PVAC Minutes 03/03/2003 RMarch 3, 2003
TRANSCRIPT OF THE MEETING OF
THE PUBLIC VEHICLE ADVISORY COMMITTEE
NAPLES, FL
March 3, 2003
LET IT BE REMEMBERED, that the Public Vehicle
Advisory Committee, in and for the County of Collier, having
conducted business herein, met on this date at 9:30AM in REGULAR
SESSION in Conference Room "E", 2800 North Horseshoe Drive,
Naples FL, with the following members present:
Members:
Pat Baisley
Nick Whitney
William Csogi
Dan Shriner
Allen Walburn
Collier County:
Michele Arnold, Janet Powers, Tom Palmer
(arrived at 10:00 am)
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AGENDA
COLLIER COUNTY PUBLIC VEHICLE ADVISORY COMMITTEE
March 3, 2003
9:30 AM
Collier Coun _ty Community Development Services Building
2800 N. Horseshoe
Conference Room E
ANY PERSON WHO DECIDES TO APPEAL A DECISION OF THIS BOARD
WILL NEED A RECORD OF THE PROCEEDINGS PERTAINING THERETO,
AND THEREFORE MAY NEED TO ENSURE THAT A VERBATIM RECORD
OF THE PROCEEDINGS IS MADE, WHICH RECORD INCLUDES THAT
TESTIMONY AND EVIDENCE UPON WHICH THE APPEAL IS TO BE
BASED.
PLEASE ENSURE ALL PAGERS AND CELL PHONES ARE OFF OR IN A
QUIET POSITION.
Regular Meeting
I. Roll Call
II.
III.
IV.
Additions or Deletions
Approval of Agenda
Approval of Minutes:
Notices
January 4, 2003
VI.
New Business:
Request for approval to Operate a Vehicle for Hire Service
a)Hollywood Limo's
b)American Medical Transport
c)Abbot Transportation
d)Bonita Bee
Request for approval on sale of business
A) Unlimited Airport Rides
VII. Hearing
VIII. 01d Business
IX. Complaint Report
X. Discussion
Increasing taxi fare
Announcements
Indira Rajah new staff member
XI.
March 3, 2003
THE PUBLIC VEHICLE ADVISORY COMMITTEE
Conference Room "E"
2800 North Horseshoe Drive
Naples, FL
9:30AM
Minutes
March 3, 2003
The meeting was called to order at 9:37 AM.
Csogi, Dan Shriner
Collier County: Michele Arnold, Janet Powers, Tom Palmer
(arrived at 10:00am)
-Mr. Csogi asked Michele Arnold to make a recommendation to
the board that Eric Hyde be removed as a member of PVAC due
to at least two unexcused absences. He asked that Mr. Walburn
be made a permanent member to fill the position. Michele
Arnold stated she would write the recommendation.
Attendance: Pat Baisley, Allen Walburn, Nick Whitney, William
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II.
III.
IV.
March 3, 2003
-Pat Baisley reminded the committee that they will need to find
a new alternate once Mr. Walbum becomes a permanent
member.
Additions or Deletions:
-Michele Arnold noted that the approval of minutes should be
for February 4, 2003, not January 4, 2003.
-Mr. Csogi asked that 6A be moved to 6D so that they could
have input from Mr. Palmer when he arrived. He also added 6E
as a time when Mr. Shriner could address the committee.
-Michele Arnold asked who placed "Increasing taxi fare" on the
agenda. Mr. Walburn stated that he had it placed o the agenda.
Approval of Agenda
-Mr. Walburn moved to approve the agenda as changed. Mr.
Csogi seconded the motion. The motion passed unanimously, 5-
0.
Approval of Minutes for December 4, 2002: Mr. Walbum
moved to approve the minutes of February 4, 2003. It was
seconded by Pat Baisley. The motion passed unanimously, 5-0.
ge
Notices
-There were no notices
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March 3, 2003
VI. New Business
Request for approval to Operate a Vehicle for Hire Service
A) American Medical Transport
-A representative from American Medical Transport was present.
-Janet Powers stated that all required documents were received
with the exception of the official receipt of the application fee,
which the staff does have. She added that the corporate name fell
under scrutiny of the state, the new approved name is American
Medical of Southwest Florida. She explained that the affa davits
in reference to 2,175 and 95-65 can be notarized after the meeting.
-Mr. Walburn stated that he was glad to see the packet was
complete and in order.
-Mr. Csogi stated that there is another company in Collier County
called American Medical Transport. Janet Powers explained that
the company he was referring to had not submitted their renewal
paperwork. The applicant added that she knew Steve Dershem and
he was currently in bankruptcy. Mr. Csogi explained that they
needed to make sure all certificate holder's interests are protected.
Michele Arnold stated that the company no longer had a
certificate.
-Mr. Walburn made a motion to approve.
-Mr. Csogi stated that they need to include the name change of
Southwest Florida into the application and the inspection sheets for
the vehicles needs to be included.
-Mr. Walburn amended his motion to include approval upon the
changes of the company name in the application and the inclusion
of the inspection sheets. It was seconded by Mr. Whitney.
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March 3, 2003
-Mr. Shriner asked that all the papers in applications be dated
appropriately.
-The motion was recalled. All were in favor; the motion passed
unanimously, 5-0.
B)Abbot Transportation
-Lawrence Comerford, representing Abbot Transportation, was
present.
-Mr. Shriner requested again that all applications be dated
appropriately.
-Pat Baisley noted a discrepancy on the vehicle for hire listing. It
listed the Lincoln as a 2000, when in fact it was 2001. Janet
Powers stated she would make the appropriate change.
-Michele Arnold noted that they needed to have the vehicle
inspection sheet included in the application. Mr. Comerford stated
that he could turn this in later that day.
-Mr. Walburn made a motion to approve but withheld until the
vehicle inspection sheet is provided to code enforcement. Mr.
Whitney seconded the motion. All were in favor; the motion
passed unanimously, 5-0.
C)Bonita Bee
-Robert Patterson, representative of Bonita Bee Airport Express,
was present.
-Janet Powers stated that noting was outstanding in the application
except the corporation name.
-Mr. Walbum asked why a criminal background check was not
included. Janet Powers stated they did receive a form stating that
nothing was found in the criminal background check and she could
get a form that verified the information. Michele Arnold stated if a
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March 3, 2003
problem was found, they would inform the applicant and bring it
back before the committee.
-Janet Powers stated that they received verification of the
certificate of insurance by fax on February 27, 2003.
-Mr. Patterson stated that he is doing business in Lee County and
that he has picked up people in Collier County within the last 60
days. Mr. Shriner asked why he had picked people up in Collier
County if he was not certificated. Mr. Patterson stated he was in
the process for certification. Mr. Csogi stated that they are present
to approve the certificate only and not to do code enforcement.
-Janet Powers stated that she would get a verification of the
criminal background check.
-Mr. Walburn made a motion to approve with the inclusion of the
criminal background check and inspection sheets for the vehicle.
It was seconded by Pat Baisley.
-Mr. Shriner was upset that there was no concern that Mr.
Patterson had been doing business in Collier County without a
certificate. Mr. Csogi explained that they were legitimate
questions and concerns, but he believed this was not the proper
venue to discuss this.
-The motion was recalled. The motion passed, 4-1. (Mr. Shriner
opposed)
-John Marsh, Field Supervisor, stated that he had stopped Mr.
Patterson in the past sixty days for operating in Collier County
without a certificate. Mr. Patterson informed John Marsh that he
did not realize he needed a certificate in this county since he had
one in Bonita. Mr. Patterson was issued a notice of violation and
then came in to get the appropriate certificate.
-Mr. Shriner asked if similar situations occur, that a statement be
placed into the application.
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March 3, 2003
D) Hollywood Limo's
-Mr. Robertson, owner of Hollywood Limo, was sworn in by the
court reporter.
-Michele Arnold stated that Vincent Mollo wanted to speak on
discrepancies that the Code Enforcement Board has had with
Hollywood Limo in the past. Vincent Mollo was a member of the
public and the neighbor of Mr. Robertson.
-The committee allowed Mr. Mollo five minutes to speak on his
concerns.
-Mr. Mollo stated that he was representing five neighbors of Mr.
Robertson. He explained that they did not want to stop Mr.
Robertson from running his business. They believed his business
had nice equipment, but the problem was he took care of it at
home. Mr. Mollo stated that Mr. Robertson had pressure washers,
compressors, spot lights, and two boats at his home for his
business. Mr. Mollo handed the committee records of Mr.
Robertson's Code Enforcement violations. Mr. Mollo and his
neighbors believe that Mr. Robertson is running his business out of
his home. He explained that they only want the board to be aware
of the situation, that it is in violation of zoning laws, and they
would like the situation corrected. He added that Mr. Robertson
had 2 limousines, a HumV, 2 pick-up trucks, and 2 boats stored at
his residence that were all business equipment. He explained that
although the boats were not used for service, there was signage of
the business on the sides of the boats.
-Michele Arnold stated that the ordinance allows for two vehicles
to be kept at the home, provided that two representatives live there.
Mr. Robertson stated that he does not keep two vehicles there. She
added that they have found he has been maintaining vehicles at the
residence. She explained that they have addressed complaints
from neighbors in the past.
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March 3, 2003
-Mr. Walbum asked Mr. Robertson if he was a commercial
operator with a commercial storefront. Mr. Robertson stated yes to
both questions. Mr. Walbum asked if he stored vehicles at his
home. Mr. Robertson stated that he stored one vehicle at his home.
Mr. Walburn stated that he sympathized with Mr. Mollo, because it
is frustrating to live in a residential area where people devaluing
the area by running a commercial operation out of their homes. He
added that he has been past Mr. Robertson's residence in the past
and noticed more than one commercial vehicle parked there. Mr.
Robertson stated that the HumV was his personal vehicle. Mr.
Walburn stated that the advertising on it made it a commercial
vehicle. Michele Arnold stated that this was incorrect.
-Mr. Shriner asked Mr. Mollo if there was an association. Mr.
Mollo stated there was. Mr. Shriner advised him to go to the
association and have their attorney write a letter.
-Mr. Palmer explained that this business cannot be an at home
occupational license and Mr. Robertson may drive a vehicle their
as a personal vehicle, but he may not operate any vehicles for his
business out of his home. He recommended doing the approval
conditionally due to all of the problems in the past.
-Michele Arnold stated that the commercial vehicles should not be
brought to the home residence or maintained there.
-Mr. Csogi asked if this wasn't a code enforcement issue. Mr.
Palmer replied that it is also in the jurisdiction of this committee
since they have the authority to make conditions on approvals for
those who have not obeyed the rules in the past.
-Michele Arnold reiterated for Mr. Robertson that he was noticed
today that he did not qualify as a home occupation and could not
have business vehicles at his home. Mr. Robertson stated he
understood and in the past he was unaware that he could not have
two vehicles at his home and at one point he had two there.
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March 3, 2003
-Mr. Csogi asked if Mr. Robertson had an office and phone at his
commercial address. Mr. Robertson stated that he had an office
there, but not a phone because he uses a cell phone for his
business.
-Mr. Shriner asked if he can stop at his home and leave his vehicle
at the residence during lunch or rest. Mr. Walburn stated that he
could, but this was not the problem they had in the past.
-Mr. Walburn asked Mr. Palmer if he could assist the committee in
the "verb-age" that would approve the application, but also satisfy
the residential complaints. Mr. Palmer stated that the committee
could make the approval conditional and that violation of the
regulations of the occupational license are a basis for the
termination of the certification. He explained that the ordinance
allowed the certificate to be revoked if the regulations are violated.
-Mr. Walburn made a motion for approval with the condition that
no vehicle can be stored on the residential premise for more than a
six hour period. He added that he included the explanation of
revoking the certificate provided by Mr. Palmer. There was no
second to this motion.
-Michele Arnold requested that they do not include the "six hour
period".
-Mr. Palmer explained that they are providing Mr. Robertson
notice that if he fails to comply with the rules and regulations, then
they have the authority, through a trial hearing, to revoke his
certificate.
-Mr. Shriner questioned the criminal background check of Mr.
Robertson. Mr. Palmer reviewed the ordinance and stated that due
to the listings on his criminal background check he would be able
to be an owner, but not a driver. Mr. Palmer added that he Mr.
Robertson should have notified the county at the time he was
charged with reckless driving. Mr. Robertson stated that he spoke
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March 3, 2003
with Michele Arnold and he understood he didn't have to do
anything since it was a misdemeanor. Michele Arnold replied that
she did not remember.
-Mr. Walburn made a motion to approve the application as
submitted with the caveat that he doesn't drive the vehicle's for
hire, that he does not store or repair the vehicles at his residential
address, and that if he is deemed to have the vehicles at the
residential address in excess of six hours, then he will be deemed
to be in violation of this board's request and therefore subject to
fines and/or license revocation.
-The committee discussed the "six hour" inclusion in the motion.
Michele Arnold stated that since the ordinance did not specify the
number of hours, they should say that the vehicles should not be
operated or maintained out of the home residence. She explained if
they got a complaint about a vehicle being stored at the residence,
code enforcement would go to the residence and let the driver
know that there was a complaint and if the vehicle is not being
stored there than it should be removed within a certain time frame.
She added that they would return to verify whether or not the
vehicle had been removed. Mr. Walburn stated that if a neighbor
had a complaint in the early AM, then they can take a stamped and
dated photo, and then take a second a few hours later, and this
could stand as proof. Mr. Shriner stated that he believed if they
put in a timeframe, then other applicants would want the same
inclusion in their approvals. He wanted to leave it open and let it
up to code enforcement to handle.
-Mr. Walburn adjusted his motion to "two hours". The motion was
recalled. It was seconded by Pat Baisley.
-Mr. Shriner reiterated his concerns that other applicants would
come in wanting the "two hours" as a precedent. Mr. Walburn
stated that this is not a policy, this is particular to Hollywood Limo
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March 3, 2003
alone. Mr. Shriner asked why this situation was so unique. Mr.
Walburn replied that it was unique because it addresses the
homeowners problems and the concerns of the owner. He added
that they can re-address this at anytime in the future if there is a
problem.
-Mr. Csogi agreed with Mr. Walbum, stating that this was a unique
situation because they had public input. Mr. Palmer added that this
was a "probationary" type of situation.
-The motion was recalled. The motion passed, 4-1. (Mr. Shriner
was opposed).
-Mr. Robertson asked what to do if he knew of other company's
parking vehicles at private residences. Michele Arnold gave him
the number for code enforcement, but asked that he keep in mind,
just because a vehicle has advertising on it does not mean that it is
a commercial vehicle.
E)Mr. Shriner addresses the committee
-Mr. Shriner stated that he believes they need to look into requiring
drivers to take physicals. He asked the committee to think about
this and discuss it at the next meeting. His concern was that many
people take this job and put passengers at risk due to health issues
that they have not reported.
-Mr. Csogi stated that he feels the ordinance controls the
businesses enough. He added that this should be left up to the
businesses to deal with and take up with their insurance
companies. Mr. Walburn agreed with Mr. Csogi.
-Mr. Walburn stated that he did not believe that any prudent
business man would allow an incapacitated individual to operate a
vehicle. He thought that it was asking too much to request owners
to pay every year for the physicals of their drivers.
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March 3, 2003
-Mr. Shriner felt that it was not a lot to ask, the cost was not so
high, and it was important because it meant saving lives.
-Mr. Csogi asked if it was a violation of law to ask someone about
their medical condition. Mr. Palmer stated that the problem was it
being "across the board". He explained that if a particular case
came across the board it was a different thing. He added that they
might be able to superimpose some kind of reasonable program,
but the question is if you want to do it based on age or another
factor, or if the committee wants to do it on a case by case basis
when a question of health is brought to the board.
-Mr. Csogi stated they could place something in the ordinance that
mandates if you have a health issue that would impair your driving
ability, then you must report it. He added that this may not keep
everyone from driving with health issues, since they may disregard
it. Mr. Walburn stated that the state mandates for certain types of
licenses that you must have a physical every five years. He used
the "mariner's certificate" as an example.
-Mr. Csogi reiterated that he wanted people to merely consider this
in the future. He added that he wants the board to consider
"capping" the business in the future. He believes that it might help
businesses thrive. Mr. Palmer stated that they have the authority to
do this with taxi's if they want to. Mr. Shriner suggested a survey
to ask the industry how they feel about limited entry.
-Mr. Walburn stated that he has concerns about the frustrations of
lawful companies being unable to do anything about the illegal
companies. He asked if they could have a predetermined
complaint form that could be easily filled out by the person filing a
complaint. Michele Arnold replied that they will discuss this
under complaint reports.
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March 3, 2003
Request for approval on sale of business A) Unlimited Airport Rides
-Bulend Duren, Unlimited Airport Rides, was sworn in by the
court reporter.
-Mr. Duren explained that he will be the full owner of the
business, Eleanor Klug was the previous owner. He explained
that he will be incorporated within the next year when the
money starts to come in from the business.
-Mr. Duren stated that he would keep the same name, operate
out of his home, and use one vehicle. Michele Arnold stated
that he did not have a home occupational license. Janet Powers
replied that he had it through Marco Island and therefore did not
need one through Collier County.
-Mr. Shriner made a motion to approve. It was seconded by Pat
Baisley.
-Mr. Duren stated that he lived in California and the company he
worked for required the drivers to have a urine and blood test,
and a physical. He added that in Marco he knew of a lot of
retired drivers who never had physicals to be a driver. He
explained that he believed it would be a good idea. He also
stated that he knew of some people who are drivers and have
physical conditions which they did not tell there employers
about. He suggested that the county hire a doctor to do
physicals for these businesses.
-The motion was recalled. The motion passed unanimously, 4-0.
(Mr. Walburn was not present, he left the meeting at 11:00 AM.)
VII.
Hearing
-There were no scheduled hearings.
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March 3, 2003
VIII.Old Business
-There was no old business to discuss.
IX. Complaint Report
-Michele Arnold stated John Marsh was present to review what
Code Enforcement is doing. She added that Ekna Hu is no
longer with the department, because she moved to a new
department within the division. She explained that the new staff
member Endira will be responsible. She explained that Endira is
currently going through the companies that have not renewed.
Mr. Marsh is calling these companies to see if they are still in
business. If a ride is offered to code enforcement through a
company that is not renewed, then a violation is given and code
enforcement reviews it with the manager of the company. She
noted that the files are currently in bad condition, but they are in
the processing of correcting this situation and bringing the files
up to date.
-Mr. Csogi asked if they could have a fast-track method if they
see a violation, similar to what Mr. Walburn was requesting.
Michele Arnold stated that they could call code enforcement and
they also have an online complaint system. She explained that
license plate numbers assist in this process and you do have to
leave your name.
-Mr. Marsh stated that they have done 9 vehicle for hire cases
over the past month. He added that they are going to try to go to
the neighborhood meetings and request that if they allow posted
advertising for businesses, that they check that they are legal and
legitimate businesses before they allow posting.
-Mr. Walburn asked if they could check up on the Hollywood
Limo company since there have been so many problems. Mr.
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March 3, 2003
Marsh stated that he does drive by the companies and does
random checks.
Xe
Discussion- Increasing Taxi Fare
-Mr. Csogi reminded the committee that they had been in a
similar situation in the last year.
-Mr. Shriner stated due to the increase in the cost of gas he
would not be opposed to $1 surcharge for each "drop" as long as
it was only for a limited time.
-Mr. Palmer stated that the last time they did this, it was only to
subsidize for the increase in gasoline. He added that they might
have reserved the right to do this through resolution. Mr.
Palmer stated that they would have to "recommend" this to the
BCC.
-Mr. Shriner made a motion for a recommendation to the BCC
to give up to $1 to the driver and to give direction to staff to take
care of the executive summary. It was seconded by Pat Baisley.
All were in favor; the motion passed unanimously, 4-0.
-Michele Arnold stated she would take care of the executive
summary.
-Mr. Csogi stated that a sticker noticing that the surcharge is
applicable should be placed on the taxis.
-Mr. Whitney asked about a time limit. Michele Arnold replied
that there would be a time limit placed in the executive
summary.
XI.
Adjournment - There being no further business for the good of
the County, the meeting was adjourned by order of the Chair at
11:33 AM.
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