Agenda 12/14/2021 Item # 2B (BCC Minutes from November 9, 2021)2.B
12/14/2021
COLLIER COUNTY
Board of County Commissioners
Item Number: 2.B
Item Summary: November 9, 2021 - BCC Meeting Minutes
Meeting Date: 12/14/2021
Prepared by:
Title: Sr. Operations Analyst — County Manager's Office
Name: Geoffrey Willig
11/29/2021 2:33 PM
Submitted by:
Title: Division Director - Corp Fin & Mgmt Svc — County Manager's Office
Name: Mark Isackson
11/29/2021 2:33 PM
Approved By:
Review:
County Manager's Office Geoffrey Willig County Manager Review
Board of County Commissioners Geoffrey Willig Meeting Pending
Completed 11/29/2021 2:33 PM
12/14/2021 9:00 AM
Packet Pg. 23
November 9, 2021
TRANSCRIPT OF THE MEETING OF THE
BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
Naples, Florida November 9, 2021
LET IT BE REMEMBERED, that the Board of County
Commissioners, in and for the County of Collier, and als6%qc4ng as
the Board of Zoning Appeals and as the governing-Cft�d(s) of such
N../
special districts as have been created accord* w and having
conducted business herein, met on this 9:00 a.m., in
REGULAR SESSION in Buildi f the Government Complex,
A
East Naples, Florida, with o lwing members present:
irman:
ALSO PRESENT:
Penny Taylor
William L. McDaniel, Jr.
Rick LoCastro
Burt L. Saunders
Andy Solis
Mark Isackson, County Manager
Sean Callahan, Deputy County Manager
Jeffrey A. Klatzkow, County Attorney
Crystal K. Kinzel, Clerk of the Circuit Court
Troy Miller, Communications & Customer Relations
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November 9, 2021
MR. ISACKSON: Commissioners, good morning.
Madam Chair, Commissioners, you have a live mic.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Good morning, County Manager.
Good morning, Collier County. We have a special opportunity
today to recognize our veterans that have come to join us this
morning. But before we begin, I would like Mr. Weston to come to
the podium, please, because I'd like you to give us the mv ca ion.
MR. WESTON: Thank you.
Item #lA
INVOCATION AND PLEDGE OF AL
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Afte h4rwould like -- I'm sorry.
I don't remember your name, the I
Florence Mitchell, I woul ou to lead -- Florence
Weinstein, I'd like you to eleu the Pledge, please. So first we'll
have the invocation. Al please.
MR. WESTON: I , as we used to say in the army, all
present and accoun C, r. So -- even airborne, sure. All right, you
guys. n,
Please b ur heads while I pray: Dear wise and loving
father, firs t say thank you on behalf of all who are gathered
here to4� ank you for your many and abundant blessings.
OZThank yo or life itself, for the measure of health we need to fulfill
our callings, for sustenance and for our friendship. Thank you for
the ability to be involved in useful work and for the honor of bearing
appropriate responsibilities.
Thanks as well for the freedom to embrace you or the freedom
to reject you. Thank you for loving us even so from your boundless
and gracious nature. In Jesus Christ I pray, amen.
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November 9, 2021
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Ms. Weinstein, if you would lead us.
(The Pledge of Allegiance was recited in unison.)
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: We're going to just take a moment
and recognize our veterans here today. They have gathered -- they're
gathering all this week and last week, and I think the festivities
continue through the whole month of November.
If you don't mind -- and if you would stay seated, I -- or if
you would stay in your seat or if you so feel like you �ioTW e to
come up to the podium, I'd like you to identify your d talk
.�< a)n
about, you know, what part of the armed servicese you served in,
please. And I think we'll start at this end ri
4, r
V
MR. McVAY: My name is Joe 1\ c volunteered for the
Jog all the testing,
Marines in 1965. Through the Induct" , rter,
everything, at the end of the day, I e erence to what kind of an
allotment would I receive for my r n. At that point in time, I
I
had three children. At the end,,(a
day they said, Joe, you really
shouldn't be here, so they s ome. And that's my military
history.
And now I'm a d ith thee museum for over two years, and
I want to remain th e r as long as I can.
CHAIRMA 0
LOR: Thank you.
MR. Mc A Thank you.
CHA TAYLOR: Mr. Hinds.
M S: My name is David Hinds. I served in the
Marine s in 1966 in Vietnam. And I am the president of the
Naples Military Museum for the last three years. And if anyone has
never been there, we are located at the Naples Airport right down
here on Airport -Pulling off of North Road. So I appreciate my
fellow docents showing up today for support and appreciate all the
veterans here.
We did bring a guest. He's 98 years old today. He's going to
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November 9, 2021
be a speaker. And me at 75, he says I'm the youngster of the group.
So I got a lot to look forward to. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you.
MS. JOHNSON: Good morning. My name's Irene Johnson.
I'm a United States Air Force veteran. I also work for the Collier
County library, and I was in during 9/11. 1 worked at NORAD. If
you don't know what NORAD is, it's that mountain that i n Air
Force Base. It was a lot of fun. I can't tell all the se r, don't
ask me, okay.
But thank you very much for giving us appr ci ion today and to
all these wonderful men and women here tha served our
country.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: We're 9 get you a microphone.
Let's pass it around.
MR. MITCHELL: Okay. o I'm John Mitchell. I was
with the U.S. Navy. I enlisted 17 in 1945, and my service was
to drive ambulances for 10 urs a day and bring the wounded
and the first aid patient� e hospital ships and from the military
ships into various host ost of which were civilian hospitals.
The military servic Iready used all their beds, so we would
drive around Ne k and preprogrammed, find hospitals that had a
few bed. A couldn't drop all the people we had in the
ambula c o spot. There weren't that many beds. Sothatwas
a lot of at time. And I thought -- I enjoyed it very much,
met a lot veterans and lived through a lot of their experiences kind
of vicariously.
So thank you very much for having me.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you. Ms. Weinstein.
Ms. Weinstein, a lady never tells her age, but would you please
give your age.
MS. WEINSTEIN: Well, I'm 97.
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November 9, 2021
(Applause.)
MS. WEINSTEIN: You had to be 20 with your parents'
consent in order to go into the woman's Army Corps. It had
previously been the woman's auxiliary corps, but when it came a part
of the regular army, you had to be 20. 1 was 20 in 1944, and I was
just itching to get in because my father had been in the first world
war. So I worked in the message center, and did everyt g hat I
possibly could, and here I am. And thank you very
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you.
(Applause.)
MR. SANFORD: Good morning. Ha e here. I'm
Jerry Sanford. I was in from 1956 to 196 h Navy. I was in
peacetime, because we all remember th ians are coming, the
Russians are coming. So everybod a ared, the Cold War.
And I was stationed on a rad *c et ship, which was an old
liberty ship used during World . They outfitted with all kinds
of sophisticated radar, and bar back and forth. So I went
from Iceland to off the c lorida, and that was a terrible duty,
but they fed us good. yway, it's great to be here, and God
bless all these vetepn hank you.
CHAIRM LOR: Thank you.
MR. MI MISS: Good morning, everyone, and thank you
very mucrApaving us.
My<7..%.,p,, Tom Middlemiss, and I was a member of the 77th
Infantry Vision. It was a New York outfit. I spent six months in
active duty training at Fort Dix, New Jersey. It was strictly infantry.
My commitment was for six years. So I started in 1959 and
honorably discharged in -- July 30th, 1965.
1 went from there to being a staff photographer with the New
York Daily News. And Jerry here, who was also a New York City
fireman, I knew him from New York because we crossed paths many
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November 9, 2021
times, and then we picked up our friendship after we came back to
Naples.
Thank you very much for having us. God bless the USA, and
God bless everyone here. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you.
(Applause.)
MR. CORTWRIGHT: My name is Charles Cortw i ht and I
was in the U.S. Naval Reserve.
In 1941, 1 was a freshman in college. Can yo a ine
December 7th in a men's dormitory when the wo nt out the
Japanese has invaded Pearl Harbor? Bedla But I thank
you for the kind words today.
And I'm one of the lucky ones who his country, and the
real heroes are still in North Africa, ro and the Islands of
Pacific.
I served on Okinawa and t nd of Okinawa and arrived 40
days after the battle which I e days. But they leveled the
island. And the job as to clean up the island getting
ready for the big war er existed, the invasion of Japan.
So far we've h c an outstanding Military Museum set up by
Bobby McDona y Dave Hinds. All the volunteers were
outstanding. s ed several years as a volunteer there, and I would
like to tell u t the visitors at our museum, Military Museum,
have so stories to tell about their uncles and their aunts and
whoever s that I felt that it was appreciation to me to listen to their
stories, too. I thank you very much.
(Applause.)
MR. WESTON: Good morning, I'm Kent Weston. Thank
you. I'm Kent Weston.
I served in the United States Army. I enlisted in 1966, spent
three years in the army as military police. The job was really
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November 9, 2021
entertaining in ways, especially being an AWOL hunter sometimes
and a traffic accident investigator. Stationed at Fort Polk, Louisiana,
for three years, and got to see a lot of Texas, Louisiana, Mississippi.
It was unbelievable how many people we had to go find. But it was
during the Vietnam War.
So, youknow, we still had ajob to do. Andl -- itwas --it's
just an honor to serve with these people. I work at the tiksel4m.
And to tell you the truth, even though it was the Viet, frt,�, I would
-- it was worth i .
do it all over again. I think it was
And thank you, fellows and ladies, for your e
(Applause.) I&
MR. CONDOMINA: Hello. I am ondomina. I
actually work for Growth Management Qe ment.
I served between -- I enlisted 1D.290 ecember of 2000. 1
went into the army, andlwas ap VJhe82ndairbornell7th
calvary, deployed to Afghanist Iraq. And I just want to say it
is an honor being in this ro my brothers and sisters, and it
was -- I was proud to re ou all over there. One of the
scariest things over th e scorpions and the spiders. I'm just
letting you know, I a o sit there every night worrying about those
things.
Other th 1 proudly served, and it was an honor to just
serve this cmn Thank vou.
(AkpNNF.)
MR`S�4cCARTHY: Hi. I'm Jack McCarthy. I was in in 1943
and got out in'46. So I spent all my time in the Pacific on LSTs.
That's large, slow targets. There are no roads in the Pacific. If you
got there, we brought you. We were the 18 Wheelers. And we
started off in New Guinea, Borneo, the Admiralties, Manis, Leyte,
Manila, all the way up through Japan. And I got out'46, so I'm
lucky to be here.
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November 9, 2021
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you.
(Applause.)
MR. CORREALE: Hello, everybody. My name is Sonny
Correale. I was in the U.S. Army from 1956 to 1958. In basic
training I took medical training, medical school, to be a medic, and
when they shipped us out to England, when we got there -- it happens
a lot in the army -- the orders were screwed up, they wero�nqsed up.
They didn't need medics. They needed engineers, co on
workers. So I became an engineer, after all that m a raining.
So, anyway, I served six months in England,(�aNn t en we were
shipped to Germany and spent one year in G uilding Nike
pads, preparing roads, and bridges. And s happy to serve my
country, and I had a great experience fo ears. So thank you
for having me today.
(Applause.)
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: you.
MR. MALZONE: Ye y name is Anthony Malzone. I
was a New York City po ce drafted in '61. 1 was a flash
ranger attached to the rtillery and discharged in'67. Thank
you very much for a me here.
(Applause.
MR. BI My name is Jack Bills. I was in the Army Air
Corps fro 9 o 1947, and nothing too big ever happened to me.
I was o We patrolled up and down the West Coast of
Californ* nd entertained a lot of gunnery students in Las Vegas.
And the only thing I can say, I hated sushi for about 50 years, but
now I love sushi. How you forgive and forget. I'm glad to see these
people here older than me.
(Applause.)
MR. TERSTEGGE: My name is Steven Terstegge, and
everybody knows me as Bear, Native American. I was in the Air
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November 9, 2021
F orc e from '6 6 to 7 8, the Navy from 7 8 to '8 1, and the Marine s for
three months, so -- when I first went into the Navy, they didn't have a
ship to assign me to, so they put me in the third marine division for
three months, and then they finally assigned me to the USS Dixie.
And since I was living in North Dakota, I never saw the ship, because
they couldn't get it up the Red River.
And it's a pleasure to be here, and it's an honor to seA�e t�is
country and be in the middle of a bunch of vets. We' e others,
and thank you, everybody. Thanks for your servic
(Applause.)
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you v c I'd like to
read something here that -- Major General es ammer Hartsell's
quote during a recent legislative presen!ab" 0- 0 Tallahassee. A
veteran is a person who, at some poipt,,in i or her life, wrote a blank
check made payable to the United Noe of America for amount up to
and including their life. We t em for their selfless service and
sacrifice.
(Applause.)
CHAIRMAN T Thank you very much. And as it's
part of the presenta io h s morning, I'll briefly read about the Artist
of the Month. ens to be a display from the Military Museum,
which is our Col County Military Museum.
The e honors all branches of the U.S. Military and is
dedicat eserving the history of freedom and liberty through the
centuries battle round the world. Over the past 10 years, the
Naples Military Museum volunteers have collected approximately
13,000 artifacts including military uniforms, weapons, maps, posters,
and photographs going back to the Revolutionary War.
Currently, the museum displays military memorabilia in Naples
City Hall, at NCH Downtown and North Naples hospitals. It is their
vision, as their collection grows, that an expanded location can be
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November 9, 2021
found providing space for this fitting tribute to our country's military
past.
Thank you very much again. Thank you so much for your
service.
(Applause.)
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: And now I think we're going to go
to -- and if you would like to stay with us, you're welcon4,,to, If
you'd like to leave, please feel you're not disturbing t e ng.
THE PHOTOGRAPHER: I'm going to take ti)re.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Oh, okay. Of al o hem?
THE PHOTOGRAPHER: Yeah. UnI y want to get up.
I wouldn't want you to if you --
MR. SANFORD: Everybody get take a picture, come
on.
MR. MITCHELL: I'm okayi t a gal like this holding me.
COMMISSIONER LoCA John, watch yourself over
there. Watch yourself.
MR. CONDOMIN glad I'm the oldest guy here.
(Applause.)
CHAIRMAN R L R: County Manager, so we are now at
the approval oft nda and the minutes, and the minutes are from
the regular, cojas and summary agenda, October 12th, 2021.
Item #241j�
TODAY'S REGULAR, CONSENT AND SUMMARY AGENDA
AS AMENDED (EX PARTE DISCLOSURE PROVIDED BY
COMMISSION MEMBERS FOR CONSENT AGENDA.) -
APPROVED AND/OR ADOPTED W/CHANGES
Page 10
November 9, 2021
MR. ISACKSON: Ma'am, maybe you'd like me to go through
the proposed agenda changes before you get to that?
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I sure would. That would be very
helpful.
MR. ISACKSON: Okay. Commissioners, good morning.
These are the proposed agenda changes for the board meeting of
November 9, 2021.
At Commissioner Solis'request, move Item 17D t which
v
aVb
was a recommendation to review and approve the c mbined
f i
Annual Update and Inventory Report on public �0, ies and
schedule of capital improvements as provide
Section 6.02.02
of the Collier County Land Development ection
163.3177(3)(b), Florida Statutes, and ad t esolution that updates
the five-year capital improvement s0he
Commissioner Saunders has e ted an add -on to -- it will be
I OB. It's a recommendation t e direction to the County
Manager regarding the pro ated at the southeast comer of
Santa Barbara Boulevar vis Boulevard.
Commissioner I is requesting that Item 16A20 be
moved to I I E. It' i mendation to direct the County Attorney
to advertise and back for a public hearing an ordinance
establishing t d Avenue Southeast Multiple Services Taxing
Unit, MST t a maximum of five mills, for the repayment of the
funds i ount of $72,231 which were used to make emergency
road repa on 42nd Avenue Southeast.
The staffs request to continue Item 16C7 to the December 14,
2021, meeting. That's a recommendation to approve the selection
committee's final ranking for Request for Proposal No. 21-7924,
construction manager at risk for the Golden Gate Golf Course, and
authorize staff to begin contract negotiations with the top -ranked
firm, Gates Group, LLC, doing business as Gates Construction, so
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November 9, 2021
that a proposed agreement can be brought back for the Board's
consideration at a future meeting.
We're going to -- Commissioners, we're going to continue an
after -the -fact item, it's No. 3 from Item 16E8, to the December 14,
2021 , meeting. That's a recommendation to approve the
administrative reports prepared by the Procurement Services Division
for change orders and other contractual modifications re . ri g
Board's approval.
At Commissioner Solis'request, to continue Itt4 to the
December 14, 2021 , meeting; this item was conti u on
October 12th and October 26th. It's a reco ion to adopt an
ordinance creating the Collier County Pub A Committee to
advise the Board on all matters related t%Q ic art within the entire
unincorporated area of Collier CoLin in ding the
Bayshore/Gateway Triangle Com I Redevelopment Area.
Nit
Ma'am, we have no time- today, and remember that our
court reporter breaks are at :"+Nnd 2:50 this afternoon.
That's all the chang De.
CHAIRMA- T : Thank you very much. Soifwecan
aks
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at 4
is'N T
go down the da s a e there's any changes to the agenda, any
comments, and , parte.
t", rt
Co MIS , I McDaniel, we'll start with you, Sir.
IM
0 _ V
COXM "NER McDANIEL: Yes, good morning. I have
an�
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no cha r any ex parte.
C4HMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: And I have no changes and
no ex parte on the consent agenda as well.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner LoCastro.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: I have no changes, no ex
parte, but I do have a question on something on the consent agenda,
so would it be appropriate to ask?
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November 9, 2021
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Yes, it is. Yes.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Okay. And it's really to you,
Mr. County Manager. First off, welcome back. Good to see you.
MR. ISACKSON: Thank you.
(Applause.)
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: It's good to see you. I mean,
Sean did an averageJob, but we're glad to see you back i th seat.
And I just wanted to make a comment on 16E2. s not to
throw rocks or spears or anything but just to make a "on, and
it's -- you know, on the consent agenda, it's just a n -liner talking
about approving an administrative report pre y the
Procurement Services Division for some * a of property, but if
you drill down into that -- into that nota ' n, e're writing off quite a
bit of things that are missing and so e nsive things; you know,
cameras, computers.
And we're a big company, ow, wevre a big organization,
stuff disappears. There's a s weire writing off that are no
longer serviceable. So 1 st stuff that's been missing or stolen
or anything. But: just e a note, you know, people need to be
held accountable fo t e things. And it's great to just, you know,
sort of write it o �:
And like , I'm not -- I'm making just more of a statement,
you know. 0 Id like to see every year that list get smaller, not
bigger, ooked like last year it was about the same size, almost
200 item So just as a notation, you know, we should really take a
close look at that. And, yeah, you've got a rusty file cabinet, no
problem, and there's a bunch of those on the list. But then we have
some things that just say missing, missing, missing, missing, and it's
camera. You know, I wrote some things down here. Golf cart.
You know, and I'm sure there's stories behind a lot those, and maybe
it's not missing; maybe it's not viable, but I would just say as a team
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November 9, 2021
here, you know, holding people accountable for things that maybe
have found legs or they're just not being, you know, watched closely.
So I don't know if you have, you know, any comment on it or
anything, but --
MR. ISACKSON: The comment is we'll have a conversation
with Procurement.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Yes, sir. Absol ly. If
you look at the list that's attached, if you drill down, i 's u know,
that's taxpayer dollars, but I have no other --
MR. ISACKSON: We'll make sure we foll w with the
Board on that.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: t y, yes, sir. Thank
you.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Co is er Solis.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: c anges, no disclosures. I'll
just say that in terms of the A reason I asked for that to be
put on the regular agend is o ow, at least since I've been here,
we go through that eve nd I think it's one of the things
that -- for the public t tand how we kind of get us where we
are and maintain r are, it's a really important thing that the
public know an stand that none of this is just pulling things out
of a hat or the o y staff getting lucky on things working out well.
I mean, th* -- we're one of the only counties, I think, that has this
process a really good process; it's how we set the level of
service verything.
So thank you for the indulgence in going through that, but I
think it's a valuable exercise, and we ought to do that as long as we're
preparing an AUIR.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you. And no --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: No disclosures, no changes.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: -- disclosures?
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November 9, 2021
I have two disclosures. 16A6, I had meetings. 16A7, I had
emails. And no changes to the agenda at this time; however, we do
have, I think, 13 or 15 folks that want to speak to the boat ramp issue
here sitting in the -- and they are commercial folks.
MR. ISACKSON: Ma'am, maybe we can ask Troy to clarify
that.
MR. MILLER: Yeah. I have four registered spea rs or the
boat ramp item.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Four registered spe sZ*
,..A
1\ R. MILLER: Yes.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: If you want
probably need to register. If not, if you'rN*
fine, too.
MR. MILLER: Speaker slips 1�1
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: 0
[o this, you
or support, that's
hallway.
MR. ISACKSON: Troy, eakers on the consent agenda?
MR. MILLER: Yes, as just going to remind the
chairman, we have a spe Item 16D I I, Jessica Bergel.
CHAIRMAN T Well, let's just hang on for a second.
So let's just decide, o - s we've got maybe 10 or 13 people sitting
f
here, although t want to speak, they are commercial
folks -- e di L1 ve a time -certain on this agenda -- is it the will of
w I ,
mend the agenda to hear this item first before we
my collea s to
go on rest of the agenda?
CO ISSIONER SAUNDERS: Sure.
'0
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Sure.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay. So then you will be heard
right after we hear public comment. So thank you very much. So
the agenda is so amended. And do I hear a motion to accept the
agenda as amended?
MR. MILLER: Madam Chair, we still have the speaker on
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November 9, 2021
Item 16D 11.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Excuse me. I misunderstood. We
do have a speaker that's online or --
MR. MILLER: No, here in the room. Jessica Bergel on
consent agenda Item 16D11. Ms. Bergel, if you'll come up to the
podium.
MS. BERGEL: I wasn't expecting to be first.
Hi, I'm Jessica Bergel, back again from Naples o ockey
League. I wanted to update everybody to let you at we've
been meeting with people, Dan Rodriguez and B illiams, and
things are really moving well, and we're so h at we finally got
a voice.
We haven't told our players yet wh 's ing on, because we
don't want everybody to get upset a th isappointed if something
doesn't follow through. But we j ted to say thank you. And I
wanted to say thank you. I kn n't have anybody here from our
group. Everybody's busy.
But I'm here, and I o say thank you for -- especially to
you, Ms. Taylor, for b advocate and helping us through this,
because we're getti ce and we're getting a rink and our kids are
getting a better n welre getting -- we're being able to store
things, and it' e moving along well.
And I we had -- or two weekends ago we had a
tourna e rink that brought 300 people to Collier County on
an avera eekend. And with our concessions, when they come
back, and when we get a better -established place, we plan to do that
at least every month to bring people into Collier County and expose
them to roller hockey and have more teams, and this also provides for
our travel team that can -- that's already won national championships
to continue to have a home here in Collier County.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Great.
Page 16
November 9, 2021
MS. BERGEL: We just wanted to say thank you.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you for saying thank you.
MR. ISACKSON: Madam Chair, Commissioners, if you don't
mind if I can get through the proclamations, we have Mr. Wert in the
audience to accept his proclamation.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay. Excuse me, sir. We'll just
have a motion to accept the agenda --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: So moved.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: -- as amended. Seow% All those
in favor, say aye.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO:
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDE-D
3
COMMISSIONER McDZN�1�
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR:
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN TA
I'm sorry to in
MR. ISACKS1
A
e.
Aye.
opposed, like sign.
t carries unanimously.
County Manager.
that's okay.
Page 17
November 9, 2021
Item #16HI
RECOGNIZING PAMELA WILSON, GROWTH MANAGEMENT
DEPARTMENT, TRANSPORTATION ENGINEERING DIVISION
AS THE OCTOBER 2021 EMPLOYEE OF THE MONTH — READ
INTO THE RECORD
The Employee of the Month for October is to L <c1gViz'e Pamela
Wilson in our Growth Management Department, E?hpsportation and
Engineering Division, again, for the October 2 �ffiployee of the
Month. I believe her rewards and recognitild ill be provided
off-line. 'AR N
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR:
Item #4 A�e
A N
PROCLAMATIONS — R TO THE RECORD — ITEMS #4A,
#4B, #4C, #41), #4E, #� 4G
MR. ISACk$N: The proclamations, I'd like to start with a
proclamation W,,c nizing Mr. Jack Wert for his many years of
outstandi efi e in leading the tourism marketing efforts in Collier
County t ink Commissioner Solis has the honor of reading
roc r
Mr. Wert roclamation.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS:
Mr. Manager.
And I will, and thank you,
And, you know, this is a wonderful opportunity to say thank you
to a great leader and a part of Collier County for 19 years, Jack Wert.
And I'll just read the proclamation but, you know, one of the things I
would like to say first is just to thank Jack for, really, the wisdom and
0-!.M
November 9, 2021
the way he went about dealing with -- I mean, the things that we've
had to deal with at the TDC from red tide to hurricanes to a
pandemic, you know, it's been, I think, masterful in the way that he
was open to everything and new ideas, and that's real leadership. So
thank you, Jack. So let me read the proclamation.
Jack Wert was hired as Collier County's first tourism director
and sole employee in December of 2002 promising to grokt4e
operation over an employment commitment to the cqyil;ro�live
years. Nineteen years later, Jack Wert has retired �Q s role
. 4M
leading an office of 10 employees, a portfolio of d rtisingand
marketing contractors, research firms, and in nal tourism
representatives; and,
Whereas, over the course of his emlio nent, Jack and his team
e r,
of destination marketing professiona responsible for attracting
a total of 30.97 million visitors to i County and the collection
of 348 million in tourist develork4. taxes providing for an
economic impact of $29.7 b* Yhenefiting the businesses and
12 e7b 0
residents of the county;,�a
J
Whereas, under J rt's coordination, the creation of the
a
internationally recyn d aradise Coast brand was developed; and,
Whereas, Jill INNert's steady leadership and professionalism has
guided our to is recovery efforts through natural and economic
obstacles, 1 1 g the Gulf oil spill, the Great Recession, red tide,
hurrica fires, Zika, and a coronavirus pandemic; and,
Wh s, during the pandemic, Jack Wert's efforts in marketing
and messaging the Paradise Pledge of local businesses' safety
protocols put Collier County on the fast track to tourism rebound and
helped to protect 45,000 jobs in the leisure and hospitality industry,
many at risk of temporary or permanent loss; and,
Whereas, Jack Wert has earned the opportunity to enjoy the
fruits of his labor to write a book imparting his wisdom to others to
Page 19
November 9, 2021
consult and advise a new generation of destination marketing
professionals and to renew his lapsed merchant marine captain's
license.
Now, therefore, the Board of County Commissioners of Collier
County, Florida, wishes to express its grateful appreciation to Jack
Wert for many years of outstanding service in leading the tourism
marketing efforts of Collier County, for being a brand hin4i�elf as -- a
brand himself as a gentleman and constant professionjil r
making the Paradise Coast an international destinat"
Thanks, Jack.
(Applause.)
MR. WERT: Commissioners, thank s much. This is
truly a great honor for me to stand up he*Q hear about all those
things. When you put it all toge*the*t r y is quite a story. We
always work on week to week an h to month and maybe the
year. It's really interesting to whole thing.
That's true, I was goin five years, and I had a lot of fun
all the way through it. p to be about 19 years. And so it
really has been good. s I look back over those 19 years, you
know, we started o h hat staff of one. The first year's budget
was about $750 s you know, it's grown to several million
now because e itation has truly grown.
At th e started, the mandate was just promote the off
season. n will take care of itself, and it did for a number of
years. eventually, as we got into marketing the destination and
we hit those real challenges that you heard about in the proclamation,
things did slow down, and the industry really said, we need help even
in the high season.
So we started doing that. Borrowed a little money from the
summer campaign and put it toward season, and that really paid off.
And, truly, the rest of those statistics are the history of what
Page 20
November 9, 2021
happened. When we continued to add more promotion dollars to the
mix, we were able to expand from just talking to Floridians to really
talking to the world as we do today.
A question I've always asked myself, and I've asked my staff
this as well: Do we now and over the years have we made a
difference in this community? And I think the evidence really points
to a definite yes. We certainly grew the number of visitoq d
spending in the area, but the thing I think I'm most r nd we,
in general, in the tourism staff really are proud of t ber of
families that those visitors and the spending the ri g to our
community really do support. Those 45,000 es here in Collier
County really look to their livelihood fro v itors that do come
to our community and spend their hard- dollars. So that's
truly, truly important.
So we grew that visitation. re less than a million that
first year. We're over two mil ow, those are just overnight
visitors that spend at least o It really doesn't count our
seasonal residents that c n and also spend great dollars here
and eventually they c buy property here and become full-time
residents.
Over those rs, welve really honed our skills, and we've
changed how e mote Collier County. As I said, we started just
with Flori(Ja% a now it's the world.
W esignated back in 2003 by a resolution by this County
Commiss as the official destination marketing organization for
Collier County. We took that the next -- actually, in the next two
years and became an accredited tourism bureau, actually the very first
one in Florida to get that designation of an accredited destination
marketing organization.
We compete with visitors from all over the world. All these
destinations that have a beach, they're our competition, and we share
Page 21
November 9, 2021
visitation with them. Sometimes they come to us. Sometimes they
go to them. But we have to constantly be having a message out there
that truly says, come to Collier County. Enjoy Florida's Paradise
Coast.
A couple of things just to keep in mind as we move forward.
As I step away and Paul and our staff who are all here -- thank you so
much for being here and being supportive -- it's importan*,to
remember that what we do is sales and marketing. Tk Mir sole
)I
purpose in being here is to help promote this c( uint ring people
here who, frankly, don't live here, and to spend t ir ard-earned
dollars.
Face-to-face selling opportunities, so ant. That's why we
go to trade shows. It's important to ma s e that we are there. If
wevre not there, our competition is t e. ey're going to get that
business. That's just how travel s hese days.
And professional develop So terribly important to the
fast-moving tourism in ust ghout the world. We need to be
on top of our game allt nd know the best way to deliver that
right message at the ri e and in the right format so that our
potential customer i .
The tourist pment tax, that tax that funds everything that
we do, our �p a S, and all of our marketing and so forth. As I
said, it's p f y people who don't live here. It's not our citizens
here th at tax, but they get the benefit of the visitation dollars
that these lks spend in our community.
And, in fact, that ends up not only helping to fuel the promotion
that we do, but it also saves our residents over $ 1 000 in taxes every
year. And they would not have that savings if we didn't bring those
visitors.
Another thing that's really great, we've found over the years, is
that our visitors are really loyal to us. About 60 percent of them are
Page 22
November 9, 2021
return visitors. The opposite of that is that we still have to replace
40 percent of the people who were here this month next year. We
either need to convince them to return or to find new and, for the
most part, we've done a really good job of kind of taking market
share from other destinations here in Florida.
So in closing, what I'd like to first and foremost say to the
commissioners, thank you so very much for all your supp rt In) ver the
years. It's truly been a privilege for me to serve this 0, ity in
u
Jj
u cil
this role. A big thanks to the Tourist Developmen cil and,
Commissioner Solis, for your chairmanship and r I of you
commissioners who have also served in that y; thank you for
your support. It really has meant a lot to ta and, more
importantly, it really has paid off in soniVr ly wonderful growth
over the years.
I leave this role knowing thi r better herein Collier
County. We've got more jobs, prosperous tourism businesses,
p (
more assistance to our citiz h4ugh the savings that we bring and
to the spending that we b usinesses in Collier County. We
brought new hotels to We brought new restaurants. We've
got a very thriving2n 0 tinuously growing arts and culture
community. T sh8pping is second to none. The dining; we've
become a dini tination to people from all over the world. And
our eco ad A r s, honestly, are things that people who compete
with us y envious of Who else has the Everglades but us,
and we n to remember that.
And those things didn't just happen. It was a team effort, and it
comes from a dedicated group of professionals like we have here
whose sales and marketing experience has really brought us to where
we are today. There's certainly no me. There's no 1. It's always
been we as a team did that, and I'm eternally grateful to having been a
partofthatteam. Thank you all for the bestjob I ever had. Thanks
Page 23
November 9, 2021
so much.
(Applause.)
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Wait, wait. Should we have a
picture with Jack? Yeah. We have a plaque as well.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: If you would have hit 20
years, you get a Rolex watch. Yeah, you really screwed that one up,
I tell you what.
MR. ISACKSON: Madam Chair, Commission r e are six
additional proclamations I'd like to recognize. Th il be either
delivered or mailed to the recipients.
The first is a proclamation recognizing t level of medical
and dental care provided by the Neighbor alth Clinic to
working low-income uninsured Collier adults since 1999.
Commissioner Taylor will deliver t r I mation to Dr. Leslie
Lascheid, CEO of the Neighborho alth Clinic.
The next proclamation re s -- is recognizing the Saturday
after Thanksgiving as Smal u ss Saturday in Collier County by
supporting the national e couraging consumers to shop at local
independently owned ses on Saturday, November 27th, 202 1.
The proclamation ailed to the Small Business Saturday
Coalition.
The next r amation designates November 2021 as National
n
Hospice arW tive Care Month in Collier County. The
procla ill be mailed to Mark Beland, community liaison for
Avow H Naples, Florida.
The next proclamation designates November 17th through the
24th� 202 1, as Farm -City Week in Collier County. The proclamation
will be mailed to Cyndee Woolley, president of the Farm -City
Barbecue of Collier County, Incorporated.
The next proclamation designates November 14th, 202 1, as
Diabetes Awareness Day in Collier County. The proclamation will
Page 24
November 9, 2021
be mailed to Joe Balavage, president of the Diabetes Alliance
Network.
The next proclamation designates November 8th through the
14th as Period Poverty Awareness Week in Collier County. The
proclamation will be mailed to Susan Mainwaring, Alliance for
Period Supplies of Southwest Florida.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: County Manager, with y r
indulgence and with my colleagues' Indulgence, we h e
representatives from Farm -City Barbecue here. A 's uch an
important event for Collier County annual event. d wonder if
we could just have a couple comments, if yo to come up and
speak to it.
Ms. Krier.
MS. KRIER: Thank you, Ma irman. For the record,
I'm Ellie Krier. I'm the executive or of Collier County Junior
Deputies, one of the charities eives the funds raised at
Farm -City Barbecue.
It's important to not our 65th year celebrating Fann-City
Barbecue. It is a Ion - . radition in our community, sharing
between the city t q unty, alternating between city dwellers
and people who ur food.
This year, w out at Robert's Ranch, which is a beautiful
Collier Co y seum on the northeast side of Immokalee. We
urge yo come -- most of you are serving, I believe; I hope. It
is just a r arkable part of our community. It's where we all kick
off our holiday season, and we hope you all will be there.
Thank you so much.
Item #2B
Page 25
November 9, 2021
OCTOBER 12, 2021 BCC MEETING MINUTES - APPROVED AS
PRESENTED
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you, Ellie. Thank you.
So I was reminded that we did not make a motion -- take a
motion for the minutes, approve the minutes. So I'd like to see if
there's a motion to approve the minutes.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: So moved.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Second.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: We have a motio o the floor and a
second. All those in favor, say aye.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO:
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Aye:
COMMISSIONER SAUND Aye.
COMMISSIONER McD Aye.
CHAIRMAN TAYLO se opposed, like sign.
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN T It carries unanimously.
MR. ISACKS adam Chairman, Commissioners, if we
can get through sentations on 5A and then I believe we've
three speaker r Item 7, and then we would move to the boat
ramp, if I h ptable to the Board.
C TAYLOR: Yeah, that's fine.
Item #5A
PRESENTATION OF THE COLLIER COUNTY BUSINESS OF
THE MONTH FOR NOVEMBER 2021 TO SHAW GALLERY OF
FINE ART — PRESENTED
Page 26
November 9, 2021
MR. ISACKSON: Item 5A is a presentation of the Collier
County Business of the Month for November 2021 to Shaw Gallery
of Fine Art.
(A video was played as follows:)
MR. SHAW: Hi. My name is Jay Shaw, and this is my
beautiful wife, Marla Shaw.
First and foremost, we are very humbled and honore4Qo
, be
presented with such a prestigious award, and we wou t.%v,010 thank
the Naples Chamber of Commerce and everybody i4,involved in
honoring us with such a special award.
Here at our gallery and the way that we run our business,
we've been family owned and operated fo e rs, and we're still
family owned and operated today. An eople that work with
you and your team are what help yo��ui your business in the
direction that you want to go. A 2�,QAake those dreams happen,
you have to have people aroun . And I am very, very lucky,
and we are very honored to y y in-laws and her parents working
here with us at the galle .
Anthony Jimo ( , my father-in-law, is the director here
at the gallery. He,,ka e a lot of very important things, and he does
I Ann Marie is our research
a fantastic job. 19,,M mother-in-law,
.-Spordinator, and she is constantly looking for new
and developmQr
innovatio Fnew directions that our business can go, things like
weddin ries are, you know, one of the things that we're
working We're working on a financing plan for new collectors,
you know, that may not have the funds to go after the big things.
And so with my team, we've really been able to come up with a
plan, sit down, come up with a plan, figure out exactly what we want
to do, and we've just -- like a beautiful symbiotic relationship, we're
just working away together as a unit, and it's amazing what can
happen when you have that.
Page 27
November 9, 2021
We would both like to thank the commissioners from the bottom
of our hearts. You know, you're welcome to join us here at our
events. Please come through the door, say hi. Anytime you're
around, stop in and say hello.
We're also very honored and very excited to be a part of -- and
to own our business here in Collier County and in Naples. We've
been here for 33 years, and we're doing better than ever, d e plan
on being here for many, many, many more.
And it's a very special place to do business. I v ry active
and a very growing community and a very tight-.k
&iommunity. I
always like to say Naples is like a small tow ut being a small
town. You'll run into people all the time o see, and you shake
hands and say hello, and we're very honKe- have our business
. 10
here, and we're very excited to see w1ure e future will bring us and
where we'll go from here.
-A
(Video concluded.)
Item #7
PUBLIC COMM T N GENERAL TOPICS NOT ON THE
CURRENT O=RE AGENDA
MR RSON: Commissioners, that brings us to Item 7,
public nts on general topics not on the current or future
agenda.
Troy, I think -- how many speakers?
MR. MILLER: We have three registered speakers for this item.
Your first speaker is Daija HinaJosa, and she will be followed by Dan
Cook.
MS. HINAJOSA: Good morning, Commissioners. For the
00M
November 9, 2021
record, my name is Daija HinaJosa, and today I'd actually like to use
my three minutes to speak about Agenda 2 1, which is the global
initiative from the United Nations. And I talked about this briefly
two weeks ago.
People don't really know about Agenda 21 or that it's called
sustainable development. And in my understanding, it's typically a
subject that is often silenced or dismissed. But this is re y
important for the Board and for people here in this ro who are
watching to understand what sustainable developm e ly means.
Agenda 21 has three tenets that I will briefl c er today. One
is social equity. This is to eliminate our nati rders, giving up
your needs and wants for the collective, a i al ownership. So,
essentially, a business owner who owns ness has no say in
decision -making. They pay taxes, t 'r esponsible for overhead
and expenses, but the employees a ital owners. They are the
ones who make decisions, and i all be found online, too.
And economic prosper' place a free market with
public/private partnershi is the merge of power of economy
with the force of gove Large corporations will deal directly
with government a for legislation that would inundate
smaller compan . . h regulations that they cannot keep up with.
And wealth r is ution, as I stated two weeks ago as well.
Ecol a i tegrity. Nature over man. Our rights are
subordi he environmental needs.
Age 21 compromises our property rights. Private land
ownership is unsustainable, and the government can take property
through eminent domain.
In the Growth Management Plan, Agenda 21 is in there, but this
was adopted by the Board back in the '90s, so I wouldn't really expect
any one of you to know about this. Considering this, I think that it's
time that we put Agenda 21 out in the open and educate people on
Page 29
November 9, 2021
what this really means so that everyone has an opportunity to decide
if this is how we want to plan the growth of our county. If you are
interested, I can absolutely send you a PDF that was written by the
United Nations that I can email over to you.
There's nothing wrong with wanting to take care of the
economy, take care of our environment, but what is wrong is, just
like mandates, where there is no choice, there is tyranny.,4,�So I feel
like it's really important for everyone to research Age and
sustainable development and find out what it truly
So thank you all very much and have a grea d
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Just question.
MS. HINAJOSA: Yes.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: you said that Agenda
21 is in some plan adopted by this c the '90s.
MS. HINAJOSA: Yes.
COMMISSIONER SA Do you have a reference to
that particular plan?
MS. HINAJOSA: r Growth Management Plan. It's
the Future Land Use It's -- I can say -- I can email it over
to you if you woul *
COMMISS SAUNDERS: I'dliketoseethat because
I'm not awareof`V%L -
Ms. JT)SA: Absolutely.
C WSIONER SAUNDERS: --the Commission --and I
was not oN4he Commission, obviously, at that time. But I'm not
aware of that issue, Agenda 2 1, ever being discussed by anybody in
this county or the state, quite frankly, in the country, so I'm curious
about seeing that.
MS. HINAJOSA: Yeah, absolutely. I would love to send it to
you.
MR. MILLER: Madam Chair, first of all, I was incorrect.
Page 30
November 9, 2021
There are four speakers on public comment. Your next speaker is
Dan Cook. He'll be followed by Ty Vigil.
MR. COOK: Good morning, Madam Chair. Thank you.
So I would actually like to correct the record. Last week -- or
two weeks ago I spoke about something, and I misspoke, so I need to
correct myself
I made some comments in response to -- I believe ONobiler I Oth
the county said that it was -- and Collier County's goikv cognize
China -- the Republic of China Day. I made some tv,
_�nirentc about a
different date in history, October I Oth of 2009. s on the record
that October 10th, 2009, was when the Articl reedom were
created, but I misspoke.
On October 10th, 2009, this is a lit en -- piece of hidden
history -- was the day when there w�*a onwide paper ballot
election of citizen delegates, and t s part of a nationwide
process to -- of exercising the Fi endment.
There was a group call e People Foundation that had a
nationwide petition plan ed several members of Congress,
several Senators vario 1 ions. And this is in regards to county
business. This wa 1 9, a grievance process. And what took
place on Octobe 009, was, in fact, the election of citizen
delegates to c e as a modem -day Continental Congress. So the
Articles ofF-4ce in is the document that came from this Continental
Congre
X
So, ;)the record, what I was trying to make reference to was
the paper ballot election of citizen delegates on October I Oth, 2009.
And I'll go ahead, since I have 90 seconds left, just brief, on this
document called the Articles of Freedom. I was one of the delegates
representing Florida, so I spent 10 days in St. Charles, Illinois,
participating with 108 other delegates representing 48 states, and the
purpose of this document called the Articles of Freedom was to do
Page 31
November 9, 2021
three things. One was to document various constitutional violations,
and this ranged from United Nations violating our sovereignty. It
ranged from the borders being opened. One of the other grievances
was the monetary system that our whole country is operating under
right now with the federal reserve.
So the purpose of the Articles of Freedom was to document
those grievances as well as lay out instructions that we as4,he,
Continental Congress men and women thought would 13t� est way
to address those grievances.
The document also included recommendatio s r peaceful civic
actions by the people, and so I thought it wo e worth my
time and worth the community's time just o about this
document, you know, whatever -- howe u feel about it. You
V, r1tical viewpoints and
know, we all have different, you ki�?�j
whatnot, but I thought it would be, Lant just to bring this piece of
hidden history up publicly. S eciate the time.
rec
CHAIRMAN TAYL06 ank you.
h
MR. MILLER: Yon speaker is Ty Vigil. He'll be
followed by Lisa Hun e
H
L
MR. VIGII H k you, Madam Chair and respective Collier
County Commis S, for a few minutes of your valuable time
today.
By w 0 1 troduction, my name is Ty Vigil. I'm a
It
comme altor by profession. South Florida has been my
homested eor over a half a century. I do remember a time when
Immokalee Road was vacant land, and for the last 25 years we've
seen substantial growth of units; coach homes, townhomes,
single-family, quadplexes, condominiums, apartment buildings,
mobile homes, assisted living. The product types have all been well
diversified.
Lennar Homes, Mattamy Homes, Pulte Home, Neal
Page 32
November 9, 2021
Communities, Toll Brothers, DR Horton, GL Homes, Ronto Group,
the plethora of apartment concepts have all participated in providing
a variety of unit product types.
Unfortunately, our public schools have been beyond capacity.
The data that presents itself encouraged Naples Christian Academy to
vacate their property on Golden Gate and Santa Barbara and move it
to Hodge's building. Collier Charter Academy, as we k w,
launched a couple years ago off Wilson. And Napplees . al
Academy, as initiated this school year, has a waitin t f almost a
thousand children. And Mason Academy also c ased a large
building back behind the Bob Evans and sub y introduced a
high school program. Despite these alte S, Collier County
School District is burdened with excess' ss
1 a sizes.
Retail and services have not be aviority in recent years.
Instead, zoning approvals for unit r We were delighted to
know that Collier County woul 4 ase the Randall Curve property
in 2006. We thought, perh k�"'ely, that Collier County would
utilize this site for upgra Department, Code Enforcement,
rh
Clerk of Courts office: Clerk of Court's office. Perhaps CAT
of
f_
substation, utility pp Ic
.,.Ay enoffice, library, perhaps, like -- similar to
what we see in lossom and Airport, thinking of unique and
innovative wa sr*minimize vehicular flow on Immokalee Road.
With p c to the unanimous vote last session, I would
encouraeoard -- or this commission to revisit the zoning or,
excuse in he value of the property. Zoning is a big deal. If we go
from soft commercial and residential play and we go into mixed use,
it's a big deal. It's a game changer.
And I'll give you a case in point and I'll leave this broker opinion
of value for your review, and you can assess it. But, similarly, at
Founders Square, 55 acres; Randall Curve, 55 acres; Founders
Square, two right outs and a signalized ingress/egress, same with
Page 33
November 9, 2021
Randall Curve.
Originally zoned agricultural. Originally zoned agricultural.
Founders Square sold for 30 million. Why are we selling ours for
3.5 ?
I'll refrain from the rest of my time. Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Lisa Hunsberger. She'll
be followed by Richard Schroeder. 4**
MS. HUNSBERGER: All right. Good mornin ,,J�ci. I'd
like to take this opportunity to quickly touch on las e s meeting
where it was mentioned that -- it was actually inLd(cad
that -- Commissioner LoCastro, you had stat��y u were under
the impression that the David Lawrence C, ?iiployees were
given an option to wear a mask in lieu o accine.
Myself and a colleague, who is?Jso ormer David Lawrence
Center employee, and Commissio) Castro, had the opportunity
to sit down and discuss what th ate truly looked like. And
also please note, this is the n that came before the federal
mandate. This was bac ust.
So Commissione tro shared that, you know, he made
calls. He followe nd it was determined that optional
masking was not, tion in lieu of the vaccine. So you had given
us the op�ort i yself and my colleague; we were able to provide
you copies t accine mandates along with some other
inform * at I wanted you -- you know, myself and others wanted
you to be are of and the Board as well.
So kind of more so what's going on in the climate and what the
employees are being faced with. And also I want to make it a point
to state that this isn't just David Lawrence Center, but it's a lot of
facilities that kind of took NCH's lead.
So the purpose of my speaking in front of the Board today is to
try to understand why such a mandate is acceptable when it's
Page 34
November 9, 2021
absolutely unnecessary. So, regardless of the county and
communities funding I percent or 100 percent of the community
facility, I feel it of utmost importance to thoroughly understand what
that entails. We can throw absurd amounts of money at a
community issue all day long, but without the right strategy, these
efforts are useless.
For time purposes, I kind of just want to move forw d. So
overall, thank you for your time. I know I give you e, but
as a veteran, I'm coming to you with my concerns s es, so
thank you.
But, overall, I do have concerns that the of County
Commissioners as a whole might not be a . ed as about what's
going on with funding and within David a ence as we would hope.
So -- quickly, so David Lawre C er had monetarily
incentivized employees to get the vaccine despite of it being
mandated as well back in Aug they were offering $ 100 gift
cards to employees who obt eir vaccine status. So simple
math says at approximat employees at $ 100 each, that's
$32,000, plus there w ncentives for, once you were
vaccinated, you co t r to win $500 monetary gift cards. So this
is -- this is a bi icant amount of money.
So none is okay. And just, with my time, it truly feels
like these mandates are mirroring New York and California
policies can't imagine that that's the vision we collectively hold
for Sout st Florida.
Thank you.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you. And I'm sorry, I didn't
want to interrupt you, but please identify yourself Just give us on
the record your name, please.
MS. HUNSBERGER: Oh, my name is Lisa Hunsberger.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you very much.
Page 35
November 9, 2021
MS. HUNSBERGER: Yes.
MR. MILLER: Madam Chair, your final speaker under public
comment is Richard Schroeder.
DR. SCHROEDER: Dr. Richard Schroeder, retired
obstetrician/gynecologist.
Two weeks ago I called out the inaccuracies of a propaganda
piece published by a member of this body which encourakd eople
s
c'
to get the COVID injection. I concentrated on the st t s
implying the shots were safe for pregnant women a h dren, which
they are not. I told the story of diethylstilbester g en to pregnant
CQY
women which caused their daughters to have reproductive and
gynecologic problems.
Today I'm going to continue with a,�a_e nal story from my
childhood, the thalidomide strategy icN in the 1950s, served to
insert the concept of teratogenicit Pbick'th defects caused by drugs
into international consciousnes
ly
Growing up in the sma dx%� of Vermillion, South Dakota,
which housed the univer as used to being far from the national
attention, so it surpris r ' Phen my father came home one night
marveling that one2Wellow professors in another discipline, a
certain Dr. Fran2d� N1 ey of the Pharmacology Department, had
Is
made an earth&JXina discoverv. I was about 10 vears old at that
time, so I -Tdea what he was raving about, but it didn't take too
long fo nd out.
r rvvtil
WhZictures began appearing in newspapers of newborn
babies without hands, feet, arms, and legs, I realized that it was
Dr. Kelsey's research that had connected the dots between those birth
defects and the drug thalidomide, prescribed for morning sickness, at
that time mostly in Germany.
Soon Dr. Kelsey moved on to become the head of the Food and
Drug Administration in Washington, D.C., where she tirelessly
Page 36
November 9, 2021
worked successfully blocking FDA approval for thalidomide in the
United States. Although intensely pressured by Richards on -Merrell
and other drug companies, she stuck to her guns, and her persistence
at the FDA helped passed rigorous approval of regulations in 1962.
Sadly, those regulations have faded and are currently not being
followed in the least with our current FDA, a revolving door for
individuals with Pfizer interests seven my last count, , eCDC, a
I and�h
tool of a puppet master pharmaceutical industry. Th iWaylble
experimental MRNA products are not -- being distr; e& as vaccines
t .,4(
10 have not only not been tested for teratogenicity, t ase reports are
already pouring in about the early and late m' It ges.
As an example, a study by Thornley r ck's published in
the New England Journal ofMedicine c ted an 82 to 91 percent
risk of miscarriage for those vaccina 'gd re 20 weeks gestation.
This should come as no surprise e already known association
between the shots and clotting icrovascular level, which
could be expected to wreak v t the uteroplacental junction.
VAERS itself, the a collector, already reports 2,433
fetal deaths from the i s. So our so-called regulatory agencies
have failed us mise o it's up to us at the local level to step up to
the plate and sto nonsense now. The health and lives of our
children and hildren are at stake.
CHA TAYLOR: Thank you.
(Appla .
MR. ILLER: That was your final speakers under public
comment, malam.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you very much.
Item #1 ID
A MANAGEMENT STRATEGY FOR COLLIER COUNTY BOAT
Page 37
November 9, 2021
RAMP PARKS TO OUTLINE SHORT-, INTERMEDIATE-, AND
LONG-TERM ELEMENTS AND INCLUDE FEE INCREASES TO
SUPPORT THE STRATEGY IMPLEMENTATION — DISCUSSED
W/BOARD DIRECTION
MR. ISACKSON: Commissioners, that, at your pleasure, will
move us to Item I I D, which is a recommendation to ap e
management strategy for Collier County boat ram ra o outline
short-, intermediate-, and long-term elements alm, I fee
increases to support the strategy implementatior �r
Mr. Barry Williams, your Parks and Re director, will
present.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank y
ood morning. Barry
MR. WILLIAMS: Commiss�(Iitks,
Williams, Parks and Recreation
Commissioners, I just w start by saying you have
approximately two million 01*t a year in your park system, and it
may seem at times that t e 11 coming to Caxambas, but that's not
the case.
But one o)tf thh hi s that we're looking at -- and throughout
lie,
your park syste do have a variety of recreational amenities that
do get capacit t . mes. Certainly, the beaches, our athletic fields.
We've Ila ot) good with the Paradise Coast allowing us to have
more a e lelds but currently our discussion this morning is to
talk about e boat ramps.
And so, you know, a couple of comments just before we provide
a presentation is we've looked at a number of issues that seem to have
occurred that have, you know, reached a crisis for us at Caxambas,
and I just wanted to briefly mention those.
One of the first things that we saw during the epidemic -- and I
want to say, you know, the Board was very supportive of the park
O-M.
November 9, 2021
system having open spaces open for the public, our boat ramps as
well. You know, that provided a large amount of relief for residents
who were isolated and, you know, a lot of people were able to enjoy
the waters, the park system, and still stay safe. But we also saw with
that, the East Coast in particular, the municipalities there and the
density, you know, they weren't as fortunate to maintain that policy.
And so we saw a lot of visitors that came to the East Coa a d found
us, folks that had traditionally not used these facilities
The other thing I'll mention, though, and it ki s eaks to,
you know, the commercial use of the facility, yo h e a tremendous
ecotourism business representation in Collier y. It's one of the
most pristine areas in the world for folks t 0 .
Your commercial users that are pr support for this
business, this industry, you know, t 're 1 e star companies. If
you look at their Trip Advisor rep you look at social media, all
these companies provide a wo experience for the people who
come. And, you know, it's important part of what we provide
in Collier County.
The commercial r the most part, are very respective of
our environment. Ir respective of the facilities. They work
with us as we a to consider alternatives. And the Parks and
Rec advisory or the last couple of months has worked very
closely wi h roup to try to find that sweet spot. And that's
really re wanting to talk about this morning is to try to find
that swee ot where we can continue commercial use but also make
what these ramps were intended to, and that's for recreational boaters.
And the recreational boaters and the boat ramp footprint that we
develop -- and we'll talk to you a little bit about the inventory that we
have -- for the most part, when they're created, they are created for
boat trailer parking. You do have some consideration for people
who park their cars but, really, it's about, you know, finding a place
Page 39
November 9, 2021
for the rig, the truck to park as people enjoy the waters.
So, you know, that's something that we're trying to reach. And
we've looked at a lot of municipalities around the state of Florida.
There are a lot of different ways that the municipalities are handling
this as Florida begins to fill up. This issue is throughout the coastal
counties, and we learned a lot about what folks were doing and not
doing, you know, to kind of correct this.
So the last thing I wanted to mention, though, be o M it
over to our beach and water manager who will wal t ough the
presentation, is there is a community center that a esigned and
built at Caxambas. And I know a question e asked, why
would we have done such a thing? And alid question.
And, you know, within your boat r cilities with the
county, you have a similar circumsfiYwe ocohatchee. We've
worked with the Coast Guard Aux or multiple years at
Caxambas; we've worked with oup for about 25 years. They
first began using the park. e uired a modular from the school
district. We bought that em to provide them a space to use at
that location, and they, e an invaluable service. What they do,
as you're aware, is e r vide for boater education, navigation of
local waters. T Iso work very closely with our Coast Guard in
search and re
u
u
So tj _I
h e important part of our group. And what we found
c
at Cax cular was that facility needed replacement. So we
looked at at. We looked to replace the existing modular. It was
cost prohibitive with FEMA and the regulations that are required now
in terms of building structures. To replace that modular with
another, it would have been -- it would cost us as much to build one.
So the decision was made to build a facility basically in the
same footprint that we have where we are now, but I think the biggest
difference for us is our location in a space that had been traditionally
O-M-L1
November 9, 2021
used for oversized vehicles. So that decision's been made. That
building is under construction. And so now what we're seeing, you
know, at that location, but others 9 is the need to look for that sweet
spot to try to find what can we do to provide -- to continue to support
commercial but also recognize that the footprints that we have, there's
limitations to capacities.
So with that, what I'd like to do is to stop and turn thk
presentation over to Melissa Hennig. She's our beac� lt�,)Ilater
manager and has worked very closely with a lot of Zw..Vis rs in
gathering data across the state as well, and we w t - to offer to you
this morning some recommendations that ha e from our Parks
and Rec Advisory Board.
So with that, I'll turn it over to Mel*
MS. HENNIG: Good mornin F he record, Melissa
Hennig, regional manager, Park creation.
So today -- let's see here - esentation will include a
summary of the boat park lo ti the goal of the strategy, current
boat ramp management, mmendation from the Parks
Advisory Board, and t ire going to be looking for the Board's
guidance and direc i .
So here's a f the seven boat ramp parks. This is finite.
This is what e. So the plan is, we need to figure out at this
point a wa a e a balance of recreational and commercial users,
which i oal. At the same time, we need to comply with
existing s and zoning, particularly as Barry stated, primary use
being recreational boating, but accessory use commercial.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Melissa, if you'd just go
back. I think Port of the Islands is also in District 1, the marina. It
says District 5 unless I'm -- because I mean, I spend a lot of time out
there, so if that's Commissioner McDaniel's district, then, Bill, you
got it. No, I'm just kidding.
Page 41
November 9, 2021
MS. HENNIG: No, it must be the map layer I have. I'll check
into that. Sorry about that.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: So I just wanted to correct
the slide.
MS. HENNIG: Okay.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: I'm sorry. Go ahead.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Yeah, I'll take it
MS. HENNIG: You'll take it?
So just quickly, during season and on weeken olidays,
we get a lot of vehicles without trailers that are keg -- trying to
hc
a are K
park in parking in the different boat ramp par y ramps and
I
docks, oversized trailers, multiple vendors e-capacity vessels
lso�
and, like I said, there's only so much spa�, so, just full parking
lots.
So, as Barry mentioned, visita(AqL)ias increased. Particularly
over the last 10 years, it's in
parks, but in the last three Y"
31 percent, and that increav�
COVID and fishing b��l
they can fish d
9 percent at the boat ramp
3 paid launches have increased
ue partly to out -of -county users and
up north. They come down, and then
CHAIRMA;� T*,�YLOR: Fishing -- what did you say, bands?
MS. HETQ�N: Fishing bans. My apologies.
COMWS%-"TbNER McDANIEL: Red tide.
M5C.tA?i;�WIG: Red tide.
COWhISSIONER McDANIEL: Different seasons.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Oh, fish --
MS. HENNIG: Yeah. It will close the seasons, and they can't
fish for certain fish.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I won't tell you where my mind went
when I heard fishing bands, and I'm thinking music, and I'm thinking
that doesn't make sense. Thank you.
Page 42
November 9, 2021
MS. HENNIG: So the increases also do, as Barry stated, the
tourism -- ecotourism has boomed, and our current public boat ramp
parks were developed originally for recreational use. So there is
limited parking for single car parking. It's primarily trailer parking.
And the initial intent of the commercial -use permits issued by Parks
and Recreation was for the marine industry to access the ramps so
that they could do test launches of different boats. But of now,
70 -- 76 percent of the commercial launch permits are i or
ecotourism type companies.
So there's 363 total public trailer parking s e 1 0 total public
vehicle parking spaces in all of our parks. sued 180
commercial launch permits to date this ye 7 recreational
launch permits.
And here's just our current ar a ement strategy, which
welve outgrown. So this is why oking at this. Right now
there is not a full-time presenc boat ramps, county presence.
The park rangers do do rou ughout the day, but there's no one
there full time. We do sel launch fees, $8 for motorized and
$4 nonmotorized. T parking fees at our boat ramp parks at
the moment. The�� o imit on how many permits for commercial
or recreational l4t6?Skps are issued.
And the ercial permits are $ 100. And that -- they also
have to pa fees, and those all expire December 3 1 st.
Recreati unch permits are also $ 100 for motorized; 5 0 for
nonmoto d annually, and they do not pay launch fees.
So to begin this conversation we did reach out to coastal. And
here's a map. The ones that aren't colored in, we couldn't get in
touch with, but for the most part, if you look at the red counties, they
do not allow commercial use at their ramps. Now, Miami -Dade and
also the City of Miami, they don't allow it at their ramps, but they do
allow commercial landing and loading at the docks. What they -- a
Page 43
November 9, 2021
lot of them do not allow is commercial parking, like, the guests of the
commercial, they cannot park there. They don't have the space.
Sarasota allows nonmotorized only. Lee, non -holiday Monday
through Friday at one ramp; Monroe, again, they don't allow
commercial guest parking, and they do put limits on weekends and
holidays for how many people come in. Broward, case by case.
Martin County, their board originally said, no, we don't nt
commercial use, and then a year or two later they ove that, so
they now allow commercial use. And I put the Cit pless there
just to mention that they do allow commercial la, i ut none at
thelaunch.
The interesting thing when you reach 0 11 these counties,
they talked to me and they said, let us k at you guys do
because everyone seems to be comi ith the same issue where
it's just really popular.
So what we did, we did w h our Parks and Recreation
Advisory Board. And I'm show you their
recommendations, whic three components, to help improve
things. Increase over ptimize parking, and identify and
develop additional c ti s.
So as state itle of the executive summary, we're looking
at a short -ter egy, which would be this coming season;
intermedia t gy, which would be next season; and then
long-te c is after that. So, basically, this is an issue that's
been ong ' g, so we want to kind of -- we know it's not going to be
fixed overnight, so we're strategizing.
So increase oversight in the short-term. PARAB did
recommend to staff Caxambas Park off season at this point with
existing staff during the weekends. Staff Caxambas in Goodland full
time using one FTE and additional contract labor in season, and then
weekends and holidays off season. Utilize a variable message board
0_1=11
November 9, 2021
on Collier Boulevard to advise when Caxambas Park is full and
closed. That's a test to see if that helps.
So next season we would look to increase park
ranger -- full-time park rangers to allow for additional patrols at all
the other boat ramps and also Caxambas Park and Goodland Boating
Park. And, finally, long term, if the variable message board seems
to work, we would recommend installing a permanent va N*b�e
message board on Collier Boulevard.
The next component is to optimize parking. ZA��
recommendation for short-term, which would be V)coming
season -- and just bear with me. I was goin all these.
Prohibit trailers carrying more than four z vessels from
parking in the boat ramp park but allow e to launch and leave.
Require commercial permit holders �Aen rage and promote
ridesharing or shuttling of comme t
,qJ.9ustomers to boat ramp parks.
Limit the number of commerci gh permits to three per
company. Limit the numb al commercial launch permits
issued to 150 annually. vessels that carry more than six
passengers from obtai ommercial launch permit. Require
commercial permi! r to carry liability insurance indemnifying
Collier County. it commercial launch permit holders from
using a count as their business address. Allow non -charter
commerci e t holders in the marine services and sales industry
to obtal ornmercial permit that they can use with multiple
trailers.
Implement an escalating fee for the second and third commercial
launch permit that is issued to one company. Increase launch fees.
Increase annual recreational launch permit fees for non -Collier
County residents. Implement parking fee for vehicles without a
Collier County beach sticker at boat ramp parks.
This item here was a recommendation -- all of these were
Page 45
November 9, 2021
recommended by the Parks Advisory Board. This one, after
consulting with the County Attorney's Office, there are legal issues,
so we would have to revisit this. It's allow no new non -Collier
County companies to hold commercial launch permits until the total
non -Collier County commercial permits held is less than 10 percent
of total permits issued.
And the last two, seek commercial use and site plan
amendments at Caxambas Park, again, to increase the p 'g , and
seek new conditional use at Goodland for additiona 1 le parking.
So that would be this coming season.
Next season we would want to reevalua egulations that are
put into place to commercial launch permi d djust the
regulations as necessary and explore pa ptions at other boat
00
ramp parks like we would at Caxamplls 4aGoodland.
Finally, continue to evaluate 1�. aeulations, any regulations that
might be put in place as we mo P_ ard.
Finally, identify and d dditional facilities. Right now
what we would do is ide 1 Fdresearch possible sites for public
boat ramp access and facilities. We would continue to
research sites and t I identify funding sources as we move into
'a ' '
next year, and t g term acquire and develop sites for use for
public boat ra iZ<rVparkmg.
So�he a st some examples of possible sites that were
brought attention by some public. This is near Goodland.
There's p ible sites. There's also different ramps along different
roadways throughout the county that could be nonmotorized assess
points. And, finally, Bayview to continue to acquire and then also
develop areas for parking near Bayview.
So what we're going to ask now is that you adopt staff's
recommended boat ramp management strategy, which is pretty much
PARAB's recommended strategy, without the recommendation about
0-IM
November 9, 2021
the out -of -county permits, limiting the out -of -county permits.
And first would be the short-term recommendations.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: We are going to take a break at 10:30
sharp so -- and then we're going to have -- if you can hold your
questions until we come back. So are you getting ready to wrap this
up?
MS. HENNIG: Yes. That was all. I was just goi t
have a slide for each of the short-term, the intermedia e, he
long-term.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I don't want to sh r ange you here.
If you'd like to go through it, please, we have time for that.
MR. WILLIAMS: Commissioners c uld, we do want to
revisit the three elements with each. I ou have speakers in
the audience. What we'd like to doAit kes sense, if you did
have your break we could go -- af
I �� heard from speakers, we
could go and pursue our recom tions with you, if you'd like,
and just seek your direction of those. So that was kind of
what we thought.
CHAIRMAN T Okay. We do have one question
from the dais, so le e -- why don't we get your --
COMMISS SAUNDERS: I just need some
clarific.,ation. y have written this down wrong, but it said on that
list of reco ations, limit commercial launches to three per
compa en right below it it said limited to 150 launch
Wt
permits. on't know what any of that means. When you say three
per company, is that three per company per day? And when you say
limit it to 150 launch permits, is that the total for the whole world?
MR. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. That's the recommendation from
the advisory board. So it's 150 total annually. Each company --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: For everybody?
MR. WILLIAMS: Each company would only -- would be
Page 47
November 9, 2021
limited to three. Most of your companies --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I'm sorry. That's three per
day or three total for the whole season?
MR. WILLIAMS: For the whole season. Three annual
permits. That would take you from January I st to December 3 1 st.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: So maybe I'm
misunderstanding what an annual permit is. If a compan h S three
as
permits, does that mean they can only deliver three v or the
entire year to a launch site?
MR. WILLIAMS: That's correct. So a pe I when it's
issued, it's applied to the trailer for the boat t ing given the
permit, and it would limit it to three of th st nces.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I of those folks would
be out of business, wouldn't they? e f they can only do three
launches?
(Applause.)
MR. RODRIGUEZ: n use that as much as they want
every day.
COMMISSION DERS: And then why 150? 1 just
don't understand th ;e u bers at all.
MR. WILL The thought was to try to put some cap on
it. Right no of your companies that are involved will get one
permit. e multiple companies that have more than one, then
you ha companies that have eight -- six to eight permits. So
you're to limit that to just three.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: A company that has eight
permits -- I apologize --
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: No, no, no.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Permits to run the boat out of the
ramp.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I'm confused. A company
0-1=
November 9, 2021
has eight permits. What does that mean?
MR. WILLIAMS: So they have eight rigs, eight trailers with a
permit each that gives them the right for $ 100 a year and $8 per
launch year-round to launch as much as they want, yes.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: That particular company,
then, that has eight permits now would only have -- would they have
24, three times eight launches?
MR. WILLIAMS: So the thought was if they h
permits, you would reduce that to only allowing th.4 ave three.
So they could only have three boat trailers that w4k'ON be able to
launch year-round. They could launch as m es as they wanted
in that year.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: 's what I'm trying to
understand.
MR. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER SA All right.
CHAIRMAN TAYL then, just a point of
clarification -- and I pro rri, we will break. The difference
between -- because it lained a little differently to me in my
meeting with staff. ifference between the PARAB
recommendatio t e staff recommendations is only about the
staff recomm that no more out -of -county permits be issued; is
that correc .
M IAMS: That's correct. PARAB made that
recomme ation in consulting with the County Attorney's Office.
There was a question, legally, could we restrict. And so we would
remove that one from consideration when we bring these all back in
front of you here in a few minutes.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay, great. And I would like to ask
the County Attorney, because they do it in the city. Thank you very
much.
0_1=
November 9, 2021
We're going to break and come back in 10 minutes.
(A brief recess was had from 10:32 a.m. to 10:44 a.m.)
MR. ISACKSON: Madam Chair, Commissioners, you have a
live mic.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you very much.
So you would like to hear from public comment?
MR. WILLIAMS: Commissioner, it's your pleasura
Certainly, we can go through the short-, intermediate, a g-term
recommendations and seek your direction, but if y a ed to listen
to the public comments, that may be useful for yoo
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: If that's okay * 6 veryone, unless
we -- I don't see any questions here. I'd r kThar from public.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: 0 n, something I wanted
you to say, but I think I'm going to swit t for the sake of the
t $1
�er the microscope because in
crowd. So Caxambas is, obvious � -
some of the other parks we're n ing out at the seams. But the
one thing I want to just clar" itis in all the reading documents,
so this isn't unknown to t missioners, but I want to get this on
the record is, we all arco Island zoning ordinances at
Caxambas. An Cax s Park has always been zoned to not have
commercial buLs, 3S�, here actually -- I was told by some citizens
there used to gn there that said, no commercial vehicles beyond
this point ebody stole it or something.
Bu ality is, the businesses have been operating out there
for many, any years. So regardless of how old that ordinance is
and whatnot, when I spoke before the Marco City Council and said
how important our businesses are out there to Caxambas, even some
citizens who don't feel the businesses are as important and they
should honor the zoning ordinance -- in part of my presentation I
said, some of you are the first ones, when your grandchildren visit,
wonder where you can rent a jet ski or where you can go shelling.
Page 50
November 9, 2021
These business owners bring an amazing -- have amazing businesses
and bring people to the island. And, you know, we want to do
everything humanly possible to keep the businesses at Caxambas.
The reality is, when I spoke before the Marco City Council, they
backed off and basically challenged us to come up with some
recommendations. I mean, a lot of these recommendations here are
really almost specifically for Caxambas. You'll pull the *
NiAer on
them at other parks, and they'll make some improvem a lot of
these -- you know, correct me if I'm wrong, Barry, lit
alternative -- and I know we're going to hear frorr�&biness owners
and, you know, you guys know that I've bee g for you -all and
trying to figure out where the sweet spot 1 .
But remember, the alternative is ev y will be out of
b
i r
y will
1
business at Caxambas if Marco sees at can't figure out. And if
you remember, when I spoke at th t ity council meeting, every
Marco City Council person sai , missioner LoCastro, we think
this is your problem to solv support the businesses out there.
-rso
soIn s
v
.ai
But I will tell you their f ences to me were 5 if you can't make
it better and it continu the wild west show and it's unsafe and
all the other things '0 re having, we can't make the park bigger.
So it's easy to sa 1, find parking, find trailer parking, but
remember the I ative at Caxambas, which is different from all the
other parkvy re under Marco zoning ordinance, and that is for
zero bu s there but, you know, they've never enforced it, but
they're t ing about enforcing it if we can't do something there.
So I just wanted to, you know, preface that, because Caxambas
is different than these other parks. These other parks we can decide
what we want to do and move forward. Caxambas, we're trying to
find that sweet spot before the citizens race to all the City Council
members and try to enforce that ordinance, which is something that I
don't support, so -- you know.
Page 51
November 9, 2021
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay. So let's hear from public
comment. How many speakers do we have?
MR. MILLER: We have eight registered speakers for this item,
Madam Chair. Your first speaker is Christian Spencer followed by
Josh Erickson. I'd like to remind the speakers we have two podiums.
If you'll queue up at both podiums, we'll move long.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: You have three minutes. There's a
little buzzer in front of you. Don't let it
MR. MILLER: Yeah. There will be a beep )Zconds, by
the way.
MR. SPENCER: In terms of what you
A
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Would YON
MR. SPENCER: Oh, my name's ir
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thajaky
AV0
identify yourself.
Spencer.
a( ri
MR. SPENCER: Rick, you oNd
%0ou can't make the park
`q
bigger. I totally agree with th Z t, you know, we do have that
zone that's shut off. Perso el like that's the only solution that
we have. 01
so e
CHAIRMAN T With all due respect to the speakers,
and we'll -- if youk' e s the Chair, not address individual
commissioners.
M R�. S *P I'm sorry.
CHA TAYLOR: No, no, that's fine. Just, please.
M CER: So, yeah. The -- you know, there's a large
;p
empty sp wherce the, you know, new Coast Guard building is. I
think the only solution for the parking problem is to create parking
where there's empty space. You know, that's really the only solution
that there is. So I think that we should focus on that.
Meeting after meeting nobody brings up what we're going to do
to develop, you know, the -- that area that's filled with empty space
and, like I said, I think that's the only solution there is.
Page 52
November 9, 2021
And it amazes me that meeting after meeting nobody's talking
about it. Nobody's talking about how many spots are going to be put
there. And, you know, the building's up already. I think, Dan, you
said it's going to be another 12 months before it's finished last time.
You know, I think that's, you know, a little crazy being that the
structure is completely up, you know. So I think that we just have to
look at that -- making more parking in that new space.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: So your -- your com e ng on
the water is that the issue is parking?
MR. SPENCER: Yeah. The overcrowdin 's ue to the
parking.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay.
MR. SPENCER: There's a lot of at -- you know, in the
new -- where they put the new Coaspl�u building up, there's a lot
of empty space, and there's no site n r, you know, anything being
done to put parking there to reli e congestion. And all these
other all the other recom ns, they don't relieve any of the
congestion. The only th* will relieve congestion is making
more parking.
You know, th a ing about turning the jet ski trailers from
six jet ski trailer o ur jet ski trailers; that's just going to add to the
congestion. s of one truck being down there with six jet ski,
every jet s any is going to be down there with two trucks
every d it's just making the problem worse.
CH MAN TAYLOR: And are you a commercial --
MR. SPENCER: Yeah.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: -- or a recreational boater?
MR. SPENCER: I'm commercial, yeah.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is John Erickson. He'll be
followed by Jesse Karen.
Page 53
November 9, 2021
MR. ERICKSON: Good morning, Board. And to clarify, it's
Josh Erickson.
MR. MILLER: I'm sorry, sir.
MR. ERICKSON: No worries.
My name's Josh Erickson. I'm a local year-round resident and
property owner and business owner here in Collier County.
One of the things I want to talk about today in partirlifilar is the
fifth bullet under optimized parking. In there it says li y will
prohibit vessels carrying more than six passengers i�taining
- 4W"- 1 � 1,
commercial launch permits. I feel this is counte r uctive to the
goal of what the Parks Advisory Board has re '% ended.
I've been operating out of the parks asit 13 years as a
've s
f le
captain and seven years as a business o , ei, 've seen a drastic
w
increase in the overall demand for p��in t the local ramps, and I
understand the difficult position t Board and the county's
facing.
One of the things that atwh� point out is the safety aspect.
tha4t it o
So a lot of people don't u nd that there's two types of vessels
that operate commerc nspected and uninspected. Inspected
vessels are those v s' i spected by United States Coast Guard that
are legally allow carry more than six people. These vessels go
t r*
through a ga ki2orous inspections, including haul inspections,
crew profi nd safety inspections, both annually, biannually,
and eve. years. The vessels that the Board recommends to
prohibit obtaining launch permits are these inspected vessels.
One of the things that I'd like to point out is that from a liability
and safety perspective, inspected vessels simply operate at a higher
professional and safety standard due to the fact that these vessels are
just more scrutinized by the United States Coast Guard.
With the addition of these small inspected vessels at the ramp,
the associated rigorous inspection process, the Coast Guard presence
Page 54
November 9, 2021
has also increased at the ramps. Since the addition of these vessels,
I've observed a drastic decline in the amount of uninspected vessels
that illegally operate overloaded charters. I believe this is in direct
relation to the safety checks and inspections that take place at the
docks by the United States Coast Guard focusing on inspected
vessels.
So, again, I want to point out that it's illegal for any s ,Ito
carry more than six passengers unless it's inspected b t ited
States Coast Guard. That's not to say that it doesn' n down
there at the ramps. 'a,
With some of these items that are being you know, one
of the things talks about having somebody n t the ramps all the
time to monitor people coming on and o t oats. Who's liable if
an uninspected vessel takes seven peoalle ay from that ramp and
something happens on the water? a s a big liability I think the
county might have to deal with.
And, you know, the ot 1 e that I have is that if we're
required to shuttle peopl e ramps, then having a boat that can
carry multiple groups . ole lot better than multiple boats having
to carry multiple di e t people. I think all this -- parking
problems and sa oblems could simply be solved by requiring
the vessels to commercial permits, have commercial parking
offsite, sh e e ple into the ramps, and then that way the
concess* still get the foot traffic, the commercial boats can still
operate, e's parking still available for everybody, and it just seems
like a safer idea all around in my opinion, so...
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Yeah. We've got some questions,
and I do, too. Would you please repeat what your solution is.
MR. ERICKSON: Yeah. My solution would be for the
commercial businesses to obtain commercial offsite parking or
commercial departure location, like any other commercial operation
Page 55
November 9, 2021
in Collier County's required to do, and then shuttle people in, and
then that way there would be an opportunity for commercial
businesses to still leave out of the waterfront access, but they
would -- they wouldn't be taking up any parking. They wouldn't be
congesting any of the ramps. It would speed up the boarding
process, because these vans could show up or the charter shuttles
could show up, hop on the boat, and go. There wouldn't-ke qeople
loitering around trying to find a specific company or t -X figure
out where to go. There would be a handler to han e le from
the shuttle onto the boats and go.
I also just find it interesting that, you kn e ramps,
commercial business -- commercial busin a e allowed to operate
p. aP
out of there commercially. I've owned businesses in other
d in, in order to have a
areas, and any other county that Fve?,4Dqe,,!P
business tax receipt, a commercia�kl i ess tax receipt, you have to
1� Of
have a commercial location, an ave to satisfy the parking
matrix as set forth. We've ky as small operators to utilize
the park as a commercial t, obviously, you know, it's come to
a head. And so --
CHAIRMAN&AR L R: Do you operate, what, fishing
charters?
MR. ER �*N: So we do be sightseeing and eco charters.
I I
CHA TAYLOR: Larger than six packs, right?
M KSON: Larger than six people, but less than 18. So
that's the er thing in these -- in this paper that's worth noting.
These large Coast Guard inspected vessels do not carry more than 18
people. It's kind of a little niche in between greater than six and less
than 50.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: And do you have a document that
says that you're inspected? If someone boarded your boat, you could
show them?
Page 56
November 9, 2021
MR. ERICKSON: Absolutely, absolutely. It's -- the
inspection certificate that you obtain is a certificate of inspection by
the United States Coast Guard.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you.
MR. ERICKSON: And I actually had turned in a speech and
some literature on Friday to all the commissioners for review, and
thank you for those of you that got back to me, and than o all for
your time.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner Sau S.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: You had a t at part of the
solution would be to have commercial parkin I e. Do you have
a location on Marco Island yourself so tha
MR. ERICKSON: I do, yes.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDE at about most of these
other commercial operators; are t
MR. ERICKSON: You ir, I'm not aware. And to be
quite frank, I feel bad for th maybe have not seen this coming
and been able to plan. firm believer in letting competition
compete. If yo r co I venture isn't able and viable to
produce enoug re n t sustain a commercial operation, then
perhaps your co ial business isn't simply viable, so...
COMMI ER SAUNDERS: Thank you.
CHA TAYLOR: Commercial McDaniel.
C IONER McDANIEL: Yes. You spoke a lot about
registrati And this is certainly anecdotal. But how many vessels
are actually conducting business that aren't inspected?
MR. ERICKSON: That's a great question. So on a real brief
research that my crew and my team did, out of Caxambas and
Goodland, there are six commercially inspected vessels that would no
longer be able to receive permits according to the recommendations.
We also looked at uninspected vessels. We found over 100 that use
Page 57
November 9, 2021
those ramps daily uninspected vessels.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: That's was -- that was the
answer that I was getting at.
MR. ERICKSON: And that was a simple Google search, Just
looking at operations, yeah.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: And so they're operating out
of our public ramps meant for public access and utilizati That's
the premise behind our ramps and facilities. And so
inspection issues that's on top of all that.
MR. ERICKSON: No. So the uninspecte�do*'Ns Is that are
only able to carry six are not -- they do not g gh a rigorous
inspection process.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL:
MR. ERICKSON: So accordipg, to e recommendations by the
Board, those vessels would still b !7ed to operate out of the
ramps. Essentially, what the doing is limiting the inspected
vessels, which are the safes on the water, arguably.
a ee s
f s
COMMISSIONER IEL: Okay. So you're -- and
forgive me. I mean, ave misunderstood your statement.
The premise of inspc n doesn�'t come until you get over six?
MR. ERIC Yeah, that's correct. So if you're operating
a commercial eRI with six or less people, you're not required by
the United, s oast Guard to have the certificate of inspection,
yeah.
CO ISSIONER McDANIEL: And to your
knowledge -- and I didn't phrase the question correctly. To your
knowledge, how many are operating more than six and not inspected,
plus/minus?
MR. ERICKSON: Plus or minus, you know -- and, again, that
would be speculating. I don't know. I see it happen. I hear about
it happen a couple times a week, yeah, so...
O-M.
November 9, 2021
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Okay. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner LoCastro.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Well, one of the things -- and
this is really for Barry and Dan when you guys come back to the
podium. His point about finding other parking places. You have a
slide that shows that, because we have been doing that. You know,
we've located some, you know, shoulders off of the road. elve got
some areas on Goodland. So, you know, you offerin s a
solution is spot on. I mean, that's a minimum thin t as to be
done, and we are doing that. So I don't know if issed that slide
or whatnot, but we've highlighted some areas ey would need to
be improved and whatnot. But being abl ri g a larger trailer out
to Caxambas, drop off, you know -- in se, you don't have this,
but if you were a jet ski operator, dr o ourjet skis, your
customers and whatnot, and then e e that trailer at the park, you
know, put it somewhere else. exploring that aggressively. So
that would -- I don't know t would really help you, but it
would help other people e.
MR. ERICKSO h -- and absolutely. And, again, it's
just -- you know, I o rsonally think it's the county's
responsibility to arking for private Industry. I think that's up to
them to figur ut. A lot of these businesses that are -- that
we're talki a right now are probably currently home -based
busines simply have been operating out of the parks for the
last deca r whatever without having an issue and, because of the
tourism increase that we've seen 5 it's helped everybody, including
tourism, and now we've got a problem. We have exponential growth
with finite parking.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Yeah.
MR. ERICKSON: That's the problem we're all facing, so...
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I have one more question.
Page 59
November 9, 2021
MR. ERICKSON: Yeah.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: What kind of -- how much is the
out-of-town or out -of -county issue of people using the boat ramp?
How does that affect or what's your sense? You've been on the
water a long time.
MR. ERICKSON: Yeah, you know, significantly on the
weekends. That is a problem, bigtime, Friday, Saturday u day.
i
y '
There is a lot of out -of -county traffic. And, again, a �10 is is
pertaining to Caxambas. But my operation leaves :�44(00Guoc dland.
And so one of the things we're concerned about i0w a happens at
Caxambas will end up overflowing to Goodl ot er county
parks throughout the county. But definite e weekends,yep.
And for that being said, there's a lo ople that come down,
they rent vehicles or they drive their Wn icles, they have Airbnbs
that then come to the ramps. I m 6t 'ose technically, I guess,
would be considered out of �ounty vehicles that would have
I
to pay higher fees, I would u so...
CHAIRMAN TAY 'kay. Thank you.
MR. ERICKSO h. You're welcome. Thank you guys
for your time. r
MR. MILL Your next speaker is Jesse Karen. He will be
followed by Gil.
I C
MR. Commissioners, thank you. My name is Jesse
Karen. ate a business, Reel Kind Fishing and Tours out of
Goodlan .
I was the first operator there the day the park opened. For the
first seven years, it was just me, so I've seen big changes happen
there.
Josh, with all due respect to what he said about other companies
obtaining offsite parking, for us that operate the uninspected vessels
that may not be inspected but have to operate under the same safety
0-1ml
November 9, 2021
standards, if we get stopped, we have to have the same safety
equipment that the Coast Guard sets a minimum for all vessels.
With a bigger boat, he may be able to afford to obtain offsite
parking, but all the individual fishing guides and small boat operators
do not generate the kind of revenue that he does to obtain offsite
parking.
So -- and I've seen the problem coming longer than h s, and
I've tried to obtain offsite parking. It is absolutely co t itive
for me. There's no reason for me to be in business h to do that.
I think the out -of -county parking is a big p�ir In
Goodland, it's only 10 percent of the days th ave parking issues
in Goodland, and that's now. Obviously, oing to increase
over time. But those weekends and holi a when we get people
from the East Coast or from Lee CouRtv beyond, it really jams up
the trailer parking and the single- a ing. A lot of the small
operators, you know, generally ave one or two cars on their
boats. So it adds up when e several small operators, but it's a
little different when you 5- or a 16-passenger boat that could
be 10 cars. So they o little differently, and they generate
different numbers c S.
So I know e county was trying -- the Parks and Rec was
trying to find nce between, you know, what number of cars per
boat is acc a They weren't trying to exclude a business model.
They w saying, you know, one model only attracts so many
cars, whe s this other model attracts a greater number of cars.
And maybe not prohibiting those vessels but allowing those bigger
vessels to have their offsite parking and allow them to leave from the
park is the answer as opposed to just banning them. But to require
the small operators to obtain offsite parking, it's just not going to
work.
But I want to thank Melissa and Barry, because they sat down
Page 61
November 9, 2021
with most of us operators that showed up to the PARAB board
meetings, and they worked closely with us to make sure that they
could strike that balance between what is acceptable and what is just
not working right now. And I feel like I have to support their
strategies, because they really listened to the bulk majority of us that
sat at that meeting, and they worked with us hand in hand to make
sure that what comes out would be fair to the bulk numb of
operators.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you. Than ery much.
MR. KAREN: Absolutely.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commission astro.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Y ust wanted to echo.
I really appreciate your comments abou ialler operators.
And one clarification I just wa o e to the entire group is
the offsite areas that we're lookin is not about providing free
parking to the businesses. Wh e trying to do is basically
enlarge the parking lot at C s and other locations. So we're
trying to increase,p�blic and business parking at Caxambas,
but because we can t park any bigger, if we can secure some
areas, that just bec 0 erflow Caxambas parking.
So it's not r of we're going to be using taxpayer dollars
to, you know, r these businesses who can't afford, you know,
their own ank lot. We're just trying to make the open public
parkin more robust. And we can't do it on the Caxambas
footprint, t if we do it down the block and around the comer, then
the flexibility we need from the business owners is youlve got to have
an extra driver or somebody that can move the vehicle or whatnot.
But it's really just to increase the parking. And we might have to do
it at Goodland as well, as you said. I mean, what did Goodland look
like seven years ago and what's it look like today? So that's what
wevre trying to do is just increase our parking lots in other locations,
Page 62
November 9, 2021
and they would be, like, auxiliary parking, so...
MR. KAREN: And that would work. And I think that that's a
good plan. And that's one of the things that they're recommending.
And the fact that the county hasn't charged for car parking, I think,
has been a good missed opportunity. Everywhere you go you pay
for parking. And my customers would have no problem paying for
parking.
The funny thing is, though, is that little $ 10, if I a �Xdd that
to my fees, that would kill me, but they'll pay the $ ark, right?
id gedollars. If
So I think it's important, right, we're not using tao
you guys have to obtain more land, great, if o it, and
absolutely charge to park to, you know, re h se fees.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: . ng I'll add is I know a
lot of these seem like huge muscle e nts. And I really
appreciate your professionalism a o r flexibility. And I know
you've been at all the meeting-24b important, and I appreciate the
thanks that you've given the nd Rec, because they're really
trying.
But the reason th like such huge muscle movements is
because we haven't o nything over all these years. So, you
know, we're out ach 10 right now, and we're trying to not go
to a dead stop Ire trying to just slow down a little so that we can
maintain tv pening at Caxambas and Goodland and the other
parks. ernative is, especially at Caxambas, because of the
zoning, co City Council could tell us to go to a dead stop.
MR. KAREN: That's right.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: But it seems like this list has
got a lot of stuff on it. And it wouldn't seem this bad if maybe every
couple of years we would have done one more thing, one more thing
here.
The other thing, too, is by having the person, especially at
Page 63
November 9, 2021
Caxambas, and even Goodland, like a dedicated person, not just a
ranger that comes and goes. You know, it's come to my attention
that there might be even some businesses that are operating in and out
of there, don't even have permits. They just pull up, they throw their
stuff in the water.
And so one way to thin out the crowd is by turning people
around, and you can't do that if you don't have somebody4jko�itoring.
And so I actually think part of the solution -- I don't Wa May it's
going to fix itself, but there is a percentage.
You know, I think you asked, Commissione n ers or
Commissioner McDaniel, like, how many pe n't have permits,
how many people -- well, we know it's no We know it's not
zero. We know that for sure. And so, now, that's another part
of the solution.
But I want to just thank you a icipating so much, and other
business owners have as well, igure out the solution.
MR. KAREN: Well, eciate the opportunity. Yeah, I
mean, look, 12 years, ri oodland Boat Park has been open.
There's been I 101000 idents alone that moved into the county.
So, you know, we'y big influx of residents and a big influx in
tourism. And s �<i NP it's an important issue that we expand that
infrastructure U� t for free, you know. There has to be a charge.
u
So anythi ht c unty can do to help the businesses, I know we all
greatly late it.
An
ilzy caps. You know, the caps are understandable because
zero is the other option. Obviously, it would be temporary until
infrastructure is increased. So I think it's important to point that out,
that those are short-term. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you, sir.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Colleen Gill. She'll be
followed by John Hoffman.
0_1=11
November 9, 2021
MS. GILL: All right. Well, good morning. My name is
Colleen Gill, and I am an eco guide with Florida Adventures and
Rentals, and I figured I'd give you guys a perspective from the
employee versus a business owner.
I am one of those local 45,000 family members that rely on our
tourismforajob. This is my main source of income. AndI'ma
little bit concerned about some of the proposed changes t thh
commercial usage at the marinas, specifically Caxam a
Our company takes great pride in promoting t ty and the
conservation as well as the history of the Paradisoas . During our
ecotours, we utilize a lot of the information W Le hrough
education. Our company also takes gre4:1at4,,e.kir1keeping our
islands clean. We do annual beach cle with cleaning up over
,f 1
121000 -- or 1,200 pounds of trash o of Ten Thousand Island
islands last year alone.
We also work with variou rvation-based organizations,
and we are often assisting a r::�Siuing, injured shorebirds and marine
life during our tours. So ot out there just to make a living,
but we're also out ther p promote and keep areas beautiful and
safe for our wildl*f i as our guests.
After seem rjNark issue -- parking issues resulting in the
overcrowding t xambas during last season, especially during the
height of t emic closures, our company actually started to take
measur ucing our company's impact by investing in a golf
cart to st rying to shuttle people when we could from the resorts as
well as from offsite parking. We also recommended them using
local transportation services to come over and carpooling if there
were larger guests and parties on our boat and jet ski tours.
We are also working now on a -- completely reducing our
impact on the overcrowding with the parking at Caxambas by starting
a shuttle service ourselves. We're going to offer offsite parking, and
Page 65
November 9, 2021
we're looking into a way to shuttle everyone in to reduce that impact
that we have and that we know that we're part of with the
overcrowding with the parking at Caxambas.
The changes, though, with the commercial business with
limiting the permits and such, this can jeopardize our company. It
can jeopardize my employment as well as many of the other
commercial businesses that do work out there. I know thkt t�e
alternative is zero business but, at the same time, we a consider
many of us who rely on this industry for our living.
We -- the proposed permitting reduction of r essel capacity,
especially on the U.S. Coast Guard inspected S, can reduce our
business almost by half. That's going to 1* -- *miting the volume
of the businesses by passenger and trail city and the
commercial permits can cause man a of these charter
companies to lose revenues resulti in etting go of employees like
myself or even putting these c s completely out of business.
I ask you, instead of re 1 commercial business that help
fuel the local economy o Island as well as Collier County,
but also to -- and we a ote tourism as well, but to find a
resolution to resolv t I ck of parking. Now, I know that we're
talking about o ers and things like that. Another issue that
we need to ad e is that we get overflow parking from the beach
parking at x as, which take up a lot of the parking as well.
A o do what we can to try to keep our local commercial
charter a ecotourism businesses working at full capacity. And I
really thank everyone's time with trying to find a resolution -- you
guys as well -- and, you know, hopefully we can work together to
move forward and find a resolution where everyone can keep their
jobs and their companies going strong.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: So could you tell me how large your
boats are?
0-1=1
November 9, 2021
MS. GILL: We have U.S. Coast Guard inspected vessels, so
we do the capacity of up to 19 total people, that includes our crew, on
most of our boats. There's usually up to about 15 to 17 guests.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: How many boats do you run?
MS. GILL: We run three vessels.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay. Daily?
MS. GILL: Daily.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay.
MS. GILL: Monday through Saturday.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay. Thank y
MS. GILL: Yep. �
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I a uick question for
her. And where do your patrons park?
MS. GILL: Most of them -- so*f t are coming from, like,
the resorts like JW Hilton and stu2� 0el either try to figure out a
Q-Mover. We suggest even
way for them to transport themN1,7
wal king. But they will util*qz��arking, if they have no other
option, at Caxambas.
COMMISSION ANIEL: Okay.
CHAIRMAN A L R: Thankyou.
COMMISS RLoCASTRO: lhaveaquestion. Andit's
really to than You were one of the first companies that
:'t
stepped fo r y getting the golf cart and whatnot. I know a few
of the o sinesses have encouraged their customers to Uber to
you
Caxamba r, you know, all the other things, and that's been a big
help.
One thing I did want to make clear is it's not just a parking
problem. At Caxambas we have the one ramp that they launch the
jet skis and the kayaks and whatnot. You know, I hear from a lot of
citizens and even some business owners, I mean if we had unlimited
parking for everybody, you still -- we can't add more ramps, and
Page 67
November 9, 2021
sometimes the backup there -- because we have so many businesses
with permits and whatnot. So I don't know if you experience that
because you have a different -- but that's the other problem there. I
mean, I've had residents that come to me and say, you know, I get to
the park early. I'm behind a whole bunch of businesses that are all
trying to launch one at a time. I just turn around and go home
because, you know, it takes me two minutes to launch my4koit, but
they're waiting on customers. They're, you know, gii ill fety
brief. They're doing this. They're doing that.
So, you know, we actually won't totally fix t e ro lem by just
ta
providing more parking. You know, that pa can only hold so
much. But having said that, thank you so h or stepping
forward. I was aware of your -- you kn e changes that you had
made voluntarily. And, you know, �iwe ve more businesses that
do that, too, and then we figure o on this list would actually
work, you know --
MS. GILL: Can I a 1 suggestion --
COMMISSIONER RO: Absolutely.
MS. GILL: --a e, the kayak thing? So many other
counties utilize act k launch sections where they have the
actual thing that ut your kayak on and just push yourself in the
water versus i he boat ramps. That could be an option. If you
guys aren't., . 1 r with what I'm talking about, if you go check out
Collier- ole State Park, for example, they have something set up
like that ch could reduce that kayak usage out of the actual boat
ramp and keep people a bit safer from being away from the boat
traffic when they're trying to launch as well, so...
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: So you launch three boats daily?
MS. GILL: We just pick up our guests from there. We
actually use a private marina to launch our actual boats.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Ah, okay.
O-M.
November 9, 2021
MS. GILL: So we pick up our guests there. We do launch our
jet ski fleet, and then also will, our kayak rentals.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: You have a jet ski fleet?
MS. GILL: Uh-huh.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: How many?
MS. GILL: Well, we have two trailers.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Two trailers? And then h t else do
you have?
MS. GILL: And then kayaks.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Kayaks.
MS. GILL: Yes.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: And you'l c those from --
MS. GILL: Rentals, yes.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Oka I right. Thank you.
MS. GILL: You're welcom .
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: ow much of a trouble is the
out -of -county traffic?
MS. GILL: Oh, it, e weekends, like they were saying
before, Friday, Saturd Sunday, we will get inundated,
especially during s s Last year when we had the shutdown and
everything that s o ght up before where it was just an invasion
of people co om out of county and taking over. And, I mean,
it was har r of the commercial businesses to even utilize that
when t going on, so...
CH MAN TAYLOR: Where do you park your vehicles
once you launch them for --
MS. GILL: Our vehicles?
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Jet skis.
MS.GILL: So the jet skis, we utilize that for our jet skis. We
do park them at the marina in the trailer parking.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: At the ramp?
O-M.
November 9, 2021
MS. GILL: Yeah. At the ramp, yep.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: At the ramp?
MS. GILL: Uh-huh.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: And the kayaks also? You --
MS. GILL: The kayak trailer, yep. We'll keep that there as we
have rentals out. Once the rentals are completed for the day and
picked up, we'll usually take off, and we'll be done for thoQdav from
there.
CHAIRI\ AN TAYLOR: Okav Thank vou,4.-N
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO:
long trailers --
MS. GILL: We do.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO:
sticking out a little bit?
MS. GILL: Yeah. But wi
before with those, you've got
that have those trailers, you'.11
permits, that doesn't s
three trailers and havc
12 jet skis every da A
CHAIRMX
Do you h eythe oversized,
t t ones that sort of are
, 1�
likt)we do -- like they mentioned
companies
that because the
.r7 it to four and they still get three
f hose companies to still get those
skis. So they're still launching those
OR: Thank you.
MR. MILJN: Your next speaker is John Hoffman.
MR. AN: I decline.
M ER: Okay. He'll be followed by -- or, excuse me.
s tir
He's waii Fhis time. All Mick will be followed by Campbell Fall.
MS. MICK: I'll decline.
MR. MILLER: Campbell Fall will be followed by Ron
Michaels.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Ali, you've sent me a
thousand emails. You have nothing to say? I'm just kidding.
MR. FALL: Commissioners, staff members, county residents,
Page 70
November 9, 2021
thank you for your time. My name is Campbell Fall, for the record.
And I just simply represent -- I am a boat captain for Eco Endeavors
actually, a smaller charter company that leaves out of Goodland.
I'm here actually to comment particularly on just the idea -- I
just want to echo a few sentiments made already today, but the very
simple idea of prohibiting a vessel that carries more than six paying
passengers, that is what I do. So I will just say, I speak ak a Vaptain
who holds a masters captain's license. That is the cre that you
need to hold if you want to operate those vessels.
I'm a veteran of the U.S. Coast Guard, so P v aware of how
this whole process works, but I just wanted t everybody think
a little bit. If we have one boat that takes eople shuttled in
from an offsite location, the smaller ope will then just fill that
void by deploying small -- all six -pa b S. And so I just don't see
it as a viable or elegant solution w you kick six boats -- that's
part of the problem here. The y six boats that would get
removed from being allowe o rate.
If we were to go co -- I actually like a lot of these
solutions. The one t e a hang-up on is cutting out the guys
who take out more si paying passengers. I just see that -- you
have a lot of bo anies, businesses, that will Just buy a new
boat as oppos o through the hurdles of becoming a COI or
inspected s e we talked about a little bit earlier. It's
financi s a big hoop to jump through. It takes a lot of
money, i es a lot of time, and it's higher safety standard.
Yes, there are local regulations that you need to adhere to if you
are a passenger vessel of six or less, but there are more strict
requirements, there's a higher safety standard to the operators and the
captains who have to utilize those larger vessels.
I am somebody who depends completely on the income
provided by my service as a boat captain down here which is, again,
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November 9, 2021
taking out, traditionally, guests of 10.
So to just try and highlight my point here really quickly is the
simple, if we take 10 guests out, that might be two to three, possibly
four cars that are removed from that parking ramp; however, if there
was a smaller company that just brings in another boat, they're still
using one to two vehicles and so -- I guess what I'm trying to say is if
we get kicked out, somebody else is Just going to fill in, d e
parking issue continues.
So I just want to echo the sentiment, I think it i e a lot of
sense to require commercial operators to have oL lot parking
locations so they can shuttle people in. To r1seems to be fair
to everybody.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank
MR. FALL: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: T ou.
MR. MILLER: Madam our final registered speaker is
Ron Michaels.
MR. MICHAELS: ard. Thank you for the time.
I'm a registered ard captain. I've been in the island
business doing to a arasailing. Since 1994, I've been coming
in and out of Ca s Park, which seems to be our main focus
today.
There u few things I want to bring to light. I have to agree
V - miting an inspected vessel that can take 12
with th at li
passeng,e s just a no-brainer. There should not be a limit to these
boats that pay to keep their boat in another marine and drive all the
way to that park just to board the few people more than the guy who
launches his boat there.
Another thing that I'm not sure that you commissioners are
aware of -- possibly you are. I haven't been to many of these
meetings. Over the years, if you had two WaveRunners on a trailer,
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November 9, 2021
you paid one $8 fee to launch that boat. A few years back -- I don't
know how long ago, it was maybe eight years ago -- a new vendor
came into the park and they said, well, we should be able to charge
for each jet ski on that trailer. So nowwhen avendor --when an
operator launches a six boat -- six WaveRunners off of his trailer, he's
paying $48 for that one trailer, okay. Most parks -- and I don't
know Parks and Rec, you did some research about d ot er
counties charge per vessel on the park in other counti s cause --
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Direct your questio e
MR. MICHAELS: Okay.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: And we'll as uestion.
MR. MICHAELS: So the question e -- would be -- you
know, first of all, that was a windfall fo endor there, not the
county. From what I understand -- d be you can correct me if
I'm wrong -- the county gets 4 per ur cents of every dollar
that's collected by the vendor ching fees. Now, that's going
to be -- it's not going to be 1 11 for you, but it was for them.
So when we're talki t fees, you know, exponentially
charging operators w more than one permit, you know, in
your long or you that's something you guys might want to
consider is why t vendor getting 96 percent of every dollar
collected at t k, and now they're collecting six times every time
a WaveRu r a nches. That's just something I want to throw in
there.
I als - I agree, like I said, that these guys that come from
another marina and have paid to keep their boat somewhere else with
inspected vessels -- the Marriott, for instance, runs a 49-passenger
boat. When it's rough out front, sometimes the Marriott will pick up
right from that ramp. Who is going to be there to tell them that they
can't? They might only do it three days a year, but the day they do
it, they're breaking the rules or the new rules that you guys are going
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November 9, 2021
to try to put in.
They do have an offsite down in Goodland, but to go along with
oversight at the park -- when you guys say there will be someone
there, are you talking about the vendor guys? Because those guys
aren't going to come out of there unless they're selling gas or selling
bait. They are not the parking police, and they'll tell you that. So is
it going to be a park ranger that patrols this?
One other thought I have is you guys said that you How six
place WaveRunners trailers to launch there, but the v to park off
property. Okay. Realistically, if I was in s place trailer, I
have to talk to my people, get their life jac e et them on a
trailer, and then get them in the water. T roper safety
vessel -- do a proper safety guideline be ou take off, which is
required by Florida FWC if you're a n and you're
renting -- according to the livery I u have to make sure your
guests understand what they're -- that guy would have to spend
at least 15 to 20 minutes, p p to a half an hour, getting that
trailer ready to launch.
So where's he go* ark when he's doing that? So parking,
is what I'm saying, iggest issue, and you've all identified it.
I'm just trying t with that, that parking is an issue.
At Caxa b ark, they have -- I don't know. It might have
been a yea t at they put in a wide spot for these long trailers to
all bac nd it's worked very well. They only made four
spaces. ere's maybe six trailers that need it. So if you just add
three more of those long spaces, that would alleviate the problem of
these longer trailers, and you wouldn't have to restrict these vendors
to having only a four place trailer which, like everyone else pointed
out, the guy that wants to launch six skis now has to have two four
place trailers. He's going to take up two parking spots.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you. Your time is up.
Page 74
November 9, 2021
MR. MICHAELS: Okay. And that's my point.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Just a quick question. How much of
a problem do you see is the out-of-town folks?
MR. MICHAELS: Major, major problem. Now, just real
quick. I grew up in Fort Lauderdale, and in Fort Lauderdale a busy
boat ramp -- and you know it's a much larger dense community, and
the beach is much more sought after when you're going te�a
,3nch a
boat. You get up 6:00 in the morning and get in line oat
park, and not that we want to do that here, but we'v_ d few days,
you know, in the past season and when it's holida s when it's
weekends, yes, the out-of-town non -Collier r s that come to
launch -- and they're not afraid to come r at 5:00 in the
morning and get in line in front of eve e se and take --
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Are si ses coming over here,
too?
MR. MICHAELS: No.
COMMISSIONER M L: Sure.
MR. MICHAELS: few. Not that I can say that I've
seen.
CHAIRMAN,T L R: More recreational?
MR. MIC But I think it's mostly recreational from the
out-of-town E#� ast is what I would identify that as.
CHA TAYLOR: Thank you very much.
M AELS: All right. Thanks for your time.
CH MAN TAYLOR: Commissioner -- I think,
Mr. Williams, you have a -- you have a question to answer.
MR. WILLIAMS: Sure.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Does the county get four cents on
every dollar in a permit?
MR. WILLIAMS: Commissioner, you do have a
concessionaire that operates in four of our boat ramp locations, and
Page 75
November 9, 2021
so the current terms of the agreement are they operate the ship store,
they also operate the ramp, and when they're -- their business hours
are in effect, they do collect the ramp fee. Your current arrangement
does provide 4 percent to the county for revenues that they create.
The monies that they use, they operate the ship store, they staff, they
provide inventory. They -- and part of our reasoning for
out -sourcing that a few years back was to avoid the lega,-36 c st
associated with a county employee running the facilit so the
third -party vendor, that's worked well for us over t S 10 years.
So, yes, that's the current arrangement.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: And who ntity gets the
proceeds from the ship store?
MR. WILLIAMS: So the entity is a ise -- a company
named Paradise. Cindy Blatt is the in al of that organization.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: A ed percent of the proceeds
from the ship store?
MR. WILLIAMS: W revenues that she generates from
the ship store, fuel, she s sodas, sandwiches, that kind of
thing, we get 4 percen rn for her operating that business and
providing that se. 6.
CHAIRM LOR: Thank you. Do we have any kind of
numbers on it t e revenue is last year? Maybe you can get
that.
M IAMS: We can definitely get that for you, yes.
CH MAN TAYLOR: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: I was going to ask something.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Oh, Commissioner LoCastro.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Barry, one of the things I
want you to just clarify, because we've got a couple questions here, is
that the rocks that we put down to try to figure out how we could let
the additional -- the longer trailers park at Caxambas, explain how
Page 76
November 9, 2021
Marco has a problem with that.
so� I mean, we've heard a lot of things, hey, park over by the
Coast Guard, this, that, and the other. Yeah, I'd love to do all of
those things, but we've already talked about with Marco Island City
Council and, correct me if I'm wrong, a few of the things that we sort
of did where we just did it and we begged forgiveness later, they
want us to undo it because they think we're busting the p t the
seams, and those really aren't solutions, correct?
Didn't they have a problem with the rocks, an d to make
some big changes on some things that we made s m command
decisions on and, you know, they have the ri rump those
things, correct?
MR. WILLIAMS: They do. The
COMMISSIONER LoCASTR they have.
MR. WILLIAMS: The city ave jurisdiction at that
facility.
We did seek expansio ing with the Coast Guard
Auxiliary -- or the com nter being built. We did receive a
permit. I think after eview, they looked at that condition and
felt that wasn't apppp and asked us to do a site plan
development ch order to accommodate parking. That's been
part of our �1. S. e know, you know, with the current Coast
Guard Auxna , here they are, that trailer's going to be removed.
That's give us some opportunities for additional parking.
We see that as something that is -- and we've included as part
of our recommendation that we do pursue that. We're not going to
get a lot. You know, it's a small footprint, but we are going to get
some back.
The question is, do you develop that parking for the longer
trailers that have historically used it? We'll have to go through that
process with the Site Development Plan review with the city to see
Page 77
November 9, 2021
what they would allow. But we do know we'll get additional parking
but probably not to meet the needs that we're seeing at this point.
Madam Chair, if I may, I know we've given you a lot to unpack
here. And we have worked closely with a lot of the folks affected by
this. And I want to say thank you, Commissioner LoCastro, you
know, for your leadership in helping us unpack this with the city.
The city at one point was wanting to ban all commercial,Vd there's
been a lot of question about the zoning of the site. Tke is,
commercial use has occurred in your boat ramps f6#414ePdecades.
So it's something that is being looked at different, 0. The city has
indicated a willingness to work with us to co me of these
issues.
Commissioner McDaniel, I want t out to you as well in
terms of working and your knowledpg, in s of, you know, the
boater community and the needs
But what I'd like to do, if suggest -- we have thrown a lot
at you. We have, basically r lides that we would just like to
walk through with you a eek your direction on those three.
The first one is proba ost challenging. It has the most in
terms of a short ter other two not so bad. But if I could, just
to talk a little bit t t is first slide. And, again, your Parks and
�o
Rec Advisory 0 have made these recommendations.
The s e strategy recommendations, I think the one thing
that we' ' 4, rd, you know -- and we found with the pandemic --
CON 14ISSIONER McDANIEL: Can you stop. I have a
question.
MR. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: And before he goes on.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I was going to let him finish the
sentence and --
MR. WILLIAMS: No, I'll stop. I certainly want to hear.
0-!.M
November 9, 2021
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner McDaniel.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I just --he's getting ready to
start going through these things.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I wasn't going to let him.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: All right. The current
vendor that's operating at the ramps, the revenue streams that you're
proposing increases in and permit fees and launch fees a p rking
fees, who gets that money?
MR. WILLIAMS: It depends. The permit goes
directly to the county 100 percent. The launch is arrangement
that we have, when the ship store is in operat* y do collect the
ramp fee at this 96-to-4 percent split.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: r * g fees?
MR. WILLIAMS: The parkin ee es, that would be the
case in the current arrangement.
COMMISSIONER McD And how long is the term of
lease with regard to this ve r.
MR. WILLIAMS: have a five-year lease. It renews, I
believe, in a year, yea alf, so there's an opportunity to do
something differen
,�Jt e.
COMMISS - I McDANIEL: Very good. Thank you.
FN
Thank you fo ']n 'Jging me.
u
CHA TAYLOR: No, it's quite all right. You have the
floor, si .
MR. ILLIAMS: Madam Chair I just the first set of
recommendations regard increased oversight. And what we're
suggesting is putting staff at the location. And we've given you
three bullet points that describe that. You know, the other thing is
this variable message board that was mentioned. You know, we
have at times during busy season, working with the City of Marco
Island, put a sign on 951 to let folks know, you know, our beach
Page 79
November 9, 2021
parks are closed. Caxambas is closed. Does that do any good in
terms of diverting people that are getting ready to go over the bridge?
We don't know.
But we do offer that as a short-term recommendation to establish
that and try to manage the ramp. But the big thing is increasing
oversight and us mobilizing additional staff. So if there's a comfort
level with that, you know, I can continue on and maybe I k t those
things that may not fit.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: So you'd like to go u h the
recommendations point by point and have a cons s s whether we
zqote
want y u t g forward or not:
MR. WILLIAMS: Yes, ma'am.
malam.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR:
So let's look at Point No.
ramp and docks Thursday thro
Commissioner McDanid,
COMMISSIONER
mean, there's no ar,!
been voiced by sev
with the taxpayeX
that's being --,LoN
vendor. IAv�(affi
CO
as that is, yes,
not tedious.
staff to manage parking lot
%,!NIEL: Well -- and here again, I
at we need additional oversight. That's
that have come. But I have an issue
%,�ir g money to take care of an oversight issue
public ramp that's being operated by a private
issue with that.
WISSIONER McDANIEL: The onus should be on the
operator. These are public ramps. These are ramps that are owned
by the county, and the onus should be put upon the operator to
increase the oversight. There's no argument there's more needed, but
I have an issue with us just -- again, one of the nice ladies said,
throwing -- you can throw money at anything and hopefully fix it, but
wevre going out with a response to a circumstance and the proposition
0-1ml
November 9, 2021
is for us to spend more money when we have somebody there that
should be doing that.
MR. WILLIAMS: Well, our proposal would be, we would use
existing staff within the Parks and Rec Division to mobilize. And
one other point I'll make is the concessionaire agreement is to sell
fuel, materials from the ship store, collect that ramp fee when they're
open. The enforcement and oversight of the park still is ta . ned
with Collier County ordinance as it relates to park rang o this
would be us positioning a park ranger permanently n this time
period to manage that facility. 0
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: If I d I need to
remember, too, these are the short-term -- e the short-term
answers to some of the issues that we h is isn't going to be a
forever thing. This is a -- there's a e 1 e levy, so just stick a
finger in there to stop this for now east slow it down, as you
said, for now, and then look at ircurnstances that we
potentially could deal with.
MR. RODRIGUEZ: morning, Commissioners. For the
record, Dan Rodrig e ublic Services Department head.
We have a pr ith the contracts as well. They've served
the county for t I years, when we had budget restraints during
the recession hatnot. Now is the opportunity to look at those
contracts. s rry stated, they expire here shortly. I say "shortly."
In aye , and a half We're going to renegotiate those and
move tho resources to better serve those public facilities.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Good.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Gotcha. Okay, thank you.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: So do we have a consensus to allow
staff to increase staff surveillance to manage the parking lot ramp and
docks --
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Yes.
O-M.
November 9, 2021
that?
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: -- at Caxambas?
Are we okay with
Commissioner Saunders, you had a comment.
I'd say it's okay.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Yeah, on that issue I don't
have any issues with that.
I was just going to make a comment for the Board t o sider.
0
It seems to me that one of the big problems is that, offine e, parking
at that facility, and that encourages people that are iggo b ce
I,
meeting friends there to just go there and park. d that myself from
v
time to time just to -- and so I think we have y parking sticker
c
program with the City of Naples where co r idents don't have to
pay for parking in the city but out-of-tov �e o.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL& IWbeach.
COMMISSIONER SAUND
COMMISSIONER McD
COMMISSIONER
that where there's a fairl
0 For beach parking, yes.
Yes.
5: And so maybe a model like
parking fee if you don't have a
county sticker would, , discourage some people from driving
their cars there inst CP f arpooling. I could see, you know, a
f
$ 10- or $20-a d ring fee for people that are not county residents
so,
might be part 1� solution, so I just want to throw that out for your
conversatioft
A LW,'obviously, we'll get into some of the other numbers of
permits. o have some comments on that. But right now just on
the parking, it seems to me that there may be not only a revenue
generator that will pay for additional personnel, but perhaps would
discourage some of the parking there.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: So maybe we can add that to the
second bullet, which is the optimized parking, which is that section.
So let's go through the staff, Caxambas Park and Goodland.
Wlm
November 9, 2021
Mr. Williams, the second bullet.
MR. WILLIAMS: Yes, ma'am. Yes. So you're looking at
increased oversight. I do want to point to -- we do have, in the
optimized parking section, something very close to what
Commissioner Saunders is describing where we would add a fee for
parking. Where you just now have to pay for the boat launch, add a
fee for parking. And as Commissioner Saunders indicat@Q, t�at fee
would -- if you had a beach sticker, you wouldn't pay h' if
you're a Collier County resident; but if you didn't, t rewould be
imposed. So we can -- I can point that out as we o hrough that
next section, if you'd like. 0
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I at the bottom of
that list there.
MR. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: o do you want to continue?
MR. WILLIAMS: Mada ir, yeah, I think the biggest
challenge is the next sectio s of optimizing parking. And,
again, one of the things t ould tell you, and you've heard
from your speakers, e, you know, looking at maximizing
parking, Caxambas n G odland both, as opportunities that we're
exploring.
We cont ed that with the building of the community
center. that modular would go away, we could add
parking ot a lot, but we want to explore that.
You * sue still is, with the commercial use, the customer base
that comes and uses the parks. So you have the congestion of the
ramp to deal with, but you also have the customer base that will go to
look for a place to park to gain their tour. That's where you really
have limitations.
So our recommendations, the first one, we can talk about
prohibit trailers that carry more than four motorized vessels from
O-M.
November 9, 2021
parking in boat ramp park. And part of that is that you have trailers
that are beyond our capacity in our parking spaces. So we're
suggesting that those folks can still launch, but they've got to park
offsite. And so that's that recommendation.
The next one requires commercial permit holders to --
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Can we take these one at a
time. MR. WILLIAMS: -- to encourage and promote -
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: We're going to take s one at a
time. .�k
MR. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. I'm sorry. 0
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: S estion I have there
is -- and several speakers mentioned it. 6 1 's because the trailers
are too long. They stick out of th ki spaces or they take
multiple parking spaces or they p i onally or they were using
our rock parking lot, which the f Marco doesn't like.
But to some of the peo made the comment, if I have
a -- if I have an extended at has six jet skis on it, and now I
have to park off site o er, what would keep me, then, from
getting two trailers r shorter, and now we really haven't helped
parking, becaus , -L v
d" ,,,t ey can park in the park, they're not too long,
they're the rig �.Agth, but now we've got two vehicles that are there
instead of
Sol ow� I took at that one, and I know we're trying to find,
you kno e fair and balanced, you know, type thing, and so our
initial thought was those extra -long trailers, they're going to -- they're
just going to have to go off site. But some of the businesses that
maybe have the resources to say, I'll sell my long trailer and I'll buy
two short ones, and then I don't have to go off site, we've made it now
worse. So I -- you know, I'm not saying I know the solution, but
what are your thoughts to that? And you've been in a lot of the
0_1=11
November 9, 2021
meetings with the business owners, so some of them have said, I'll
just do that.
MR. WILLIAMS: I think that's where this conversation about
caps come to play, you know, and I think -- you know, you had a
speaker that described, and I think rightly, so if you looked at a cap,
you're basically trying to take care of the businesses that have been
I You put that cap o th t, you
operating in some form or fashion. vok
continue to work this problem. Your long-term solut*
develop more boat trailer parking, but that cap will u to kind
of keep to, you know, what your current capacit is. I tell you, 150
is probably overcapacity still, but it's a numb s been consistent
of what historically you've provided. So 't ow if that answers
your question.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTR cap, you're saying, is that
every business could only get thre its. So if I had one long
trailer and now I had -- and I h permit and then I reduced it
down to two shorter trail rs e would need two permits, right?
MR. WILLIAMS: t your max is three. You
couldn't -- it's n t a -- * -- you canit just continue to get permits,
though,depend n u business model.
CHAIRM LOR: But the permit is directly tied to the
vehicle that tr s s the vessel?
MR L MS: That's correct.
C IONER McDANIEL: And we will have somebody
on site to pect to ensure that those that are launching are properly
licensed and have the -- have paid the fee?
MR. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. That's a big part of that role.
And a lot of these things that we're offering where in the past you
really only issued a permit without any type of restriction or
regulation, all these things would be tied to the permit, and you
would have the ability, if a person wasn't abiding by the permit, you
O-M.
November 9, 2021
could withdraw that permit. So that is a big change in terms of how
we manage.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: If I can just --
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Andy's up.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Forgive me, Andy.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: So three permits per operator, but
there was also a cap of 150 total permits. That's county *de, not per
park, but that would be countywide?
MR. WILLIAMS: That's correct.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Okay.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you.
Commissioner McDaniel.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: o weire -- what I'm
ie rator with a larger trailer,
asking -- or what I was thinking wasA
they'd still be able to come, offlo,�kN oe)� jet skis or kay -- it's hard for
me to not call them kayanks ffload those vehicles and
Jro
then -- but they'd have to g:,, mewhere else if their trailer had
that more -than- four-vehJ041t,4Xcity?
, I
MR. WILLIAM �rt s correct.
COMMISSIO cDANIEL: Okay.
CHAIRM LOR: Okay.
MR. WI L S: Madam Chair, if I could, I'll go to the next
item. C TAYLOR: Yes.
MR. ILLIAMS: Is require commercial permit holders to
encourage and promote ride sharing or shuttling of commercial
customers to boat ramp parks. We do see a little of that. Uber and
Lyft are services that operate on the island. There was a question
about whether that was as robust as some other communities, but,
you know, that was, you know, again, requiring commercial to
encourage; it's a little wishy-washy, but it's something that we also
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November 9, 2021
got from our Parks and Rec Advisory Board.
The next one -- and the next two probably are the ones that
maybe you might have concerns. Limit number of commercial
launch permits to three per company and, again, limit number of total
commercial launch permits issued to 150 annually.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Do we have any problem with that?
Commissioner McDaniel, then Commissioner LoCastro.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Yes. Well, fir I
thought I saw a slide that said we issued 180 perrmi t ear.
MR. WILLIAMS: That's correct.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Oka
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: And they' I permits?
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: rstand what they are,
yes, ma'am.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: N asking.
MR. WILLIAMS: They S, malam.
COMMISSIONER M L: It says 150 annual permits
there. So -- and I have with limiting it to 150. 1 have an
issue with limiting it -- ly, I mean, we -- there needs to be
accommodation, b s hat are operating commercial businesses
also have to hav ities associated, and it can't be enriched by the
public boat raiQp So there's a -- there's a balance there, and I don't
think the a2-Nv ould be limiting the actual commercial permits,
persona)C7.NN
MR'VILLIAMS: Just a suggestion. One of the discussions
with PARAB was this issue and similarly to what you're describing,
you know, one thought was to limit the number of permits to what
was issued this year in order to kind of grandfather folks that have
been participating with this. And, again, part of that limitation is
letting you catch up, you know, with capacity and looking at
developing these longer -term plans. So I offer that as a thought.
O-M.
November 9, 2021
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Well, that goes back to what
my main memory was telling me with 180 permits issued in the last
12 months. If we minimally kept it at that, we're not precluding
anybody who has been operating at our boat ramps with a permit.
That might be a way to not -- I mean, you've said it well,
Commissioner LoCastro, there's going to be an adjustment in how
folks are utilizing our public boat ramps. It's coming. Ukt Tat
limitation, at least mirroring what we've already done- i ast, I
think, is a good path to go.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: I was goi g say, you
know, I agree 100 percent, because I think so ese other things
are going to have the positive we're looki So I think in this
particular case, limiting the permits to I JQ something we need
to -- I don't personally think we nee 47Tt immediately. I would
like to see the things that we do a here, to monitor them, and
we might not need to do any m
I like the idea of not h mebody that has a permit not
being able to get one nol the magic number right now is 180,
1 think, you know, we t 180, and we haven't hurt anyone. But
I think these other i re going to come into play and give us at
least some of th ive change that we want.
After we -- you know, we had a long, long meeting, and
then I tho t re about this. The limiting the number of the
comme rmits to three per company -- one of the things that
you and Rodriguez said when you came into my office was, we
have some people that have as many as eight, right? Eight or 10,
right?
MR. WILLIAMS: That is correct.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: So the problem that I have is
the person that has eight or 10 -- eight and they go down to three,
that's a gigantic -- you know, they're at Mach 8, now they've got to go
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November 9, 2021
to Mach 3. Someone that has four and then just gets three -- gets
limited to three, they don't get hurt as bad.
And so, you know, we had talked a little bit about, you know,
would it be better to have some sort of ratio, at least? And then, you
know, over time -- the other thing, too, I want to stress is we're going
to be monitoring all these things. So anything we say yes to today, if
you come back to us in 3 0 days and go, you know what, ac ually
had the opposite effect or it didn't work or it's been a a we want
0
( a to
to tweak it, everybody here needs to know that this i g to be
very fluid; we want to see what the result is.
If putting that message board out there ing, then I don't
want more sign pollution on -- you know,O u enter Marco Island.
But what are your thoughts on the tkeN? And I'd like to even
hear from my colleagues. You kno IT Vnder if it should be more
of a sliding scale or ratio, because, ow, we've done this to
ourselves. If we've let someb eight permits, if we've paid the
concessionaire 96 percent, W, we are the worst
businesspeople in the wo telling you that right now, maybe,
and we're going to fix ings.
And I know e o y up here, you know, agrees. Maybe it
didn't seem like� i ryq eal, you know, a long time ago, but it is now,
and it's not etocLl ze Cindy and her team, but it's not good business.
"o 'I
But I g t ack to the three -- the three per company. You
know, t S, like I said, that have a lot more right now, it just
i g
seems Ilk ey get hit really hard really quick. What are your
thoughts?
MR. WILLIAMS: Well, it is a dilemma, and it goes both ways.
If you have people that have historically only gotten one permit and
now they can get three, do they get those two extra and somehow do
something with them? You know, so it's not as elegant as we'd like
in terms of it was meant to kind of review how we could limit.
0-!.=
November 9, 2021
Again, maybe the sweet spot with this one is looking at not
increasing the number of permits based on what you have this year.
And so if you had eight this year, you get eight next, if you had one
this year, you have one next, versus to try to do the math and the
ratios, you know, in terms of --
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Yeah. The more I thought
about it, I was thinking something along those lines beca ou
know, us, you know, the county, maybe not reacting t V�r,� yness
of these parks quick enough and making changes dA tXe road, we
just can't now dump the problem and penalize the obiness owners,
so shame on us or whatever. Or maybe you see it coming.
I'm not trying to throw anybody under the We're trying to find
solutions, not make excuses. But in thi cular case, I think that's
something to maybe take a look at.
And I'm curious what everyo I thinks as well, because we
could have -- if somebody cam eir eighth permit, we could
have said whoa, whoa, eigh' -- what I also see happening is now
these permits become v ble. So if I've only gotten one
permit, I'm going to t going to get all three and, like you
said, what happens e the scenes? Maybe I get with a business
who had eight p , now only has three, and we have some sort of
back deal, yo and we've created that. We've created some
sort of littl a oor deal between the business owners, and we don't
need to m in that situation. I mean, do you see that -- in your
conversa s, did you see that as a possibility? I think we did.
MR. WILLIAMS: We did, yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: And we don't want to do that.
You know, we don't want them to be, you know, trading permits and
whatnot, you know, because, I mean, they're business owners.
They're going to want to help each other, so...
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner Saunders.
OEM
November 9, 2021
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I agree with Commissioner
McDaniel and Commissioner LoCastro in terms of not reducing the
number from what the number is right now and perhaps freezing that
at this point.
But a couple questions about how these permits are issued and
how many new operators there are. This year you've issued 180
permits. Out of those 180, just kind of a guesstimate, ho4k Many of
those go to existing Collier County businesses that ha
operating earlier than just this year?
MR. WILLIAMS: It's a good question. I welve seen an
increase, and in part of our slides we showed crease in terms of
the number of launches at the facilities, b know that answer.
I could certainly find out.
I could tell you anecdotally yotldQ e new people in the
game, and so we are seeing that. X&gain, the pandemic created
that. People looking for some do. Business opportunities.
People wanting to get out o ter, and ecotourism has boomed
over the last couple year ow, because of that. But I can get
that. I just don't hhav
0,
Commlsstz S UNDERS: So next year -- if we limited
this to the 180 z1ve right now, how often do you issue these
e
W
permits? Is t * s nething that happens every day somebody comes
in and ask r ermit, and it's issued or --
M IAMS: Typically, that's -- you know, your
permit establish them so that they start January I st and they
expire December 3 1 st. And so most people will start to show up at
our door in December to acquire the permit for the January I st start.
Most of them come in the beginning. You'll get some stragglers
throughout the year, but most of them are issued in the month of
December.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Okay. It would be
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November 9, 2021
interesting to see how many Collier County businesses are repeating
year after year for that 180 versus the number of out -of -county
businesses that are getting those types of permits.
MR. WILLIAMS: You do have a small percentage of
out-of-towners that have the permit. The bulk of them are Collier
County businesses, so we can tell you that. We can get you a better
number of the new businesses, though, that emerged in t la t year
or two.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Thank yo
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner niel, then
Commissioner Solis.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Y hink -- and I'm just
going to say my peace a lot shorter than 0 issioner LoCastro did.
I think if we limit the total amount o e s to what was equivalent,
what was issued last year, and don4, the amount per company,
we accomplish everything that ooking to do and still allow
folks to conduct their busin so on and so forth, and we're not
shorting anybody on an ercentage.
COMMISSION STRO: But if we don't see a
positive -- like, if t�in c ntinue to worsen, then maybe it's
something we ae
N later on down the road and we say --
COMMI �NER McDANIEL: You did say -- you did say
when you r ing on there that this is a very fluid circumstance.
There's VV*o be a lot more information provided to this board
with regj,'a; to the circumstances that are prevalent at our ramps, but I
think a simple answer is limit it to the -- cap it at the existent -- what
we issued previously and no cap on the individual businesses for
now. These are short-term -- these are short-term answers to the
circumstance.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner Solis.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Do we have any idea how many
Page 92
November 9, 2021
companies there are that have more than three at this point in time?
MR. WILLIAMS: Yes, we do. Just a second.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: If I missed that before, I'm sorry.
MS. HENNIG: No. Again, Melissa Hennig, for the record.
There's one company with eight, four with five, and five with four.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: So there's about 18 companies out
of the 180?
MS. HENNIG: No, 10; 10 companies.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Ten companies. o ght you
I 'I
Ao�*91
said eight, five and
MS. HENNIG: One company has eigh
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Oh, one thy has eight.
f
MS. HENNIG: Yes. Four comp "d ave five permits, and
y IF
five companies have four permits.
r
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: So this is 10.
MS. HENNIG: Uh-huh.
CHAIRMAN TAYLO ay. So I think it's agreed that we
do not want to address --],, 't agree with limit number of
commercial pe its touSetv'.)ftor limit number of commercial permit
launches to 15 an a
'W�,; s that correct? Is that the consensus?
COMMISS R McDANIEL: We're going to limit it to 180.
COMMI ER SAUNDERS: What's issued already.
COM NER McDANIEL: The issued -- the previous 12
months * is 180, and no limit on the companies.
CH MAN TAYLOR: Are you --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: The 180, you said that they
go until December 3 1 st, so we're going to be starting that cycle all
over again. So we would start 2022 with a limit of 180.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Yes, go ahead.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Maybe to add to that I if the goal is
to try to reduce this, to reduce the situation that we have now, we
Page 93
November 9, 2021
could limit it to 180 but no new companies can apply so that maybe
there's -- as there's some attrition, the number comes down.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Or put a priority on the
existing companies first.
(Applause.)
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: That's what I'm saying is -- well, I
mean, that's the priority is we limit it to 180 today, the I Mktthn t
already have permits can reapply. If there's attrition �h en
maybe next year there's only 170. Do you see wh !t� n?
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Could yo s a date and say,
you know, current companies, you have to c uring this
window to reapply for your permit? The n hat date passes, we
look at the number and we go, wow, we' ady at 180. If we're at
140, then we can have an open wind -- I don't want to say 40
new companies; it could be 10 co s that want four permits or
whatnot. But I would think so g along that line would make
sure that our current busine s n't boxed out by somebody new.
CHAIRMAN TAY ommissioner Saunders.
COMMISSION DERS: I think Commissioner Solis
is 100 percent cory at some point I was going to start to raise
that issue of gra er the businesses that already have licenses
right now.
Ulti I erhaps the number of permits should be 150, but
that wo an 30 businesses or businesses that have those 30
permits Id be hurt. So if we -- you have a list of those
businesses. They have those permits. As they drop off, then the
number of permits would be reduced to get to 150. 1 think that's
what you're saying. Basically grandfathering --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Overtime.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: -- everyone that's already in
the business here, but over time limiting it to a smaller number, 150
0-1=11
November 9, 2021
probably is a good number, but that way no one currently in business
today is going to get hurt in the future. And that's where I was
wanting to go, so...
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: And it just occurred tome that
there's one other thing I think we should think about, and that is that
we're kind of capping things as they are today. So should we say
that none of the existing companies -- for example, the o t at has
eight can't apply for 10 next year.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: That's right. EightA'e *ap, right?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I mean, so that LW e capping the
numbers now, and over time, as there's attriti ose businesses,
they leave town, whatever, that we get to t er that the PARAB
thinks is the right number. And the sta
. ft er McDaniel.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Con��is
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Ire not putting anybody out
of business, is what I'm saying.
COMMISSIONER M L: That's correct. Well -- and I
think we get there by gra ring or some prioritization on our
existing businesses. �d &-11' e got to say, I mean, the goal here,
thought process, wp I imately reduce the amount of commercial
NUIXT
endeavors that Ning our public boat ramps over time.
COMMI ER SOLIS: Right, right.
COM NER McDANIEL: And so that number of 150
just ca t wasn't -- there wasn't a study done or a -- there was
just a re ion from the existing permits that we issued in the last 12
months. So it -- that wasn't a fixed -- that wasn't a --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Well, it was the number the
PARAB recommended.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: It was a reduction.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Can I just say one thing? Because
it just occurs to me that unless we do this third thing that I was just
Page 95
November 9, 2021
referring to, we'll never reduce the number because somebody
will -- right?
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Right.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I mean I if an existing company
leaves, they had three, well, one of the other company's is going to
get three, and then we'll have a company with 11.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: If we don't do th ri rity on
the existing businesses, the guys over in Miami --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Well, right.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: -- (indisc le) put a limit
on it, are coming in and getting permits, and eezes people that
are here out.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Right. even -- what I'm
saying is if -- and if the goal is -- an u rstood the goal to be to
try to reduce the commercial dem o the boat ramps, that unless
we do that, then we'll never ver be less than 180 because --
CHAIRMAN TAYLO S.
COMMISSIONER -- the existing companies that are
grandfathered in will ting -- buying up the available ones.
So it will always b
CHAIRM LOR: Commissioner Saunders.
COMMI ER SAUNDERS: Okay. We have two Lyoals.
One is to e -Tre that current operators
Cf-1% SIONER SOLIS: Right.
CO ISSIONER SAUNDERS: -- at the current levels are
not hurt, and the way we do that is grandfathering all those in. The
other goal is we want to reduce the number of operators out there,
and we want that to occur over time so nobody gets hurt.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Right.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: So the one business that has
eight permits, next year and the year after and the year after, they can
Page 96
November 9, 2021
get eight permits.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Right. They can't get I I next
year.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: So you freeze things the way
they are right now so that nobody gets hurt.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Right. That was my point.
MR. RODRIGUEZ: If I may, Commissioner. Pavi,,Ro�driguez.
You're exactly right. And what you want to do 's those
categories, because if you don't, you'll get someone, y e an
existing vendor, maybe not, come in and want 20 e its.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Nob n grow.
MR. RODRIGUEZ: Correct. IF
COMMISSIONER SAUND S: X ing businesses can't
grow but at least they're not bein p ou business. That's the
point.
MR. RODRIGUEZ:
COMMISSIONER M
permits, too. There is --
CHAIRMAN TAA
COMMISSIO
c L: Unless we have an excess of
,Ow-
�: No.
cDANIEL: -- attrition -- it's happening --
CHAIRMA;� T*,�YLOR: That's the market.
COMMI§�?Q, ER McDANIEL: Right.
,.N
CHAtFjVf*-TK TAYLOR: All right. So we're okay with that.
You unj�� that, correct?
MR. ILLIAMS: I think so, yes, malam.
N*
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: So now we're talking about the
no -- probably vessels that carry more than six passengers from
getting a commercial launch permit.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Could I -- you said you
think. So this is a -- this is the guts of the whole thing right now.
So I want to make sure. It's not "I think I understand." We need to
Page 97
November 9, 2021
make sure you understand what the Board is basically saying.
MR. WILLIAMS: Absolutely, Commissioner. And I
appreciate you saying that. So 180 permits grandfathered by
category is what we would issue for January 1, 2022.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: That exist now.
MR. WILLIAMS: That's correct.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Now, if some ofAhosie Dermit
holders go out of business, that reduces the total num e ermits
available until you get down to 150.
MR. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: And e have another
conversation at that point.
MR. WILLIAMS: Absolutely. ommissioner Saunders
we will know, more than likely, in
Dermit total is for the vear. Most,
during that time, so we'll know
CHAIRMAN TAYLOP4 C
Williams speak. I
MR. WILLIA
CHAIRMAN
think we need to^�
after lunch for,
So pr *b
agree w
CO
, mid January what our
Pse guys come in, you know,
uickly where we stand.
r,ay. I hat was -- that was Barry
but I'm glad you clarified it.
So let's talk about the -- I
is up, because we don't need to come back
ssels that carry more than six passengers.
SSIONER SAUNDERS:
I don't
Yeah, I don't agree as well.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Nor do 1.
(Applause.)
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: But we should have some
discussion with regard to -- and it may just happen by attrition. If
weire not letting pedestrian -- and that's people -- and I call
pedestrian -- cars to park that don't have a beach permit, then they've
O-M.
November 9, 2021
got to pay 10 or $20 for the nonresident parking. That may come up,
and those people then would seek additional parking somewhere else
and maybe shuttle in and so on.
I don't think it's -- I don't think -- I don't see us being able to
regulate Josh to -- and I'm using him as an example because he sent
us -- there he is. How you doing? I don't think we can regulate his
customer base, where they can and cannot park. If they' n t
Collier County residents, they're going to pay the ne g fee
that we do, and God love them.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: So, Commission c aniel --and
gentlemen, it is 12:03, and we have a huge a So let's -- if we
could, let's move through this as quickly a c n.
Commissioner LoCastro.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTR I was just going to
say, in the interest of time, that w ng to solve the parking
problem, but this bullet here h boat captains that have a lot of
folks. And so we really -- r rt of trying to fix one thing by
hurting another thing. S in this particular case, I mean, I
think all of us agree, t eloquent presentation on that bullet
were from the busi s ners. And so I think it goes without
saying, maybe t omething that we table, we think about down
the road, but 't implement now. I don't think it does anything
that we wayAit 6 o. and it's LyoinLy to have the ODDOsite effect.
IAMS: Understood.
,N TAYLOR: Commissioner -- or, Commissioner
McDaniel, do you have a comment or --
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: No, that was from before.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay, good.
Mr. Williams, continue.
MR. WILLIAMS: Yes, ma'am. So the next one is require
commercial permit holders to care liability insurance indemnifying
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November 9, 2021
Collier County as part of their permit.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay. So what do we say,
gentlemen?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Yes.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Absolutely.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Absolutely.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay, require. Okay. t e next
one, Sir.
MR. WILLIAMS: Prohibit commercial launc it holders
from using a county park as their business addres
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: AbsoIAZ12
well.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Yes, abso
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: %I
MR. WILLIAMS: Allow
holders in the marine service
d agree with that as
commercial permit
industries to obtain one
commercial launch pe it t be used for multiple trailers?
And so commerec7iale 'about in your boat parks mainly
from the marine indus sually one vessel, one or two people.
COMMISSIO;� cDANIEL: We're okay with that.
MR. WILLIAXS:' Gotcha.
COMMI§&Q'N I
ER McDANIEL: I am okay with that. I don't
want to sp
C4 AN TAYLOR: I don't quite understand.
C
CO ISSIONER SAUNDERS: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Yeah.
MR. WILLIAMS: So you're not trying to limit the marine
industry. What they'll do is they'll put a boat, say, at Bayview for a
sea trial. They've done some maintenance on the boat or it's a new
boat. And so you don't want to restrict that. They're not the people
that are coming with, you know, guests that are, you know, getting a
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November 9, 2021
tour. So you want to support that industry.
And part of the history of allowing commercial use with your
boat ramps in the parks had been to support that activity. And
typically you see it at Bayview Park. You don't see it at all your
boat park locations, but they do use all of them, but primarily we do
see a lot Bayview to get out in the Gulf of Mexico.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Off site.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: We have a -- N�
MS. HENNIG: I just wanted to add, when thi up at the
PARAB, that was a way, with the 150 cap, to ma e possible that
everyone would get a permit. So if you're s at you're capping
it at 180, that may not be a viable option a r .
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: 180 goe- n to 150.
COMMISSIONER McDANIE r time.
MS. HENNIG: Eventually.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: time.
MS. HENNIG: Butt e ple, the commercial industry,
service industry, they ha its right now. So if we say
everybody gets the sa unt of permits, this one may be obsolete
or not necessary pSFs .
CHAIRM "'IV LOR: Commissioner.
COMMI ER SAUNDERS: How many of those fellows
or folks la axambas? You said most of them are at
B ayfro .
MR. ILLIAMS: Bayview.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Bayview, rather.
MS. HENNIG: I can -- I don't have a good answer now.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: We're trying to get the usage
at Caxambas reduced. We have other alternatives for the marine
industry to launch their boats. So I would say that we should not
permit that. Again, we're trying to -- we're trying to satisfy a couple
Page 10 1
November 9, 2021
things. One is the City of Marco Island Council and that we're going
to solve this parking problem. And that's a little piece of it, but there
are other options for them. I'm assuming you don't know how many
launch there.
MR. WILLIAMS: We don't. Just anecdotally we see a lot
of -- you know, Bayview is what I would tell you. I don't see a lot of
that at Cax. I do see a lot at Bayview and, again, Bayvi b cause
you get to the gulf really quick.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner Mc e .
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Yes. A ant to caution,
we have a Parks and Rec Department, Parks c Advisory Board
that's giving us global ideas for all of our want, ultimately,
to be seeing individual rules and individ cumstances for our
different boat ramps.
This bullet that we're talking u here, if we limit -- we have
an enormous amount of marine e industry that's not on the
water, people that repair bo the allowance of a permit per
company to launch boats their testing and so on and so forth,
it should be done. T ood recommendation, Commissioner
Saunders. It's not - s ggestion of eliminating that would hurt a
lot of people tha r ot -- that are not on the water. This is a good
recommendat* n.
COM NER SAUNDERS: Well, we can -- welve got the
180 tha ow weire going to be issuing. This could be in
addition at, as long as it's not a whole lot.
MR. WILLIAMS: No, and we'll monitor and measure that.
And I agree with you, Commissioner Saunders. I think in addition
to the 180, allowing for that marine industry with the permit would
be important.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I don't have an issue with
that, at least for this first year.
Page 102
November 9, 2021
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner Solis, are you all right
with that --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Yes.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: -- allowing this?
Commissioner LoCastro?
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: I don't think the marine
industry is what's causing a problem at Caxambas, so...
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: All right. So youfve� ��The
next one.
MR. WILLIAMS: Commissioner, the next n is implement an
au
escalating fee for the second and third comm Pi nch permit that
is issued to a company.
Now, the previous discussion sugg Le a three -permit limit.
a
So we may need to look at this. I t kvt we're suggesting is, as
you increase the number of permit a ou acquire, it's an escalating
fee associated with that. So c I your fee that you pay, if you
ial
want to have a commercial it's $ 100 annually, and then you
c
pay for each launch, the $tolt
. So this would change that from 100
sl
to an escalating fee fo st three permits of going from 250 to
350 to 450. 1 N 71
COMMISS R LoCASTRO: And the rationale was you
thought if ther, an escalating scale, that somebody that -- you
know, that I - only needed three permits right now and, say, ah,
give me S� one for a hundred bucks, if the price was a lot more,
'I
i-40
they mig ort of think -- because we're not trying to make this a
cash cow for the county. I know we hear that a lot. They're like,
oh, the county's making so much money. I mean, we don't want to
give 96 percent to Cindy either. But what was the thought process
there?
MR. WILLIAMS: It was --
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Discourage.
Page 103
November 9, 2021
MR. WILLIAMS: -- greater impact on the facility, it's worth
more. The $ 100 price point -- you know, again, if you have an
operator that's paying $ 100 but launching, you know, 3 00 times, 3 00
times 8 it's a significant amount of money they put out.
It's just -- the feeling was that -- and, again, feeling's not the
right word. In looking at kind of our over -- looking at the state of
Florida and what charges were made for launch fees, $ 1 (** diq seem
light, you know. So you're looking at that escalation- o based
on the permit.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner MAniel.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Who R;ee money if we
increase the permit fees? ly
MR. WILLIAMS: So the permit f Ns to the Parks Division
that offsets the operating expenses w..kh t -- with the facilities.
COMMISSIONER McDANIK O-lt's not going to the vendor --
MR. WILLIAMS: It doe
COMMISSIONER Mc L: -- that's only paying us
4 percent.
CHAIRMAN T Let's make a decision, gentlemen.
Commissioner Mc '��
,�a 1. 7
COMMISSATNR McDANIEL: I think -- well -- and again,
what are you. - N.question that comes up, because we only
addressed two, and three permits. What do you do for the
10 com at have four, five, and eight permits? So what do
they pay. s it --
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Escalating. Let them decide and
make it escalating beyond three.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: They've only talked about the
first three.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: No.
MR. WILLIAMS: Commissioners, if you allow me, if you're
Page 104
November 9, 2021
comfortable with the concept of escalation, we're actually bringing a
rate resolution back to you in December.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay.
MR. WILLIAMS: We can make a recommendation at that time
given this guidance that we have, if you're comfortable with the
escalation. We do think that the permit, as you get multiple permits,
it's worth * more. We've also heard -- and I'll say this withlklyt of
commercial in the room -- that that's not -- that amou a
prohibitive amount for them. And there's not -- th s n interest
from the commercial users, they have interest in e oth ramp
locations. They want to see them managed to a certain
level so they have, you know, skin in the to speak.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Bring "
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: So I in e say it's okay to bring it
back. Would you agree?
COMMISSIONER SA I would add one thing to
that. We're, obviously, at s nt in the not so distant future,
going to be adding perso monitor all of this. And I know
you've said that you're o use existing staff, but I'm assuming
your existing sta p tt busy.
So we're goi e adding staff. I think the base fee of $ 100
is too low. S n you come back, perhaps that should be $200. 1
don't kno h e right number should be, but $ 100 for an annual
permit , even though there's a launch fee on top of that, just
seems to that that's pretty light, and I'd like to -- I don't have a
problem with an escalating scale, necessarily, but I think the starting
point's a little low.
MR. WILLIAMS: Yes, sir. We can bring that back in
December with this guidance, so --
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Escalating fees, are we all okay?
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Can I just ask, how long has
Page 105
November 9, 2021
it been 100? Has it been 100 for many years? Or we've bumped it
up over the years? Do you know offhand?
MR. WILLIAMS: It used to be a permit was $1,500 annually.
It went -- and I think the gentleman spoke about eight or 10 years ago
it went from 1 500 annually to 100 plus the $8 launch, so it changed
about eight, 10 years ago.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: The only thing I *,ou d just
say is when you come back, maybe just take a look at- t iding
scale, because we're not trying to take a giant bite o f e apple.
So we know it's been $ 100, and it's been light for i e. So all of a
sudden making these big, huge muscle move -- but like you
said, I know the businesses said, hey, you t's not like we're
going from 100 to $2,000. But I would ay when you come
in to
back here, you know, I know you're if have more conversation
with business owners and whatnot. 6're not trying to catch up
after all these years. We coul t slowly, you know, in the
future. I*t
CHAIRMAN TAY kay. You've got a consensus on
the escalating fee for third, plus commercial launch permits.
So let's talk about 1 r si g launch fees. Are we okay with that?
And understand* t number's going to come back to us in
December. e all right?
(No verba s se.)
C_ TAYLOR: It looks like that's okay.
Ann recreational launch permit for non -Collier County
residents. Increase it. What do you think? I would agree.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Yes.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: What's the fee now?
MR. WILLIAMS: It's $ 100 annual permit.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: It's the same, okay.
MR. WILLIAMS: And, again, if you're in agreement with that,
Page 106
November 9, 2021
you'll have another bite at this apple as we bring the fee resolution
next month to you.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Is that a consensus? It's good.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: And, again, that gets to the
trying to utilize your local ramps for our local people.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Yep. Okay. Implement parking fee
for folks that have vehicles without Collier County beach ti ers.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Yes.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I would agree.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: How wo e do that,
though? Would we have the machine out th ike what we
have at South Beach?
MR. WILLIAMS: That's correct. ave a meter --
COMMISSIONER LoCASTR er.
MR. WILLIAMS: A parkini2qaer out there that people could
acquire a sticker to put in their 7et us know that they paid their
fe e. ']AN;�,
COMMISSIONERIe4t"'187RO: And then people will monitor
that?
MR. WILLIA
N. We do. The park rangers will circulate and
look for making A eople have --
COMMI ER SAUNDERS: Just a quick question. How
long does or your department to implement a parking plan
with fe . at something that can be done by early January,
February, does it take six months? How long does it take you to
put all that stuff in?
MR. WILLIAMS: No. With Board approval of fee increases,
you know, we have -- like our beach access points, we have staff that
point of sale is there. That's easily done. At your boat ramp
locations, you have parking meters. That's easily adjusted. So it
can happen as soon as it comes into effect. If you determine, you
Page 107
November 9, 2021
know, a particular day, we can make that happen.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay. Second -- last -- second to
last, commercial use and site plan amendment at Caxambas Park.
Commissioner LoCastro.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: We have to.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Yes, I would agree.
Commissioner McDaniel.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Absolutely.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner Sa S.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Yes.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commission
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Yes.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Seek ne c itional use at
Goodland for additional vehicle pariiing_ eah.
COMMISSIONER LoCAST Y
,%.,) eah, that's a requirement.
COMMISSIONER McD And, you know, there again,
if I might just add to that, w do that at all of our ramps in
proximity to all of our ra crease -- seek additional parking at
all of our ramps not j ean, we have specific issues at
Caxambas and Goo 1, or sure, but all of our ramps sooner -- the
balloon effect, a missioner Solis has talked about regularly,
when you squ e ere it pops out over there, so...
t
CHA TAYLOR: And now we're going to three, which
covers t e, correct? Are you --
MR;.ILLIAMS: Yes. Identifying and develop additional
facilities, and we gave you some examples of that. We do have
some opportunities, Hamilton Avenue, and appreciate the Board's
support of that initiative. So looking at that through all our boat
ramp locations is certainly what we do. So that's the short-term.
That was the hardest job.
And, again, if you indulge me, just the intermediate strategies
WE=
November 9, 2021
that we've identified. Again, increase oversight, reevaluate
regulations to commercial launch permits, and adjust regulations as
necessary. That's just us looking every year with you on this issue
and continuing to adjust as needed as we got input. Explore parking
options at other boat ramp parks. And, again, similarly,
research -- continue to research other additional sites.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Yes.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Yes.
MR. WILLIAMS: You're almost home.
So your long-term recommendations,
short-term recommendation is looking at a
951 to see if that makes a difference.
placing a permanent one there.
commercial launch permits. J
continuously looking at this is�L
recommendations. And. aaZ
sites. So that's the
COMMISSIO
COMMISSIO
CHAIRM
COMMI
CHA 4
Voncept -- your
e message board on
I fj�Nd long-term strategy is
�alu , regulations to
01 Ire seeing a theme of us
[ coming back with
iring and develop additional
long-term recommendations.
Yes.
YLOR: Yes, thank you.
R McDANIEL: Yes.
TAYLOR:
One more question to our County
Attorne LI�Tce we leave. I did read the analysis of restricting
'I
11�)s public parking, public boat ramp, but -- completely, but
parking.
could we do it on specific days every week, like the weekends, and
leave it open all week long, but the weekends it's only for Collier
County residents?
MR. KLATZKOW: I think you run into the same problems,
malam.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay.
Page 109
November 9, 2021
MR. KLATZKOW: I mean, you can differentiate between
commercial and noncommercial, but as far as noncommercial goes,
it's for everybody.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay. Thank you.
Are we clear?
MR. WILLIAMS: Yes, ma'am. And thank you, again,
Commissioner LoCastro, Commissioner McDaniel, ComVisyoner
Saunders in terms of your knowledge and backgro4unNVX(adership
V j
in this. It's helped us with our constituents in hop oming up
with a good strategy for all, so thank you very m
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you.
Commissioner McDaniel, quickly. 34
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: 0 on't need to tell me
quickly. I go quickly all the time.
Barry, it's been brought to in e tion that we need to attend
J_
our boat ramps with regard to gulations. So I want that to
s aoil
become part of our ongoin o s going forward.
� tely. Yes, sir.
MR. WILLIAMS: ; "a t1c
COMMISSIO
we hadn't actually
CHAIRMAN
lunch. We'll
(A luWj
live mic.
ANIEL: That was the one thing that
i S'
��YLOR: All right. We're going to adjourn for
k at 1: 10.
F'recess was had from 12:19 p.m. to 1: 10 p.m.)
V
KSON: Madam Chair, Commissioners, you have a
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I was approached by the folks from
the Mosquito Control issue, that there are a significant number of
people online from the different agencies that would like to speak to
this issue as well as we have some in the -- in our chambers right
now. So if there's an agreement, I would like to hear Mosquito
Control now.
Page 110
November 9, 2021
All right, good.
MR. ISACKSON: If that's the pleasure of the Board, that
would be Item I I C. It's a recommendation that the Board of County
Commissioners further consider a previous support resolution
adopted by the Board approving the expansion of the Collier
Mosquito Control District boundaries.
Mr. John Mullins will introduce.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you.
MR. ISACKSON: Well, Mr. Mullins tells m t e
representatives from the Mosquito Control aren't e yet.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay. So w they coming?
MR. MULLINS: John Mullins, dire ommunications,
Government, and Public Affairs. I thin were following with
the agenda. With no time-certains, hi hey were anticipating
short-term rentals and some other probably coming first.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I think that maybe we need to
reach out to them. If it , s 1 - if they're at Mosquito Control
Naples Airport and they s a meeting today, it's not going to
take them that long, s we'll hear the --
MR. ISACKS a'am, we'll do that. Maybe we can go to
9A, then.
CH R AYLOR: Short-term rentals first, if that's -- if
wevre in s here.
W at do you think, Commissioner Solis?
CO ISSIONER SOLIS: Well, I mean --
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: If they're not here, they're not here.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: No, I mean, we didn't do a
time -certain. I guess it's disappointing. Everybody else has been
here all day, but I guess we'll do something else first.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: I mean, does it preclude us
from hearing the people on the phone, or you want Mosquito Control
Page I I I
November 9, 2021
to be able to --
MR. MILLER: I only have one person online for that item,
malam.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Oh.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: All right. So let's hear the
short-term rentals.
Item #9A
ORDINANCE 2021-45: AN ORDINANCE E
SHORT-TERM RENTAL REGISTRATIO
FOR OWNERS OF SHORT-TERM VA
MONTHS OR LESS, IN UNINCORPOI
COUNTY AT A RATE OF FIFTY ML
NON -TRANSFERABLE FEE —AQP
QWHING
"UIREMENTS
RENTALS, SIX
COLLIER
ARS FOR A ONE-TIME
.D W/CHANGES
MR. ISACKSON: Coftpjs�ioners, that would be Item 9A.
It's a recommendation t 'an ordinance establishing short-term
rental registration re nts for owners of short-term vacation
rentals six months I in unincorporated Collier County at a rate
of $50 for a on ontransferable fee.
Mr. Jam ch will present.
MR. H: Good afternoon, Commissioners. For the
record, rench, with Growth Management.
I'm py to provide you with a presentation. This was just
brought to you at your last meeting where you approved the
advertisement, and this is the adoption hearing. So happy to go
through this -- I know that the Naples Area Board of Realtors, who
we have met with a number of times, is here as well -- or just happy
to go into questions.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I don't see any questions. What's the
Page 112
November 9, 2021
pleasure of the Board? Shall we hear from the speakers?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Yes, I think so.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I'd like to hear from our
speakers, and then we can deliberate. And I don't need to have
another presentation.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: No.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I think we've rev . w d this
ad nauseam, personally, so...
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay.
MR. FRENCH: Since 2019, sir.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Yes, sir. Lo stimony, so
let's --
MR. MILLER: Madam Chair, we six registered speakers.
I think maybe a couple of them mig a ad to leave due to the
hour. Danielle Hudson is our firs A�_er. She's been ceded
additional time from Martin M
COMMISSIONER M
rl, Is he in the room?
I
L: Make sure he's in the room.
(Raised hand.)
MR. MILLER: �V �atotal of six minutes, and she will be
followed by Brad t le
S
S
MS. HUD ood afternoon, Commissioners. My name is
I
Danielle Hud n. am the vice president of public policy at the
Naples ArQpo3Wa d of Realtors.
As usly mentioned, our board has been engaged with the
county � ollier County rent registration ordinance since at least
2019. And we are amenable to the intent and spirit of the ordinance
you have before you today which is to collect current and accurate
information regarding short-term vacation rental properties and to
encourage the appropriate management of these properties.
That being said, while this ordinance is clearer than earlier drafts
that we have reviewed, the board does have some specific
Page 113
November 9, 2021
suggestions that we hope you'll consider.
So first we believe that the definition of short-term vacation
rental in the draft ordinance needs to be expanded to clarify the
A
homes that will be required to register under the new ordinance.
it stands, the current ordinance language references State Statute
212.03 which gives the county Tax Collector the authority to collect
taxes on transient rentals for six months or less; however,4�Qot�all
transient rentals are required by the state to register w . t ' R as
required in the Collier Registration Ordinance und IcC' on 3 . L
To ensure that the ordinance is clear for pra it ners and
homeowners and to specify which homes wil uired to register,
we believe it would be best to add a re ere o tate Statute
509.242(l)(c) which defines transient 1 odging as homes that
are rented to guests for more than th t" s in a calendar year for
periods of less than 30 days or on e dar month. We believe that
this is important to include to c any confusion, if this
ordinance is enacted, bei�ng�i PR does have licensure
exclusions pertaining to ners that rent their homes for longer
periods, such as six m nd that do not consistently advertise as
transient public lod 1 e just want to make it very clear, if this
is enacted, who e to register so that, as they go through that
process, there r questions.
Next Id like to point out a few pieces of information that
we hop e food for thought for you -all. There is some concern
amongst e practitioners that have spoken at our board that this
registration ordinance may be duplicitous in terms of existing state
and county tax registration processes. So, as it stands, homeowners
are required to register with DBPR and with the county Tax Collector
via the business tax receipt process, which is extensive, and collects
an excessive amount of information. If this ordinance should pass,
in fact, it will be the Tax Collector that sends notification to
Page 114
November 9, 2021
homeowners that a new registration process is required indicating
that contact information and who owns the property is listed in
county records.
Further, a review of existing Code Enforcement Board
complaint data reveals that a process already exists for neighbors and
interested parties to refer non-DBPR licensed individuals to Code
Enforcement, and there I will Just stop and mention that AC
I >_ ear over
year, request FOIA data to take a look at the complai t are
coming through the county.
Over the last three years, if you remove du c S, there have
been a total of 65 complaints related to short- acation rentals.
Of those, only three have had a case pendi S we're looking at
I percent, really, of even the complaints are going to case. I
bring that up only as a data point for ou show you the exposure of
what we're seeing in Code Enforc in terms of complaints
related to short-term vacation r
And of the homes that v mplaints related to non-DBPR
licensed individuals that g through the existing Code
Enforcement process, e 16 were brought through voluntary
compliance. So t r n existing process.
And one o ggestions that we have, if we want to move
forward with tration in order to get designated responsible
parties, I s� 1 a database, would be to -- instead of maybe having
a Collie ration number being required, that we ask and mandate
that they their DBPR license number in their advertising. It's
something that already exists. For people that are following the law,
it's something that they would already have. And it would also free
up Growth Management from having to put in a new registration
process by which they have to release registration certificates.
If that is not the will of the Board, then we may suggest that we
put parameters in terms of turnaround time of when homeowners
Page 115
November 9, 2021
should expect to see their Collier registration if that is the direction
that you choose, and that is in line with some of the state bills that we
have that are going through, namely SB 512, which is requiring a
60-day turnaround time for local registration certificates. So I
mentioned that also because there is current legislation going through
at the state level that specifically pertains to local registration and
advertising, and so it may make sense if you choose not tksi ply list
the DBPR license number and you choose to do a Col�li istration
number, that we have that turnaround time baked i 17.+
Finally, we really just want to thank Growth agement; this
really has been a process. They've been ve able and open to
vJ
our questions of which, you know, we've a y over the past
couple of years. Jamie French and his t as been very open to
answering our questions and taking r c ments, and we hope to
continue this dialogue moving for Thank you.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: you.
MR. MILLER: Your x eaker is Brad Estes. He'll be
followed by Laura Puck
MR. ESTES: Gi moon. Brad Estes with the Poinciana
Civic Association.
We whole ly endorse this creation of the requirement for
short-term re istration, and this is short-term rental
'r 'T
registratiol o st vacation rental registration.
A: �io -term rental registration is an issue with us as well as
vacation etaol�rlegistration. So please consider that it's not Just
vacation rental.
And we also are, how's the word, especially happy to hear or
glad to hear that there will be a designation of a responsible party.
Responsible party, who do we contact as an association? Because
as -- in our case, we often contact the residents or the owner, property
owner more likely, as a courtesy before we complain to Code
Page 116
November 9, 2021
Enforcement.
But who do we contact? Let me put a -- we struggle with
getting in contact with ownership. This is a copy of our letters to
owners over the last four years asking them to help us with
compliance, whether it be trash, parking -- trash, parking, you know,
late -night parties, whatever the issue is. The associations need
access, too. The associations can assist. We don't have4,o o to
Code Enforcement, and we attempt to use Code Enforc as the
last measure, but we don't have the information.
And that I can count on probably one hand - a t ere's
probably 3- to 400 there -- probably 400 ther s that went to
property owners. I can count on one han r we have heard
from homeowners. So we actually, tho and I have to add, they
have been fairly cooperative in resp di o our concerns.
I would just like to thank Co s *oner Solis, because I
think -- and others as well for g this up and have been
considering this. It's a situ at is not just, in our case,
distracting and a threat t mmunity character, but there are
communities that are -- actually had very serious consequences
from this. How r ach it, I don't know. But we think
information is t t ing. Who owns it and who's going to be
responsible, a ols going to be immediately responsible if I could
ask -- if I d that -- immediately responsible? Thank you.
C TAYLOR: Thank you.
MR. ILLER: Your next speaker is Laura Puckett. She will
be followed by Christian Jasinski. I think they have left. Let me
move on. Maurice Cossairt. They have all left, ma'am.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay. So, Mr. French, we
heard -- you know, we heard testimony from the Board of Realtors.
Are you in agreement with the modifications they suggested?
MR. FRENCH: Commissioners, again, Jamie French, for the
Page 117
November 9, 2021
record.
Just for some record clarification, with regards to the duplication
of information, the information that the Tax Collector has when you
register the property as a vacation rental or short-term rental, that is
not readily available to us.
So it's not duplicative to us. It's unique. And with regards to
having any type of unique identifier, much like -- and I vAkul5 only
ask each one of you on this dais, when you've ever reqc t to me
before, whether it's a land -use petition or whether it' kilding
permit or a Code Enforcement complaint, you' e 6 unique
identifier beyond the address. That is issued . ately. So as
soon as that is applied for, you receive a u entifier. It is not
months.
And our process that we're wor " g now and the reason why
we're asking for a January "go liv is because it will be
available online. It is simply your DBPR registration, show
us that you're properly filed e Tax Collector, here's a license.
Give us a designated poi ntact. We're done. There's not a
whole lot of review ot the zoning piece. And the reason why
we bring in the zon ie e is that we want to make sure that we
don't have a cub standing up in a warehouse building that now
all of a sudde e got a hostile -- or you've got a bed and
breakfast t r a y should be an industrial park warehouse. And so
that's w e tie into zoning review, and that's already standing
regulatio at exists. So we're not impeding or impairing any of the
state process, and it will be an immediate look at that property over
the counter.
So, ma'am, we process about 6,000 permits a month. So to say
that we've got 10,000 or 14,000 rentals out there, okay, give me a few
weeks. I can get to them. Not that big of a deal. And we'll work
with it.
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November 9, 2021
Now, as far as the Code Enforcement pieces -- and, look, as
Danni said, they have been really good, much like the County
Attorney's Office and the community and the Sheriff7s Office.
Really, really good partnerships there amongst all of us to work on
something good for the community.
But with the Code Enforcement piece, we are not -- we register
those as a short-term rental, but we close out the case bec*,us� we
don't regulate short-term rentals. They typically lead t erty
maintenance, noise, junk cars, broken windows, pr
maintenance type issues. So they could be open d as a rental or
short-term rental, but we have no authority t ause we don't
regulate those, and we're still not going to.
Again, this is a -- this is a registrati cess. But we do agree
with NABOR that 509 does give go de ition, and 509 is
mentioned in this ordinance. o nything that 509 exempts, if
that's the language, staff woul with that.
CHAIRMAN TAY 0 ay. Commissioner McDaniel,
Commissioner Solis, an issioner LoCastro.
COMMISSION ANIEL: You answered my question.
If 509 is mentione n ordinance and you're okay with adding
that or having tV a a
, Np A of that definition, then I think that takes
care -- t a ta s e of the one thing that she said.
And t other thing with regard to the DBPR number that a
short-te ation rental is supposed to already get, could we add a
reference that? Is that part of this application process for that
registration?
MR. FRENCH: Yes, sir. It will be in there. It will all be
there.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner Solis.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I was just going to mention the
reference to 509.242(l)(c), or whatever the exemptions are. I mean,
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November 9, 2021
I think we could just -- and the County Attorney and I spoke about it
yesterday, I think, just to say, short and sweet, this is applicable to all
short-term rentals not exempted by the statute, whatever. Just so it's
in there. Because I think it wasn't only NABOR that brought this
up. The Florida property rental property association. Did I say
that right? Are they here?
MR. FRENCH: Apartment Association of Florida.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Apartment associat*
MR. FRENCH: John Christopher or somethi
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Yeah, made th ' s e request.
And I think they were right. I mean, it's -- y "4b U'd have to go
andlookup509. Soifwecouldjustma t ear in the statute
E
r
what's included and what's exempt, then Ji.4n 'thalt would be easier.
The County Attorney is holding is P�,ad cer there.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: P d.
MR. KLATZKOW: No. n, we spent three years on this
N
ordinance, and I know r. n as spent an enormous amount of
time with the industry to particular definition. And every
time we get to this de the goalpost changes, and we want a
new definition. A appy to make adjustments, but if you're
exempt by the st you're exempt. That's the end -- that's the end
of it. And th ition, I think I is as clear as we could possibly
make it ov ree years.
C IONER SOLIS: But I think the issue is is that
somebo at's a homeowner that just looked at this, they may not
even realize that somehow they're exempt because they don't even
know there's an exemption to 509, because they have to then go to
509 and see what 509 says.
MR. KLATZKOW: Yeah, but 509 doesn't really do what they
say it does. The core of this ordinance is that we need a contact
person when somebody's partying at 2:00 a.m. That is the heart and
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November 9, 2021
the soul of this ordinance. It really doesn't do anything else. We
know who the apartment people are. They're easy to find. There's
apartment managers.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Right. But there can -- I mean,
they don't have to register under this, because they're exempt from
509.
MR. KLATZKOW: If you want to say apartments ot have
to register, that's fine.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Yeah. Whateve pt by 509.
MR. KLATZKOW: But 509 doesn't exem t m. What I'm
saying is 509 doesn't exempt them, but it doe ' ter because we
know who they are. The purpose of this a ce is to make sure
that we know who you are, and right no e got countless outside
investors buying properties all over Ili ounty renting them out
through Airbnb. We have no ide the contact people are.
MR. FRENCH: So, ConAq ner, if you wouldn't mind, what
I've provided you is this is t 's guide, kind of their fast
facts --
COMMISSION IS: Right.
MR. FRENC t who needs to register and who doesn't,
and we hand thi nd we will include this within our letter so
it's Just a re-c f what the state is already doing. But if you
could jum s t this PowerPoint slide, you've got a definition that's
identifi in 509 that talks about non -transient apartments, which
would be empt, and then you've got your transient apartments.
509 clearly identifies what those are by definition by percentage of
usage on how much of those units would actually be considered
short-term.
So it's short-term -- and we understand it from the apartments
point of view because there may be companies that come along and
may only rent for two or three months while they're placing an
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November 9, 2021
employee that they're bringing into a market, or perhaps it's a
prospective buy where they're just trying to finish a home.
So we recognize that, but the statute does clearly call out
509 -- or within 509 it does say what's exempt and what doesn't. So
if we need to strengthen that language within our correspondence or
within this handout, we'll certainly do that, because we're not going to
try to enforce something that is exempt by law.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Yeah.
MR. KLATZKOW: I would suggest you all2t a to
implement this ordinance, and if for some reason h e are any kinks
along the way, we'll come back and make the Rize, happy to, but I
think this language works, I really do. A An, this has been
three years we've been going back and f ith the industry on it,
and we've never gotten consensus ny ng.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: . So looking at short-term
vacation rental, it says, short-t ation rental means the rental of
any habitable space includi a M, apartment, living quarters, and
any residential building i g, but not limited to, condos,
multifamily for a te - ay. And maybe I misunderstood. So
we want just co r I ental apartment owners to have to register
as well, or we
MR * : If they are considered transient apartments to
where yo got maybe -- let's say you've got 10 units and only
three o ive there longer than six months, the rest of them are
short-te entals, sir.
If they're renting them a month at a time or a couple months at a
time, it would fit that definition under 509. And the state clearly
defines that, so this isn't anything that we're defining at a local level.
So what NABOR said, what Danni has said is absolutely correct. So
if we need to strength the language and the message that 509 is the
overall deciding document --
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November 9, 2021
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Right.
MR. FRENCH: -- by all means; absolutely.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: That's all I'm suggesting is just put
a reference into 509.242, whatever it is, that makes those distinctions
as to what's exempt and what's not.
MR. KLATZKOW: But that's the last line of the definition.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Can we put that up?
MR. KLATZKOW: We can at apartments if yo
that's -- if we can put it up. but
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Okay. Well, iot says 509 -- I'm
just saying, can we --
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: We don't t t definition here.
It's not in our packet, so...
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: P jus ggesting that instead of
it just saying 509, that we actually Ju, 509 is a whole statute.
COMMISSIONER M4cD It's a big statute. It was
actually referenced, 509.24
CHAIRMAN TAY 4here it is.
AY
COMMISSION IS: I don't understand what the
downside to --
COMMISS)ONU
, ,R McDANIEL: I thought that's what we were
actually d1oin Nr I asked if it was referenced. I didn't realize it
was the enj a ute, 509, but if we just add the language of
.242(l)
MR. NCH: We'll work with the County Attorney's Office,
sir. Staff has no concerns, and we'll make it right.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: You've answered most of my
questions. Two things that I did hear from Ms. Hudson and the
second speaker as well, she was saying the DBPR number
would -- you know, she was suggesting it be "the number" and not
Page 123
November 9, 2021
also some special county number. I didn't know if I heard you
answer that you agreed or disagreed with that. Do we need the
special county number? Is it sort of redundant?
MR. FRENCH: So the number is a unique county number.
That is not a shared database. So if someone were to call in and we
were to do an investigation, that's a -- you know, it's where -- the
Sheriffs Office or Code Enforcement or EMS or Fire, thck're going
to have access to this database -- that they would b a I ut in that
r
county number through our CityView software, an t ere. I
would not be able to cross-reference that unless v6uql4v;ent into that
individual property, you would have to
registration.
We don't share data or the datab
That is not available to us.
duplicity.
wish it didl
That duplicity does
but it is not availab
flat file or whatever the
CHAIRMAN TA
have.
MR. FRENC
I heard, and I
get that numb
imm
same.
1hin the
e State of Florida.
talked about the
,�between the agencies. I
either -- other than, perhaps, in
cant would offer us.
o at 1:00 in the morning, it's nice to
'eTre going to generate that number, and what
corrected, was the amount of time it takes to
NER LoCASTRO:
You said it generates
It's immediate, and it is unique.
It's not the
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: The second thing I had was
the second speaker took exception to the term "vacation," that it's
really "all rentals." What is your comment to that?
MR. FRENCH: I totally appreciate Mr. Estes. I'm glad that he
didn't say anything bad about Growth Management. So, no. Listen,
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November 9, 2021
the state defines it. The state will define what that is, and all
I'll -- again, we've worked very close with Mr. Estes and Poinciana as
well as a number of these communities, so weire appreciative of their
input, but we're really relying on state statute.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Got it. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay. Are we all satisfied here?
Do I hear a motion? Commissioner McDaniel.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I'll make a in tl r
approval with -- and I think, if it's okay, we'll add —4 '1 add the
specifics with regard to 509 in there that was mer eiNoe for the
h "1411
definition purposes.
MR. KLATZKOW: We'll add the I a I will email each
of you a copy of it.
back.
If for some reason
COMMISSIONER McD
motion.
MR. KLATZKOW:
CHAIRMAN TA
COMMISSIO
CHAIRMAN
All those in favolple,
11
cOmm' N
COMW &
C
CO
ect to it, we'll bring it
I'll make the
hk, we'll just implement it.
o I hear a second?
Motion on the floor and a second.
�N aye.
ER SOLIS: Aye.
NER LoCASTRO:
TAN TAYLOR: Aye.
SSIONER SAUNDERS:
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL:
Aye.
Aye.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Those opposed, like sign.
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you. And thank you very
much for your patience.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: And cooperation. It's been
Page 125
November 9, 2021
mentioned multiple times in the industry, the folks -- there was a
whole bunch of people running for the cliff to jump off that didn't,
and you folks were really assistful in communicating the message.
MR. FRENCH: Very quickly, just thank you to Jeff. He's
been -- you know, not only is he a good colleague, but he's been very,
very helpful through this process, so we're appreciative of his office.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: There you go.
MR. ISACKSON: Thank you, Commissioners *A
I believe the Mosquito Control folks are in the,44
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay. So let's 43441N
Control.
MR. ISACKSON: We'll wait for
we'll have him introduce the item.
MR. MULLINS:
And, John
Communications, Government,
this introduction slowly as they
At your last board meeliCg
District update on their
legislative sponsor foj�
full legislative dele
.ga
motion carried
adopted in Juli
Mr. Lynn 94CL
wish to 2r%00
initiative'
osquito
to come up, and
director of
ic Affairs. And I will read
'Morning up the elevator.
5u heard a Mosquito Control
Knds outreach and efforts to obtain a
al bill which would be presented to the
t their hearing on December 8th.
B
Vloo'usly to further consider the resolution you
�,upport of the district boundary expansion, and
I
staff are available to facilitate any discussion you
on the resolution and the district's expansion
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay. And so Mr. Lynn is not in the
room yet.
MR. MULLINS: They were coming up the elevator.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Do we have any questions for
Mr. Lynn at this point, or do we want to hear from the speakers?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Speakers.
Page 126
November 9, 2021
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Like to hear from the speakers.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I actually have questions for
the Mosquito Control District that I think can maybe help us a lot,
and there they are.
MR. LYNN: Hello, Commissioners. For the record, Patrick
Lynn, executive director, Collier Mosquito Control District.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I think we have a questio fo you.
MR. LYNN: Fire away.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner Mc e .
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: The I OM 0- ot view, does
the Mosquito Control have legislative sponso is proposal?
MR. LYNN: To the best of my kno we do. It is
subject to a referendum, but to the best rd o nowledge, yes, we're
still working with our representativy*�T ahassee on that.
COMMISSIONER McDANI X-)So do we require Senate and
House sponsorship for a propo, as this, or can this be done on
a local bill?
COMMISSIONER ERS: I think just a local House
sponsor, I think, is all d.
COMMISSIO cDANIEL: So with that, my question to
you -- and this iii *IkEmy thoughts. Without -- without seeing the
language on t rendum, without seeing the referendum and the
response t c es from the electorate, I'm hesitant -- ostensibly,
I'm in fkvrNV he approval of the boundary expansion, but I -- with
this new Wormation, I'm hesitant in continuing on with that support
until we actually go through the -- until we actually go through the
process of having -- seeing that language that's going to go on the
referendum and ultimately the legislation that's being proposed.
MR. LYNN: Well, I would ask counsel if he could address that
for us. This is Mr. Owens.
MR. OWENS: Thank you. Bill Owens, counsel for the
Page 127
November 9, 2021
district.
I would -- and I know this term's been used too much, but I
would say that's the cart before the horse. Under Florida Statute
388 it requires the district to obtain approval from this Board of
County Commissioners before proceeding to the legislature to pass
an amendment to the act that created the Mosquito Control District.
So it would be tough for you to review the legislatwid b ore you
approve -- or I should say the resolution's already in e!! at you
passed. So we would need that, according to Cha of Florida
Statutes, to go to the legislature.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Do e a drafted bill?
MR. OWENS: We have a rough dr a ill, correct.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: o you just provide that?
MR. OWENS: Absolutely. efre not saying we can't
provide a draft bill, but --
COMMISSIONER SA That will have the language
he's looking for.
MR. OWENS: Ye d I almost -- I guess I interpreted
your comment as sayi hould wait until the actual bill is in
place or has been ttwo h he process with the legislature, so I
apologize if I rn your comment.
COMMI ER McDANIEL: No, you didn't misinterpret
my Comm cause my thoughts were without a specific
c w
rl 7
sponsor - ause what I'm told is is that the sponsor wants a
r u jrsu
t f
c
referend first before they come forward with the legislation, and
so --
MR. OWENS: And I could just add a little color to that. My
understanding is the representative would be supportive of it if the
local bill included a condition that after the legislature passes the
local bill I it's still subject to and conditioned upon approval by a
referendum vote of the qualified electors. So it would go through
Page 128
November 9, 2021
the legislative process approved by the legislature as an amendment
to our special act, and then it goes to a referendum vote of the
qualifying electors.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: So you're asking Collier County to
overturn a state decision?
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: No.
MR. OWENS: No.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: What if they vote no?
MR. OWENS: Then the act would never g2o 1 e ect.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: That's what I'm s 1 You're
asking Collier County to rule on whether or state act is valid
in Collier County.
MR. OWENS: I would look at it -�41 rent way. We're
basically letting the legislature appr i rough its procedures, and
then it goes to the public to either t it or not support it.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: issioner Solis.
COMMISSIONER SO nd so it's -- so the amendment
would be contingent upo
contingent upon a ref
MR. OWENS:., -4-.
COMMIS
support the el
fact, okay.,,n
I effectiveness of it would be
SOLIS: So there's no support for it just to
It's contingent upon a referendum after the
SoA%(N'-- here's my question -- and I've tried to boil this down
to the rnMessential difference from what I hear everybody talking
about, because it seems to me to be a chicken -and -the -egg issue, and
that is, operationally, what is the difference between what the district
can do and wants to do if some conservation lands are within the
boundary of the district and there's an Arthropod Management Plan
and what the district can and wants to do if those lands are actually
within -- are not within the boundary and there's an Arthropod
Page 129
November 9, 2021
Management Plan?
I'm trying to figure out what is -- what's the -- what's the big
deal? I mean, what is the difference between there being an
arthropod plan and it being within the boundary of the district as
opposed to there being an arthropod plan and not being within the
district? Can somebody explain what the difference is?
MR. OWENS: I can --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Because I've heard lis �*e of it,
and I'd like to hear your side of it.
MR. OWENS: Sure. Just as Collier Coun s certain police
power, zoning rights, and controls within its p ical boundaries,
you cannot exceed those boundaries unles ter into and get
agreement by an unincorporated area an 1 own and negotiate.
That other unincorporated area can s?y we're not interested.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS:
MR. OWENS: We are i me analogous situation. We
already are aware of the op 1 of certain stakeholders, and we
just want a seat at the tab able to sit down and negotiate an
Arthropod Control PI we talked about at the last meeting,
there's a statuto a d atory framework that protects public land
managers in thaZA tiation process. But if they're not within our
district, then e no legal right to require another party outside
of our dist,q** hdaries to enter into an Arthropod Control Plan.
They c y say no.
MR. ATZKOW: You can't require it, but you can get into
it. If there's -- if both parties want it, you can get into it.
MR. OWENS: You can't require them to enter into an
agreement. But if they voluntarily enter into an agreement with us,
then we can obtain access.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Okay. On the other hand, if
they're within the district boundary, then you can require a
Page 130
November 9, 2021
mediation/arbitration under some -- there's some process for
eventually somebody deciding here's an Arthropod Management
Plan.
MR. OWENS: Correct. And the way we look at it is it
requires all parties to come to the table and negotiate an agreement,
or a third -party state agency is that arbitrator and makes the decision.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: And who's the third-Dativ
h
arbitrator? Who's -- who makes up -- who makes t4ht on?
MR. OWENS: It is an office within the state etyment.
don't have the exact name, so I don't want to mis e
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I'm iust cu� i 9don't know.
MR. LYNN: It's the Florida Coo
Mosquito Control.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS:
MR. OWENS: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER SOLI&C
difference --
MR. OWENS:
COMMISSIO
don't want to -- wh
as opposed to
MR. O)�
CO
district b
uncil and
So that's -- that's the
-- is whether or not you can -- I
I
oTnot you can, essentially, force the process
V
able to force the process if they don't agree?
N Exactly. We have no --
Tr5NER SOLIS: Okay.
: -- legal right to require any party outside our
es to enter into an agreement with us.
Okay.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS:
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I just want to make sure I
understand this correctly. Under your charter or your governing
ordinances, you're required -- in order to expand your boundary, you
have to get approval from the County Commission. So you can't go
Page 131
November 9, 2021
to a special act, have a referendum without the County Commission
agreeing to the boundary expansion; is that correct?
MR. OWENS: We have decided to follow Chapter 388, which
does have the process start with this board. Although, I imagine
under preemption, the state legislature could probably just go ahead
and change the enabling act of the district, although we obviously
would prefer to work through the normal process.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I would agr% gislature
could probably make whatever changes they desire �44ie��
And, Commissioner McDaniel, you may ha me comfort
because there's a referendum, but I would gu in the history of
the world, mosquitoes have never won a r in. So we really
do need to make the substantive decisior*Qy t er we want to support
the boundary expansion and not si Y, 'S well, there's going to be
c use I think you sort of
a referendum, let the public decid M6
guaranteed what that outcome e.
COMMISSIONER M L: Well, thank you. I
appreciate that. I just -- ing to figure out whether we were
the cart or the horse. I was in the process. I said -- from the
beginning I've oste 1 een in favor of the expansion, and that is
the path that the uito Control District has chosen to seek
approval of th t ansion from us, and then the legislation is
prepared a b ght forward and then enacted after a referendum.
So that ere I was going. I understood it that the legislation
wasn't go to actually be proposed until after the referendum was in
place.
MR. OWENS: No, but -- it's the opposite, correct.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Gotcha. So I'm okay.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: I have some questions for
you, but I want to hear from the speakers first, so we can also bring
you back.
Page 132
November 9, 2021
MR. OWENS: Okay. Sure. Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Madam Chair, we have four registered speakers
here in the room, one online. Our first speaker -- actually, it's
speakers. Meredith Budd, Brad Cornell, and Shawn Clem would all
like to pool their time, not cede; they'd all like to appear at this
podium and kind of rotate their speech. They would have a total of
nine minutes. They would be followed by, wow, Keith a onen.
I hope I'm saying that correctly.
MS. BUDD: Troy is the presentation --
MR. MILLER: I'm getting to it right now, ith.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Use two pod*
MS. BUDD: Is there a way to toggl etween the slides?
MR. MILLER: Yeah. It should arrow and back
arrow. I hope. I think so.
MS. BUDD: Got it. Than
Meredith Budd on behalf lorida Wildlife Federation.
The Florida Wildlife F n maintains the same position that
we have had on this sinc first brought before you -all over the
summer. It has been at the Mosquito Control District doesn't
have the ability to e t outside of their boundary, and I want to
point out their o . ns in Ave Maria. They have an interlocal
agreement c�r not within the boundary, and they're able to
operate ( u o heir boundary with that agreement in place.
Al n we're looking at the implementing statute, Florida
Statute 3 111, you can see the highlighted words in red. Any
public land owned by the state or any political subdivision thereof
where arthropods are, essentially, may be subject to control measures.
That does not necessitate that the land has to be within the boundary
in order to create plans and have those treatments and research in
place.
Also, they do have an active Arthropod Control Plan in
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November 9, 2021
Picayune Strand State Forest, and I affirmed that this plan is, in fact,
valid. I have spoken directly with Mara Clark, the program lead at
Mosquito Control for FDACS, who has confirmed that the existing
plan is not only signed by both Forestry and the Mosquito Control,
which makes it valid, but it also -- she has a copy with her in her
office, which means that it has, in fact, been submitted and filed with
FDACS.
While all the parties agree that that control plan �a ertainly
modified to be made better, it is valid, and the Mos!!Ak ontrol
District has authority to go in and operate in acco da ce with that
plan, while it is not in the boundary, of cours ntly; however,
according to the Florida Code 5E-1342, N cifically, you'll see
that inclusion in the boundary actually s s public lands to the
Mosquito Control District's general )*�,r Tan. You can see in the
language here that until the plan - V
, Xropod Control Plan is in
place or if that plan happens to -- again, this is in perpetuity,
forever, inclusion within th o ary -- then public lands are, in
fact, subject to the gener plan, which could include naled,
which we all know h ffects on pollinator species.
So, again, in t s ce of a control plan, Ten Thousand
Islands, Rooke ollier Seminole, they don't have control lands
currently. A as that boundary's expanded, they will be subject,
according to the general work plan.
F portive of the expansion into the urban and
soon -to- rban areas. We simply just don't think it's appropriate to
include the state and federal lands. So we do ask you to revise your
resolution to support expansion but exclude those state and federal
lands that are on the periphery of the county.
MR. CORNELL: And, Commissioners, I'm Brad Cornell. I'm
here on behalf of Audubon Florida and Audubon Western Everglades
and Audubon Florida's Corkscrew Swamp Sanctuary. And I want to
Page 134
November 9, 2021
emphasize that there is no boundary expansion that is necessary to
assure creating those strong science -based Arthropod Control Plans
or Management Plans. That's kind of synonymous.
And it's not necessary to have a boundary expansion in order to
do robust research and monitoring of viruses. And that's, again,
based on state statutes in Section 388. And as you heard, there
already are Arthropod Management Plans in existence o114 ic yune
. kic�
Strand State Forest, and there are also two research p nV4;KIt
Collier- Seminole State Park that were issued thi � Dhat are in
s s�
force for the Mosquito Control District to do rese rc t ere, and
there's no -- that's not in the boundary. So it' at we can
accomplish public health and mosquito co a needed in these
public lands, public conservation lands, ut expanding the
boundary.
I also want to point out that t as a workshop recently by
Dr. Durland Fish that was orga y Dr. Mike Duever, and that
five -hour workshop was att y many agency staff and
conservation groups and and in it we learned that one of
the important things o rvation lands is that the Mosquito
Control District an e efforts need to focus on viruses and disease
that would infec ns, not on mosquito control necessarily, and
that's because ul o control -- just getting rid of mosquitoes for
that pu o icts with restoration work, including millions of tax
dollars e been invested in exotic plant biocontrols. These are
friendly 1 cts that have been brought in by the agencies to control
Melaleuca and Brazilian pepper. These insects that are beneficial
have been released in these restoration lands, and mosquito control
conflicts with maintaining those populations of beneficial insects.
So that's an important principle that -- one of the many reasons that
mosquito control work plans in general conflict with conservation
lands, but research and reconnaissance can be done.
Page 135
November 9, 2021
Now, I'd like -- on that question of science, I've like to have my
colleague, Dr. Shawn Clem, just briefly some of the issues
concerning what studies say about the impacts of mosquito control on
ecological environments.
DR. CLEM: Thank you, Madam Chair and Commissioners.
I'm Shawn Clem. I'm the research director at Audubon's Corkscrew
Swamp Sanctuary. I work for Audubon Florida. I havo4�cvs
�r 20
years ecological research experience in the Everglade a,
U7 n
expert in Everglades food of ecology, particularly 1 ic systems.
We're spending billions of dollars and so rn y f us, our
careers, restoring the Everglades and focusin nservation and
restoration of the public lands in our regio .
And this project is so big and so i t that the world is
watching us. Mosquito control metpo��)s get the species at the
base of our food web. While res the food web impacts of
mosquito control are pretty spa er studies in the Everglades
have demonstrated food we ts on higher trophic levels due to
changes in aquatic invert ommunities.
Impacts at the ba is food web will trickle up through the
food web. Reduc!Fg o , which is energy available at the base of
the food web, wX ITNit populations of higher trophic levels. We're
talking ab t i.11 s I I I
ou ; Nl like fish, wading birds, and alligators.
S
As -1 - 71, I'm also concerned that our focus is broadscale
11 Act::Y
(.-,ontrol<Nvagement of mosquitoes rather than focus on those that
are diseaNIvectors. We really need to advance the science and
really work to better understand, detect, and target the disease
vectors, not just all mosquitoes.
Finally, I'm also very concerned about the impacts of nontarget
organisms. Numerous studies have documented impacts of BTI on
nontarget dipterans. Further, naled is linked to the decline of South
Florida's bees and native butterflies, which are both critical
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November 9, 2021
pollinators for our native plants. We need to see data to justify that
this application is appropriate and safe on our conservation lands.
In summary, the threat to human health is real. I shared at a
previous meeting that I know and understand the reality of
mosquito -borne disease, and it's something my family deals with on a
daily basis, but there's a clear difference between managing disease
vector mosquitoes in developed areas and managing mos it es on
conservation lands.
MR. CORNELL: To conclude, I just want to arize what
we believe, Audubon and Florida Wildlife Feder io believe, are an
appropriate alternate to expanding the bound s we said, it is
very important for public health and safet x and the Mosquito
Control District boundary to include nev*X n areas and we support
to I
that. That's not what we're talking u re. Regarding how we
� � 0,1 V ti
deal with public health questions u lic conservation lands and
restoration lands, the alternativ;&NP�e are advocating is the creation
collaboratively of Arthropo gement Plans between the
agencies that have told want to do that. They are willing.
They are voluntarily s ng that they collaborate; and then also
the use of permits 1* e e already in existence for research
reconnaissance re disease vectors are, where the viruses are in
these consery i ands. That accomplishes the public health and
safety that equire and also protects the public in urban areas.
So that' ggestion to you -all.
Plea consider that, and thank you very much.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you.
Commissioner Solis, did you have a question?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: No, just after the speakers.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay.
MR. MILLER: Your next speaker is Keith Laakkonen,
followed online by Michael Duever. I hope I'm getting close on the
Page 137
November 9, 2021
last name, sir.
MR. LAAKKONEN: You nailed it. Thank you.
My name is Keith Laakkonen. I'm the program administrator
for the Florida Department of Environmental Protection, Rookery
Bay National Estuarine Research Reserve.
One thing I want to point out is that Rookery Bay manages
110,000 acres in Collier County. We actually manage 4(�Vejcent of
this county's shoreline. Sothis is a significant biolo ic rNfilportant
and environmentally sensitive area.
Rookery Bay, research is in our name, and i e of the reasons
why we exist. We actually get funding fro and from the
Florida Department of Environmental Pro n o fund
collaborative research within the resery have a long history of
doing collaborative research, includig �$Collier County Mosquito
Control where, going back in the 144� s and early 2000s, we
worked very closely with Fran ssen, and you can actually go
into the Environmental Lea n enter, and we have a nice display
on it. We actually talke the kind of collaborative research we
did which actually im control of mosquitoes, reduced negative
impact, and reduce 611 ts of spraying pesticides in these areas.
So I Just w point out that all of this happened without the
need for a bo .9; expansion or Arthropod Control Plan. As
C""
recentl as,&�s ring, we were working with Dr. Keira Lucas with
y !iP�r
Mosquikleyplrol and Dr. Brita Jessen with Rookery Bay to work a
collabora'We grant project. So these things definitely happen
without the need for any boundary expansion or any Arthropod
Control plan.
So if you have any other questions, I'd be willing to answer
them; otherwise, I just wanted to point that out. And of course,
yeah, we are not in favor of being in the boundary. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I see no questions at this time.
Page 138
November 9, 2021
Thank you.
MR. MILLER: Madam Chair, your final speaker is online,
Michael Duever.
Michael, you're being prompted to unmute yourself, if you'll do
so at this time. Michael, you're being prompted to unmute yourself,
if you could do so at this time.
(No response.)
MR. MILLER: I don't see him unmuting. SoAh t
we -- I'll keep an eye on this. We'll try to commu e ith him
off-line.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I wa ng, I have Mike's
phone number. I'm going to try to call hi lives in the
Sanctuary, and, like me, gets his Interne r od, so he might be a
minute behind.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: 0 ommissioner Solis, we'll
start with you.
COMMISSIONER SO eah. I mean, this has been quite
a rollercoaster, I know, body, and when I first got involved
with this issue, you k impression was was that, you know,
everybody was kin
,�,o n he same page, certainly in terms of the
other agencies aX N land management entities.
And , yo now it appears to me that there's
significarit there's absolute opposition from all of the land
manage ntities. I had a Zoom call with everybody on one call
rc lel
i
just so I Id hear it all together as opposed to piecemeal, and it
seems very uniform in the opposition from the land managers, the
conservation land managers, to be included within the district, and I
don't feel comfortable -- if the land managers aren't on board with
this, I don't know how I can be on board with it. I know that's
probably not what the district wants to hear, but I was under the
impression that there was some consensus.
Page 139
November 9, 2021
So if what's being proposed is a bill that's subject to a
referendum, I mean, I think it's just an adjustment of what the new
boundary of the district would be. If the referendum passes, it
doesn't seem like that would require starting over. Commissioner
Saunders, I don't know if you would know better. I mean, is that just
something that -- the legal description of the boundaries could be
changed to exclude these conservation lands, and it couI64,ust move
forward?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I would assu�le would
-Ilk
assume.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I mean, I upport it, but I
can't support -- if the basin -- Big Cypress here, they're not
supportive, if Rookery Bay's not suppo * e, n't feel comfortable
supporting it. I mean, it seems like is e right hand fighting the
left hand, and they have to work t and come up with a plan.
And it seems to me that c atin ation where one can force the
issue, I don't feel comfort s orting that anymore, and I'm sorry,
because I know I did bef
CHAIRMAN T Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIO UNDERS: I agree with Commissioner
Solis. At the la t . g, I read a little paragraph. I'm going to
read one from ater Management District and Big Cypress
9 ell
Basin ( nd * c udes with, the South Florida Water Management
District e Big Cypress Basin respectfully requests that the
Collier ty Board of Commissioners not support the expansion of
the boundary into the Picayune Strand restoration project at this time.
And they remain committed to working with the Mosquito Control
District on these management plans.
I don't see how we can support a referendum, which I think,
quite frankly, as I said before, will pass, because no one's going to
vote to not expand a boundary when it involves eradication of
Page 140
November 9, 2021
mosquitoes. So we have to get to the substance of it, and I think the
substance of it is that these environmentally sensitive lands, where
there's a lot of research going on and a lot of
environmentally -- environmental preservation efforts going on, that
we not move too quickly. And I don't see any reason why we
couldn't delay this until the 2023 legislative session instead of the
2022 legislative session. I don't know what the urgency o Id be;
give everybody the opportunity to work out manage S.
So I agree with Commissioner Solis; I can't su is even
though we did support it initially. Quite frankl di n't have all
the information.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissi L Castro.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: r. ynn, I have a question
for you. The last time you were he a stion that we asked
several times, and I think your an as, no, it can't be done. But
I don't understand why we can' - ade the environmentally
protected lands, keep the ur s shaded, and move forward. I
understand what Commi aunders is saying, but the reason
that makes me not su of waiting is we're penalizing all the
residential areas th d he spray now.
And so, yo V , what I want to support is the boundary being
expanded in t s rban areas but not being shaded in the -- in the
environme I rotected areas. And I don't know why we have to
wait till o do that unless you tell -- I want you to explain to me
why we Idn't wait. I mean it just seems like we just need to get
an eraser. And I don't mean to oversimplify it. But I mean, are we
so far down the road that it's either all or nothing right now?
MR. LYNN: I'd just like to say a couple of things about that.
The first is that that it is my understanding, and it is news to me
that FDACS would recognize an Arthropod Management Plan for
Picayune. We have never engaged with Picayune other than they
Page 141
November 9, 2021
were contacted by Department of Environmental Protection after
Zika to go get a plan. They came to us. That is appropriate per
5E- 13.
Second is if we cut these areas out, we are -- we have an awful
lot to do right now. We're still under a mosquito -borne-illness alert.
I'm astonished at where we are right now, to be frank. I have
letters of support that I brought personally today from th e artment
of Health, from the Eastern Collier Property Owners, �rr r. Bob
Peterson of the American Entomological Society, at4,�hPCDC.
We are not going to spray in these areas. e control
ar
products that are well established that are mi mpactful to the
food web. It's -- if you -- if we stand a i e out this two years
nd
hence, there's two years' worth of data t won'thave. 5E-13
gives us a timeline to engage in an 4gqhr d Management Plan.
Yes, the only option we have is t�oj�( N),c
,.Pthe hand of the land
managers and, to my knowled Cypress Basin is not the land
manager for Picayune. To wledge, the representatives from
the NGOs have no mana authority over these areas.
We are here to p blic health, public comfort, value of
real estate, the valu 0 0 rism because, trust me, when you see a
child with encep on a ventilator in the emergency department
because We di o what we knew we should be doing, gathering
the data, S, i controlling mosquitoes at their larval stage, not
negativ acting the environment -- it's all there in our mission,
in our vis Icannot I in good conscience, take an eraser and cut
these areas out. Humanity continues to encroach on these protected
areas, and these protected areas continue to demonstrate year after
year evidence of disease from mosquitoes. So that's the shortest
answer I can give you.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: That's not what I asked you.
I didn't ask you if in good conscience you felt comfortable cutting
Page 142
November 9, 2021
those out. I just said, if you cut out the environmental areas, is that a
possibility --
MR. LYNN: No.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: -- if we directed it. Why
not?
MR. LYNN: Because I know better.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: No, but that's not t at's not
an answer. I mean, I'm not asking you your opinion *-f sv6uant to
cut those out or not. I already know that opinion. king you if
it was the will of the commissioners here to say, o orward with
the urban areas but not with the environment ected areas,
would you be able to do that and stay on i eline regardless if
you like that or not?
MR. LYNN: No.
COMMISSIONER LoCAST Why?
MR. LYNN: And the an �*because I have to take it back
to my board. I don't posse wer to change the form that
this
COMMISSION ASTRO: And that would put us off
timeline to be able i
MR. Lya r next meeting's on the 18th, and we have a
meeting ith tjae " islative delegation on the 8th of December.
CO NER LoCASTRO: No, but for something this
importa dn't the meeting on the 18th happen sooner?
MR. I would have to defer to counsel to set a special
meeting for our board of commissioners. But my recommendation
to them would be to not forego this, because we will have the same
discussion.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Well, my position is -- and if
weire sort of giving a peek under the tent -- is that I just don't think
we should penalize all those urban residential areas that are
Page 143
November 9, 2021
applauding that they're finally going to be, you know, shaded and in
the district, and then because we're having this debate over the
environmental areas, welre going to kick the whole thing, you know,
more than a year down the road and not do anything and basically,
you know, penalize them.
MR. LYNN: Well, it's my understanding that you had
recommended that we establish Arthropod Managerne t with
these control -- or with these management agencies; i �t,17yru true.?
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Yes. Wel t Was
the -- forgive me. I didn't mean to speak over y VA.,
00
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: No, it 6 e.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: T a the rationale for
receiving the approval for the expansio use it allowed for a
mechanism for forced discussion wi re to the Arthropod
Management Plans.
MR. LYNN: Right. To u just a very brief -- extremely
brief, to the best of my abili - forgive me for trying to think on
my feet here.
The -- we recentl meeting with the folks from Big
Cypress. We gavS4 e same presentation that we give
everyone. We them through 5E-13. Weansweredthe
questions. W follow-up emails. We answered those questions.
Then we s er that says we cannot support this because 2,
3 degre paration, folks on the East Coast who are South
Florida -- South Florida Water Management District say, I need to
see the data. I need to approve this.
We're talking about an issue that is here within Collier. There
are plenty of precedents of areas, of districts within the state that have
public lands within the district and Arthropod Management Plans.
It's not rocket science. And I assure you that 5E-13 is the only thing
that I have as the executive director to carry out the mandate from our
Page 144
November 9, 2021
board of commissioners who unanimously voted to expand the
district boundaries per the recommendations of our caring and
professional staff at Mosquito Control who's trying to protect public
health and comfort.
That's as simple as I can make it. And mosquitoes will not pay
attention to a sign planted in the ground on the west side of the
Picayune that says do not pass here and don't go and bite pone.
We're getting too close to a public health crisis.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner Mc24e.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I have a
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: May I --
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: t esting request.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I also d you would just defer
to the Chair. I think Forestry's here
COMMISSIONER McDANI eah, I was just going to --
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: ir supervision of the Picayune,
I'd like to understand exactl exactly is going on in the
Picayune, please. Aq�y
COMMISSION ANIEL: I'm not deferring to the
Chair. That'�s wha s going to ask you, if it's okay to bring
Shawn up.
CHAIRN� TAYLOR: Oh, you know him by first -- I didn't
know.
CQkVWSIONER McDANIEL: Yes, Mr. Allen.
MR'VLLEN: Good afternoon, Commissioners thank you.
I'm Shawn Allen. I'm the manager for our Caloosahatchee Forestry
Center, the Florida Forest Service which covers Lee, Collier, and
Hendry Counties.
In regards to the Arthropod Control Plan, that is correct; yes, we
do have one. We are the primary land management agency for
Picayune Strand State Forest. It is land managed under the board of
Page 145
November 9, 2021
trustees of the State of Florida. This is also the site of the Picayune
Strand restoration project, which is a large -- very large federally
funded restoration project that's been underway for the better part of a
decade.
That Arthropod Control Plan was put together in 2017, as
mentioned before, and it is a part of our I 0-year land management
plan. That plan just underwent a rewrite and has been r b itted
and has gone through the Acquisition and Restoration il with
the State of Florida. So it is the approved I 0-year anagement
plan that went into effect in 2019, so from '19 un 1 2 , and that
Arthropod Control Plan is in there.
We did not update it since 2017. W n no need to do so.
And we had a large portion of public co t that was available for
not just the public but also other rep en ives who have interests in
Picayune Strand State Forest.
Nobody had mentioned th ropod Control Plan. It was in
there, it passed, and it went o That plan does allow for the
research. It allows for s be done, which there can be
additional studies bro ard. Anybody that wants to can
submit a request th u ur state ecologists in Tallahassee. We can
issue a letter of . zation for anybody to do any kind of research
on the state s It's no big deal.
The ot* roved action in that plan is for -- the application of
larvicid pproved within that Arthropod Control Plan.
So pe that answers your questions and, again, if you have
any more, please feel free.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Stay right here. I think we do.
Commissioner McDaniel.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I wanted to hear from him
with regard to that --
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay.
Page 146
November 9, 2021
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL:
-- because it was represented
that that plan was there, and I --
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: No questions?
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: No, no. That was perfect.
Thank you.
MR. ALLEN: You're welcome.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner Saunders,Nny,
questions?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I don't hav stion. I
was going to make a comment when he was fini
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay. So y have a
question. You are the -- you're the mana nfyentity. So you are
the land manager for Picayune Strand?
MR. ALLEN: That is correct.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: 0 nd that there are -- South
Florida Water Management's i U.S. Army Corps of
Engineers involved, U.S. D nt of Interior/U.S. Fish and
Wildlife are involved. T iculture Commission is involved
with Picayune, is that
Research A
MR. ALLE2�:Nh-huh.
CHAIRNL�k'TAYLOR:
Wildlife avviel
�-Ts Forestry?
M N: Yes.
U.S. Department of Agriculture's
-- all right -- and Florida Fish and
TAYLOR: I would say this represents the United
States of America in Picayune Strand.
MR. ALLEN: In a nutshell, yes, ma'am. We do have a lot of
concerned parties. And, again, this is a very large restoration
project, and it is important that we all work together on this. And
being that there are some concerns, I understand those concerns, and
I appreciate those concerns, and I definitely agree they should be
Page 147
November 9, 2021
taken into consideration.
But just to reiterate, you know, the expansion of that boundary is
not going to change whether or not Mosquito Control can do
anything within Picayune Strand State Forest; they can. That
Arthropod Control Plan allows for that --
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you.
MR. ALLEN: just to clarify.
th
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay. And it says -- a is is a
letter from Jennifer Smith, who's chief of staff fronA ut�h Florida
Water Management District. It's a letter that we I eceived this
week. And in it she states that there are $ 1 0,4'QZn in investments
as well as the 600 million restoration effo!�ONU there's 10 million
in investments in the research, developnjQTN,and testing of all natural
biocontrol agents that reduce harmf*pv)p�e species that impact the
ecosystem restoration efforts. So there's a lot going on in
the Picayune.
MR. ALLEN: Yes,
CHAIRMAN TAY here's a lot. Any other questions?
Commissioner S ?
Thank you Ve c .
MR. ALLEm ou're welcome.
COMMI ER SAUNDERS: I'm going to make a
suggestio uestion for you, sir.
M N: Okay, thank you.
CO ISSIONER SAUNDERS: I'm kind of sitting here
trying to find out how I can get to yes on the request. And I've
listened to Commissioner LoCastro, and I think he's hit on the
solution and that is that this board approves the expansion of the
boundary into the urbanized areas like Ave Maria. I don't know if
there's another area that we can identify, but we're not supportive of
expanding the boundary into the preserves. And we may need to list
WE=
November 9, 2021
those, but I think we can do that fairly quickly and show some
support but at the same time show some restraint in terms of these
preserve areas.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: That would be my motion
word for word.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Point of order. Do we have to
'der what was done before as it was a resolut*on?
reconsi I n'!
'10
MR. KLATZKOW: As it stands now, you have a ution in
support of the district's application to the legislatur
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: This wo�o,,e a resolution to
replace that.
MR. KLATZKOW: This would be, s , repeal and replace.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: So can y1pu rk that into your
motion that we repeal what was pass
,od AfTre?
'A
COMMISSIONER SAUNDE4&.4)1 think Commissioner
LoCastro made the motion, butjQ7,M1d second that if that's --
v,
COMMISSIONER Lo RO: Absolutely. I mean, like you
r
said, that would be prope dure, and then whatever Mosquito
0
9
Control District has t Fwe all agreed or it passed, they would
have to -- they'd ha 611 V6 it.
COMMISSJ��ER SAUNDERS: Now, do we need to list the
preserves so wQ'rN'plear, or what kind of language would we need to
make it c le t we're supporting the boundary expansion into the
areas th nder development?
MR. ATZKOW: Well just for my clarity, by preserves
we're talking about all the state-owned land?
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Public land.
MR. KLATZKOW: Okay. We're talking about the federal
land, all right. Are we talking about the Conservation Collier land?
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: No.
MR. KLATZKOW: So we're not talking about the
Page 149
November 9, 2021
county -- the county land. So we're limited, then, to the state-owned
public land and the federally owned public land.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: State and federal.
MR. KLATZKOW: That's your resolution.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: And if we --
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Go ahead.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: If we did that, th w uld
include the to -be -developed lands. We just approve t wn of
Big Cypress in between Golden Gate Estates and A ia, and we
know there are several rural village applications t a re coming
northeast that would include them in that are
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Yep. S
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: a O!just
preclude -- exclude the state and fedp;qll eld lands.
VC
MR. KLATZKOW: If you Neve me about a half hour, I
could redo your resolution and . t back, because I know they
have a timing issue with the re.
COMMISSIONER ERS: I bet we'll be here at least
another half hour.
CHAIRMAN L R: You think?
�A6'
MR. KLATI Let me direct my staff to get that done.
�A
CHAIR�4A TAYLOR: And if our environmental folks have
any conce a o t the wording here, I would --
M V
ZKOW: I will distribute copies to everybody.
CH MAN TAYLOR: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Can I --
MR. KLATZKOW: If you'll excuse me for a few minutes.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I'd like to bring Mosquito
Control -- because I have a question for Patrick that's similar to what
Commissioner LoCastro said.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay.
Page 150
November 9, 2021
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: So you hear which way we're
going, Patrick?
MR. LYNN: Yes, I do.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Okay. Is this within the
bounds of the time frames that you have with your board and making
the necessary boundary adjustments with your board for the 18th and
then meeting with the legislature in early December?
MR. LYNN: The short answer is I don't know. ry.
V
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Okay.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay. So I thin�oat we'll do is
continue this until -- about a half an hour and ue with the
meeting. So we'll put everything -- this I r discussion will
come after the next discussion, whateve scussion is.
P, . 1 fta
MR. ISACKSON: CommissioAae�rs, I can, I'd like to hold on
the AUIR discussion for a bit and AQ Diht to 10, Board of County
Commissioner items, which is that's okay with the Board.
CHAIRMAN TAYLO yeah.
I
Item #I OA A�
AMENDING P$� CE 2008-68 ESTABLISHING
D 14N G AN
_I
AMPLIFIED D PERMIT REQUIREMENTS AND
PENALT UNINCORPORATED COLLIER COUNTY -
BRIN FOR FURTHER DISCUSSION AND BOARD
DIRECTI N — CONSENSUS
MR. ISACKSON: I believe this was a Commissioner Taylor's
sponsored item. Recommendation to amend Ordinance No. 2008-68
establishing amplified sound permit requirements and penalties in the
unincorporated area.
Page 151
November 9, 2021
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: And, again, this is really to get a
consensus from my colleagues that we can go a little bit further into
the issue of amplified sound and outdoor entertainment permits and
conditions using the State of Florida to allow staff to do the research,
not to do anything more than do the research and bring back their
recommendations to this board. I don't want to go any further and
expend staff time unless there is a consensus that perhaps4;Lve peed to
look at this. Obviously, I think we need to look at it, bl��ed the
consensus of my colleagues.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Yeah, I o d agree.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: A
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO:
COMMISSIONER McDANIE I don't think any
have no issue with it.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you very, very much.
So we're rolling right along r o I'll say --
MR. ISACKSON: - had five head nods on that?
CHAIRMAN T : Yes, you do.
COMMISSION WSLIS: Yes.
Item #I OB
PROVIREWjC�DIRECTION TO THE COUNTY MANAGER
REGARI)k&G PROPERTY LOCATED AT THE SOUTHEAST
CORNER OF SANTA BARBARA BLVD. AND DAVIS BLVD. —
MOTION TO ACCEPT STAFF'S RECOMMENDATIONS
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioners, Item I OB is an item
brought forth by Commissioner Saunders. It's to discuss the Davis
and Santa Barbara rock crushing activity. And I'll turn that over to
Page 152
November 9, 2021
Commissioner Saunders for commentary.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Well, I'd like for staff to go
through the current situation there, and then I've got some
recommendations. And I know representatives of the property are
here as well. But I think the Board needs to be brought up to speed
as to what's happened at that site.
MS. COOK: Good afternoon, Commissioners. Ja ie ook,
your director of Development Review.
Since the last BCC meeting on October 12th, eeting, I
informed you that staff, both Engineering Inspect and Code
Enforcement, were conducting daily site visi e property located
at the corner of Santa Barbara and Davis. re also discussing
with the state because the South Florida r Management District
Environmental Resource Permit was n �r eview for its extension.
As a result of that meeting, you is temporary moratorium on
importing material to crush on construction.
Since that meeting on v er 3rd, the South Florida Water
Management District de extension of the ERP for significant
,th
noncompliance w P onditions. In discussions with the
Water Managemen ri t, we have learned that their appeal
process is the a t as 21 days to file an appeal, but the hearing
process itself in time length, so we don't know exactly how
long it wo efore they go to hearing.
St continued to do daily site visits to the property to
ensure t he product was being done in accordance with the site
plan. Upon receiving the denial letter for the Water Management
District ERP extension, staff posted a suspension of work for the site.
Additionally, we have also determined that the lake that is on site
never actually completed their county permits. They still are
missing the performance bond and the performance agreement.
Our staff s recommendations for moving forward are that the
Page 153
November 9, 2021
applicant reinstate their South Florida Water Management District
ERP permit; that they finish the excavation permit for the on -site lake
and have that permit approved; that the applicant be required to come
into our office for another preconstruction meeting prior to
continuing the crushing operation after they have received both their
ERP as well as the approval for the excavation permit.
As a condition of that preconstruction meeting, your4 o a
torium
on importing additional crushing material would be p o d. We
1c,
would also ask for additional emphasis being place ist control,
because we are entering the dry season, and the d s 's a concern of
00
all of the neighboring residents. And, finalill as you all know,
the SDP is up -- will be expired in March 2 , and prior to
issuing them an extension to continue arw on site, we would
recommend that at least 90 percent ��t e shing has been
completed prior to an extension o t DP.
Any questions?
CHAIRMAN TAYLO nk you, Commissioner Saunders.
You have the floor.
COMMISSION DERS: Yeah, I just want to clarify.
Your recommendat* at, also based on the fact that we've
imposed a mora 1 on the importation of this type of material for
rock crushing he property owner will be required to crush what
is there, at s percent of it by March, and if it's not 90 percent
done, t not be an extension of the SDP and that no more
material 1 ermitted to be brought to the site.
MS. COOK: You are correct, sir. That is staff s
recommendation.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Right. And I have problems
with that recommendation.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay, all right.
Commissioner McDaniel.
Page 154
November 9, 2021
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Just a -- because -- did we
implement a moratorium on all importation of construction debris for
the whole county or only on this site?
MS. COOK: For the entire county.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I thought we did it for the
entire county.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: But we didn't prkibit the
importation of concrete to facilities that are set up off�
crushing. We have several recycling facilities that, pt that
material; is that correct?
MS. COOK: Correct. For
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: T 'e till --
MS. COOK: -- projects that are al*,Qa approved to do that
operation, yes, but for development 6'es, rrect.
COMMISSIONER McDANI 11� If we can have a discussion
about lifting the moratorium ex r the -- on this particular site
until these parameters are �N' r staff, because this is a normal
business practice that is elevating a site with people that
do -- that do have the ermitting.
10
COMMISSI S UNDERS: We imposed the moratorium
while the Count ager -- or County Attorney's in the process of
drafting an or . n e, so that should be fairly --
MR. KOW: You'll have the ordinance next meeting.
C IONER SAUNDERS: So we don't need to do that
u 'I we
ntil we this ordinance in place.
MR. KLATZKOW: So the moratorium's -- the moratorium's
only until the ordinance is presented to the Board. And we'll just do
one reading, given the time period.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: So in theory we could have the
reading and then lift the moratorium. We don't have to have the
second -- we'll have a second --
Page 155
November 9, 2021
MR. KLATZKOW: I'm going to bring you an advertised
ordinance, and then you can make a decision what you want to do,
and the moratorium would end, whatever you decide to do.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: There's two readings to the
ordinance.
MR. KLATZKOW: You don't need two readings. We do two
readings for various reasons, but we'll do this as one rea J2q
di g. We're
running into Christmastime and everything else and
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I had sever e calls
after our last meeting, and everybody was -- the I I spoke with
were pretty much okay with this. But, I me is site specific
I in le
with what we're endeavoring to do here be e permit issues,
t* f ]
ERP issues. I'm really concerned abou e excavation that has
already transpired outside of our perpi�tti parameters. That can be
very precarious for us. How is thA�Noc ified? How can somebody
actually dig a -- I mean, how cAq ebody dig a lake and not have a
performance bond and actu sically -- how could that happen
with us?
MS. COOK: I ctly know how it happened, but it was
an oversight by sta�f a h original preconstruction meeting. Staff
hadthoughteve Ng was approved and in place, and during this
review of this ct, we found that it wasn't done. So that would
be one of" r mmendations, that that lake be finally approved.
C IONER McDANIEL: I would rather we not -- if we
SIC
could, 11 the moratorium to this particular site, because it's the one
that's of issue, without putting a limitation on all of our contractors
and all of our property owners in Collier County that use the
construction debris as a mechanism to elevate their sites. That's
what I'm looking for. I certainly agree with this process which limits
the importation.
You keep raising your hand, so...
Page 156
November 9, 2021
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner Saunders, this is your
issue.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Well, part of the reason that
I had suggested the moratorium is that we don't want this type of
situation to evolve anywhere else in the county. It's normal process
for a property owner, if they tear down a shopping center, for
example, to crush the material there, and there's no issue i that.
And that moratorium doesn't impact that.
I wanted to make sure that we didn't have a sit where
another property owner begins to import cement r rushing the
same as occurred at this location until we hav rdinance in
place. It looks like we're going to have a in nce in place in two
to three weeks for consideration.
So I'll rather not lift that mora
That was the reason for it. I've
anyone saying, hey, we've got
saying that hasn't occurred A
i�uhtil we have that in place.
n any phone calls from
with that. And I'm not
I commissioners. I just haven't
gotten any complaints. J��JfXnow if staff has gotten any requests
for that, that youknovvX1',-
MR. FRENC n, Commissioner, for the record, Jamie
French. We ha tten some calls. It's going to -- it Just drives up
li� tior
the cost of co t ion, because now they have to take it to a
processin ci ty.
A know, not to speak ill of Mr. Cadenhead or that
business ctice but he doesn't take this for free. He charges
V I
people. He's running -- and then he processes it and makes it fill,
basically, inert materials.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I just want to make sure --
MR. FRENCH: So, yes, we have gotten calls, but nothing that
has been --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: So they're taking the
Page 157
November 9, 2021
material to existing processing facilities as opposed to taking it to
Santa Barbara and Davis?
MR. FRENCH: Or other sites that have been approved that we
provided you, the four or five sites that we know that this is actively
going on that are already approved for construction. They just
redirected that material to sites for now.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: There's more
that's in trouble. And I -- and that was my thought.
seem to have this particular piece of property un
limit the moratorium for the in -haul on this parti
permit parameters are met by staff and not ,
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: CommissiU2 S
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I just
understood what was just said. Mr..
accept this material, he's crushing
site, right? -A
MR. FRENCH: Corr:.�
is one
we
Ool and just
s " te until the
7re whole county.
is.
make sure that I
�nhead is being paid to
it's being used for fill on that
COMMISS;IONER It's not being hauled off anywhere
else for fill?
h t woul
MR. FRENC r d require a commercial excavation
0 Vj
0
permit. He's n oes not (qualify for that.
COMMI§&14'NER SOLIS: Okay. So I just wanted to make
sure of tha e., you know, this moratorium did not also include
just
rock c ust in general. It's concrete.
C 'o
C
0 ISSIONER SAUNDERS: Concrete.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I mean, this is concrete, right,
recycled concrete?
MR. FRENCH: It would be the importing of that material to be
crushed on that site.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: On that site. And there was five
other locations?
Page 158
November 9, 2021
MR. FRENCH: I believe there was four or five that I provided
to all of your aides.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Yeah. I mean, I remember the
discussion being we didn't want this to pop up anywhere else until we
had an ordinance that specifically addressed it. I mean, I agree with
Commissioner Saunders. I think if it's imminent that we're going to
get it at the next meeting, I wouldn't want there to be a sh to
create one of these things. And, frankly, I don't feel in that
we have this property under control.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I agree.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I mean, thi at, the fourth
meeting we've had on this thing?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: t st, yes, that's correct.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEI..z, don't have --
, f
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: 4,,1qe)n, I'm, frankly, tired of
having meetings about this propiC.M7.*-
CHAIRMAN TAYLO N1 would agree with Commissioner
Saunders and Commissio� is. So if there's no other discussion,
I'd like to have a moti I se.
SAU
COMMISSIO 0 NDERS: Well, I would make the
motion to accep"IK17aff recommendation that there's been a stop
41
work order issg�eN( They'll have until March to crush a minimum of
90 percento( d(Ftiaterial that's on site; there will be an additional
emphas* ust control, because we're approaching dry season; that
j(;VV'
no more terial can be imported to that site, and that the property
owner come into compliance with the issues dealing with the lake as
well as with the crushing operations.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I'll second that.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS:
you need?
MS. COOK: Yes, sir.
Page 159
Does that capture everything
November 9, 2021
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: All right. There's a motion on the
floor and a second. All those in favor, say aye.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Aye.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: The represen al��f the
property owner, I don't know if they want to speak.
CHAIRI\ AN TAYLOR: I'm sorry. Are t\e3r any speakers?
I do apologize.
MR. MILLER: I do not have -- weIL4S m double-check.
No, I do not have any speakers on this;
correct?
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR:
of -- there's a motion on the fl
say aye.
COMMISSIONER
COMMISSIO
CHAIRMAN
COMMIS
COMMI
_'O
CHA
like sign.
Thank you.
MS. COOK:
Item #1 IA
VOR: Aye.
R SAUNDERS:
R McDANIEL:
- TAYLOR:
TAYLOR:
Thank you.
our add -on item,
in the middle
All those in favor,
Those opposed, like sign.
It carries unanimously. those opposed
Page 160
November 9, 2021
AWARDING INVITATION TO NEGOTIATION #21-7898,
"COLLIER COUNTY SPORTS COMPLEX MANAGEMENT," TO
SPORTS FACILITIES MANAGEMENT LLC AND AUTHORIZE
THE CHAIR TO SIGN THE ATTACHED AGREEMENT —
MOTION TO CONTINUE TO TIME -CERTAIN NOVEMBER 12,
2021 AT I I AM —APPROVED
MR. ISACKSON: Commissioners, I'd like to g.� � if we
can. That's a recommendation to approve the aw I vitation to
negotiate No. 21-7898, Collier County Sports x Management
to Sports Facilities Management, LLC, and e the chair to sign
the attached agreement.
Sean Callahan, your Deputy Count ager, will make a
presentation.
COMMISSIONER SAUN While Sean is getting ready,
Madam Chair, if I could just ne quick comment, because it
may have some impact on an is going to be discussing.
I met with the Cler ay and spoke with the Clerk last
week about several c al issues that she had some concerns
with. Some of th ought were very substantial. Some of
them, as she de were just typographical types of things. But
as you're oin this, I will tell you, I'm feeling a little
uncomfo ith proceeding with this because there weren't any
further sations with the Clerk. So as you're going forward
with this, st keep in mind that I'm a little uncomfortable with this
agreement right now.
MR. CALLAHAN: Understood.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: And, Commissioner Saunders, I echo
your concerns. The fact that there wasn't follow-up with the Clerk
when this information was given to staff when it was given, I don't
think is the way we want to do business in Collier County. I am -- I
Page 161
November 9, 2021
think this could have been worked out, and I actually asked for this to
be continued until the December meeting until these issues -- so that
we don't have to spend hours and hours going through this. This is a
100 and, what, 2 0 -million- dollar facility, for Pete's sake. Why are
we doing this like this? And I have a question: Why were you not
able to meet with the Clerk? I know you said you met with her, but
she gave you a pretty detailed four pages of issues tha s h d
concerns about and never got a response from the Co nager's
Office.
MR. CALLAHAN: So we have her list of erns, and I
believe we can address them today. I think stantial ones there
might be some misunderstanding about e ntent of language is
in the contract. If necessary, we've spo n i h the contractor.
They'd be willing to amend that Ian e
I mean, part of this is time, ri It needs to stay on this
agenda because our current co rminates on November 22nd
with our representative in p e
We've had several t have reached out to us that have
large events coming u complex wondering who they should
be coordinating w t p it's upon us to make a decision of who we
want to be in pl Nconduct this business.
CHAIR NR'TAYLOR: And I respect that, and I empathize
with that, c ould underline absolutely the importance of you
respon e Clerk in a timely fashion. If you're going to show
L t
us somet g up here that we haven't reviewed in advance, I think it's
very unfair to this board.
I think we needed to see this. The Clerk did. The Clerk gave
us a response. It's now at two -- quarter to 3:00 in the afternoon
we're supposed to think this thing through and make a decision. It's
very unfair.
MR. CALLAHAN: Well, I'd also point out that the Board, at
Page 162
November 9, 2021
our last meeting, gave us some specific direction as to where to go to
bring this contract to a close with Sports Facilities Management. I
believe we've done that and are ready to present that today.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: But not -- then the Clerk's concerns
came forward, which we all have a copy of, and the response was not
forthcoming from the County Manager's Office.
MR. CALLAHAN: Okay. I don't think that we s e he
concerns of the Clerk.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Obviously.
MR. CALLAHAN: With that said, I think
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Let's I; e presentation.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Yep. I'm to do that.
MR. CALLAHAN: So anyways, I oza, ernoon,
Commissioners. For the record, SeaK C han, Deputy County
5
Manager.
Just to review, welve
but at your last meeting yo
number -one ranked firm A
and asked that the rev��
which we've done.
14iQThd of gone through the timeline,
01Wfirm the selection of the
L
JKwas Sports Facilities Management,
its be adjusted within the contract,
So just real the contract summary, there's a five-year
contract with Qn e-vear renewalODtion. There are no uDfront
managem
this conk!
!s or corporate services fees within the contract with
J�4
�V, which means they are fully incentivizcd and do not
receive co$npensation without meeting profitability milestones on net
operating income.
We believe that we have appropriate cost controls in place on a
fixed expense budget that's reimbursable by pay applications based
on contract deliverables. This is how we've been operating with our
current vendor for the past 18 months with minimal issues, and we'd
certainly appreciate the Clerk's Office working with that to ensure
Page 163
November 9, 2021
prompt payment and reconciliation.
The revenue will be reconciled on a monthly basis to offset
complex expenses, and the county maintains control over all uses and
agreements that will be executed at the complex.
So revised splits on net operating income for the county and
contractor. If you'll remember, it was proposed as a straight 50150
split of all revenues that went into the complex due to the4�a c that
there were no upfront management fees considered. ve
resized that share of net operating income to be 501 n he first
million dollars of net operating income at the co 0/40 up to
two million; anything over two million is 80/
Commissioner Saunders, you had as h t the impact of that
was. So over the first five years of this Xg4Q ct, that results in an
additional $411000 that would comp� 3 V%V
1 c t4e,county as compensation,
so those splits adjust. That's real N&s. That's taken out of the
contractor's actual compensati ; they're giving up. 411,000
may not seem like a lot, but txcess of what most firms have
proposed as a year -long ment fee at the complex.
If you run the pr out about 10 years, you'd have an
�n
p o
additional $2.1 mil 0-- "V-- t would come to the county in
revenue -share b those revised operating -- operating splits on
the income.
Contr 0 we were asked -- you know, there's been some
conce ere raised about the county being able to present
control o the complex just due to some of the different bond
covenants and the way that the complex is financed. Right here
from the contractor, two different -- two different pieces of language.
One, the county shall continue to exercise a significant degree of
control over the facility included, but not limited to, approving the
annual budget of the facility, approving any capital expenditures with
respect to the facility, approving any disposition of the assets of the
Page 164
November 9, 2021
facility, approving the rates and charges for use of the facility, and
approving the general nature and type of the use of facility.
So if there's question about, you know, what things that we
would be looking to -- I think as staff, we would obviously work with
the contractor to make sure there was no improper use of the facility
and within there, there's another provision that limits that and talks
about improper, immoral, or offensive use, which could c use to
terminate the contract with our contractor.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: I have a U' stion.
MR. CALLAHAN: Sure.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Sean previous slide,
the split, give me the rationale. I mean, a ust -- I'm
spitballing here a little bit. But someti s e split works the other
way. In order to keep the contracto .10 ated to make more money
and to bring more business into th . um, you know, you give
them more of a percentage wh hit bigger figures. Why did
we do it the other way?
MR. CALLAHAN: appy to answer that, Commissioner.
So due to the fact that no upfront cost, right, so Sports
Facilities Manage n oposal was unique in the fact that they
have no fixed in a ent fee. Every other proposal that we've had
had $350,000,, ome percentages of gross revenues. We know
spinning u e revenue is actually going to be a loss leader in
the first nd it's going to grow significantly over the years. So
that's wh - just the rationale of them not charging us an upfront
management fee combined with not having to pay for corporate
services fees, which we've seen in other proposals for things like
accounting and their back office corporate support, because they
forewent that, that's why we did the split of the --
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: What would entice them to
work harder? Like, if they hit the 1.5 million mark and they thought,
Page 165
November 9, 2021
wow, anything we do above and beyond that is sort of frosting. We
get 20 percent. I mean, it's still a significant amount.
MR. CALLAHAN: You're still making money.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: But, I mean, I was Just
curious -- it is. I was just curious, your conversations with them if
they were, like, oh, yeah, we're all for this. This is great.
MR. CALLAHAN: Yeah. I think we felt on the Nit illion
11 ewent
dollars, because of the significant compensation that t Vei
vis a vis other types of proposals that we've seen, t eM split that
first million dollars with them evenly.
Now, that could be adjusted if it's the w e Board, but it
would require their agreement, so...
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: And I h uestion. The 411 50K
what is that based on?
MR. CALLAHAN: So if y ember correctly, there's a pro
forma of the first five years.
CHAIRMAN TAYLO U're basing it on their pro forma?
MR. CALLAHAN: ct, right. So --
CHAIRMAN T Have you read the pro formas of the
management that tlWy done in other places like --
MR. CAL We have.
CHAI AYLOR: -- Rocky Top? They've never met
their pro hey've never met it.
M AHAN: I think they provided specific examples --
CH MAN TAYLOR: No, not what they provided. What
your office has been sending to us.
MR. CALLAHAN: Okay. Well, I'm happy to have the
contractor address that. You know, as we did in our procurement
process, we think we evaluated as apples to apples as we could and
brought it to the end of that. If there's concerns about the
contractor's performance at other venues, I'd be happy to ask
Page 166
November 9, 2021
Mr. Clement to come up and address that if you've got specific
questions about that.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I think our County Manager pulled
the CAFRs of those stadiums. I think he can speak to it.
MR. ISACKSON: I think we're placing way too much
emphasis, frankly, on their pro forma. It was 20 percent of the
evaluation process. Excuse me, Sean. And I contribut 3 illion
a year to the sports complex. The fact that I can red
$3 million out of the General Fund would be fantas '
Every audit I've looked at, these things don't e money when
you look at one year over the next in terms o come. A lot of
infusion goes in from the municipal entit
For me to sit here and project out o r let alone three and
four is a fool's errand. I can do one,*ear al good, generally, but I
can't do two, three, and four. I thi t t's -- that's a stretch.
So to rely on pro forma n -- we asked each of those
vendors to give us an hones r is opinion on what they thought
they were going to gener come, and that's what they gave us.
That's my commenta t.
MR.CALLA oving on to the next slide, I'd just
add -- and this i usly --
CHAI AYLOR: Commissioner McDaniel has a
question.
C IONER McDANIEL: Go back to that last slide,
please. o points I'd like to add. And, number one,
Commissioner LoCastro, at our last meeting I had a discussion.
There's an economy of scale. As your revenues go up, you, the
operator, can -- you have a fixed asset base, and you're pouring more
revenue over it, so your cost per unit goes down, which justifies a
higher rate to your land.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Oh, sure.
Page 167
November 9, 2021
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: That was -- we had talked
about that two weeks ago. I did it back in the mining business.
Number two, my question with regard to the -- I had a -- I
expressed it to you yesterday, and that's the assertation of the net
income. That's a -- that's critical to me, because I really -- when I
was reviewing the agreement, I was having a difficult time
determining, how much are we exposed for with this con c 9. Is
_n
this -- and I don't want to -- I don't want to make misl a
statements, but I was having difficulty in ascertaini t our
out -the -door number was maximum with this --
vendor.
I
MR. CALLAHAN: So if you go based pro forma in the
first year, they're showing about $21,000 1 v all, right? So, I
,rr'al
11 1
mean, that's what we evaluated and wen' ' . Outside of that,
when you add in utilities, capital a' ten ce, and other -- our staff
2'1 'S I
that -- our county staff that's at th lex, you re out the door about
another 1.4 million. .4
COMMISSIONER McRUWL: So plus/minus, our first -year
exposure potentially?
MR. CALLAHANSv�'h this contract?
COMMISSIONEX McDANIEL: Yes.
MR. CAL 7 : Specific, if they made no income, right,
and you took - a*� �you took their expenses -- so this is assuming
they gener ncome -- and we do have a fixed expense budget
that the exceed without our -- or, excuse me, without our
approvalV,u would be looking at about $980,000 in expenses plus
the 1. 5.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: That's already ours, and that
was where --
MR. CALLAHAN: It's 1.4, excuse me. So that's assuming
that they make no revenue in the first year, which I think is a bad
assumption. But they can't exceed those expenses, right? We have
WE=
November 9, 2021
fixed expenses they cannot exceed. The biggest --
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: So it's not an open checkbook
to them to cover their operating expenses and corporate expenses and
things along those lines?
MR. CALLAHAN: Not at all.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Thank you.
MR. CALLAHAN: If we're unhappy with the perf@�Lmqnce of
our contractor, the previous contracts with our vendor h me long
lead times and some complicated termination provi s. We
switched that. It's 90 days out the door. 0
So, quite frankly, if they're not meeting 9,,R�ectations, which
we've been very clear about -- and if we c t Xutside of the
procurement process, I hope all of you e chance to sit down
with Sports Facilities Management 4xqh their ideas for the
complex. If we're not happy with4��,Omuch as I think we will be,
! t
01�e
we can terminate their contract 0 days' notice.
COMMISSIONER Mc L: And just -- I have a quick
question with regard to t
CHAIRMAN T Yes.
COMMISSIO FNMcDANIEL: -- and kind of leads into the
other portion. T - er question that I had was, what's our
exposure? A u ng the tennination were to take effect, what's
our -- wha -- what are we obligated for after that 90-day
termina * ilar to the November 22nd termination that's
forthcom ? Is the existing contractor entitled to procured revenues
for booking and events going forward?
MR. CALLAHAN: They are not.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Okay. And the same with
this -- with this --
MR. CALLAHAN: That's correct. Our hope would be that
were the contract to be awarded today, obviously, the first thing that
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November 9, 2021
we would want to sit down with the new vendor is to look at what's
on the immediate horizon so that we can make arrangements to
accommodate those events. Again, I think I mentioned there's a
gentleman with a large soccer tournament that's bringing about 600
teams in December who's worried about logistics and coordination on
that. And then for an extended period of time in the intermediate
range, to look at what events are on the books with our c e t
contract, which has our current contract prescribes, c r to us
and evaluate the effectiveness of those and whether., they
should continue. 0
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: So w ing to be able to
negotiate with the theoretical commitment t e existing vendor
already put in place for upcoming event g forward?
MR. CALLAHAN: The existKII uage in the agreements
that we have with folks with upco A
,,jZ7- upcoming events booked at
the complex would allow us to ate them at no penalty if we
want. 1;F
COMMISSIONER IEL: If we needed to.
MR. CALLAHA r.rrect. I'm not saying we're going to do
e we�
I re C
that, just to be cleaj,,, s. e we re on public record.
COMMISSIX
A, �TNR McDANIEL: I just wanted to make sure
we -- I wasn't hen I was reviewing this that we had that
flexibility, c e you could get into a position with a vendor that
was he ut that would not necessarily do good things.
MR. LLAHAN: I talked a little bit about timing. This was
in the email from that gentleman. Our staff recommendation is that
you move forward with an award today.
I would go to -- there's some language that came up in question
as far as revenues go that I think had some discussion around the fact
that, you know, the existing -- or the vendor, if they were awarded
this contract, could take stuff off books and, you know, we would be
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November 9, 2021
out of a lot of money.
There's two instances where that's come up in the Clerk's notes
that I could see the need to at least explain what the intent was or
clarify the provisions, the first of which is on revenue. It says
that -- shall not include ticket proceeds held by the manager and trust
for a third party and paid to such party. So that's with booking
platforms. Sometimes you'll see if you go on Live Natioq a.qd buy a
concert ticket, there's the actual ticket sale for $40, n s a $2
fee that that platform charges. So the intent of that age_is to be
able to exclude that $2 fee that would go to com Ote that third
party.
Now, if that's really a huge concern t el e going to be
defrauded out of a bunch of money, we' ed to the contractor,
and we're willing to amend that.
And then on right of use by s manager --
COMMISSIONER SA Okay. So I see the vendor
is -- they're all shaking, yes e ould amend that. That's a big
issue. What would be t ment? Because we're about to vote
on this contract, most oday.
MR.CALLA ell, I would think -- you know, they're
going to report onthly basis. Could they show us what the
revenue that's e withheld in a separate line item so that we're
reviewing* o be, I think that would be a good control. If it's
really t ensate a ticket fee through a booking platform, you
know, I Id think that that would be a good way to evaluate and
ensure that we're not losing some significant amount of revenue.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I wonder if we could hear from the
Clerk.
MR. CALLAHAN: Sure.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Because I think the Clerk would be
helpful.
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November 9, 2021
MS. KINZEL: I'd like him to finish, Commissioner, if that's
okay.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: If you could clarify, I Just
want to make sure that this language is clarified so the County
Attorney is satisfied.
MR. CLEMENT: We're comfortable putting whatol�er
language in there. Like in an instance that this woulq t , Mace, we
have to disclose it to whomever our point of contac he county
so that everything's above board and transparent.
'arent.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: That's what
I
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: - d that to me is
Wea 1,
or us t
satisfactory, because it's a control mech S1, or us to be able to
continue to monitor going forward s ha, i doesn't get out of hand.
L? sr,
COMMISSIONER SAUND So if there's an approval
today, this language will be in to reflect the comments of our
staff and the vendor in term vping forward with that.
COMMISSIONER RO: And I think the County
Attorney understands ...
MR.CALLA . eAnd then there's a second situation where
the Manager shq�Nie the right to utilize its employees as needed to
support the or tion as a whole included, but not limited to,
travel and and temporary staffing coverage. This vendor
currentl everal venues across the country. We would hope that
we woulaVlow them the flexibility to do that to support a large event
up in, I don't know, Ohio or wherever else they -- and they would do
the same for us when we do that.
And then on the Manager having the right to utilize the facility
to host events for its employees from time to time, no operational
budget cost. Again, you know, that's intended to be -- to allow them
to have employees on site for training events and otherwise, but if it's
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November 9, 2021
really that large of a problem and we think it's a Trojan horse, we
could, obviously, amend that language as well.
So those are the two areas I wanted to address.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Can I ask a quick question on
the last one?
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Yes, of course.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Does the existin o) tractor
have that similar circumstance within their agreement t their
employees to do -- to participate?
MR. CALLAHAN: They have -- yeah. I e we have a
temporary labor provision where they've �ad mployees come
in. I do not think that we gave them the r o se the facility to
host events for their company, but there een specific instances
of agreements that we've worked o�pA;�h they have utilized the
facility for that purpose. It wasn' Vtxpressly put into the
contract, which, if we really w strip this out, I mean, that
would be our approach to it ould handle it like we did any
other event in the comm. e would Just go to Jason and say,
how many employees bringing down, and we would figure
out the cost. V
COMMISS R McDANIEL: Basically, it would be on a
case -by -case s and they wouldn't have a carte blanche use of the
facility. I 0aysI mean in an extreme circumstance they
could - ould -- yes, so let's strike it.
LL
MR. ALLAHAN: I've got a head nod, okay.
Well, I'm happy to answer any questions. I think Mr. Clement's
here with his whole team, if you have any questions for him.
Again, our recommendation is to award this so that we can get
moving forward with delivering a world -class service at the sports
complex.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I would like, with the indulgence of
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November 9, 2021
the Board, to bring the Clerk up. But it is time for a well -deserved
court reporter break. So we'll comeback at 3:10. Thankyou.
(A brief recess was had from 2:59 p.m. to 3: 10 p.m.)
MR. ISACKSON: Commissioners, you have a live mic.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you very much. So at this
point, I know I asked for the Clerk to come up to respond to the
Assistant County Manager's presentation.
MS. KINZEL: Thank you, Chairman Taylor.
Well, let me just start out by saying this: I've with each
of you. I spoke with the county representative, r. a lahan. I
have voiced our concerns over the last two m I had
wished -- and it might have been great -- t b ck together on these
items. That didn't happen.
My intent is always to make th on cts better. When we
have concerns of management r er, I'm not trying to tell you
policy. That is totally up to y t whatever you do, I have to be
able to account for it.
So there are a lot of s with not only -- Mr. Callahan said
it's just like the 18 mo ell, no, it is totally a different
agreement. We do t ave even the operating manual that
describes what t, or s going to do. And, again, I just met the
vendors. AllQV gies. This has nothing to do with them and their
framewor 've been dealing with the county, and we will work
through these things.
My atest disappointment is not being able to get together and
work through the items.
If the Clerk of Courts has concerns, I would love to work
through those concerns to the comfort of us all. It is not to the
benefit of the taxpayers nor to anyone else, in my opinion, to be
obstinate and refuse to even meet with me or speak with me on the
issues.
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November 9, 2021
Now, I met with Sean for an hour before the agenda even
dropped. I met with him last Tuesday. We gave him a draft for
discussion of all the items. I again reached out to Mr. Isackson on
Friday. No call back, no return, no willingness to discuss the
individual items.
Mr. Callahan comes up today, talks as though they are minor
things, $2 on an item for a ticket, whatever. Now, if yo ea the
language in the contract -- and I'm not the lawyer, but t re
several in the room -- the language is the language. h it says
things like ticket sales that will not be reported th o h their
transactions, ticket sales to what? Now, I u if that's a
commission or an acquisition fee, but that' at the word says.
And without an operating manual, e d 't en have the
information as to what these event g i g to be.
In addition to the operating a , we don't have the costs.
Commissioner McDaniel said, hat is this going to cost?
Commissioner Taylor aske he pro forma. Mr. Isackson
brings forward, you can't ro formas. Well, wait a minute,
because that's the info in the book that I'm supposed to pay by
when they submit r or expenses from us to validate the net
cost of this even atever they're doing for the month.
If you lo(j� he document that I received on the contract, it
says that ay monthly reimbursement, equal monthly
install payroll, and then it listed individual positions and
payroll, a beneath that in the contract it has their corporate
structure, principals, executives, but in other parts of the contract it
says that we're not paying any of those corporate executives, whether
it's by incorporation of the invitation to negotiate or in the actual
contract itself.
I've got conflicts all the way through this document, and I did
not say that that could never be worked out with this vendor. I
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November 9, 2021
would hope it would all be worked out so that I can track what I'm
supposed to pay on your behalf and so that I can pay it promptly and
correctly.
We already had a failed situation for 18 months with an existing
contractor. To do this on the fly in this manner when they knew they
had terminated the other vendor in May, they had chosen this vendor
in August, and the first time this was presented to us for aj or
discussions were when it dropped on the agenda at th eeting.
Now, we've worked diligently, and I think we' u together a
lot of the information that could be cleared up wie, ut they've
tke rq
h
tog(
t 'r
u
.A: ut the
been unwilling to do that. A
So I understand that you have to mak e sion today for the
I
r
operations, but I have to put on the reco very concerned when
they tell you, we borrowed on this itp4l we borrowed under
nontaxable bonds. If the constru. k
, Lt3kis contract goes in a certain
direction and they do make ga rs, you may need to address
those bonds.
Now, okay, we'll ad at, the executive summary says,
within the next year a f. The cost of that -- just the cost of
reissuance can be$ 11 If we thought we were going even in
t
that potential dir t why didn't we borrow the money under the
other ta*xable)n ?
So th4S a er under the bridge. We are where we are, and
we'll m and with what happens. But as your comptroller, I
get very 1 ecure with this method of preparing financial agreements,
and that's what this is. And there are multiple, multiple constructs
that you can do to manage anything. This one needs a lot of work.
As I said, you don't even have the operations manual. It says,
no corporate service fees in one area, payroll in another area. We
don't even have a list of your existing contracts. If you'll remember
a few meetings ago, the county staff asked to relocate a lot of the
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November 9, 2021
events or venues from other county parks into this park to
accommodate parking, size of the event, size of the venue. Okay.
Are those going to be included in our split with them on an income
basis? I don't know. There's no list of them. They say that will be
provided November 22nd when this is executed. We don't know. I
don't know what they're even considering for those items. These are
all things that we could have worked out.
But, again, I'll answer any questions if you have ve
spoken with each of you in detail on this. I'm just e ed and
frustrated, because I do want to move forward wi u as a board,
with county management now that Mr. Isack ack, and I -- I'm
just disappointed, significantly, that this is em for this
community, it's a big contract for this b our citizens, and it's
being done in the way it's being donpA,,
That's all I really have to say. Xa�nk you.
COMMISSIONER M4cD . Don't go away.
CHAIRMAN TAYLO Ive got questions here.
Commissioner McDame n Commissioner LoCastro.
COMMISSION ANIEL: Yes.
MS. KINZEL- ead.
COMMISS McDANIEL: You can't just walk away.
MS IN,4 - Okay. Go ahead.
COM NER McDANIEL: And I understand the concern
with re your perceptions on how the agreement was
coordina done. You and I had a brief meeting yesterday to share
your concerns.
If this board were to approve the agreement as being presented
today, what would happen if you got to a spot where the vendor
submitted a pay request and you couldn't verify it?
MS. KINZEL: Well, we would follow a process that I would
hate to follow, but we'd have to get back and work it out with the
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November 9, 2021
vendors, as we usually do. If the information and documentation
could be presented, we would work through that, make sure it
comports to the contract in its final form. If we have a disagreement,
we'd have to bring it back to you, and the Clerk would be accused of
holding up payments. So that always bothers me, because I don't
think that's a good way to do it.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Don't go down t r bbit
hole.
MS. KINZEL: But we try to work out anythi e pay
about 99 percent of our vendors, so...
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: So t answer is, is if --
MS. KINZEL: We work it out.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: he short answer is, if
the -- if you have a question on a re n'st payment and there's a
conflict or a misrepresentation or s nderstanding specifically in
the contract, that will be, in fac ed out. And in the event that
it's not satisfactory or n t p rms of the agreement, then we
have the right to, then, e that agreement if there is substantive
circumstances that ca orked out.
MS. KINZEIL. o Id -- we already have a liaison with the
Clerk's Office a agement. As we work through these next
couple month uld like to work with someone else from the
Board wit a I don't think that it's been productive lately to sit
with th express these issues, so I'm not real confident that I
might m any headway moving forward.
So if Commissioner Saunders would maybe sit in a few times
and we'll go over some of the issues, or if I run into a payment or
contract discrepancy, work with that. I could work with Jeff and his
office in the County Attorney's Office to see if we can fine-tune some
of the language. The vendor seems totally agreeable with that. You
know, I always want to make the things work. I think that's what's
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November 9, 2021
so frustrating, but thank you.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Yes, ma'am. Well -- and
that was where I was -- I was kind of looking to go. I mean, the goal
here is to work through the indiscretions that are potentially in any
contract, language, misunderstanding, so ons and so forth. And I
don't think that -- I'm pointing at Sean. I don't think that it was done
with malice. So having said that --
MS. KINZEL: I appreciate your opinion there, I'm a
little concerned. And I will be honest the preferre i#yvf doing
business is not agreeing to a contract and then w g it out as you
go. That's not typical. I'm willing to do it i oard -- if this is
what you want to work together on, that's ut I -- you know,
you don't usually do that.
COMMISSIONER McDANIE ainly. Because you've
represented it might could have h n d in a different form or
format --
MS. KINZEL: Yes.
COMMISSIONER IEL: -- but it's not where we're at
here today.
MS. KINZEL- e.
COMMISS McDANIEL: And I think as long as
everybody work operatively, and especially if Commissioner
Saunders i o eering his time to make sure --
Cr-1 IONER SAUNDERS: Sure.
CO ISSIONER McDANIEL: -- that I's are crossed and T's
are dotted [sic], we'll get through it.
MS. KINZEL: We always do. We've been doing this a long
time. That's why I wish it were less frustrating, but...
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner LoCastro.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: First, I don't feel under
pressure right now to approve anything, so, you know, your comment
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November 9, 2021
about, like -- you know -- and I know you're just, you know, talking
out loud. But the reality is, I mean, we could extend the current
contractor 30 more days if we don't feel right -- first of all, we've had
an unsuccessful contract for 18 months. A couple of more weeks,
another month -- I'm not saying that's my answer, but I'm saying I
don't feel like, it's -- hey, it's 51 percent good and move forward.
But I will take exception to something that you said A d I
don't mean this in a negative vein, but when you sa W, We'll
move forward and we always work it out, let's go t heFGCU
contracts, right. Their contracts were horrible, a d some cases
actually really good and required them to o ery specific
things. You had very specific concerns c ain payments.
And I'm not saying this to beat up FGC we want to learn from
past history. But we continued to p t
So the lesson I have here is, this thing ironclad and not
you coming up to us every 30 ing, you know, this contract
was -- remember, it was I s *ttle loose, and they're a great
contractor, and we all m and we're all adults here. The
bottom line is, I mean get my house painted unless I've got a
top -- a rock -solid n c . This is a 120-something-million-dollar
facility.
So I don' e under pressure to do anything, and I want you to
be as voca],Op a articulate as you can so that we -- our starting
contrac ething that, as a county, we feel is the approved
solution ause, as you and I have had conversations on previous
things that -- where you've gotten me up to speed as a new
commissioner, I think you took exception to some contracts, and
rightly so, and then we didn't work it out. You took exception. We
still cut the check. It was maybe wasted taxpayer money, maybe it
wasn't. So in this particular case, I don't want to do that again.
MS. KINZEL: No.
OEM=
November 9, 2021
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: I don't want to do that again.
MS. KINZEL: Well -- and you're absolutely right. My path
was to start and change some of the relationships and move forward.
That's what I wanted to do. But if you ask me right now, absolutely,
you should move this out. You should do something
that -- whatever you're doing right now, two wrongs don't make a
right. We need to fix this. We need to make it strong. 1kVS need to
make it so that everyone understands the language. ITSVWy to point
to a paragraph and say, well, this is what we meant k . I have
�41 ky
those two paragraphs on record. What do I do yk7th)he rest of it?
I guess I am going out of my way to sa I ways committed
to working with you if that is your decisio t ould I prefer that
we had time to work this out before you n the dotted line?
Absolutely.
COMMISSIONER LoCAST ee, and my major concerns
weren't those two paragraphs. okay. They were explained.
But I will echo that the tim S with you and the comments that
you made, very, very det mments, they had merit. They had
merit.
MS. KINZ L- a you.
COMMISS LoCASTRO: For sure. You know, for
sure. They ave an explanation, so I'm not saying that, oh,
God, som d as trying to do something funky behind the
scenes -
MS. NZEL: No.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: -- but, you know, if that was
my contract personally for something in my house and you were
advising me, I would have taken a pregnant pause very quickly,
because your stuff had total merit.
MS. KINZEL: I would not sign and agree to this. I would
work with you on what you need to do, but I think it needs work.
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November 9, 2021
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: One of the voices that's very
silent right now is from our attorney. We're talking about a rather
complex contract. The Manager has gone through an explanation of
some issues. The Clerk has gone through some explanation of
issues. But these -- this is a legal document, and I'd like to get some
S4k I tandled
information from Mr. Klatzkow concerning how this wa I
through his office, because if there are inconsistenciiAeil,
contract -- and I think the Clerk pointed out that th rdractually
even some typos in the contract, little nit-pickin), hi gs, but things
that are generally cleaned up in a contract. 0%
So, Mr. Klatzkow, where are we wit i your office?
MR. KLATZKOW: We didn't ha time to review this
contract. We just didn't, all right. w anded to us rather late in
the process, and we did the best W 6u Id to get it to this board. But
we would have appreciated mo
COMMISSIONER SA S: And who in your office is
handling the --
MR.KLATZKO
COMMISSIO
now. Is he --
MR.
I'm sure f
C
like to
ott Teach.
UNDERS: Is he -- he's not in the room
W: No, he's finishing up the resolution, but
��(cdbwn momentarily.
7SIONER SAUNDERS: Okay. Yeah, because I'd
'hat he has to say in terms of -- because I assume he
spent more time on this than you have.
MR. KLATZKOW: Far more time, yes. Scott's our primary
contract.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: So if Scott can hear me, we
need him to come down here.
MR. KLATZKOW: Well, I'll go get him. It will take just a
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November 9, 2021
moment.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I have a question. What I'm hearing
you say -- and I don't want to put words in your mouth. But what
I'm hearing you say is that this contract that you reviewed has
substantial problems with it, that unless they're corrected -- or unless
we are very clear what we want, like in the contract, we are going to
be in a position where we're going to agree to something at ou
can't pay.
MS. KINZEL: That could happen. What F i to convey
is there are so many items -- you know, Mr. Call a was in
negotiations with them. He knows what the I have to
translate those pro formas, the schedules, i 13� D� F1 E for
payroll, and make payments based on W t ubmitted to me. I
haven't seen representative documen.Wtillo We haven't seen the
operations manual that even descri hat they do. There's no
inforination in the contract nor e seemingly had an agreement
with the current vendor reg i ventories at the termination of a
contract I inventory count
This vendor has o let the Clerk look at a lot of records
interestingly absen in th seem to be the bank reconciliations.
As custodian of ash, by statute, by constitution, it does concern
th o a vendor's management account.
me that the ca 1 s t
We r i PD, qualified public depository, which gives
govern ertain protections on their funds that usually are not
provided a vendor or business individual. Those are all things that
I would bring up and like to finalize and make sure the controls are
there to our comfort so that we can actually validate the net income
or loss, whichever it is, to the pro forma.
Several of the items look a bit loose in the way of who approves
a contract for sub -services, as long as they're reasonable. We'll give
them office space that's sufficient and suitable. How much office
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November 9, 2021
space is that? Are we giving them a building, or are we giving them
two offices? I don't know. There's obviously a cost or value
associated with those.
It says that they'll use the individuals to go to another facility.
So I'm assuming we wouldn't pay them the hours, then, at our facility
to go to work for another, but yet it says I'm going to make the
payroll payments in 12 equally -- 12 equal payments equ ly
throughout the year. I knew what I meant, see.
So those are all the types of things that I have orking on
with staff to look at. If I got an invoice, what do(&is contract say
how I pay it? And it's not clear.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: - d you had some
other concerns, too. It wasn't -- they wQ-rp ust typos.
MS. KINZEL: Right. It was on hat. You know, the list
of existing agreements, as I pointe o Commissioner Taylor and
as a reminder, we pay several rather large groups, over the
years. Football league was them. We've paid them
considerable funds out o o come to Collier County. I would
assume that perhaps t ract would not be calculated into this to
give them a percen o f e're going to reconstruct that, will the
money not com f t e TDT, come over to the stadium. I'd like
to understand tent of those contracts that will be moved over.
Are they i or excluded? We don't have a list of those
agreem hey said that that will be forthcoming.
so� in, those are just the top of my head...
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Do you want to speak to Scott?
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: When you're
finished -- when the Clerk's finished.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Are you -- I didn't --
MS. KINZEL: Oh, I'm finished, I mean, unless you have
another question. I could go on on little -- like I said -- and, you
WE=
November 9, 2021
know, it says we'll do the 15th of the preceding following month.
Okay. I think that's a language typo, but what is that, even? It got
to the point in some of the language that I said, okay, who knows
what they mean. And that's very frustrating.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: If you could stay there,
because I'm going to ask Mr. Teach if he could come up.
So where are we with this agreement in terms of -- fVmy o u r
perspective? I understand you didn't have as much ti haps, as
you needed to go through it in detail. Have you s e time
with the Clerk as well as on some of her concern
MR. TEACH: The Clerk and I have s n a couple
occasions, and she shared with me on Frid a she had a list of
questions. I have not been provided tho*,g estions, not by Crystal,
but staff apparently had, and I have t b -- you know, I can only
rely on the information that's prov* e as far as questions or
concerns, even that the Clerk e, and those have not been
provided me.
COMMISSIONER ERS: The question is: Have you
had sufficient time to gh this agreement to make sure that
there are no incons . t i s and that it's an agreement that the Board
would feel corn le signing? Because I think that that would be
the j ob of the y Attorney's Office, to make sure that the
agreement s 11 of our needs and is understandable and that you
can ma ommendation. So I am curious as to whether you can
even ma recommendation.
MR. TEACH: Well, Commissioner, based on the infori-nation
afforded to me, yes, I could. But to the extent that Crystal has
concerns, which I am not aware of, that have not been shared with me
regarding particular details that are outside of my knowledge, it's
hard for me to address those type of things.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Outside of that, you felt
Page 185
November 9, 2021
pretty comfortable with it?
MR. TEACH: Well, I can tell you this, like -- well, it's hard
to -- it would be nice to see what the particular concerns are. And I
know Crystal shared some of those. Some of those concerns that she
shared, for example, like the vendor's use of the facility, some of
those were for things, like, for training purposes and, you know, we
do that. We do provide -- it's not apples to apples but, y@4j k ow, on
other pr 'ects. Sometimes we provided office spa e Wr
OJ ineers
C 0
and project managers to get together. So that's not sual thing.
To the extent that Crystal wants more specificit b3 t ow much
square footage and whatnot, we can do that. n, this is a park
facility. I don't know if there's meeting r a d things of that
sort. We can identify something. I'm o get into that type of
particular rooms or whatnot. That s eralized, I agree.
You know, but, Commission o know, I can tell you that I
have, you know -- and I've sha h Crystal, you know, we did
talk to bond counsel. Bon I provided us language. They
provided it in the previo ment to sort of ease our concerns
regarding that becaus as a big issue. I must have had three
conversations with 1 ause that was a concern of mine as well.
I had a con� rINti*on with Crystal and Derek on that issue as
well. We rel o ond counsel -- I provided him with the entire
contract, p i so that he could review it in that context. And,
you kno?n, ond counsel would have said do not go forward, I'm
not goingy go forward. That's not an area that I'm involved in.
But if the Board has concerns -- and it's -- obviously, it's been
expressed, what would be my recommendation? My
recommendation would be that if you -- and, actually, I made the
recommendation earlier, not -- you know, through staff, that, you
know, extend the current vendor. See whether we can extend it, and
then work on these details so that we get it into a position that the
0-13=6
November 9, 2021
Clerk is comfortable with.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Madam Chair, could I make
one more comment?
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Yes, and then Commissioner
LoCastro, and then McDaniel.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Obviously, time is of the
essence. We need to get this thing done. I'm feeling a lAtie
uncomfortable. But I'm just going to throw out an idQa if the
Board has any interest in this, see if this might wor have an
MPO meeting on Friday. We could continue thi i until a
time -certain on Friday. MPO usually ends a 1:00. We could
continue this meeting until a time -certain, Teach and the
Clerk and our management staff and the ger of the facility to
work out all these details. You'd h A ays.
MS. KINZEL: But, Commi Saunders, I'm actually out
of town. I'll be back on Tuesd ut I would be available by
phone. If I could do that a t, that would be fine. And I
have -- the staff can mee em, and I can contact in by phone.
But I did want you to at I wouldn't be physically here.
COMMISSIO S UNDERS: But your staff has all of the
questions, and e available by phone?
MS. KI Yes.
COM�N NER SAUNDERS: I'm going to throw that out.
I'd feel ore comfortable doing something like that to get more
eyes on t * contract, and that would, perhaps, solve the problem of
expediency in getting this done quickly enough, because we have,
you know, plans for the park.
So I'll throw that out. I don't know, Mr. Isackson, if that's
something that you would find workable and --
MR. ISACKSON: I don't like the idea. I think you go and
extend -- you go and we ask for an extension of the current contract.
Page 187
November 9, 2021
There's too many issues, apparently, that the Clerk has that we have
to iron out, and you're not going to get that done in two days. I'm
sorry.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Why not? Why can't that be
done in two days? Bigger contracts than this have negotiated in a
shorter period of time. I don't understand why those details can't be
worked out over the next couple of days.
MR. ISACKSON: I'm giving you my caution. I guys
want to pursue that, that's fine.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I would agree wi unty Manager
Isackson. This is too important. It's a $120 n facility. We
extend the contract, recommendation of th si ant County
Attorney. I think we can extend the co a and look at this in
December.
MR. ISACKSON: And if w n extend the contract, then
wevre flying blind.
COMMISSIONER S: Well, I'm going to say this
again, and I won't say it an one more time. We have a very
competent County Att Office. The Clerk has gone through
this agreement. I t nderstand why we can't sit down -- have
you sit down in or the next couple of days and work out
these details. ot accept that it would be impossible to do that.
That's justvNts
fQS;TTZKOW: I think we can do that. I think my office
will certdWy --
MS. KINZEL: I can do it tomorrow.
MR. KLATZKOW: Okay. So we can do that, and worst -case
scenario, we canit , we canit , but --
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Let me interject here a little
bit. First of all I just because you review the contract and it's legally
sufficient doesn't mean it's a good contract, you know. So there
olmm
November 9, 2021
could be plenty of things. So it's not an illegal contract, I get that,
but I think the concerns are valid.
I like what Commissioner Saunders is saying, but I think, you
know, out of respect for the County Manager as well, I appreciate
what you're saying, but I think, regardless of if you work it out or
not -- so I don't think the direction is work it out and come back here,
wevre going to vote it on Friday. You might come back F iday
and go, you know what, we spent the last two days, w e max
of what we could, we can't get here from there, and day we
could say, okay, extend the contract. I think it's e est of both
worlds. e1%
MR. KLATZKOW: We can do the can. Always a
Board decision.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTR9�;,, if it's not good enough,
then on Friday after the MPO meeqV.,.>
7T
MR. KLATZKOW: But MR '79 that gives me chills is the
County Manager's notation M'd be flying blind if your existing
contract just doesn't wan
COMMISSI N OtSTRO: But I think we'd check with
the current contract r ediately to make sure that --
1,
MR. KLAT He has very little incentive to do much of
ou
aiobrightnoN�,� ouneedto get this done.
COM MNER LoCASTRO: Well, all right.
C SIONER SAUNDERS: That's why I don't want to --
C 0 ISS
WIONER SOLIS: And having been there this
weekend, very little incentive.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Yeah. Well, then we've got
a lot to do in two days.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner McDaniel.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Well, I have a proposition,
and that's accept the County Manager's recommendations with regard
0-13MI
November 9, 2021
to the existing contract, understand that the deficiencies -- purported
deficiencies by the Clerk's Office, questions -- by the way,
Commissioner LoCastro, there's no pressure to have to do this.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: I agree.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I get what you're saying.
But I think the necessity of diligence here in us moving forward, it
could be a better -worded contract. There maybe could hkve been
some better communication with the Clerk's Office.
not -- the TV's on, so I'm not going to say anything out that.
It's not a perfect world, but I think, overall, t a ur moving
forward with this agreement doesn't put us in arious position.
I've already asked the Clerk what happens er are circumstances
within the agreement that she can't be h ith. That's going to
delay the payment on those items fo c in period of time. The
new vendor takes over. We go f a persevere. We work
through the issues that are, in re, and maybe give direction to
staff to be more communic e h the agencies, other agencies that
are in review of these thi at we don't end up in this spot at the
'nth hour again.
CHAIRM L R: Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISS SAUNDERS: Could somebody from
the co Id y e up for a minute?
w n e this statement so you understand. I want to go
forwar is contract. I appreciate the fact that you changed the
percenta and I think everybody's trying to work together on this.
Now, I've suggested that because there are some inconsistencies
and there are some problems, that the Clerk has -- and, quite frankly,
I believe the County Attorney has some issues for not being that fully
involved in some of these negotiations. I've suggested that we put
this off until Friday to work out these details. Now, does that
present a problem for you guys?
Page 190
November 9, 2021
MR. CLEMENT: We can make that work. If we can -- part of
the concern here is because of the procurement process, we haven't
been able to engage in a conversation with any of the groups here, so
if we can open up that dialogue. I don't have any concerns in a day
that we can work through whatever the concerns are.
I would also we want to get to work. There's a lot to do.
And so our team our operational team here is ready to Waiting
till Friday isn't going to break anything. We could al� �*`and if
you're not comfortable approving it, you're not co a e
approving it. We want to make sure you're com ble with our
agreement, for sure, and our partnership.
We could approve and amend on Fri s ell, if that helps.
So whatever works for you -all, we want e sure you're
comfortable with the agreement bec e want to be here a long,
long time.
COMMISSIONER SA All right. I'm going to
suggest to the Board that w e is item until, say, noon on
Friday. We're all going re for an MPO meeting anyway. In
the interim, that all th get together, and especially with the
Clerk, and get thes it -picking things resolved. Now, if we
need to say som a out the procurement process so that opens
up a dialogue 't understand why --
MR. OW: There's no reason my office can't chat with
the ven
CO ISSIONER SAUNDERS: Okay. So part of that
motion is, everybody's free to talk to everybody. But I would make
that suggestion. I'll feel much more comfortable. I think the Clerk
will. Quite frankly, I think Mr. Teach will feel more comfortable
having that opportunity, and then on Friday we'll vote for it.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: With all -- may I ask the vendor, are
you prepared to deliver an operational manual by Friday?
Page 191
November 9, 2021
MR. CLEMENT: We are.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Good. That's very good.
MR. TEACH: Commissioner I if we could meet with the
Clerk's Office in the morning, I'm sure by the afternoon maybe some
of these things can be addressed, and we can provide something to
the vendor. You know, we're going to work expeditiously to address
these concerns.
And Crystal knows that I'm always more comfo a en the
Clerk is on board on these type of things, because t want to
get into a situation where there are payment issue .
MR. KLATZKOW: We've been worki the Clerk for
many years now, and I'm confident she'll s ething.
MR. TEACH: And, Crystal, I thi and I have had a pretty
good relationship.
MS. KINZEL: And pretty g nversations about the
condition of the contract alread
Could 1, Madam Chair
CHAIRMAN TAY es, of course.
MS. KINZEL: thing. I do want to put on the record,
this seems -- puttin t v ndor out, you know, they have an
expectation of b andled properly. We all would like to come
here, present, ively, agreements and things that are done. We
did not cre i urgency at the Clerk's Office. We knew back in
May th ere terminating the other group. August 25th we
knew we this agreement, and it got dropped on the agenda last
agenda.
I apologize for that. I want to work with staff so that this never
happens again. I would like to have upfront conversations so that we
can all do our job to the best ability for the taxpayers. That's my
goal.
So I apologize to the vendor. We'll work through this.
Page 192
November 9, 2021
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: And, you know, quite
frankly, I don't think apologies are necessary. Everybody's trying to
do the best they can. We've got a great vendor on board here. We'll
get through all of this. So that's my motion.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Second.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: All right. We have a motion on the
floor and a second. We will have a special meeting callokat�noon
on -- noon on Friday or a little bit after depending on htWO
schedule, but it will be immediately following the MPO
meeting. 0,
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Yea you have to set a
j4
specific time. You can't say immediately kTnlg because that
might -- it will be at 12 o'clock or later.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: So I o'c k, is that the time, would
you agree, or 11:00?
COMMISSIONER SA We can say 11:00.
CHAIRMAN TAYLO .00 or later. Let's make it 11:00
or later. Okay. So we kA�*�'Yhotion on the floor and a second that
we will have a speci
MS. KINZEL:.
manual ready n
MR. CLul
Ms.
think, i S
hg at 11:00 on Friday, the 12th, or later.
ore question. If you have the operations
we get it now?
Yes.
Thank you. That will be a great step forward, I
tanding the entire process from them.
kN TAYLOR: Good.
MS. KINZEL: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: All right. So there's a motion on the
floor. And, Commissioner McDaniel, be short.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Short now. Because it was
quick before. Now I've got -- 6-foot-4, I've got to be short.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Now, that's your 30 seconds, sir.
Page 193
November 9, 2021
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I want to ask the County
Manager's Office -- because there are extraordinary circumstances.
There are extremities that have brought forth, the potentiality of
things that could go wrong with this agreement. What happens if we
don't come up with a solution by Friday and we are --
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Extend the contract.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: -- and we are in 0 ition of
already terminating another vendor? Do we have to e with
the existing vendor to have someone in contract or t ink, you
said flying -- flying? Because, again, I'm not in p ert with this
thought process. I think the Clerk raises so y good points. I
think that the agreement can, in fact, be -- rcumstances can be
negotiated, and we can have an agreem ay and then work
through these things that have been se p. And I have a concern
about delaying this to a special in
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR:
COMMISSIONER M L: And the County Manager's
response to that is?
MR. ISACKSO 11 it sounds like the County Attorney's
Office and the Cler c et together and iron the language out
legally.
MR . KL OW: No, no. We'll get together with your
office, too
CQZOW IONER SAUNDERS: Yeah. I'm not sure if your
statemenNI that you're not going to be involved in this, that that's not
the intent. The intent is for the parties, which includes the Manager
and the County Attorney and the vendor and the Clerk, to work out
these details. So I assume you're going to participate.
MR. ISACKSON: Understood.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: All right. So there's a motion on the
Page 194
November 9, 2021
floor and a second. Everyone understand the motion? All those in
favor, say aye.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Aye.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Those opposed, like sign.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Aye.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay, 4-1.
Item #1 IC
RESOLUTION 2021-237: FURTHER IDER A PREVIOUS
SUPPORT RESOLUTION ADOPTED THEBOARD
APPROVING THE EXPANSIO
CONTROL DISTRICT — AD
COLLIER MOSQUITO
D W/CHANGES
I think we can go t _N we go to the Mosquito Control issue?
We have it up on the
MR.KLATZ lim going to ask Troy to put the language
on the screen.
MR. MIL*Z1W-: Just give me one second.
MR. K11XT2KOW: I know.
C14Q]%MAN TAYLOR: Troy, just to add to your busyness,
this is losiXg battery here.
MR. MILLER: I will get on that in just a second, ma'am.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you.
MR. KLATZKOW: Do it the old-fashioned way.
MR. MILLER: Here, I got it.
MR. KLATZKOW: You got it?
MR. MILLER: Yeah.
Page 195
November 9, 2021
MR. KLATZKOW: If you can just go to the last -- the very last
of it, second page. Single page, and scroll down.
All right. That's the clause, Commission. My understanding is
that the environmental groups are in favor of that clause.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Have the -- I'm sorry. Excuse me.
Have the groups reviewed it, the environmental groups?
MR. KLATZKOW: Yes.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: You're fine with it?
Okay. So we have a nod from the chambers tt4 h
environmental groups have reviewed this. Are ppy with it?
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: And theeta as well.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: And the a e yeah.
MR. OWENS: If I may, I would j t . e to say the Collier
Mosquito Control District has not hjd.�an. portunity to discuss with
the County Attorney's Office our e
,Qo We don't think
..� d changes.
it makes any substantive chang it's important, you know, that
we had these changes if we r take this forward to the
delegation and try to bri e legislature. So we have not had
an opportunity to talk with the County Attorney. It's a little
awkward to talk ab nges in this venue, but I'm happy to do
U,
whatever.
MR. KL OW: I'll do it right now. What change do you
want? Z%,
MV4C—.SJ' 'VENS: Okay. And let me just state for the record that
these chaVes have not been approved by the board of the Collier
Mosquito Control District, so I don't have authority and
MR. KLATZKOW: This is the Board's resolution
MR. OWENS: No, I understand. I just wanted to make that
clear for the record.
Our concern is that we want to make sure that this resolution,
since it amends and restates and replaces the existing resolution,
Page 196
November 9, 2021
actually has some form of legal description describing what the
expansion area is. And so we would recommend -- and I have
wording -- that it includes the exhibit that describes the expansion
area. This does not.
So if this is intended to approve an expansion area, it doesn't
necessarily describe what that expansion area is. It only talks about
what's excluded from that expansion area.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: But you have an exhii i
MR. OWENS: Well, it's not referenced in he o hat was
part of our requested changes. 0
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: And the exhijkRz
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: It was a e(T--
MR. OWENS: It was former Exhi on your prior
resolution. Obviously in this one, I ou recommend that it now
becomes Exhibit A.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: ht. I think we have the
previous resolution in front ul
MR. OWENS: An -- you know, basically, if you -- and
it's a change to both P s very similar. But if you go -- just
b h
skip ahead to the la t a raph where it talks about "now therefore,"
we would like it d 5 if you pick up the language, "approves the
expansion 0ofe squito Control District boundaries." Instead of
x
saying ' ex t o the inclusion of," we'd like to say "into all areas
depicte tached hereto as Exhibit A, less and except tax
I
exempt," d then pick up your language, "state and federal public
lands."
The only other comment we have is there is a reference to
Delnor-Wiggins Pass State Park. That is not part of the proposed
expansion.
MR. KLATZKOW: We took that out.
MR. OWENS: Okay. I wasn't aware of that. Okay. I was
Page 197
November 9, 2021
working from what you gave me.
MR. KLATZKOW: I understand.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: No issues with that.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Those make sense to me.
MR. KLATZKOW: All right. Well, we can make those
changes easy enough, if you want to vote on them now. I don't think
you want me to bring it back.
MR. OWENS: And those changes would appl t ast
whereas clause as well?
MR. KLATZKOW: Yes.
MR. OWENS: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay. A torneys on the
y
Board and the County Attorney comfort ith that?
MR. KLATZKOW: Yes.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Qkes good sense.
COMMISSIONER SA A� : I'll move for approval.
CHAIRMAN TAYLO
say aye.
COMMISSIO
COMMISSIO
CHAIRM��
COMMI
COMW
kcond that. All those in favor,
N ��W_ I S: Aye.
N L`bCASTRO: Aye.
), LOR: Aye.
ER SAUNDERS: Aye.
NER McDANIEL: Aye.
CEkAWAN TAYLOR: Those opposed, like sign.
(No'Vponse.)
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: It carries unanimously.
Thank you.
Item #1 IB
PROPOSED COLLIER COUNTY STATE AND FEDERAL
WE=
November 9, 2021
LEGISLATIVE AND ADMINISTRATIVE PRIORITIES FOR 2022
— MOTION TO APPROVE W/LETTERS OF SUPPORT
MR. ISACKSON: Commissioners, that brings us -- welre
going to go to Item I I B, which is a recommendation to approve the
proposed Collier County state and federal legislative administrative
priorities for 2022.
John Mullins, your Director of Communicationsj esent.
MR. MULLINS: For the record, John Mulli i ctor of
Communications, Government, and Public Affai r
The proposed 2022 state and federal le e and
administrative priorities are included in yo
,0 e. ing materials.
This document was produced in conjuno4,oft*
pith the lobbying teams,
county management, and departmen stVTand with your individual
input.
Now, this is not an exhau t, and it is a snapshot in time,
and we'll bring you any iss ich we cannot derive direction
from that document.
The topics are lis- ection in alphabetical order, not by a
level of importan o a or any particular member of the Board.
Selected issues ects outlined in the document will be
presented by aylor at the legislative delegation meeting on
Wednesda c ber 8th, at North Collier Regional Park exhibit
hall.
An en you were previously provided this document for
review, and given today's time and temperature, I'm going to simply
agree to answer any questions you may have on the 35 or so issues
contained therein.
I would only ask that any motion to approve also contain the
authority for the Chair to write any letters of support as applicable for
these particular items.
Page 199
November 9, 2021
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Are we okay with that?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Now, the one thing I would like to
speak about, given the importance of the nursing home -- the veterans
nursing home and also the overwhelming emphasis the state has on
water, when I present to the delegation, I would like to highlight the
veterans nursing home, and I would also like to highligh e
septic -to -sewer initiative we have, which corresponds - should
know that FAC -- I'm a member of the water comn-iN*- FAC.
They carried forward what we brought them last ea about the septic
to sewer, and they're bringing it forward agai '10
So I think it speaks well for success. i s also an
issue -- the septic to sewer is to talk about c nties that don't have a
great population to understand the i or ce of funding the
engineering. They may not have Z%0- they may not be shovel
ready like Collier County is, b still need assistance in it. So
that would apply to rural co ti so. So I'm very excited about
this, and I hope I have th nsus of my colleagues to go forward.
COMMISSION AQ ANIEL: Sure.
CHAIRMAN
motion?
MR.
support h
CIV
And I do.
And do you need a
VS: Yes, also with your authority to write any
the items contained herein.
TAYLOR:
And I promise you will get copies of
those supVrt letters. All right.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS:
So moved.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Second.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I have a motion on the floor and a
second. All those in favor, say aye.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Aye.
Page 200
November 9, 2021
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Aye.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Those opposed, like sign.
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: It carries unanimously.
Thank you very much.
MR. MULLINS: Thank you very much.
Item #1 IE
DIRECTING THE COUNTY ATTORN?&ADVERTISE AND
BRING BACK FOR A PUBLIC HEARMWAN ORDINANCE
ESTABLISHING THE 42ND A
SERVICE TAXING UNIT (MS-'
(5) MILLS, FOR THE REP
AMOUNT OF $72123 1.00
REPAIRS ON 42ND
E MUNICIPAL
H A MAXIMUM OF FIVE
OF FUNDS IN THE
TO MAKE EMERGENCY ROAD
SE — APPROVED W/CHANGES
I
MR. ISACK N: Commissioners, Item I IE, which was
formerly 16A2 a moved by Commissioner McDaniel. It's a
recommendati direct County Attorney to advertise and bring
back for earing an ordinance establishing the 42nd Avenue
Southe Itiple Service Taxing Unit, MSTU, with the maximum
of five mi s for the repayment of funds in the amount of $72,231
used to make emergency road repairs on 42nd Avenue Southeast.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Ms. Trinity Scott to give a
report or answer the question.
MS. SCOTT: For the record, Trinity Scott, deputy department
head, here to answer any questions you may have.
Page 201
November 9, 2021
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: I don't have any questions. I
just would like to make a proposition that we limit the -- allow the
cap to be five but limit the expense to be one mill for two years at the
inception of this MSTU.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: How does that differ from what's
before us?
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: When the gove e has the
right to charge you five, what do they do? Charge you I want
to hold it at one for two years. It has -- it's virtuall i pact other
than extending out the payback for our -- for our x n ed funds for
a couple of years until we sort through it.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS:
COMMISSIONER McDANIEJ.&', t's my motion. I'd like to
make that motion for approval wit�N ap at five and -- the cap is,
per the total, five but hold it at 17r wo years.
COMMISSIONER SO econd.
ER So
CHAIRMAN TAY '�nd
r
MS. SCOTT: T be coming back next month for actually
I re s
e're s
establishing. This t e eeking today approval to be able to
's
c r a t(
advertise for the ���4ic caring to establish the MSTU. So this will
4ingba but I'll work with the County Attorney's
be coming ba ember,
Office to I ate any necessary language.
C AN TAYLOR: And budget -wise, are you
r i
comforta with that?
MS. SCOTT: Yes, maam.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Okay.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I'll second it.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: All right. So there's a motion on the
floor and a second to amend it following Commissioner McDaniel's
remarks. All those in favor, say aye.
Page 202
November 9, 2021
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Aye.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Aye.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR:
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR:
MS. SCOTT: Thank you.
Item #9B
Those opposed, like sign.
It carries unammousl
RESOLUTION 2021-238: REVIEW A PROVAL OF THE
2021 COMBINED ANNUAL UPDA'TX ND INVENTORY
REPORT ON PUBLIC FACIL
SCHEDULE OF
CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT ROVIDED FOR IN SECTION
6.02.02 OF THE COLLIE TY LAND DEVELOPMENT
CODE AND SECTION 7(3)(B), FLORIDA STATUTES
AND ADOPT A RE ZON THAT UPDATES THE 5-YEAR
CAPITAL IMPR(
SCHEDULES — ADOPTED
MR. ISA$4�5ON: Commissioners, Item 9B was moved -- it
was previo<NLY71) -- by Commissioner Solis. It's a
on to review and approve the 2021 Combined Annual
Update aff Inventory Report on public facilities and schedule of
capital improvements as provided in Section 6.02.02 of the Collier
County Land Development Code and Section 163.3177(3)(b), Florida
Statutes, and adopt a resolution that updates the five-year capital
improvement schedules.
Mr. Bosi will present.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: And, Madam Chair?
Page 203
November 9, 2021
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Yes.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: You know, I had not considered
that we would be starting this at 4:00 when I asked you. So feel free
to, as far as I'm concerned, to be as brief as you want to be. Again, I
just think that it's good for the public to understand this process that
we go through that's very time consuming.
MR. BOSI: Mike Bosi, Planning and Zoning direct4kr.
And the item that we have before you today, the IE, this
is a good -news item. This is a process Collier Co u dertakes
annually. It basically analyze -- or evaluates the x ected population
growth over a five- and a I 0-year period and 4at's the
infrastructure requirements that we're goil 0�d to meet the
levels -of -service standards.
It's going to set the concurrenc a ement system for the
upcoming year for the developme think most people often
wonder, how do we know that enough capacity on our road
system, within our utility s or when we approve a project,
whether it be residential, rcial. The AUIR/CIE sets the
benchmark for that, s heckbook for concurrency, and this
allows you to be c 1 n that the levels of service that the
community has e is going to be maintained on a year-to-year
basis.
The n Commission had heard this at their October 21 st
with th -- recommended unanimously to adopt the AUIR and
transmit CIE annual update.
With that, any questions you have -- but really it is, it's the -- it's
the unique character -- or the unique aspect that Collier takes to really
go to not only our concurrency level, which is our roads, our sewer,
wastewater, stormwater, parks, but we look at levels of service for
our EMS, for Sheriff, for Fire.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Libraries.
Page 204
November 9, 2021
MR. BOSI: We go well beyond any other county, any other
jurisdictions to make sure the public is aware that we are trying to
provide and maintain what they expect in terms of levels of service
for any of our infrastructure providers. And to me, it is a good -news
item, but we don't need to belate it anymore. And any questions you
may have, I'll be happy to answer.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Well, just -- can you e 11,ain how
the level -- we set a level of service for any number o t which
then is broken down to a dollar value, right? Whic e translates
to the Capital Improvement Plan.
MR. BOSI: Correct. Here's a real go ple. Library
buildings. So you've got your new popul t at we're going to
expect over a five-year period, and then e ve the level -o f- service
standard. So for this AUIR, we ex t 33 people over the next
P
five years. That's how many peo 6w expect are going to be
coming in.
lit
We have a level of ser libraries. We have a .33 square
e
r
feet per person. That's ve adopted that we said that's the
�f s
appropriate standard. it's just math. How much do we
build? Wemultiplet e3,433 times the .33, and we need to build
are feet to maintain that level of service. That
10,703 additio4�xz
formula is rep id for the majority of your infrastructure providers.
CHA TAYLOR: Yeah. So -- okay. So we've got a
level of Who sets this level of service?
MR*.Sl: The Board of County Commissioners.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Yes, but you recommend it, right?
You decide. I mean, because, you know, a level of service on roads,
correct?
MR. BOSI: No, no. I mean, we can make a recommendation
to the Board of County Commissioners, but the --
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: The final -- no, we -- but the
Page 205
November 9, 2021
recommendations, what is it based on? I know -- I know that
there's -- because this is -- this is a progressive exercise from when
concurrency meant something in the state of Florida, correct?
MR. BOSI: Well, concurrency does still mean something in
Collier County.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Growth management?
MR. BOSI: We -- the State of Florida has loosenedo�-,- ip 20111
the Community Planning Act loosened the requine t Xthe only
thing that's required is stormwater and your utilitie . t's the only
thing that's required by the State of Florida for co c ency.
Collier County has maintained all of its 0 concurrency,
whether it be school concurrency, whether arks, land
concurrency, whether it be transportatio*,� urrency. So we've
always maintained that commitmer�ti-,�n at commitment to
concurrency is basically -- like I saaq,&.�it the commitment to maintain
the levels of service that we ha 11 of our -- all of our
infrastructure providers.
So when you say w - there's certain letter grades that are
assigned to individual and those deal with how much traffic to
volume to capacit �u . I h re is associated with it, what's the delays
within the peak ' n terms of where it's the most taxed. And
that's how etho e s of service are established, and every year we
'low
come bac ou either maintain those or there may be a
recom on from the Planning Commission or for staff to maybe
just
adjust. adjusted law enforcement. We've adjusted jails. We've
adjusted levels of service for transportation system, for segments as
well. So it is a fluid process. But we are -- we're proposing
something that's consistent with what we presented to the Board last
year, a continuation of those individual projects.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: And this is available on the county
website.
Page 206
November 9, 2021
MR. BOSI: It's available on the county website, and we have --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: If anybody's interested.
MR. BOSI: We have about -- we have 15 -- 16 years available
on the website. So you could watch and see the consistency of what
we do as a county as a whole.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: But you were -- and I misspoke. But
you were mandated by the Growth Management Act, conq�ct?
MR. BOSI: Yes. Concurrency started from th V% wth
management requirement that we have to maintain I f service
for the important systems within the county.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I just -- com s to Collier
County for maintaining that. I mean, that' t emarkable.
MR. BOSI: We are the -- we a e he few counties that
still looks at DEO as if they still we I t a DCA, and the DCA
was the former name of them. A DCA really did take a very
vested interest in local matters.
DEO doesn't quite - t -- they put their hands off. They
say, only if it's state sign But we adhere to all the protocols.
We adhere to the con management system, and we make
sure that we commri te with DEO, that we are continuing doing a
good job of pla-,,C-, Nbecause we care about the future, and we want
to make sure o , -- what they have come to enjoy for this county,
that we ca a ain it as we grow, and we know that's a challenge.
C TAYLOR: Thank you.
CO ISSIONER SOLIS: Can I say one more -- oh, I'm
sorry.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Of course, of course.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: No. Go ahead. I'll wait.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I was just -- can you go back to the
slide that you had before, because then there's one -- there's one last
step. Oh, you passed. Yeah, so there's -- so we know that for
Page 207
November 9, 2021
libraries we've got to build 10,703 additional square feet. That then
goes to the capital improvement plan with a number --
MR. BOSI: Yes.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: -- for constructing that amount of
space.
MR. BOSI: Well, what we do is we look at the inventory. A
lot of times we'll have -- we'll have excess space. So it 'I
Vkl �e
satisfied. But it we are deficient, then we have plans next
capital improvement.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: And then that e into our budget
that we review.
MR. BOSI: Yes. And this sets -- t U, Commissioner.
This helps set your stage for your discu your budgetary
process that starts to begin, I believe . ruary of next year.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: t all I've got.
MR. BOSI: So this is on continuum of recognition
looking at what we have t ared for, understanding of what
those trends are, mod'fyi udgets appropriately, and then
modifying our capital ased upon those trends and changing
patterns of trips.
COMMISS LoCASTRO: This example is hypothetical
for the library ? Just to show us the math, or this is --
MR. No, this is the level of service. This is what -- for
the five eriod, this is what's required to maintain that level of
service. y
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Now, the conundrum is where you
build it, but that's another question.
MR. BOSI: Well, yes. That's a whole'nother discussion, but
we have tools for that as well.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: There is another conundrum,
and that is money.
olmm
November 9, 2021
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Yes.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: And these
level -of- service -- I mean, these are all good things, but as we're
going forward with this -- because I'm in support of this going
forward. This is how Collier County has conducted business for
millennia, but there are other ways to get to this same point and have
the proper priorities in place. This is a nice thing for us kq dQ to be
meeting the set board recommendations of level -of -se ut that's
not always the case.
And you have listened yourselves, in the rec n ast, about the
deficiencies of our infrastructure, our road;s and so on and so
forth, because these level of services get a *&e on a budgetary
basis based upon the particular cons
t'are coming on. So I
just recommend to you -- financial c strTofits. I recommend that
you speak with the County Mana n talk about some potential
to I
ways we may be able to get to e re going in a different
manner. I
fine?
CHAIRMAN TA
you very much. Are you
COMMISSIO
.,NNSDLIS: That's it. Thank you.
CHAIRMA;j T*,�YLOR: All right. Thank you.
MR. BO§J::(�n I wou say, we are see ing a
nmen&i��f approval to -- approval of the 2021 AUIR and
adoptioj<nl�VCIE.
CONRISSIONER SOLIS: So moved.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: So moved -- second.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Second.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Third.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Motion on the floor and a second.
All those in favor, say aye.
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: Aye.
Page 209
November 9, 2021
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Aye.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: Aye.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Aye.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Those opposed, like sign.
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Thank you.
are here also to speak to this. Thank you.
Item #15
STAFF AND COMMISSION GENE
MR. ISACKSON: Commissi
staff and Commission general co
to revisit three specific issues rN
meetings. One is service a r
and three is Business of
remotely. What's yo
IN
remotely, or do yot
,�,w
C
COMMI
th.
Thank you r Uff that
ATION
,�tlfat brings you to Item 15,
ations. The Board wanted
ng in -person attendance at board
o is in -person proclamations;
We've been doing a lot of this
)5ure? Do you want to continue
bring them in in person?
�: I'd like to bring them in in person.
R LoCASTRO: I'd like to -- I think we offer
that they c e *n, and if they decide not to and they want to do
remotel s fine. But they need to know they have the option
e in person. And hopefully most of them will come.
now to co
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: That's a fine way to do it
because our -- it still allows for that individual to make a decision.
COMMISSIONER LoCASTRO: Choice.
COMMISSIONER McDANIEL: Correct.
MR. ISACKSON: The second item I have is some
correspondence from the Florida Association of Counties regarding
Page 2 10
November 9, 2021
participation in their Broadband Infrastructure Policy Committee.
I'll let Commissioner Taylor discuss aspects of this with the Board.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: This was directed to me because I'm
chair. They want a commissioner from each of the counties that are
part of FAC, and we're all part of FAC, to be involved in the
expansion of broadband and can be considered broadband county
champions.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I thought we
already.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: No. No one vol red.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I tho was volunteered
by the Board.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I wasnit *jlr ou were.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDEF,&,, ich I'm willing to --
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: LNI N 0 W.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: u are? He is now.
COMMISSIONER S11 "Irso I'm willing to forego it,
but --
CHAIRMAN T
Commissioner Mc
COMMIS
CHAIRM
record.
�&: No, no, no. I was looking at
1,"6ut if you're willing to do this, that's fine.
McDANIEL: He's already --
AYLOR: You heard it. He put it on the
C(WiNMIONER McDANIEL: Commissioner Saunders was
already tftonointed FAC representative, and I just thought he had
this. I'd be happy to do it if he doesn't want it, because this is a huge
issue in the east.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: No, no. Mr. Likens is
already doing some research on what's involved with all this.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Oh, good. Oh, good. So we're --
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: He's going to help me -- he's
Page 211
November 9, 2021
going to help me understand what broadband is.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Oh, good.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: And --
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: So you can speak -- you know, that's
what the M-CORES was all about, right, expanding broadband.
Anyway, thank you very much.
MR. ISACKSON: That's all I have.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner -- or
Attorney?
MR. KLATZKOW: Nothing, ma'am. Th k ou.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commission
COMMISSIONER SOLIS: I think i tough meeting
today, but I will say that while we have L rimportant things to
io ith the implications that
work out on this contract I take exc IV
t 3
were made that somehow our Cou lz,�"anager's staff was not
somehow above board in tryin rk on this contract. I take
exception to that, beca se t * Niough situation in a change that
ul,
needs to be made, and it be made in a hurry, and I think that
that is completely unE
That's all I'veio .
CHAIRM , N LOR: Commissioner LoCastro.
COMMI &ER LoCASTRO: I want to say something on a
positive n ink it was really classy and really meaningful that
mec�
we start meeting with the veterans that were here. I mean, I
t
r
served it;nekAir Force for 24 years in some areas that you never
want to go to. So did they.
As veterans, we always say we stand on the shoulders of giants.
Those World War 11 vets that were here, those are the giants that we
talk about, because they saw some pretty horrific things. And even
the ones that talked about just driving an ambulance in Wisconsin or
whatever they did, you know, when you put on the uniform, you
Page 212
November 9, 2021
serve. And so I know we're all proud of our service. And I would
just lastly say, we have a lot of veterans that work for our county.
I've met so many of them that have come up to me, Colonel
LoCastro, you know, just -- I was in the Air Force, and you'd be
surprised. There's probably some people here working for the
county that you -all know on a first -name basis but you didn't realize
they served four years in the Marines, five years in the anky, pr what
have you. And so, you know, I'm meeting people ev and I
lv�
just think it was a great start.
And know the difference between Veterans a and Memorial
Day. If you go up to a veteran and say, "Ha morial Day," you
know, it's insulting. Memorial is about t o have fallen and,
you know, who didn't come home. Vet a ay is honoring people
who have worn the uniform. So yo a appy Veterans Day," not
"Happy Memorial Day."
So I made a video for the and one of the things I said is,
veterans, you know, take ex to watching on TV and seeing
that Veterans Day seems I about mattress sales and car sales
and, you know, it sho ally be about that unless maybe the
veterans are gettin c unt. But a lot of times, it's, you know,
"Happy Memori 10 percent off of your Kia. That's really
disrespectful, now, on Memorial Day.
But t t whoever arranged for the veterans, you know, to
be here. it was great and, you know, you meet anybody in
their '90s o can stand up, salute, and said they served is a pretty
cool thing, so thank you.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Commissioner Saunders.
COMMISSIONER SAUNDERS: I have one item that I think
we just need to address. And we all got letters concerning some of
the panhandling at various intersections, and -- pardon me. We can't
adopt an ordinance that prohibits panhandling. That would be
Page 213
November 9, 2021
impermissible. But we can adopt an ordinance that involves safety,
traffic safety and to prohibit activities in the medians. A lot of
communities are doing that.
I know we've all experienced coming up to a traffic light. And,
I mean, it's a very sad situation for those people, so I don't want to be
sounding like I don't have any sympathy for those folks that are
trying to get enough money to find a place to spend the rt*ilkht but we
do have a traffic safety issue, I think, associated with nd I
would just throw out for consideration as to wheth oard might
want to take a look at an ordinance to prohibit ce al activities in the
medians to make sure that we are maintainin y of the motoring
I py
public and the individuals.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: I think unty Attorney is
looking into that. I sent him an em a that with the Sheriffs
Department.
MR. KLATZKOW: We' -A working with the Sheriff now
for some time on this. Theawas raised by the Sheriff, and I
have an ordinance. It wj1iZU4,M your next agenda.
CHAIRMAN T : Great. That's it, sir?
' OAUUNDERS: That's it.
COMMISSIONk S
CHAIRMi�� T*,�YLOR: Commissioner McDaniel.
I
COMMIFAS IONER McDANIEL: And I like the idea of
approachi r a safety standpoint. I really wasn't aware that we
couldn' it that type of activity on our right-of-ways, so now I
know.
Other than that, no, I have nothing else other than Happy
Veterans Day and Happy Thanksgiving.
CHAIRMAN TAYLOR: Just briefly. I was asked to come to
Shula's Steakhouse on Friday night to celebrate the birthday of -- the
246th birthday of the Marine Corps, and they had a Lieutenant
Colonel Edwards there who was in Afghanistan, third tour when a
Page 214
November 9, 2021
bullet caught him, and he was in a wheelchair; wife with two
children. And he was talking to a Vietnam vet. Both these men are
residents here, who was also in a wheelchair. And it was such a
lesson for me to see the sacrifice that our veterans have given us.
And, again, I want to thank you, Commissioner Saunders, for
championing the veterans nursing home because, clearly, there's a
need for it. And we -- we pass them on the street, we p t em in
w t
the store, and we don't know what their stories are, b it
behooves us in this very special time to remember, e ho have
been injured, but also those as -- that were here t a and just say
CO
thank you. So on that, we are adjourned. h 1%
""Commissioner Solis moved, secon Commissioner
Taylor and carried that the follt*k items under the Consent
and Summary Agendas be appro e /or adopted****
1 4$141
Item #16AI
FINAL ACCEPTAN
POTABLE WA
FRONTERRAI
THECOUN
THE FIN 0
$41000 E
DESIGNfED
Item #I 6A2
ACCEPT THE CONVEYANCE OF
SEWER UTILITY FACILITIES FOR
,A'$E 2A, PL20180003266 AND AUTHORIZE
�kNAGER, OR HIS DESIGNEE, TO RELEASE
IGATION BOND IN THE TOTAL AMOUNT OF
PROJECT ENGINEER OR THE DEVELOPER'S -
FINAL ACCEPTANCE OF THE SEWER UTILITY FACILITIES
FOR SPRINGS AT HAMMOCK COVE PHASE 4,
PL20190002783, AND AUTHORIZE THE COUNTY MANAGER,
Page 215
November 9, 2021
OR HIS DESIGNEE, TO RELEASE THE UTILITIES
PERFORMANCE SECURITY (UPS) AND FINAL OBLIGATION
BOND IN THE TOTAL AMOUNT OF $7�968.06 TO THE
PROJECT ENGINEER OR THE DEVELOPER'S DESIGNATED
AGENT
Item #I 6A3
FINAL ACCEPTANCE OF THE SEWER UTILITAACILITIES
AND ACCEPT THE CONVEYANCE OF A PO _ _ OF THE
t�ON
SEWER UTILITY FACILITIES FOR 2061 NE BLVD.,
PL20210002229
Item #I 6A4
FINAL ACCEPTANCE AND
THE POTABLE WATER
FOR BRENTWOOD
AUTHORIZE THE C
TO RELEASE THE f
AMOUNTOF
DEVELOPEA,:
Item #I
.'iPT THE CONVEYANCE OF
WER UTILITY FACILITIES
SYHASE IA, PL20200000350 AND
Y MANAGER, OR HIS DESIGNEE,
OBLIGATION BOND IN THE TOTAL
0 THE PROJECT ENGINEER OR THE
IGNATED AGENT
FINAL ACCEPTANCE OF POTABLE WATER AND SEWER
UTILITY FACILITIES AND ACCEPT THE CONVEYANCE OF A
PORTION OF THE POTABLE WATER AND SEWER UTILITY
FACILITIES FOR THE PRH MEDICAL OFFICE BUILDING,
PL20210001404
Page 216
November 9, 2021
Item #I 6A6
RECORDING THE FINAL PLAT OF ISLES OF COLLIER
PRESERVE PHASE 16 (APPLICATION NUMBER
PL20210000695) APPROVAL OF THE STANDARD FORM
CONSTRUCTION AND MAINTENANCE AGREEMENT AND
APPROVAL OF THE AMOUNT OF THE PERFO
SECURITY
Item #I 6A7
RECORDING THE FINAL PLAT OF S
NUMBER PL20210000514) APPROVA
FORM CONSTRUCTION AND MMN'
AND APPROVAL OF THE AM(ALA
SECURITY
Item #I 6A8
0 -1%
(APPLICATION
'THESTANDARD
ANCE AGREEMENT
OF THE PERFORMANCE
RECORDING TH FVII.AlL PLAT OF TERRENO AT VALENCIA
GOLF AND CO Y CLUB — PHASE I, (APPLICATION
L Ok
NUMBERP 00 1880) APPROVAL OF THE STANDARD
S
FORMCOP44S CTION AND MAINTENANCE AGREEMENT
AND AP?VQTAL OF THE AMOUNT OF THE PERFORMANCE
SE
Item #I 6A9
AN EASEMENT USE AGREEMENT (AGREEMENT) FOR LOT
835 THE LODGINGS OF WYNDEMERE, SECTION ONE,
ACCORDING TO THE PLAT THEREOF AS RECORDED AT
Page 217
November 9, 2021
PLAT BOOK 13, PAGE 8 OF THE PUBLIC RECORDS OF
COLLIER COUNTY
Item #16AI0
DEVELOPER AGREEMENT ASSOCIATED WITH THE LAND
EXCHANGE OF THE COUNTY'S 3.7 +/- ACRE PAR-GkL (LESS
A
AND EXCEPT NORTHERN 0.6+/- ACRES), T BE CED
WITH THE 5.0 +/- ACRE PARCEL OWNED B E DVIISORS,
LLC SUBJECT TO THE TERMS AND CONDI - I SPECIFIED
IN THE DEVELOPER AGREEMENT --ienN
Item #16AI I ��N
THE PURCHASE OF PROPERTY,6RCEL 157FEE) REQUIRED
FOR MAINTENANCE OF T KELLY OUTFALL EAST
OF BAYSHORE DRIVE W �ESTIMATED FISCAL
IMPACT OF $52�500
CAPITAL IMPROVE
REQUIRED BUD
Item #16AI2
THE STORMWATER
FUND (325) AND APPROVE THE-
14DMENTS
AWARP-kT*JNVITATION TO BID NO. 21-7906 "PETERS
A v ,
VENU IDEWALK PROJECT - GRANT FUNDED" TO
COASTAL CONCRETE PRODUCTS, LLC D/B/A COASTAL
SITE DEVELOPMENT IN THE AMOUNT OF $247,365.75 FROM
WITHIN THE TRANSPORTATION GRANT FUND (711) AND
AUTHORIZE THE CHAIR TO EXECUTE THE ATTACHED
CONSTRUCTION SERVICES AGREEMENT
Page 218
November 9, 2021
Item #16A13
A BUDGET AMENDMENT FOR THE TRANSPORTATION
ENGINEERING DIVISION IN THE AMOUNT OF $618919474.66
TO FUND THE REMAINING FOUR (4) INFRASTRUCTURE
SALES SURTAX PROJECTS UNDER THE VARIOUS
SIDEWALKS PROJECT CATEGORY
Item #I 6A 14
AUTHORIZING NECESSARY BUDGET MENTSTO
$ET I
REALLOCATE FUNDS, IN THE AMO $825MW
0
WITHIN THE GROWTH MANAGEM EPARTMENT
STORMWATER BOND FUND
Item #16A15
AWARDING REQUES ROFESSIONAL SERVICES NO.
21-7902, "GOODLE T- K STORMWATER & DITCH
IMPROVEMENT ION B)" TO AIM ENGINEERING &
SURVEYING, THE TOTAL AMOUNT OF $674�360.23
FROM WITH E STORMWATER BOND FUND (327),
AUTHOR CHAIR TO SIGN THE AGREEMENT, AND
APPRO NECESSARY BUDGET AMENDMENTS
WMINKIlw0i
AN INTERLOCAL AGREEMENT WITH THE CITY OF NAPLES
FOR A JOINT STORMWATER AND WATER UTILITY
PROJECT FOR BROOKSIDE, SITUATED ON HARBOR LANE,
HOLIDAY LANE, AND HARBOR PLACE
Page 219
November 9, 2021
Item #16A17
A PROPOSAL FROM HUMISTON & MOORE ENGINEERS FOR
THE STATE REQUIRED ANNUAL MONITORING OF COLLIER
COUNTY BEACHES AND INLETS FOR 2022 UNDER
CONTRACT NO. 18-7432-CZ AND RECOMMENDATION TO
AUTHORIZE EXPENDITURE OF TOURIST DEVEL(VM
FNT
TAX FUNDS FOR A NOT TO EXCEED AMOUNT O��
IT
$1701460.00 AND MAKE A FINDING THAT TH
EXPENDITURE PROMOTES TOURISM CIN
Item#16A18
A WORK ORDER WITH TAYLO
PROVIDE PROFESSIONAL EN
THE 2022 DUNE PLANTIN
REMOVAL PROJECT AT
NAPLES BEACHES F
AMOUNT OF $3214
? 4
AUTHORIZE THLC
ORDERFOR
FINDING TB
Item #I
EERING, INC., TO
G SERVICES FOR
EXOTIC VEGETATION
9ERBILT, PARK SHORE, AND
AND MATERIAL IN THE
ER CONTRACT NO. 18-7432-CZI
TO EXECUTE THE WORK
POSED SERVICES AND MAKE A
S ITEM PROMOTES TOURISM
AN INCREASE IN THE COLLIER METROPOLITAN PLANNING
ORGANIZATION'S (MPO) PLANNING (PL) GRANT FOR
FISCAL YEAR (FY) 21/22 AND AUTHORIZE NECESSARY
BUDGET AMENDMENTS IN THE AMOUNT OF $80,988
Item # I 6A20 — Moved to Item # I I E (Per Agenda Change Sheet)
Page 220
November 9, 2021
Item# 1613 1
RESOLUTION 2021-228: A DECLARATION OF RIGHT OF WAY
EASEMENT FOR THREE COUNTY OWNED LOTS (I � 2� AND 3)
LOCATED ON BAYSHORE DR. AND THOMASSON DRIVE TO
CORRECT A 25 FEET RIGHT OF WAY DISCREPANCY
Item #16CI
A "SUBORDINATION OF COUNTY UTIL
(SUBORDINATION AGREEMENT) AS
FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF TRANSP
COMPLY WITH FDOT EASEMEN
Item #I 6C2
AWARDING INVITATIO
WELL DRILLING, TE
SOUTHEAST DRILLE
COMPANY, N
SHULTES OF
Item #16
,6
STSI�
D BY THE
A71ON (FDOT) TO
S
UALIFICATIONS #21-7859,
. 7AAAND MAINTENANCE, TO
RVICES, LAYNE CHRISTENSEN
T
TER SYSTEMS, INC. AND A.C.
A, AND APPROVE THE AGREEMENTS
Ai;)�ING THE CHAIR TO SIGN A FIRST AMENDMENT
AUTHO
TO CONTRACT NO. 19-7637, "GOLDEN GATE CITY
TRANSMISSION WATER MAIN IMPROVEMENTS DESIGN,
WITH JOHNSON ENGINEERING, INC., PERTAINING TO THE
DESIGN OF STORMWATER REPLACEMENT WITHIN
GOLDEN GATE CITY, IN THE AMOUNT OF $305,760.00
Page 221
November 9, 2021
Item #I 6C4
AWARDING REQUEST FOR QUOTATION ("RFQ") NO. 2108-
008, "NCRWTP RE -ROOF (AREAS 9,11 � 12913,14) - 5 ROOFS
TOTAL" UNDER AGREEMENT NO. 19-7539 FOR ROOFING
REPLACEMENT CONTRACTORS, TO FA REMODELING AND
REPAIRS, INC., IN THE AMOUNT OF $7241390.00
WITHIN THE WATER CAPITAL FUND
Item #I 6C5
N
THE SELECTION COMMITTEE'S RANANGYFOR REQUEST
FOR PROPOSAL ("RFP") NO. 21-791 *ZVI,. ITMAR FOR
COLLIER COUNTY MENTAL HEAA�LIVTACILITY," AND
AUTHORIZE STAFF TO BEGI OOTRACT NEGOTIATIONS
WITH THE TOP RANKED FI EANGELIS DIAMOND
CONSTRUCTION LLC, S A PROPOSED AGREEMENT
CAN BE BROUGHT B R BOARD CONSIDERATION AT
A FUTURE MEETIN i
Item #I 6C6
STANDAR-Q RUPPORT SERVICES AND LICENSING
AGRELeW NO. 21-033-NS, FOR INTEGRATED POINT OF
SALE/VMCLE SCALE SOFTWARE MANAGEMENT AND
ACCOUNTS RECEIVABLE SYSTEM, WITH PARADIGM
SOFTWARE, LLC.
Item #16C7 — Continued to the December 14,2021 BCC Meeting
(Per Agenda Change Sheet)
Page 222
November 9, 2021
RECOMMENDATION TO APPROVE THE SELECTION
COMMITTEE'S FINAL RANKING FOR REQUEST FOR
PROPOSAL ("RFP") NO. 21-7924, "CMAR FOR GOLDEN GATE
GOLF COURSE," AND AUTHORIZE STAFF TO BEGIN
CONTRACT NEGOTIATIONS WITH THE TOP RANKED FIRM
GATES GROUP LLC D/B/A GATES CONSTRUCTION, SO
THAT A PROPOSED AGREEMENT CAN BE BROUGUTBACK
FOR BOARD CONSIDERATION AT A FUTURE MP
I
Item #16DI 0
TWO (2) RELEASES OF LIEN FOR FU MENT OF
$52,503.72, PURSUANT TO AGREE OR DEFERRAL OF
100% OF COLLIER COUNTY IMBAC ES FOR OWNER -
OCCUPIED AFFORDABLE 1-101&� DWELLINGS
Item #I 6D2
AUTHORIZING TH IRPERSON TO SIGN NINE (9)
MORTGAGESAT IONS FOR THE STATE HOUSING
5
INITIATIVES P RSHIP LOAN PROGRAM IN THE
AMOUNTOF '$',- X5 AND THE ASSOCIATED BUDGET
AMENDM�&Ng
Item #16
A BUDGET AMENDMENT RECOGNIZING $3,157.43 IN
REVENUE RECEIVED UNDER THE HOME INVESTMENT
PARTNERSHIP PROGRAM
Item #I 6D4
Page 223
November 9, 2021
RESOLUTION 2021-229: TWO (2) SUBSTANTIAL
AMENDMENTS TO COLLIER COUNTY'S U.S DEPARTMENT
OF HOUSING AND URBAN DEVELOPMENT FY2019-2020
ANNUAL ACTION PLAN TO REALLOCATE COMMUNITY
DEVELOPMENT BLOCK GRANT -CV FUNDING AND HOME
FUNDING TO EFFECTIVELY IMPLEMENT FEDERAL GRANT -
FUNDED PROGRAMS lk I
Item #I 6D5
CHAIRPERSON TO SIGN THE SECOND
BETWEEN COLLIER COUNTY
ABUSED WOMEN & CHILDREN, IN
ADMINISTRATION OF EMERG
CARES ACT FUNDING PROGR�
nF.30101
LTER FOR
LUTIONS GRANT
AWARDING INVIT TO BID ("ITB") #21-7908,
"AQUATIC FACI IDE FLUME MAINTENANCE," TO 8
1
BLOCKS MAI CE CO LLC D/B/A SLIDEPROS, FOR
ANNUALA IC TSLIDIE FLUME MAINTENANCE AT
COUNTY TIC FACILITY SITES IN THE ANTICIPATED
OL
ANNU' ""V UNT OF $63,205 FROM WITHIN THE PARKS
AND RNIEATION CAPITAL FUND
Item #I 6D7
AUTHORIZING THE CHAIRPERSON TO SIGN THE SECOND
MODIFICATION TO THE FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF
EMERGENCY MANAGEMENT HAZARD MITIGATION
Page 224
November 9, 2021
GRANT #H0390 AGREEMENT, TO ACCEPT $34,193.13 IN
ADDITIONAL FUNDING AND AUTHORIZE THE
ASSOCIATED BUDGET AMENDMENT
Item #I 6D8
CHAIR TO SIGN THE SECOND AMENDMENT TO
AGREEMENT NO. 19-7500 BETWEEN COLLIER C
AND G.A. FOOD SERVICES OF PINELLAS COW,,\,,YY, LLC
D/B/A G.A. FOOD SERVICE FOR THE SEN100001)
PROGRAM
Item #I 6D9
"AFTER -THE -FACT" ELECTR
COMMUNITY DEVELOPME�
CORONAVIRUS RELIEF
THE FLORIDA DEPAR 0
SUBMITTAL OF A FY21
CK GRANT
G GRANT APPLICATION TO
OF ECONOMIC OPPORTUNITY
IN THE AMOUNT 0 "r,1067 FOR THE DESIGN AND
CONSTRUCI-71DN EW GOLDEN GATE SENIOR
CENTER FACI
Item #I 6D
AWED AND RESTATED LEASE AGREEMENT WITH
AN AM
MHP BEMBRIDGE, LLC AND THE ASSOCIATED GROUND
LEASE NON -DISTURBANCE, ATTORNMENT AND ESTOPPEL
AGREEMENT WITH THE FLORIDA HOUSING FINANCE
CORPORATION, ON COUNTY -OWNED PROPERTY LOCATED
WITHIN THE BEMBRIDGE PUD AND AUTHORIZE THE
NECESSARY BUDGET AMENDMENT
Page 225
November 9, 2021
Item #16DI I
ENHANCING AND PROVIDING ADDITIONAL SPACE FOR
CONCESSION AND STORAGE AVAILABILITY AT
VETERAN'S COMMUNITY PARK FOR RECREATIONAL
ORGANIZATIONS WHO PROVIDE SERVICES AT THIS
LOCATION lk I
Item #16EI
THE PURCHASE OF GROUP HEALTH
THROUGH SUNLIFE IN THE ESTIMA
$368,877 EFFECTIVE JANUARY 1, 2$
Item #I 6E2
AN ADMINISTRATIVE
PROCUREMENTSER
PROPERTY AND N
DISBURSEM
Item #I 6E3
,6
MANCE
OUNTOF
PREPARED BY THE
IVISION FOR DISPOSAL OF
ATION OF REVENUE
RATIF ROPERTY, CASUALTY, WORKERS'
COMPE TION AND SUBROGATION CLAIM FILES
SETTLED AND/OR CLOSED BY THE RISK MANAGEMENT
DIVISION DIRECTOR PURSUANT TO RESOLUTION #2004-15
FOR THE FOURTH QUARTER OF FY21
Item #I 6E4
Page 226
November 9, 2021
AMENDMENT #2 TO AGREEMENT NO. 15-6409� P25 DIGITAL
RADIO SYSTEM, WITH COMMUNICATIONS
INTERNATIONAL, INC.
Item #I 6E5
THE DONATION OF A 53-FOOT SEMI -TRAILER FRkM,THE
FLORIDA DIVISION OF EMERGENCY MANAGEM&N
(FDEM), AUTHORIZE THE DIRECTOR TO EXEC., TE THE
NT
ASSOCIATED MEMORANDUM OF AGREENONT""BETWEEN
THE COUNTY AND FDEM, AND AUTH
NECESSARY BUDGET AMENDMENT5�
AMOUNT OF �'
Item #I 6E6
24,225 TO REFURBIS]
RECOGNIZING CARRYF
FROM THE PERIOD J
2021 EARNED BY E
y
FUNDS FOR A Ta I
Item #I 6E7
'6
ESTIMATED
TRAILER
ON INTEREST EARNED
J-,Y2021 THROUGH AUGUST 3 1 �
UNTY GRANT AND APPROPRIATE
OUNT OF $51.26
EXTEN
,k�HE DEBARMENT OF BRADANNA, INC. FOR A
PERIODINOT TO EXCEED THREE (3) YEARS
Item #16E8 — Continued After -the- Fact Item #3 to the December 14,
2021 BCC Meeting (Per Agenda Change Sheet)
RECOMMENDATION TO APPROVE ADMINISTRATIVE
REPORTS PREPARED BY THE PROCUREMENT SERVICES
Page 227
November 9, 2021
DIVISION FOR CHANGE ORDERS AND OTHER
CONTRACTUAL MODIFICATIONS REQUIRING BOARD —
APPROVAL
Item #16F1
AWARDING INVITATION TO BID ("ITB") NO. 21-7 6,
"PELICAN BAY MEDIAN LANDSCAPING IMAP�R NTS,
TO LEO JR. LAWN AND IRRIGATION SERVI C, IN THE
AMOUNT OF $154,223.30, AUTHORIZE, THE tSSARY
BUDGET AMENDMENT, AND AUTHOR CHAIR TO
SIGN THE AGREEMENT
Item #I 6F2
THE USE OF TOURIST DEV ENT TAX PROMOTION
FUNDS TO SUPPORT TH MING DECEMBER 2021
KELLEHER FIRM HO UP TO $5,625 AND MAKE A
FINDING THAT TH NDITURE PROMOTE TOURISM
Item #I 6F3 Noll
IT TH M,
OMD
NI
RESOLUI� 21-230: APPROVING AMENDMENTS
(APPR ING GRANTS, DONATIONS, CONTRIBUTIONS
OR IN S NCE PROCEEDS) TO THE FY21-22 ADOPTED
BUDGET
Item #I 6F4
Page 228
November 9, 2021
A REPORT COVERING BUDGET AMENDMENTS IMPACTING
RESERVES AND MOVING FUNDS IN AN AMOUNT UP TO
AND INCLUDING $25,000 AND $50,000, RESPECTIVELY
Item #16GI
CHAIRMAN TO EXECUTE AN AMENDMENT FOR
EXTENSION OF PUBLIC TRANSPORTATION GRA
AGREEMENT (PTGA) GOZ 16 WITH THE FLO
DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION TO ]A
DATE OF THE AGREEMENT FOR THE S
ENHANCEMENTS AT IMMOKALEE I
Item #I 6G2
CHANGE ORDER #1 TO AG
"IMMOKALEE REGION
REHABILITATION - G
MATERIALS, INC.
$ 7 513 3 9.91 , EXTER
79 DAYS -1^
.-Aw 1,
Item #16
THEEND
AL AIRPORT
'6 "y
-�,-ENT NO. 20-77841
1
ORT RUNWAY 18-36
UNDED," WITH PREFERRED
�SE THE CONTRACT BY
CONSTRUCTION SCHEDULE BY
RESOL� ON 2021-23 1: THE BOARD OF COUNTY
COMMISSIONERS, ACTING AS THE AIRPORT AUTHORITY,
ADOPT THE A RESOLUTION APPROVING THE PROPOSED
RATE SCHEDULES FOR THE EVERGLADES AIRPARK,
IMMOKALEE REGIONAL AIRPORT AND MARCO ISLAND
EXECUTIVE AIRPORT FOR 2022
Page 229
November 9, 2021
Item #I 6G4
THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS, ACTING AS
THE AIRPORT AUTHORITY, AUTHORIZE ITS CHAIRMAN TO
EXECUTE THE COLLIER COUNTY AIRPORT AUTHORITY
STANDARD FORM LEASE AGREEMENT WITH EXEC AIR
INC. OF NAPLES DBA EXECAIR FOR AERONAUTI
OFFICE SPACE AT MARCO ISLAND EXECUTIYE�
I
Item #161-11
RECOGNIZING PAMELA WILSON, G
DEPARTMENT, TRANSPORTATIO�
AS THE OCTOBER 2021 EMPLOYEE
Item # 1611
MISCELLANEOUS CO
ONDENCE
Page 230
N
USE
ORT
MANAGEMENT
ERING DIVISION
THE MONTH
November 9, 2021
Item #16JI
A FACILITY USE AGREEMENT FOR ELECTION DAY
SPECIFIC COUNTY -OWNED POLLING PLACES
Item #I 6J2
BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS ENDO E
UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF JUSTIC UN�ITED
STATES DEPARTMENT OF TREASURY C ED
RT
EQUITABLE SHARING AGREEMENT,4 rIFICATION
0
THROUGH SEPTEMBER 30,2022 0
Item #I 6J3
TO RECORD IN THE MINU;W%"`0F THE BOARD OF COUNTY
COMMISSIONERS, THE WK NUMBER (OR OTHER
A tl PAYEE AND PURPOSE FOR
PAYMENT METHOD bUNTI I
WHICH THE REFE D DISBURSEMENTS WERE DRAWN
FOR THE PERIO '5' FTWWEEN OCTOBER 14,2021 AND
OCTOBER 27, URSUANT TO FLORIDA STATUTE 13 6.06
Item #I 6J'111�
N�
DETER:9E VALID PUBLIC PURPOSE FOR INVOICES
PAYABLE AND PURCHASING CARD TRANSACTIONS AS OF
NOVEMBER 3, 2021
Item #16KI
Page 231
November 9, 2021
RESOLUTION 2021-232: APPOINTING ELLE HUNT AND
STEPHEN JARON TO THE CONTRACTORS LICENSING
F551672=01C,
Item #I 6K2
RESOLUTION 2021-233: APPOINTING ROBERT JO
TO THE ANIMAL SERVICE ADVISORY BOA
Item #I 6K3
RESOLUTION 2021-234: REAPPOINTING YLE
THOMAS TO THE IMMOKALEE BEA 4#1ATION
ADVISORY COMMITTEE
Item #I 6K4
RESOLUTION 2021-235:
AND JOHN MELTON
ADJUSTMENT
Item #I 6K5
,6
INTING ELOY RICARDO
BUILDING BOARD OF
CH
A STIPUL,�%T FINAL JUDGMENT IN THE AMOUNT OF
$120100 $27�573 IN STATUTORY ATTORNEY AND
EXPER 'FEES� AND COSTS FOR THE TAKING OF PARCEL
1208FEE REQUIRED FOR THE VANDERBILT BEACH ROAD
EXTENSION PROJECT NO. 60168
Item #I 6K6
A STIPULATED FINAL JUDGMENT IN THE AMOUNT OF
Page 232
November 9, 2021
$32,000 PLUS $13,835 IN STATUTORY ATTORNEY AND
EXPERTS'FEES AND COSTS FOR THE TAKING OF PARCEL
11 95RDUE REQUIRED FOR THE VANDERBILT BEACH ROAD
EXTENSION PROJECT NO. 60168
Item #I 6K7
A STIPULATED FINAL JUDGMENT IN THE AM
$66,250 PLUS $21,652.50 IN STATUTORY ATT(A
INCLUDING EXPERTS� FEES AND COSTS FON
OF PARCEL 243RDUE REQUIRED FOR
BEACH ROAD EXTENSION PROJ
Item #I 6K8
A STIPULATED FINAL JUD
HMO
SPOF
W FEES
E TAKING
ERBILT
i�iT IN THE AMOUNT OF
$19,000 PLUS $12,205.39 TUTORY ATTORNEY FEES,
APPORTIONMENT FE EXPERTS'FEES AND COSTS
FOR THE TAKING CEL 11 86RDUE REQUIRED FOR
THE VANDERBI CH ROAD EXTENSION PROJECT NO.
Item #17 a-Tinued to the December 14,2021 BCC Meeting
-` 'V'w*te'r Agenda Change Sheet)
RECOMMENDATION TO ADOPT AN ORDINANCE CREATING
THE COLLIER COUNTY PUBLIC ART COMMITTEE TO
ADVISE THE BOARD ON ALL MATTERS RELATING TO THE
PUBLIC ART WITHIN THE ENTIRE UNINCORPORATED
AREA OF THE COUNTY, INCLUDING THE BAYSHORE
Page 233
November 9, 2021
GATEWAY TRIANGLE COMMUNITY REDEVELOPMENT -
AREA
Item #I 7B
RESOLUTION 2021-236: APPROVING AMENDMENTS
(APPROPRIATING CARRY FORWARD, TRANS
SUPPLEMENTAL REVENUE) TO THE FY21-22
BUDGET A
Item #I 7C
ORDINANCE 2021-44: RATIFYING
ORDINANCE NUMBER 202 1 -11 �
PARK COMMUNITY DEVELOW
ACKNOWLEDGE AND CO
D
RELATED TO THE LAN AfH�
�N
THE PETITION OF ESTiL
Item #I 7D - Move i?
ON -'qqk
NFIRMING
ESTABLISHED HYDE
,�YT DISTRICT I � TO
A SCRIVENER'S ERROR
'S CONSENT SET FORTH IN
NT
#9B (Per Agenda Change Sheet)
Page 234
November 9, 2021
There being no further business for the good of the County, the
meeting was adjourned by order of the Chair at 4:17 p.m.
BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS/EX
OFFICIO GOVERNING BOARD(S)4QF1
SPECIAL DISTRICTS UNDER T��TROL
PENNY TAYLOR,
(I'll"
0.7
I on
'ected
MIR
TRANSCRIPT PREPARED ON BEHALF OF FORT MYERS
COURT REPORTING BY TERRI L. LEWIS, RPR, FPR-C,
COURT REPORTER AND NOTARY PUBLIC.
Page 235