CCPC Minutes 02/02/2017 February 2,2017
TRANSCRIPT OF THE MEETING OF THE
COLLIER COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION
Naples,Florida,February 2,2017
LET IT BE REMEMBERED,that the Collier County Planning Commission,in and for the County of
Collier, having conducted business herein, met on this date at 9:00 a.m., in REGULAR SESSION in
Building"F"of the Government Complex,East Naples,Florida,with the following members present
CHAIRMAN: Mark Strain
Stan Chrzanowski
Diane Ebert
Karen Homiak
Joe Schmitt
Patrick Dearborn
ALSO PRESENT:
Raymond V.Bellows,Zoning Manager
Fred Reischl,Principal Planner
Jeffrey Klatzkow,County Attorney
Scott Stone,Assistant County Attorney
Tom Eastman,School District Representative
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AGENDA
COLLIER COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION WILL MEET AT 9:00 A.M., FEBRUARY 2, 2017,
IN THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS MEETING ROOM, ADMINISTRATION
BUILDING, COUNTY GOVERNMENT CENTER, THIRD FLOOR, 3299 TAMIAMI TRAIL EAST,
NAPLES,FLORIDA:
NOTE: INDIVIDUAL SPEAKERS WILL BE LIMITED TO 5 MINUTES ON
ANY ITEM. INDIVIDUALS SELECTED TO SPEAK ON BEHALF OF AN
ORGANIZATION OR GROUP ARE ENCOURAGED AND MAY BE ALLOTTED
10 MINUTES TO SPEAK ON AN ITEM IF SO RECOGNIZED BY THE
CHAIRMAN. PERSONS WISHING TO HAVE WRITTEN OR GRAPHIC
MATERIALS INCLUDED IN THE CCPC AGENDA PACKETS MUST SUBMIT
SAID MATERIAL A MINIMUM OF 10 DAYS PRIOR TO THE RESPECTIVE
PUBLIC HEARING. IN ANY CASE, WRITTEN MATERIALS INTENDED TO
BE CONSIDERED BY THE CCPC SHALL BE SUBMITTED TO THE
APPROPRIATE COUNTY STAFF A MINIMUM OF SEVEN DAYS PRIOR TO
THE PUBLIC HEARING. ALL MATERIAL USED IN PRESENTATIONS
BEFORE THE CCPC WILL BECOME A PERMANENT PART OF THE RECORD
AND WILL BE AVAILABLE FOR PRESENTATION TO THE BOARD OF
COUNTY COMMISSIONERS IF APPLICABLE.
ANY PERSON WHO DECIDES TO APPEAL A DECISION OF THE CCPC WILL
NEED A RECORD OF THE PROCEEDINGS PERTAINING THERETO, AND
THEREFORE MAY NEED TO ENSURE THAT A VERBATIM RECORD OF
THE PROCEEDINGS IS MADE, WHICH RECORD INCLUDES THE
TESTIMONY AND EVIDENCE UPON WHICH THE APPEAL IS TO BE BASED.
1. PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE
2. ROLL CALL BY SECRETARY
3. ADDENDA TO THE AGENDA
4. PLANNING COMMISSION ABSENCES
5. APPROVAL OF MINUTES—January 5,2017
6. BCC REPORT-RECAPS
7. CHAIRMAN'S REPORT
8. CONSENT AGENDA
9. ADVERTISED PUBLIC HEARINGS:
Note: This item has been continued from the January 5,2017 CCPC meeting:
A. PUDA-PL20150002280: An Ordinance of the Board of County Commissioners of Collier
County,Florida amending Ordinance Number 92-10,as amended,the Tollgate Commercial
Center Planned Unit Development (PUD), by amending the PUD document to add
specific institutional uses as permitted uses on Tracts 7-10, and 15 of the commercial use
areas, "A" parcels, as shown on the PUD Master Plan; by amending the PUD document to
add specific institutional uses as permitted uses on tracts 16-20 and 24-25 of the
commercial/light industrial uses area "B", parcels as shown on the PUD Master Plan; by
adding Exhibit B to further define the areas that allow the institutional uses as permitted
uses; and providing an effective date. The subject property is located at the intersection of
Collier Boulevard (CR-951) and Beck Boulevard in Section 35, Township 49 South,
Range 26 East, and Section 2, Township 50 South, Range 26 East, Collier County, Florida.
[Coordinator:Fred Reischl,AICP,Principal Planner]
10. NEW BUSINESS
11. OLD BUSINESS
12. PUBLIC COMMENT
13. ADJORN
CCPC Agenda/Ray Bellows/jmp
February 2,2017
PROCEEDINGS
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Good morning,everyone. I shouldn't say"everyone." I think it's almost
just us and a couple of—okay.
Welcome to the February 2nd meeting of the Collier County Planning Commission. If everybody
will please rise for Pledge of Allegiance.
(The Pledge of Allegiance was recited in unison.)
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Will the secretary please do the roll call.
COMMISSIONER EBERT: Yes. Good morning.
Mr.Eastman?
MR EASTMAN: Here.
COMMISSIONER EBERT: Mr.Chrzanowski?
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: Here.
COMMISSIONER EBERT: Ms.Ebert is here.
Mr.Strain?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Here.
COMMISSIONER EBERT: Ms.Homiak?
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Here.
COMMISSIONER EBERT: Mr.Schmitt?
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: Here.
COMMISSIONER EBERT: And,Mr.Dearborn?
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: Here.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. There's one item on today's agenda. I don't know of anything that
needs to be changed under addenda to the agenda.
Ray,do you have anything?
MR.BELLOWS: I have no changes.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. That takes us to Planning Commission absences. Our next meeting
is February 16th. Does anybody know if they're not going to make it to the February 16th meeting?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Looks like we'll have a quorum.
The approval of minutes is the January 5th meeting. Those were sent to us electrically. Are there
any corrections or a motion to approve?
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: Motion to approve.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Made by Patrick.
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: Second.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Second by Stan.
All in favor,signify by saying aye.
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: Aye.
COMMISSIONER EBERT: Aye.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SCHIvIITT: Aye.
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: Aye.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Anybody opposed?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Motion carries 6-0.
BCC report and recaps,Ray.
MR BELLOWS: Yes. On January 24th,the Board of County Commissioners heard the PUD
rezone for Hamilton Place. That was approved on their regular agenda by a vote of 5-0 subject to the CCPC
recommendations.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Thank you.
Chairman's report: I just had one thing I wanted to ask if staff could do some research on.The LDC
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and GMP and other kinds of amendments that come to us,generally Judy Puig is in charge of handling the
packages for this commission,and she's well versed and does that very competently,but those other two
elements,when an LDC item comes through or sometimes I think it's GMPs,they may not always go through
her if they're stand-alones.
Is there some way that we could have the consistency of having her involved in all of the agendas for
this panel instead of others doing it?
MR.BELLOWS: For the record,Ray Bellows. I don't believe that would be a problem. I thought
she was involved in those,quite frankly. But if not,we will work to make sure that consistency's in place.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. I think it would be helpful to everybody. She has a good pattern
down,and we've worked with her a long time. So thank you.
Consent agenda: There are no items.
***We'll move right into our advertised public hearing. It's Item 9A. It's Petition No.
PUDA-PL20150002280. This is a continued item from the January 5th CCPC meeting. It's for the Tollgate
Commercial Center Planned Unit Development.
All those wishing to testify on behalf of this item,please rise to be sworn in by the court reporter.
(The speakers were duly sworn and indicated in the affirmative.)
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: And disclosures on the part of the Planning Commission: We'll start with
Mr.Eastman.
MR.EASTMAN: None.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Stan?
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: Not since the last time.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Diane?
COMMISSIONER EBERT: None.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Since last time I have talked with the applicant's representatives a couple of
times,there's been some correspondence and emails going back and forth,and numerous conversations with
staff.
Karen?
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: None.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Joe?
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: None.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Patrick?
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: None.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. With that,Richard,you want to take us through today?
MR.YOVANOVICH: Well,hopefully--sorry.For the record,Rich Yovanovich on behalf of the
petitioner.
Hopefully you have all received the strikethrough and underline changes to the PUD that have been
made since the last time we met incorporating the discussions we had. I believe all of the changes accurately
reflect the changes that were brought up mainly pertaining to buffers and assuring that the new uses can be
placed into existing buildings,I think,were the primary issues that needed to be addressed.
And if you need me to go page by page,I can,but I believe you have all of that;am I correct?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Anybody--I think that all came to us. There was some changes,though,
after that packet came out.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Okay. So I don't know—that's why I'm asking. I don't know exactly what
packet you have in front of you,so...
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: And I'd have to ask staff.I know that there was some changes needed to the
legal,the way it was legally--Fred? I know there were some changes made to the way it was legally
described in the document,and those changes have been corrected,but I just want to make sure—
MR.REISCHL: And have not been forwarded to you.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Then you're going to have to walk us through,if you don't mind.
MR.YOVANOVICH: I don't mind. If you don't mind,let me work my way backwards.
One of the issues that came since the subsequent review was we had legal descriptions with the
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property that was being added to the--actually not added to the PUD,but that the new uses were going to be
allowed to occur on.
There was a change in philosophy on how to deal with that and instead deal with it through the
master plan identifying the properties that these new uses could go on.
So there was a revision to the master plan to identify--and you've seen this exhibit before,but there's
a small modification to what you previously saw. These are the parcels in either the Section 3 or Section 4
uses that are eligible for the new uses on the property;however,these two pieces right here--and I think I
have those right,but I don't have my glasses on.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: That's correct.
MR.YOVANOVICH: We're in a condominium,and a couple of the condominium owners had not
signed on as part of the application.
We had originally intended to have just the unit owners that were participating in the PUD who had
consented to it participate;however,it was recommended to us that the condominium in its entirety should be
excluded from the eligibility of having new uses.
So we have deleted those two parcels from what you had previously seen as being eligible for these
uses,which resulted in,now if we work our way back to the forward,we no longer needed an Exhibit B,
which was the new legal descriptions.So we have an Exhibit A that identifies the properties that are located
on the property. And I don't think you have this changed page,but I'm not 100 percent sure.
We don't have another change—there were some legal descriptions that have been struck through. I
only have a clean version with me,but we removed some legal descriptions that were previously added that
are no longer in the PUD document.
Other than that,I think everything you should have at this point should be the same.
Am I right,Fred?
MR.REISCHL: That's my understanding. It should be—
MR YOVANOVICH: You already have—
MR.REISCHL: —except for the legals.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Right. And they're out. So those are what you have not seen and what's in
front of you.
We had gone through,and I hopefully better defined the types of social service uses that are
hopefully acceptable to the Planning Commission,because those-it was SIC Code 8322 that came up as it
has the big long list,and we said we'd come back and we would shorten the list to the types of uses that we
hope are acceptable to those on the Planning Commission who had concern about the breadth of that original
SIC code. So hopefully we did it okay,and if there are still concerns,please let me know.
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Pm not sure I understand them,because they're not listed the way
they are listed under that code. The wording isn't--you can't even figure out which ones they are.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Well—and that brings back the reason I gave Fred an overhead.
Please put it on the overhead,then Karen will be able to—it will be more easily rectified.
And the issue at hand is the language on Page--and,Karen,I agree with you;there's nothing gained
by the language that was presented to us.
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: I was trying to find it,and I couldn't.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Well,let's just walk through it,because on those lists there,and according
to what you submitted,it said,social services,SIC Code 8322,limited to daycare centers dash,adult. Okay.
That is one of the items in the left-hand column. You see daycare centers,adult and handicap. Then it says,
child development programs. I don't see that on here.Government then,dash,individual/family social
services. That's what's the title says,so now you're incorporating the title as a limitation to the whole thing,
which doesn't make a lot of sense.
Then it says,senior citizen centers or associations. That one is on here. Then it says,general
counseling services. That is not on here.So we've gained nothing by this submission.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Well,actually,if you'd rather we take the word"general"out and leave the
word"counseling centers,"which is on there,in,we could do that. We thought,frankly,by putting the word
"general"in there,it might be more limitation on the types of counseling services.
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I don't have an express definition,but it seemed to me that there were concerns about how broad
counseling services may be. I'm happy to delete the word"general"if that makes sense to make it easier to
understand that if,for instance,you have--you know,you want to go to a marriage counselor or if you want
to go to a counselor because you can't figure out how to deal with your kids and things like that,that's what
we thought general counseling services were. But Fm happy to better describe that if that will help.
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Well,those are listed out. I mean,if you want,there's family
counseling services,marriage counseling services.I mean,the list—it just is hard to understand what--
MR.YOVANOVICH: Well,counseling services as a general category is also listed according to
what—I didn't bring my SIC code book. I'm just looking at what's on the left-hand side.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Look at 7999 on the top.You said,7999,limited to,and you were very
specific about those items that are—some of them that are listed at 7999. You were supposed to do the same
thing with social services,8322,but instead,that's not what we got here. We don't have items that can
specifically be picked out of those bullet points.
In fact,the second or third one in says,government,dash,individual,slash,family social services.
That's the title. So basically you're saying by that one you want everything in there and circumventing
everything we asked you to take a look at. It does no good. I mean,I don't understand what you're trying to
do here.
MR.YOVANOVICH: All right. Let's take that one out. Is that okay?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Well,it's a beginning.
MR.YOVANOVICH: The beginning.
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Well,our discussion at that meeting--at that time was for senior
services,day care to be added. That was your concern that you wanted to leave that in.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Well,I think the regular child daycare was what I said.
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: That's different. You have another code in there for that.
MR.YOVANOVICH: I know,but we talked about both of those,because one of the issues that
came up was,is child daycare appropriate. And we said,well,would it make sense in this category for adult
daycare to also be an allowed use,and I think we took care of that.
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Well,they have--it's listed as adult daycare centers—
MR.YOVANOVICH: Right.
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: —centers for senior citizens,daycare centers,adult and handicapped,
old age assistance—
MR.YOVANOVICH: So what we have—
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: —and your senior citizens associations. Those are listings under that
code for seniors.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Okay. And don't we have those listed? The only ones--which ones are too
broad,if I remember,is the government individual and family,take that out,correct?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Richard?
MR.YOVANOVICH: And general counseling services.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Why can't this be approached just like you did the first one?
MR.YOVANOVICH: Mr.Strain,we were trying to do that.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: No. You were trying to re-generalize it to a point where no one would
know what of these were applicable at that site and,in essence,with the language you provided,all of them
would be reapplied.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Mr.Strain,it really—it really is not fair to tell me what I intended to do.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Did you read this document?
MR..YOVANOVICH: I did,and I did read it.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Then we'll see how hard you read it in a few minutes.
MR.YOVANOVICH: I did not intend to go back and put back in everything that we were deleted
(sic). That's not my style. It has never been my style.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Then if you read it,then what did you see government,dash,individual,
slash,family social services to exclude from that list--
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MR.YOVANOVICH: I thought--
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: --since it's the title?
MR.YOVANOVICH: I understand that,Mr.Strain. But I'm saying in Rich Yovanovich's mind,it
meant government services that deal with individuals and families,social service related,not the entire group.
Now,if that was the unintended consequence,I will accept responsibility for that,but I will not
accept someone saying to me that my intent was to try to delete then put it back in. I will tell you—
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Well,we each have our own opinion on that.
MR.YOVANOVICH: That's fine. But it was not my intent.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Well,I don't know if it was your intent,but it came out in a manner that
could have been interpreted that way.
MR.YOVANOVICH: I appreciate that,but I did read it,because we got a comment back,and
I--and that's what I thought it meant. I did not get comments back saying,hey,why don't you change the
words to this. Maybe that would be better.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Well,let's go back to what we anticipated in the first place. 8322 limited to,
and then let's look at—
MR.YOVANOVICH: Are we okay with daycare centers adult?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: I don't have a problem with that. Karen?
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: No. Yeah.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: It's Karen's area. I'll let her--
MR.YOVANOVICH: I agree.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: --jump in on most of it,so—you started it.
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: I mean,I just read the ones that pertained to adult daycare,and—
MR.YOVANOVICH: Instead of my trying to figure out which ones you don't want and the
limited-to list,why don't you tell me which ones you'd like us to take out.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: You want to walk through the list,then,one at a time?
MR.YOVANOVICH: Quickly looking,looks like there's five.
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: I thought you were just going to list the ones that pertained to
seniors.That was what we were talking about at the last meeting. And I read the minutes over,so—the child
daycare is listed under another code.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Are senior citizen centers or associations acceptable?
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Yes. Adult daycare centers,senior—centers for senior citizens,
daycare centers,adults and handicapped,old-age assistance. I don't know what that is.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Well,we didn't ask for the—
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Senior citizens association.
MR.YOVANOVICH: And we thought—and I thought social services,senior citizens centers or
association,was from the list of what we wanted.Is that acceptable?
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Social services? Where is it?
MR.YOVANOVICH: Well,you have social service centers. You have senior citizen associations,
so we were trying to limit that to seniors.
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Yeah.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Both senior citizen centers and then senior citizen associations. Are
those—is that category that we have okay?
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: I just said that on the other one twice already.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Okay. Well,I'm trying to go through the list of which ones need to come
out.So nobody likes,it sounds like,governmental-individual/family social services. We want that out,
correct,because that was believed to mean we were now bringing everything back in;fair?
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Right.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Okay. We're okay—are we okay with the characterization senior citizens
centers or association?
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Yeah.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Okay. Do you want me to change"and general counseling services"to just
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"and counseling services,"or do you want the whole category gone?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Why don't we follow what the bullets are that are on the overhead,and it
says counseling centers. So let's just leave it as counseling centers.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Okay. So I have on this--this is my—hopefully I took the notes correctly
for revisions that we need to make.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: What are child development programs?
MR.YOVANOVICH: Well—okay. I missed that one when we went through the list. Does
anybody have a problem with child development programs?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: I don't know what it is.Where on the list does it occur?
MR.YOVANOVICH: Can I move this so I can actually read it?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Sure.
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: Mark,a small point,but I think the citizens,I think the
apostrophe S should be an S apostrophe. Small grammatical point.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Well—
MR.YOVANOVICH: I don't see that terminology specifically used. I see the terms"youth centers"
and"youth self-help organizations." Would you prefer we use those two references?
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: You know you have child daycare services in there,8351?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: That's the NACS code. That isn't SIC. Why don't we stick with the 8322
description in the 1987 NACS code—or SIC code.Well,that isn't the one that's in front of us.The one that's
in front of us is the one we use in Collier County. So you tell me,which one would you like to use?
MR.YOVANOVICH: I'm just saying,Mr. Strain,apparently,when Mr.Duane was working on this
list,was looking at a more current version of the SIC code book. So we took a terminology from an SIC
book. It was not an—it was not intended to confuse anybody,so I'm just trying to explain how we got to
where we are with the difference in terminology.
So what I'm asking is would you prefer us to go to youth centers and youth self—I can't read it from
this far--youth self-help organizations,since that's in the current SIC code book.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Rich?
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: Why not use the term that's on there,"child guidance agencies"?
MR.YOVANOVICH: Can do that as well. I'm okay with--you know,child development services
is what's the more common or the more current SIC code book. So I'm happy to use all three of those.
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: Youth self-help programs,organizations. Youth self-help
organizations. I guess I'm waiting for you to tell me what you want so I can--
MR.YOVANOVICH: I almost called you,out of habit,by your first name. Mr.Schmitt--
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: Yes.
MR.YOVANOVICH: —Pm fine with all three of those;youth centers,youth self-help,youth
gui—is it youth guidance or guidance?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Richard,a simpler way to approach this--most of those aren't
problematic. I would think we'd be better off saying—
MR.YOVANOVICH: Most of which?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: The list you have in front of us right here today. The issue started with just
a few of these uses that were probably more extreme that might be benefiting an interchange activity center,
such as the alcoholism counseling,probation offices,parole offices,outreach programs,offender self-help
agencies,offender rehabilitation programs. If we were to take some of those out,the rest,I didn't think,were
problematic.
MR.YOVANOVICH: I agree,Mr.Strain.
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: I agree.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: We're going at it backwards.Instead of saying what should be in,because I
think that's a bigger list,we ought to just look at what should be out,then we just cross them out,and we're
done.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Okay.
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: So just—let's approach it. Say,instead of"limited to,"say
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"excluding."
MR.YOVANOVICH: Just help me. Are we referring to the list that's on the—
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: Pm going to defer to Karen.
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: So now what are we doing?
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: Just take the ones that are—
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Let's just walk through it. If you were to look at that list,the fifth
bullet down,alcoholism counseling,drop that. On the next list over,drop the two offender programs.
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: Right.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: On the ones down from that,drop parole offices and probation offices.
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: Chairman Strain?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: I think that gets us there for the most part.
Yes,Patrick.
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: On the left-hand side,second one down,bullet point,meal
delivery programs,is that an outreach programs for people in need for meal delivery,or is that a
commercial/retail meal delivery-type food service?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: That would be something I don't know without looking at the detail.
Ray,would that be a—would people be going there eating,or would they be just delivering? Do
you know from your—we've probably never had that question asked before.
MR.REISCHL: No. I believe that under that category,because it is a social service,it would be like
Meals on Wheels rather than Schwan meal delivery,which is a commercial use.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Does that get you there,Patrick?
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: It does,and I'm all for those type organizations. I'm just
wondering—again,it goes back to the issue--we talked about issues with childcare services,et cetera. The
type of people that might be coming there for these outreach programs,does that potentially cause any
problems?
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Well,no. This isn't soup kitchens or anything.
MR.YOVANOVICH: I interpret this to mean,nobody's coming there for the meal. It means that
we're actually going to deliver them to your house—
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: Okay.
MR.YOVANOVICH: —or wherever else.
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: Okay. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Right now we look at those five as being excluded;that pretty much cleans
it up,unless somebody else has others that seem problematic. We're taking out the alcoholism,the offenders,
and the parole and probation offices,so that's five of them. Does anybody have any more that seem
concerning for that location?
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: No.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: There we are. Doesn't that solve it a little bit better than what we've got
currently on the PUD?
MR.YOVANOVICH: I'm never going to argue with someone giving me more uses than I originally
thought I was asking for.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: No. You were originally asking for six—five more uses than you're now
getting. But that's as simple as it needs—it can be,Rich.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Mr.Strain,I understand that,and I thought the direction was to come back
and tell you what we wanted,not what we were excluding. So we had a failure to communicate.I'll take 100
percent responsibility for that,and let's just move on.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Well,now that we've gotten past that and we understand what six
uses are involved,does anybody have any other questions of the applicant at this time?
MR.YOVANOVICH: Which six uses are excluded.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: It's five uses are excluded.Yeah,those are excluded. Does anybody have
any other issues?
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: We have that on the record now,so...
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CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Yeah,we've—we'll have to—I have--this will most likely have to come
back.
MR YOVANOVICH: Oh,come on.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: We're not done yet,Richard,and after we're done,maybe we can talk about
whether it needs to come back or not. Since you read it--
MR.REISCHL: The commission would be comfortable with the SIC code excluding—
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Those five.
MR.REISCHL: —those five. Okay.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. If you could turn to Page 1. Mr.Coleman,your partner,probably
wouldn't appreciate his name being misspelled. I think that needs to be corrected.
On Page 6,property ownership, 1.3 says the subject property is currently owned by and under the
unified control of Tollgate Commercial Center.The properties in question we know were not. You have a
sky,something or other,involved in this,so I think 1.3 may need to be updated to reflect the other
ownerships.
On Page 11,under the Table 1,Item A,second sentence—
Ray,do you have Internet access to MUNI code?
MR.BELLOWS: Yes.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Could you go to MUNI code and tell me if there's a Section 10.02.13.6
Capital E.
MR.BELLOWS: 10.02.13?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: 10.02.13.6.E.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Mr.Strain,what page are you on?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Pm on Page 11 under A,the second paragraph.
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: I'll look that up if you've not found it.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Well,he won't fmd it. I just wanted him to acknowledge it wasn't there.
MR.BELLOWS: Thank you. Yes,I could not find it. I could still be looking.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. So that's the citation error.
Ray,could you go to 10.02.04.2. Tell me if you can find that. I mean,I know the answers,
but— 10.02.04.2. This is on Page 12,second paragraph.
MR.BELLOWS: 10.02—what was the last part?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: 10.02.04.2. It can't be there because that's not how we lay out our code,but
I thought you'd--
MR.BELLOWS: Yeah,I don't see it.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. If you go to 2.5 on the same page,it's that same one you
acknowledge is not there, 10.02.13.6.E. That's an incorrect citation as well. If you go to 2.6,it's
10.02.13.6.D. I don't believe you'll find that either.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Mr.Strain,help me remember.We went through a list of incorrect citations
at the last meeting. Are these the same list?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: I'd have to go back and verify it. I don't know if they are or not.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Because I'm just looking at what was in front of you the last time,and the
same cites were in front of you the last time.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Well,you—oh,so it's my fault I didn't check that last time?
MR.YOVANOVICH: No,I'm not saying that. I'm just asking—you know,look--
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: I'm not—if you think that this document leaving here today goes to the
Board and then gets recorded with these errors,it's not going to happen,Rich.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Mr.Strain,I'm not asking you to do that,but I would—could we have a
five-minute break;do you mind?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: No,I don't mind. We'll break until 9:33. How's that?
MR.YOVANOVICH: That would be great. Can I have a moment with you?
(A brief recess was had.)
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. We're back on record.And I had a discussion with Mr.Yovanovich,
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and he's acknowledged that there are some incorrect citations. We don't know today what those citations are
correct--need to be corrected.Staff apparently missed it as well.
I will move through the rest of them just to point them out,and at the end we'll have a discussion on
how this can be finalized in a manner that may at least save the applicant's ability to come back on consent.
There's a bunch of conflicting schedules that would make consent difficult.
So I'm more than willing to try to get this fixed without a consent,but we do have to get it fixed.
So on Page 12,the 2.8,that citation is in error as well. If we can move down to 3.3.1.A—and this is
on Page 15,the suggestion from--I talked to Ms.Ashton before—she wasn't able to be here—and she
suggested that the sentence read,in addition to the uses set forth in 3.3.A,the following principal uses are
permitted on Tracts 7,8,and 9 as shown on the master plan,Exhibit A.
COMMISSIONER EBERT: Mark,I have a question.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Yes.
COMMISSIONER EBERT: They said they were using an updated SIC book. Why are they not
using the same one that the county uses?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Well,I think for the most part they are. There were just some
generalizations in that version that we saw that weren't the same as we use,and that's been fixed by the
exclusions now on 8322. The rest of them are consistent.
COMMISSIONER EBERT: Okay.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Tracts 7,8,and 9?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Tract 7,8,and 9. And the next one we go to,which will be 431 --if there's
a problem with that we'll--
MR.YOVANOVICH: And there's a small portion of 10.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: That's right. There is.That was added back in after the legals were
modified. Okay.
MR.YOVANOVICH: And a portion of 10.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Yeah.
MR.YOVANOVICH: On the PUD master plan.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Yep.
On Page 16,No.8,the new reference to Section 5.06.00 just needs to be underlined. It's new
language.
Number 9,No.9 reads the minimum off-street parking and off-street loading requirements,
semicolon or colon,as required by Division 4.05.00 of the Land Development Code. It should read,as
required by Division 2.3,and then that crossed out as old language because that's how it exists in the PUD,
then add the word"Section"before 4.05.00 and underline those two words. .
Under No. 10,minimum landscape requirement,Ms.Ashton reviewed this and had a couple other
comments.
Under—where it says A,landscape buffer width requirement adjacent to CR84 and CR951,colon,
CR84,five feet,and CR951,then there's a period. The period needs to be a comma,and it should say 10 feet
Type D buffer. But the landscape--then it goes on with the rest of the sentence.
MR.YOVANOVICH: D as in dog?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Pardon me?
MR.YOVANOVICH: D as in dog.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: D as in dog,yes.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: With the landscape installation requirement set forth in the Land
Development Code,and then the 4.06.02.C.1 is supposed to be just C.4,not C-1.4. Then you can drop the
rest of that sentence because that's redundant.
MR.YOVANOVICH: So C.4?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: That's correct. You don't need the C-1.4. That's another citation that's a
problem.
Under B,the landscape buffer width requirement adjacent to interior platted streets,colon,five feet
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with a Type A buffer instead of Alternative A. And the citation on that one is 4.06.02.0 dot 1,not dash 1.
Then drop the rest of that sentence.
MR.STONE: Mr.Chair?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Yes.
MR.STONE: Just one point of clarification.After Type A buffer,it should say Type A buffer
pursuant to.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. That's right. Well,it says--now it says it will be Type A buffer of
the Land Development Code,and it will say pursuant to the Land Development Code is what you're
suggesting,right?
MR. STONE: Correct.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Then that gets us to Page 17,a small grammatical under Item D. The
citation is 4.06.00,landscaping,comma,buffering,comma,and vegetation retention. The comma was
missing between landscaping and buffering.
Under No. 12,uses set forth in section--the S should be capitalized,and it says 4.3.1,but that's from
the next section. So this one should read 3.3.1. It's on Page 17.
That takes us to Page 20,which is Section 4.3.1. The sentence in the beginning needs to be changed
to reference the tracts involved,and it should say,in addition to the uses set forth in Section 4.3.A,the
following principal uses are permitted on Tracts 16 through 20 and 24 through 25. And it's shown on the
PUD master plan,Exhibit A.
And in that one we'll also be correcting the exclusions to section--SIC Code 8322.
On Item--Page 21 towards the bottom,No. 10,the same corrections to A and B that were just talked
about on Section 3.3.A,and 10A and B would apply.
Same correction to No. 10.D would apply.That's just a comma between--in the title. And that page,
this is—now we're on Page 22. On that page the Paragraph 12 is correct because it does reference Section
4.3.1.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Do you want me to capitalize the S?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: The S,thank you.
When we move into Page 25 a couple pages down,Ms.Ashton noted that the fourth line of A,code
of ordinances should read Code of Laws and Ordinances,and that,again,is an incorrect citation to the
utilities section involved. I don't know what the right one is,but that will have to be-
MS.STONE: Mr.Chair,I can tell you the correct citation.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay.
MS.STONE: It's 134-57.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. And this one is 1.3.5.7,so that needs to change to 134-57.
MS.STONE: Yes.
MR.YOVANOVICH: So it should read Code of Laws and Ordinances,Chapter 134-57,and then
strike the rest of that?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: I think that would—is that right--
MR.STONE: That's right.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: --or is that just a section?
MS.STONE: You can simply replace this 1.3.5.7 with 134-57.
MR.YOVANOVICH: So it's Section 134-57,okay.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: If we go to Page 26 at the top of the page under B,this one is referenced to
a 201-19. First of all,it's not a right-of-way ordinance. It would be a Collier County ordinance.And
it--that's,again,another incorrect citation. I don't know—I did not take the time to figure out which one it
should be.
And No.C,Collier County code,and it should be Code of Laws and Ordinances,Chapter 22.
We move down to 5.7 on the bottom of Page 26,Item 6C,it's referring to the old division of the
Land Development Code that used to have the excavation permit. That would need to be corrected consistent
with the other reference to excavation.
MR.YOVANOVICH: I'm sorry,Mr.Strain. I was behind you. Which one?
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February 2,2017
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: 5.7.C. That an old reference. It needs to be corrected. You had caught it in
one of the other parts of the document,but it wasn't caught here.
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: Is the EER correct on that? Isn't that the old designation of the
organization? Isn't it DEP now?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Might be,yeah.
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: And then instead of ACOE,it should be—USACE,U.S.Army
Corps or Engineers. ACOE is improper. USACE.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: If we move down to the next page,Item D doesn't exist in the reference ifs
at. Ifs at 60.06.01,street system requirements.I asked Mike Sawyer to help clarify this.
Mike,did you find a correct reference?
MR.SAWYER: For the record,Mike Sawyer,Transportation Planning.
I think this is actually fairly simple. I think the reference was meant to be LDC Chapter 6.06.01.H.2.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Six-point--
MR.SAWYER: 06.01.H.2.
MR.YOVANOVICH: So ifs LDC section--
MR.SAWYER: Correct,with a Capital S.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: So if that correction is made,that will take care of that one. Thank you.
MR.SAWYER: Correct. I can also give you the correct ordinance.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: By the way,in B,it would be referring to,Richard,Collier County Code of
Laws and Ordinances again,I believe.
MR.YOVANOVICH: I got that one.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Mike?
MR.SAWYER: Going back on Page 26,top of the page,B,I believe the correct ordinance
reference there is 93.64.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Dash 64?
MS.STONE: If I may,Mr.Chair. Again,I believe the current right-of-way ordinance would be
03-37. If I'm incorrect,please let me know.
MR.SAWYER: Oh,I apologize. You're right.Yes.
MS.STONE: And if that's the case,it should read 03-3 7,as amended.
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: Could I ask something? 5.8.D,all traffic control devices,
why didn't they just put a period after MUTCD,Manual on Uniform Traffic Control Devices? Sony. You
know
COMMISSIONER EBERT: There's a lot of corrections.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Why didn't they what,now?
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: Just put a period after Manual on Uniform Traffic Control
Devices.Why do you have to put as required by chapter whatever? We always just used to say,you know,
conform to the MUTCD.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Mike?
MR.SAWYER: Staff would also agree with that and,quite honestly,that whole section could be
stricken because we're always held to that same standard and always have.
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: It's redundant.
MR.SAWYER: Correct.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Well,then we'd have to change all the lettering and everything else. So let's
just strike--let's leave it generic,like Stan's suggesting. I think that cleans it up nice.
MR.SAWYER: Agree. It's a developed PUD,obviously.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay.
MR.YOVANOVICH: So D ends at devices,period?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Correct.
MR YOVANOVICH: Like the rest.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: If we get into the last page,which is your mapping or your master plan,you
had this language there. It was struck out,part of it was. There's two things I would suggest. Where the
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arrow's pointing,instead of saying see Sections 3.4 and 4.3 for permitted uses of the PUD,really the whole
PUD has the permitted uses spelled out. So why don't we change that reference to say additional permitted
uses per Sections 3.31,and 4.31 for those tracts that we are dealing with in this particular PUDA. Because
the whole PUD automatically falls under 3.3 and 4.3,but only those parcels have 3.31 and 4.31.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Well,you probably don't need this at all now that we've gone back and
added to the individual sections the actual tract numbers,because this was--before,we did not have
reference to which tracts within those sections.Like,for instance,7,8 and 9 and a portion of--Pm sorry.
Previously we didn't--Heidi hadn't suggested we add Tracts 7,8,9 and a portion of 10,so we had to go to
the actual PUD master plan.Now that we've called them out by number,I'm not sure you need to do that.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Yeah,that's a better idea,and I like it,because the next item I was going to
suggest is the yellow's not going to show up on recording because it's only black and white,and we'd have to
deal with that by some form of crosshatching.
So why don't we just drop the PUD master plan and accept completely,because it's already in the
existing PUD. This is no different than the existing PUD,right?
MR.STONE: Mr.Chair,that would seem to be acceptable except I believe there was one reference
to a portion of one of the tracts.
MR.YOVANOVICH: A portion of Tract 10.
MS.STONE: And I don't know how you would maintain that reference without—
MR.YOVANOVICH: Well,the issue—obviously,this is not to scale. The portion of Tract 10
really is going to be governed by what the legal description is for the condominium encompassing 15 and the
remaining portion of Tract 10,so—
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Is that piece of Tract 10 part of condominium?
MR.YOVANOVICH: No.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Then why don't we just say that portion of Tract 10 that's not part of
existing condominium on Tract 10.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Will that work for you,Scott,to get you to where we now know with
specificity?
MS.STONE: Well,it may not be a condominium in perpetuity. I think the simplest thing would be
to have some form of legal description. But some kind of more definitive reference,I think,would be
helpful.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Well,you know what we could do is take the master plan,crosshatch just
that small sliver of Portion 10 with just a footnote or just an arrow going to it,say,a portion of Tract 10,then
the reference can be tied to the text.
Does that--the text was changed to say a portion of Tract 10,so all we have to do is add an arrow
with the text on the master plan saying portion of Tract 10,pointing to that little strip,and that would—I
think it would take care of it,wouldn't it,from your perspective,Scott?
MR.STONE: I believe so.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Richard?
MR.YOVANOVICH: I'm happy to work with Scott to come up with the appropriate way to do that
and subject to your reviewing it and making sure we got it right.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Well,that takes us through the document and the changes in the
citation and the various SIC codes and the master plan,all the items that need to be corrected.
Now,there is—Mr.Yovanovich expressed a desire last month and again today to try to get this
resolved today without going to consent for various schedules. And we tried to accommodate that schedule.
I'm more than willing to take the responsibility with staff to review these corrections when they come back,
since most of them are notes that I have brought up,if the Planning Commission is comfortable with that in
lieu of a consent hearing.
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: I'm very comfortable with it. I certainly don't want to get this back
again and go over what I would call editing errors.And I defer to you to get with staff and make sure it's
corrected before it goes to the Board.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Well,then as long as you're happy with that,I'd suggest we
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not--when we get done with this hearing,we won't need a motion to have a consent hearing then. We'll just
move it forward like we always do.
MR.BELLOWS: Correct.
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: The only thing we need to do is vote on the language that has
changed,not—the other citation and such.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: We've got to get staffs report and then public speakers.
MR.REISCHL: And if I could just emphasize the speed that this needs to be done with. Pm already
late for Level 2. I know that means nothing to you. But it's--for the 2/28 meeting,it should be in the next
step of reviewers.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: When should it be in? When do you need to submit this?
MR.REISCHL: Should be in last Tuesday.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: To get to the date that we already tried to establish?
MR.REISCHL: I mean,they're working with me,but I'm getting daily emails saying hurry up,
you've got to get this done.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: I mean,this stuff--if the citations—
MR.KLATZKOW: I don't have that problem.I'll put it on the agenda. I just want it right.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Let's do this. When I originally said,hey,can we make the 28th,that was
already too late for me. So letting it slide another two weeks,hopefully it will stay on summary agenda and
we won't be required to do another further continuance.
So let's just get it right. Let it slide,assuming I'm just going to stay on summary agenda,unless
somebody's going to come and object to this.Let's just get it right and let it slide instead of rushing,because
we see what happened when we were rushed;people missed some things,and I don't want to come back up
here again and have to deal with that,either here or at the Board.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: I'd rather not deal with this one again myself.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Or any instance. I don't want to be up here because people rushed and
missed things.
MR.REISCHL: That would be March 14th?
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Well,that's up to the applicant.
MR.YOVANOVICH: That's fine.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: So we'll still not do the consent. We'll still make sure it's right,and it will
be scheduled for the 14th BCC meeting.
Fred,do you have--anybody have any other questions of the applicant?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Fred,did you have any staff report?
MR.REISCHL: Nothing further,no thanks.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Fred,this is--this shouldn't have happened,these citations and all this
stuff. The applicant had a responsibility,and so did you. I would hope that in the future we check all these
references. It's not a good thing for this board to have to get into this kind of detail.
MR.REISCHL: Correct. I agree.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: So I don't know how it needs to be done,but this kind of stuff needs to be
checked more thoroughly before it gets to this board.
MR.REISCHL: I agree. It's last-minute changes that usually do us in.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. Are there any members of the public here to speak?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Any registered speakers? I think the answer's going to be no.
MR.REISCHL: No,no registered.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Okay. With that,we'll close the public hearing and entertain a motion.Is
there a motion?
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: I make a motion to approve the PUD subject to the noted changes as
discussed and that are a matter of record.
COMMISSIONER EBERT: I'll second.
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February 2,2017
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Motion made and seconded.Discussion?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: All in favor,signify by saying aye.
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: Aye.
COMMISSIONER EBERT: Aye.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: Aye.
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: Aye.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Anybody opposed?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Motion carries 6-0.
Thank you.
MR.YOVANOVICH: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: There's no new business listed. There is no old business listed unless
anybody has anything.
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: Motion to adjourn.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: We've got to ask for public comment first.
Is there any public comment?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Hearing none,there's a motion to adjourn made by Patrick. Is there a
second?
COMMISSIONER EBERT: I'll second.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: By Diane. All in favor,signify by saying aye.
COMMISSIONER CHRZANOWSKI: Aye.
COMMISSIONER EBERT: Aye.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Aye.
COMMISSIONER HOMIAK: Aye.
COMMISSIONER SCHMITT: Aye.
COMMISSIONER DEARBORN: Aye.
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Anybody opposed?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN STRAIN: Motion carries 6-0. Thank you.
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February 2,2017
*******
There being no further business for the good of the County,the meeting was adjourned by order of
the Chair at 9:55 a.m.
COLLIER COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION
v/L(14
ARK STRAIN,CHAIRMAN
ATTEST
DWIGHT E.BROCK,CLERK
These minutes approved by the Board on LI ' L —fat .as presented V or as corrected .
TRANSCRIPT PREPARED ON BEHALF OF
U.S.LEGAL SUPPORT,INC.,
BY TERRI LEWIS,COURT REPORTER AND NOTARY PUBLIC.
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