CCPC Minutes 02/01/2018February 1,2018
TRANSCRIPT OF THE MEETING OF THE
COLLTER COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION
Naples, Florida, February 1,2018
LET IT BE REMEMBERED, that the Collier County Planning Commission, in and for the County of
Collier, having conducted business herein, met on this date at 9:00 a.m., in REGULAR SESSION in Building
"F" of the Government Complex, East Naples, Florida, with the following members present:
CHAIRMAN: Mark Shain
Stan Chrzanowski
Patrick Dearbom
Edwin Fryer
KarenHomiak
Joe Schmitt
ABSENT: Diane Ebert
ALSO PRESENT:
Raymond V. Bellows, ZonngManager
Timothy Finn, Principal Planner
Jeffrey A. Klatzkow, County Attomey
Heidi Ashton-Cicko, Managing Assistant County Attorney
Tom Eastman, School Distict Representative
Page I of 16
AGENDA
COLLIER COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION WILL MEET AT 9:00 A.M., FEBRUARY 1, 2018, IN
THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS MEETING ROOM, ADMINISTRATION BUILDING,
COUNTY GOVERNMENT CENTER, THIRD FLOOR, 3299 TAMIAMI TRAIL EAST, NAPLES,
FLORIDA:
NOTE: INDIVIDUAL SPEAKERS WILL BE LIMITED TO 5 MINUTES ON ANY
ITEM. INDIVIDUALS SELECTED TO SPEAK ON BEHALF OF AN
ORGANIZATION OR GROUP ARE ENCOURAGED AND MAY BE ALLOTTED 10
MINUTES TO SPEAK ON AN ITEM IF SO RECOGNIZED BY THE CHAIRMAN.
PERSONS WISHING TO HAVE WRITTEN OR GRAPHIC MATERIALS INCLUDED
IN THE CCPC AGENDA PACKETS MUST SUBMIT SAID MATERIAL A
MINIMUM OF 10 DAYS PRIOR TO THE RESPECTIVE PUBLIC HEARING. IN
ANY CASE, WRITTEN MATERIALS INTENDED TO BE CONSIDERED BY THE
CCPC SHALL BE SUBMITTED TO THE APPROPRIATE COUNTY STAFF A
MINIMUM OF SEVEN DAYS PRIOR TO THE PUBLIC HEARING. ALL
MATERIAL USED IN PRESENTATIONS BEFORE THE CCPC WILL BECOME A
PERMANENT PART OF THE RECORD AND WILL BE AVAILABLE FOR
PRESENTATION TO THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS IF
APPLICABLE.
ANY PERSON WHO DECIDES TO APPEAL A DECISION OF THE CCPC WILL
NEED A RECORD OF THE PROCEEDINGS PERTAINING THERETO, AND
THEREFORE MAY NEED TO ENSURE THAT A VERBATIM RECORD OF THE
PROCEEDINGS IS MADE, WHICH RECORD INCLUDES THE TESTIMONY AND
EVIDENCE UPON WHICH THE APPEAL IS TO BE BASED.
1. PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE
2. ROLL CALL BY SECRETARY
3. ADDENDA TO THE AGENDA
4. PLANNING COMMISSION ABSENCES
5. APPROVAL OF MINUTES
6. BCC REPORT- RECAPS
7. CHAIRMAN’S REPORT
8. CONSENT AGENDA
9. ADVERTISED PUBLIC HEARINGS:
NOTE: This item has been continued from the January 18, 2018 CCPC meeting:
A. PL20170001083: An Ordinance of the Board of County Commissioners of Collier
County, Florida, amending Ordinance Number 2004-41, as amended, the Collier County
Land Development Code which includes the comprehensive zoning regulations for the
unincorporated area of Collier County, Florida, by amending the appropriate zoning atlas
map or maps by changing the zoning classification of the herein described real property
from a Rural Agricultural (A) zoning district to a Commercial Planned Unit Development
(CPUD) zoning district to allow for development of up to 40,000 square feet of
commercial development for a project to be known as 15501 Old US 41 CPUD; and
providing an effective date. The subject property is located on the west side of Old US
41, approximately one mile north of the US 41 and Old US 41 intersection, in Section
10, Township 48 South, Range 25 East, Collier County, Florida. [Coordinator: Timothy
Finn, AICP, Principal Planner]
B. PL20170001320: An Ordinance of the Board of County Commissioners of Collier
County, Florida amending Ordinance No. 96-79, the Eagle Creek Planned Unit
Development by expanding the golf course by removing one acre from residential tracts
and adding the one acre to golf course Tract H-1; by superseding and repealing prior
Ordinance Nos. 81-4, 81-114, 82-53 and 85-8; by amending the Master Plan; and
providing an effective date. The subject property, consisting of 298+/- acres, is located
southwest of the intersection of US 41 and Collier Boulevard in Sections 3 and 4,
Township 51 South, Range 26 East, Collier County, Florida. [Coordinator: Timothy Finn,
Principal Planner]
10. NEW BUSINESS
11. OLD BUSINESS
12. PUBLIC COMMENT
13. ADJORN
CCPC Agenda/Ray Bellows/jmp
February 1,2018
PROCEEDINGS
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Good moming, everyone. Welcome to the Thursday, February I st meeting
oflhe Collier Counry Planning Cornrnission.
If everybody will please stand for Pledge ofAllegiance.
(The Pledge ofAllegiance was recited in unison.)
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Thank you. And our secretary, Ms. Ebert, can't make it today. She has a
conJlict, so it's an excused absence.
So I'll go ahead and take the roll call.
Mr. Fastman?
MR. EASTMAN: Here.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Mr. Chrzanowski?
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: Here.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: NCd?
COMMISSIONER FRYER: Here.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: And Diane's gone.
I'm here.
Karen?
COMMISSIONERHOMIAK: Here.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Joe?
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: Here.
CIIAIRMAN STRAIN: Patrick?
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: Present.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Thank you.
Planning Commission - or addenda to the agenda. We have two items under advertised public
hearings. One is a continuation from the last meeting, the Old U.S. 41 CPUD. The other one is a change in
the Eagle Creek Planned Unit Development.
And the other - there are two items I'd like to add. One's an old subject but we'll add it because it's
being rediscussed under new business.
I'd like to have a brief discussion on the analysis of the MMs by staff and then also a database that
the county keeps and how it's kept up called CTS. I want to bring it up for discussion today so we can get
some resolution on that, and that's the only changes I make.
Does anybody have anything else?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN STRAN: Okay. Pla:ming Commission absences. Our next meeting is next
Wednesday night at 5:05 in this room. It's the cleanup of the remaining LDC amendments that we saw last
time, for the most part. Does anybody know if theyte not going to make it to that meeting? It should be
rather short.
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: I will not be here.
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: No.
CHAIRMAN STRAN: Patrich you're not going to be here?
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: I told you last time I could not be here for that.
CHAIRMAN STRAN: Okay. So one, two, tkee, four. We'll still have a quorum. If Diane can't
make it, we'l[ still get the quorum. So one way or another we'll be okay.
And the meeting after that is the i 5th of February. Now, that's going to - it's going to have one of
our bigger projects coming in.
And, Ray, that's the CityGate - no. Gateway project, Gateway Triangle.
MR. BELLOWS: Mini triangle.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Yeah, the mini-triangle prqect. It's a first of its kind for redevelopment in
Collier County, so hopefully we'll get ou-r package as early as possibly, and we'll have that. But I expect that
one's going to dominate that meeting, and that's the 15th.
Does anybody know ifthey're not going to make it on the 15th?
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February l, 2018
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: I will not be here for that one either.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. So we still have a quorurn, so we're good.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: Mr. Chairman, are there other agenda items besides the mini triangle?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: I dont know as of yet.
MR. BELLOWS: Therc were four items on the agenda.
CIIAIRMAN STRAN: Four?
MR. BELLOWS: Four. Well, they're companion - one is a companion item; GMP amendment for
the mini triangle.
CHAIRMAN STRAN: Okay.
MR. BELLOWS: The other is the Calusa Island Village, which is a -
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: That's rather short, yeah.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: Thank you.
CIIAIRMAN STRAIN: For the sake of the Calusa Island Village folks, if anybody is interested in
that, including the applicant, we ought to hear that one first, because that should go rather fast, then that way
we haven't got to keep them waiting the whole day for the other one.
MR. BELLOWS: Okay.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: And that takes us to approval of the minutes. There were none in - I don't
see any on the agenda, so there's nothing there to do.
And BCC report and recaps, Ray.
MR. BELLOWS: Yes. On January 23rd the Board of County Commissioners validated the Hearing
Examiner decision or determination for the Heritage Bay PDI. That was the only item on the agenda.
CIIAIRMAN STRAN: Okay. What was not on the agenda, which this board maybe - maybe
would want to be made aware of is the Isles of Collier project ftat I could not padicipate in has withdrawn, I
bclieve, their application as a result of the discussion at the Planning Commission. Is that fair to say?
MR. BELLOWS: That is my understanding as well.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. The next item up is chairman's report. Oh, Joe?
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: Yeah, just a question. Are they going to proceed with the project at
a greater -- at the minimum square foot level, do you know, or is it -
MR. BELLOWS: The only thing I heard is that they withdrew their application for the amendment
to reduce the square footage, but whether they're going to pmceed or not, I haven't heard.
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: All right. Of course, they still could proceed at the -
MR. BELLOWS: Yes.
COMMISSIONER SCHMITI: - by modiffing their design.
MR. BELLOWS: Correct.
CHAIRMAN STRAN: And if they did, the additional stipulations that were proposed or
volunteered may not necessarily come to fruition.
MR. BELLOWS: That is also correct.
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: Yeah. That pretty much negates any of the provisions that we
discussed.
MR. BELLOWS: Yeah.
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: So it's kind of -
CHAIRMAN STRAN: It could not be - it may not be a win-win for those that were opposing it.
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: Right.
CHAIRMAN STRAN: So, anyrvay, that's sometimes why compromise is a best solution, because
what remains may not be the better of the two.
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: Yeah. That's what I meant; the residents may see that project
anlway. It's just at the minimum square foot of 700 square feet.
MR. BELLOWS: Whatever their PUD currently allows.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Yeah,
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: Oh, well.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. I dont have any chairman's report other than what we've just
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February i,2018
use would you possibly have there that would produce outside sound? I mean, I'm not sure it matters that
much. Do you guys have anything in mind?
Well, Norm's not -- what's he got to do with outside sound?
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: He knows shrff.
MS. CRESPO: That's a good point.
Norm correctly notes that the second sentence states that the only two t)?es of uses that could have
amplified sound are the food store and eating place. So any other -
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Oh, yeah. All other commercial. Very good. Very goodpoint.
Thank you, Norm.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: Yeah, that works.
Now getting back, though, to the substance of the sound. It seems 7 a.m. to me is too early and 10
p.m. too late, so I'lljust raise that point ofconcem that I have. And I guess you're talking seven days a weelg
too, aren't you?
MS. CRESPO: Yes, sir.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Now, we have in the past had this issue come up, and that is the general
time frames we've used on the others. I think that's probably why they went with it as a starting point. I
don't - that doesn't mean we can't change it. Im just mentioning it.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: Yeah, understood.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Stan?
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: Just curious, what kind of amplified sound would be going
on at 7 a.m. on Sunday moming?
MS. CRESPO: In this specific situation there could be a breakfast shop with some outdoor seating
that could have some amplified sound is - would be my best guess ofa scenario that would apply to this
condition, but certainly a lot ofuses would not.
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSIC: Okay.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Anybody else?
COMMISSIONER FRYER: I have more points, but...
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Go ahead.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: So to me it's too early and too late, and I'm not sure that - well, I don't
know what the county ordinance is with respect to decibels ofsourd, but I'm told that there is such a thing.
CIIAIRMAN STRAIN: There is, and it varies betrveen the types of uses on the various properties
involved. Commercial against residential has a different decibel issue than agricultural next to residential.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: So in addition on the too early and too late, I have objections to the
weekend starts of 7 a.m. on a Sunday moming. Just seems to me to be way too early.
Then - let's see. I appreciate very much your proposal to reduce the peak p.m. traffic from 216 to
I 16. I think that's very definitely a step in the right direction. I ask as a questio4 though - and it really is
only a question - is this enough of a reduction? WeYe already over capacity, so presumably it's goi ng to
be - what was that number? 87 - 87 plus I 16 over capacity until there's remediation with a road fix of some
kind.
And I, for one, am not satisfied that the built-in remediation steps such as carpooling and the like arc
sufficient to facilitate a reasonable level of flow or control on the level of flow. So I raise that as a point of
concem as well.
Then I get into individual uses. And let me go through those. First ofall, under SIC Code 7389,
which is business services, miscellaneous. Ofcourse, that's very, very broad, but I looked those up and found
some that it seemed to me - well, from my perspective, I'm concemed about things like use of chemicals and
things that would just nahrrally increase in commercial traffic that might not be necessary for your planning
purposes. And the first thing I come to -- they're not numbered. They're only bulleted, but it's called
inspection of commodities under this SIC code. First ofall, I'm not sure what that means, but it sounds like it
could involve some big things.
MS. CRESPO: And this is on Page I of 12 under 16; is that correct?
COMMISSIONER FRYER: Well, I took it right offthe SIC code.
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February 1, 2018
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: What he's saying is, I believe, the exceptions you have for 7389, he's
looking for more.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: Exactly.
CIIAIRMAN STRAIN: I think that's what you're sayng.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: Exactly.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: And one of them he's concerned about is what he just mentioned. In order
to expedite this discussion, are there others that you have concems about?
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: Yes.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Could you just rattle those off, and we'll see where Alexis stands on them.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: Of course. Parcel packing service. Again, that suggests large things.
Process serving service suggests an activity that might involve people having disagreements of
various sorts at that location.
Produce weighing service, I'd like some more explanation on that.
Water softener service sounds like it might involve chernicals, possibly noxious ones.
Weighing foods and other commodities. And that's it under that SIC code, under 7389.
I'm not - I'm not inalterably opposed to all those. In some cases I just don't understand what they
involvc. But they struck me, upon reading them, as being, perhaps, you know, a potential for concem to the
neighbors to the north.
MS. CRESPO: Okay.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Alexis, what we'll probably do is when Ned finishes I'll ask you for your
comments, and then we can take a general idea from where this board matches Ned's concems or not.
MS.CRESPO: Okay.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Ned, do you want to go through the rest of it?
COMMISSIONER FRYER: Yes. The next one, SIC Code 7261, funeral services. And I see youVe
excluded crematories, but it includes embalmers, and they, ofcourse, use noxious chemicals. Again, I'm not
saying that this is definitely a problem with me. I'd just like to hear more about it to satisry potential concems
ofneighbors.
Garment pressing. Again, chemicals. Crroup care facilities; does this include substance-abuse
patients? And, again, I'm not necessarily opposed to tha! but I'd just like to know what we're getting into.
Clinics; I assume this would include total body massage and acupunchrists. And I realize, to the
extent that it's sexually oriented, there's already protection in there, but I'd like to maybe have a conversation
about that.
Membershrp organizations. The SIC Code 8799 includes pet stores and animal adoption sewices.
I'm not sure whether that's needed, not sure whether that would be objectionable, but I just thought I'd point it
out.
Paint stores, obviously going to have - that's 5231 - going to be noxious chemicals. Repair services,
the catchall - actually, I read that more carefully, and it looks like that's self+ontained; that's self-limiting.
Then retail services, miscellaneous, SIC Code 59 seems awfully broad.
So those are my use concerns.
CHAIRMAN STRAN: Okay. Well, do you have any other concems so we can wrap them all up
with Alexis now?
COMMISSIONER FRYER: No, I think that's all I have in total.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Do you have any comments you want to make before we talk about
them?
MS. CRESPO: I need to discuss with the applicants any concems they have wth eliminating any of
those fi.[ther uses. I think we've tried to go through and really tighten this up.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: To summarize, if I may, in three quick sentences or phrases: I'm
concemed about whether reduction to I i6 is enough, I'm concemed about the sound, ald I'm concemed
about uses.
CHAIRMAN STRAN: Okay. I think the - fiom this panel's discussion, before you spend time
with your applicant, we mlght want to see where we all stand on it. They're asking for the C3 uses, which is
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February l, 2018
one of our milder commercial sections of the code. They're next to a light industrial parcel on the south, and
they're across the street from a healy industrial park.
The idea that the pollutants or chemicals - I cant see from the uses described how they'd be any
more harmful than anything that already surrounds the area, and I don't believe from what I can -- in fact, I
got the maps ofthe wellfrelds; there are no wellfields, so there's no pollution from that perspective.
l'm not sure - and the sound only being restricted by the - to the eating places, and nobody else can
have amplified outside sound, I'm not sure how much ofa concem that is at this point with that kind of
restriction.
At least those are my thoughts on it. And anybody else on the Planmng Commission want to weigh
in? Stan?
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: Yeah. And I know it's a knee-jerk reaction, but when I hear
amplified sound at 7 a.m. on Sunday moming, I'm thinking of an AC/DC concert. And I know that, you
know, we're talking about a liftle background elevator-type music going on, and I don't have a concem with
that.
A lot of Ned's uses - that's very close to an industrial area. I don't have a concem with those uses
either. Like you say, theyte pretty mild.
And traflic - I go by there sometimes in the moming, and there's quite a bit traffic, but just r ait
another light change at 41 and Bonita Beach Road, OId Bonita Beach Road, and be through there.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Well, the tra{Ec is a good issue. It's one that we pressed hard for at the last
meeting, and the applicant came back and voluntarily offered to rcduce it almost in half. Ironically, to meet
the concunency, all they've got to do is meet the TCMA requirements ofadding a - kind of what I thrnk is a
useless clause to one of their SDPs saying they're going to have carpooling. And I agree with you, the whole
TCMA thing is a waste ofour time and consideration. But it's on the books and it is allowed and, therefore,
the property owner bas a right to take advantage of it.
I'm pretty comfortable with the traffic that you've dropped down to. You did that at a request from
this board, so I have to applaud you for that. I think that was a good move. I do want ouI Transportation
Department to comment during staffreport to make sure they concur that itrs wntten as we understand it to
be.
But I guess that's the other issues we'vc got to address. Anybody else have any comments?
(No response.)
CFIAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Now, with that, Alexis, whatever you want to do, you can do, and
you might want to -
COMMISSIONER FRYER: I'm not going to -- none of these rises to a level where I'm going to vote
against this, particularly since I didn't hear much support up here. But I'm satisfied that I made the record I
wanted to make.
MS. CRESPO: On one of those items, the sound, the applicant is comfortable reducing that to 9 a.m.
to 9 p.m. to address -
COMMISSIONER FRYER: That's great.
MS. CRESPO: -- that concem.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Thank you. That will help.
Okay. Anything else on your side, Alexis?
MS. CRESPO: We appreciate the comments and feedback. We have reduced the kips by 50 percent
in the intenm condition to try to address the concems. And I'll just note that a large part ofthose trip are
going to be this mail-order house, which our TIS runs it as retail-type use, but it's going to generate much less
traffrc than any retail use, just the way the ITE codes are set up. So the 1 16 is really a worst+ase scenario.
I'll submit that.
CI{AIRMAN STRAIN: Than} you.
With that, anybody else have any questions of the applicant?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: We'll go to the staffreport. Tim?
MR. FINN: For the record I am Trm Finn, principal planner.
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February 1, 2018
The project is compliant with the GMP and the rezoning criteria within the LDC; therefore staff
recommends approval.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Thank you. And Ray is training you guys well.
Mike, could you address the paragra.ph in transportation I mentioned to you yesterdayjust to take a
look at it and make sure it provides what's needed? Since you traffic people have these weird ways of
looking at things, I want to make sure we all look at it the same way.
MR. SAWYER: Thank you, Chairman. Mike Sawyer, Transportation Planning, for the record.
Actually, this is the fint time I've seen this language, so I would like to be able to see it again.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: We're not going to continue this again, and it's only one paragra.ph.
MR. SAWYER: I do not want to do that. I would just like to look at it again so that I - I believe
that it is to concurrency, which would be the preferable time frame. So if you don't mind, I would like to be
able to review this first.
CTIAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. We'll wait. How long will it take you to review it? Five minutes?
MR. SAWYER: Not even that, probably.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Well, go start reading.
MR. SAWYER: Okay.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Sixty seconds.
And I guess from Ray's perspective, or Tim's, ifthere's a transportation commitment and change,
why wouldn't the Transportation Department have alrcady seen it? Don't they have to rcview these before
they come to us?
MR. BELLOWS: Normally they do. I'm not sure when the change occurred. And there's normally
a coordination effort, but I'll have to talk to Mike a liftle bit more about what happened.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: And, Mike, I did mention it to you yesterday as a heads-up for today, so I'd
hoped you'd read the paragraph before today.
MR. SAWYER: Again, I did not get - I didn't see the language until this moming.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Do you have access to Cityview?
MR. SAWYER: I was hoping that - I looked at it in CityView, and I did not see it last night.
Admittedly, we had a NIM for our transponation planning last night, so I did not - I was not in the office
past three o'clock.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. The two sentences that are there, do you have any problems with
them?
MR. SAWYER: I don't. As - like I indicate4 the preference would be that "deemed concurrent"
with - to the permit - "to permit the prqect buildout" would be a preference from us as well, so we would
agree to that language.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Thank you very much, Mike. Appreciate it.
MR. SAWYER: Thank you.
CIIAIRMAN STRAIN: Anybody have any questions of staff?
COMMISSIONER FRYER: I guess I do, on traffic. The language that's used using words like
"concurrency" and "buildout," how does that relate to the concept ofcapacity; in other words, trips?
MR. SAWYER: Real briefly. What we look at wher we are reviewing zoning petitions is we look
at a five-year window and the capacity of the existitrg roadway system plus what weVe already got planned
for increases within that five-year period.
We look at what the current capacity ofthe roadway system is with the cunent trip counts we've got
now, and then we project those out based on both trips that we know are coming in, based on site plans and
plats, as well as other developments, plus we then look at what actually comes in with those SDPs and plats.
We take all of that information, along with our quarterly trip counts that we take every quarter and
we, again, project that out five years. And we find the differential between what the road capacity is and what
the remaining capacity is, and we look at that number and compare it to what is being proposed. If wete
within that capacity or that remaining capacity, then it is deemed consistent with the GMP.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: Right. So, rn other words, the capacity would have to get up to 87 plus
216 before they gotthe2161' is that correct?
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February 1, 2018
MR. SAWYER: Honestly, I'd have to review the numbers again, but I believe that's correct, yes.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: Okay. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Thank you, Mike.
Anybody else?
(No response.)
CIIAIRMAN STRAN: Appreciate it.
Any other questions from this panel before we go to public speakers?
(No response.)
CI{AIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Ray, are there any registered speakers?
MR. BELLOWS: No speakers.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: No registered public speakers.
Are there any members of the public here who wish to speak on this item?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Hearing none, Alexis, you obviously don't need a rebuttal, unless
you have anlhing else you want to add.
MS. CRESPO: No, sir.
CIIAIRMAN STRAIN: All right. With that, we'll close the public hearing and we'u entertain a
motion. There has been one suggested volunteered change from 7 to 9 p m. for the outdoor amplified sound.
Motion rnaker may want to keep that in mind.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: No, wait. It's 9 a.m. to 9 p.m.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Nine a.m - is it 9 a.m. to 9 p.m., Alexis?
MS. CRESPO: Yes.
CIIAIRMAN STRAIN: Thark you. Nine to nine.
Okay. Is there a motion?
COMMISSIONER FRYER: So moved.
CHAIRMAN STRAN: So moved to recommend approval subject to the sound - amplified sound
change?
COMMISSIONER FRYER: Correct.
CIIAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Is there a second?
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: Second.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Second by Patrick.
Discussion?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: All in favor, signifu by saying aye.
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: Aye.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: Aye.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Aye.
COMMISSIONERSCHMITT: Aye.
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: Aye.
CIIAIRMAN STRAIN: Anybody opposed?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Motion carries 6-0.
Alexis -
MS. CRESPO: Thark you.
CIIAIRMAN STRAIN: - thank you. That's an outcome that probably wouldn't have been the same
had you not asked for the continuance, and thus the matter got cleaned up, so I appreciate your cooperation.
MS. CRESPO: Thank you, all.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Thank you.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: *+*That takes us to Item 98. It's PL20170001320. It's rhe Eagle Creek
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February 1, 2018
Planned Unit Development. It's located at the southwest of the intersection ofU.S.41 and Collier Boulevard.
All those wishing to testi$ on behalfofthis itern, please rise to be swom in by the court reporter.
(The speakers were duly swom and indicated in the affirmative.)
CI{AIRMAN STRAN: Well, Fred, I'm sure glad youte going to speak, because you're about the
only one left in audience.
Disclosures from the Planning Commission?
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: None.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: None.
MR. EASTMAN: None.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: I did talk with Fred about a couple issues an{ other than that, there's
no - and staff
Go ahea4 Karen.
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Nothing.
CHAIRMAN STRA]N: JOE?
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: I believe I received an email, but I said I had no questions. I don't
know if that was from Fred or one ofhis staff members.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Patrick?
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: Just told Fred in the elevator he had a nice sport coat. That's
about it.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Would Fred - probably - and there's no - is there any member of
the audience here on this item that was going to speak or anything?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN STRAN: Okay. Kind of like the other office, if - we've all got the packet, we've all
read it. Staff is here. They've read it. I think it's a F€tty simple enough application, so no sense belabori-ng
the point. Do you have anythitrg you want to add to it?
MR. HOOD: I don't, just - I'll answer any questions that you guys have.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. And just so everybody's clear, it's just for a small piece of what is
being used as open space adjacent to the golfcourse to be zoned to be golf course. Is that generally what the
issue is, Fred?
MR. HOOD: Generally.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay.
MR. HOOD: They're expanding - just really quickly. It's for a short course play area to expand;
that H hact nght now is a driving range, so they're expanding that portion to Hl for a short play area. That's
really it.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: It seemed pretty succinct when I was rcarling it, so - anybody have any
questions ofthe applicant? Ned?
COMMISSIONER FRYER: Ijust had one. It's not so much ofan objection. It'sjust a point of
curiosity, because I have lived near golfcourses before.
And sometimes driving ranges are netted to prevent the golfballs from breaking windows and
residences and the like. Is that something that was considered? Have you spoken with the residents about
that?
MR. HOOD: That didn't come up in our neighborhood information meeting.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: It didn't?
MR. HOOD: The existing golfcourse or golfdriving range area - I'm actually not specifically sure
if there's netting on that side ofthe course. But it has not risen to be a problern for the existing neighbors.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: But yow proposal said no vertical structures.
MR. HOOD: No vertical -
COMMISSIONER FRYER: So from that I assumed that there was no netting.
MR. HOOD: And for "struchres" what we meant was buildings like outbuildings for maintenance
or bathrooms or things like that.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: That's really all I had.
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February l, 2018
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Anybody else?
COMMISSIONER SCHMIfi: I'd have to say, Ned, for the short game, if somebody's out there
hitting into the backyards, then that's a neighborhood - or the golf club issue, because they shouldnt be. If it's
just for the short game, it'sjust for chipping and putting and some other things, sand, hitting out ofthe sand
and --
COMMISSIONER FRYER: I thought it was a driving range potentially.
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: No. The driving range is adjacent to it. It's already there. The
driving range already exists.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: Got it. Thark you.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. With that, Fred, thank you.
And is there a staffreport?
MR. FINN: For the record, I'm -
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Go ahead. I want a long staffreport, Tim.
MR. FINN: For the record, I'm Tim Finn, principal planner.
The project is compliant with the GMP and the rezoning criteria within the LDC; therefore, staff
recommends approval.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Thank you.
Any questions of staff?
(No response.)
CIIAIRMAN STRAIN: Any members of the public here to speak on this matter?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Obviously not. Close the public hearing.
Is there a motion?
COMMISS1ONER FRYER: I'll move approval as presented.
CIIAIRMAN STRAIN: Is there a second?
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Second.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: By Karen, made by Ned.
All in favor. sigrifu by saying aye.
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: Aye.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: Aye.
CI{AIRMAN STRAIN: Aye.
COMMISSIONERHOMLAK: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: Aye.
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: Aye.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Anybody opposed?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Motion carries 6-0. Thank you.
MR. HOOD: Thank you, all.
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: Well done, Fred.
CTIAIRMAN STRAIN: That was probably one of the simplest ones you've had, Fred.
MR. HOOD: I think it was one of the quickest ones, too. It was like, what, four minutes, five
minutes?
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: We can make it more painful, if you want to stay longer.
MR. HOOD: Bye.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: *+*Okay. That takes us to a couple new-business items. I just have two
things to talk about, just - it will be real short.
The NIMs, we had a lot of discussions about the NIMs when Ned had proposed some videos and/or
transcribing. We're trying to live with it with the audios that we have and improving on that process. But one
thing I noticed - and I could not participate in the Isles of Collier discussion. I did review the audio and the
hanscripts and everything for that, and not knowing whether I'd participate or not - there were commitrnents
made by the applicant to the public at that meeting, and they werent in the recommendations, and they
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February 1, 20i 8
weren't in the writeup of the PUD amendments that staffprovided to this board.
So I would like to ask that from now on when an applicant tells the public that they're going to do
somcthing in regards to this quality or style ofthe land use they're asking for - in this particular case they
were going to have tile roofs, they were going to do a few other things. They were going to have a recreation
area. They're going to have a pet area. Those are all quality improvements that, on other projects where
they've becn volunteered -- and I'm thinking Vincentian -- we've put them in the PUD.
Now, we can't demand them because it's not necessarily a requirement of the LDC. But if the
applicant wants to volunteer them, we can include them as improvements that were provided - proffercd to
the public.
So from now on, I would ask that stafftry to look at those and make sure they're included in the
process going forward, and that will help us with the NIM issues.
The second discussion I wanted to have was on the database. There's an intemal database that's used
by staff.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: Mr. Chairman, I'm sorry. Before you move on to the second item --
CI{AIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. I'm sorry. I should have asked anybody if they had anyhing else.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: First of all, I've had exactly the same concem -- I think I raised it with
respcct to the mafter at the last meeting - that whatever commitments are made should find their way into the
PUD. But having said that and having, for the last couple ofmeetings, had the capability oflistening to these
NIMs, I just - I want to compliment staff for finding a solution that works perfectly well for me. I satisi,
myself completely that I've heard what has happened, and I feel more informed and better able to do myjob,
so thank you.
MR. BELLOWS: For the record, Ray Bellows.
And I understand Mr. Strain's comments, and I appreciate that we have made some improvements in
the process. Why - I have found in reviewing some of these is when an applicant is making what could be
perceived as a general comment versus this is what we are committing to do. But if they are mentioning it in
the meeting as this is what it's going to look like, then we can make that as a condition of approval.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Well, I think the interpretation of whether an applicant at a meeting makes
a general comment to influence the perception ofthe public that's there, ifthat happens and you think it's
general and not a commitment, well, at least list it as at least these following general items were mentioned by
the applicant. Let us make that decision as whether it's something that sways the public's opinion and
concems over how that project's going to evolve. That way when the public's participating, they know those
opportunities are there.
MR. BELLOWS: And we'll do that now that I understand your concem.
CHAIRMAN STRAN: Okay.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: One last question.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Go ahead.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: I must say that the quality of the audio taping is excellent. And we had
talked about people using their iPhones and the like. I'm not sure how you're doing it, but it's very, very
audible and clear. Is this professional equipment being used, or is it an iPhone?
MR. BELLOWS: The applicants bring their recording devices, so I can follow up with the staff
members who attended those NIMs to see if they're using an)'thing unusual or differcnt.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: Well, it's - I think it's established what I hope is a standard of practice
going forward, whatever it is, because it's really very clear.
MR. BELLOWS : I think one of the things that helps is the staff emphasis in coordinating thc NIMs,
that they take the proper precautions to get a good recording.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: SIAN?
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: At the pre-app meetings a staffmember writes down the
commitments, and the owner or developer or engineer, whatever, signs something on the bottom he
understand those are the commitments. Is it possible to do that in a NIM?
MR. BELLOWS: WeIl, there is a possibility for staff to take notes, and most do.
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February 1,2018
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: Well, not just notes but, you know, these commitments were
made, one, two, three, four, five, and then have the developer sign it.
MR. BELLOWS: Yeah. Part of following up with the staffreview of any iterr! once the NIM
cornment letter and summary is provided, staff should be working those into the PUD document as
conditions. And if thc applicant is determined that that is no longer a condition they want to support, that witl
have to be mentioned in the staff report.
CHAIRMAN STRA]N: Joe?
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: Yeah. I have to say it's - the staffplanner that is assigned that
project, it's got to be their responsibility to caphfe that information, and during the review, to go back and
make sule that it's properly presented in the documents that are proffered to us. So, I mean, it is a staff
responsibility.
MR. BELLOWS: It is.
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: If you have summarized notes, which typically you do as well, it
should be in those notes so that - that, again, that information is presented to us. But I really have to depend
on the staff. That's your staffs responsibility to ensure that they caphre that and it's presented in
the - followed up in the PUD. And if it's not, well, that's the kind of information that should be made public
again to the people who - at least who attended it saying, you know, we can't do this, or whatever.
MR. BELLOWS: Yeah. And where projects change over time, say, the NIM is held after the hrst
review and we're down to the fifth review and things have changed based on the staff comment, if it's
changed enough where the prqect - we would require the applicant to hold another NIM to address all the
changes. Where they are commitrnents, we'll have tojust make sure we do a betterjob ofconveying those
commitments in the staffreport.
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: I'll go back to the Atilles (phonetic) rezone. Of course, we had
Phil Brougham who was here. He was deeply involved in some of the negotiations between the develop - so
he caphued some of that as well, as well as your staff in pre - in the NIM.
So until - when it comes to us, all that iDformation needs to be captured and, typically, if someone
from the community is watching it as well to make swe that's in there, I don't know if that solves the problem.
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: Yeah. My - when you have a pre-app at Community
Development, a planner writes down all the commitments. Doesn't the developer sign something on the
bottom that that's his understanding ofthe commitments?
MR. BELLOWS: Well, there is a - pre-app notes that are - they may have changed a bit over time,
but when I was doing the meetings, they were a signahre page. But we have an operations team that
coordinates the activities and provide the NIM notes later.
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: Okay. I've been gone seven years, so maybe things have
changed.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay.
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: Almost eight.
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: What about .- in that case, the Isles case, wasn't it - the owner of the
property didn't want to commit to those, not the potential developer?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: No, no. On the Isles property, at the NIM they committed to certain styles
of the building. They said tile roofs. They said certain other things. And all I'm suggesting is when someone
says that they're going to do those, just to put them in the notes so we see them printed up, and we can know
which ones should be applied as stipulations. Thafs all I was looking for.
Anybody else?
(No response.)
CIIAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. The other item is there's a -- there's some data bases intemally at the
county that are used to check various things. One ofthem is called CTS, and in it they keep a running log of
the amount ofunits on a project.
The Eagle Creek projert that wejust finished with had a discrepancy in the number ofunits that were
built versus number of units allowed in the PUD. I'd just like to suggest to staff -- I mentioned yesterday I
was going to bnng thrs up.
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February 1, 2018
I saw this moming you had sent me an email that said you checked the SDPs, and when we had
talked, that you were going to check the tax appraiseB or Tax Collecto/s Office to se€ how many units are
there being taxed.
I'd suggest we still ought to do that, and that will at least make sure Eagle CreelCs got the right
reconciliation for its units it's supposed to have, ifyou don't mind.
MR. BELLOWS: No. We'll be glad to do that. I think, some time constraints, we didn't do it for this
meeting. But we did do the condominium documents, which gave us a pretty good sense of what the units
were approved for, so we felt comfortable relaying that information.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: I think that project has single-family and villas as well.
MR. BELLOWS: Conect.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: They may not be in condominiums, so...
MR. BELLOWS: Yeah. We also counted the lots on the platted lots.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. I just want to make sure everlthing that everybody's using is
accurate, so if we have issues we can bring it up and clean it up at one fell swoop instead of making people
come back again.
MR. BELLOWS: Definitely.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Arlhing else?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Anybody? Public comment? Anybody in the public here to comment on
anything at all?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Hearing none, motion to adjoum?
COMMISSIONER FRYER: So moved.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: By Ned. Seconded by?
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: Second.
CIIAIRMAN STRAN: Patrick.
All in I'avor. signiS by saying ayc.
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: Aye.
COMMISSIONER FRYER: Aye.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SCHMIfi: Aye.
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: Aye.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Anybody opposed?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Motion carries 64. Thank you.
I **:l ++*
There being no further business for the gmd ofthe County, the meeting was adjoumed by order of
the Chair at 9:47 a.m.
COLLIER COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION
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February 1,2018
ATTEST
DWIGTN E. BROCK CLERK
These minutes approved by the Board on as presented lr/ oras corrected
TRANSCRIPT PREPARED ON BEHALF OF
U.S. LEGAL SUPPORT,INC., BY
TERRI LEWIS, COURT REPORTER AND NOTARY PUBLIC.
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