conditional use.
A couple last comments, and I'll try to answer any questions you
may have. An important part of this is remember we're dealing only
with the industrial zoning district. And then on top of that there is a
1,500 foot setback from any residential zoning district or residential
component of a PUD. So we tried to build a fairly substantial setback
between any residential and the industrial zoning district where a
helipad or a helistop or heliport may be proposed.
Secondly, all of the Florida Department of Transportation and
FAA, Federal Aviation Administration, requirements, criteria,
standards, all of those have been incorporated and adopted. They are
very thick, they are very comprehensive. They go through a serious
notice process where everyone around, all the airports around get
notice of what you're proposing to do. And they have final say as to
whether a helipad or a helistop or a heliport is going to be approved in
the first place.
So we tried to build in all the safety measures to make sure this
doesn't fly out of control, so to speak. And at that point -- with that, I'll
close and try to answer any questions you may have.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: Yes, we'll start with Commissioner
Henning.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Are we approving each one of
these or all at once?
MS. FABACHER: We would be approving everything in the
amendment, which means the conditional uses, the accessory use, so
forth, based upon what's been submitted.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Okay. We're approving each of
the amendments --
MS. FABACHER: No. I'm sorry.
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October 16, 2007
COMMISSIONER HENNING: -- separately?
MS. F ABACHER: I'm sorry, Commissioner, no. This is our first
hearing, really. We're not approving anything. We're just taking
comments and hearing it for the first time. And this is the first time
we've heard about the heliports. So on October 24th we'll begin our
second hearing.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: That's the only question I have.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: That was a good question.
We'll go to Commissioner Halas.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Okay, it's my understanding, you
said that this has already been approved by the FAA, it's been
approved by the state, and that all the airports such as Naples Airport,
which is right across the street from them, basically have been notified
of what is being addressed here this evening as far as a change in the
Land Development Code in regards to a heliport, right -- or a helistop?
MR. BROOKER: This proposal itself does not require approval,
prior approval by the state or the federal government. What the state
law, what Florida law says is that the design and operational criteria of
all airports and these types of facilities are strictly their prerogative. A
county cannot even get into that business because of the highly expert
-- expertise that's required.
But what the county can do is impose zoning requirements such
as setbacks from various areas, and can tell the state and federal
governments where they would like to see or whether they would
permit in the first place.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: So what we have here is that the
final approach and takeoff has to be 1,500 feet away from any
residential area; is that correct?
MR. BROOKER: That's correct.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: So this has already been measured
out, that radius of where this is going to be located on -- what is it,
Enterprise?
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October 16, 2007
MR. BROOKER: Yes. And I have a map of that, if you'd like to
see it.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Yeah, I'd like to see that, please.
MR. BROOKER: This is a map of the county. And we tried to
highlight the industrial areas in the county by those little circles. This
area here is in the area where my client owns his property.
Now, what I'll do is I'll show you that area now with the
residential setback imposed, and you can see.
The airport is here. My client's property is somewhere around in here.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: And then what's to the south, right
in -- whoops, right there. Put your pointer. Bring it down, bring it
down, more, right there. Whoop. Back over.
See that little white block with -- it looks like a number of
streets? Right here. What area is that?
MR. BROOKER: That's a single-family three units per acre
zoning district.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Okay.
MR. BROOKER: And this is the measurement, the 1,500 foot
measurement back. So the yellow portion is where it is even possible
that someone could propose, per the proposal in front of you, to have a
helipad. So nothing could even be proposed here. The state and federal
government could not even entertain a proposal down in this area.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Okay. In this criteria that was given
to us here, it also says that the private use heliport are limited to use
by single-engine helicopters with a maximum takeoff weight not to
exceed 12,000 pounds. That's a pretty good size helicopter, wouldn't
you say?
MR. BROOKER: The idea -- I'm not an expert on helicopters,
but the idea was we looked at the various helicopters out there. And
actually, Mr. Schmitt had a lot of valuable input here, given his
military background. We wanted to make sure not a great big double
rotor type of aircraft would be able to come in. This aircraft is -- that
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October 16, 2007
12,000 pounds is probably a little larger than -- heavier than a typical
single rotor helicopter. And so what we were trying to do is give a
little bit of flexibility, but in fact what that does is it limits it to a
single rotor on what in the grand scheme of things, and whole scale of
the type of helicopters that are out there, on the smaller side.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: So would this be equivalent to a
Black Hawk helicopter?
MR. SCHMITT: Commissioner, no, it would not. This would
probably be equivalent to a commercial version, kind of a BellJet
Ranger. That type. A Black Hawk is much, much larger and certainly
would be a lot noisier.
But I have no idea what your client owns, but I had a vision of
something that size, almost a little bit smaller even than the EMS type
of helicopter that we have. And that's -- I can't even think of that --
that's Augulette (phonetic), but I can't remember what the --
COMMISSIONER HALAS: What the takeoff weight is on that?
MR. SCHMITT: No.
MR. BROOKER: In may add one other thing. I wanted to throw
in the proposal, because of the takeoff angles required by the FAA and
the Department of Transportation, we did not want to impose anything
on like a first-come first-serve basis and somehow infringe our
neighboring properties.
So what's built in here is when you get your approval from your
FAA and the FDOT, you must get the approval from those agencies,
assuming that your adjacent properties are fully built at the maximum
building height, even if they're not.
So you're preserving their property rights to be able to build to
their levels that they're entitled to today and not be able to somehow --
if you were to approve a helipad and a takeoff zone and now your next
door neighbor can't build a 25-story building because he's in a takeoff
path, we've eliminated that possibility by requiring the assumption that
everything is built to the maximum development standards around
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him. And that way we're not infringing on any private property rights
around us.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: Commissioner Fiala?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yes. Why are we considering -- why
aren't we considering just this particular helistop rather than now I saw
all those circles around there with industrial areas. And you mentioned
all these different purposes and heliports and helistops and private and
public.
So what we're actually doing is really opening the door for
misuse and abuse. I mean maybe this guy has a helicopter or
so-and-so, but you never can tell what else is coming in on all the
others. And I want to tell you, we have a lot of problems with things
like that. One guy may have the right intentions, but then other people
don't.
So why are we doing this for the whole county? Why aren't we
just considering this particular helistop? It's the guy that wants to do
this, Mr. Simmons, and why aren't we just considering that?
MR. BROOKER: Well, and that's a good question. And I think
the way to start off answering it is to say your existing code as it exists
right now that just allows transportation by air, there's no other criteria
in the code right now. So we are actually imposing more restrictions,
more limitations that currently exist in the code today.
So when we came before the staff, the staff asked us to make sure
that it's going to apply throughout the county so we're not making sure
someone else can do something that's perhaps not desirable.
And so what we're proposing is a set of criteria that does not exist
today. For example, in any of those circled areas you saw on that map,
someone could come in and place a public heliport. Because
transportation by air is permitted right now. And that's a staff decision
right now. And if staff wanted to say no, then you've got a fight on
your hands, because it is a permitted use as of right in the industrial
zoning district today.
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This stops that. This gives control to the county from a
conditional use process standpoint for any of the heliports, whether
they're private or public. This board will have the right to, say, impose
conditions or flat-out reject it if that's deemed appropriate by the
commISSIOn.
So we believe it's just the opposite, that what we are proposing,
maybe it's a little bit legal in nature, but I don't think I could propose
zoning for just my property. That might be considered spot zoning, I
don't know. But I couldn't come in and just say I want this on my
property and no one else gets it. But I'll let Mr. Klatzkow weigh in if
you think that's appropriate.
But the purpose here was give a full set of criteria and close the
holes that exist today in the code.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: Jeff, do you--
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Go ahead, that's okay.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: If! may.
Jeff, did you have anything to add?
MR. KLATZKOW: Well, it might be a problem just doing just
this area. But if that's the will of the board, we can certainly sit down
and try to work through that problem, if we can. I'm not saying we
can, but if that's the will of the board, we can try to work through that
problem.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: I have some concerns here. I know
we've been through this thing with the airport before like Everglades
City, remember we had that discussion about how do you declassify
an airport? And you don't. Basically when it's declared an airport, it's
an airport forever. I mean, to try to get it declassified practically takes
an act of Congress.
By giving this type of permission, anyone that establishes a
heliport, will that be the same as considered an airport under the
regulations that govern that?
MR. BROOKER: I don't believe so. That gets into criteria
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promulgated by the FAA and the State Department of Transportation.
And I know there are monitoring requirements and reporting
requirements on a routine basis. And at any time if things are violated
or gets out of control, the FAA and the Department of Transportation
come in and take care of it. But that's more their role, as I understand
it, than county zoning.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: Well, here's what I'm getting at, is you
already said that you've made allowances in here for what the building
heights are going to be, the maximum possible building heights. But
you made no allowances for what people may want to do with their
lands 20 years from now. If this is permitted, then everybody would
be held to a criteria from then on out that they wouldn't be able to do
anything different. That's my concern.
And then we have to deal with the federal government because
now we designated this an airport. Now, you know, try to give me a
little comfort level on this so that --
MR. BROOKER: Well, I guess if in fact 20 years from now the
code changes and a helipad has been established somewhere, I think
the zoning district would have to reflect that there's now a helipad in
existence. Now, if the helipad is abandoned, probably things can be
done in that regard.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: The thing isn't so much as it would be
abandoned. Suppose the heliport wants to stay there. It determines
everything else that would happen within a certain radius what could
take place. There may be -- I mean, I can't foresee the future. There
may be a time coming when the industrial zones don't fit into what's
going to happen. Possibly they may want to build high-rise buildings
or they may -- any number of things.
But now the limitations to the industrial zone, at least wherever
there's a heliport, forever more is limited to what the code is now, and
it can't change because the federal government's going to oversee --
now, I'm not saying we automatically determine this to be fact. We
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don't. But if this goes forward to bring it back again, maybe you
would be prepared to answer some of these questions. Possibly the
people that are in this industrial zone that are landowners might have
some concern over what's going to happen to their property in the
future. Will it still have the same retail value with this limitation put
on by this industrial use?
MR. BROOKER: I can tell you the only feedback I've had from
other industrial property owners is why the 1,500 foot setback. If your
property is going to meet that setback, we want it too. And that means
the people in the blue area around this yellow area, they wanted to
have this right to put this on there.
And the comment to me was did you tailor fit the 1,500 feet just
to meet your property? And to a certain extent that's true.
And so I've taken away property rights from certain people by
converting it to a conditional use in some areas.
And I understand the question, and perhaps I can say that a
property owner's rights are framed by what is allowed today. You
have no expectation greater than that. So 20 years from now, if
someone complains that well, back 20 years ago they placed a helipad
and that's now circumscribing my property rights, no, it's not. Because
20 years you didn't have those private property rights bigger or better
than you had back then.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: No, you're absolutely correct on that.
But still, if I was a landowner there and I was going to be looking to
resell my property or give it to my children, this would become a
criteria of future development that would have me concerned. Now I
have to deal with the federal what do you call it aviation --
MR. SCHMITT: FAA.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: FAA. I'm going to have to be able to
deal with them in order to be able to get anything changed. I'm locked
m.
Sure, I'm fine now. I'm fine for the immediate future. But
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whatever that future is, my future is now dependent upon this heliport.
And forgive me, maybe I'm thinking way beyond what I should,
but somebody has to have some forward thinking on this to make sure
that the rights down the road.
Also, too, let me ask you this: Suppose we're putting this
ordinance together to give them the power to be able to go forward to
be able to set up a heliport which will come under the federal
guidelines and regulations and everything. Would we ever have the
power to be able to withdraw that permission, or would we be locked
in because now the federal government's at play in it?
I know we ran into this problem when we were discussing a long
time ago about the Airport Authority over Everglades Airport.
MR. BROOKER: You would certainly have the ability to amend
this proposal to play around with the setback or do whatever --
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: No, I mean to be able to eliminate the
use.
MR. BROOKER: Eliminate the use altogether? Yes, you could
do that.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: Okay.
MR. BROOKER: But whatever was in existence would be
grandfathered in at that point.
COMMISSIONER COLETTA: But I mean -- okay.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: I think I could help you.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: And my concern too is the fact that
suppose it goes in there and it becomes a detriment to the whole
industrial complex, the noise, the background, the dust that comes
from it. Now they're grandfathered in and we've got the problem. How
do we eliminate it? All we'd be able to do is maybe eliminate it in
future places.
Just a bunch of issues that really haven't been answered. I don't
know what's happened in other areas of the country where this has
taken place, if there's been negative connotations to it or not. Listen,
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I've had enough time here.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Jeff wanted to answer that for you.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: Go ahead.
MR. KLATZKOW: One approach you might want to discuss is
creating this as a conditional use. If you were to create these things as
a conditional use, then you could put conditions in there. You could
put say we'll look at this every five, 10 years and, you know, see
what's happening in the community, or whatever conditions the board
-- would please the board at that point in time. And that's how you
would tackle that issue.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: Okay, that sounds interesting.
MR. BROOKER: And if I may comment on that. That was the
beginning of all of this, the -- I won't call it a dispute but a
disagreement between my client who purchased this property with the
right to put an airport on it ifhe wanted to, under current law. And
then the staff said no. Even though the code was very clear that he
could place air courier services, scheduled and non-scheduled air
transportation, helicopter carriers, air ambulance services. Matter of
right, can go there today.
Then staff -- even though that's the case, that's true, that's a right
he holds today, staff said no, you have to pay the $3,000 to propose
this private amendment, even though that's the law today. And they
said, well, what about making it a conditional use?
And we thought we have narrowed this down to the most finite
thing that we are able to live with, a huge buffer. Everyone else, if you
want to go with a heliport that has facilities for fueling and repairs,
that's a conditional use.
But given what the law is today, given the fact that my client was
forced to come before you to propose something, notwithstanding
what the law is today, this is what we're able to live with.
And my client, he's not here today, but I would imagine he would
object to making what he is proposing, which is a very limited
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October 16, 2007
proposal, from his perspective, a conditional use. Because now you're
a year and a half down the road again and tens of thousands of dollars
in fees, even though the existing law is on --
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: Be as it may, you know, we're here
today to be able to discuss this all out. And we appreciate your input.
Let's go to Commissioner Halas, then Commissioner Henning,
then Commissioner Fiala.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: So in this geographical area there
can be more of these helistops there; is that correct?
MR. BROOKER: Pursuant to the zoning requirements, yes.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: So long as they're in that white area
there.
MR. BROOKER: Right. Whether the FAA would allow that is an
entirely different question, because they're going to be looking at
established airports, traffic patterns, all of that sort of thing.
And that's another point I can make is they -- the FAA comes in
and does a very comprehensive study of everything that surrounds
your proposed site. And they design a takeoff and approach corridor
that is the best one from their perspective in terms of not impacting
other people on the ground.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Why do they want to do this when
they have right across the street the Naples Airport?
MR. BROOKER: I asked that same question. They said that he
has a right to fly a helicopter ifhe'd like to, number one.
And then number two, apparently in 2005 during the hurricane
season he lost a tremendous amount of business opportunities from the
Charlotte County area because he could not spend the manpower to
drive up and back to Charlotte County.
He apparently has the wherewithal to purchase a helicopter and
he would be able to take advantage of those business opportunities
which are at a greater distance and from his perspective and analysis
in a cost effective way. And that's why he wants it on the property
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October 16, 2007
there.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: But he's less than half a mile away
from the Naples Airport.
MR. BROOKER: Correct.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Just drive over there half a mile. I
don't -- it's -- I'm trying to figure out where this Jeanie's going to get
out of the bottle and how we're going to get it back in.
And if the man is -- the person that's asking for this lives within
less than half a mile or half a mile of Naples Airport, it seems to me
that ifhe's got the ability to purchase a helicopter, he's got the ability
to have a tie-down over there at Naples Airport or something to store
this.
MR. BROOKER: He considers it a value added service to his
business to be able to land and take off straight from his location and
serve his clients better.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Where does he live?
MR. BROOKER: Sorry?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Where does he live?
MR. BROOKER: Where does he live?
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Yeah.
MR. BROOKER: I have no idea.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: I wonder if he's thinking about
flying from his residence to this location.
MR. BROOKER: He lives in the City of Naples, so that would
be a short flight.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Okay.
MR. BROOKER: To give you an idea that the comprehensive
nature of the FAA -- if we're worrying about the Jeanie getting out of
the bottle, I think it might be -- perhaps I can allay your concern in
this way: That the comprehensive regulations are inches thick. For
example, for site approval from the FDOT alone, and I'm not even
getting into FAA, you have to give notice to all VFR airports and
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October 16, 2007
helipads within three miles and all IFR airports within 10 miles. You
have to give a statement of compliance from your local government,
which would be Collier County, including any governments within
five miles of your site. You have to give notice to all property owners
within 300 feet of you. You have to give notice to the general public
by an advertisement in the newspaper. You have to give a memo of
understanding regarding air traffic pattern separation with all airports
within three miles of your site. And you have to have FAA approval.
That's a summary of the FDOT requirements.
So there's a lot of thought and a lot of paperwork and a lot of
analysis that goes into each proposed site. And so to think that there's
going to be helipads all throughout the county I think is -- I don't
believe it's realistic.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Okay.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Question.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: Yes, go ahead, Commissioner
Henning.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Susan, what types of businesses
using a helicopter can operate out of the Industrial Park today? Air
transportation. So you can actually have an airport there.
MS. ISTENES: Technically yes, I believe you could.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: So air transportation, ABC
helicopter rides, could you have that today?
MS. ISTENES: I believe you could, Commissioner.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: So I don't know why we're
discussing this so much. If somebody wants to provide an extra value
service to his customers and have that helicopter on top of his
building, if it's already allowed then, you know, what's the fuss? I
don't understand, from the rest of the colleagues.
MS. ISTENES: I will agree with -- I'm sorry.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: If a business can ride around
with a clown in the sky with a helicopter, can do it today, what's
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October 16, 2007
wrong with somebody using that in their business?
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: You're asking the question directly of
commissioners?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Yeah.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: Go ahead. I'd like to respond, in may.
The truth of the matter is it is here before us today. And the reason
we're discussing it is to be able to find out if we want to move forward
at this point in time to be able to give it a place in our Land
Development Code, to be able to identify what the use is.
I don't know if there's a negative connotation to this or not. I just
raised a number of questions that I have that I really don't have the
answers yet. It may be truly permissible. And if the people there don't
mind it, I don't have a problem with it.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Well, the argument about the
Everglades Airport, the issue with that is we accepted grants for the
development of that airport. That was the whole issue with that. So it's
not that we can't use it for other things, but there's some paybacks to
the federal government.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: But you do agree to the fact,
Commissioner Henning, that if we do this that they'll have to limit the
building heights from then on out, whatever they are.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: No. What you have in zoning
districts now, it is what it is. Now, if the board wants to change that,
let's say raise that, that would be an inhibitor. But in a matter of fact,
just two years ago we lowered the height in the commercial districts.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: That's true, we did.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: So I can see the only thing that
we're going to do is lower it more instead of, you know, raising it.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: You don't know that. You're putting
20 years or some time in the distant future when they may need to do
this. And at that point in time, not only could this ordinance get in
front of us, but the federal government could.
Page 18
October 16, 2007
That was just questions. And I'm not saying I really know the
answers, I don't. I'm just raising the questions.
But let's go, anybody else wants to address.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Commissioner Fiala.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: Go ahead, Commissioner Fiala.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Commissioner Halas said before, he
was talking about this particular area, but actually this amendment
affects all of the industrial areas you had circled; is that correct?
MR. BROOKER: Yeah, it applies to every industrial zoning
district in the county. And once you -- some zoning districts are so
small that once you apply the 1,500 foot setback, it completely
swallows the zoning district. So no helipads would be allowed there at
all.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Now, my second question is staff
must have had a reason for their concern. And you were saying before,
you were kind of complaining a little bit that you had to be here and
you didn't think you should be. But staff must have had a reason for
their concern.
Susan, could you tell me what your reasoning is?
MS. ISTENES: I actually probably will defer to Catherine,
because I know her and Clay have worked pretty extensively on this in
kind of trying to break down the issues and trying to break down the
various uses within the industrial zoning district.
I will say, we obviously don't deal with this that much. And this
actually does -- I will agree with Clay, this actually does kind of
tighten the position and the regulations as far as dealing with these
types of uses. So from that perspective I think it's a good thing,
because I think the way things are written in the code now, and I think
that was probably part of the issue of the debate, it's fairly loose and
not clear.
And I'm talking in generalities. Maybe Catherine can give you a
little bit more definitive.
Page 19
October 16, 2007
MS. F ABACHER: Thank you, Susan.
Under the SIC code, transportation by air included activities that
were all for the public; sightseeing, these various sort of things where
people paid money to do it.
As far as the staff was concerned, this was not for a private use,
this was public use. People paid money, go to the fairgrounds, want to
take a little helicopter view, you want to take a -- you need to take a
helicopter somewhere.
As far as we were concerned under the SIC code, transportation
by air involved services that people paid for and it was a public
service. We couldn't see that a private use of a helicopter at a helipad
or a helistop was included in this use, which is why we recommended
that it go as an accessory use to a permitted use.
But that was staffs concern, that this use was not permitted by
right in the industrial district. What was permitted by right were these
different air carriers that you paid a fee for or sightseeing trips on a
helicopter. That's what the SIC code says. So we're having a
difference on that.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay, so what you're really saying
then is you're trying to tighten up the Land Development Code with
this amendment. And also that you recommend approval?
MS. F ABACHER: I'm going to defer to Joe on that.
MR. SCHMITT: Commissioner, we met with Mr. Brooker and
his client, Susan, Catherine, some other staff members, and there was
concern, exactly what Catherine said.
But the second piece is we offered to Clay for clarification
submit for an official interpretation, we would render an opinion, and
of course that could be appealed to the BZA. We also discussed the
option why don't we just look at amending the LDC to clarify
locations. And we worked with Clay, the staff worked with Clay in
really tightening I'll call it a noose around this. Because we did. And
trying to make sure that number one, depending -- and there's three
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October 16,2007
options that you see in your proposal.
And this is really a private helistop, which was going to be
deemed a permitted use, a private -- a public heliport or some other
measure they would go through a conditional use. So there was
different thresholds. And that's how we got to where we are today. So
this does add some discipline to it and it does define criteria.
And the federal process is a very laborious process. This is the
first phase that -- the applicant still has to go through the FAA
application. I spoke to Ted Soliday about this at the airfield as well.
He's been well briefed on this. He knows about it.
It's just the mere fact of once they get the identification, it's
identified, notice to airmen, this goes out to update a chart. They're
under control of the approach at the Naples tower. That's all under
approach. That's nothing we have to worry about.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: But that's just this one. There's a lot
of them that they could -- is there a downside to this?
MR. SCHMITT: Frankly, the downside is going to be will it
create a nuisance? Will somebody complain about the noise?
I even sent an e-mail to --
MR. BROOKER: Grey Oaks.
MR. SCHMITT: -- Grey Oaks. And I'm trying to think of --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Tom Sansbury.
MR. SCHMITT: Thank you. Tom Sansbury. Sent Tom a note
saying, Tom, are you aware of this. Sent him the LDC amendment,
your Grey Oaks staff, the foundation needs to be aware of this.
And basically he responded but never had any concern. I
informed him as well of the hearing dates and no one raised any
objection to it.
The approach is going to be clearly controlled as part of their
application. We have noise ordinances that we can uphold.
I'm not trying to defend this, I'm just trying to point out we've
been through this pretty thoroughly, and I think what we have here
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October 16,2007
gives us more discipline and more oversight and control than kind of
what we had in the past which was debating whether a heliport could
go in there and if somebody wanted to have a private air taxi service
or a public free rides down the beach service, I guess. And this gives
us a little more control.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: Okay?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yeah, I guess. And so does that
mean then they can do this by right?
MS. ISTENES: It depends on what they're proposing. Because
they've got private use heliports, which would be allowed as a
conditional use, so that would be a public hearing. And then they have
public use heliports, which again would be allowed as a conditional
use in industrial. So that also would be a public hearing.
And then you have private use helistops. And that is allowed as
an accessory use to a permitted principal use in the industrial zoning
district. And the differences are defined under number two, three and
four on Page 6.
And so to answer your question, Commissioner, yes, a private
use helistop would be allowed by right as an accessory to a principal
use permitted by right in the industrial zoning district. The other two
types would require conditional use approval.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Thank you.
MR. BROOKER: As long as that setback is met.
MS. ISTENES: Yes, yes, thank you.
And Jeffpointed out, you know, you could always as a condition
of a conditional use approval ask that it be reevaluated or brought
back to you or set time limits on its approval so that let's say you say
well, we want to reevaluate this in two years to see if there's been any
problems. We could -- you know, we could put that as a condition of
approval and it could come back into another public hearing forum for
further discussion. So that's the benefit of the conditional use.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I would like that. I would feel a little
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October 16, 2007
more comfort with that.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: I would, too. Let's go to
Commissioner Halas.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Maybe staff can answer this
question.
Was this pretty well vented (sic) by the planning commission?
MR. SCHMITT: Commissioner, yes. It was --
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Was there a lot of time spent on
this?
MR. SCHMITT: Commissioner, yes. It was debated probably
two different hearings, and I'm thinking well over a couple hours each
hearing as we went through this process.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Okay. So I can see from the vote
they must have felt very comfortable of where they ended up with on
this, the planning commission.
MR. SCHMITT: At the end, yes. By the time we went through
all this and we created this thing defined called private use helistops, I
think that solved the problem with the planning commission. And this
would be an exclusive private use. It would be restricted only to this
individual, basically.
MR. BROOKER: They did make it painful for us.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Okay. I have a better level of
comfort on this then. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: Commissioner Henning?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Well, I'm just amazed. And I'm
trying to find the SIC code for private heliport. But I'm amazed that
your client can apply for an application for -- to take a ride with Funky
The Clown in a helicopter, but he can't use it in the business. And I'm
just trying to find the difference between public uses versus one
individual business use. And it must be defined in the SIC somewhere;
is that right?
MS. FABACHER: Well, Commissioners, since this is the first
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October 16, 2007
hearing, we can provide that information for you. But the uses that
they provided for under this SIC code were all public carriers.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Public carriers. But there must
be an SIC code for a private carrier then.
MR. BROOKER: If I may jump in. And I researched that and I
could find nothing. And so that was what we used as support for our
argument. If all of these things, a 24/7 scheduled on the hour leaving
and taking off helicopter is permitted, there's no other SIC code that
we could fall under, then this must fall under what we are proposing.
And that didn't get very far.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: I don't have any problem with it
already because, you know, somebody could have a 24-hour service in
an industrial area to where I think he's just going to be using this for
his business and maybe pleasure.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: And we have two commissioners so
far, I don't know if we've got a third, that would like to see that
additional language added to it that would give us the right to be able
to review it at a future date.
MS. ISTENES: Actually, that's already your right. It doesn't have
to be spelled out in the Land Development Code. That's really an
inherent right within the conditional use process to attach conditions
of approval to that. And that could be one of the conditions that you
could attach.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: So are we doing this as a
conditional use?
MS. ISTENES: Well, let me clarify that. Like I read earlier, you
have two uses that are conditional, and you have one which is
accessory to permitted principal, provided it meets the setbacks. And I
believe that is -- Clay's client in particular would fall under that
category number four on Page 7. So that would not be a conditional
use. So they would be just a use permitted by right.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: As an accessory use.
Page 24
October 16,2007
MS. ISTENES: You know, your option would be to require that
it be a conditional use like the others. That's your option, if you want
to change that.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Why don't we figure that out in
the next hearing?
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: Okay.
MR. SCHMITT: Just to put things in perspective, if you own 20
acres out in, let's say, beyond the Estates somewhere and you built a
large home and you wanted to fly an aircraft from out there into the
airport, it's again a matter of applying and notifying the FAA that
you're going to move an airplane or in this case a helicopter from a
private location. That's kind of what we're talking about here.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Is that a conditional use?
MR. SCHMITT: Well, that again depends on zoning,
Commissioner. If you're out there in an area that is ag., there really is
no restriction. You can land a helicopter out there, if you had a home
out there. It depends on the zoning. That's the first phase of this. This
is a piece where they're actually getting the local government to sign
off in saying they agree on the use, and then he goes through the
process of applying through the FAA.
But to answer your question, Commissioner Henning, we'd have
to research to find out if in fact if you were out in ago in that area and
built a home and you had a helicopter, could you land it there and park
it there. Most likely yes.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: I was just trying to understand
where you were going.
MR. SCHMITT: Well, this is using a similar type of discussion
with the business park. This is a private use business for a helicopter
and it's private transportation. We're just trying to add a little more
control with this criteria that we're developing.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Okay, let's move on.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: No, Commissioner Fiala.
Page 25
October 16, 2007
COMMISSIONER FIALA: I just want to ask a fast question.
What does Funky The Clown have to do with a helicopter?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Funky The Clown has been in
Golden Gate for years and years. And I just --
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Threw him on the helicopter?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Threw him on the helicopter.
Take a ride with blow-up balloons.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: I like how we can blend these things
together.
I think we are ready to move on.
MS. F ABACHER: All right. Thank you, Commissioners. Thank
you, Clay.
Originally -- I'm on sheet C of the summary sheets. And
originally we had intended to hear permits for outdoor serving areas
tonight. However, we have received additional direction to modify this
amendment, and so we are requesting that we bring it back on the 24th
with the modifications that would bear on this.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: What's the -- how drastic is the
modifications?
MS. FABACHER: We're looking at another section in the
modifications. And what we're looking at, it goes to the planning
commission on the 18th.
What we're looking at is giving the -- under SDP review,
although a use may be permitted under the underlined zoning, it may
be permitted under the PUD document or what passes for that now,
but when you come down to it, SDP, the signing of the use, it might
be a fine use in a certain location, but when it's less than -- when it's
less than 300 feet from residential, it may not be.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: You answered my question
when you said it's going to go through the planning commission.
MS. FABACHER: On the 18th.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Because if it's going to be a
Page 26
October 16, 2007
different animal, I think they ought to weigh in on it.
MS. F ABACHER: Yes, sir.
Okay. All right. And I'm going to go back and on our summary
sheet. And we have really done a good job, because we've heard
almost everything the first time.
There was a question, though, on our last meeting on October the
11th was to come back and ask Mr. Joe Thompson to come back and
talk about TDRs. And he's here tonight.
And I'm on sheet M, and I'm under section 2.03.07.D, special
treatment overlay ST, Page 141 in your book.
When we discussed this on the 11 th, we didn't have the benefit of
having Joe here, and we got kind of tangled up. And so now we've
asked -- you requested that he come back to kind of explain on Page
141 and Page 145 in the bluebook. Do you have your bluebook?
MR. THOMPSON: I actually have. I don't know if this is an
older one. Mine's on 135, so --
MS. FABACHER: Well, I'm giving them their pages. Sorry.
I have one here, if you want.
MR. THOMPSON: For the record, Joe Thompson,
comprehensive planning.
This first one here, if it's on 141, the same one that the board's
looking at, it's really a simple administrative change. Initially the code
just references that severance applicants have to submit a title search
for other evidence sufficient to establish, which really doesn't have a
legal backing to it. So we're requiring that they submit a title opinion.
It's really just a matter of something that's more stringent.
In conjunction with that, in terms of process right now, there's no
requirement for a GAP affidavit or any affidavit that would basically
attest to the time frame between the date of the initial title opinion
that's submitted and also the time that we would record the instrument
that's associated with TDR severance.
So by having this as a requirement, it's really a fail safe that
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October 16, 2007
shows us that gap period where something could have been recorded
that would have restricted residential development.
So as a result now that we have this signed by the owner, that
won't be an issue. And that's really the -- that's the main focus of this
first amendment here. Just a process, procedural change.
COMMISSIONER HALAS: Okay.
MR. THOMPSON: I guess moving on to 145. Real simply, this
one has to do with environmental restoration and maintenance bonus
associated with the TDR program. If it's a private restoration and
maintenance plan, the applicant has to submit financial surety to the
county, just to show us that they're going to actually maintain the
restoration and maintenance.
And initially it was -- a performance and surety bond was
required. But in dealing with this about a year ago, we had an
applicant come in that wasn't really familiar with how to go about
getting one of those, and we thought an easier route would be a letter
of credit because it's an instrument that the board is familiar with and
you see routinely. So we went ahead and went with that, and you
actually approved on I think last November.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: Any questions?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: Please move on.
MR. THOMPSON: Okay, thanks.
MS. F ABACHER: Thank you, Commissioners.
Actually, we've covered everything except the pink book which,
as you recall are the land use lists. And we were ready to discuss it
tonight, but over the weekend we received some comments that we
need to address and we need to research. And so we thought we could
more fully address these comments and present to you on the 24th on
the land use list, which you recall is going to replace the tables. So
that's it.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Well, there's some other things
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October 16, 2007
here. There's some strike-throughs on this list that changes the
meaning. Let me find them. And they talk about numbering things.
Like on Page 73.
MS. F ABACHER: Are we in the pink book, Commissioner?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Yes.
MS. F ABACHER: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Number two, it says accessory
uses. You have some strike-throughs. Uses and structures that are
accessory, those are struck through.
MS. F ABACHER: Commissioner, that's just because it's
redundant. Accessory use is a defined term and we don't need to
explain it again if we define it.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Where did you define it at?
MS. FABACHER: It's defined in the very front of the LDC.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Okay. So it's in the definitions?
MS. F ABACHER: It's in the definitions, so we thought that this
was redundant from the old language. And we did look at the
amendment that you did refer to us and we agree that there is a
problem there and that it might be a Muni. code problem. And because
of your comments over the weekend, we have decided to look at it
with paralegals and really look at it very -- give it intense scrutiny
again, and like I said come back on the 24th, because we haven't had
quite the he time. But thank you for your comments.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Not bad for the village idiot.
The accessory uses are strucken (sic) out of all of the zoning
districts. Is that true that they're within the definition of the Land
Development Code? Like agricultural, residential, estates. Those
accessory uses is strucken.
MS. F ABACHER: Which page are we on, Commissioner?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: I mean, it doesn't matter. I'mjust
saying -- well, let's say Page 11. Again number two, accessory use is
stricken in the Golden Gate Estates district. And you're saying that is
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October 16, 2007
in the definition of a Land Development Code --
MS. F ABACHER: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: -- under each zoning district.
MS. F ABACHER: I'm saying that accessory uses, as bolded out,
identifies a defined term in the code, and the code defines what an
accessory use is. Therefore, we thought it was redundant to explain --
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Right.
MS. FABACHER: -- that they're accessory and incidental. We
haven't struck the uses, we just thought we wanted to --
COMMISSIONER HENNING: And that applies to all of the
zoning districts.
MS. F ABACHER: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: That's my only point.
MS. FABACHER: Yes, sir. We're not striking the uses. We're
just saying it's a defined term and that we don't need to explain it
twice.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: And there's some other
strike-throughs in here. I think you did it because it is not allowed
legally, such as owning and maintenance and operating a facility and a
part thereof for the following purposes is prohibited (sic). It's saying
it's prohibited, fighting and abating of animals by owners of such
facilities.
You're striking that out because you can't do that anyways, right?
MS. FABACHER: Exactly, sir. It was listed. It's a prohibited use,
but it's listed under the uses saying you can't do it. So we said under
modern code terms it's a prohibited use. So we simply took it from the
discussion under the permitted uses and said no, this is prohibited, and
made it what it is. I mean, it's kind of our thing to update the code.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Well, I understand. But the
understanding of this, this is a codification -- or recodification of the
code. That was my understanding of it. And what we have here is in
some parts is just a correction.
Page 30
October 16,2007
MS. F ABACHER: Exactly, sir. Trying to upgrade it and make it
proper. To be in the uses and say you definitely cannot do this, well,
to me that's a prohibited use. And we just simply moved it from the
permitted uses where it said thou shalt not to the prohibited uses which
made it pretty clear that this can't be done.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Right. So maybe just in the
clarification in the front is where it addressed it in the different
ordinances, you know, just a double strike through or something of,
you know, it's outdated or something like that.
MS. F ABACHER: You're right. And we did not clearly identify
these changes for you, and that's why we want to do it again on the
24th. Because we have staff looking at it to strictly tell you exactly
what was done.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Okay, thank you.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: Commissioner Fiala?
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Yes, just to comment a little bit
further on Commissioner Henning's comments where you say that it's
redundant. Like accessory uses.
MS. F ABACHER: Yes, ma'am.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: And you say it's already in the front
of the LDC.
MS. F ABACHER: Yes, ma'am.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Are there ever people like me who
don't know the code very well, who don't understand it very well that
would read it and then would not know to go to the front or would
prefer to see the definition right there rather than try and fish through
and find it just for ease of reading?
This is wonderful for people who like a Clay Brooker or staff
members who know it, but maybe for somebody like me, it would be
nice to have it right there so they understand what the definition is.
MS. F ABACHER: I understand, Commissioner, but --
MS. ISTENES: Catherine, can I respond to that?
Page 31
October 16, 2007
MS. FABACHER: I'm sorry, go ahead, Susan.
MS. ISTENES: Because it's actually what I would call one of the
improvements we made when we recodified.
The reason you'll see the bolded words there is because that
identifies words in the text that are actually defined in the LDC in the
definition section. Whereas before in the old LDC you would read a
term and you would say oh, gee, I wonder if that's defined in here and
then you'd have to flip back.
This catches your attention and it says this is a defined term, by
being bold. And I believe that is in the beginning of the code and it
says that, you know, defined terms are bolded within the text. So it
culls it out to you that this is defined and you can then go back and
read the definition in the code.
Yeah, there's a lot of fine print in the LDC, so you would
certainly have to know that a bolded word is something that's defined,
and you would have to read that in the LDC. But it is actually better
this way than it was before, because you would just never know if a
term was defined without having to go look it up. I hope that helps.
MS. FABACHER: Excuse me, Commissioner, you can always
call me.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: That's me. I mean, I wonder if Jane
Smith is reading it.
MS. FABACHER: Jane calls me all the time.
MS. ISTENES: You know, another nice thing about having this
on Muni. code is a tool, and I don't know if you used it yet, but it's
actually the search tool on Muni. code. If you pull it up on-line, you
can actually do a word search or a phrase search, and it will search
every part of the LDC for that word and where that word is used
within the text of the LDC.
So I was looking up something the other day to do with alcohol,
and so I put in alcohol, alcoholic, you know, all-- and everywhere in
the code it pulled up where that word was referenced.
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October 16, 2007
That's a very, very handy tool. And now that we have everything
on-line in Muni. code, I'd recommend you check that out as well.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay, thanks. That would make it
easier for others, too.
MS. F ABACHER: Commissioner, to expand on what Susan's
saying, if you would were run accessory use, the first hit that you
would get from Muni. code would be in the definitions to tell you
what it was.
COMMISSIONER FIALA: Okay. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: I think we're all set.
MS. F ABACHER: All right, Commissioners, that's what we have
tonight. We plan to meet with you again to continue this meeting, the
second hearing, on to October 24th at 9:00 a.m. in these chambers,
and at that point you'll be hearing all of these amendments for the
second time but the first time for the outdoor seating.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: Commissioner Henning?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: I sent a couple -- Catherine, I
sent you an e-mail.
MS. F ABACHER: Yes.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: I haven't received a response. I
sent an e-mail to Bruce McNall, I haven't received a response.
MS. F ABACHER: No, Commissioner, I believe he did respond
to you. I was copied on that one.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Right. But I also responded back
to him.
MS. F ABACHER: Subsequent one?
COMMISSIONER HENNING: And my issue was the way the
maps are drawn out, or a particular vegetation species, you can find
them in other districts wild --
MS. F ABACHER: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: -- growing wild. But they're not
allowed. So the further away from the coast, the less choices that you
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October 16, 2007
have for -- to use vegetation.
MS. F ABACHER: No, excuse me, sir, but the farther away from
the coastline, they have more choices, because they have less native
requirements.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: They have less native
requirements.
MS. F ABACHER: The farther away from the coastal zone you
get to the inland zone and the mid zone and they have less of a
requirement for native because of the salt.
But I understand your comments and I'd be happy to have Bruce
back here on our next meeting.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Yeah. I mean in my house I have
seagrape, but it's not allowed in the district, or Cocoa plum or wax
myrtle, I think.
MS. F ABACHER: Sir, I'm going to have Bruce here, because I'm
no landscape architect.
MS. ISTENES: The requirements are -- for certain plant types
are requirements for the required buffer. So when you have a
commercial zoning district, for example, and you have a required
buffer around a parking lot, for example, depending on your location
that buffer has to be comprised of a certain percentage of native
plants. When it comes to just your home, I mean, and this is going
from memory here, there may be some restrictions like for the ficus
and things like that. But I don't think there is restrictions on anything
else as far as just residents. But I'm just shooting, you know, from
memory here.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: Right. But in want to rezone my
property from residential to a bar, I couldn't use those type of
plantings. And maybe if Bruce just e-mails me, we can have that
conversation.
MS. ISTENES: Okay, we'll do that.
MS. F ABACHER: Commissioner, we'll be happy to bring him
Page 34
October 16, 2007
back on the 24th.
COMMISSIONER HENNING: I'm not sure if it's really needed.
I'm not sure if the other commissioners really have a question about it.
Maybe we can settle it with communication. That's all.
MS. F ABACHER: Thank you.
Commissioner, that's all we have tonight.
CHAIRMAN COLETTA: We're adjourned. Thank you very
much.
*****
There being no further business for the good of the County, the
meeting was adjourned by order of the Chair at 6:10 p.m.
BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS/EX
OFFICIO GOVERNING BOARD(S) OF
SPECIAL DISTRICTS UNDER ITS CONTROL
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These minutes approved by the Board on i Ilr;(f;2
presented ~. or as corrected
, as
Page 35
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