CLB Minutes 03/18/2015 March 18,2015
MINUTES
OF THE COLLIER COUNTY
CONTRACTORS' LICENSING BOARD MEETING
March 18, 2015
Naples, Florida
LET IT BE REMEMBERED, that the Collier County Contractors' Licensing
Board, having conducted business herein, met on this date at 9:00 AM in
REGULAR SESSION in Administrative Building "F," 3rd Floor, Collier County
Government Complex, Naples, Florida, with the following Members present:
Chairman: Patrick White
Vice Chair: Thomas Lykos
Members: Michael Boyd
Ronald Donino
Terry Jerulle
Richard Joslin
Kyle Lantz
Gary McNally
Excused: Robert Meister
ALSO PRESENT:
Michael Ossorio — Supervisor, Contractors' Licensing Office
Kevin Noell, Esq. —Assistant County Attorney
James F. Morey, Esq. — Attorney for the Contractors' Licensing Board
Rob Ganguli — Collier County Licensing Compliance Officer
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Any person who decides to appeal a decision of this Board will need a record of the
proceedings and may need to ensure that a verbatim record of said proceedings is
made, which record includes the testimony and evidence upon which any Appeal is
to be based.
ROLL CALL:
Chairman Patrick White called the meeting to order at 9:02 AM and read the
procedures to be followed to appeal a decision of the Board.
Roll call was taken and a quorum was established; eight (8) voting members were
present.
Chairman White noted Robert Meister had been excused.
II. AGENDA—ADDITIONS, DELETIONS, OR CHANGES:
Changes.
• Item #VIII, "Public Hearings,"will be heard following Item #V, "Discussion."
III. APPROVAL OF AGENDA:
Vice Chairman Thomas Lykos moved to approve the Agenda as amended. Gary
McNally offered a Second in support of the motion. Carried unanimously, 8— 0.
V. DISCUSSION:
(None)
VIII. PUBLIC HEARINGS:
(Note: With reference to the cases heard under Section VIII, the individuals who
testified were first sworn in by the Attorney for the Board.)
A. Case#2015-01: Board of County Commissioners vs. Tracy Lee Cummings,
d/b/a "Catch `Em All Contracting, Inc."
Chairman White outlined the order of the proceedings:
• The Public Hearing will be opened, witnesses will be sworn in, and evidence
from the parties will be presented;
• The County will present its "Opening Statement," followed by the
Respondent's "Opening Statement;"
• The County will present its "Case in Chief;"
• The Respondent will present his/her Defense;
• The County may offer any rebuttal;
• The process is then concluded.
• After closing the Public Hearing portion of the proceedings, the Board will
receive instruction from its Attorney, similar to a"Charge to a Jury" in a civil
trial, which sets out the parameters upon which the Board will base its
decision.
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• During deliberations, the Board members may ask for additional information
and clarification from the parties.
• The Board will decide two different issues:
o Whether the Respondent is guilty of the offense(s) as charged in the
Administrative Complaint. A vote will be taken on the matter.
o If the Respondent is found guilty, the Board must decide the Sanctions
to be imposed.
• The Board's Attorney will advise the Board concerning the Sanctions that may be
imposed and the factors to be considered.
• The Board will discuss the Sanctions and vote.
• The Chair will orally report the decision of the Board.
Chairman White moved to open the Public Hearing. Vice Chairman Lykos offered
a Second in support of the motion. Motion carried, 8—0.
Rob Ganguli,Licensing Compliance Officer, requested to enter the County's case
packet in Case #2015-01: Board of Collier County Commissioners vs. Tracy Lee
Cummings, d/b/a "Catch `Em All Contracting, Inc." into evidence.
Chairman White, noting there were no objections from the Board, approved
entering the information packet into evidence as County's Exhibit "A."
Rob Ganguli presented the County's combined"Opening Statement "and "Case in
Chief"
• Tracy Lee Cummings is the holder of State-issued License CGC 1522156 and
Collier County License#201400001622
• Ms. Cummings is the also Qualifier of"Catch `Em All Contracting, Inc."
• She is appearing before the Contractors' Licensing Board for having
committed a willful Building Code violation.
• The County is prepared to show evidence that "Catch `Em All Contracting,
Inc." accepted and performed subcontracted work on the construction of new
residential swimming pools located in the Olde Cypress community.
• During the course of performing the subcontracted work, a willful Building
Code violation was committed by employees of"Catch `Em All Contracting,
Inc." and was discovered through the inspection process conducted by the
Collier County Building Department.
Chairman White asked the Respondent if she wished to present an"Opening Statement"
but she declined. She did not have any questions or comments.
Chairman White asked the Respondent to present her defense.
Tracy Cummings stated:
• It was an error and her employees made a bad judgment call or just didn't do
their jobs properly.
• She was made aware of the situation and accepted complete responsibility.
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• "It will not happen again—we have taken appropriate measures to see that this
work—the equal potential bond grid—is installed properly at this point and from
here out."
• She indicated the employee who did not install the equal potential bond grid
properly was no longer working for her company and the remaining members of
the crew were"put on notice"that this type of work was not acceptable or
reflective of what she wants her company to do.
Greg Surniak, Collier County Electrical Inspector, was called to testify on behalf of
the County.
Richard Joslin questioned Inspector Surniak.
Q. Mr. Surniak, you are a Certified Inspector for Collier County as far as reporting or
doing inspecting for what phases?
A. For the electrical phase.
Q. How many electrical inspections are required for swimming pools in Collier County?
A. There are approximately—I believe there are six.
Q. Six. Out of those six, how many bonding wires are in each pool? How many blank
wires would there be in each pool?
A. Each shell requires a minimum of four bond wires today ... to the shell itself which
connects to a bonding ring which goes around the pool.
Q. Could there be more?
A. Yes, absolutely.
Q. Could it be that one of these wires was just a blank, dummy wire that someone stuck
in the ground or maybe a piece that someone cut off? Because I build swimming
pools also, and I know for a fact that when a pool is back-filled—lots of times—the
wires will be buried or cut off, but generally there are more boundary wires that can
be bonded to complete the consequential bonding that goes around a pool.
A. I checked the ones that are bonded at the shell inspection.
Q. As an Inspector, how do you check those? What is your procedure for checking
them?
A. For checking them—my procedure is ... on the equal potential or the shell?
Q. On both ... either one.
A. For the shell inspection, we make sure that the right connections are used on the steel,
that they are sticking out ... and there are at least four of them—sometimes there are
six, sometimes there are seven. Okay? But there are at least four—that's the
minimum requirement. That inspection was done. It could have been a month prior.
Q. Do you know for a fact that the inspection was done in the past?
A. Yes.
Q. It was done and completed?
A. Yes.
Q. So the bond wires were there?
A. Yes. In fact, in the computer—I can't tell you who did that inspection ... it might
have been me. We do many of them. But the computer indicates that the inspection
was done because we review it before we go in. And I couldn't have done the four—
the equal potential—without having that shell done—because the computer would
show it as unresolved.
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Q. When you check the bonding for the steel shell, when it's raw ... when there's just
steel showing ... where there's no concrete ... all those wires are connected?
A. Yes.
Q. And they are all out at some point ... above the pool—in the pool?
A. Yes.
Q, The wires are exposed. If you wanted to know if all the wires were actually tied
together, grounded to the steel,how would you do that? How do you do that? Other
than pulling on the wire?
A. Once they back-fill and they put the ring around and connect those four conductors to
that ring—those conductors are exposed. I personally go around and I tug on each
one.
Q. Does a paver deck need a footer inspection?
Terry Jerulle expressed his concern about the content of the questions—he noted it was
a Public Hearing—he did not understand the questions or why the County was being
questioned on its procedures.
Richard Joslin explained his concern was the "willful" charge. He stated, "In my
opinion, after reading the case and some of the items in the case, I don't believe this is a
`willful' violation. I think it was a missed violation, yes. But as far as being a `willful'
Code violation, I don't think that applies."
Terry Jerulle stated he would like to hear both sides and then ask questions.
It was noted the Respondent admitted to the violation—there were no questions to ask of
her.
Richard Jerulle continued the Respondent understood that she was in the wrong. The
point of his questioning was to determine whether or not the violation was `willful.'
Chairman White stated while he appreciated having additional information presented
about the bonding process for a pool, it would likely be—regardless of our questions—
that the opinion of the Building Official who is not present will probably not be reversed.
He continued the Board will be required to weigh the evidence to determine whether or
not there has been a `willful' violation. He noted it is up to the Respondent to change her
position.
Tracy Lee stated she had not taken into consideration that she could explain. She stated
she knew that three of the four wires had been bonded. When the backfill process took
place—she stated it was clear—she saw that it was not connected properly. She stated,
"My bottom line is—yes, it is an error and it was made by my company."
Chairman White stated the first time the pool was inspected and the error was found, it
may have been accidental. He noted in the reports that the second time the pool was
inspected; the wire was attached to a plastic pipe and could not have been properly
installed. His conclusion: it was `willful.'
Ms. Lee agreed and continued, stating that she took responsibility because "it is not how
I want to put my work out there—it's not who I am. It is not what my company is
about."
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Richard Joslin referenced the County's photograph: E-20, E-21, E-22 and E-23. He
asked where the pipe was located, i.e., was it around the corners of the pool where the
Inspector said that he found the ground wires.
Inspector Surniak replied the four conductors were arbitrarily placed at equal distances
from each other since some pools are not square and do not have corners. He noted the
inspections of the two pools took place the day before the photos were taken and they
were just"stuck in the ground" on the house side of the pool.
Rob Ganguli stated he returned to the j obsite after the inspection was completed and
took the photographs.
Inspector Surniak established that after he failed the work after the first inspection, the
errors were repaired and it was passed after a second inspection.
The County's case was concluded.
Terry Lee stated her company has taken measures to ensure that there are at least four
wires connected at all times, even after the pool has been backfilled. She confirmed her
company has taken drastic measures to ensure that this error will not happen again. She
stated she contacted Gary Martin with Serenity Pools and have come to an agreement
concerning the equal potential bond grids that are used, i.e., all of the wires will have a
coating of orange reflective paint. She stated her employees have been instructed that
after the backfill, if they can't dig and find the wires, they are to stop working. The goal
is to ensure that everyone on the crew knows where the ground wires are located.
Ms. Lee stated there has been vandalism at some jobsites, i.e., the copper portion of the
wires has been stolen. She confirmed her company's crew and supervisors have been
instructed that if they find wires that are missing the copper component, they are to stop
work immediately
Gary Martin, Serenity Pools and Spas, stated he was the Contractor and had hired Ms.
Lee's company to perform the work as a subcontractor. He confirmed the additional
steps that both companies have set in place to ensure the bonding wires will be identified
on every pool that they install. He further stated everything was done for compliance on
the case and it was a first violation for Ms. Lee.
Terry Jerulle stated he may have worked with Serenity Pool several years ago and did
not feel that his judgment would be influenced.
Chairman White stated he appreciated Mr. Jerulle's disclosure but did not feel there was
a potential for conflict since Serenity Pools was not the Respondent.
Rob Ganguli stated the Contactors Licensing Office had received a notarized Affidavit
from Mr. Martin attesting to his inspection of all the jobsites where "Catch `em all"
Contracting had been subcontracted and he validated the work that was done.
Vice Chairman Lykos moved to approve closing the Public Hearing. Terry Jerulle
offered a Second in support of the motion. Carried unanimously, 8— 0.
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Chairman White noted the Respondent was charged with: "Willfully violating the
applicable Building Codes of law of the State, City, or Collier County,"pursuant to
Ordinance #90-105, as amended, Section 22-202.1(2).
Vice Chairman Lykos moved to find the Respondent guilty of the violation as charged.
Ronald Donino offered a Second in Support of the motion.
Motion carried, "7— Yes"/1 —No." Richard Joslin was opposed.
Attorney James Morey, Attorney for the Board, was requested to advise the Board
concerning possible Sanctions.
He stated:
• The Respondent is a State-certified Contractor, License#CGC 1522156, and
holder of a Collier County Certificate of Competency, #201400001622.
• If, after a Hearing, the Board determines there has been misconduct by a State-
certified Contractor, the Board may deny the issuance of Collier County
Building Permits or require the issuance of permits with specific conditions.
• Notification of, and information concerning any permit denials shall be
submitted to the Florida Department of Business and Professional Regulation
within fifteen days after the Licensing Board's decision to deny issuance of the
permit.
Mr. Morey continued that when imposing any specific Sanctions on a State-certified
Contractor, the Licensing Board shall consider the following:
• The gravity of the violation;
• The impact of the violation on the Public Health/Welfare/Safety;
• Any action taken by the violator to correct the action;
• Any previous violations committed by the violator;
• Any evidence presented by the parties during the Hearing that is relevant to the
Sanctions which is appropriate to the case, given the nature of the violation and
the violator.
Michael Ossorio recommended suspending the permit pulling privileges for a period of
two months; request that the company pay the investigative costs of$540 (voluntary);
and provide a"no penalty recommendation" letter to the State.
After a discussion of potential Sanctions, it was suggested to re-open the Public Hearing
in order to further question the Respondent.
Terry Jerulle moved to approve re-opening the Public Hearing. Ronald Donino
offered a Second in support of the motion. Carried unanimously, 8— 0.
Terry Jerulle asked the Respondent if she had instructed the employee to cover up his
error or was it the employee's decision alone.
A. I would never instruct my employee to take the lazy way out. Because he was lazy
and not attentive to his job. He no longer has that job.
Q. Did you terminate this person?
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A. Absolutely. I will not have an employee who is too lazy to do a proper job— I don't
need him on my jobsite. I don't want my name put out there like that—I've worked
very hard to get my State license and I don't need employees like that. He was let go.
Everyone who is employed by me is on notice—there is no room in my business for
the mis-handling of any type of work, period.
Michael Boyd asked if the company had failed inspections at the two different pools
and the response was, "Yes—with the same employee."
Kyle Lantz:
Q. Does your company primarily do pool shells?
A. Pretty much. I obtained my State license because, in the future, we may do more.
But at this point, no ... we strictly do shells and footers.
Q. How many employees do you have?
A. Three, now.
Q. So your company is small?
A. Oh, absolutely. And I want to keep it small. I like knowing that our work is
consistent and as close to perfect as it can be. I'll take quality over quantity any day.
Terry Jerulle moved to approve closing the Public Hearing. Vice Chairman Lykos
offered a Second in support of the motion. Carried unanimously, 8—0.
Kyle Lantz commented concerning the Sanctions:
• Serenity Pools has stood by Ms. Lee and her company. They acknowledged
hiring her—acknowledged the problem and also that they were working together
on resolving it.
• Because of this, I am pretty confident this problem will not occur again.
Chairman White stated he was comfortable accepting the County's recommendation
concerning Sanctions.
Vice Chairman Lykos asked Michael Boyd for his opinion concerning the County's
recommendation, since he discovered the same Violation existed at two different jobsites
where the Respondent had been hired to work.
Michael Boyd replied:
• They repaired at least one pool—I think they attempted to repair both of them.
• Obviously, there was a lazy employee who didn't care about his work—all of us
have run into that over the years.
• I have a tough time thinking she really did this "willfully" on her own.
• Yes, she's responsible because she is the Licensee but the "willful"—I have a
tough time accepting that.
Chairman White explained that, as a legal matter, the "Agency"relationship flows from
the employee. He stated it as clear that the former employee intended to deceive which
led to the Building Official's conclusion.
He continued that anyone who accepted responsibility in the first place, and then
demonstrated how, in a detailed process,they eliminated the "problem employee" and
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created a system that supports the Code's goal, i.e., that all of the equal potential bonds
are made.
His conclusion: The "impact" on the Health/Safety/Welfare of the County's resident
was almost a net-zero because no one testified that, if the problem had not been caught, a
person would have been shocked or electrocuted upon entering the pool.
Chairman White moved to approve accepting the County's recommendation for
Sanctions as follows:
• To suspend the permit pulling privileges for a period of two months;
• To request the company voluntarily pay the investigative costs of$540.00
incurred by the County;
• To send a letter to the State that recommends "no penalty."
Gary McNally offered a Second in support of the motion.
Motion carried, "7— Yes"/"1 —No." Vice Chairman Lykos was opposed.
VI. NEW BUSINESS:
A. Orders of the Board
Vice Chairman Thomas Lykos moved to approve authorizing the Chairman to sign
the Orders of the Board. Richard Joslin offered a Second in support of the
motion. Carried unanimously, 8—0.
III. APPROVAL OF AMENDED AGENDA: (2nd Amendment)
Michael Ossorio requested the following change:
• To move Item VIII-B to Item VII-A: The case of Veronica A. Compean
(d/b/a: "Compean Maintenance, Inc.") will be heard under Item VII, "Old
Business."
Vice Chairman Thomas Lykos moved to approve amending the Amended Agenda as
stated above. Ronald Donino offered a Second in support of the motion.
Carried unanimously, 8— 0.
VI. NEW BUSINESS:
(Note: With reference to the cases heard under Section VI, the individuals who
testified were first sworn in by the Attorney for the Board.)
B. Steven M. Hall—Waiver of Examination(s)
(d/b/a: "Stahlman-England Irrigation,Inc.")
Steven M. Hall stated:
• He was appearing before the Board to request a re-instatement of his Collier
County Contractor's License for Landscaping—Restricted.
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Chairman White explained since Mr. Hall previous Contractor's license had lapsed,
one of the County's requirements for reinstatement was to take the required exams.
Mr. Hall replied he did not think he needed to take the exam again was because he
had passed it and has remained working in his field for the past 15 years. He is also
licensed in Lee County and worked in Lee County during the period when his Collier
License had expired.
When asked about Continuing Education, he responded that CE credits were not
required for a Landscaping/Restricted license. He stated he also holds a license for
fertilization which requires that he obtain CE credits. He obtained the Fertilization
license within the past two years.
Chairman White referenced Page 2 of his Application and asked Mr. Hall to identify
the Officers of Stahlman-England Irrigation, Inc.
A. James England—President,
Mark Stahlman—VP and Founder,
Steve Hall—VP.
Chairman White referenced Page 3 of his Application and asked Mr. Hall to list any
formal training which he omitted to include.
A. In addition to the Fertilization license, he also obtained the Florida Water-Star AP
accredited Professional. He has obtained a Certified Irrigation Contractor
designation through the Irrigation Association as well as a Certified Landscape
Auditor. They are all four-hour closed book exams. The passing grade is 75.
They are kept up to date. He further stated he has a Miami-Dade license that
requires CEUs every two years. He maintains his Continuing Education within
the industry.
Michael Ossorio:
• Mr. Hall was licensed in 2012 but it did lapse.
• He has been working with Mark Stahlman since then.
Steven Hall stated Mark Stahlman is a licensed Landscape Contractor. He stated he
wanted his license as a back-up and to obtain the requirement he needed to move
forward.
Vice Chairman Lykos moved to approve granting the Applicant's Request for a
Waiver and reinstate his license without requiring testing. Richard Joslin offered a
Second in support of the motion. Motion carried, 8— 0.
C. Michael L. Catanzaro —Review of Experience
("SWFL Pool & Spa, LLC" —d/b/a "ASP—America's Swimming Pool Co.")
Michael Ossorio stated to be a Licensed Pool Cleaning Contractor, an applicant
should have twelve months of experience. He has some education and training but
not all education and training can be forwarded or considered as on-the-job training .
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Michael Catanzaro:
• He is requesting a Waiver of the One-Year Requirement concerning cleaning
swimming pools experience in order to obtain a license
• He purchased the pool cleaning franchise in November, 2014
• For the past 25 years, his experience has been in the hospitality industry—he
was the General Manager of country clubs in Fairfield County, CT, and was a
caterer earlier in his career.
• He managed not only the clubhouse but also the facilities and has extensive
experience managing people.
• He has learned a"good amount" about pools, i.e., testing and balancing.
• He has received 13 days of training from ASP which he completed in
February.
• He recently obtained his CPO (Certified Pool Operator) license.
• His immediate goal is to begin cleaning pools and to obtain a CPC license in
the future.
Richard Joslin asked the Applicant if he had ever run a business before by himself
A. Yes, sir. I owned a catering business before I began managing country clubs.
Q. How long have you been actually involved in swimming pools?
A. I'm just getting into it. The closest I have been to "hands-on" experience has
been in country clubs in the past. They all have pools—getting the open and
running and staffed ... making sure the lifeguards are taking readings when they
should for the health inspections.
Q. Did you do that yourself or did your employees do it?
A. Occasionally, I would. If there was an issue, I'd be called out. I obtained my
CPO about 10 to 15 years ago to have a better understanding of pool water
balancing and to be able to help his staff to figure out when the levels were off.
Q. Do you have a CPO now?
A. I do.
Vice Chairman Lykos asked Mr. Joslin for his opinion concerning whether or not
the applicant's classes and previous experience would be enough since he had never
worked for a pool cleaning company previously.
Richard Joslin: "Considering that he has taken the CPO course and he has been in
golf communities where there are commercial pools ..."
Q. Are you going to try to maintain in your business commercial or just residential
pools?
A. I would like to try although I understand HOA's want companies with more
experience.
Q. Have you been involved with any type of commercial pools before other than
those in clubhouses that you managed?
A. No, sir.
Richard Joslin stated he would not vote in favor of granting a license to the applicant
before he took the required test.
Chairman White asked if there was an exam that could substitute for the required 12
months of experience.
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March 18,2015
Attorney James Morey explained the application had been summited not for a
Waiver of Examination but for an explanation of experience from the Applicant.
He outlined the "Proof of Experience" required under Section 22-183(B) of the
Collier County Code:
• Affidavits from former employers with specifics as to the number of years of
experience, work performed and any other relevant information;
• Copies of other certificates of competency, if any, held by the applicant in
other counties or cities;
• Affidavits from any Building Director in locations where the applicant has
worked;
• Affidavits from any union organization of which the applicant has been a
member relating to the trade for which the Applicant has made application;
• Affidavits from any other source within the trade applied for.
• The Applicant's personal testimony as to his/her experience.
Under Section 22-183(C):
"Education at an accredited school may be presented to satisfy a portion
of the experience requirements of this Section. Specifically, each full year
of school-level work in the trade for which application is made shall be
credited to the Applicant as 0.75 years' experience, but such credit shall
be for no more than one-half of the total experience required by this Section."
Richard Joslin expressed concern that even though the Applicant recently took the
CPO test, he did not have enough experience to know how to set-up and manage a
pool cleaning business.
Chairman White: "What would be the appropriate ways for the Applicant to obtain
the experience that the Board may feel he needs. What other avenues are available to
him?"
Richard Joslin replied the Applicant should work for a licensed pool contractor as an
employee.
Michael Ossorio stated the Board had the option to restrict the license to residential
pools only. The Board could also place the Applicant on probation while granting a
provisional license.
Richard Joslin stated he would support placing the Applicant on probation for one
year while restricting him to cleaning only residential pools to gain experience. Then
he could be granted a permanent license.
Kyle Lantz asked the Applicant if he had cleaned his own pool and the response was,
"No."
When asked how many months of experience the Applicant felt he had, based upon
his prior experience in country club management or anything else, Mr. Catanzaro
replied that his experience with the country clubs and training with the franchisor was
probably more than someone who was just hired "off the street"to clean pools. He
stated the training he received from ASP and the CPO was "pretty valuable."
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March 18,2015
Richard Joslin stated he reviewed the Affidavits that were part of the application.
He observed that each one listed the Applicant as a handyman for various projects
and in various capacities but there was nothing that directly related to pools or pool
cleaning.
Mr. Catanzaro clarified that his experience in the country clubs was as a General
Manager which he stated was "a little more than just a handyman."
Vice Chairman Lykos stated the limitation being considered was to restrict the
Applicant to cleaning residential pools only but he lacked experience in residential
pools and had only limited experience in commercial pools.
Mr. Catanzaro explained that one of the reasons why he went to a franchise
company was for the support. He stated he could call anytime he had a question
concerning water balance or any other issue and they would respond.
Kyle Lantz stated there is a big difference between"support" and "supervision."
He further stated he understood that cleaning pools was not "rocket science," but the
Applicant should have personally done even a little bit before he could charge
someone for his services.
When the Applicant asked "for how long,"the response was "12 months."
Mr. Lantz explained that the requirement did not mean the Applicant could clean his
own pool, rather, it meant working a 40-hour week for one year, i.e., a full-time job.
Vice Chairman Lykos strongly suggested the Applicant should invest some time and
work for someone else or hire someone who has the required license to run his
business—the Applicant could learn from the qualified licensee because the
Applicant lacks residential pool experience.
Mr. Catanzaro stated the reason why he got into the franchise was not to spend a
year working for someone else cleaning pools. He further stated his investment in the
franchise precluded him for going to work for someone at $13.00 an hour.
Chairman White reiterated that the Applicant could bring someone into his business
who has the required licensure to run his business. The Chairman reminded the
Applicant it was not the Board's responsibility to explain to an applicant what the
requirements are for a specific license.
Richard Joslin stated the Applicant might find a Contractor who would allow him to
work under his umbrella. He noted there are "smaller"tests that would permit the
Applicant to work for a licensed pool contractor. The only other option would be to
take the"big"test through the testing agencies in Tallahassee. If he passed, he could
work as a subcontractor for a licensed pool contractor.
Attorney Morey suggested Mr. Catanzaro contact the franchisor to see if there is a
local franchisee willing to partner with him or work with him.
Vice Chairman Lykos stated the Ordinance allows the Board to give the Applicant
six months of credit toward his experience. He suggested the Applicant should find a
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March 18,2015
way to prove six months of on-the-job experience in order for the Board to approve
his application.
Richard Joslin suggested since the Applicant did have a CPO license, he could apply
to any hotel or condo complex to work directly for the entity. He would be an
employee of the hotel or condo complex.
Kyle Lantz moved to deny the Applicant's request for a license. Vice Chairman
Lykos offered a Second in support of the motion. Carried unanimously, 8— 0.
RECESS: 10:23 AM
RECONVENED: 10:29 AM
IV. APPROVAL OF MINUTES—FEBRUARY 18,2015:
• A discrepancy was noted on Page 12, i.e., information was missing.
• Approval of the Minutes was tabled until the April meeting to allow the Hearing
Reporter an opportunity to research the issue.
Gary McNally moved to approve tabling the vote on the February minutes until the
next meeting. Vice Chairman Lykos offered a Second in support of the motion.
Carried unanimously, 8— 0.
VI. NEW BUSINESS:
(Note: With reference to the cases heard under Section VI, the individuals who
testified were first sworn in by the Attorney for the Board.)
D. Janet Ramirez—Waiver of Credit
(d/b/a: "Castaway Flooring Service,Inc.")
Janet Ramirez:
• She contacted the creditors listed on her application and made payment
arrangements with each;
• She is currently working out of Lee County and her fuel costs have become
quite expensive;
• She has applied for a license in Collier County to generate more income
which will also allow her to pay off her old debts more quickly.
Michael Ossorio:
• Ms. Ramirez is currently licensed in Lee County in floor covering and has
been doing business for many years in Lee County;
• She has been to the Contractors' Licensing Office to review her credit and she
has a Business Plan to present to the Board;
• She is attempting to correct her credit issues;
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March 18,2015
• The corporate credit report has nothing to report;
• He has no concerns about her company
• He recommends issuing a probationary license for 30 or 60 days to monitor
the payments she intends to make.
Chairman White asked Ms. Ramirez to provide more details about her business
plan.
(Note: Hard copies of the Ramirez business plan were distributed to the Board.)
Janet Ramirez:
• She contacted her creditors—found that new issues had arisen because she
had three addresses (family home—PO Box—her apartment);
• She verified balances with the new creditors—some were from 2008;
• She made payment arrangements with Bank of America and Sprint; she
submitted partial payments to each creditor on March 9th;
(Note: There was a pause in the proceeding to allow the Members to review the
Business Plan.)
Ms. Ramirez summarized her goals:
• To obtain her license in Collier County;
• To work locally and reduce her expenses;
• To establish her business in Naples;
• To pay off her debts by the end of the calendar year.
Kyle Lantz noticed a typo in the verification of experience provided by Ronald
Ohner; the Applicant could not have begun working for his company in 1985 because
she was born in 1986.
Kyle Lantz:
Q. You have a business now in Lee County?
A. Yes.
Q. How long have you been doing it?
A. Since 2012; I have been a subcontractor for Wayne Wiles Floor Covering.
Q. And that is Castaway Flooring Service, Inc.?
A. Yes.
Q. Your application states your opening date of business as 02/04/2015?
A. In Collier County—I haven't done any business in Collier yet.
Q. So your business has been open and operating for almost three years?
A. It will be three years in June. I have been limited to only carpet, linoleum and
vinyl.
Mr. Lantz asked why the Board was reviewing the Applicant's personal credit since
she has been in business for more than two years.
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• March 18,2015
Michael Ossorio responded there wasn't anything on her business credit which is
why the personal credit was under review. He stated he called Mr. Wyles to verify
the dates the Applicant worked for his company.
Vice Chairman Lykos stated he was leaning toward approving the application
provided there was a probationary license with a review at either six or twelve
months.
Chairman White stated he would support such a motion.
Vice Chairman Lykos moved to approve granting a probationary license to the
Applicant;she is to appear before the Board at the end of six months and present
an updated credit report for review by the Board. Richard Joslin offered a Second
in support of the motion.
Vice Chairman Lykos explained the Board will want to see how well she performed
based on the business plan that she provided.
Chairman White stated she could also bring receipts and other documentation to the
review.
Michael Ossorio stated he supported the motion. He explained t if, within the six
month probationary period, the Applicant's credit score was 660 or better, she could
be removed from probation administratively and the Applicant would not need to
appear before the Board.
Chairman White stated he supported the policy.
Gary McNally noted that bankruptcies and other items can"hang" on a credit report
and take up to two years to be removed. He stated even if the Applicant paid her
creditors in full, it might take longer than six months to clear the credit bureau.
Chairman White stated if the Applicant produced a credit report of 660 or better, the
Contractor Licensing Supervisor would have discretion to automatically issue her a
permanent license.
Vice Chairman Lykos amended his motion to allow the Contracting Licensing
Supervisor to issue a permanent license to the Applicant if she produced a credit
score of 660 or better at the end of six months. Richard Joslin offered a Second in
support of the Amended Motion. Carried unanimously, 8— 0.
E. Jim E. Skelton—Waiver of Examination
(d/b/a: "Skelton's Construction,Inc.")
Jim Skelton:
• Has been licensed in Collier County since 1993 doing framing.
• Developed Stage 3 cancer and did not renew his license.
• Has been in remission since 2014.
• Wants to reinstate his license without taking the exam.
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March 18,2015
Michael Ossorio noted Mr. Skelton took the Carpentry exam in 1991 but never took
the Business and Law exam because it was not required in 1991. The Applicant is
requesting the Board to waive both the Carpentry exam AND the Business and Law
exam.
Chairman White asked if the County had a recommendation.
Mr. Ossorio stated the Applicant must take the Business and Law exam to comply
with the new Ordinance.
Mr. Skelton stated he has been in business for 20+years and should be exempted
from being required to take the Business and Law exam—he would not have allowed
his license to lapse if he hadn't become ill.
Chairman White stated he did not see any negative items on the Applicant's
business credit report which suggests that Mr. Skelton's business is being conducted
appropriately. He noted some negatives on the personal credit report.
Jim Skelton explained his business had been affected by the downturn in the
economy, but he managed to pay his suppliers and other creditors. However his
personal credit suffered. Most of the negatives on his personal credit report were due
to medical bills.
Terry Jerulle asked what type of carpentry he did.
A. Framing, custom homes in Mediterra—mostly custom homes.
Q. So it's rough carpentry?
A. Yes.
Q. What size crews do you think you will have?
A. Usually it takes 5 or 6 of us to do the houses that I normally do. I don't want to
get big ... I've been there before and it wasn't worth it for me. Small—just
enough to do one house at a time.
Richard Joslin stated since the Applicant has been in business in Collier County
since 1993, he must know how to run a business or he wouldn't still be in business.
His opinion: it was not necessary for Mr. Skelton to take the Business and Law
exam because he has the technical training and the experience.
Kyle Lantz concurred with Mr. Joslin's opinion.
Terry Jerulle:
Q. Have you ever been in front of the Board before?
A. No, sir.
Q. Any fines or trouble with the County?
A. No, sir.
Terry Jerulle stated, in this case, he would make an exemption and not require the
exam.
Vice Chairman Lykos was concerned with the Applicant's liability coverage which
he considered to be insufficient especially since the Applicant worked on custom
homes.
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• March 18,2015
Mr. Skelton stated as soon as he begins to work again, he will increase the liability
coverage. He just wanted to show there was a binder so he could submit his
application. In order to work on custom homes, his insurance aggregate will be
increased to at least $1M.
Vice Chairman Lykos strongly recommended that Mr. Skelton meet his insurance
agent to review his policy limits and obtain information concerning the gaps in
coverage. He noted some insurance companies require Contractors to maintain a
higher threshold.
Jim Skelton agreed. He stated he has worked with the same insurance company
since he began his business and his insurance agent was very good about letting him
why type of insurance coverage is needed for each builder. He confirmed his
insurance will be upgraded as soon as he begins to work again.
Michael Boyd stated every two years he is required to take CE courses and he feels
that he always learns something new. He strong recommended that Mr. Skelton take
the Business and Law exam.
Jim Skelton stated he runs his employees through a leasing company which provides
Workers' Compensation insurance coverage.
Terry Jerulle asked Mr. Skelton why he did not want to take the test.
A. I feel that my experience running a business should supersede the test. I have been
licensed in Collier County since 1993.
Q. So it's not a money issue?
A. No.
Q. Is it a time sensitive issue?
A. Actually it is because if I have to take the time to study for the test, it will take
more time for me to get my license.
Q. So if we gave you a license and you agreed to take the test within a certain time
frame?
A. Whatever you decide, that will be fine. I don't mind taking the test if I have to
but I'd like to have my license.
Kyle Lantz moved to approve granting a probationary license to the Applicant. The
testing requirement for the Carpentry test is waived but the Applicant is required to
take the Business and Law exam within the next six months. The probation will
terminate when the exam is passed. If he does not pass the test within six months,
his license is revoked. Richard Joslin offered a Second in support of the motion.
Carried unanimously, 8— 0.
Chairman White asked Staff to inform the Board of the Mr. Skelton's test results.
VII. OLD BUSINESS:
(Note: With reference to the case heard under Section VII, "Old Business,"the
individual who testified was first sworn in by the Attorney for the Board.)
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March 18,2015
A. Veronica A. Compean —Review of Order of the Board— One Year Probation
(d/b/a: "Compean Maintenance, Inc.")
Michael Ossorio:
• The company is run by a husband and wife team, Veronica and Alfonso
Compean.
• There have been no complaints made against the business or the license
holder, Veronica Compean.
• He has no issue with the Board terminating probation and granting a
permanent Landscaping license.
Veronica Compean and Alfonso Compean appeared before the Board.
Richard Joslin moved to approve terminating the probation and to issue a
permanent Landscaping Contractor's license to Veronica Compean. Terry Jerulle
offered a Second in support of the motion. Carried unanimously, 8—0.
IX. REPORTS:
• Michael Ossorio stated there was a joint venture between Workers'
Compensation and the Fraud Unit. Spot checks were conducted in the City of
Naples and four or five arrests were made.
• Vice Chairman Lykos announced that he will be unable to attend the April
meeting.
X. NEXT MEETING DATE: Wednesday, April 15, 2015
BCC Chambers, 3rd Floor—Administrative Building "F,"
Government Complex, 3301 E. Tamiami Trail,Naples, FL
There being no further business for the good of the County, the meeting was adjourned
by the order of the Chairman at 11:40 AM.
COLLIER COUNTY CONTRACTORS'
NS1 ,G BOARD Wei A' AA ..-
PA RI ' H E, Chairman
The Minutes were approved by the Committee Chair/Vice Chair on // , 2015,
"as submitted" [,..ff'lifi "as amended" [ 1.
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