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CLB Minutes 09/19/2007 R September 19, 2007 TRANSCRIPT OF THE MEETING OF THE CONTRACTOR LICENSING BOARD Naples, Florida September 19, 2007 LET IT BE REMEMBERED, that the Contractor Licensing Board in and for the County of Collier, having conducted business herein, met on this date at 9:00 a.m. in REGULAR SESSION in Building "F" of the Government Complex, East Naples, Florida, with the following members present: CHAIRMAN: Les Dickson (Absent) Acting Chairman: Richard Joslin Sydney Blum Michael Boyd Eric Guite' (Absent) Glenn Herriman Lee Horn (Absent) Ann Keller William Lewis (Absent) ALSO PRESENT: Patrick Neale, Attorney to the Board Robert Zachary, Assistant County Attorney Tom Bartoe, Licensing Compliance Officer Michael Ossorio, Contractor Licensing Supervisor Page 1 AGENDA COLLIER COUNTY CONTRACTORS' LICENSING BOARD DATE: WEDNESDAY - SEPTEMBER 19, 2007 TIME: 9:00 A.M. W. HARMON TURNER BUILDING (ADMINISTRATION BUILDING) COURTHOUSE COMPLEX ANY PERSON WHO DECIDES TO APPEAL A DECISION OF THIS BOARD WILL NEED A RECORD OF THE PROCEEDINGS PERTAINING THERETO, AND THEREFORE MAY NEED TO ENSURE THAT A VERBATIM RECORD OF THE PROCEEDINGS IS MADE, WHICH RECORD INCLUDES THAT TESTIMONY AND EVIDENCE UPON WHICH THE APPEAL IS TO BE BASED. I. ROLL CALL II. ADDITIONS OR DELETIONS: III. APPROVAL OF AGENDA: IV. APPROVAL OF MINUTES: DATE: July 18, 2007 V. DISCUSSION: VI. NEW BUSINESS: Dora Goren - Review of experience affidavits for Floor Covering. John Aldrich - Review of credit report. Joseph A. lafomaro - Review of contractor related misdemeanor. VII. OLD BUSINESS: VIII PUBLIC HEARINGS: Case #2007 -09 Case #2007-10 Case #2007-11 IX. REPORTS: X. NEXT MEETING DATE: Samuel Greenwood d/b/a Greenwood, Inc. Scott Perry d/b/a A+ Air Condo & Heating of SW Florida, Inc. Douglas Scott White d/b/a Guardian Technologies of SW Florida THURSDAY OCTOBER 18, 2007 COLLIER COUNTY DEVELOPMENT SERVICES CENTER 2800 NORTH HORSESHOE DRIVE, ROOMS 609-610 NAPLES, FL 34104 September 19, 2007 ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Sorry for the delay, ladies and gentlemen, but we've got a problem with the group here. As it stands, I'd like to call to order the Collier County Contracting Licensing Board meeting for September 19th, and advise everyone that anyone who decides to appeal a decision of this board will need a record of the proceedings pertaining thereto and therefore may need to ensure that a verbatim record of the proceedings is made, which record includes that testimony and evidence upon an (sic) appeal is to be based. With that in mind, I'd like to start with roll call starting to my right. MR. HERRIMAN: Glenn Herriman. MR. BLUM: Syd Blum. MS. KELLER: Ann Keller. MR. JOSLIN: Richard Joslin. MR. BOYD: Michael Boyd. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Are there any deletions or additions to the agenda, staff? MR. BARTOE: Good morning, Mr. Chairman, Board Members. For the record, I'm Tom Bartoe, Collier County Licensing Compliance Officer. Staff has one deletion. Actually it's a continuation. Case No. 2007 -11 will be continued until the October meeting. And I have no other deletions. I don't know if Mr. Ossorio does or not. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Mr. Ossorio? MR. OSSORIO: Good morning, Mr. Chairman. For the record, Michael Ossorio, Collier County Contracting Licensing Supervisor. Weare in a time constraint, so we are going to postpone Case No. 2007-10, which is Scott Perry, doing business as A Plus Air Conditioning and Heating of Southwest Florida. Case 2007-09, Samuel Greenwood, d/b/a Greenwood Incorporated, that is going to be on short notice. I will talk to the Page 2 September 19,2007 complainants within the next few minutes. But right now we're ready to proceed with new business. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: All right, I need a motion for approval of the new agenda. MR. BLUM: So moved, Blum. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Motion and seconded (sic)-- MR. HERRIMAN: Second, Herriman. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: All in favor? MR. HERRIMAN: Aye. MR. BLUM: Aye. MS. KELLER: Aye. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Aye. MR. BOYD: Aye. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Also we need approval for the minutes dated July 18th of 2007. MR. BLUM: So moved, Blum. MR. JOSLIN: Second? MS. KELLER: Second. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: All in favor? MR. HERRIMAN: Aye. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Aye. MR. BLUM: Aye. MS. KELLER: Aye. MR. BOYD: Aye. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Any opposed? (No response.) ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Motion carries. New business. Is there a Dora (sic) Goren here, please? MS. GOREN: Right here. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Yes, would you please come up to the podium. Ms. Goren, you were here I think months or several months ago Page 3 September 19,2007 regarding carpentry license; is that correct? MS. GOREN: No, I was never here. I applied for an application for a flooring contractor's license. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: All right, would you like to explain to us your reason for being here, then? (Speaker was duly sworn.) MS. GOREN: I am here today because my initial licensing or application was denied based on a -- one reference that I believe was misunderstood by the hearing board officer, or whoever reviewed the original application. I have a letter here that I had sent to the board, and I think it best describes what happened. In regards to the above-referenced hearing, I was denied initial licensing based on a verification of construction experience, completed by Mr. Barry with WB Construction. As I told Mike, the licensing reviewer, there was obviously a misunderstanding with the conversation he and Mr. Barry had in regards to the document that Mr. Barry signed, which was the application of verification of construction expenence. Me and my partner, Chad LaFlamme, who I'm still partners with, did flooring in several of Mr. Barry's preconstruction and existing homes several years ago. Chad has always been the contact person for Mr. Barry, so I believe he assumed that the verification of construction experience was for Mr. LaFlamme and not myself. Although me and Chad have been partners for years and he's more experienced than me, I'm an experienced flooring installer and have been installing floors for several years. I feel that Mike has basically discriminated against me by denying my license based on Mr. Barry's conversation with him. Since I am female, he assumed that I didn't do the work myself, and he even implied that Mr. LaFlamme take the test himself and apply for licensing instead of myself. I don't see the reason for this, since I'm Page 4 September 19,2007 fully capable of installing flooring and I've been doing it for several years. Mr. Barry has contacted him since to try to explain the misunderstanding, but it's my understanding they have not spoken. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: How many years have you been doing flooring? MS. GOREN: About seven years. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Seven years? How many companies have you worked for? MS. GOREN: Several different companies. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: As an employee of the company? MS. GOREN: I've been working under general contractors and builders as a subcontractor. MR. BLUM: I see that -- I can understand why Mr. Ossorio flagged it from Mr. Barry's comments. I see a Mark Howell, Hunter Tile and Marble. MS. GOREN: Yes. MR. BLUM: He gives you a glowing reference. Evidently that -- he says you've been seven or eight years in that -- tile installing, wood installing and all prep work. So to you and to Michael, does one offset the other, Michael, or what? MR. OSSORIO: Yeah, I have no objections of Mrs. Goren receiving a floor covering license. I think she's missing the point why she's here today. Under the code, it tells you that if you are unable to make a decision or if there is a -- falsifying any information provided herein may subject your license to be revocations (sic). In other words, the application, if you look on the top of Page No.8, I guess it's Page 8 under William Berry. It says application name. And it has her name on there. But Mr. Berry said he was Page 5 September 19,2007 actually writing it for Chad. So that put a red flag into the system. I'm not saying that she's not going to receive a license, it's just that it gets forwarded to the licensing board for further review. Anyone knows if you go to Lee County, every single applicant goes to the licensing board. Collier County, it's up to the contracting licensing supervisor. If it meets all criteria, everything has been completed, I will proceed with the license. Unfortunately, if you look at this verification of construction experience, the applicant's name is yourself, but Mr. Berry said he specifically wanted it for Chad. Not saying that you don't have the expenence. If you look on the second page it says okay, MGO, which is my initials. But since my initial call was to Mr. Berry, this application wasn't filled out properly, it gets forwarded to the licensing board. No matter if you're a female, male or whatever it may be. That's what we stated to you and that's what we stated to the building director. MS. GOREN: Okay. MR. OSSORIO: And I recommend this license. However, you should explain to the board why your name wasn't put on the top and then why did Chad assume it was for -- why did Mr. Berry assume it was for Chad. That's what you need to explain to the licensing board. MS. GOREN: I know that he assumed it was for Chad because Chad is the contact person with him, or has been when we work together. So that's probably why he assumed it was for Chad. MR. BLUM: So do we have your assurances that you in fact physically can do the work, do do the work, you get down on your hands and knees, you lay the floor out, you do the thing -- MS. GOREN: Yeah. MR. BLUM: -- you have all that competency and-- MS. GOREN: Yes, I do. MR. BLUM: Okay, that's all I need to know. MS. KELLER: I had a question about your credit report. I'm Page 6 September 19,2007 having trouble understanding it. Can you talk a little bit about your credit report? MS. GOREN: Where would you like me to start? I've got a lot of things on my credit that I'm paying on. I haven't been late on anything. MS. KELLER: I see two charge-offs, three collections. MS. GOREN: The collection might have been medical, but they've all been paid off. They were before, when I was 18. MS. KELLER: And something that says high risk fraud alert, which I've never seen before. MS. GOREN: I've never seen that before either. And I've looked at my credit like a month -- less than a month ago and it did not have that on there. And I don't know why they would -- I'm not a credit bureau, but I've never been in trouble for any fraud or ever had anything to do with anything like that. So I don't understand what that would mean. I'm not a credit report -- you know, I'm not experienced at that. MS. KELLER: Does anybody -- can anybody help me with this? Because I can't really interpret it. MR. BLUM: It's one of the highest alerts that they have. And it is something to be concerned with. And were I Dara, I would certainly want an explanation, as by law they have to provide you. Because that sends up not one but about 15 flags for us, quite frankly. MS. GOREN: I didn't even know that was on there. Last time I looked at my credit, it wasn't on it. Can you tell me what credit bureau has put that on? Because I know there's three different credit bureaus. I mean, you would think they would have to inform me. MS. KELLER: It's really hard for us, because every single one of these that we get, it looks different and has different interpretations. And so, you know, when I looked at it last night, I -- MS. GOREN: Can I see a copy of it? Page 7 September 19, 2007 MS. KELLER: -- I didn't really understand. This was prepared by Mortgage Solutions. MR. NEALE: And there's an 800 number on there that says for any questions requiring creditor reporting services. MS. GOREN: Mortgage Solutions. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: It appears, though, that the mortgage people or the actual credit report came from Experian, Transunion and Equifax, which are three of the largest. Those are the three ones that have reported this. MR. BLUM: But Mortgage Solutions is the one that put the high alert on it. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Right. MS. GOREN: They -- I don't even have any debts with them, so I don't understand how they -- MR. BLUM: Did you apply for credit to buy a house possibly recently? MS. GOREN: I've been looking into refinancing, and I have talked to Mortgage Solutions, but I've never done anything with them. MR. BLUM: How long ago? MS. GOREN: Within the last I would say month or month and a half. MR. BLUM: Okay. That coincides with our situation with the planning industry in especially Florida. And in my experience, something like that, Mortgage Solutions feels that this young lady's guidelines don't meet their criteria, and for them to issue the mortgage they think she's a high risk alert. That wouldn't bother me, just knowing the market as I do. MS. GOREN: Yeah, 1-- MR. BLUM: You applied for refinance and they didn't feel you met their guidelines. And what their guidelines are, none of our -- so I wouldn't have a problem with that. MS. GOREN: I've applied with several other companies for Page 8 September 19,2007 refinance too, as you will probably see on there. MR. BLUM: Yeah, I would definitely contact them -- MS. GOREN: Okay. MR. BLUM: -- and make them aware. MS. GOREN: I can't believe-- MR. BLUM: That's really -- they shouldn't have placed that kind of thing on a credit report, because it does send up flags. And if we didn't have experience in a real estate market and especially lending institutions, that might scare a lot of people. You need to address that. MS. GOREN: I need to get that taken off. I'm glad you brought that to my attention. Because I wasn't even aware that just because you apply for something they can put something on your credit like that. MR. BLUM: Yes, they can. They can do it. And my suggestion is that you might want to have an attorney write a letter. Just for some -- you know. MS. GOREN: Okay, thank you. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: One last thing. On this same credit report, next page, there's another entry in here for a mortgage that you have for $344,000? Am I reading this correctly? MS. GOREN: Yes, probably. Yes, I have a mortgage. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: And an automobile for $53,000? MS. GOREN: Urn-hum. Oh, does it say 53? Because it should be 36. Is it Infiniti Financing? ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Fifty-three balance is what they're showing. And change. MS. GOREN: Wow. It's Infiniti? ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: I'm not sure exactly. It says automobile. MS. GOREN: I'll have to look into that. MR. BLUM: If it's a lease, they'll show the original price. They Page 9 September 19,2007 won't show the balance of the lease. MS. GOREN: It's not a lease. MR. BLUM: It's not. It should be the correct amount. MR. HERRIMAN: Well, I think what they did is they lumped the automobile and the recreational vehicle. Do you have a camper or something? MS. GOREN: I have two four-wheelers. MR. BLUM: There you go. That's what it is then. And they're all financed the same place? MS. GOREN: Well, both were financed with Honda Financing, and then my car was financed with Infiniti. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: That's what it is. MR. BLUM: Yeah, that explains it. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: What's the pleasure of the board? Any ideas? MR. BLUM: Are we done with the discussion part? ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: If you would like to quiz her anymore, you can, sure. MR. BLUM: I'd like to make a recommendation, if it's in order. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Okay. Help yourself. MR. BLUM: I like this young lady's presentation, and I'm inclined to work with her. I would suggest a period of review by the contractor licensing office, just to kind of have an overview for a period of time. There are some things, even though it appears to be settled, that I would like to have a little bit of an overview for a while. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Probation period? MR. BLUM: Yeah. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: How long? MR. BLUM: Six months? ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Any other comments on it? (No response.) Page 10 September 19,2007 MR. BLUM: I'll make a motion, if nobody disagrees. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: You can see our dilemma here. Because of the credit report that we're looking at and the falsification of the paperwork that we got -- received already, it's a little bit iffy for us to grant your license on those terms. But Mr. Blum has made a suggestion and I think the board will probably be able to go along with that for a six-month period, but you'll be monitored for sure. MS. GOREN: Okay. So it's like six months -- MR. BLUM: Probationary period. So if Mr. Ossorio's office for any reason feels that there's a problem resulting from the things we've brought up today, he can shut you down. MS. GOREN: Okay. MR. BLUM: Without coming to us, he can just do it. MS. GOREN: Okay. But you'll just inform me? MR. BLUM: Mr. Ossorio's the man. MS. GOREN: Okay. MR. BLUM: We're going to make a decision today; we're going to put it in his hands. That's between you and him. Keep a nice relationship. I don't think he believes in any harassment or any violating any of your rights. He's not that kind of guy. I think you'll find -- MS. KELLER: I've been on this board for five years, I can tell you that. MR. BLUM: -- he's a very fair and even-handed kind of a guy. We have a lot of faith in Mr. Ossorio. MS. GOREN: Okay. MR. BLUM: So I'll make an official recommendation then. I recommend that we -- a motion to approve Dara Green (sic), is it? MS. GOREN: Goren. MR. BLUM: Goren's application with a provision for a six-month probationary period monitored by the contracting licensingsupervISOr. Page 11 September 19, 2007 ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: I'll second the motion. I have a motion and a second on the floor. All in favor of the motion? MR. BLUM: Aye. MR. HERRIMAN: Aye. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Aye. MS. KELLER: Aye. MR. BOYD: Aye. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Motion carries. MS. GOREN: And I will try to get that taken off my credit report immediately, because I think that was justly unfair for them to do that. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Please. And by the way, for all those listening, also the paperwork that you're going to need to carry this through will be down at the county at Horseshoe Drive. But all that's here right now, so you'll be able to pick that up probably until (sic) tomorrow. MS. GOREN: Okay. So I can just basically leave and then go back -- come back and pick up my paperwork tomorrow in Horseshoe. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Yes, Horseshoe Drive. And see the powers to be in there will set you up. MS. GOREN: Okay, thank you. MR. BLUM: Good luck. MS. GOREN: Thank you. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Next case. Do we have a John Aldrich here? MR. ALDRICH: Yes, sir. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Would you please come to the podium to be sworn in. (Speaker was duly sworn.) ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Mr. Aldrich, would you like to I guess explain the reason why you're here? Other than the fact I know Page 12 ___"___.._ ""n__"_~'___~_,_,_,~_",_,_~._~ __. '___'_'_'__'~_~'_~._'_'~'_"____'_'~__"""___'~'_.'_"_....__.,,~..,..__""_...._,"_.~.______. September 19,2007 we're going to review your credit report. MR. ALDRICH: Yes, sir. I'm a painting contractor that's licensed in several counties in the state, which it's unfortunate that there is no state-wide license for a painting contractor. Each county has its county specific licensing. My business was founded 15 years ago. We primarily serve the municipal water and wastewater industry throughout the Southeast United States. We were very successful the first 10 years of business, but in 2004 and 2005 we experienced a lot of problems. Some problems were foreseen, some problems were not. Over the years we've grown up to 100 employees and got a little bit out of control as far as having -- I'm sure you can understand, having too many people at one time. We were hit with a bunch of -- because most of our work is water/wastewater, a lot of it's environmentally sensitive. So the five hurricanes within two years took a toll on our profits for those two years. And that same year in 2005 we were hit with a hurricane in Key West when we were doing four, five million gallon tank interiors. And the backlash of Wilma flooded one of the tanks and we sustained over $350,000 of losses on that job, and we were only able to recover $50,000 for media loss through our insurance company because we wasn't carrying flood insurance for the job. At that same year we got our visit from the Department of Environmental Protection, or -- yeah, Florida FDEP at our shop, and there was accusations that we were burying paint on our property. And we successfully -- we successfully dealt with that, and that was a toll on us for about $335,000, which left us in a bad position in 2005 to where we had -- we were under constraints with a consent order from DEP to pay them off and to pay off the other -- the legal fees and all. And we just had so much debt in 2005 that we had to work with Page 13 September 19,2007 the primary vendors and the secondary vendors and make priorities to keep the business alive. I believed in the business, because we always carried a great deal of backlog of work. Because of dealing with water/wastewater it's a year out for the work, so we knew we had several million dollars of work on the books, and we knew we could recover from it. And I'm just too stubborn and I don't believe that I should just bankrupt it because if -- I knew that I could recover it in two years. So mostly everything on my credit report -- everything on my credit report on my business all relates to losses that's occurred in 2005. All of those things that's on there has been satisfied, the vendors have been paid, and I have proof of all the thing. In other words, either they've been paid or -- I mean, they've all been paid. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: So just I guess a silly question: Coming from my understanding here, you have about four different counties that you work in? MR. ALDRICH: Actually I work throughout the state. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: So you work in a lot of different counties. MR. ALDRICH: Yes, sir. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: What brings you to Naples, Florida? Collier County. MR. ALDRICH: Quite often the City of Naples has wanted a water -- one of my largest customers that I think you'll see in the reference letter there is a company called Crom Corporation. Crom Corporation builds pre-stressed concrete tanks. I have a specialty in rehab in those tanks, so I've worked in Collier County before, and Collier County will order us a job to come down to do -- rehab one of their tanks. So about 80 percent of the work I do is usually through a general contractor, but I do have work from time to time where I'm contracted direct from the City of Naples or Collier County. Page 14 September 19, 2007 So, you know, I just -- I don't have our shop here. In other words, I'm not doing business with the public. I'm not ever going to do business with the public. You know, I'm just -- I'm here because I rehab water tanks. Then whenever you have one, you know, I get it done and my business goes back. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: How many employees do you employ right now? MR. ALDRICH: About 52. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: In the packet I see a couple of things. Number one is a competency card from Hillsborough County MR. ALDRICH: Yes, sir. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: -- where it shows Workmen's Comp expired on 1/1 of'07. MR. ALDRICH: We have a Workmen's Comp -- I can get you a new certificate, sir. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Also I have a license from Brevard County that expired on 8/31 of '07. MR. ALDRICH: Well, we might have a -- this thing's been on the docket for a few months. It might have some transit -- ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: It is? MR. ALDRICH: Yeah. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Do you know ifhe's active on that one, current? MR. OSSORIO: I have no idea. That's something we'll look into when we do a review. Mr. Chairman, the other thing I had a question on, on page number three, that's why he was actually here. I looked at his credit report. He is making a good faith effort. But this one is -- unfortunately it doesn't give me a little latitude. He -- his deposition is still pending, top of the page, number three. Maybe Mr. Aldrich can go ahead and maybe elaborate on that. Page 15 September 19, 2007 ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Top of page number three. MR. OSSORIO: Page number three of your -- MR. ALDRICH: Personal or business? MR. OSSORIO: Just says page number three. MR. BOYD: I don't have a page number three. MR. HERRIMAN: Keep going. It's pretty deep. MS. KELLER: Find it? ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Yeah. You're talking the credit report, correct? MR. OSSORIO: Yeah. After the resolution. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: I found it. MR. OSSORIO: Okay. Top of the page. MR. ALDRICH: I have two page number three. I'm sorry, I don't have a copy of it in front of me. MS. KELLER: Are you talking about the case? E.R.I.S.A.? ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: There's two page number threes in the packet. MR. OSSORIO: Sorry about that. Here you go. MR. ALDRICH: Okay. The -- we have a -- we're a union -- we are an open shop. We're not under contract with any -- at this time we're not under contract with the union. And when this whole 2005 thing happened, the union just basically got nervous and came in and did an audit on the company. They have a -- when the union comes and does an audit, they have some terminology in there that they feel that they're due benefits for any union employees and non-union employees. We have an agreement inside the union agreement that said that we have a utility work clause for six months of the employment to where we don't have to pay fringes on that employee. The union has agreed to come in and review all the employees that were not union and that were union, and only the funds which have already been paid and on the actual union members. However, Page 16 September 19,2007 it's in their hands. That's how come it says we have an agreement that it's stayed, because they haven't come to do any -- they were supposed to give us a list of all the members that's active so that we can compare that to all the people we've paid in on, so then -- you know, and they haven't done anything. So there's nothing -- I mean, as far as I'm concerned, the ball's in their court on that. And it's been out for two years, almost. So we still employ union employees, we still pay fringes and pension on union employees, they still ship us employees, but they just filed this to protect theirself (sic), I think. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Mr. Ossorio, what do you make of this? Do you have a comment on this? MR. OSSORIO: I think that this company has been hurt financially for a couple of years. I think he does have a license throughout most of the county. And I don't have a problem with him working for a government agency. I believe he's stipulated the fact that he would only contract with a government agency, not with a -- you know, a consumer. If that's something we can do, Robert Zachary, I have no idea. Could we hold the company only to contract with a government agency, not with a consumer or a taxpayer? MR. ZACHARY: I think as a condition of granting a license this board could -- if the applicant accepts that, this board could make that stipulation on the granting of the license. MR. ALDRICH: Absolutely. I have no intentions of conducting business with the homeowners, or for that matter even commercial entities. I'm just a -- I'm a municipal contractor. Been that all my life. MS. KELLER: Well, that kind of makes me think of the phrase, if it doesn't kill you it will make you stronger. Do you get insurance now for -- MR. ALDRICH: Yes, ma'am. We have $5 million of coverage. MS. KELLER: But for the flood insurance for what you're Page 17 September 19, 2007 working on, or after you had this -- MR. ALDRICH: Yes, we did. MS. KELLER: -- incidence, or was it just one time? It's a business decision, I'm not asking for -- MR. ALDRICH: Because the job was in Key West, the deductibles, we try to get builders risk, but the deductible is a half million dollars. So the loss was greater than -- the loss was less than the deductible on the builders risk insurance for that job. Yes, we've now looked into better ways of covering jobs. We would have never thought -- we thought we had insurance for the hurricane damage. The problem what happened, if you can picture this, you can picture a tank the size of a football field. The job was bid prior to the gas crunch. So we were planning on bringing the media in from Miami to the job and disposing of it in Key Largo like everything's supposed to be done. Well, when the gas crunch hit the fuel went up and so therefore the freight and the shipping to get the media from Miami to Key West was like triple in cost. So we had to use a media called Steel Grit, which is a media that you recycle over and over and over. Well, what happened, the media is very expensive. On one tank you spend about $50,000 in media. Well, the media was inside the-- we put all the media inside -- the job was ongoing. We put all the media inside the tank, thinking that was the safest place because of wind damage and stuff. And what happened, the reason they covered the 48,000, because that damage was caused to (sic) the hurricane for wind damage. But what happened, the storm surge actually filled the tank with six foot of water and all the media was ruined, not to mention all the media that when the blasting was going on was on the ground and all the rust to the floor. We spent three months chiseling andjackhammering up all the media off the floor to get it back up to where we could sandblast to finish the job. Page 18 September 19, 2007 MS. KELLER: Sounds like now you know what you're doing. MR. ALDRICH: Oh, yeah. Well, I thought-- MS. KELLER: Leave it outside. You have hurricane insurance. MR. ALDRICH: Yes, ma'am. MR. BLUM: In order to move this along-- ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Yeah, let's move it along. MR. BLUM: Obviously this company has made some catastrophically bad business decisions. Some they could have prevented and some not. And hindsight's always better than foresight. It's obviously a company who is trying to do the right thing. I agree with Mr. Ossorio, they are paying their debts. I'd be very concerned if they were dealing with any kind of a consumer, even a local subcontractor on a lesser scale. So if we could be assured that they're only going to deal with high-end commercial people, i.e, the city, which is going to have a lot of oversight, or the county agency, I'd go along with Mr. Ossorio's recommendation. MS. KELLER: Second. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Is that in the form of a motion? MR. BLUM: That would be in the form of a motion, should you desire. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Also, I'd like to make just one interjection also, that he be monitored for this situation with the union situation that's going on now, because that's a pending case. Something could come out of this, I'm sure, and it could probably take hold of your business and you wouldn't be in business any longer. MR. ALDRICH: We actually have a -- we don't have a -- we have an agreement that we are -- we are waiting for their numbers, and we have an agreement that we're honoring just to keep things going with them. That's probably why they're not -- that's probably why they haven't done anything, because we're continuing just dealing with them and doing business with them for -- and I don't want to say I'm Page 19 September 19,2007 an expert with union relations either, because I'm not, but I know that the union needs guys like me that will hire and entertain their people in Florida. So we feel that they are wanting to work with us and do whatever they can to continue to keeping their membership alive and people employed. And that's -- you know, we want to work with them, but we just don't feel it's fair if we ask for employees and they don't send us any and we have to recruit and find our own employees that they turn around and want us to pay $5.00 an hour in for them. You know, we just didn't feel that was appropriate, you know, for them to ask for. So they've agreed. And like I stated in review, that they would only make us pay in on our long-term employees that's beyond the probationary period, and in turn they wouldn't make us pay in only union people they shipped us but actually aren't union members. Because if they don't stay in the union, they're not union members and therefore they shouldn't have benefits paid in. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Okay, that will work. MR. ALDRICH: Okay, thank you. MR. ZACHARY: Mr. Joslin -- ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: You agree to the motion, right? MR. BLUM: Yes. MR. ZACHARY: If! could just interject one more time, we do have precedence for granting limited licenses, but I wanted you all to make sure that what we're talking about is government entities, probably some private utilities, since we have some of those. And he said high-end commercial, I think that would open it up for shopping centers or whatever commercial buildings there might be, so I don't know whether you want to do that. MR. BLUM: I have a problem with that personally. Because you're talking about a lot of credit risk now with a high-end shopping center with -- Page 20 September 19,2007 MR. ZACHARY: I think you're talking about-- MR. BLUM: -- private developers. MR. ZACHARY: -- primarily utilities and government entities. MR. BLUM: Yes. MR. ALDRICH: That's typical to me. MR. BLUM: That would be my thrust on it. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Would you modify the motion MR. BLUM: Yes. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: -- to explain that? MR. BLUM: I would modify my motion to accept this gentleman's application, as long as his contracts are not go (sic) beyond the scope of government agencies or public utilities. With-- MR. ZACHARY: And there are private utilities as well. MR. BLUM: Or private utilities, yes. And it's assuming that Mr. Ossorio will closely monitor the operations as well. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: And we need a second? MS. KELLER: Second. Sorry. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: We've got a motion and a second on the floor. All in favor of the motion? MR. HERRIMAN: Aye. MR. BLUM: Aye. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Aye. MS. KELLER: Aye. MR. BOYD: Aye. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Any opposed? (No response.) ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Motion carries. MR. ALDRICH: Thank you. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: You're welcome, and good luck to you. Page 21 September 19, 2007 Once again, remember that you can't pick up any part of the application for the license until tomorrow. MR. ALDRICH: I can come back next week. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Yeah. Maybe later this afternoon, but next week for sure. MR. ALDRICH: I'm going back to Lakeland, so -- okay, thank you. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Have a good day. Moving right along to Joseph Iafornaro. Did I say it right? MR. IAFORNARO: Yes, you pronounced that correctly. (Speaker was duly sworn.) ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Mr. Iafornaro, could you please explain to us why you are here today? MR. IAFORNARO: I've applied for a Collier County carpentry license, and it was brought to my attention that because I had a recent contracting related misdemeanor case in the Collier court, that I had to apply to the board. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Okay, that is absolutely correct. Would you like to explain the reasons of the case? MR. IAFORNARO: Well, I don't really want to go into the details of it, unless you require me to -- MR. BLUM: Yeah, we do. MR. IAFORNARO: -- but I have satisfied the case. It's been totally settled and released and finalized. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Correct. According to the packet that we have here in front of us, you were given the opportunity at one point to rectify the situation of the case that you were taken to court for, and at that time you refused, in which case you were taken to court and found guilty? MR.IAFORNARO: Well, no. From advice from my attorney-- Jerry Berry's office was representing me in this case. And he Page 22 September 19,2007 suggested that I take a plea. And as a result, the charge was a conviction. But the -- but it was left open for a separate restitution hearing, and that was a separate deliberation. And Michael Hopkins was representing me on that. And it came out to a judgment of a restitution. And then I've since settled the judgment. MS. KELLER: You have a number of collections on your credit report. Is there -- that just concerns me as somebody who's running a business that there are so many even small collections that seem to have not been dealt with. MR.IAFORNARO: Well, I -- it's not that I can't and haven't or don't intend to. I have been taking care of some of my small debts. In its entirety my full debt for the last eight years or whatnot might total $5,000. But I currently have reasonably good credit and I have satisfied many of my various things on my credit, and intend to rectify the rest of my credit. I'm in the process of working on it. Not to mention the fact that I probably incurred 15 or $20,000 worth oflegal expenses this year. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Why were those legal expenses necessary? MR. IAFORNARO: Well, some of them were related to this particular case, but not totally. MR. BLUM: Part of our mandate is to look out for the concerns for the citizens of Collier County. Personally I have a problem with a contractor who has more than one or numerous collection problems with people he's doing business with in Collier County. MR. IAFORNARO: In may, sir? MR. BLUM: Sure. MR. IAFORNARO: I've never had a collection problem with anybody who I've conducted business with in Collier County. But more importantly -- ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: I have to go and ask the Page 23 September 19,2007 question then. She said the statement. The case that you were convicted on, was this not a contracting case where you had done work for a homeowner and you were -- MR. IAFORNARO: As a licensed handyman. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: As a licensed handyman. MR. IAFORNARO: Yes. Yeah, I'm a registered LLC. I'm a licensed handyman. I have liability insurance and -- ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Mr. Ossorio, can you explain to the board members possibly what a licensed handyman is allowed to do and the dollar value that it's placed upon per job? MR. OSSORIO: There is a handyman exemption under Statute 489, anything under $1,000 or inconsequential work. Collier County, we don't have a handyman license. We have what you call a maintenance license. It is a tax -- it's called a business receipt tax. We used to call it, quote, the occupational license. This particular case, unfortunately this gentleman contracted with a homeowner over at King's Lake Boulevard. And I don't want to tell you, but obviously it was extensive work, way over $1,000, and not considered a handyman item. And this is why he was probably convicted. Other than that, I have some questions about his credit, I have some questions about his experience. You can review his experience letters. And also, his being convicted as a misdemeanor, working without a license, that has some bearing on it, too. MR. BLUM: One of my questions is we're here to ostensibly review a contract related misdemeanor; however we're now going afield and looking at other things in the packet. Do we only rule on the merits of this acceptance based on the misdemeanor, or can we feel free to -- MR. NEALE: No, when an application is brought to this board, everything within the application is within the purview of the board at that time. Because when the contractor licensing supervisor refers it to Page 24 September 19,2007 the board, it's for a review of the application. MR. BLUM: Whatever field we can use. MR. NEALE: In whole it may focus on the credit report, but certainly everything there becomes, for lack of a better term, fair game. MR. BLUM: As Mrs. Keller mentioned, then, there's 18 accounts with delinquency, but there's 38 serious delinquency and public record or collections filed. It's been a long time since I've seen that number of situations with one small contractor. Talk about flags. MS. KELLER: We see some big numbers of delinquencies and, you know, people who have filed for bankruptcy or whatever, but these are small numbers that -- MR. BLUM: It's a lot of people. MS. KELLER: -- need to be cleaned up. They need to be taken seriously. And if you're going to be serious as a contractor, you have to be serious with your personal financial situation. So that's my feeling anyway. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: I have one other item that I'm going to bring up, only because I think this is something that the board needs to hear. I'm not sure of how many board members are aware of this or not. But I'm going to go into some case law, okay, that was held in January of '06. That was a case in which a gentleman applied for a general contractor's license. He was convicted of a felony of a crime that had nothing to do with construction or construction related work. In which case then he took the crime to -- or the case to the State DPR trying to get a license to be a general contractor. And he was denied. After a period of time they reviewed this and found out that he could not be denied a license because he was convicted of a crime other than a felony that had nothing to do with contracting. In turn they did give the man a license. However, when they did, Page 25 September 19,2007 they came into the case law and they wrote out the actual ordinance the way it's written. I'm going to read it to you so you understand where we're coming from. Except as provided in 775.16, a person whose civil rights have been restored shall not be disqualified to practice, pursue or engage in any occupation, trade, vocation, profession or business in which a license permit or certificate is required to be issued by the state and of its agencies or political subdivisions or municipalities solely because of a prior conviction of a crime. However, a person whose civil rights have been restored may be denied a license, permit or certification to pursue, practice or engage in an occupation, trade, vocation, profession or business by reason of the prior conviction for a crime if the crime was a felony or first degree misdemeanor and directly related to a specific occupation, trade, vocation, profession or business for which the license, permit or certificate is sought. Meaning -- MR. IAFORNARO: I understand that. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: You understand the term? MR. IAFORNARO: Yes. And if I may ask something. It's not necessarily directly related to that. I do understand what you have read. I realize I made a mistake by contracting maybe outside of the scope of my license as a handyman, but nevertheless I have, you know, many years, 20 years experience working as a carpenter. I'm an experienced carpenter, and I'm well known and appreciated for that. And if I may impress upon the board today that it's my intent to and desire to abide by applying to just to achieve just that in compliance to be formal in doing and performing, you know, as a legitimate carpenter in Collier County. I'd also, if I may ask, if needs be that I'm on a probationary period, in which time I will take care of my -- what's left on my credit report. I just haven't addressed it yet because I've been so busy with Page 26 September 19,2007 so many other things this last couple years. And that -- I would just ask that you allow me to try to at least advance myself in my endeavor in good intent and good faith to perform as a carpenter in Collier County. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: I'm going to go to Mr. Ossorio. What are your recommendations, or do you have any recommendations that you think we should be looking at? MR. OSSORIO: Mr. Chairman, I did talk to G.W. Harold, who's the attorney for the State Construction Licensing Board, and I asked some guidance through his office to find out what scenario does the construction licensing board do. And he basically didn't really give me that much information, only to say that yes, we could give him a license. Yes, we can put him on probation. However, it has been known that they usually take a back seat and deny and say come back in a year and if you work for a carpentry company and you establish yourself, you fix your credit, whatever it is, and there's no other problems with working without a license and you work with a handyman, then we can proceed with that. That's the recommendation he actually gave me. But I don't know what to tell you other than this gentleman had an opportunity before the lawyers got involved. We sat down in a meeting, we explained to him about the occupational license and the tax and the State Statute 489, and unfortunately this gentleman decided to go the legal route. And that's exactly what happened. He had ample time to come up with the $4,000 two years ago, but unfortunately he wanted to go a different way, and that's fine. But it does concern me. I mean, if it was a crime that was committed and it was adjudicated withheld; in other words, he was nolo contendere, I probably would probably say let's give him some probation. However, the judge decided on his own accord to find him guilty, with an attorney. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: A very good attorney, I might Page 27 September 19,2007 add. MR. OSSORIO: There had to be some circumstantial reason why they did that. They didn't find him -- they found him guilty. With that, I would hate to have some homeowner come into my office two months from now saying that this gentleman did this work without a building permit or he did some electrical work and you knew he was a convicted person in contracting. So that does put a red flag in my office, and that's why the board makes those decisions. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Right. Thank you. MR. ZACHARY: Mr. Joslin, since it's in the packet, I think the board should be aware, I don't know whether you've read the settlement agreement that's -- MR. BLUM: Yes. MR. ZACHARY: -- included in the packet. I want you to note that restitution was awarded in the amount of$17,630 and change. The settlement agreement was $4,000 to satisfy that restitution. But if you read the last line on the first page, it said the lump sum of $4,000 will be paid by third party, and the defendant is of limited financial means. If you're concerned about the public, then I think you should take this into account, as well as that credit report. MR. NEALE: What I'd like to do is just review for the board the standard for financial responsibility, which the board can review. And the standard under the Florida Administrative Code, which is incorporated in Collier County ordinances, that the applicant must have financial responsibility, and the financial responsibility is defined as the ability to safeguard that the public will not sustain economic loss resulting from the contractor's inability to pay his lawful contractual obligations. I would point the board to both the previous conviction for him not paying contractual obligations, and the fact that in a sworn statement from the settlement release restitution award, that in the Page 28 September 19, 2007 court document it says that he's limited financial means, owns no real properties, and that he had to have the $4,000 paid by a third party. And I would ask that the board please review all of that in determining whether he has adequate financial responsibility. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Got you. If you're ready, I mean -- any other comments that we want to get into? I think it's pretty much cut-and-dry to all, but-- MR. BLUM: I think so. But in addressing Mr. Ossorio's comments, ordinarily I'd probably go along with the come back in a year. To me, an additional -- let's just forget about the conviction, okay? That was a mistake and it was he said/she said and he got his dander up and so forth. So let's forget about that. We still got 38 other situations to me which shows a way of doing business that's more confrontational than anything. And that always results in problems. You've got to get along with your customers, you've got to work with your customers. Just being right isn't good enough. I've been saying that forever. My position would be to deny this, period. MS. KELLER: Yeah, I think I'd like to see things cleared up a little bit and maybe if you wanted to come back -- because I don't think the case would make me feel that, you know, you couldn't be capable, but I would like to see some effort made before I would consider voting for approval. MR. HERRIMAN: Do you plan to continue your handyman work if you don't get this license today? MR. IAFORNARO: Absolutely. I mean, I -- MR. BLUM: The lack of any additional problems resulting from your handyman business will go a long way the next time you come before us. MR. IAFORNARO: When do you suggest I come back before you? Page 29 September 19,2007 MR. BLUM: I'd say a year. MS. KELLER: Don't come till it's clean. MR. IAFORNARO: And what part of the cleanliness would you like me to clean? MR. BLUM: No more collections, no more liens. MR. IAFORNARO: Just my debts? MR. BLUM: Absolutely. We want to see a guy who really cares about his customers. That means a lot to us. The money notwithstanding, the credit notwithstanding -- MR. IAFORNARO: I didn't bring my list of my 500 customers, people that I've worked for for the last 25 years. I'm 43 years old. I may not look it, but I've worked for -- you know, I must have built 100 boat docks, renovated a dozen homes. And if you would have liked, I could have, if you had asked and put it in your criteria -- MS. KELLER: I don't think anyone's denying your abilities. MR. IAFORNARO: Well, no, I'm just saying, if I could just finish -- ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: I don't think it's necessary that you have to get into this, because you're only putting yourself in deeper. Now we're talking about you building boat docks and we're talking about things that you need licenses for besides a handyman license. MR. IAFORNARO: Well, no, I didn't need a license to build a boat dock in Orlando for a private friend. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: What county are you in, sir? You are not in Orlando. You are in Collier County. MR. IAFORNARO: I'm talking about my 25-year history -- ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: I understand. MR. IAFORNARO: -- as an honest, hard-working -- ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Your history in Orlando I couldn't care about at the moment. MR. IAFORNARO: -- is what I'm talking about. I'm not getting Page 30 September 19,2007 personal about your county and your criteria for that. But I'm just saying when you suggest that I need to make my customers happy, I didn't bring in 1,000-page reference book for you to find out more about my history. Because if you read it, you'd find that these thousand people that would be sitting out here would testify for themselves, and you can analyze their testimony as well if you'd like, they all come from pretty good histories, and they would tell you how satisfied and how competent and how pleased they were and are to this day with my abilities and my work. And I respect your position, but I just wanted to put -- just ad-lib that properly for the context. And I will take care of my credit and I will come back before you. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Okay, that's-- MR. BLUM: We look forward to that. MS. KELLER: Good. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: And I think that's probably the best thing you could do right now. MR. IAFORNARO: Thank you. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: So we have a motion on the floor for denial? MR. BLUM: Yes. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: A second? MR. BOYD: Second, Boyd. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Boyd seconded the motion. And a second (sic) on the floor to deny this packet for a Joseph A. Iafornaro. All in favor? MR. HERRIMAN: Aye. MR. BLUM: Aye. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Aye. MS. KELLER: Aye. MR. BOYD: Aye. Page 31 September 19, 2007 ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Any denials? (No response.) ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Motion carries. Thank you. Moving on to old business, any old business that we need to discuss? No. Then we'll move right into public hearings. Are we going to do any public hearings today or no? MR. BARTOE: I don't believe so. And I believe very shortly we should adjourn for Ms. Keller's sake. I just want to add that if you look at the bottom of your agenda, next week's (sic) meeting will be on a Thursday in our building on Horseshoe Drive, Rooms 609 and 610. Thursday, October 18th. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: A Thursday, hm. MS. BARNETT: And it should say 9:00 a.m. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: And I assume that-- MR. BLUM: Is there a reason for that, Mr. Bartoe? MR. BARTOE: This room is not available on the normal date, and neither was our rooms, 609, 610, so we went one day later. MR. BLUM: It's not because of a particular contentious calendar that requires media attention and all those good things like last time? ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: WINK won't be there, in other words? MR. OSSORIO: Could be. I don't know. MR. BLUM: You remember the last time we did that, it was more than interesting. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: All right, you want to take a short adjournment here, just to allow Mrs. Keller to take care of her items, or do you want to try to continue this case? Are we going to do any case now? MR. NEALE: I would say because Mrs. Keller, she has to head for the airport, the board would not have a quorum when it reconvenes, so I would say that essentially you have to adjourn the Page 32 September 19,2007 board meeting and continue the item to the next board meeting. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Okay. MR. OSSORIO: Mr. Chairman, I've -- MR. NEALE: They may already have gone, so-- MR. OSSORIO: I've talked to the respondent and they're going to go ahead and wait till October. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Okay, that sounds good. MR. NEALE: I do have a question, this is personal, but -- and I don't know if it would be inconvenient for anyone else. Is there any way possible to schedule the meeting next month for the 16th instead of the 18th, to make it on Tuesday? MR. OSSORIO: I'll call you today. MR. NEALE: If you would. Would that inconvenience any of the board members? ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: No, not me. MR. HERRIMAN: No, it would be more convenient for me, because I won't be here Thursday. MR. ZACHARY: Is the 16th a BCC meeting? MR. NEALE: It doesn't really conflict with us, though. MR. ZACHARY: Well, if it's up there I guess it won't. But it might with me. But you can always find somebody else to send. MS. KELLER: All right, someone will let us know, Mike, which day it is? MR. OSSORIO: We will. MS. KELLER: Okay. Do you want our e-mails so you can e-mail us stuff? MR. BLUM: I gave mine to Maggie. That's the only way I do it. MS. KELLER: Does she e-mail you then? MR. BLUM: She e-mails me every time, yeah. It helps a lot. MR. OSSORIO: Just give it to me after the meeting, because we're going to be adjourned in a few minutes. MR. NEALE: That's not a BCC date, as far as I can tell, because Page 33 September 19,2007 it's the third Tuesday instead of the second. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: All right, with that I suppose that we need a motion to adjourn. MR. BLUM: So moved, Blum. MS. KELLER: Do you want to keep our packets for us for next week? ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Shall we keep them? MR. BARTOE: Yeah, keep those, please. MS. KELLER: And then you'll bring them back with the other stuff. MR. BLUM: We should keep them. MR. OSSORIO: Yeah, we'll take them, because last time you took them, you didn't bring them and then we had a problem. So we have enough hands, we can bring them back. Especially if it's going to be in our office, it's not a big deal. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: I only have one last comment I'd like to make real quick about the fire situation with the condominiums and the fire control alarm system company. Since this is going to be carried on until October, is there a way that we can find out if these alarms have been actually taken care and fixed in Park Plaza and these other units that are underway are safe? MR. OSSORIO: I think they do have permits now. The question is, it's not about the work or the quality of work or unsafety of it. The question is is it's a continuance process. I don't want to get into the meat of the case, but hopefully we'll have some mitigation issues next month. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Okay, but there's no safety factor involved right not. MR. OSSORIO: No, there's not. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Okay, that's what I was wondering. Motion on the floor to adjourn. Second? Page 34 September 19,2007 MR. HERRIMAN: Second, Herriman. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Motion and a second. All in favor? MR. HERRIMAN: Aye. MR. BLUM: Aye. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: Aye. MS. KELLER: Aye. MR. BOYD: Aye. ACTING CHAIRMAN JOSLIN: See you next month. ****** There being no further business for the good of the County, the meeting was adjourned by order of the Chair at 10:09 a.m. COLLIER COUNTY CODE ENFORCEMENT BOARD RICHARD JOSLIN, ACTING CHAIRPERSON Transcript prepared on behalf of Gregory Court Reporting Service, Inc., by Cherie' R. Nottingham. Page 35